S05.E06: One Heart

[helenamonster]

Quote

Dr. Shaun Murphy and Dr. Alex Park grapple with a life-and-death decision and must decide between saving one patient over another. Dr. Morgan Reznick goes a little too far in her attempt to win Salen's favor.

Original airdate: 11/15/21

[Annber03]

Well, that was an emotional ending. I felt for the poor dad, but I liked Shaun and Asher letting him know how many people his son wound up helping. It was interesting to see Shaun and Asher working together on this case, and obviously fitting, too, given their own history with their fathers (and in Shaun's case, father figure - I liked all the flashbacks with Glassman). I'm glad that little boy got the heart in the end. Park's interaction with him was cute. 

And speaking of Glassman, he seems pretty content where he is right now, but I get Lea coming to try and encourage him to come back, too. Glassman was also right to call her out on her decision to delete those comments - will be interesting to see how Shaun reacts if and when Lea tells him what she's done. 

Regarding Andrews and Salen, all I can say is, Andrews, what are you doing? 

Morgan taking that office is interesting. Curious what that'll mean for her future going forward. 

[possibilities]

I'm all for Glassman going to live his best life in MT, and giving Lea what-for over her behavior, but to stand Shaun up for the tux fitting and completely stop taking his calls is a bit much. He could at least say what's up. Totally ghosting him is rude and unkind, even if you're not the father figure of someone whose own parents abandoned them.

Andrews and Salen gross me out, individually and together. And do they hate all women of color on this show? Claire was not allowed to be happy for even a second. Lim was given the story of not being able to be in a romantic relationship with someone she supervised. Actually both of them were in trouble for their closeness with Melendez, who they also got rid of. And now whatever happened with the abrupt exit of her new BF/underling, though that might not have been planned, given how abrupt it was. And now Salen is romancing Andrews. I guess they let you do it if you're a Machiavellian and also blonde. 

Lea had better dye her hair blonde if she wants job security. Salen and Reznik seem to be the only women who get to be happy and keep their jobs at the same time on this show.

Other intern was also absent this week, it was notable because it gave Asher a chance to work alone with Shaun, and it meant there was no bickering this week. The two of them are always bickering, which I really am tired of. They had that one episode where they patched up a major fight but I don't believe it will last.

Edited November 16, 2021 by possibilities

[Leeds]

It was good to see Asher back, and with a decent storyline.

I can't stand Salen with her ridiculous ukulele playing in the lobby and her dreadful "blonde" hair.

I prefer Glassman in Montana where presumably he wasn't berated constantly and where he could relax and enjoy himself.

[Zonk]

Shaun was kind with what he said to Park. I would have gone with something like "How dare you put me in this position, you fucking asshole! A friend wouldn't do that. The rules are there for a reason."

Also it's increadibly irresponsible for these writers to write such a storyline. Fear of doctors not giving it their all and giving up before they usually would, if they have other patients who could live, if they'd get your organs, is a major reason why people won't fill out organ doner cards. Fuck these writers, seriously.

[Good Queen Jane]

Park is still a resident, isn't he? Have heart transplants become so commonplace that now unsupervised residents are doing them?

[greekmom]

Just because Salen said she would sign something or whatnot because she's wants to have a relationship with a subordinate it is still as wrong as the whole Melendaz-Brown and Melendaz-Lim. More so as she is the CEO of the hospital. Furthermore, Andrews helping her stop a colleague from negotiating was major kiss ass brownie points move. 

Moving on to the big case of the week. I thought Park did jump the gun and was putting too much pressure on Shaun to give up and call it. While I did feel bad for the little boy, doctors are obligated to do whatever they can for their patient to live. Moving into the second case.... I felt for Morgan while she wanted to do what was best for the patient but went along with Salen's suggestion in giving the patient option B. Gawd, if this was one of her rich friends or herself, she would want option a.  I don't like her and I don't think she should be an owner/CEO or whatever she is of ANY TYPE of medical facility.  Please show MAKE HER GO AWAY.

I did like the flashback to Shaun in school. 

 

Edited November 16, 2021 by greekmom

[cinsays]

I thought when they first were discussing the impossibility of actually saving the one boy with his father, when the father asked about organ donation, he was told, only the heart would be usable, yet they managed to donate all those other organs.

Did they find they could cleanse the other organs to make them acceptable or did I not hear correctly?

[judyri]

Lately, the only ones I like on this show are Asher and Park.  All the rest have really unsympathetic story lines.  Does the new administrator ever do any work?  She just lurks around.  I think she's going to turn out to be really shady.  She's pretty irredeemable right now.

[amarante]

I don’t understand the economics of  why the more expensive option could not be suggested. 

The about to be blind girl had medical insurance. If a doctor recommends a procedure the insurance company determines whether they will pay for it. The patient fights for coverage if it is refused and may or may not get coverage. 

A private hospital doesn’t spend more just because a procedure is more expensive. They just don’t provide services until someone agrees to pay. 

