S35.E07: Like Two Cats Fighting in a Car

[iMonrey]

22 hours ago, Netfoot said:

I think that just trying every possible combination of coins should have come with a detraction. Possibly a time delay between attempts or having to do the rappel each time before getting another guess.

Ooh! That's a good idea. For everyone, not just Chelsea. Any time someone presented the wrong number of coins, rappel and then start over. Would have made the task much more challenging. As is, I though it was ridiculously simple, and not likely to shake up placements. 

21 hours ago, proserpina65 said:

It might've been simple to you but it would not have been to me.  I'd have done what Chelsea did - keep adding a coin and going back until it was the right amount.

On 11/9/2023 at 1:27 AM, Lantern7 said:

You know, I thought the same thing at first, because I'm no ace at math. But after studying the sign several times it did seem to be fairly simple. I think even I could have figured it out. 

The carnival thing was just a strange time eater. It makes me wonder, did they add extra tasks to this season to fill out 90 minute episodes? Or do they usually have more tasks per leg that they end up cutting out to fit 60 minute episodes? Because the legs do seem to be more grueling this season than usual.

[chaifan]

11 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

The carnival thing was just a strange time eater. It makes me wonder, did they add extra tasks to this season to fill out 90 minute episodes? Or do they usually have more tasks per leg that they end up cutting out to fit 60 minute episodes? Because the legs do seem to be more grueling this season than usual.

Based on what I've read, the episodes are 90 minutes to fill out scheduling gaps caused by the actors/writers strikes.  This season - which we are calling 35 - is actually Season 36.  The "real" Season 35 was already edited for standard 60 minute show time.  It would have been more work to re-edit that to 90 minutes, so they kept that in the can as is, and edited Season 36, which was already shot, for 90 minute episodes. 

There have always been tasks that end up on the cutting room floor.  Sometimes we hear about them through contestant interviews, sometimes TAR fans post pictures of them.

I think this season was designed to "go back to basics", to old-time TAR, which is why things seem tougher.  We had a few fluff years due to Covid, which may also make things look tougher. 

[vousviou]

34 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

23 hours ago, Netfoot said:

I think that just trying every possible combination of coins should have come with a detraction. Possibly a time delay between attempts or having to do the rappel each time before getting another guess.

Ooh! That's a good idea. For everyone, not just Chelsea. Any time someone presented the wrong number of coins, rappel and then start over. Would have made the task much more challenging. As is, I though it was ridiculously simple, and not likely to shake up placements. 

There was a small version of this -- every time she gave the wrong number she had to go back to the sign with the conversions before she could make another guess. The first time they showed the gatekeeper sending her back.

It's a fair question whether that distance was far enough. A couple of seasons ago Penn was basically making semi-random guesses of the number of columns in Portugal with repeat trips to give his answer. I think his eyes just weren't good enough to get more than an approximate number. The difficulty he faced was that he had to go back hundreds of yards for each wrong guess while he worked by process of elimination, and he ended up spending a lot of time and effort along the way.

[PurpleTentacle]

1 hour ago, iMonrey said:

You know, I thought the same thing at first, because I'm no ace at math. But after studying the sign several times it did seem to be fairly simple. I think even I could have figured it out. 

Yup. The math wasn't that hard if you didn't get discouraged. Of course I'm not sure how their head space is just coming from asia in the summer. But even with half a brain, this should be doable.

Sign:

• 1 Groschen = 24 Heller
• 4 Heller = 1 Rappen
• 2 Rappen = 1 Witten

They had to pay 5 Groschen.

So if 2R = 1W and 4H = 1R, then 8H = 2R = 1W, so 24H = 3W = 1G, so 3 x 5 = 15.

You could write that out better and in more detail, with proper math signage, but that's about how I did the math in my head and there it's even easier than writing it down.

Edit: Or you could come from the other direction 24 / 4 = 6, 6 / 2 = 3, 3 x 5 = 15. But that direction isn't quite as intuitive, at least for me.

1 hour ago, chaifan said:

Based on what I've read, the episodes are 90 minutes to fill out scheduling gaps caused by the actors/writers strikes.  This season - which we are calling 35 - is actually Season 36.  The "real" Season 35 was already edited for standard 60 minute show time.  It would have been more work to re-edit that to 90 minutes, so they kept that in the can as is, and edited Season 36, which was already shot, for 90 minute episodes. 

Which is kind of a baffling decision. Any other season, sure. But going from a post-covid season back to a covid season is going to be very jarring.

Edited November 10, 2023 by PurpleTentacle

[katalizt]

I'm so glad to see extra mini tasks to fill out the time, this is what I was expecting from a season of 90-minute episodes. 

I cannot stand mustard, I would have to do that task purely visually and hope my partner can do the tasting, lol 

[illdoc]

22 hours ago, kitkat343 said:

After being tortured by Luke for two very long seasons,

It was actually 3! The original (Season 14), "Unfinished Business" (Season 18) and "All-Stars" (Season 24). 

[PurpleTentacle]

Just now, illdoc said:

It was actually 3! The original (Season 14), "Unfinished Business" (Season 18) and "All-Stars" (Season 24). 

Thought so, but I was too lazy to look it up. :D

I guess I was one of the few people who actually liked Luke and Margie. But I always stan my gay rep on the race (even though at the time that must have been subconscious recognition).

I get how he might have been a bit much, but it was still fine for me.

[eel2178]

45 minutes ago, PurpleTentacle said:

Yup. The math wasn't that hard if you didn't get discouraged. Of course I'm not sure how their head space is just coming from asia in the summer. But even with half a brain, this should be doable.

Sign:

• 1 Groschen = 24 Heller
• 4 Heller = 1 Rappen
• 2 Rappen = 1 Witten

They had to pay 5 Groschen.

So if 2R = 1W and 4H = 1R, then 8H = 2R = 1W, so 24H = 3W = 1G, so 3 x 5 = 15.

You could write that out better and in more detail, with proper math signage, but that's about how I did the math in my head and there it's even easier than writing it down.

Edit: Or you could come from the other direction 24 / 4 = 6, 6 / 2 = 3, 3 x 5 = 15. But that direction isn't quite as intuitive, at least for me.

I did it as:

5 groschen = 120 heller (multiply 24 by 5)

120 heller = 30 rappen (divide 120 by 4)

30 rappen = 15 witten (divide 30 by 2)

[eel2178]

28 minutes ago, illdoc said:

It was actually 3! The original (Season 14), "Unfinished Business" (Season 18) and "All-Stars" (Season 24). 

Now that my brain was thinking of everything as a math problem, I thought that 3! was 3 factorial or 3 x 2 x 1 = 6.

[Teriacky]

I would STILL be standing there trying to figure out the money challenge! Although I cruised through both college and law school, my mind automatically shuts off when I’m presented any math problem. Always has. 
(In high school I had straight A’s and a D- in math.) You should have seen my ridiculously uneven SAT scores… 

[Hera]

20 hours ago, vousviou said:

The cars were automatic, weren't they? I would have liked to ha e a little stick shift drama.

