Legends - General Discussion

[anstar]

I cannot believe that Ana went for suicide by cop rather than doing five years in prison

She told Dante that she was in an orphanage from age 2 to (about) 8 when the Colonel adopted her and that they were 'kept in cages'.  When she was offered the 5 year prison deal, the first thing she said was that she couldn't/wouldn't go back into a cage.  I guess the thought of being caged up again was so terrifying that she would rather die.  I knew when she picked up the gun that she wasn't leaving the bank alive; I just wasn't sure if she was going to kill herself or make someone else shoot her.

[thuganomics85]

So, I guess this wraps up the "Dante" arc.  I wonder if the next episode will be Martin decompressing (or, more then likely, going nutty again), or if he'll be jumping straight into another "legend."  But, judging from these episodes, it sounds like it isn't going to be a "legend of the week" thing, but there will actually be several episode arcs, with the characters.  Overall though, wasn't a huge fan of this one.  Yuri never really grabbed me as the main bad guy, and Ana's story was sympathetic, but I really wasn't invested enough in her, to care that she took her own life at the end.

 

Movement on the Rice story, at least.  It looks like he now knows that Martin didn't kill the guy, but it was some lady.  But, I'm sure he's still suspicious over why Martin was there, and what he is hiding from him.

 

I love Gates simply because he gives Crystal crap.

 

Did not miss Martin's family though.  Not one bit.

 

I hope this gets better, but right now, I still think I'd probably not be watching this show if Sean Bean wasn't the lead.  He's the only thing that makes this show feel different on some level.

[tv echo]

Sean Bean was fantastic in this episode.  You can really see his internal struggles on his face.  Crystal (Ali Larter) continues to annoy - it must be the way she says her lines.

[Auntie Anxiety]

For a minute there, I really thought the writers allowed Crystal to bite the dust.  I am sorely disappointed.

[wanderingstar]

I like Ali Larter. I want to like Crystal. I did briefly in the pilot. But her character is incredibly one-note. The fact that her one-noteness stands out on this show full of one-note characters is quite telling.

[Catherinewriter]

I love Tina. Is she the Grey's intern who was electrocuted in the basement?

I find that I often don't like the leading women in a series, but the supporting roles. I think that's because male showrunners choose good looking women who aren't necessarily good actors for the leads. That leaves the secondary roles for the good actors, and Tina is one of those. My opinion, obviously.

Edited September 5, 2014 by Catherinewriter

[iscoffy]

I can't really tell if I like this show or not, but I like Sean Bean enough to keep watching it.

 

I don't really get some of the "legends," though. Assuming my multi-tasking while watching this show didn't lead me astray, "Dante" had clearly been around a long time and developed actual contacts who believe he is who he says he is (as in, the arms dealer guy who got Dante in touch with the VX people), so is Martin having to pop in here and there over years to establish each of these personas?  Because it seems like the FBI is coming up with them on the fly, and I'm guessing you can't really suddenly be accepted as an international dealer if Dante is supposed to have been doing this stuff for years, but no one has ever seen him or done a deal with him.

Edited September 5, 2014 by iscoffy

[Catherinewriter]

Simone S, I agree that black performers have a limited number of options, and it angers me. But I also think, more and more, that despite really fine shows such a "The Americans," "Justified," well, you know all the good ones - that despite them, a lot of really shoddy writing goes on for actors of all races. Especially if there's a star sure to bring in the audience, which is the case here. And the writing and plotting isn't even that good for the stars sometimes (as here).

I can get really really annoyed, don't you know. Wonder how the new season will stack up, both for new and returning series.

[Catherinewriter]

Oh, Auntie, you silly person. I don't like Chrystal but I really feel for Larter. Again, a lovely woman, which the showrunners want, but not an actress, which I want. Do other people recast roles as episodes are running? I do and it's really distracting, but there are so many good actresses who aren't necessarily Miss America, that it boils me.

Bean deserves another role worthy of him, in the league of Boromir and Ned Stark. Wonder if there will be one.

[La Tortuga]

Sean Bean was fantastic in this episode.  You can really see his internal struggles on his face.  Crystal (Ali Larter) continues to annoy - it must be the way she says her lines.

