S07.E15: Battlefield

[Frozendiva]

2 hours ago, Gobi said:

I blame it on the Ottoman Empire.

A footnote, er, footstool….

[Frozendiva]

5 hours ago, Starlight925 said:

Who goes to an Open House without even knowing the price?  Without looking at photos online?  I call B.S. on that whole fake house tour with Ed & Liz.

Ed going on & on about how amazing he is at "design", gag.  How dare. She. call it. a COUCH.  Shudder.  

Ed is that guy who initially, last season, I wanted to root for.  Poor guy has this unfortunate neck issue, but truly wanted love, and I so wanted him to have it.  Now, I think he's just a jerk with no neck.

A lot of people go to open houses. To see how the other half lives, check out houses in the area, and basically snoop. The average realtor will ask your price range for a home and your needs (transit, close to work, shopping, disabilities (homes with no step railings would be out), size, etc.) before showing you anything. Open houses are not successful in terms of sales.

Edited December 5, 2022 by Frozendiva
Realtor typo

[greekmom]

16 hours ago, AR Traveler said:

I like Sumit's father, too.  I think this is the most he's spoken in the whole saga, and he just states how it is with no manipulation or dramatics.  Living with Mama Sumit must be  exhausting.  We don't have to agree with the culture, but he is part of it and it really feels he's under a lot of pressure and embarrassment.  Jenny has a snowball's chance in getting Sumit to America.  She can't support herself, let alone both of them.  I was wondering if that "marriage" they went through in the temple would be legally recognized in America.

Add me to the list of liking Papa Sumit and to an extent Mama Sumit (yeah I know not a popular choice) but hear me out!  These two have been saddled with a lazy son (yeah again, their own doing but how did the other one turn out ok?). Sumit brings over this woman (who is 30 years his senior) who he met online under sneaky circumstances calling her a friend and saying she will stay only a few weeks as she wants to see India.  Chicken Jenny over stayed her welcome.  To add further insult to Mama and Papa's hospitality, Chicken popped Sumit's cherry as they were sneaking off upstairs in the attic to do the deed while everyone was asleep. I don't know about you, but even though my son is of age, I would get hugely pissed off and want nothing to do with Chicken. Especially with the fact that culturally, this is unacceptable and her circle of friends are laughing their asses off and probably cutting them off.  If anyone watches Karl Rock youtube videos, he and his East Indian wife got alot of flack for marrying from extended family even though they are suited and her parents accepted the match.

Ohhh Chicken will never bring Sumit over to the States. She can't afford it.  It's all TLC storyline.

[Midwestern Lady]

Ed talking about his design esthetic and his taste level while wearing pink crocs.   

[Elizzikra]

Quote

You cannot judge or fault the man for the strength of his conviction if you look at the situation through the lens of their culture.

Why not?

If we never examine our cultural beliefs and challenge them, cultures never change. Sumit's parents don't like Jenny because she is an older, white, American lady. They want Sumit married to a younger, Hindu, Indian woman who will bear children (whether Sumit actually wants them or not). That is racism. 

If we never challenged racism in the US, our culture would not tolerate marriages between people who are of different races or different sexes. If we had all sat back and said "hey, that's our culture, don't judge us" we would never have made progress. Sumit's father has very strong convictions but I still believe they are 1) wrong and 2) have led to his wife, and possibly him, disowning their son. I think that adds up to being a pretty shitty parent.

Quote

Sumit brings over this woman (who is 30 years his senior) who he met online under sneaky circumstances calling her a friend and saying she will stay only a few weeks as she wants to see India.  Chicken Jenny over stayed her welcome.  To add further insult to Mama and Papa's hospitality, Chicken popped Sumit's cherry as they were sneaking off upstairs in the attic to do the deed while everyone was asleep. I don't know about you, but even though my son is of age, I would get hugely pissed off and want nothing to do with Chicken. Especially with the fact that culturally, this is unacceptable and her circle of friends are laughing their asses off and probably cutting them off.  If anyone watches Karl Rock youtube videos, he and his East Indian wife got alot of flack for marrying from extended family even though they are suited and her parents accepted the match.

