S01.E08: Chocolate Soufflé

[Pallas]

Despite an extraordinary run, Julia decides to make the first season's finale the series' last, shocking Paul and the staff of WGBH.

[Words]

Another wonderful episode, even though obviously we know The French Chef had many successful seasons. And they've set up all the principal players with potential stories for a 2nd season.  It's hard to imagine "Julia" won't get renewed.

 

[Ms Blue Jay]

It appears it already is.

Per Wikipedia:

Quote

In May 2022, the series was renewed for a second season.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julia_(2022_TV_series)

Joan Cusack almost played Julia!  I prefer this version.

Sad the season is done.

Edited May 6, 2022 by Ms Blue Jay

[vesperholly]

Damn, I just discovered that Judith Light played Blanche Knopf when I was reading Wikipeda! WOW, did she disappear into that role.

[Yeah No]

This article from Variety talks about the direction of the show for Season 2.  There's a spoiler alert not to read it if you haven't watched this episode:

https://variety.com/2022/tv/news/julia-finale-season-1-showrunners-hbo-max-1235257374/#article-comments

They say they're going to continue to explore the many social issues of the period between 1963 and 1973 through the show.  I'm not really loving that aspect because some of the fictional themes are a little clunky for me and take away from my experience of a show about Julia's life.  Having lived through the period it's feeling like a modern template is being forced upon these issues that doesn't do either the period or the characters enough justice.  I don't know why the compulsion for shows today is to force-fit social issues into them rather than just give us a good story based on mostly real events.  They liken what they're doing here to "Amadeus" which was based on Mozart's life with a lot of "poetic license" and fictional themes.  Maybe that's OK for a historical figure that few people knew much about other than his music and a few general details, but I've known Julia since 1963 and have been a lifelong fan.  I feel that the "poetic license" they're taking with her life is not in ways I think do her justice or that she herself would appreciate if she were still alive.  Just my opinion.  

[Irlandesa]

This was such a delightful episode and Paul's monologue about Julia's show being such a "joy" pretty much sums up this show. 

[rejnel]

Quote

Paul's monologue about Julia's show being such a "joy" pretty much sums up this show. 

and, in that same scene--while people our age are shutting down their lives, let's keep saying yes to everything. We'll die someday; let's be saying yes when we do. Loved that.

[Words]

Quote

and, in that same scene--while people our age are shutting down their lives, let's keep saying yes to everything. We'll die someday; let's be saying yes when we do. Loved that.

Indeed--most memorable line of this episode, and truly words to live by!

[Juneau Gal]

Despite Paul's wonderful speech at the end, I was not charmed by this episode as I have been by all the others. In fact, it really dragged on for me; I kept looking at how much more was left in the episode. I think it might be that for me, the whole Betty Friedan business carrying over into this episode and with such weight was just too much. The whole thing did not ring true. Julia Child lived anything but a traditional, in that era, life. If such a confrontation had occurred, Julia would have, ever so politely, disabused Betty of her notion. 

Even so, what a delightful series to get through the end of winter with. Very happy will will get a season two.

 

[Words]

Quote

Despite Paul's wonderful speech at the end, I was not charmed by this episode as I have been by all the others. In fact, it really dragged on for me; I kept looking at how much more was left in the episode. I think it might be that for me, the whole Betty Friedan business carrying over into this episode and with such weight was just too much. The whole thing did not ring true. Julia Child lived anything but a traditional, in that era, life. If such a confrontation had occurred, Julia would have, ever so politely, disabused Betty of her notion. 

Juneau Gal, I agree 100%.  Julia Child was a remarkable woman who led a unique life. She also had a fascinating marriage to a true Renaissance man.  You are correct:  real life Julia would not have let Betty Friedan deign to pass judgement on her life and life's work. And I sure hope to see storylines and writing in subsequent seasons that will draw a more complete picture of JC, and to quote "Oh Yeah, from above:

Quote

  I don't know why the compulsion for shows today is to force-fit social issues into them rather than just give us a good story based on mostly real events. 

The real life Julia Child's life is enough.

[ichbin]

2 hours ago, Juneau Gal said:

I think it might be that for me, the whole Betty Friedan business carrying over into this episode and with such weight was just too much.

15 hours ago, Yeah No said:

Having lived through the period it's feeling like a modern template is being forced upon these issues that doesn't do either the period or the characters enough justice.  I don't know why the compulsion for shows today is to force-fit social issues into them rather than just give us a good story based on mostly real events.

1 hour ago, Words said:

The real life Julia Child's life is enough.

All of the above! I feel as though there currently is a list of hot social issues which are being checked off regardless of the era or setting of shows.  It's as though show creators today are now afraid to do otherwise lest they face the wrath of some group or another. There is a time and place for everything but not every time or place.

