S01.E01: Pilot

[Nick24]

Quote

SERIES PREMIERE – Before Sam and Dean, there were their parents, John and Mary. Told from the perspective of narrator Dean Winchester (Jensen Ackles), THE WINCHESTERS is the epic, untold love story of how John Winchester (Drake Rodger) met Mary Campbell (Meg Donnelly) and put it all on the line to not only save their love, but the entire world. When John returns home from fighting in Vietnam, a mysterious encounter sparks a new mission to trace his father’s past. In his journey, he crosses paths with 19-year-old demon hunter Mary, who is also searching for answers after the disappearance of her own father. Together, the two join forces with young hunter-in-training Latika (Nida Khurshid) and easygoing hunter Carlos (Jonathan “Jojo” Fleites) to uncover the hidden truths about both their families. Their investigation leads them to a rare book emporium, whose owner Ada (Demetria McKinney) takes an interest to the occult and could provide the missing pieces to their puzzle. But secrets run deep for both the Winchesters and Campbells, and despite the best efforts of John’s mother Millie (Bianca Kajlich) to protect her son from pursuing a dangerous life of demon hunting, John and Mary are both determined to work together to uphold their families’ legacies while beginning to form a family of their own. Glen Winter directed the episode written by Robbie Thompson (#101). Original airdate 10/11/2022.

[Nick24]

That's us begging the network to give the episode now!

[AnimeMania]

  
 

[ILoveReading]

I honestly, really enjoyed it.  I thought the supporting characters were great (especially Carlos).  Drake and Meg did a really good job channelling Mary and John.  Lots of Dean parallels with both characters. 

I can see how John is going to get to the the person he was in the SPN pilot. 

The atmosphere was a very old school vibe.

I'm not just saying this because it's Jensen's project.  If this was my first exposure to the Supernatural world, I'd be all in. 

[Nick24]

Well, I loved it. I really did!

The episode itself was interesting and entertaining. I like the idea of their Big Bad. The cast did great. Drake very impressed me with John's PTSD after the war and I hope for exploring more of it. I like John/Millie dynamics, too. 

The other main characters Latika, Carlos and Ada seem to be decent, and I feel like I'm getting interested to learn more about them.

The music was wonderful!

And Dean's voice in the beginning and Dean himself at the end!!!

All in all, I'm a happy viewer and I'm really looking forward to seeing more!

Edited October 12, 2022 by Nick24

[Snow Apple]

I admit I didn't watch much of the later seasons of Supernatural so it's weird that John knows about this stuff as a young man. I'm liking it so far though.

Anyone else thinks John looks like Sam in some angles including the bitchface(tm)? Good casting.

Edited October 12, 2022 by Snow Apple

[trudysmom]

I enjoyed it too, BUT.  I missed the first 5 minutes so I don't know if they changed the story of how John and Mary met.  That is a pretty iconic story, IMO.  Dean tells it to Mary after Amara brought her back.  If that changed, I have a problem.  This Mary is pretty hard-nosed, no nonsense, the Mary from In the Beginning was a softer, more personable person, then back-from-the-dead Mary, a character I wish they had left dead and buried, again, hard as nails.

Good music, as a stand alone show, I liked it.

[BornToDie]

Welp, guess I’ll be waiting for that revival Jensen and Jared keep bringing up, because this was a big nope for me.  I’m actually more interested in the snippets of Dean than anything else, which amounted to like a minute in this episode.  The characters feel Buffy-esque, with some Scooby gang mixed with OG Supernatural, and that’s not really a winning combo.  Drake Rodger is cute and all, but John seems pretty happy-go-lucky for someone who just got home from war.  Yes, he seemed to be having some sort of flashbacks, but I didn’t feel convinced.  I’m not crazy about Meg Donnelly’s portrayal of Mary; it seems like the writers and the actress were trying too hard to portray her as a badass.  I’m not really into the rest of the ensemble either.  What more did we really need to know about John and Mary, and how long is it going to take to get something about Dean’s mission?  Those watching largely for glimpses of Dean are going to a bit disappointed, I think.

[Frost]

If I hadn't watched Supernatural, I would have really enjoyed it.  Unfortunately, I spent a lot of time trying to match up my early impressions of John and Mary to the young versions in this show.  For example, I thought John searched out Missouri because he didn't know anything about the supernatural.  Also, young Mary trading punches with a demon bothered me.  Demons should be extremely hard to fight.  I can see I'm going to have to let this stuff go or I'll never be able to watch it.   I want to give it a fair chance.

[Nick24]

11 minutes ago, Frost said:

 Also, young Mary trading punches with a demon bothered me.  Demons should be extremely hard to fight. 

This didn't bother me, because demons (angels, too) were already turned into some joke in the latter seasons of SPN.

[Pondlass1]

Well that was all a bit gung ho and rushed.  Exposition is not your friend, writers. Like they were trying to cram all explanations  into this pilot episode.  people were having conversations that people in real life never do. 

And the action was rushed too imo. They got up and down that well pretty damn quick.  Slow down for suspense to build. Monsters and situations were dealt with way too quickly and easily. 