Procedurally, a doctor would recommend a procedure and if necessary provide support for why it was the preferable procedure. The hospital administrator or owner doesn’t care unless for some reason they are asked to do it pro bono. But the potentially blind woman had insurance so the insurance company would be asked to approve the expenditure.

A hospital isn’t going to purchase equipment specifically for one operation so the cost of the equipment was irrelevant. A hospital determines whether there is enough need for new equipment to justify the purchase and once they have it, there is an incentive to use it to amortize acquisition costs. World class hospitals want to have cutting edge equipment because it attracts star doctors and patients with good insurance. 

This hospital is not an HMO type of situation in which the hospital is given $X to cover all medical costs for enrollee. It is a straight for profit hospital in which it gets payment from insurance companies. It doesn't make a decision not to do a procedure because it is "expensive" and there is a less expensive alternative. The insurance company is the one who makes those kinds of economically driven "medical" decisions - again unless this is an HMO (which this isn't) a hospital has no incentive to not perform a surgery absent ethical or similar non-economic factors. 

The hospital will receive less money from blind woman's insurance company for the less expensive procedure and if the more expensive procedure was approved, the hospital would receive more money. But approval would come from the insurance company. Since the blind woman was an upper middle class professional with probably good corporate health benefits and a knowledge of how the system worked, she would probably have been able to get the more expensive procedure approved by her insurance company.

This was just a ridiculous set up to show the increasing moral depravity of blonde doctor.  It had nothing to do with the realty of how medical care is rationed. 

Edited November 17, 2021 by amarante

[judyri]

53 minutes ago, amarante said:

This was just a ridiculous set up to show the increasing moral depravity of blonde doctor.

Both of them.  Resnick didn't even suggest it just so she could get Glassman's job.  And I was so happy for him calling out Leah on infantilizing Shaun when she deleted that review. Way out of line!

[greekmom]

8 minutes ago, judyri said:

Both of them.  Resnick didn't even suggest it just so she could get Glassman's job.  And I was so happy for him calling out Leah on infantilizing Shaun when she deleted that review. Way out of line!

It's like Salen is Satan and tempting everyone.

[amarante]

6 hours ago, cinsays said:

I thought when they first were discussing the impossibility of actually saving the one boy with his father, when the father asked about organ donation, he was told, only the heart would be usable, yet they managed to donate all those other organs.

Did they find they could cleanse the other organs to make them acceptable or did I not hear correctly?

I think the issue was that the heart had been damaged so the veins had to be repaired. It wasn’t that it was contaminated so no issues with other organs and they wouid have always been viable so long as the patient didn’t die. I believe there is a very short period of time when organs can be harvested which is why donors are generally brain dead but technically alive until they are taken off life support and declared dead and the organs are immediately removed. 

[possibilities]

I think Salen thought that since the more expensive procedure was considered experimental, it would definitely not be covered by insurance. And thus, if they wanted to keep the patient happy and get the contract for all her business, they would feel like the only way to do that would be to do the procedure themselves, and not punt the decision to the insurance company, or have the patient go elsewhere. They wanted her to feel grateful and impressed by them, not to take her business elsewhere or leave feeling like there was something better that they refused to do for her even though she was going to bring them a lot of other business.

I am not saying I like it. I'm just saying I think that is what Salen's thinking is. And I don't think Reznik needs much tempting. Andrews, either. They're both basically Salen already, but are not used to getting support rather than being reined in. 

This is actually the first episode I liked Glassman. I think the only one I like anymore on a consistent basis is Lim. I am not even sure why I'm still watching. 

[izabella]

1 hour ago, judyri said:

Both of them.  Resnick didn't even suggest it just so she could get Glassman's job.

Reznick is a piece of work.  That should be considered malpractice.  She should have told her patient there was a machine that could save her sight 100%, but their hospital didn't have it.  And then she should have given her a referral. 

[Driad]

Did Resnick tell her patient she was going blind before she did the brain scan?  A visual field deficit can have several causes, so the next move is to test the patient, not terrify her.

Salen, among her other despicable features, is constantly trying to be cute.  Yecch.  Andrews, you're usually smart, but getting involved with Salen is idiotic.

[Zonk]

3 hours ago, possibilities said:

I think Salen thought that since the more expensive procedure was considered experimental, it would definitely not be covered by insurance. And thus, if they wanted to keep the patient happy and get the contract for all her business, they would feel like the only way to do that would be to do the procedure themselves, and not punt the decision to the insurance company, or have the patient go elsewhere. They wanted her to feel grateful and impressed by them, not to take her business elsewhere or leave feeling like there was something better that they refused to do for her even though she was going to bring them a lot of other business.

Yeah, but still. If they have the equipment already, then the cost of the procedure is mostly virtual to them. Sure, they don't make money in the few hours it's being used for that operation, but it didn't sound like such a machine would be used 24/7 anyway. Which only leaves doctors salary. That is certainly high, but not astronomical. And maybe they could even make a deal with the insurance company where they pay for the normal operation and they do the more expensive one. In any case the potential contract would make more than up for the cost.