Sumit chose to start a relationship with Jenny. Sumit chose to cheat on his first wife. Sumit chose to have sex with Jenny under his parents' roof knowing that they would have some sort of problem with it. Sumit was an adult when he made all of these decisions about his relationship with Jenny, who was also a consenting adult.

Yet somehow Sumit's parents dislike... Jenny?

I just can't wrap my head around disowning an adult child for his/her choice in romantic partner, no matter what issues I may have with that partner. It's not my choice. It is my choice to love and support my adult child and to not try to force him/her to make the decisions I want. I get that Papa and Mama Sumit are under a tremendous amount of pressure from their community to try to get Sumit back in line but at the end of the day, they have a choice to make - their son or their friends. This is not a difficult choice for me. And actually, evidently it's not for them. But their choice is very different than mine would be.

[greekmom]

7 minutes ago, Elizzikra said:

Why not?

If we never examine our cultural beliefs and challenge them, cultures never change. Sumit's parents don't like Jenny because she is an older, white, American lady. They want Sumit married to a younger, Hindu, Indian woman who will bear children (whether Sumit actually wants them or not). That is racism. 

If we never challenged racism in the US, our culture would not tolerate marriages between people who are of different races or different sexes. If we had all sat back and said "hey, that's our culture, don't judge us" we would never have made progress. Sumit's father has very strong convictions but I still believe they are 1) wrong and 2) have led to his wife, and possibly him, disowning their son. I think that adds up to being a pretty shitty parent.

Sumit chose to start a relationship with Jenny. Sumit chose to cheat on his first wife. Sumit chose to have sex with Jenny under his parents' roof knowing that they would have some sort of problem with it. Sumit was an adult when he made all of these decisions about his relationship with Jenny, who was also a consenting adult.

Yet somehow Sumit's parents dislike... Jenny?

I just can't wrap my head around disowning an adult child for his/her choice in romantic partner, no matter what issues I may have with that partner. It's not my choice. It is my choice to love and support my adult child and to not try to force him/her to make the decisions I want. I get that Papa and Mama Sumit are under a tremendous amount of pressure from their community to try to get Sumit back in line but at the end of the day, they have a choice to make - their son or their friends. This is not a difficult choice for me. And actually, evidently it's not for them. But their choice is very different than mine would be.

I don't think they hate Jenny because she is white or American.  Big time, it's the age thing. Second, the disrespect that Jenny showed his parents with her first trip to India (if you do a dig in their page, there are photos of Jenny and Mama Sumit sitting on the couch smiling). Third, Jenny and Sumit got it on before he was married. Story goes parents found out, she left in disgrace and they found him a bride to forget Chicken.  If Jenny was a young woman who can provide a grandchild, I don't think that Mama and Papa would have such an issue. 

Yeah I would dislike Jenny myself if she came in my home misrepresenting who she is and why she came there. 

Plus what is good for the gander is also good for the goose. Chicken could have said: "Hey Sumit, why dont you tell your parents that I am your girl?" "Or hey Sumit, why do your parents think that Im here as just a friend?"  before she started fooling around with him?  Chicken likes the whole Romeo & Juliet/star crossed lovers thing.  They are equally at fault. 

[1011101010001]

People judge India but apparently the Irish constitution still provides that a woman’s place is in the home.  A lot of places are less enlightened than the US.

[Back Atcha]

1 hour ago, MrBuhBye said:

A lot of places are less enlightened than the US.

And there are those MORE enlightened.

1 hour ago, Elizzikra said:

It is my choice to love and support my adult child and to not try to force him/her to make the decisions I want.

I agree, but Papa Sumit would continue to explain to both of us that is OUR culture ... not THEIRS.  He's probably too kind to questions some of the things in our "culture" that need improvement.  Can't Jenny and Sumit simply take a visit to America ... travel around and see different places?  Why doesn't TLC make that leap?