I like the actor playing John.  Mary has to take a breath once in a while and not speak a hundred words a second. If she keeps this up I’ll find her annoying.

Eric took his time unravelling the brothers relationship with their dad. Jensen needs to do the same.  Lots of tricky twisting relationships here. Let them evolve naturally over time. 

But the episode did keep me engaged.  I do not wrestle much with canon, but I think that’s the hoop Jensen has to jump with die hard supernatural fans.

I’ll stay tuned to support Jensen. Loved the music.

[Myrelle]

I genuinely like all the characters.

That might be a first for me.

And I'm just gonna say it-I love both John and Mary, but especially John. And Latika, too.

The cinematography was beautiful and, yes, very old school. The music was great.

The pacing was a welcome surprise,  too. Perhaps a little rushed at times, but never slow, something that plagued the mothership too often in it's latter seasons, IMO.

The double monster fight at the end was terrific and hearing Dean at the beginning was only topped by seeing and hearing him at the end, with my last thought being, where is he?

This is going to be a fun show.

[ahrtee]

I wasn't expecting much, and I found (to my surprise) that  I enjoyed it.  Mary is still kind of iffy to me, but I'll wait and see if she tones down  later.  Maybe she's just annoying here because she's driven by worry about Samuel.

I did have some trouble understanding Latika, but I don't know if the issue was her, my TV or my ears.  

30 minutes ago, Frost said:

Unfortunately, I spent a lot of time trying to match up my early impressions of John and Mary to the young versions in this show.  For example, I thought John searched out Missouri because he didn't know anything about the supernatural. 

I thought they did a pretty good job of working around the "tentpoles" of canon:  Mary hating hunting and determined to quit, having hunting cousins, and John still being idealistic (as Mary pointed out in In the Beginning.)  And yes, @trudysmom, they had John and Mary meet in the correct way:  she was coming out of a theater showing Slaughterhouse 5 and knocked him on his ass.  

IIRC, John's journal started with "I went to Missouri and learned the truth."  We always assumed that meant that was the first time he learned about the supernatural, but (I suppose) it could just as easily be the truth about what actually happened to Mary.  If he believed that she really *had* quit hunting when they married (and since he didn't know about Mary's deal with Azazel) then it would come as a surprise that a demon was hunting her after all that time.  (I suppose we'll find out if he knew that Mary was still hunting now and then when Dean was young.)  And it makes more sense that he already knew/knew about Missouri than that he just picked a random psychic out of the phone book to ask (as Sam and Dean tried.)  

I also enjoyed watching for the easter eggs throughout.  Who's spotted what?   The main ones I noticed were "D. Nutter" as the name on the MoL folder and Dean's theme playing in the family scenes (as well as the nods to canon above).  And I was confused but enjoyed the Raiders beginning, but I'm sure there are more. 😊

I also noticed that they avoided showing Jensen with his longer hair and old(er) face that was visible in the original scenes from the pilot, so they avoided (for now) the question of the timing.  I'll wait and see what happens later.  

[SueB]

Loved it!

This felt seamless with the Mothership.   It’s like I’m back in the Supernatural world again. 
 

Personal theory: I think Dean is in Heaven and he’s writing this down for Sam when he gets there.  

Clearly this Acretian (sp?) threat to all existence is why we have what appears to be either an alternate timeline or an event that injects itself into 1972.  I keep thinking of Marvel’s Endgame. Where from the future they interfere with the past, creating an alternate branch.   This feels like Angel involvement.  I suspect it’ll be trimmed someday. 
 

Character thoughts:

John (Drake).  PERFECT casting.  He feels very Sam-like but his PTSD reminds me of Dean.  His almost suicidal recklessness is a theme worth exploring.  Again, in just about every scene, I thought I saw a Sam mannerism.  
 

Mary (Meg). Well written.  Her line delivery, so matter of fact, is very consistent with hunter-Mary we saw in S12-S14.  So no-nonsense.  
 

Carlos (Jojo). Highly entertaining.  I’m looking forward to his story. 
 

Latika (Nida). Enjoyable.  Smart, kind, and newbie.  
 

I’m glad they showed sparks between not just John/Mary but John/Carlos and John/Latika.  Those ship engines are firing up as we speak. 
 

Millie as the mechanic.  A surprise.  I didn’t expect that but like it.  And it fits with John having mechanic knowledge with Henry being the scholar. 
 

Bottom line: I’m all in. 
 

[MAK]

It was much better than I thought it would be.  IA with  a lot of the above comments. I try not to compare it to the OG. Even Jensen has said that this is not Supernatural, it's just in its universe. 

Things were rushed, but you can't always judge by the pilot, since they have to establish multiple characters.

The casting is pretty good.  The only one I have to get used to is Meg as Mary.  Nothing against Meg, but the character of Mary has been so all over the place in the OG, that this version will take a little getting used to. Drake was really good as John. 