I think stick shift drama is slowly going to become a thing of the past (at least in European legs). The EU voted to ban the sale of new cars with internal combustion engines by 2035. Electric cars, which don't need a manual transmission, are going to become way more common.

9 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

As far as snippy goes, I think she was well within reason, considering her navigator refused to navigate.

Totally agree. I actually felt sorry for Anna Leigh. I know her personality has been a bit divisive on this forum, and while she's not my favorite racer, I think she's fine and her dad presumably knew that she was high-strung when he signed up to race for her. I appreciate that she seems up for anything and pulls her weight. I'm not sure the same can be said for her dad, who really sucked at two of the three roadblocks he's done so far and is apparently useless when they're driving themselves places. If their positions were reversed, and Anna Leigh basically said, "I will not be able to contribute to us getting to where we need to go," I don't believe he'd have been as understanding about it as he seemed to expect her to be.

Speaking of navigation, while I generally sympathize with Lena over Morgan, I have to say that I felt for Morgan a little bit in this episode. Your life as a navigator is so much harder if the driver doesn't follow your instructions. Someone upthread suggested that Morgan could have tapped Lena on the shoulder to indicate which way to turn, which is an elegant solution that I never would have thought of. And apparently, neither did Morgan or Lena.

2 hours ago, vousviou said:

A couple of seasons ago Penn was basically making semi-random guesses of the number of columns in Portugal with repeat trips to give his answer. I think his eyes just weren't good enough to get more than an approximate number. The difficulty he faced was that he had to go back hundreds of yards for each wrong guess while he worked by process of elimination, and he ended up spending a lot of time and effort along the way.

This is what I thought of too when Chelsea announced her strategy. I don't really have a problem with converting a mental/concentration task into a physical one (or the reverse), if it's possible. It's not like she got out of there faster than Corey or Morgan because of it—although if she had, that might be an argument for her being especially smart to do it that way.

Edited November 10, 2023 by Hera

[chaifan]

1 hour ago, eel2178 said:

I did it as:

5 groschen = 120 heller (multiply 24 by 5)

120 heller = 30 rappen (divide 120 by 4)

30 rappen = 15 witten (divide 30 by 2)

That was my process, too.  I wasn't able to figure it out during the show because a) I missed what they were supposed to pay the guard, and b) I couldn't read it all fast enough each time they flashed it on the screen.  But when PurpleTenticle posted it above, it took me less than 30 seconds.

They were given a bag of just wittens, right? 

As for AL jumping the line, so to speak, it seemed that the guys were standing there debating it, and she figured why not give it a shot as that's the only way of knowing whether they're right or not. 

If someone in that position wanted to be really evil about it, they could have said "I don't think that's right, I got a different number" but actually telling the guard 15.  That would have left everyone else thinking 15 was wrong and wasting time trying to figure out the "right" number. 

[dgpolo]

13 minutes ago, Teriacky said:

I would STILL be standing there trying to figure out the money challenge! Although I cruised through both college and law school, my mind automatically shuts off when I’m presented any math problem. Always has. 
(In high school I had straight A’s and a D- in math.)

Me also. All those equations upthread did NOT help me understand the problem at all. Kudos to Chelsea for figuring out a strategy that worked!

9 minutes ago, Hera said:

This is what I thought of too when Chelsea announced her strategy. I don't really have a problem with converting a mental/concentration task into a physical one (or the reverse), if it's possible.

I believe there have even been instances in the final challenge where one or more teams have resorted to try this one-no-try that one-no try the next one etc. Flags come to mind as one.

I cannot make the multiquote function work across multiple pages. Way back on page one someone mentioned the locks reminding them of Freddy/Kendra, are you sure you didn't mean Hadeyn/Aaron? Also someone mentioned Flo in relation to a selling task, she always was super good at those kind of challenges it was the physical ones that did her in.

[Skooma]

8 hours ago, tracyscott76 said:

By this logic, Andrea would have been in "Roadblock mode" until she got the correct coins, so she would have had to drive back to the correct ferry and get the right coins by herself. Not exactly practical from the show's perspective. I'd say that once it was clear that Andrea didn't have the right tools to do the task, "Roadblock mode" was cancelled and they were back in team mode.

Yeah and the one rule we ALL know for sure is that unless you are at a RB or some place that gives you special permission otherwise you HAVE to stay within so many feet of your partner at all times so she couldn't go back all alone anyway.

6 hours ago, iMonrey said:

The carnival thing was just a strange time eater. It makes me wonder, did they add extra tasks to this season to fill out 90 minute episodes? Or do they usually have more tasks per leg that they end up cutting out to fit 60 minute episodes? Because the legs do seem to be more grueling this season than usual.

Like said above this had nothing to do with 90 minute legs.  This is what standard 60 minute legs were like in the old timey.  TAR has been dumbed down a lot as the years went by then covid forced the charter planes stuff but this season was more what TAR used to be minus the stupid "reality show" U-Turn garbage which we didn't have to put up with in the old timey.

4 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

Yup. The math wasn't that hard if you didn't get discouraged. Of course I'm not sure how their head space is just coming from asia in the summer. But even with half a brain, this should be doable.

Except you also add in the adrenaline pumping which makes it way harder to calm down and think logically.  That every second added could cost your team the race and you are letting down your partner and your body is so pumped up coupled with killer fatigue and yes not eating since the meal on the plane and the stress factor simply cannot be duplicated while sitting on one's couch.

4 hours ago, katalizt said:

I'm so glad to see extra mini tasks to fill out the time, this is what I was expecting from a season of 90-minute episodes.

See above.  Has nothing to do with 90 minutes.

2 hours ago, dgpolo said:

I cannot make the multiquote function work across multiple pages. Way back on page one someone mentioned the locks reminding them of Freddy/Kendra, are you sure you didn't mean Hadeyn/Aaron? Also someone mentioned Flo in relation to a selling task, she always was super good at those kind of challenges it was the physical ones that did her in.

Good catch.  It was Hayden that had the major meltdown on that lock wall in China.

Selling fruit comment was me.  I think it was Ken & Gerard who came up with under selling the competition thing the more I think about it.  And Flo only did one RB all race and that was the selling snails in Morocco but yes indeed I agree she actually did good with it.  If someone only saw that episode from Season 3 they would never understand the whole Flo thing that has lasted about 20 years now.

Edited November 10, 2023 by Skooma

[Netfoot]

11 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

I mean. you usually have to do some pretty advanced math when going to school for software engineering. So unless he is one of the few people (used to be more common) who got into the job through practical experience, rather than formal schooling, he would have had to be at least decent at math.

I studied Software Engineering at college and made it my career until retirement. Sure, you have to have some basic skills in mathematics but not as advanced as you'd think. Sure, you have to have some basic I am generally poor at mathematics and get my computers to any math I need done.

10 hours ago, Haleth said:

As soon as they got on the wrong ferry without rereading the clue they were toast.

Yup. And really, I don't know how they managed. I mean, how hard can it be? They had the name of the ferry. Every ferry dock has the name printed on it. Follow the river and reject each dock whose name is not the same as what's on your clue. You have to try very hard to get this wrong!