 

I think the problem is that the writing team and the director are trying to force Ali Larter and Sean Bean to show sexual tension, and it's just stupid. They make her smile about him when he's not there like a teenage girl nursing a crush on an older guy, and it just doesn't work for me. She slept with him years ago, and it didn't end well; presumably they've both had other partners since then and moved on with life. I'd rather she be hard-boiled when it comes to him, because then whether they're getting along or feeling adversarial, at least they'd be conveying mutual respect.

[John.G]

so is Martin having to pop in here and there over years to establish each of these personas? Because it seems like the FBI is coming up with them on the fly

I would say yes, he is maintaining some of these legends. When Gates suggested using the Dante legend, he introduced it as "Odom's most successful legend" (or something like that), which means that Dante has been in play before, with good results to show for it. Edited September 7, 2014 by John.G

[John.G]

But the show stretches credibility. In this day and age with the Internet, it is impossible to believe that Malcolm's or any FBI legend can stand up to even cursory scrutiny by criminals

maybe they have a Chloe O'Brien somewhere covering all the tracks.

This was explicitly shown in the pilot, when the team was creating his legend's cancer history on the fly during his meeting with The Founding Father. And spelled his name wrong while doing so.

[betsyboo]

I think the problem is that the writing team and the director are trying to force Ali Larter and Sean Bean to show sexual tension, and it's just stupid. They make her smile about him when he's not there like a teenage girl nursing a crush on an older guy, and it just doesn't work for me. She slept with him years ago, and it didn't end well; presumably they've both had other partners since then and moved on with life. I'd rather she be hard-boiled when it comes to him, because then whether they're getting along or feeling adversarial, at least they'd be conveying mutual respect.

Agreed. But I was very much relieved when they didn't go for the tried and true plot device where Crystal watches the interrogation room and hears Anna and Martin talk about sleeping together - and crumbles. I thought for sure they would flash to her watching and being upset.

[wanderingstar]

Martin is put on leave in the wake of a confrontation with the Colonel. Martin then begins to investigate his own past, discovering that an enigmatic smuggler in Houston may have the answers he needs.

 

 

This episode gave me flashbacks to the Manchurian Candidate (Something happened over there! During the war!) and the X-Files episode "Sleepless" (They put chips in our brains!) That is, until we moved to karaoke night in Texas. Sigh.

 

Anyhoo, this may be the first episode I actively liked. We got movement on the Who is Martin story, and Crystal had a purpose beyond badmouthing Martin. Plus, I liked the dynamic between Crystal and Agent Rice (as investigators, nothing more).

 

Oh, and nice to see Kirk Acevedo!

 

[Catherinewriter]

What the hell with the wife?

Yes, Kirk Avecedo is always a welcome pleasure. I first saw him in OZ many years ago, though don't know if that was his first major performance, and always look for him in cast lists. He needs a regular slot somewhere (probably not here as he's likely not going to live very long. Could be wrong.)

Tina (forget character name) says she's being careful, but where else would she do her computer hacking if not from the office system? And if she has a setup at home, wouldn't it have to be linked to the office as a job requirement? I fear for her.

Are those weapons we saw briefly in Avecedo's warehouse? That can't be good. And how many people did Martin kill in tonight's episode, or were many of those just woundings? He surely is quick on the trigger. Do organizations such as his get carte blanche to waste people hither and yon?

Edited September 12, 2014 by Catherinewriter

[wanderingstar]

What the hell with the wife?

 

 

I forgot about that. Did they show who she was talking to after she hung up with Martin?

[anstar]

And how many people did Martin kill in tonight's episode,

I asked that same question.  And in Texas, no less.  We're a death penalty state.  Aside from the atrocious accents that made my ears bleed, this was a pretty good episode.  I was suspicious of the wife early on, when she started showing up all lovey dovey, after pushing him away all season.  Clearly she was trying to get him back on track, so her "how was that" to the unseen person when she hung up the phone didn't surprise me.

So, I guess I'm supposed to not hate that detective on sight any more? I don't even know his name. That's how much his character annoyed me.  His refusal to obey orders in his quest for justice, lying to coworkers about authority to proceed and general arrogance was just off-putting to me.