2 hours ago, BornToDie said:

John seems pretty happy-go-lucky for someone who just got home from war

Probably. I don't personally know anyone who came back from a war/military mission.  But it doesn't seem wrong that maybe some people who came back with PTSD and other issues, might try to just power through their MH issues by putting on a brave face and trying to "fake it til you make it." It seemed to be what John was trying to do, just putting stuff behind him, and trying to get back to normal. He also needed something to do after coming back. He fell into this case, and ran with it.

Overall, I will continue to watch.

[PAForrest]

2 hours ago, SueB said:

Loved it!

This felt seamless with the Mothership.   It’s like I’m back in the Supernatural world again. 
 

Personal theory: I think Dean is in Heaven and he’s writing this down for Sam when he gets there. 

I thought there was an interview or something a little while back that claimed Dean was in Heaven and writing down this story for Sam. That may have been part of the leaked script. I can't remember anymore, but it makes the most sense, especially with the car having the original Kansas license plate and the amulet from the rearview mirror. Maybe when they tweaked the pilot script they decided to hold off stating definitively where Dean is and why he's writing this story, and we'll get that information at the end of the season.

It definitely feels like OG Supernatural, which is something that was missing from the series the last several seasons. I actually like the entire ensemble, and I think Carlos is going to become a quick fav of mine.

My working theory right now is that an angel is the one who gave John the key to the bunker - someone who was there and just disappeared. And I hope that angel is Cas. Again, that would make the most sense. But whoever it was has gone back in the past and changed history already, and I think that is how they're going to get away with telling this new story. At least that's what I'm thinking after this episode.

Yes, pilots have to introduce a lot of information fast, and I think the subsequent episodes will flow a lot better. But already I'm feeling like Meg's Mary is more like Amy G's Mary, and nothing like Dabb's trainwreck who seemed nothing like the Mary from In the Beginning and Song Remains the Same. So already I'm feeling some of the old fondness I had at one time, very long ago, for Mary Campbell Winchester, and that's already an improvement. And John is adorable!

I'm very much in. Two thumbs up!

Edited October 12, 2022 by PAForrest

[Casseiopeia]

Who is Dean talking too? His narration didn't really add much to the Pilot other than inform us that the story isn't going to follow canon...which we already knew and that's fine. It just seemed like the only reason Dean was there was to connect the two shows together and promise it was all going to make sense eventually.

I liked Drake. I think he fit into his role the best of the cast. The others need to grow into theirs. 

So John was 15 when he enlisted? 

When they took off in the Mystery Machine they kind of looked like they were going to a Greatfull Dead concert.

[ahrtee]

38 minutes ago, Casseiopeia said:

So John was 15 when he enlisted? 

More like 17.  He was gone two years, and he told Millie (as he took a drink) that he was "legal now" (though he wasn't officially of age when he enlisted.)  Drinking age in Kansas in the early 1970s was 18 (yes, I looked it up 😊)  Henry had disappeared 15 years earlier, when he was 4, which would make him 19.  IIRC, according to their SPN tombstones, both John and Mary were born in 1954, so that fits.  

I have a different issue:  if this was supposed to be March in Kansas, the weather sure was warm and sunny!

[SueB]

3 hours ago, Casseiopeia said:

Who is Dean talking too? His narration didn't really add much to the Pilot other than inform us that the story isn't going to follow canon...which we already knew and that's fine. It just seemed like the only reason Dean was there was to connect the two shows together and promise it was all going to make sense eventually.

I liked Drake. I think he fit into his role the best of the cast. The others need to grow into theirs. 

So John was 15 when he enlisted? 

When they took off in the Mystery Machine they kind of looked like they were going to a Greatfull Dead concert.

I think Dean is writing this to Sam.  ThT last bit about picking the music was the giveaway IMO.  Because Sam is the guy who always rides shotgun.  
 

Goes back to my ‘this happens in the future when Dean is in Heaven and the Acretian crisis causes a temporal event resulting in and alternate branch being formed’ theory.  

[AnimeMania]

Shouldn't the Men of Letters bunker have some kind of "Nanny" hologram.

Latika's accent bothers me, it is like a British girl in a Teahouse with her mother. I wish she would throw in some American slang to loosen her up, they could even play it for laughs.

I was disappointed that John didn't seem to have a "good" relationship with his mother, seems like he has some "Daddy Issues".

[Casseiopeia]

5 hours ago, ahrtee said:

More like 17.  He was gone two years, and he told Millie (as he took a drink) that he was "legal now" (though he wasn't officially of age when he enlisted.)  Drinking age in Kansas in the early 1970s was 18 (yes, I looked it up 😊)  Henry had disappeared 15 years earlier, when he was 4, which would make him 19.  IIRC, according to their SPN tombstones, both John and Mary were born in 1954, so that fits.  

I have a different issue:  if this was supposed to be March in Kansas, the weather sure was warm and sunny!

I thought they said 3 years.  

[Dancing Queen]

11 hours ago, BornToDie said:

The characters feel Buffy-esque, with some Scooby gang mixed with OG Supernatural, and that’s not really a winning combo. 

I also felt a distinct Buffy vibe, but that worked for me.  The Hunters have always been too isolated for my taste, so I prefer when they have friends who can offer them emotional and/or tactical support.