[Back Atcha]

6 hours ago, Frozendiva said:

A lot of people go to open houses.

3 hours ago, Midwestern Lady said:

Ed talking about his design esthetic and his taste level while wearing pink crocs.   

Big Ed wasn't merely "going" to an open house.  He had already reasearched that one...told Liz that it had five bedrooms (which she questioned).  He thought it was everything he needed.  Most of us aren't Big Stars like Big Ed, so we usually consider the COST of the house before we drive even a mile.  Mr. San Diego doesn't know his city well if he's surprised by the price of the location/house they toured.   If TLC is FORCED to provide Big Ed with a comfortable living from a television contract, can't they find writers to come up with good storylines?  Big Ed is big on dreaming and bossing Liz.  HOW do people like this fine each other?   

[Elizzikra]

Quote

I don't think they hate Jenny because she is white or American.  Big time, it's the age thing. Second, the disrespect that Jenny showed his parents with her first trip to India (if you do a dig in their page, there are photos of Jenny and Mama Sumit sitting on the couch smiling). Third, Jenny and Sumit got it on before he was married. Story goes parents found out, she left in disgrace and they found him a bride to forget Chicken.  If Jenny was a young woman who can provide a grandchild, I don't think that Mama and Papa would have such an issue. 

Ok - it's less racism and more ageism.

Still not good.

Sumit himself said he never wanted children. His parents don't care. They want a grandchild (from him, since they apparently already have one from the other brother). 

This is all about the parents wanting what they want for their son with no regard for what he wants for himself and what decisions he makes for himself - to the extent that they will disown him if he does not obey. That's where I part company with any fondness I might have for them.

Quote

I agree, but Papa Sumit would continue to explain to both of us that is OUR culture ... not THEIRS.  He's probably too kind to questions some of the things in our "culture" that need improvement.  Can't Jenny and Sumit simply take a visit to America ... travel around and see different places?  Why doesn't TLC make that leap?

I get that. My point is that cultures don't change or evolve until and unless the people living in them start to question some of the core beliefs. I don't give Papa and Mama Sumit a pass on their racism (I believe) and ageism (I also believe) and their blatant disregard of their adult child's wishes because it's "their culture." Our (US) culture used to be different in a lot of ways too and I don't look back on that time and say "hey - discrimination against mixed race couples was ok because that was the culture then."

Edited December 6, 2022 by Elizzikra

[1011101010001]

17 minutes ago, Elizzikra said:

I don't look back on that time and say "hey - discrimination against mixed race couples was ok because that was the culture then."

Yeah we say “boy people were ignorant then.”

[Raine]

16 hours ago, Cementhead said:

I always hear about these mysterious Canadian people who use the word chesterfield instead of couch but in my 49 years of being a Canadian living in Canada, I have never once heard it said by anybody.  I shall someday go on a quest and seek one out. 

I’ve been a Canadian for 75 years and use the word couch, maybe sofa, but never chesterfield.  I’ll join you on that quest. 

[magemaud]

I can’t unsee this when I think of Ed. 

[greekmom]

5 hours ago, Raine said:

I’ve been a Canadian for 75 years and use the word couch, maybe sofa, but never chesterfield.  I’ll join you on that quest. 

Maybe it's a regional thing? Canadian here from Ontario. Couch or sofa is most popular but i have heard on the odd occasion chesterfield.  Anyone from the east coast, west coast, PQ and central Canada we can check in with???

[renatae]

7 hours ago, Elizzikra said:

Ok - it's less racism and more ageism.

Still not good.

Sumit himself said he never wanted children. His parents don't care. They want a grandchild (from him, since they apparently already have one from the other brother). 

This is all about the parents wanting what they want for their son with no regard for what he wants for himself and what decisions he makes for himself - to the extent that they will disown him if he does not obey. That's where I part company with any fondness I might have for them.