[thuganomics85]

Sean with a Texan drawl... well, I've heard worse.  Usually British/Australian actors go over-the-top, but he seemed to at least tone it down.  Still, it took a bit to get use to that "legend"!

 

Surprisingly, the previews actually weren't lying, and some big stuff happened this time.  I'll wait and see where it goes, but I'm glad it's finally going forward.  So, basically, it sounds like Martin served in Iraq (he still doesn't remember), and his platoon was involved with some kind of experiment, that made him lose his memory.  The guy from the pilot was also in the platoon as well, and now, everyone else is dead.  But Kirk Acevedo's character is also a part of this, somehow?  Hmm...

 

Oh, and, it sounds like Sonya is totally playing him.  Is she working for this mysterious organization as well?  Hey, I'm all for it.  I rather her be a bad guy, then just the wife.  But, now I'm curious about the son and what the deal over that is.

 

Crystal and Rice have now teamed up, to try and figure out what is going on.  But, Martin has now enlisted Maggie's help.  If that's the sides, I'm Team Martin/Maggie, all the way!

[ShellSeeker]

I've enjoyed every episode of this show so far, including this one, until we got to Texas. That whole part of the storyline seemed painful, awkward, and clunky. And Martin/Glenn being able to pick off all the bad guys by himself strained credulity, even for a TV show. But overall it was OK and I'm liking where they're going with the story.

I figured Sonya was in on something as soon as she showed up at Martin's apartment with dinner. I'd suspected she was more than just the long-suffering ex.

[tv echo]

I hate to admit it but Sean Bean's Texas accent as Len Barlow just didn't sound believable.  I also found his quick killing of all those henchman a bit off-putting since he doesn't know yet what's really going on.  For all he knew, some of those men might be petty crooks but not murderers, or some of them might be working there under duress.  Yes, I know, it was self-defense since they were shooting at him as well.  But he's the one who trespassed.  I just wish he had found another way to get that Kyle guy out

 

If Sonya's not really his ex-wife, then is that boy really his son?

 

I really liked the Martin-Maggie team up.  It reminded me of Jack Bauer and Chloe.  Every hero (or anti-hero) needs a loyal computer expert.  

 

I understand the need for the Crystal-Rice team up to add drama and complexity to the plot, but something about Ali Larter's portrayal of Crystal still rubs me the wrong way.  I still find Crystal unlikeable and I'm not sure why. I liked her fine in Heroes.  I also still don't care for Rice.  Their increased screen time this episode drove the episode down for me.  

Edited September 11, 2014 by tv echo

[Haleth]

I completely forgot about this show until looking at the guide I saw last night's episode listed.  I watched this episode on demand and hopefully will remember to catch epi 5 before epi 6 airs.  Not a good sign if Sean can't even impel me to watch.

[tv echo]

I just read this TVOvermind review of this episode and it pinpointed why I didn't like Crystal and Rice:

http://www.tvovermind.com/reviews/legends-1-05-review-rogue-239826

 

So Crystal has no scruples about committing an unethical act (eavesdropping on private therapy session) and Rice has no scruples about committing an illegal act (breaking and entering).  Great examples of our law enforcement personnel...

Edited September 13, 2014 by tv echo

[caprice]

Okay, no, no, no. I don't want to have to worry about Maggie.

[Catherinewriter]

Caprice, WORD. When a new show starts these days I try to figure out who's going to die so it's not such a shock. So far not particularly good at predicting. But if this show has been lucky enough to sign Tina Majorino and then kills her off, they deserve much suffering.

[johntfs]

I can't be the only one who squealed "Charlie!" when Kirk Acevedo showed up, can I? 

 

Yes, this show is pretty flawed, but what do you expect from the people who did 24?

 

For my part, I'm looking forward to the complete series of "Wiseguy" arriving at my house sometime Monday.  That show fell down a little in the third and especially fourth seasons, but damn if season one wasn't one of the best things ever to touch a TV.

[La Tortuga]

At first I wasn't buying the Texas setting at all, what with the barrage of weird accents, and especially the guy claiming he couldn't keep up with every criminal in town because "It's the 4th largest city in the US!" (which nobody in Houston goes around just saying out loud, because it's very obvious even to a stranger how large, complex, and crime-ridden Houston is once they try to drive through it).

