Fandom and Viewer Issues: "Fan" Is Short for "Fanatic"

[daxx]

9 hours ago, KingOfHearts said:

Well, yeah, there's those people. Then there's casual watchers who use more words, but they mostly just react. They don't ponder deeper meanings or how the writing is supposed to function.

You mean normal people that don't obsess about tv shows? lol it's true though, most people don't look too closely.

[OnceUponAJen]

I'd have to say I'm hope watching too. Despite feeling disappointed by the plots lately, I really do like most of the cast.  I'm also invested in CS, so I have to see how that ends.

[Souris]

Jen accidentally posted a picture of Ava with her phone number showing on her tag. She deleted it, but people capped it, of course. I hope she's changing her number this instant. Because you know some jerks are going to use it.

[KingOfHearts]

24 minutes ago, Souris said:

Jen accidentally posted a picture of Ava with her phone number showing on her tag. She deleted it, but people capped it, of course. I hope she's changing her number this instant. Because you know some jerks are going to use it.

Jen: "Hello? Who is this?"
Fan: "SWAN QUEEN FOREVER" *hangs up*

Edited March 1, 2017 by KingOfHearts

[Souris]

4 minutes ago, KingOfHearts said:

Jen: "Hello? Who is this?"
Fan: "SWAN QUEEN FOREVER" *hangs up*

Fan text: "SWANQUEEN FOREVER!!" ::graphic manip::

[Souris]

Jen has changed her number. Only thing she could do.

[Curio]

 

The red-headed guy perfectly describes my exasperated relationship with this show. Any time an interview comes out or a bad episode airs, all I can say is, "WHAT?"

Edited March 3, 2017 by Curio

[maryle]

Ok a little rant about the weird obsession between some b a. and JMO.

I don't go over the rainbow of sq fandom because it was bad for my heart.

But, tonight I was interesting to see what the new article by professional journalist will be interpreted in all the fandom.

So, here I go and fall on a Tumblr who I wrote a diatribe strongly hitting that JMO was using her Instagram pic to send coding message to the power that be... I guess? 

And was very demanding and difficult and probably trying to make some shit stirring with this new article.

I just don't understand how I should have trust in someone using the same logic as samcait shipper ( Sam h. and Cait.b from Outlander)  

And I believe JMO is a professional and negotiate  with good will like all the others cast members. There nothing really surprising in the fact that these four actors are the most useful for the show going on.

So maybe people should learn some decency before spreading vile rumor about one actress.

[Kktjones]

@maryle Please don't believe anything that person says. She hates JMo and in continually bashing her for not acknowledging her fanon ship. She hates her as a person and calls Emma's character "blurg." Also her "inside" sources are the voices "inside" her head. She is literally wrong about EVERYTHING. She is trying to stir up shit against JMo as per usual. Just block and move on.

[sharky]

Which is just so bizarre when you consider that JMo is a half of her fanon ship. I just don't understand the hate for JMo from people who declare themselves SQ fans.

[Rumsy4]

From what I've seen, many SF fans also either dislike or just don't care much for Emma. To these kind of fans, it's about the happiness of one half of their ship. If it makes their fav happy--that kind of deal. But when that dislike gets translated to the actors themselves, that's when it becomes toxic. 

[Mari]

I think @Rumsy4 is right. 

Plus, there are characters on other shows I haven't particularly liked, but enjoyed in certain relationships.  I didn't particularly like Cordelia from BtVS, but I did like Cordelia and Xander as a pairing.  It made them both more entertaining, even when I didn't usually like Cordelia on her own.

I can't say why people like Regina more than Emma, but I do get liking one half and not the other.

[superloislane]

I'm guessing SF stands for Swanfire? Are there still Swanfire shippers in existence?

[Mathius]

3 minutes ago, Mari said:

I didn't particularly like Cordelia from BtVS, but I did like Cordelia and Xander as a pairing.  It made them both more entertaining, even when I didn't usually like Cordelia on her own.