9 hours ago, smartymarty said:

Someone above stated that one does sophisticated math to be a software engineer, but my memory (albeit from the 80s) is my computer programming professor pointing out that programming is really logic, not math (despite our high school guidance counselors asking about our math grades if we were interested in programming).

There is Logic as per Mr. Spock and there is Logic as per Boolean math or algebra. Both of these are helpful indeed to a career in Computer Science, but they are not "math" as the average layman imagines it.

7 hours ago, mbluecpa said:

When Chelsea did her workaround with the coins, I first thought it a little sketchy but quickly came around to “it’s a cop out but it was smart.”

Yes, I have no problem with her doing it, but that changed the clue from "Do the math" to "Do the math or just keep guessing" which seems to me to be a failure of the clue or the challenge. We've seen people using the WAG (Wild Assed Guess) method before, but usually there is a downside - some sort of delay which pushed you closer to elimination for example.

 

[Netfoot]

5 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

Sign:

• 1 Groschen = 24 Heller
• 4 Heller = 1 Rappen
• 2 Rappen = 1 Witten

They had to pay 5 Groschen.

So if 2R = 1W and 4H = 1R, then 8H = 2R = 1W, so 24H = 3W = 1G, so 3 x 5 = 15.

They had to pay 5 Groschen.
Which is 5 x 24 or 120 Heller.
Which is 120 ÷ 4 or 30 Rappen.
Which is 30 ÷ 2 or 15 Witten.

[Guiaoshi]

Damm, this leg had so much potential. Too bad the friends took their own particular leg. Still, it was so good that It was enjoyfull to watch while see how the teams handle the stress of the Race. Count me as someone else that actually enjoy Morgan & Lena. As sisters specially, thats tô be expected. What is Fun It that they are so ALL over the place. One min they are the bottom, right after in the top, than in the middle...  They might go miserally running awfull leg or just find their way to the finale. Who knows with these two?

[chicagofan]

5 hours ago, eel2178 said:

I did it as:

5 groschen = 120 heller (multiply 24 by 5)

120 heller = 30 rappen (divide 120 by 4)

30 rappen = 15 witten (divide 30 by 2)

 

4 hours ago, chaifan said:

That was my process, too.  I wasn't able to figure it out during the show because a) I missed what they were supposed to pay the guard, and b) I couldn't read it all fast enough each time they flashed it on the screen.  But when PurpleTenticle posted it above, it took me less than 30 seconds.

Exactly what happened with me chaifan. Once I was able to see the "key" for more than a quick flash on my TV screen I was able to get to 15 in less than 30 seconds. Reminds my of trying to figure out clues on Jeopardy when I don't see the clue long enough to do the math or unscramble the letters. Sigh!

[PurpleTentacle]

6 hours ago, eel2178 said:

I did it as:

5 groschen = 120 heller (multiply 24 by 5)

120 heller = 30 rappen (divide 120 by 4)

30 rappen = 15 witten (divide 30 by 2)

Seeing it written out, that's probably the most straight foreward way of doing it. My brain never was very straight foreward. XD

5 hours ago, Hera said:

I think stick shift drama is slowly going to become a thing of the past (at least in European legs). The EU voted to ban the sale of new cars with internal combustion engines by 2035. Electric cars, which don't need a manual transmission, are going to become way more common.

That's more symbolic than anything though. New electric car sales are growing exponentially. They are just way cheaper to fuel and maintain and now there are actually cars coming to market that have roughly the same MSRP as their gas equivalents (Citroen e-C3 for example). So it's a no-brainer. 99% of all new cars sold are going to be electric way before 2035. It's already 80% of all new car sales in Norway now.

But used ICE cars can be sold indefinitely, so if the race wanted to, they could keep stick shift cars forever. Though at some point there won't be any gas stations anymore.

5 hours ago, chaifan said:

They were given a bag of just wittens, right? 

yes

3 hours ago, Skooma said:

Except you also add in the adrenaline pumping which makes it way harder to calm down and think logically.  That every second added could cost your team the race and you are letting down your partner and your body is so pumped up coupled with killer fatigue and yes not eating since the meal on the plane and the stress factor simply cannot be duplicated while sitting on one's couch.

Except most people got it pretty quickly. So it can't have been that bad.

They are fed by production at pitstops, as you said there are meals on the planes and they weren't racing for very long that day, at that point.

2 hours ago, Netfoot said:

I studied Software Engineering at college and made it my career until retirement. Sure, you have to have some basic skills in mathematics but not as advanced as you'd think. Sure, you have to have some basic I am generally poor at mathematics and get my computers to any math I need done.

That sounds like it was a while ago. Software engineering nowadays requires quite a bit of math, to get the degree, not the actual work, to be clear. Not like a physics degree or anything, but also not nothing.

6 hours ago, chaifan said:

That was my process, too.  I wasn't able to figure it out during the show because a) I missed what they were supposed to pay the guard, and b) I couldn't read it all fast enough each time they flashed it on the screen.  But when PurpleTenticle posted it above, it took me less than 30 seconds.

Yeah, had to pause it and they said the 5 Groschen part pretty late. Phil did very much not say it during his long winded explaination.

[vousviou]

7 hours ago, Hera said:

I think stick shift drama is slowly going to become a thing of the past (at least in European legs). The EU voted to ban the sale of new cars with internal combustion engines by 2035. Electric cars, which don't need a manual transmission, are going to become way more common.

Thanks, that's a good explanation. 

But maybe the regs will have an exemption for vintage cars, and we can see teams racing 1968 Ferarris down the Autobahn! Or we can at least dream....

[iMonrey]

9 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

Yup. The math wasn't that hard if you didn't get discouraged. Of course I'm not sure how their head space is just coming from asia in the summer. But even with half a brain, this should be doable.

Sign:

• 1 Groschen = 24 Heller
• 4 Heller = 1 Rappen
• 2 Rappen = 1 Witten

My problem was that I didn't recognize "Groschen" on the sign at first. But I wasn't standing there looking at it, I was just getting brief glimpses of camera shots. Once I recognized the word I could have figured it out. And believe me, math was always my achilles heel. Then again, I never had a problem with adding, subtracting, division or fractions. It was theoretical math that shut my brain down. 

7 hours ago, chaifan said:

If someone in that position wanted to be really evil about it, they could have said "I don't think that's right, I got a different number" but actually telling the guard 15.  That would have left everyone else thinking 15 was wrong and wasting time trying to figure out the "right" number. 

That's fair. Anna Leigh was nice enough to let the others know 15 was the right number. Would have been interesting to know if she would have done that for Joel and Garrett or Rob and Corey who she swore to come after. But, Anna Leigh just isn't enjoyable to watch. She's wound too tight and just doesn't seem to appreciate the experience the way others are. You can be a good racer and have fun too, just look at Rob and Corey, Greg and John, Joel and Garrett, Andrea and Malaina and (sniff, sniff) Liam and Yeremi. I want to root for people having a good time, not people who are sniping at each other.

[aghst]

Navigation pretty much decided the order in which the teams finished.

AL and Steve bickered over directions as did the sisters.

The beard guys didn’t bicker but they went from front of the pack to the end because they couldn’t find the parking garage in Cologne.