Edited May 6, 2022 by ichbin
misspelling

[Cinnabon]

22 hours ago, Yeah No said:

This article from Variety talks about the direction of the show for Season 2.  There's a spoiler alert not to read it if you haven't watched this episode:

https://variety.com/2022/tv/news/julia-finale-season-1-showrunners-hbo-max-1235257374/#article-comments

They say they're going to continue to explore the many social issues of the period between 1963 and 1973 through the show.  I'm not really loving that aspect because some of the fictional themes are a little clunky for me and take away from my experience of a show about Julia's life.  Having lived through the period it's feeling like a modern template is being forced upon these issues that doesn't do either the period or the characters enough justice.  I don't know why the compulsion for shows today is to force-fit social issues into them rather than just give us a good story based on mostly real events.  They liken what they're doing here to "Amadeus" which was based on Mozart's life with a lot of "poetic license" and fictional themes.  Maybe that's OK for a historical figure that few people knew much about other than his music and a few general details, but I've known Julia since 1963 and have been a lifelong fan.  I feel that the "poetic license" they're taking with her life is not in ways I think do her justice or that she herself would appreciate if she were still alive.  Just my opinion.  

I actually love the fact that they’re delving into those years. That’s probably my favorite time period in history.  I don’t think you can ever completely separate someone’s life story from the time period in which it was lived. It’s up to HBO and the show runners to create according to their visions, keeping the show’s ratings in mind.
  
Apparently the real Julia didn’t love the book or movie “Julie and Julia,” but I thought it was wonderful and so did many others. She didn’t have to like it for it to be good work. 

 

Edited May 7, 2022 by Cinnabon

[J-Man]

I loved Nancy Walker's (aka Ida Morgenstern) "I Can Cook Too" (from "On the Town") playing over the closing credits. 

Did they have those juice/milk cartons in the early '60s? I remember mostly glass, and the waxed cartons didn't have that peaked roof -- they were flat with a cover over a round pouring spout. 

I'm curious to know whether the real Julia (and the other personages depicted) used such foul language in real life. In that day and age, people were mucn more genteel about those kinds of things--I can't imagine four-letter words being used in a workplace outside of an all-male blue-collar-type situation. I began working in an office in the '70s and even then, people didn't use that type of language. 

[ichbin]

22 hours ago, Yeah No said:

 

This article from Variety talks about the direction of the show for Season 2.  There's a spoiler alert not to read it if you haven't watched this episode:

 

It was only when reading this article that I discovered Simca was played by Isabella Rossellini. 

[Cinnabon]

4 minutes ago, ichbin said:

It was only when reading this article that I discovered Simca was played by Isabella Rossellini. 

They both have very distinctive voices to me. Often I recognize an actor’s voice rather than their appearance. 

[shrewd.buddha]

On 5/6/2022 at 12:29 AM, Yeah No said:

I don't know why the compulsion for shows today is to force-fit social issues into them rather than just give us a good story based on mostly real events. 

 

On 5/6/2022 at 4:23 PM, ichbin said:

I feel as though there currently is a list of hot social issues which are being checked off regardless of the era or setting of shows. 

As much as I enjoyed Paul's encouraging speech to Julia near the end, I couldn't help to be taken out of the moment, slightly, because part it sounded like a checkbox of current ideas: specifically "catastrophizing" and "saying 'yes' to everything".  It felt like someone had been reading books from the current self-help section on Amazon. 

It also seems as if the show is trying to create a dynamic between Russ Morash and Alice that is somewhat like Mr. Grant and Mary Richards from the Mary Tyler Moore show.

I appreciated that the showrunners did not attempt to use Julia's decision to stop the show as a cliffhanger for the season.  Paul's speech was nice, but it might have been better if Julia had been collecting her things from the TV station and somebody wheeled out shopping carts full of fan letters addressed to her.  it would have been a good time for Julia to realize that she was "sparking joy" to a large number of people. 

[ichbin]

On 5/6/2022 at 11:07 PM, J-Man said:

Did they have those juice/milk cartons in the early '60s? I remember mostly glass, and the waxed cartons didn't have that peaked roof -- they were flat with a cover over a round pouring spout. 

I could have sworn I remembered the peaked cartons from my early school days around the time this is taking place.   I poked at Google  a bit and found that there had been a patent filed for that design in 1953 so I guess my memory wasn't playing tricks.

https://foresthistory.org/digital-collections/kieckhefer-container-company/

[ItCouldBeWorse]

On 5/6/2022 at 11:07 PM, J-Man said:

Did they have those juice/milk cartons in the early '60s? I remember mostly glass, and the waxed cartons didn't have that peaked roof -- they were flat with a cover over a round pouring spout. 

On 5/12/2022 at 12:41 PM, ichbin said:

I could have sworn I remembered the peaked cartons from my early school days around the time this is taking place.   I poked at Google  a bit and found that there had been a patent filed for that design in 1953 so I guess my memory wasn't playing tricks.

https://foresthistory.org/digital-collections/kieckhefer-container-company/

Agreed.  In NYC public school in the mid 60's they had the pint cartons of milk with the peaked roof - no cover.

These are the lyrics from the song Paul was singing at breakfast at the beginning of the show (that Julia was less than thrilled with):   https://g.co/kgs/uPmXrh

 

[Yeah No]

On 5/12/2022 at 12:41 PM, ichbin said:

On 5/6/2022 at 11:07 PM, J-Man said:

Did they have those juice/milk cartons in the early '60s? I remember mostly glass, and the waxed cartons didn't have that peaked roof -- they were flat with a cover over a round pouring spout. 