I get that. My point is that cultures don't change or evolve until and unless the people living in them start to question some of the core beliefs. I don't give Papa and Mama Sumit a pass on their racism (I believe) and ageism (I also believe) and their blatant disregard of their adult child's wishes because it's "their culture." Our (US) culture used to be different in a lot of ways too and I don't look back on that time and say "hey - discrimination against mixed race couples was ok because that was the culture then."

I originally was giving them a pass because of culture, but when you really look at it, it's not just ageism, etc., it's downright cruelty. I've read a lot of first person accounts from Indian people (and to a certain extent Asian cultures) and what they've been through is appalling. Say they grow up and marry a family approved person. If that person is a female, she generally winds up a slave to the MIL, who basically abuses her. The youngsters are kept under the thumb of the parents, and guilt manipulation is the name of the game. Suicide threats, minimalization and other tricks of narcissists seem to be standard practice.

Here we are with Sumit. He must kowtow to his family or he is cut off. I'm waiting for them to say they don't care if he moves to the US; he's dead to them anyway. This is not love.

[Welshman in Ca]

No amount of pearl clutching from thousands of miles away about another country's customs and way of life is going to change anything just the same way as almost every other country in the world clutching theirs about the amount of guns & lack of gun control in the USA is going to change anything. People in glass houses springs to mind.

Summits parents are not the ones who are going to or want to change the culture in India, they are happy with the status quo.

[ezzy4]

17 hours ago, Midwestern Lady said:

Ed talking about his design esthetic and his taste level while wearing pink crocs.   

^^^^^^^

Bravo!!!!

When visiting my grandparents growing up, they would insist we take a family photo while seated on their davenport. 

Edited December 6, 2022 by ezzy4

[ezzy4]

On 12/5/2022 at 11:18 AM, Elizzikra said:

I agree that the problem is that Sumit has never accepted that he has to choose - between his family and Jenny. He wants both, which is understandable but they have made it quite clear that he has to choose. 

But the thing is ... He DID choose.  He married Jenny.  That was his choice.

The problem is he absolutely feels no responsibility to the consequences of his choice.

(I think some cultures- both family and regional- really struggle with the this sort of thing.  Instead of dealing with real choices/consequences, they place as much emphasis on "intent" as they do on "action".  Which makes it impossible to reslove anything.  Sumit seems fine to linger in unresolved (to him "unresolvable") conflict.  American culture is much more direct and resolution focused.)

[ezzy4]

I gotta say I think Jovi and Yara are perfectly suited for one another.  They both seem to put a lot of importance on very unimportant things like "image" and....well I got nothing else...

I think they hold themselves in very high esteem.  They have that in common.  And since neither seems to have any other interests, hobbies, quirks, talents or personality...well then that's a lot to have in common then.

They can be as boring in Europe as they are in the US.  Why would it matter where they lived?

Edited December 6, 2022 by ezzy4

[the-grey-lady]

On 12/4/2022 at 10:43 AM, Kid said:

No histrionics and, whether you agree with his view or not, he is crystal clear that he is never going to except her and about what he wants to see happen.  And I am sorry, but given that culture and the world within which they live, I understand his position.

I mean, he's been honest the whole time. 

He's not going to accept her, his wife isn't going to accept her, the rest of Sumit's family isn't going to accept her, and their society isn't going to accept her.

Jenny keeps insisting on these meetings and saying "if she isn't going to be accepted" like there's any chance she might be.

She isn't. She's heard it over and over again.

[Kid]

22 minutes ago, the-grey-lady said:

I mean, he's been honest the whole time. 

He's not going to accept her, his wife isn't going to accept her, the rest of Sumit's family isn't going to accept her, and their society isn't going to accept her.

Jenny keeps insisting on these meetings and saying "if she isn't going to be accepted" like there's any chance she might be.

She isn't. She's heard it over and over again.

I agree wholeheartedly with everything you said. But I believe it is Sumit that is insisting on these meetings, and in this case, it was her daughter and daughter-in-law.

[the-grey-lady]

Just now, Kid said:

But I believe it is Sumit that is insisting on these meetings, and in this case, it was her daughter and daughter-in-law.

Oh, that may be. I could have been making assumptions.