I think the brothers who won the leg got smart phone directions right after repelling and really pulled ahead to Cologne and all the tasks they had to do before the pit stop.

I think everyone got smart phone navigation at least once during the leg.  The best friends got smart phone directions more than once and still took forever to find the right ferry.

They all pretty much had to ask someone to look up the combination for the lock task.

So why again are they not allowed to use their own phones?  It’s guaranteed that racers will have to get navigation from smart phones and trivia info. like the oldest cologne from Cologne.  It’s not about using paper maps and it probably isn’t about interactIng with bystanders because any interaction is very minimal, get the info, thank them, rush on.

Or they do want racers to win legs or be eliminated based solely on navigation errors.

The soccer dart task is potentially the easiest or the hardest.  It would be interesting to compare the amount of time it took the father and son to get it compared to the mustard tasting tImes.

 

 

 

[JH Lipton]

Start times went from 6:42 for Greg and John to 9:18 for Robbin $ Chelea

Another mix-up for end times:

20 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

Weird hearing the Baron von Münchhausen refered to exclusively as "baron of lies". I guess it's true that he has the colloquial titel of Lügenbaron, but usually you'd use his name.

I thought that was weird too.  Maybe now that "Munchhausen by proxy" is a known psychological condition, it might be confusing to use his name.

[aradia22]

Quote

Except you also add in the adrenaline pumping which makes it way harder to calm down and think logically.  That every second added could cost your team the race and you are letting down your partner and your body is so pumped up coupled with killer fatigue and yes not eating since the meal on the plane and the stress factor simply cannot be duplicated while sitting on one's couch.

Eh... We can make all the excuses in the world. Corey and Morgan flew through it. There's no reason they'd be less tired than the others. And remember how much they struggled at the word puzzle in episode 1? I think some of them just aren't very bright. When @PurpleTentacle wrote out the conversion, I did it in my head. And I'm not particularly good at math. I figured out how many witten = 1 groschen and then multiplied by 5. The only "difficult" math is 24/4 =6. Then you divide by 2 to get 3 witten. 3 x 5 = 15

[PurpleTentacle]

5 hours ago, aghst said:

The beard guys didn’t bicker but they went from front of the pack to the end because they couldn’t find the parking garage in Cologne.

I'm pretty sure there was more to it than not being able to find the parking garage, we were not shown. I don't think Robbin and Chelsea could have caught up if that was the only thing. There probably was a traffic jam on the Autobahn or something. Maybe some teams even took a wrong turn, because half the signage on the Autobahn we saw was crossed out, because of course there are a quadrillion construction sites, which can get pretty confusing, even if you have point to point navigation (I speak from experience).

I wish they had shown us what actually happened. Just circling a parking garage was certainly not it.

5 hours ago, aghst said:

So why again are they not allowed to use their own phones?

Because then this would have been a boring-ass leg, with point to point navigation allowing for no shakeups. Everybody would have gotten to the correct ferry, everybody would have gotten to the parking garage right away, etc. Asking people with a smartphone and then having to remember the direction is not the same as a female computer voice telling you every turn you have to make.

5 hours ago, aghst said:

Or they do want racers to win legs or be eliminated based solely on navigation errors.

Yes, self navigation is an integral part of the race and 98% a skill-issue. Penn and Kim pretty much won their season on navigation. Of course they almost exclusively only had self driving because of covid.

It's very unsatisfying if poor navigation from a taxi driver knocks a team out, like last episode, it is very satisfying if a team knocks themselves out with poor navigation, like in this one.

3 hours ago, JH Lipton said:

I thought that was weird too.  Maybe now that "Munchhausen by proxy" is a known psychological condition, it might be confusing to use his name.

Münchhausen syndrom is named after the baron of Münchhausen, since it's basically lying about your medical symptoms and he was a famous liar. Münchhausen by proxy is just a more nasty form of it, where a parent or caregiver lies about the medical symptoms of their child / makes the child sick on purpose.

So I think it would be more informative than confusing...

Edited November 11, 2023 by PurpleTentacle

[mbluecpa]

8 hours ago, aghst said:

The soccer dart task is potentially the easiest or the hardest.  It would be interesting to compare the amount of time it took the father and son to get it compared to the mustard tasting tImes.

Definitely agree on that - it looked like it could take all day unless you had skill and a strategy. Rob and Corey (who had both) completed it on their sixth attempt, so it might’ve taken them…10, maybe 15 minutes? Hard to judge the mustard task because of editing but I’d guess the first-try successes were in the same time ballpark. 

[iMonrey]

12 hours ago, aghst said:

So why again are they not allowed to use their own phones?  It’s guaranteed that racers will have to get navigation from smart phones and trivia info. like the oldest cologne from Cologne.  It’s not about using paper maps and it probably isn’t about interactIng with bystanders because any interaction is very minimal, get the info, thank them, rush on.

I see a difference between stopping and asking a local to look up directions to something, and having a smartphone in your own hand the whole leg using a navigation app. It's never been out of bounds to stop and ask a local for directions, even before smartphones were so common, so the only thing that's really changed is the proliferation of smartphones in the world.

[aghst]

7 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

Because then this would have been a boring-ass leg, with point to point navigation allowing for no shakeups. Everybody would have gotten to the correct ferry, everybody would have gotten to the parking garage right away, etc. Asking people with a smartphone and then having to remember the direction is not the same as a female computer voice telling you every turn you have to make.

 

6 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

I see a difference between stopping and asking a local to look up directions to something, and having a smartphone in your own hand the whole leg using a navigation app. It's never been out of bounds to stop and ask a local for directions, even before smartphones were so common, so the only thing that's really changed is the proliferation of smartphones in the world.

So then it wouldn't have been a navigation task, it would have been a memorization task.

They're allowed to write down direction they get from bystander phones so it's not a memorization task either.

It's a transcription task!

Even with explicit point to point task, you run into traffic because there's constant road construction.  So people do real detours.

For the lock code, they definitely needed the Internet.  I guess in some earlier seasons they went to cybercafes.

If the bystanders were always locals, you could say at least they interacted with the locals.  But in a lot of cases, they're American tourists, even fans of the show.

Some bystanders are eager to help out and sign waivers to have their faces shown on the show and some on this episode had their faces blurred.

The Amazing Race, stuck in the 20th century, except contestants can ask 21st century bystanders!

 

 

 

[Cotypubby]

51 minutes ago, aghst said:

 

So then it wouldn't have been a navigation task, it would have been a memorization task.

They're allowed to write down direction they get from bystander phones so it's not a memorization task either.

It's a transcription task!

Even with explicit point to point task, you run into traffic because there's constant road construction.  So people do real detours.

For the lock code, they definitely needed the Internet.  I guess in some earlier seasons they went to cybercafes.

If the bystanders were always locals, you could say at least they interacted with the locals.  But in a lot of cases, they're American tourists, even fans of the show.

Some bystanders are eager to help out and sign waivers to have their faces shown on the show and some on this episode had their faces blurred.

The Amazing Race, stuck in the 20th century, except contestants can ask 21st century bystanders!

 

 

 

You ask this every single season and are always given the same answers. I get that you want the racers to have phones. It’s not happening. The race would be boring as hell if that happened.