Agreed, except that it was Xander who I didn't like on his own, not Cordelia.

[Rumsy4]

Yes--SF stands for Swan Fire. I think most SF fans are retired/semi-retired now.

[Curio]

22 minutes ago, superloislane said:

I'm guessing SF stands for Swanfire? Are there still Swanfire shippers in existence?

The OUAT Reddit forum has a lot of them for some reason.

[KingOfHearts]

Quote

Yes--SF stands for Swan Fire. I think most SF fans are retired/semi-retired now.

All they have is an offscreen baby and a portrait from a fake realm, so.

Quote

Agreed, except that it was Xander who I didn't like on his own, not Cordelia.

Same... I hate Xander, but I love Xander/Cordelia.

Quote

From what I've seen, many SF fans also either dislike or just don't care much for Emma. To these kind of fans, it's about the happiness of one half of their ship. If it makes their fav happy--that kind of deal. But when that dislike gets translated to the actors themselves, that's when it becomes toxic. 

Captain Swan is the only major ship left where I feel like the shippers are equally engaged to both characters. With Rumpbelle, Rumple wears the pants. With Outlaw Queen, it's all about Regina. Snowing is pretty even, but that ship (no pun intended) has sort of sailed to me. There's no reason to want them to be together if they're already living out their happy ending with very little turbulence. Any external conflicts are just that - external. Nothing puts their relationship in danger for very long.

Edited March 11, 2017 by KingOfHearts

[Serena]

1 hour ago, Curio said:

The OUAT Reddit forum has a lot of them for some reason.

Of course Reddit would like how Neal sent Emma to prison "for her own good" and then proceeded to Nice Guy her years later. Of course it'd be Reddit.

[Mari]

I don't Reddit.

Is it a particularly foul place?

[sharky]

Reddit is a particularly male place. So there is definitely a bit more Nice Guy hand waving over there.

[Camera One]

I'd rather not lump all fans of certain characters or pairings together as if they were homogeneous.  If Hook had been killed off in Season 3 instead of Neal, there would have been bitter feelings as well.   Heck, there are bitter feelings and claims that A&E hates CS from certain contingents of the crazy social media sites even now.  I'm just glad it's generally not as one-note here.

Edited March 11, 2017 by Camera One

[Amerilla]

5 hours ago, superloislane said:

Are there still Swanfire shippers in existence?

Yes.

[KAOS Agent]

There are many Rumbelle shippers who despise Belle and her abusive behavior towards Rumpel. I don't know if it has translated to hatred towards Emilie, but I don't really understand how anyone could hate a character so much and still want them to be with their favorite. It doesn't compute. If a character is so terrible and hurts their partner, why would you ship them with someone you like? I know that it has something to do with wanting the favorite to get what they want, but how would that make you as a fan happy if one member of the couple enrages you? Fanon ships make more sense to me since they aren't actually a pairing on screen and actions that would unacceptable if two characters were in a relationship (because couples should treat each other with respect) are easier to swallow when they actually aren't involved romantically. It's a lot easier to form your own personal fantasies if there isn't canon awfulness to mess them up.

[daxx]

Belle's abusive behavior to Rumple? Do they watch the same show I do? I won't even get into listing Rumple's egregious behavior towards Belle, I don't have time for that...

[Souris]

14 minutes ago, daxx said:

Belle's abusive behavior to Rumple? Do they watch the same show I do? I won't even get into listing Rumple's egregious behavior towards Belle, I don't have time for that...

I know. Out of all the disturbing things I've seen in the fandom, the fans who say Belle is abusive to Rumple are among the most disturbing.

[oncebluethrone]

1 hour ago, Souris said:

I know. Out of all the disturbing things I've seen in the fandom, the fans who say Belle is abusive to Rumple are among the most disturbing.

Same with the fans who think Hook is a rapist (usually SQers).