[90DayFart]

8 hours ago, greekmom said:

Maybe it's a regional thing? Canadian here from Ontario. Couch or sofa is most popular but i have heard on the odd occasion chesterfield.  Anyone from the east coast, west coast, PQ and central Canada we can check in with???

Canadian here from the Best West Coast! Couch is most common, rarely hear sofa, and only ever heard chesterfield from my grandparents who are long since passed. It's certainly not common, at least not among people that I know 🤷‍♀️ 

[1011101010001]

1 hour ago, the-grey-lady said:

He's not going to accept her, his wife isn't going to accept her, the rest of Sumit's family isn't going to accept her, and their society isn't going to accept her.

Except there was the weird outdoor meeting where they told her that they accepted her and even loved her.   Either they are bipolar or they do things to create plot points.

[Mondrianyone]

I've always thought that a chesterfield was specifically this type of sofa, with rolled arms and tufting:

[Frozendiva]

9 hours ago, greekmom said:

Maybe it's a regional thing? Canadian here from Ontario. Couch or sofa is most popular but i have heard on the odd occasion chesterfield.  Anyone from the east coast, west coast, PQ and central Canada we can check in with???

https://katherinebarber.blogspot.com/2020/05/chesterfield-not-quite-dead.html

[Tuneful]

10 hours ago, greekmom said:

Maybe it's a regional thing? Canadian here from Ontario. Couch or sofa is most popular but i have heard on the odd occasion chesterfield.  

From my childhood in Western New York State -- "davenport." 

[Kid]

7 hours ago, the-grey-lady said:

Oh, that may be. I could have been making assumptions.

The only reason that I believe that to be true was that there were multiple episodes this last season where he was going to try to have another meeting with his parents, and she tried to talk him out of it.  In her TH, she then stated that she she doesn't know why  he doesn't leave it alone as they are never going to accept her.  She is right, of course, except she has NO understanding of the culture in which she is living or she would know why he keeps trying.

Edited December 7, 2022 by Kid

[Elizzikra]

15 hours ago, magemaud said:

I can’t unsee this when I think of Ed. 

OMG! I knew he reminded me of someone!

Quote

No amount of pearl clutching from thousands of miles away about another country's customs and way of life is going to change anything just the same way as almost every other country in the world clutching theirs about the amount of guns & lack of gun control in the USA is going to change anything. People in glass houses springs to mind.

Yup - every country has it's sins and its less desirable features. You can dismiss them as "that's just the culture" or you can view them as opportunities for people to change and grow. Neither option requires pearls or houses of any type, glass or otherwise. 

Quote

But the thing is ... He DID choose.  He married Jenny.  That was his choice.

The problem is he absolutely feels no responsibility to the consequences of his choice.

I can see that. He "chose" by marrying Jenny but he hasn't stopped trying to get back in his parents' good graces, to the point that he is willing to have a child he doesn't want to make them happy. He just needs to man up and own his choices and their consequences.

[magemaud]

39 minutes ago, Elizzikra said:

OMG! I knew he reminded me of someone!

I have to give credit where credit is due. On the Single Life Tell All last night, Shaun asked Caesar a viewer question that was sent in by "Blocked by Ed the Mucinex Snot Guy" and I realized that was who I had been trying to think of, too.

[Raine]

13 hours ago, greekmom said:

Maybe it's a regional thing? Canadian here from Ontario. Couch or sofa is most popular but i have heard on the odd occasion chesterfield.  Anyone from the east coast, west coast, PQ and central Canada we can check in with???

I lived in Ontario for many years, now on the West Coast.  Also lived in Winnipeg for a few years.  I think I qualify in saying it’s pretty much couch or sofa wherever I lived.  I recall my mother saying chesterfield way back when but I think that was dropped a long time ago by most people.  

[1011101010001]

39 minutes ago, Raine said:

I lived in Ontario for many years, now on the West Coast.  Also lived in Winnipeg for a few years.  I think I qualify in saying it’s pretty much couch or sofa wherever I lived.  I recall my mother saying chesterfield way back when but I think that was dropped a long time ago by most people.  