 

But then there was a massive shoot-out and impromptu kidnapping, immediately followed by a loud and painful-looking car accident involving a pick-up truck, and I said, "Oh yeah. That's Houston, all right." All they needed was a random asshat driving around shooting his pistol in the air for shits and giggles, and I'd have been convinced they actually filmed in Texas.

[justcris]

If the accident was in 2003, then I think the boy was born after than, even though I can't remember if they mentioned his age on the show. 

 

I think all the pans to the guns or whatever the guys had in that warehouse was supposed to show they were really bad guys so it was ok for Martin to shoot them.

[caprice]

Yes, this show is pretty flawed, but what do you expect from the people who did 24?

Other than flexible travel times and bad guys slipping through perimeters? ;)

If the accident was in 2003, then I think the boy was born after than, even though I can't remember if they mentioned his age on the show. 

Wasn't the accident in 2004? I thought that was the date on the back of the picture, which was why Martin asked his ex about it again. I could be wrong and since I've already deleted it from my DVR, I can't re-watch.

[La Tortuga]

I think what bothers me about Rice is that he's so vocal and braggy about his abilities as a crime-solver that it starts to come across as insecurity. It's not enough for him to believe he's clever; everyone else has to know it and acknowledge it, from Martin's DCO handler to the city cop who runs the evidence locker and does not give a shit. I think that's why Crystal smiles a little when Rice calls himself "masterful." It's not just because Rice is a reverse snob; it's also because he's pleading with her to believe he's more than just a guy who sits behind a desk in the Transportation department.

 

What surprised me about Crystal is that she let Rice lead her along his logical path without looking back on the other events that were taking place at the same time. Martin is involved in (not guilty of) a crime that takes place when one of his legends is trying to stop a bombing by the Virginia Militia. Gates demands that Rice stop investigating, because that's when they're all trying to deal with the VX gas problem. Rice doesn't know these things, but Crystal does, and it's like she's suddenly forgotten that they happened even though she was there.

[SoapDoc]

 

What surprised me about Crystal is that she let Rice lead her along his logical path without looking back on the other events that were taking place at the same time.

I agree with this. However, I think she also knows that something more is going on with him right now. She just watched his psych session so she my suspect that there is something more amiss.

 

 

Wasn't the accident in 2004?

Yeah, his wife told him that it was in 2004 and I guess he found the newspaper clippings. The conspiracy must be pretty high if your "fake" accident ends up in the LA paper. It must be fake right since he was in Iraq? Is the child actually his?

 

I now see why Amber V. was hired for this role -- she plays spy and shady much better than loving happy housewife.

[Happytobehere]

I just read this TVOvermind review of this episode and it pinpointed why I didn't like Crystal and Rice:

http://www.tvovermind.com/reviews/legends-1-05-review-rogue-239826

 

So Crystal has no scruples about committing an unethical act (eavesdropping on private therapy session) and Rice has no scruples about committing an illegal act (breaking and entering).  Great examples of our law enforcement personnel...

I couldn't agree more with this assessment. This is particularly sad because I usually like Chestnut and think he is actually a solid actor. I never thought Larter could act so my dislike of her is a no-brainier.

As for Martin/Not Martin, I knew from the beginning that the wife had to be in on it. It's the only thing that makes sense if you took the intimation that Martin is a legend at face value (it also feeds into his difficulty to separate his legend from his life -- his "life" is a legend too, and he knows this on some level). There are really only two questions for me regarding this scenario -- 1) Is the boy really Martin and the wife's, or did they take someone's baby for the ruse? and 2) a Is Gates in on the ruse, or did he meet Martin after the legend was in place? I hope it's the latter because I like Steve Harris and I like Gates' support of Martin. Besides, I think one relationship on this show should be exactly what it appears to be.

Loved seeing Kirk Acevado and hope they find a way to keep him for more than an episode or two.

Nothing better happen to Megan because if it does, it would be hard not to hold Martin partly culpable, especially since he knew what happened to the first guy he asked to help him.

[TV Anonymous]

What kind of bank lets two different safe deposit boxes have exactly the same set of keys?