[cappoe]

My fav thing is when SQers say they would have accepted SF. LOL sure okay.

[CCTC]

6 minutes ago, oncebluethrone said:

Same with the fans who think Hook is a rapist (usually SQers).

I have never understood this, because it is always by people are saying this to say why Regina is so much better.  They ignore all the times Regina threatened Emma, tried to killer her parents, and raped and killed her boyfriend.   I cannot remember original recipe Hook doing as much threatening as Regina, and I don't remember anything rapey  with Emma or Rumple's first wife.  Some of Regina and Gold's fans do a really good job of projecting.

The Belle-Gold dynamic might be one of the more disturbing relationships, esp. if they end up reconciling again.  The one time I found them interesting the last few seasons was this fall when they were acting as a divorced couple and Belle seemed to have awoken up to how Rumple really is not a good person.   If they undo that before the end of the season and Belle is starry eyed again, it will leave a bad taste in my mouth.

[Camera One]

Rumbellers calling Belle abusive is very different from SQ'ers criticizing Hook.  The latter is the common case of fans over-invested in one pairing constantly feeling the need to cut down the other love interests (canon or not).  In regards to Emma, it would be anyone ready with their usual go-to barb whenever Hook, Regina or Neal are brought up.  For anyone who's not rah rah whoever, it's tiresome to hear... I mean, Hook has shown remorse, Regina isn't even canon and Neal has been killed off.

[oncebluethrone]

I do agree that it gets tiresome when fans keep insisting that SQ should be made canon when it was never the direction A&E were going and ignoring facts such as Killian's redemption and remorse and Neal being dead.

[Curio]

The fandom wouldn't be nearly as bad as it is if A&E still had the guts to shut down fanon drama. I miss the days back in Season 1 and Season 2 when they were blunt about Regina and Emma never being a thing. Even the actors joked about how it was never going to happen. But something happened around Season 3 behind the scenes and now everyone involved with the show has to treat all fans with kiddie gloves. Even Morrison had to apologize for simply stating Neal and Emma had too much baggage, even though in canon, that's totally the truth. It's okay to have opinions, but when you base your opinions on a warped reality and not on facts, then it creates a dangerous atmosphere where everyone who has the same warped perspective believe they're correct because no one is allowed to call them wrong anymore. 

Edited March 12, 2017 by Curio

[Camera One]

Even Morrison had to apologize for simply stating Neal and Emma had too much baggage, even though in canon, that's totally the truth.

The actors should never have to apologize for what the Writers write.  Canon also says that Emma has made peace with Neal and think very well of him now, yet every time he's mentioned, vitriol erupts.  

The problem with social media now is it's very possible to be in an echo chamber, with all the suggested news/sites reinforcing one's own opinions and hatred building in momentum based on people who think the same thing grouping together.

[Souris]

1 hour ago, Camera One said:

Rumbellers calling Belle abusive is very different from SQ'ers criticizing Hook.  The latter is the common case of fans over-invested in one pairing constantly feeling the need to cut down the other love interests (canon or not).  In regards to Emma, it would be anyone ready with their usual go-to barb whenever Hook, Regina or Neal are brought up.  

And that's why I find the Belle-is-abusive-to-Rumple crowd more disturbing. The Hook-is-a-rapist nonsense derives pretty solely from disgruntled SQ/SF shippers. It's shipper nonsense. It's annoying and wrong, but it's pretty standard. But the Belle stuff doesn't stem from anti-ship goggles. It's its own thing and it makes my soul hurt to see the victim portrayed as the abuser.

Edited March 12, 2017 by Souris

[Rumsy4]

13 minutes ago, Souris said:

It's its own thing and it makes my soul hurt to see the victim portrayed as the abuser.