10 hours ago, Pondlass1 said:

But the episode did keep me engaged.  I do not wrestle much with canon, but I think that’s the hoop Jensen has to jump with die hard supernatural fans.

I’ll stay tuned to support Jensen. Loved the music.

I'm not too attached to the canon, either, and I'm definitely curious as to where the show goes.  I really liked the setup and the cast. 

I totally geeked out when Dean said, "I'll keep picking the music," because the music was great AND because that's a simple yet effective tie between the original show and this one (without Jensen having to be physically present here).

[Pondlass1]

Lots of 10/10 reviews on IMDb.  The haters point to lack of chemistry between the John/Mary leads. And wondering why Jensen wanted to tell the story of the two least liked characters in the whole series.  And a few are obvious Sam/Jared fans having a gripe. But the good reviews far outweigh the bad. 

I hope Jensen is happy this morning. 🫰

[catrox14]

6 hours ago, ahrtee said:

ave a different issue:  if this was supposed to be March in Kansas, the weather sure was warm and sunny!

I thought they started out in Kansas and then said they were going to New Orleans for the remainder of the hunt/story? 

[Nick24]

19 minutes ago, Pondlass1 said:

 And wondering why Jensen wanted to tell the story of the two least liked characters in the whole series.  

That's ridiculous. I'm wondering who gave them right to claim that John and Mary were the least liked characters? Were there any surveys among all the viewers I haven't heard of? I could name at least one character who was imo 100000000x more annoying than the rest of the characters of the entire show.

Edited October 12, 2022 by Nick24

[catrox14]

When the question of why we would want to see a story about characters that we already know their end, especially for  characters who takes a dark turn, my first thought goes to my Better Call Saul. No spoilers here:

Don't get me wrong, by no means am I saying this show is/will be anywhere near the quality of BCS, just more that we know what happened to Saul in Breaking Bad and they still managed to give such a rich backstory to him and still created tension and drama and humor on the way.  If we get even a fraction of that kind of storytelling, this will be a success.

That's what I like about prequels. We know what happens to certain characters but we don't know why or always how they get there.  I think The Winchesters will have an even more tragic turn to what happens eventually. 

[Frost]

4 hours ago, SueB said:

Goes back to my ‘this happens in the future when Dean is in Heaven and the Acretian crisis causes a temporal event resulting in and alternate branch being formed’ theory.  

Wouldn't that mean that OG Supernatural never happened?  I can't think Jensen would produce a show that would negate the original.  I could see Dean's narration being in Heaven and somehow able to watch his parent's lives, but I don't want it to alter the future.

[ahrtee]

1 hour ago, catrox14 said:

I thought they started out in Kansas and then said they were going to New Orleans for the remainder of the hunt/story? 

They did.  I was referring to the beginning of the ep, when John got off the bus and went to see his mom, with everyone coatless and enjoying the sunshine.  Even at night, when they were fighting the demon, no warm clothing, no puddles, no leftover snow.😊  

[MAK]

1 hour ago, catrox14 said:

When the question of why we would want to see a story about characters that we already know their end, especially for  characters who takes a dark turn,

Not to mention one of the first to do this was Star Wars, with Darth Vader. I'm sure they had a lot of criticism too. But like you said, people wanted to see what happened and how got to his end. 

Same with John and Mary. Whether one likes them or not, how they ended up in SPN is interesting, IMO.

[Whimsy]

I was a bigger fan of early SPN when they did the monster of the week. Even though I stuck it out until the very end, I always liked the isolated cases much better than the huge, convoluted, storylines in the later years. So, I was happy to hear that this show would be more like early SPN. Even though I’m not a die-hard fan that even really remembers how John and Mary met, the truth is that they were played by specific actors on SPN and I just can’t rectify the actors on this show with the characters on SPN. For example, I like the observation that @SueB stated about THIS John having a bit of both Sam and Dean in him. If JDM wasn’t such a big part of OG Supernatural, it would be easier for me to just accept that, but this John looks, sounds or acts nothing at all like JDM that I’m having a hard time. Same with the actress who plays Mary. I don’t see any of the previous iterations of Mary in this character. I kind of wish these were just brand-new characters. I think I’d enjoy it more, even if I enjoyed the minute we got of Dean. 

[Aeryn13]

I admit I wasn`t feeling the trailer but watching the whole episode, I really did enjoy it a lot. I`ve been incredilby soured on the original show in terms of story and character but it was fun to kind of get a bit of the vibe back, but with its own spin.

Liking that it is a period piece because frankly the CW shows have been somewhat stuck in recent years, their storytelling approach was still like in the 2010s but at the same time they tried to be super-relatable to exactly what the current year was. It dated them big time and turned into a goofy mess. Having a period show IMO helps it a lot because they can just let it go with the 70s vibe more and noone has to say twitter hashtags out loud. Yay.   

The Indiana Jones beginning made me giggle.  