[tv echo]

Fallout from a shoot-out finds Martin taking Kyle Dobson into custody. Before long, Dobson's mysterious employers enlist hit men to retrieve a wounded Dobson, prompting Martin to plan a desperate escape with Dobson back to Los Angeles.

Is anyone still watching this show? 

 

I can't believe Dobson survived being dragged around the city, including onto a bus, only to be shot at the end.  I can't believe Martin drank that cup of coffee.  He should've known better.  Maybe lack of sleep dulled his wits.  I did like Martin defending the house and taking out all of those attacking guys in different ways.  The Gates and Sonya reveal was a surprise.  Crystal and Rice didn't annoy as much this episode.

Edited September 19, 2014 by tv echo

[tv echo]

A Saudi prince's life is threatened during a visit to Los Angeles. Martin's investigation leads him to a beautiful female-rights advocate.

[tv echo]

Martin poses as a journalist to uncover the true assassins of Prince Abdullah. This "off-book" investigation leads Martin into his most perilous standoff yet.

[tv echo]

Conclusion. Martin learns that Verax may be plotting an assassination in the Season 1 finale. Also: Martin gets kidnapped and makes a shocking discovery about his own identity.

[betsyboo]

I'm still watching, but am guessing this was it for me since SVU and MF start back up next week, along with everything else.

 

When he sipped the coffee I was screaming at the TV. will also blame the car crash and lack of sleep on this slipup.

 

So did Amber Valletta only tell him they were married when he woke up in the hospital after the "car accident" (Iraq)? Is that child even his?

 

CLEARLY Ali Larter and Chestnut are going to sleep together. First she propositions him at the bar (not caring he was married), and now he's fighting with his wife on the phone in front of her.

 

I can't decide who's good and who's bad, other than Tina marjorino.

 

(I just realized I used all the actors' names because i don't know any of the character names. :-| )

[Catherinewriter]

Can't understand what reason the wife and Gates have for keeping things from Martin. They both presumably love/respect him, so why have him suffer so? I can't with the understanding.

Will miss Acevedo. He's such a good actor. And really, to stand up tall (when he's apparently seriously wounded) against a pillar, offering such a good shot. And did they even try to go after the sniper? I can't remember. These actors, most of them, deserve a better show. Remember Sigourney Weaver's wonderful lines in "Galaxy Quest," - "This episode is poorly written. Whoever wrote this episode should die!" Could say that about the series.

[thuganomics85]

Ha, I only finally got around to watching this episode, only to see that it's been quite.

 

Not that I'm surprised.  After thinking last week's episode was interesting, a lot of stuff in this one bugged me.  I rolled my eyes over the coffee bit.  It must have been the wreck and fatigue, because the Martin we've seen, would have never fallen for that trick.  Of course, that must have been some weak-ass knock out pills, since he still recovered in time to save the day.  That out-of-nowhere tackle was fun though.  Caution!  A Wild Sean Bean is On the Loose!

 

And, then to save himself and Kirk Acevedo against numerous odds, by creating what was a basically a more violent Home Alone scenario, only for Kirk to get taken out by a sniper was anti-climatic.  Crystal and Rice should have gotten him in protection and cover, as soon as Martin handed him off to them.  Ugh.

 

Yeah, Rice having marriage problems means he is totally hooking up with Crystal.  And, since Crystal and Martin had history, I'm sure that's going to cause drama.

 

I guess it is intriguing that Sonya is actually working with Gates, and he seems to be part of the conspiracy.

 

I still like Maggie, at least.  And, Bean's still doing his best, but the writing really is letting him down, IMO.

[seacliffsal]

I love this show.  I like all the action of the episodes.  I wish the Kevin Dobson character had lived, but oh well.  The conspiracy is growing and I'm confident that Martin will eventually figure it out.  I'm in for as long as it lasts.

[Enigma X]

I am still watching and think the last two episodes have vastly improved. Instead of watching for just Sean Bean, I am actively interested in the mystery now.

[SimoneS]

Not a bad episode. I still think that the legends and writing are weak, but the show seems to be finding its feet exploring Martin's mysterious past. I was surprised that Gates was in cahoots with the wife. Nice twist. I do hope that she makes up with Martin. Even if she deceiving him, she can give him some emotionally stability for a short while.