I could have sworn I remembered the peaked cartons from my early school days around the time this is taking place.   I poked at Google  a bit and found that there had been a patent filed for that design in 1953 so I guess my memory wasn't playing tricks.

https://foresthistory.org/digital-collections/kieckhefer-container-company/

In NYC we got the flat topped ones with the pull-up top when I was in kindergarten (1963) through about 2nd grade (1965).  Those cartons were of a waxy consistency that isn't used today.  Then we started getting in the peaked ones and we'd get alternating flat and peaked lids depending on what dairy supplied them.  After a few years the flat topped ones disappeared completely This is a more vivid memory given that I was often what was referred to back then as a "milk monitor".  

[purist]

Absolutely excellent article about the real Judith Jones (Julia Child's editor) by Sara B. Franklin, who knew her well and is currently writing a biography of Jones.

[ItCouldBeWorse]

11 hours ago, purist said:

Absolutely excellent article about the real Judith Jones (Julia Child's editor) by Sara B. Franklin, who knew her well and is currently writing a biography of Jones.

At least the show made her out to be one of the few completely "good" guys, along with Alice.  Both Avis and Paul had their issues, although when brought to their respective attentions, they succeeded in repairing them.  And Russ was also redeemed.

[TimWil]

There was a special screening last night here in New York of the season finale. The episode looked great on the big screen. It was followed by a Q&A with Sarah Lancashire, David Hyde Pierce, Fran Kranz, Fiona Glascott, Brittany Bradford, Chris Keyser and Daniel Goldfarb. It was taped so I guess it will be on YouTube at some point. And after that there was a reception with an omelette station and a serve yourself beef bourgoignon (sp?) and coq au vin table! 

It was all lovely but I was disappointed I didn’t get to pitch my idea for Season 2 to Mr. Goldfarb and Mr. Keyser: Julia engages in a contentious showdown with the formidable Fanny Craddock (Gillian Anderson) in a Christmas cooking special co-produced by WGBH and the BBC. With Stephen Fry as the BBC’s Director-General. Oh well!

ETA-Forgot to mention one interesting thing and one funny thing that was brought up at last night’s Q&A. The interesting thing was Daniel Goldfarb saying that Season 1 was originally supposed to span three years, with the Season 1 finale ending with Julia winning the first Emmy Award for public television. That obviously didn’t happen. And the funny thing was Sarah Lancashire saying to Goldfarb “So is it in Episode 5 or Episode 6 where Julia finds a dead body in the cupboard?”

Edited May 24, 2022 by TimWil

[LisaM]

Just finished watching all of Season 1. Loved it. Cannot wait for Season 2. 

I originally started watching because of Sarah Lancashire but quickly fell in love with the rest of the cast and show. Have loved Judith Light since One Life to Live and she did not disappoint. Great performance as Blanche Knopf. 

[pasdetrois]

Judith Light redeemed herself after all of the hammy characters she shoved down our throats - I'm thinking of Transparent.

This was a delightful series. I adore Sarah Lancashire and Bebe Neuwirth.

I worked in television news in the 80s and frequently visited a friend who was talent at the PBS station. That station was held together with spit and baling wire, and the staff barely made enough to live on.

I'm barely a "cook" but I always love watching master chefs do their thing. When I encounter them in real life, they turn up their noses upon discovering I am a vegetarian, although that perspective is improving a bit.

More than anything, I could see that Julia suffered her Pasadena childhood but managed to be a devoted spouse and very kind human being.

Edited May 28, 2022 by pasdetrois

[paramitch]

I enjoyed this a lot, and absolutely loved Paul's final speech to Julia -- not just as a lovely speech that summed up what Julia did in fact bring to lot of people, but as the summation of Paul's arc as a character, finishing his self-doubt and envy, and bringing him to a place of peace and pure support. I thought it was also just beautifully performed by David Hyde Pierce, and I so appreciated how different he was here as Paul (versus his iconic performance as Niles on "Frasier"). There has so often been a more coiled, tense, prickly aspect to Paul across most of this season, and I especially love how different DHP's diction and bearing were as well. But it was lovely to see Paul relax into the situation at last, to realize his value and place beside Julia as both a companion and collaborator.

I also thought this was a very gentle, sweet ending, and I cared so much about all of the characters and wish them well. While I wish the show had been a bit more accurate to the complexities of who Julia actually was (complexities they did allow Paul and other characters), it was still a warm, joyful escape, and I'll definitely be back next season.

[chessiegal]

i don't subscribe to HBO Max but was willing to sign-up to watch this until I found out here it was not a biopic. I love Julia too much to see a fictional take.

[ProudMary]

On 2/1/2023 at 11:16 AM, chessiegal said:

i don't subscribe to HBO Max but was willing to sign-up to watch this until I found out here it was not a biopic. I love Julia too much to see a fictional take.

HBO Max also has the 2021 documentary Julia available. I've watched it and would recommend.

https://m.imdb.com/title/tt13782428/