[Ducky]

On 11/9/2023 at 2:27 AM, Lantern7 said:

Rob & Corey continue to impress. Okay, I was a little bothered that Rob got the 4711 clue from Ashlie, mostly because I thought cooperation between teams was limited after the Mine Five ran TAR32 into the ground. On the flip side, he and Corey were the only team to play soccer darts. I think they're the team that gives the best interviews . . . like the arguing about who was better at soccer.

 

LOL- that was one of my favorite moments of the ep- Rob and Corey arguing about who was best at Darts (not soccer).  Playing Darts is a big thing in the deaf community- I used to be a part of a Deaf darts team when I lived in Colorado (still have the shirt too).

Sad to see the Philly pair go :( but navigation - or lack of it- really burned them.  No idea what happened fully since we only get snippets on screen but it seems like they handled the elimination with grace (the comment about the party being held already without them was memorable).  

Steve and Anna Leigh sure showed another side of themselves this episode- and not a pretty one.  Still don't care for them though I like Steve a bit more.  

Greg and John continue to impress and I love them for the finale three.

Rob and Corey- they're just amazing overall- I'd be on the ground crying with that Soccer Dart (Dart Soccer?) detour after a bunch of tries lol.  They definitely stopped for a minute to see how they could improve their odds and it worked. (BTW- loved the silent laughter in the talking heads- visual communication at its finest lol).

Garrett and Joel- kind of lukewarm with them though liked that they at least didn't melt down thinking they were last.

Lena and Morgan- ooof... I feel like after the India (KF) leg they were more apt to be at each other throats.  I'm terrible with directions and probably would have done the same thing that one of the sisters did turn right instead of left (I do that enough when I use google maps!)

Robbin and Chelsea- eh...they seemed...I don't know like what others have said like they aren't enjoying it much though they seem enthused at the mat for a 2nd place finish(!!? was so sure they'd be lower down in the order)

Todd and Ashlie- not much to say but they were smart to switch detours and Todd admitted that he wasn't quite thinking clearly regarding his wife's preference (and not doing well with the ball kicking).

Malaina and Andrea- they were fun to watch even with the out of towners deal and I love that they barely bickered (maybe some)- their friendship is strong.  Thems the breaks that they had such a bad leg- was sad they didn't get to enjoy the carnival and the horse-bike.

My final three- Greg/John, Rob/Corey, toss up between Garrett/Joel,  Lena/Morgan (even with all their bickering) and Todd/Ashlie.  Chelsea/Robbin and Steve/Anna Leigh I'd like to see walk off into the sunset.

[PurpleTentacle]

7 hours ago, aghst said:

So then it wouldn't have been a navigation task, it would have been a memorization task.

They're allowed to write down direction they get from bystander phones so it's not a memorization task either.

It's a transcription task!

It's not a task at all. It's just navigation.

By your definition putting on clothes in the morning is a task, because if you try to run the race naked, you'll get arrested and eliminated.

 

 

[iMonrey]

On 11/11/2023 at 11:07 AM, aghst said:

For the lock code, they definitely needed the Internet.  I guess in some earlier seasons they went to cybercafes.

I don't know how well known that cologne is, but right there in Cologne? It's possible some random local would know the answer to that without having to look it up. So no, I don't think they needed the internet. But having the internet just made it so easy it almost wasn't worth being a mystery when everyone and their brother is walking around with the internet in their pocket. 

In a way I think this speaks to how smartphones are making us dumber. (Or at least lazier.) In the olden (pre-phone) days if you stopped and asked someone directions or what some local thing was, you'd either find someone who knew, or you wouldn't and would keep searching. Now nobody has to think anymore or search, everyone just pulls out their phone. 

It is making the race easier, I grant you that. I don't think there's much they can do about it though, and I think if the racers themselves had their phones it would be much too easy and kind of pointless. 

[dgpolo]

On 11/10/2023 at 9:30 AM, mbluecpa said:

At least three or four teams seemed to get the mustard task on the first try. I’m thinking either some non-TV-worthy attempts were edited out or the task designers misjudged the difficulty.

Really? I didn't see any that got it first try.

On 11/10/2023 at 9:18 AM, shura said:

I also wonder what kind of training the crew people have.  How you do not give away to the racers that something extraordinarily wrong is happening? Those guys must be good at poker.

How many times have we seen the cameraperson sneakily show whatever the team was looking for, I recall one memorable time when a team was looking for the clue box on a bridge and walked right past it several times while the camera was showing it -right there-

[JH Lipton]

On 11/11/2023 at 1:50 AM, PurpleTentacle said:

IMünchhausen syndrom is named after the baron of Münchhausen, since it's basically lying about your medical symptoms and he was a famous liar. Münchhausen by proxy is just a more nasty form of it, where a parent or caregiver lies about the medical symptoms of their child / makes the child sick on purpose.

So I think it would be more informative than confusing...

I'm not sure how they make it informative.  Any kind of PSA, in the show or after, is going to seem kind of weird.  But it's a moot point so i won't say more.

On 11/11/2023 at 9:07 AM, aghst said:

For the lock code, they definitely needed the Internet.  I guess in some earlier seasons they went to cybercafes.

1 hour ago, iMonrey said:

I don't know how well known that cologne is, but right there in Cologne? It's possible some random local would know the answer to that without having to look it up. So no, I don't think they needed the internet. But having the internet just made it so easy it almost wasn't worth being a mystery when everyone and their brother is walking around with the internet in their pocket.

At least one local knew what they wanted without looking it up.  One racer asked for a cologne that had a 4 digit name and got the answer immediately.

[aghst]

2 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I don't know how well known that cologne is, but right there in Cologne? It's possible some random local would know the answer to that without having to look it up. So no, I don't think they needed the internet. But having the internet just made it so easy it almost wasn't worth being a mystery when everyone and their brother is walking around with the internet in their pocket. 

In a way I think this speaks to how smartphones are making us dumber. (Or at least lazier.) In the olden (pre-phone) days if you stopped and asked someone directions or what some local thing was, you'd either find someone who knew, or you wouldn't and would keep searching. Now nobody has to think anymore or search, everyone just pulls out their phone. 

It is making the race easier, I grant you that. I don't think there's much they can do about it though, and I think if the racers themselves had their phones it would be much too easy and kind of pointless. 

Well you can say lazier but I would argue more convenient.

What are you going to do for that information, go to a public library, maybe go through microfiches of old newspapers or magazines to find an article which lists the oldest cologne in Cologne?

Or go to some department store and go to the perfume counter and see if a saleswoman knows?

You definitely have to work harder and come up with ideas to look for that piece of information, might exercise your  brain as well as your body.

But obviously they don't have time during the race to go off on such a search./

So unless this information was commonly known by residents there, it was going to require a smart phone.

 

Yes one bystander told one of the racers what the number was but are we sure he or she wasn't someone who observed another racer get that information from another bystander?

Or the same person had already looked it up for a previous racer?

I've lived by San Francisco all my life and I couldn't say when the Ghiradelli Chocolate factory was founded or the oldest winery in Napa.