 

But really, they could not give Kirk Acevedo a couple episodes? Such an under appreciated actor. I think that Crystal and Rice have chemistry. I look forward to them hooking up.

[Auntie Anxiety]

Some of Sean Bean's (swoon) facial expressions remind me of Kiefer Sutherland/Jack Bauer's tics.  And the acting isn't bad but I am totally obsessed Ali Larter's blunt haircut.  Wish my hair did that.

 

The episode:  I am enjoying the ride and sometimes it's nice to not have to think so much (The Honorable Woman, which was excellent, gave me headaches).  Odum's wife and Gates was an interesting twist, Dobson getting killed was predictable and I do like Chloe O'Brien 2.0.

[Sofie Fatale]

Did someone complain about Tina Majorino's Who-Ville hair? It looks so much better and less distracting now.

[tomorrowgirl]

I'm glad that Tina Majorino did change her hairstyle.  I agree that it was distracting.  I guess we'll never know if she was asked to change it or if she decided on her own that it looked sort of ridiculous.

 

I wondered why Martin didn't pick up some of the automatic rifles that belonged to the men he killed.  He could have used that extra fire power.

[Cindylou]

I love this show!  Jack Bauer and Martin could really clean up the Country!   Suspending belief really makes me enjoy the ride.  I'm glad i was not the only one yelling at my TV for him to NOT drink that coffee!  I knew that nurse was up to no good as soon as she handed him the coffee!  THEY DON'T DO THAT!!!!!    I can't wait to see what happens next.

[caprice]

I rolled my eyes over the coffee bit.  It must have been the wreck and fatigue, because the Martin we've seen, would have never fallen for that trick.  Of course, that must have been some weak-ass knock out pills, since he still recovered in time to save the day.  That out-of-nowhere tackle was fun though.  Caution!  A Wild Sean Bean is On the Loose!

 

And, then to save himself and Kirk Acevedo against numerous odds, by creating what was a basically a more violent Home Alone scenario, only for Kirk to get taken out by a sniper was anti-climatic.  Crystal and Rice should have gotten him in protection and cover, as soon as Martin handed him off to them.  Ugh.

Agreed about a Martin at the top of his game wouldn't fall for the drugged coffee.

 

For that matter, I also agree with you that it was ridiculous to have Seriously Wounded Kirk STANDING in the open once Martin handed him over to Crystal. I was scanning the hillside as soon as they brought him out of the house. *facepalm*

[tv echo]

I thought this episode was kinda 'meh'.  I'm also confused because I must've missed something ... when did Agent Rice become part of their team?

[alias1]

I thought this episode was kinda 'meh'.  I'm also confused because I must've missed something ... when did Agent Rice become part of their team?

I think I missed last week's episode but I wondered the same thing.  

 

Is no one else watching this show anymore? 

 

I noticed that this show is not in the Main Forum List of shows beginning with L.  You have to search for it by selecting "See All Shows."  I'm wondering why a new show isn't in the main list.

Edited September 26, 2014 by SierraMist

[thuganomics85]

I'm still watching the show, but I just have to watch it later On Demand, since everything else is starting now.

 

Rice: there was some kind of throwaway line from Gates, that he is now officially transferred to their unit.  Not sure why (I doubt the higher-ups would have impressed with anyone's performance in Texas), but whatever.  I rather he be here now, the more of him on the outside, trying to take out Martin.

 

I did love seeing Christine Adams as Hani.  She's great in everything (Agents of SHIELD, Terra Nova, among other things), but she'll forever be remembered best by me as Simone from Pushing Daises.  I still miss that show.

 

Martin's already doing a new "Legend" already.  Sean Bean seemed to be having fun at playing a drunk and more snippy character. Confused over the main plot though.  It looked like Christian Clemenson is the ringleader for this assassination, and the diplomat and CIA traitor are in on it, but is Hani/Christine Adams just a pawn?  She seemed sincere about just attacking the Prince with words and protest, and didn't expect the bombing.  Plus, I feel like Maggie is the character they want viewers to relate to the most, so her being a supporter makes me think something else is up.

 

Gates now is trying to claim that the picture of Martin with the soldiers is a fake.  Sonya is planting the seeds of them "reuniting." Martin's falling for it... for now.