Probably around when doilies went out of fashion.

[anoninrva]

17 hours ago, magemaud said:

I can’t unsee this when I think of Ed. 

[Elizzikra]

Quote

Probably around when doilies went out of fashion.

Wait - doilies aren't in fashion anymore???

[Racj82]

On 12/5/2022 at 1:57 PM, Cementhead said:

Usman giving Jamal a PS5 was one of the weirdest things I have ever seen on this jacked up show and that is saying something.  What next?  A game of catch in the park?  A new skateboard?  A talk about the birds & the bees?  And when Kimberly said she was only 51 I almost fell off the couch chesterfield.

I dont think some you understand that the new Playstation is a big deal. Its not a kid. Grown man and women own them. Some make money that by filming themselves playing certain games. He's not treating him like a kid. And it's really hard to acquire a PS5 at times because of the high demand with inventory not able to match. It was a smart gift. Forcing Jamal to have to schlep it home is not though.

[Gobi]

8 hours ago, Elizzikra said:

Wait - doilies aren't in fashion anymore???

And let's not forget antimacassars.

[Cementhead]

9 hours ago, Racj82 said:

I dont think some you understand that the new Playstation is a big deal. Its not a kid. Grown man and women own them.

Lol, no, I totally get it.  I have a grown man at home in the form of my 50 year old husband who is a gamer.  It was just my piss poor attempt at sarcasm.  😉

[1011101010001]

2 hours ago, Cementhead said:

Lol, no, I totally get it.  I have a grown man at home in the form of my 50 year old husband who is a gamer.  It was just my piss poor attempt at sarcasm.  😉

I do think if Jamal really wanted one he would have one already.

[Pepper Mostly]

On 12/5/2022 at 9:07 AM, Baltimore Betty said:

Bilal and Sheaada, please do not have a child, neither one of you really want a child you just want to argue about it.

I am firm in my conviction that this is nothing more than a storyline and they have committed to it fully. Guaranteed Bilal will either give in or Shaeeda will gleefully announce her pregnancy by the finale. 

On 12/5/2022 at 12:54 PM, Frozendiva said:

Barenaked Ladies - If I had 1,000,000 dollars

My relatives have used the word.  It is officially a couch with large rolled arms. Most likely a piece of language that is phasing out.

Just like "tonic" for soda or "elastic" for rubber band or "packie" for liquor store or "parlor" for living room or "supper" for the evening meal in the Boston area. And for those of us who live outside the city of Boston, a trip to Boston was called "going in town". I miss the old nomenclature, I confess. 

[Baltimore Betty]

1 hour ago, MrBuhBye said:

I do think if Jamal really wanted one he would have one already.

I had a thought about the gift, maybe Jamal is supposed to be wearing the headphones and play with that PS non stop when they are at the hotel to drown out the Yammy noises his mother and new Daddy make to keep Jamal from continuing to throw up in his mouth.

Also, I will continue to refer to all couches, sofas, chesterfields, etc...as divans just to be difficult.

Edited December 7, 2022 by Baltimore Betty

[Elizzikra]

12 minutes ago, Baltimore Betty said:

Also, I will continue to refer to all couches, sofas, chesterfields, etc...as divans just to be difficult.

In our house, you can call them whatever you like but they all end up as dog beds anyway…

[Pepper Mostly]

On 12/5/2022 at 9:11 PM, Elizzikra said:

If we never challenged racism in the US, our culture would not tolerate marriages between people who are of different races or different sexes. If we had all sat back and said "hey, that's our culture, don't judge us" we would never have made progress. Sumit's father has very strong convictions but I still believe they are 1) wrong and 2) have led to his wife, and possibly him, disowning their son. I think that adds up to being a pretty shitty parent.