It goes back to still-prevalent sexist ideas about marriage. For all the "strong women" Adam and Eddy claim to write, their so-called strong women can be pretty weak, and it is reinforced in the writing. Regina's "strength" comes from being overly-powered over her victims. Belle's claims of wanting to be independent and explore the world are thrown away by her toxic obsession with redeeming Rumple. Emma's strength is undermined by her tame acceptance of Regina's verbal bashings, etc.. Women are fridged (Marian). Male-rape is never punished, etc.. I can't tell you how many people still believe that Rumple and Belle should be together simply becasue they are married, and that Rumple was totally justified in murdering Milah (twice) becasue she chose to leave her family. It's just so sad... 

[ParadoxLost]

I'm mulling over whether I'm done with this show now.

My reaction to this episode was that the ending wasn't about the love of a twist or sending Hook to Regina's level or even a misguided belief that its an interesting story or an attempt to be edgy.  I think they just hate fans Hook and Emma.  That is why I'm considering hanging it up because that is just a little too close to fanatical thinking for me.  I don't want to feel that way.

But it seems like fans of the "heroes" are more likely to write out long critiques of the writing.  But maybe that's just because this is the only place I frequent often and we hammer on the writing constantly.  I'm starting to think that the way this show goes is more about them being thin skinned and punishing fans that critique them.

[Camera One]

There is surprisingly very little on Twitter about the big twist.  It seems to be mostly gifs of the CS kiss, or OQ'ers who are unhappy.  

This is the latest tweet Adam deleted, which was pretty innocuous.

amanda‏ @robinlocksleys  
 @AdamHorowitzLA can you give me one reason why any fan of robin hood should continue watching these episodes?
Adam Horowitz @AdamHorowitzLA
@robinlocksleys I think Sean has some AMAZING work coming up!

---------

Adam doesn't seem to understand that "amazing" acting is not necessarily what disappointed OQ fans are looking for.  I'm sure the actor can play a creepy villain version of Robin Hood quite well, but is that going to provide any closure?  Would Regina kissing Wish Realm Robin and saying it was like kissing a photograph be enjoyable to them?

Edited March 13, 2017 by Camera One

[CCTC]

Yes,while I find possibly evil Fake Robin more interesting that the original, I thought the reason they brought him back was to give his fans better closure and a better send-off to the character.  This almost seems like it is trolling the fans who wanted him back.  "Robin is back!  Psych -- just kidding!"

That said, I am surprise Outlaw Queen has such a passionate following.  I never felt they were that developed or interesting as a couple or came across having any real connection.

[Kktjones]

I continue to wonder who the writers think they are appealing to these days. They have pretty much disappointed and/or alienated every single fandom. Yes, many of us continue to watch, but who is truly happy with the way they are writing the show? I could go through and list out the reasons that the Regina, Robin, OQ, Emma, Hook, CS, Snowing, Charming, Snow, Rumbelle, Rumple, Belle & Zelena fans are unhappy, but I think everyone can work that out for themselves. They've managed to accomplish the seemingly impossible feat of somehow pissing off fans who like the exact opposite of things. So the CS fans and anits both hated last night's episode. As did both the OQ fans and OQ antis. I do think they are heading in a direction that some fans may ultimately like, but the path they are taking to get there is no unpleasant and depressing that I wonder how many will still be along for the ride at the end!

Edited March 16, 2017 by Kktjones

[Souris]

38 minutes ago, CCTC said:

Yes,while I find possibly evil Fake Robin more interesting that the original, I thought the reason they brought him back was to give his fans better closure and a better send-off to the character.  This almost seems like it is trolling the fans who wanted him back.  "Robin is back!  Psych -- just kidding!"

I really think A&E enjoy sticking it to fans and doing the opposite of what fans want. This whole thing really comes off as unnecessarily cruel to the OQ fans. Basically just rubbing it in that Robin is dead. Fans thought they were bringing back Robin, and instead they're getting very much NOT Robin. That's a nasty bait-and-switch for OQ fans. A&E didn't have to do that, but being mean to fans and squashing their hope appears to give them the jollies.