Young John with the floppy hairdo did look a lot like early Sam. While Mary clearly is supposed to be more coded as Dean. While at the same time she does want out and he kinda does want in for the moment. It`s not a 1:1 copy - as it shouldn`t be - because here we have a newbie to hunting, though a trained fighter in other ways and a consummated child-trained hunter. Not to mention romantic sparks are already flighing. That gives the characters some familiarity but also their own dynamic. I like it. 

Couple neat Easter Eggs. 

I wished Mary would have had something like brass knuckles, dipped in iron or holy water in that one fight against the demon. All the other action bits were very good and believable within the world set-up.

Seeing Dean was very bittersweet. I know him being in heaven is the prevalent theory but that`s a place where he could easily ask his parents or maybe even know it all already and I hope the framing device is more than what that would imply.

The story being set up is pretty intriguing. So an invading entity that is a threat to even demons and monsters? So technically, the interests of hunters, demon and monsters are aligned?  

So far the supporting characters Carlos and Latika haven`t had much to do but I did like them. Also, a little quartet isn`t a bad core group, not too small and not too full for the moment. 

Thumbs up from me. 

[ahrtee]

Anyone remember the Shedim, back in season 13, who were supposedly the worst things ever created, that would destroy the world?  Jack almost freed them and then shoved them back into the ground, and they were never mentioned again.  Think they're related to the new Big Bad?

[tessathereaper]

I truly enjoyed this and can't wait for the next episode.  Obviously I was looking forward to it and supportive of it but it really turned out to be great.  There is so much heart. And the world very much felt like the Supernatural universe even with the differences and the new characters.  It felt much like home.  It actually felt better than the last few seasons of Supernatural and more like "Supernatural" too imo.  It felt like a fresh start, something new while at the same time familiar.

Drake and Meg have great chemistry and the whole group does together as well.  I enjoyed all the new characters and even though their story is a bit different, Drake and Meg feel like John and Mary to me, they feel like "Winchesters"(in the sense of being ancestors of Dean and Sam).  Drake has a slightly easier job in seeming Sam-ish(he's a tall man for one thing so people are more ready to see the similarities) but I see a good bit of Dean in Meg's performance of Mary, not a lot, not like either one of them are doing carbon copies, but her attitude, etc.  They are both believeable as Dean and Sam's parents.  I already feel like that meme with Carlos and Latika - you know "i've only know them for a day but if anything happened to them I'll kill everyone in this room and then myself", that one. LOL  They are going to be great additions to the Supernatural universe.

I don't know what the big bad is going to end up being but I wonder if they will be like The Winchesters version of Leviathans, I don't mean in look or how they act, etc but just in the sense that they are new, they don't know how to fight them yet, they are from outside the realm of heaven, hell and earth.  

All in all off to a great start and I'm really proud of what Jensen, Robbie and Danneel have created.

[Featherhat]

I enjoyed it. I did think it had a Buffy vibe but that's not a bad thing for me. It was very "instant Scooby Gang" but no worse than many other shows do and both Lata and Carlos are decent characters. I hope they get more to do, especially Ava who had all of 2 scenes. I think they will have to be careful that Carlos doesn't become solely comic relief though. He does have some pathos with his family being killed but whilst the menu thing was funny it will get old quick if that's all he brings. 

So Ava and "hit by a bus girl" were possessed by two different demons? It seemed Bus Girl was the one Mary and John first encountered together but Ava got possessed before she did and also had a familiar line of dialogue. 

I thought Meg and Drake had good chemistry, not lightening in a bottle necessarily but it was fine. I was kind of worried about how I would find Mary given I did NOT like her during her return (although I did in ITB and TSRTS) and was worried I'd find her abrasive attitude insufferable because of it but I thought Meg generally managed to pull it back when needed and we see glimpses of vulnerability without too much neon blinking lights going "she's SUFFERING EVERYONE!" and we saw moments where she was the person she could be without Hunting. 

Drake seemed to do well with the war flashbacks and I'm actually interested to learn more about his time there when I thought I wouldn't be - flashbacks can be tricky to make interesting at the best of times. 

Some of the dialogue suffered from pilotitis but it wasn't too bad. And yeah @Aeryn13 at least no one was forced to say #TeamHunters or something even worse. I think the CW's goofy storytelling actually works for the 70s. 

I liked the idea of the MOL much better than the execution a lot of the time so it's good for me that they're reworking them. I wonder if the fight with the Akida will somehow rewrite reality or people's perceptions of reality and that's what Dean is trying to untangle? It will be interesting to see if they actually team up with some demons to stop it. Although I don't really want a "Spike circa Buffy S4-7" character in S1. 

[Nick24]

20 minutes ago, Featherhat said:

I liked the idea of the MOL much better than the execution a lot of the time so it's good for me that they're reworking them. I wonder if the fight with the Akida will somehow rewrite reality or people's perceptions of reality and that's what Dean is trying to untangle? It will be interesting to see if they actually team up with some demons to stop it. Although I don't really want a "Spike circa Buffy S4-7" character in S1. 

Taking to the speculations.

[SueB]

3 hours ago, Frost said:

Wouldn't that mean that OG Supernatural never happened?  I can't think Jensen would produce a show that would negate the original.  I could see Dean's narration being in Heaven and somehow able to watch his parent's lives, but I don't want it to alter the future.