I agree. And I think its important to note that the views of Sumit's parents are not a blanket depiction of Indian culture across the board. How many of us have seen countless news articles and social media posts of Indian same sex couples or couple of different religions marrying in big splashy traditional Indian weddings with their beaming parents front and center in all the photos? On the Netflix show "the Big Day", which follows Indian engaged couples, one of the couples featured was two men. One of my fave Netflix shows is "Little Things", about a young professional Indian couple who live together openly. They aren't pariahs, their social circle is other young professionals like themselves, and their parents know. There have been a number of Bollywood films that address these issues too. Granted, Bollywood isn't real life but they're influential and do reflect the culture. Sumit's parents are old fashioned, traditional, angry, and yes, shitty parents. 

[Cementhead]

4 hours ago, Gobi said:

And let's not forget antimacassars.

Am I the only one who had to google this word?

34 minutes ago, Pepper Mostly said:

I am firm in my conviction that this is nothing more than a storyline and they have committed to it fully.

I'm with you on this and it is BORING.  Have the fucking baby or don't.  Just STOP TALKING ABOUT IT.

[magemaud]

4 hours ago, Gobi said:

And let's not forget antimacassars.

Why are you against macassars? They never hurt anyone! 

[Hotel Snarker]

PrEd pretending to know anything about interior design was precious.

Did Usman rewrap Kim’s PS5?

Billy telling Michael that he didn't know Angela had a "crush" on him. There is so much evidence to disprove that. There's a scene on YouTube of them video calling and when Billy answers, Angela says "there's my sexy baby". Also, Angela telling him that if he danced for her the way he does in his videos, she would "run out of dollar bills". The way they gaslighted Michael was disgusting. Even the most clueless man would know that if a woman talks to them like that, they are 100 percent attracted to them.

[1011101010001]

1 hour ago, Hotel Snarker said:

PrEd pretending to know anything about interior design was precious.

Did Usman rewrap Kim’s PS5?

Billy telling Michael that he didn't know Angela had a "crush" on him. There is so much evidence to disprove that. There's a scene on YouTube of them video calling and when Billy answers, Angela says "there's my sexy baby". Also, Angela telling him that if he danced for her the way he does in his videos, she would "run out of dollar bills". The way they gaslighted Michael was disgusting. Even the most clueless man would know that if a woman talks to them like that, they are 100 percent attracted to them.

Angela also flirted shamelessly with one of the doctors in California. 

[Gobi]

21 hours ago, Elizzikra said:

In our house, you can call them whatever you like but they all end up as dog beds anyway…

Divan? Chesterfield? I wouldn’t go so fa as to couch it in those terms.

[Racj82]

On 12/7/2022 at 9:29 AM, MrBuhBye said:

I do think if Jamal really wanted one he would have one already.

As I said, they are actually not easy to get. Especially based on the time of filming. Also, expensive. It's not just a matter of want.

[gaPeach]

17 hours ago, Hotel Snarker said:

Billy telling Michael that he didn't know Angela had a "crush" on him. There is so much evidence to disprove that. There's a scene on YouTube of them video calling and when Billy answers, Angela says "there's my sexy baby". Also, Angela telling him that if he danced for her the way he does in his videos, she would "run out of dollar bills". The way they gaslighted Michael was disgusting. Even the most clueless man would know that if a woman talks to them like that, they are 100 percent attracted to them.

This segment has to be the only one I can recall where Angela was not yelling and actually seemed......well, kinda normal.......but then her TH dispelled all that when she said Michael was pushing back for the first time, so she backed off.  But only because he was trying to be "in control or charge".  So, she let him feel that brief moment of victory, knowing she is fixing to bust that shit up and get him back in line.  Did it ever dawn on her he was truly hurt and was pushing back because he has had it with her shit?  I believe she even said she "went too far".  HA!  When hasn't she gone too far?

[1011101010001]

1 hour ago, Racj82 said:

As I said, they are actually not easy to get. Especially based on the time of filming. Also, expensive. It's not just a matter of want.

Most middle class people can afford them and he appears to be middle class.  Also if you really want one you can find one.  They may not be on the shelf at Target but you can track them down.  Kim found one and she is no genius.