Does everyone in Kentucky know the oldest whiskey in the state or the most expensive?

 

[Lady Calypso]

Tough leg for Andrea and Malaina this time around. They got lost just getting to the ferry; it looked like it took them at least a couple of hours just to get the right coins, but the fact that Phil met them at the carnival goes to show that they were SUPER behind. It's a shame, but that's what happens when navigation does you in. I liked their team a lot, and I love that they were still supportive of each other to the very end.

Lots of team shake-ups this time around, I guess thanks to the equalizer, but also to do with how many teams couldn't navigate in Cologne to the parking garage. 

Per the debate on the use of cell phones when asking locals or other tourists with help from a task, I think it's fine. There's a lot of tasks that require teams to figure it out on their own. Plus, we've seen instances where they ask people for help, but they get told the wrong place. There's always instances of getting help going very wrong (even with getting the wrong taxi driver or whatever) so a little help in figuring out an answer through someone else's cell phone is fine with me. I think there was an equalizer in the lock road block, since you had to FIND the lock in a seas of locks. 

I know Morgan/Lena's fighting should bother me but....sisters, am I right? I think it's because I see me and my sister in Morgan/Lena that I just have to laugh at their bickering. 

Steve/Anna Leigh fighting was great. I was wondering when Steve would finally lose it and tell his daughter to shut up. That being said, she wasn't wrong about Steve needing to navigate better since she couldn't. But it was nice that, once they got to the carnival, it was a reflection moment for Anna Leigh to stop the bickering. After that, she did seem to pull it together.

Ashlie helping Rob with the lock roadblock was really nice. I figured Rob would find someone to ask, as he does sometimes verbally communicate, but Ashlie helping him saved some time that likely would have been lost with the communication barrier. 

This leg was definitely a mix of easier tasks with harder tasks. I do like how Rob/Corey stuck out the foot dark task and got it done. 

I was fine with Chelsea decided to game the coin roadblock by just going back and forth, because it's still a strategy and she still had to keep going back and forth until she hit 15 coins. But I think, with a lot of other tasks being harder and not so easy to find a workaround, I think it balances out. If all the tasks had been super easy, I might have been more annoyed, but also even if Chelsea had stuck it out and genuinely tried, Andrea/Malaina would have still been last. Chelsea would have had to be there for hours, at that point. That being said, having her need to wait at least a minute between each guess would have been a little bit better.

I love Rob/Corey and Greg/John still, and am becoming a fan of Todd/Ashlie. I really thought Todd/Ashlie would be my most hated pair this season since they didn't start off great for me. But Todd/Ashlie have been working together quite well and their attitude has been great. I really don't hate any teams. I'm only really annoyed by Steve/Anna Leigh and a bit by Robbin/Chelsea (but I admire the latter team). But there's no teams I'm actively rooting against. 

Speaking of Robbin/Chelsea, yet another instance where Robbin decides she's just gonna outright ignore any team who tries to talk to her. I mean, she's racing, which is all I want to see, but it's just adding to Robbin/Chelsea vs the rest of the teams narrative. I don't think it would have hurt to show Ashlie the type of lock, as she still had to find it, but I guess if she was racing to stay at the top, it makes sense. I know Robbin/Chelsea are under no obligation to help teams, but the list keeps growing with them refusing to even talk to other teams during the race, at this point. It's just a funny side plot for them.

 

[dgpolo]

42 minutes ago, aghst said:

I've lived by San Francisco all my life and I couldn't say when the Ghiradelli Chocolate factory was founded or the oldest winery in Napa.

Does everyone in Kentucky know the oldest whiskey in the state or the most expensive?

My daughter pointed out that the question specifically asked for a cologne with a 4 digit name, not the the oldest. Given -that- question I'm sure a lot of people in Cologne could've answered that. (especially since someone upthread said they saw it on a building). Someone in Tennessee might not know the -oldest- whiskey in the state but they might know -Old #7-.

[mbluecpa]

3 hours ago, dgpolo said:

Really? 

Yes, unless there’s footage of fails on the Amazing Cutting Room Floor.  At least three teams were shown with a single, successful attempt: Todd/Ashlie, Steve/Anna Leigh, and Morgan/Lena.  Joel/Garrett were as well, but footage of them at the mustard task was really brief. Greg/John and Robbin/Chelsea were shown taking two attempts, and of course Andrea/Malaina didn’t reach that stage.

[iMonrey]

Some things I noticed on re-watch:

It was fifteen miles from the airport to the ferry, and most teams seemed to have a little notepad they wrote directions down in. We don't know how they got those directions (or where they got the notepads, for that matter). Robbin said they Googled it, so they must have all stopped somewhere at the airport once they got their first clue, which we didn't see either. 

I think Morgan is the vinegar to Lena's oil. She was sniping at her before they even had trouble navigating. When she finished the castle Roadblock, all Lena asked was if it was hard and Morgan snotted back "I went to the number one MBA school in America, I know how to do math." Way to be snide about it.

At first I was going to credit Anna Leigh with being nice about telling Todd and Garrett that 15 was the right number of Witten, but it was actually Todd and Garrett who figured that out and told her. She was just the first to try it, then called back that it was right. They already knew that, and it's not as if she could have fooled them and said it was wrong. She wouldn't have come back. So she really didn't do anything there.

The look on Greg's face while Phil explained about the cannonball guy was priceless. Like he was feigning interest while waiting to see what place they were in.

What I really want to know is . . . who ate their sausages? Joel and Garrett ate them right then and there, and it looked like Todd was eating his as they were leaving. Anna Leigh, Lena and Morgan carried theirs all the way to the pitstop. But I think Greg and John threw theirs away. They had them in hand while grabbing their backpacks but the next shot of them was ripping open the clue and they were gone. I'm not sure I would have wanted to eat a whole sausage after eating all that mustard, frankly. But it would be a shame to waste them. Made me hungry for sausage.

4 hours ago, aghst said:

What are you going to do for that information, go to a public library, maybe go through microfiches of old newspapers or magazines to find an article which lists the oldest cologne in Cologne?

So unless this information was commonly known by residents there, it was going to require a smart phone.

I think that's the point, it's fairly commonly known, since they are in Cologne. We even saw a sign above a store with 4711 on it. The show's not going to ask them to find something so obscure you'd need to go to a library, even before smartphones were common it was always something you could ask the locals about until you found one who knew it. 

4 hours ago, aghst said:

Yes one bystander told one of the racers what the number was but are we sure he or she wasn't someone who observed another racer get that information from another bystander?

That sounds vaguely like a conspiracy theory. There are a lot of people walking along that bridge, the chances that the very first person Steve asked was someone who saw another team get the answer are pretty slim. 

4 hours ago, aghst said:

I've lived by San Francisco all my life and I couldn't say when the Ghiradelli Chocolate factory was founded or the oldest winery in Napa.

No, but you'd know where Ghiradelli Square is, and if you lived in Napa you'd probably know which winery was the oldest. If you didn't you could probably find someone who did, with or without the internet. I've never seen the show throw anything at the racers they couldn't find out by asking around. Ever. Cell phones just make it a lot easier but they could do the race without them. They did for years!