No.  The OG happened.  I’m applying the multi-verse construct. The multiverse was a part of S14/S15 on the mothership so that’s cannon.
Now add the time travel element.  I am assuming Time Travel because the Acreda (sp?) represent an ‘existential crisis’.  That means they are breaking reality by showing up.  I can see someone (say an Angel) going back in time and handing John the key.  For this explanation, I’m relaying on the most recent Marvel universe theory of Time Travel versus the old Star Trek notion.  In Marvel Time Travel, if you go from the future to the past, you create a new BRANCH.  The original future doe not change. It’s still multi-verse but unstable.  The entire Loki series was dedicated to trimming branches to maintain stability.  
 

So I think we are dealing with something akin to a Marvel branch concept. But I suspect the branch will be weaved back into the timeline via some McGuffin in the future*, not simply snipped.  Even if snipped, we get to see WHO John and Mary are and see their bond.  But Robbie is damn clever.  I expect he’s got a fan-acceptable theory that will eventually be revealed.  
 

*Note: I think ‘I went to Missouri and learned the truth’ is STILL in the future for this John.  I think he’ll choose that as an option to protect reality.  And the exceptional bond between Mary/John will have more depth without them really understanding why (versus simple Cherub roofie). 
 

[tessathereaper]

14 hours ago, MAK said:

It was much better than I thought it would be.  IA with  a lot of the above comments. I try not to compare it to the OG. Even Jensen has said that this is not Supernatural, it's just in its universe. 

Things were rushed, but you can't always judge by the pilot, since they have to establish multiple characters.

The casting is pretty good.  The only one I have to get used to is Meg as Mary.  Nothing against Meg, but the character of Mary has been so all over the place in the OG, that this version will take a little getting used to. Drake was really good as John. 

Probably. I don't personally know anyone who came back from a war/military mission.  But it doesn't seem wrong that maybe some people who came back with PTSD and other issues, might try to just power through their MH issues by putting on a brave face and trying to "fake it til you make it." It seemed to be what John was trying to do, just putting stuff behind him, and trying to get back to normal. He also needed something to do after coming back. He fell into this case, and ran with it.

Overall, I will continue to watch.

Another thing to consider, he just got back from the war and now he's immediately found himself another one?  That sounds potentially like someone who actually is not so happy go lucky but someone who isn't even really trying to "get back to normal".

[goyour-own-way]

That was awesome.

When they released the first promo, I was a little concerned there were going for a lighter, more campy vibe than what I like-- so happy to see it was dark, and had some real weight to it. All the characters are much younger than I am, but it didn't feel like a teen show. 

Something else I was hoping for was the chance to touch on John's Vietnam PTSD, and I was thrilled they immediately got into that. Drake was perfect casting, he looks so  much like JDM and S1 Sam, and the way he sounded just like Gil when he was delivering that line Henry used to tell John was great. Kid has done his homework and it shows. He had such a sadness in his eyes, and a compassionate side (how he tried to reassure Murph, and Mary, and Latika)  I immediately cared about him. 

Also, as someone who enlisted on my 17th birthday with a (legal) waiver, that line made me chuckle. And I appreciated the attention to detail.

I was hoping they weren't going to turn Mary into a stereotypical "tough girl", and so far so good. She's a badass, she is tough, but she also showed compassion and some vulnerability. The way she noticed John's uniform and how he'd been gone for 2 years and gave him her licorice-- it was a small moment, but it was cute. And their convo in the car about John's friend and all the  people Mary couldn't save had me feeling for both of them.

Not as much to say about Carlos and  Latika but I enjoyed both of them and can't wait to get to know them more. Ada, as well. I'm wondering where Mary's mother is?

Oh, and Millie! I was curious to see if she knew about the Men  of Letters and kept  that from John, as a way to keep him away from that life. I'm a little unclear, but I think that's the case? I love that she's this tough mechanic, and picturing her with bookworm Henry is cute. Really excited to learn all about her.

The creature was a bit cheesy, but honestly I'm so tired of monsters who just  look like humans that I welcome the change. And John slicing  into his arm was a nice way to see the future John in his younger self. 

And, obviously,  DEAN. I feel like a little piece of me has healed, or at least scarred over, getting to see him again. To each their own, but I hated how his life ended, so I'm thrilled he has more story to tell. 

[Bergamot]

2 hours ago, Featherhat said:

I enjoyed it. I did think it had a Buffy vibe but that's not a bad thing for me.

Latika reminded me of Willow -- but as you say, that's not a bad thing for me. She is intelligent, good at puzzles, a little timid, and apparently has trouble making friends, maybe because of shyness. Also I like that she is a librarian. I love libraries! In the early years of Supernatural, Dean and Sam would go to a library to do research on their own, and I preferred that to later when they would call Bobby (or later Rowena) to be provided with the answers.