Which is why I'm not optimistic about how this season will end for any characters who aren't coming back for a potential S7.

[ParadoxLost]

1 hour ago, Souris said:

Which is why I'm not optimistic about how this season will end for any characters who aren't coming back for a potential S7.

I think the ending for any characters they think aren't going to be coming back will be much more palatable than for those they think are coming back.

[asabovesobelow]

On 3/12/2017 at 3:46 PM, Camera One said:

 

The problem with social media now is it's very possible to be in an echo chamber, with all the suggested news/sites reinforcing one's own opinions and hatred building in momentum based on people who think the same thing grouping together.

Which is kind of how it feels here, to be honest. I'm an unapologetic fan of SQ, and if you read this page alone, SQ fans are over-invested, tiresome, absorbed in fanon drama, etc.

I originally came to this site because I enjoyed the intelligent analysis and differing opinions. Unfortunately, for this show, in this forum, there is only one acceptable ship to set sail on. And it ain't mine.

I commented earlier about appreciating the Snow/Regina friendship, and was summarily schooled for being wrong. As much as SQ fans have a reputation for being bullheaded and unwilling to entertain dissenting opinions around these parts, I'm not sure those are traits limited solely to that faction of the fandom.

[Camera One]

I can see why you feel that way.  This thread is a bit of an anomaly in terms of the number of generalizations about fandoms.  The episode discussions are usually better, so I hope you will continue to log your thoughts since it's always interesting to read differing points of view.

[Curio]

I'm genuinely nervous to read fandom reports about the Vancouver convention this weekend. I have a feeling a few uncomfortable questions will be asked and all hell will break loose.

But...ya know...if anyone manages to ask when Regina is going to confess about Graham, especially since the show is making such a big deal about Killian killing Robert...you would be my hero.

[sharky]

Yeah, fans already have some issues with boundaries. Just reading the guidelines for what is and is not allowed for photos made me cringe. I can only imagine how bad it's going to get. Same with the set reports that are coming out this week. There are fans who are already in Van for the convention so more people watching the set, more people with reports, more people bugging the actors on set. It has some real potential to become a dumpster fire.

[Souris]

Unless they're going to use this con for an announcement, I'm guessing the cast will just say they don't know anything yet.

[Curio]

6 minutes ago, Souris said:

Unless they're going to use this con for an announcement, I'm guessing the cast will just say they don't know anything yet.

"We would like to announce that us actors have absolutely no control over the writing of the show and the retconning of our characters, nor do we know if ABC is desperate enough to keep this dumpster fire on the air, so please be gentle."

[Kktjones]

Yeah - I could almost see someone making a blanket announcement at the opening of each day requesting that people not ask the actors about Season 7 and contract negotiations as they are not allowed to share any information. Otherwise I could definitely see it getting very uncomfortable/awkward. I mean there are duo panels where one person may want to stay and one may want to go (or one may be asked to stay and another one not asked to stay). I do hope this whole situation doesn't ruin relationships/friendships amongst the cast. 

[Camera One]

I agree they need to make a blanket statement to set the ground rules and then be consistent about ignoring any questions about contracts or future speculation.

At this point, I don't know what I would even want to ask any of them.  "How do you feel about Gideon's plan?"  "Well, what about that latest retcon?"  If I were an actor, I wouldn't even know what to say.

[Curio]

Luckily, most of the questions asked at these conventions are nothing like the questions we pose here. The actors aren't going to be answering hard-hitting questions about retcons and continuity issues, they're going to be asked, "What fairy tale character do you still want to see on the show?" for the billionth time, or, "If you could pick a favorite fruit to eat, how long would you eat it for?"

[sharky]

We had a good meerkat meme going when someone asked Colin what animal he would like to be. Although that may have been a Hail Mary pass someone threw his way after an awkward question about kissing a woman who isn't his wife. There are fans who simply know no bounds and this extra drama is just going to make it worse.