[chaifan]

7 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I don't know how well known that cologne is, but right there in Cologne? It's possible some random local would know the answer to that without having to look it up. So no, I don't think they needed the internet.

My guess is that the knowledge of Cologne 4711 for people in Cologne is equivalent to Chanel No. 5 as far as the number is concerned.  As in, if you asked a random person "what popular perfume has a single digit number in it?", most people would know. 

 

4 hours ago, Lady Calypso said:

Speaking of Robbin/Chelsea, yet another instance where Robbin decides she's just gonna outright ignore any team who tries to talk to her. I mean, she's racing, which is all I want to see, but it's just adding to Robbin/Chelsea vs the rest of the teams narrative. I don't think it would have hurt to show Ashlie the type of lock, as she still had to find it, but I guess if she was racing to stay at the top, it makes sense.

Oh, I'm going to totally side with Robbin on that one.  100%.  Knowing what the locks looked like would be a huge advantage - they were very distinct from the other types.  I also would not have helped another team on that.  That could wipe out a significant lead you had on another team. 

Now, what Ashlie did, giving the number to Rob?  To me, that's different.  As others have noted, getting the cologne # from anyone around (whether they had a cell phone or not) took almost no time at all.  Ashlie could have put her team a minute or two ahead of Rob & Corey by saying nothing.  Being nice here really didn't cost her, or give a significant advantage to another team.  And it may come back in her favor later in the race.  Also, while I think Rob could have handled it even without an interpreter, it saved him more frustration than time. 

The sausages...  I think it was Joel/Garrett who commented that they hadn't eaten since (I think) 6am.  Hell, yes, I'd be snarfing those sausages down!  I was surprised people had them in their hands at the pit stop.  I'd think carrying  them would slow me down more than eating them!

That comment made me wonder... what do the camera and sound crew do as far as eating/drinking?  Do they eat and drink in front of the teams?  That seems a bit rude, especially if the teams are starving in between pit stops.  But it also seems necessary.  I wonder if they try to be a little discrete about it - eating a snack during a natural down time in filming when they can step away from their team for a minute or two? 

Are teams allowed to pack snacks?  Can they grab fruit or whatever from a pitstop and shove it in their packs?  Can they pack protein bars from home?

[StevedeMena]

On 11/8/2023 at 10:30 PM, dancingdreamer said:

I'll miss my pink ladies" out of towners ". But half way through, we knew they were going to be last.
 

Why were Malaina and Andrea referred to as the “out of towners”?  Maybe it’s some pop culture reference I don’t get 🤔

[Seelouis]

2 hours ago, StevedeMena said:

Why were Malaina and Andrea referred to as the “out of towners”?  Maybe it’s some pop culture reference I don’t get 🤔

Because they always yelled “out of towners” whenever they were running through a crowd of people. 

[QuantumMechanic]

22 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I don't know how well known that cologne is, but right there in Cologne? It's possible some random local would know the answer to that without having to look it up.

In fact, one random local did know it without looking it up!

[iMonrey]

15 hours ago, chaifan said:

Now, what Ashlie did, giving the number to Rob?  To me, that's different.  As others have noted, getting the cologne # from anyone around (whether they had a cell phone or not) took almost no time at all.  Ashlie could have put her team a minute or two ahead of Rob & Corey by saying nothing.  Being nice here really didn't cost her, or give a significant advantage to another team.  And it may come back in her favor later in the race.  Also, while I think Rob could have handled it even without an interpreter, it saved him more frustration than time.

Frankly I was worried about Rob doing this task, because we have yet to see him try to communicate with anyone other than Corey, and I don't know how well that would have gone down. I did feel like trying to get the info from Ashlie was a little beat of a cop-out, but the fact that Ashlie was nice enough to write it down for him raised my opinion of her tenfold. Todd and Ashlie seem to be the also-rans nobody cares about, but I like them and I wouldn't mind if they won. 

(I also got a kick out of Todd admitting choosing the wrong Detour was a "husband fail.")

Edited November 13, 2023 by iMonrey

[blackwing]

I liked Andrea and Malaina, and their navigation issues took all the suspense out of this episode.  I did like their continued positive attitudes and I felt bad for them when Malaina was saying "maybe we're in first".  They didn't argue with each other or blame each other at all.  The strength of their friendship really shone through despite their troubles.

On 11/9/2023 at 1:27 AM, Lantern7 said:

Anna Leigh . . . I bet she's a real sweetheart in real life. With the pressure of the show, however, she's a bit too much. It didn't help that even her father is getting fed up. I did enjoy them trying to pronounce that one German mustard for what seemed like an eternity.

On 11/9/2023 at 8:23 AM, chaifan said:

I know we only get short snippets of what's going on, but Steve didn't look like he was even trying to navigate.  I get why AL was snippy with him.  And for him to tell her to shut her "smart ass mouth"???  Wow.  Dude, she's been carrying you for most of this race.  Also, never an appropriate thing to say to your daughter. 

Anna Leigh is a real peach.  I don't think she's a sweetheart in real life.  Someone else upthread said that it's Steve's fault because he basically raised her like a man, which I don't agree with.  The Type A aggressiveness that she exhibits isn't limited only to men.

People on these threads have been commenting about the nasty way she talks to her father and bosses him around, so I was glad to see him stand up for himself and tell her not to talk to him that way.

I don't agree that she's been carrying him for the race, only in the sense that I get the feeling that if she could have run the race solo, she would have.  She clearly thinks her father is an incompetent, slow, lazy boob.  So why did she pick him for a race partner?  Did she want to race with her husband or a friend and they couldn't get the time off?  It seems obvious to me that her father likely wasn't her first choice but either he was the only one available, or the producers really wanted a father/daughter team.  The way she treats him is abysmal.

Even with the mustard, she has to be difficult.  The name was meritalling or something like that.  It had an R in it.  She said a number of times that there is no R, it's a D, or something like that.  Even to the German guy himself.  Finally he said there is an R and she didn't even acknowledge that she had insisted there was no R.  Anna Leigh seems to be a person who is unable to acknowledge that she is ever wrong.

On 11/8/2023 at 10:04 PM, tracyscott76 said:

Morgan & Lena are such a mess, I love it. "Slow downnnn!" as she's running after Morgan on the big horse bike 😆

You can sooo picture what they were like as kids, it's hilarious.

On 11/9/2023 at 7:52 AM, PhD-Purgatory15 said:

Everybody keeps hating on Ana Leigh, while I'm over here watching the older of the two sisters in horror. She hates, no loathes her little sister with a passion. It literally drips off her every time she belittles her.

I'm not sure which one is which.  Is the little sister the one that was driving and doesn't know her left from her right?  She is also the one that was screaming at the other one at the dolls and almost got poked in the eye with a needle?  That is the one I can't stand.  She's bossy and controlling and always telling her sister what to do.

 

On 11/9/2023 at 7:03 AM, Ancaster said:

I cannot for the life of me understand why teams don't take the divide and conquer approach for task such as the mustard tasting - you have 9 flavours: one of you learns four and one of you learns five, instead of both of you trying to learn 9 each.  Doh!