I really liked when Latika, who is obviously nervous herself, says to John, "It is okay to be a little nervous". And he is so kind and gentle with her, telling her that he is nervous too and that they can be nervous together. It was a nice character moment for the two of them, and I liked the big brother/little sister vibe between the two of them.

[tessathereaper]

14 hours ago, Casseiopeia said:

Who is Dean talking too? His narration didn't really add much to the Pilot other than inform us that the story isn't going to follow canon...which we already knew and that's fine. It just seemed like the only reason Dean was there was to connect the two shows together and promise it was all going to make sense eventually.

I liked Drake. I think he fit into his role the best of the cast. The others need to grow into theirs. 

So John was 15 when he enlisted? 

When they took off in the Mystery Machine they kind of looked like they were going to a Greatfull Dead concert.

People who aren't following interviews wouldn't know that it isn't following canon thus the narration to set up that we are also looking to find out WHY things are different. Two mysteries one in the past, one in the present - probably eventually tying together.

 John was 17 when he enlisted.  Tours of duty were 2 years.

[Casseiopeia]

16 minutes ago, tessathereaper said:

People who aren't following interviews wouldn't know that it isn't following canon thus the narration to set up that we are also looking to find out WHY things are different. Two mysteries one in the past, one in the present - probably eventually tying together.

 John was 17 when he enlisted.  Tours of duty were 2 years.

I don't think you have to follow interviews to know the show isn't following canon. If you never watched Supernatural then the narration wouldn't have any meaning other than the guy in the black car was searching for some answers about his parent's. The viewer wouldn't know that this is a different timeline...at least not yet.

I thought I heard Millie say that John had been gone 3 years. There aren't any transcripts posted yet and I don't really want to rewatch the episode so I'll take everyone's word for it that John was 17 when he enlisted.

Edited October 12, 2022 by Casseiopeia

[trudysmom]

Ahrtee, thanks, that helps ALOT.  

[FlickChick]

I really enjoyed it as well as most here. Yes, it was great to hear Dean's voice and see him at the end. I loved that when John read the letter from his dad, that it was Gil McKinney's (OG Henry) voice that we heard. I like the actor who's playing John and think he's doing a great job. I think I read/heard that he was a fan of Supernatural and watched all the episodes, so he's invested in the story. Speaking of that, I think that having Robbie Thompson write this pilot was perfect, since I believe he was the only writer who saw all the episodes and was a big fan. I don't know whether he will write all the episodes or just some, but I thought he did an excellent job. I'm looking forward to watching the characters grow and interact in future episodes. Let's hope all goes well with the ratings.

ETA: Also, loved that John's mom, Millie, was a mechanic. Matches the line from In the Beginning: John to Mary: " He doesn't want you to marry a mechanic from a family of mechanics" Great job, Robbie!

Edited October 12, 2022 by FlickChick

[Emma Snyder]

Just a little reminder to everyone to please discuss the episode, not the fandom.

[Shadow42]

6 hours ago, goyour-own-way said:

That was awesome.

When they released the first promo, I was a little concerned there were going for a lighter, more campy vibe than what I like-- so happy to see it was dark, and had some real weight to it. All the characters are much younger than I am, but it didn't feel like a teen show. 

Something else I was hoping for was the chance to touch on John's Vietnam PTSD, and I was thrilled they immediately got into that. Drake was perfect casting, he looks so  much like JDM and S1 Sam, and the way he sounded just like Gil when he was delivering that line Henry used to tell John was great. Kid has done his homework and it shows. He had such a sadness in his eyes, and a compassionate side (how he tried to reassure Murph, and Mary, and Latika)  I immediately cared about him. 

Also, as someone who enlisted on my 17th birthday with a (legal) waiver, that line made me chuckle. And I appreciated the attention to detail.

I was hoping they weren't going to turn Mary into a stereotypical "tough girl", and so far so good. She's a badass, she is tough, but she also showed compassion and some vulnerability. The way she noticed John's uniform and how he'd been gone for 2 years and gave him her licorice-- it was a small moment, but it was cute. And their convo in the car about John's friend and all the  people Mary couldn't save had me feeling for both of them.

Not as much to say about Carlos and  Latika but I enjoyed both of them and can't wait to get to know them more. Ada, as well. I'm wondering where Mary's mother is?

Oh, and Millie! I was curious to see if she knew about the Men  of Letters and kept  that from John, as a way to keep him away from that life. I'm a little unclear, but I think that's the case? I love that she's this tough mechanic, and picturing her with bookworm Henry is cute. Really excited to learn all about her.

The creature was a bit cheesy, but honestly I'm so tired of monsters who just  look like humans that I welcome the change. And John slicing  into his arm was a nice way to see the future John in his younger self. 

And, obviously,  DEAN. I feel like a little piece of me has healed, or at least scarred over, getting to see him again. To each their own, but I hated how his life ended, so I'm thrilled he has more story to tell. 

According to Milly John forged his I D or used someone else's. At 17 did they need parental consent ln 1970?

[DeeDee79]

I thoroughly enjoyed the pilot. I like all of the actors even young Mary which seems to be a fairly unpopular opinion so far. Carlos was great also and it felt like the early years of SPN which was a plus for me. I'm not stressing about the so-called canon being rewritten because as it's been said many times before, that ship sailed when the mothership was still on air. I will definitely be watching again, and it was such a thrill to see Dean in the Impala again!!

[DeeDee79]

6 hours ago, tessathereaper said:

People who aren't following interviews wouldn't know that it isn't following canon thus the narration to set up that we are also looking to find out WHY things are different. Two mysteries one in the past, one in the present - probably eventually tying together.

Agreed. The mothership deviated from canon too many times to count. I don't fully understand why it's been such a sticking point for the spinoff. 

[Bergamot]

9 hours ago, Featherhat said:

He does have some pathos with his family being killed but whilst the menu thing was funny it will get old quick if that's all he brings. 

The part with the menu made me laugh, not just because John obediently reads it off (he is probably thinking, "Okay, I guess this is no crazier than anything else that has happened today!") but mainly because of the way he recites it, with such total energy and enthusiasm. 😄 Like, if you need a menu read out loud to a demon, John will get it done!

I really liked the moment where Carlos tells John, "The only thing worse than how it starts for a hunter is how it ends." Not so much because it helps define Carlos as a character, but because of what it says about what it means to be a hunter. The original conception of what made someone a hunter in Supernatural is that they were ordinary people whose lives had been shattered by an encounter with supernatural evil. And who then, maybe from a need for revenge, or maybe from a desire, as Dean expressed it, to keep what happened to them from happening to other families, devoted their lives to fighting that evil.

Hunters were damaged people, forever isolated from normal society even as they risked themselves to preserve it, only able to connect with each other. Unfortunately (in my opinion), Supernatural moved away from this original conception as the show went on. Increasingly, hunters were no longer ordinary people whose lives were changed by tragedy;  more and more they were people with a special destiny. They were people who belonged to a special mystical organization, or people who could trace their special hunter heritage back to the Mayflower.

To me, this weakened the strength of the original foundation of the show, and I am hoping that with The Winchesters we could get back more to this concept. That's why I like the idea that Carlos is a hunter not because it is his special chosen destiny, but because a ghoul killed his family. And so now, he hunts the kinds of things that killed them.

Edited October 13, 2022 by Bergamot

[7kstar]

On 10/11/2022 at 8:39 PM, BornToDie said:

Drake Rodger is cute and all, but John seems pretty happy-go-lucky for someone who just got home from war.  Yes, he seemed to be having some sort of flashbacks, but I didn’t feel convinced.

Actually, the first time I met some vets in College and High School, he's not that far off.  One guy was like my protective older brother.  He did do drugs and was always happy.  He was constantly joking around and trying to get you to laugh.  I was in college when we met.  He was constantly telling me that I couldn't do drugs and what parties I could and couldn't attend.  Which in the theatre dept.  it's everywhere.

The other guy had been in a much harsher situation; I met him in High school. He hated the world and thought everyone was out to harm him.  When I watched Platoon, it became clear.  He had to watch his back from everyone, including his so-called fellow Americans.  I didn't work with him for long but every other word was a cuss word.

So my point is, John is showing signs of PTSD and yet trying to look like everything is fine.    Most Vets have something in common, they don't want to talk about it with someone who hasn't been, especially Nam.  Remember many of these soldiers had been called names and spit on when they came back from War.  It's not like it is today.

So I didn't expect them to go heavy on realism on this part in the pilot, especially since they had so much story to tell.  I thought the flashbacks did show that he was having trouble.  Plus the need to do something to help someone to make amends for not saving his friend worked for me.

I did like it on first watch.  Are there questions, sure. 

I liked John more than Mary.  Carlos looks interesting.  The rest of the gang...I'm willing to hold judgment. 

On 10/11/2022 at 10:00 PM, SueB said:

Millie as the mechanic.  A surprise.  I didn’t expect that but like it.  And it fits with John having mechanic knowledge with Henry being the scholar. 

IA I liked it. 

I'm expecting that they will explain how this ties into the Original but I also think it can stand on it's own.  You don't have to watched Supernatural to figure this one out.  So new fans can enjoy it. 

I do have a wish that Mary felt closer to Amy Gumenick Mary.    But perhaps they'll find the right mix.  I know in some shows it can take several eps before the actors totally gel and it works.

In all I'm willing to give it a shot.  Not bad  I could easily give it a 6 out of 10

[7kstar]

10 hours ago, SueB said:

*Note: I think ‘I went to Missouri and learned the truth’ is STILL in the future for this John.  I think he’ll choose that as an option to protect reality.  And the exceptional bond between Mary/John will have more depth without them really understanding why (versus simple Cherub roofie). 

One thing they can play with and it is cannon.  I went to Missouri...Sam and Dean are the ones trying to figure out what that meant.  So what if they had it wrong all along?  If John went to find Missouri the person vs the state it still fits with cannon.

I loved the music and forgot to say that.

I thought that Dean could be open to interpretation.  I did believe he was writing this down for Sam, but when this happens is a big question mark.  For now, I'm not really trying to figure it out.  I suspect more hints will be given down the road.