I don't think that would be the best approach since the tasting was blind.  When they go to taste a pot, one says "this one wasn't mine", the other says "no it wasn't mine either".  I think the best approach would be for both to taste them all, but perhaps one person make sure they learn the name and pronunciation correctly.

On 11/8/2023 at 11:08 PM, Jodithgrace said:

Who was the racer who didn’t bother doing the written math, but instead brought different numbers of coins to the counter until she got it right? Pretty smart. 

I thought it was lazy and terrible.  I wish there had been a ten minute penalty in between wrong guesses.  As it was, because she was the only one there, she didn't even have to wait in line for others to take their turn.  She just walked back and forth.

On 11/9/2023 at 1:04 PM, Tango64 said:

Loved this episode, but I don't like how much they relied on asking people to use their cellphones. I know it's nothing new, but it still seems to take away from the spirit of the task. If they had asked passersby, "Hey, do you know of a cologne from here whose name is a four-digit number?" that would have been better. It would have taken more time probably, but just using someone's cell phone is an easy out and not much fun to watch.

But then again, I guess if you ask people, they're just going to whip out their phones anyway. So maybe it's better not to have a clue that relies on internet research.

I agree, I hate the lazy use of cellphones.  If I were in charge of the race, I would specifically state that you are not allowed to get help from anyone who uses a cellphone otherwise there is a penalty.

At least one local knew the cologne answer without looking it up, so I would say they should just keep asking around until they find someone who knows.  And I would ban asking for directions through maps on the phone.  Go back to using an actual map.

I think back to TAR Classic when the teams got a Tunisian flag and had to keep asking around until they found someone who knew what it was.  I miss the days where Racers didn't automatically just get help from someone's phone.

On 11/9/2023 at 10:34 PM, bunnyface said:

I'm not going to go back and watch, but I seem to remember Robbin and Chelsea being fairly okay in the beginning.  I think Robbin is sucking all the fun out of Chelsea.  She's very snappish and churlish with Chelsea at times.  I think Chelsea is tired of it and if it were me, I might have kicked Robbin in the neck by now.

I can't stand Robbin.  It seems she's been dealt a rough lot in life, with her brain tumor and dead husband, so I want to cut her some slack.  But she seems like a thoroughly miserable person.  She and Chelsea got four of the 9 U-Turn votes.  Some may say that they were targeted by the trailing teams as someone to try and get out of the race, but why them?  Why wouldn't others have targeted the sisters, or the hapless brothers, or someone else?  I can only think that they got four votes because they are unlikeable.

I agree that Chelsea looks miserable, but I chalk that up to having to be with Robbin every single minute of the day.

Edited November 13, 2023 by blackwing

[dgpolo]

2 hours ago, iMonrey said:

(I also got a kick out of Todd admitting choosing the wrong Detour was a "husband fail.")

I did not, only because it seemed he was putting all of the blame on 'my wife couldn't do it' and didn't seem to acknowledge that he barely hit the target either.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, blackwing said:

I'm not sure which one is which.  Is the little sister the one that was driving and doesn't know her left from her right?  She is also the one that was screaming at the other one at the dolls and almost got poked in the eye with a needle?  That is the one I can't stand.  She's bossy and controlling and always telling her sister what to do.

Based on this, it's actually both of them you can't stand.

Lena is the younger sister who was having trouble keeping track of her right and left while driving.

Morgan is the older sister who was micromanaging Lena's sewing and almost got poked in the eye with the needle. Morgan is also the one who made a passive-aggressive swipe at Lena making sure she knew which continent India is in, and who got snippy over Lena complimenting her speed at the math Roadblock and came back with "I went to one of the best MBA programs".

In short, Morgan is the controlling one, and Lena is the one who goes from 0 to 100 on the freak-out scale, probably because she's tired of Morgan looking down on her.

I personally think they are hilarious and I think it's fascinating watch them be calm and composed and adult in the calmer moments and talking heads, and then instantly transform into their c. 11-16 year old selves.

But you're free to not stand them. Just wanted you to be clearer on where to direct your disdain :P

[PurpleTentacle]

21 hours ago, JH Lipton said:

I'm not sure how they make it informative.  Any kind of PSA, in the show or after, is going to seem kind of weird.  But it's a moot point so i won't say more.

By people googling why both have the same name. If they aren't interested enough to do that they are not interested enough to be bothered.

19 hours ago, chaifan said:

My guess is that the knowledge of Cologne 4711 for people in Cologne is equivalent to Chanel No. 5 as far as the number is concerned.  As in, if you asked a random person "what popular perfume has a single digit number in it?", most people would know. 

I highly doubt that. I may not live in Cologne but not thaaat far away and I had to have my childhood memory triggered by them saying the name. It's really old-people cologne.

So yes, old people would probably know it, but it isn't as widely known Chanel No. 5. That one has permiated pop culture.

1 hour ago, blackwing said:

I agree, I hate the lazy use of cellphones.  If I were in charge of the race, I would specifically state that you are not allowed to get help from anyone who uses a cellphone otherwise there is a penalty.

That's nice in theory, but how would that work in practice? Especially in countries where there is a communication barrier.

[blackwing]

4 hours ago, iMonrey said:

(I also got a kick out of Todd admitting choosing the wrong Detour was a "husband fail.")

1 hour ago, dgpolo said:

I did not, only because it seemed he was putting all of the blame on 'my wife couldn't do it' and didn't seem to acknowledge that he barely hit the target either.

I agree that Todd was just as bad as his wife at it.  It seems that he thinks of himself as a "former professional athlete" and that defines his persona to the point where he thinks he is so athletic that they will automatically choose any sports task.  I was happy to see that he was pretty much as bad as she was.  But at least he did more or less acknowledge that he picked the task without considering her.  He wanted to show off on TV, and instead, he looked like a fool.

10 minutes ago, PurpleTentacle said:

That's nice in theory, but how would that work in practice? Especially in countries where there is a communication barrier.

Teams typically don't have issues finding people who can speak English who can talk with them.  I think the Race could be designed so that teams would have to find different ways of getting the information they need.  They could be supplied with a map, or told where to go to buy a map.  Or they resort to finding an internet cafe, if those still exist.  

In the olden days of the Race I seem to recall many teams purchasing guidebooks or maps at the airport.  I'd like to see some more "old school" racing instead of just having teams automatically looking for the easy answers.  I guess I just miss the old days of the Race when I felt like teams had to be more self-sufficient, or at least had to ask questions of locals who wouldn't just automatically whip out a cell phone to look up answers.

I guess times have changed and technology has advanced since the Race first debuted 20+ years ago.  I also don't like how I don't think we heard any of the Racers say please or thank you, unless I missed it.  It was just "can I use your phone" or "do you have a phone".  What happened to general politeness?

I'm rooting for Greg and John or Rob and Corey.  The beard guys, I'm indifferent.  I slightly dislike Todd and Ashley and I outright dislike the bickering sisters, Robbin, and Anna Leigh.

[Tango64]

5 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

That's nice in theory, but how would that work in practice? Especially in countries where there is a communication barrier.

Just don’t use clues or puzzles that require an internet search or even questioning a local. There have been plenty that involved counting visible items, etc.