If they don't have the equipment, they could send her to another hospital. She would still be greatfull that blonde doctor diagnosed her early, figured out a way to save 100% of her eyesight and sent her to the right doctors who could do that operation and would give the hospital the contract, because of how greatfull she was and because of the great medical care she recieved.

Whereas only saving 60% of her vision could have seriously disgruntled her. She works in the medical sector. Who says she wouldn't have gotten a second opinion and there she would have learned of the 100% option?

I agree with @amarante this didn't make any sense in any shape or form. So either the writers wrote a lot of hogwash or Salen is incompetent.

Edited November 17, 2021 by Zonk

[possibilities]

Salen said they'd have to buy the equipment and it was so expensive that it would cost more than the clinic would make off the contract for the patient's business, thus she didn't think it was worth it to the hospital to do it, and apparently Resnik agreed.

Again, I am not saying they did the right thing. I can't stand Salen on any level and I've never liked Resnik either. But she did her financial analysis explicitly. It was wrong, it was bullshit, but I think it was spelled out that it was cheaper and easier to short-change the patient than to help her, purely on a dollars basis. She didn't care about making the patient happy. She cared about not spending the money to buy the equipment and not complicating the conversation with options for the patient. the least effort to get the contract was all that mattered to her. Patient care is a hassle to Salen.

 

[Zonk]

2 minutes ago, possibilities said:

Salen said they'd have to buy the equipment and it was so expensive

She didn't. She said "the cost of the medical equipment and treatment is several hundred thousand dollars more than the value of that contract."

If they already have the equipment was left unclear.

Of course the whole conversation wouldn't make sense if they already had it, but as we have established, it doesn't make sense either way, so: ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

5 minutes ago, possibilities said:

Again, I am not saying they did the right thing. I can't stand Salen on any level and I've never liked Resnik either. But she did her financial analysis explicitly. It was wrong, it was bullshit, but I think it was spelled out that it was cheaper and easier to short-change the patient than to help her, purely on a dollars basis. She didn't care about making the patient happy. She cared about not spending the money to buy the equipment and not complicating the conversation with options for the patient. the least effort to get the contract was all that mattered to her. Patient care is a hassle to Salen.

Except that it could have massively backfired and just informing the patient of her options wouldn't have run that same risk.

Let's assume the hospital doesn't have the equipment and blonde doctor has to tell the patient that she is refering her to a hospital that does, is the patient then going to go "What?! You won't buy million dollar equipment just for me and treat me here?! Instead you are giving me a referal to a top notch hospital?! You bitch! Not only am I not going to give you the contract, I'm going to ruin you!"

Does that sound like a realistic reaction?

[bros402]

So that organ donor plot was.... yeah, they shouldn't push that belief of "if you aren't in a good spot the doctors will just let you die!!!!"

they could've done that much, much better

 

6 hours ago, amarante said:

I don’t understand the economics of  why the more expensive option could not be suggested. 

The about to be blind girl had medical insurance. If a doctor recommends a procedure the insurance company determines whether they will pay for it. The patient fights for coverage if it is refused and may or may not get coverage. 

A private hospital doesn’t spend more just because a procedure is more expensive. They just don’t provide services until someone agrees to pay. 

Procedurally, a doctor would recommend a procedure and if necessary provide support for why it was the preferable procedure. The hospital administrator or owner doesn’t care unless for some reason they are asked to do it pro bono. But the potentially blind woman had insurance so the insurance company would be asked to approve the expenditure.

A hospital isn’t going to purchase equipment specifically for one operation so the cost of the equipment was irrelevant. A hospital determines whether there is enough need for new equipment to justify the purchase and once they have it, there is an incentive to use it to amortize acquisition costs. World class hospitals want to have cutting edge equipment because it attracts star doctors and patients with good insurance. 

Yeah - the 100% treatment (and nothing is 100%, so saying that is just irresponsible) was experimental, so no way it would be covered by insurance. It should have at least been offered to her - who knows, she could've had a rich uncle who would've paid for it out of pocket. If they didn't have a proton beam machine, I bet another hospital in not-Nicole-Sullivan's hospital system has one - since it is used primarily for prostate cancer (I think), and they are testing it on new things all of the time.

4 hours ago, Driad said:

Did Resnick tell her patient she was going blind before she did the brain scan?  A visual field deficit can have several causes, so the next move is to test the patient, not terrify her.

Salen, among her other despicable features, is constantly trying to be cute.  Yecch.  Andrews, you're usually smart, but getting involved with Salen is idiotic.

Yup, Reznick told her right away. I was expecting her to, you know, at least check the machine to see if it was functional - but nope "lol ur going blind!"

[thuganomics85]

While well acted as always, the scenes about the heart transplant did leave me feeling kind of uncomfortable.  While I know he meant well and truly wanted to save his patient, it really did feel like Park was trying to pressure Shaun into basically letting one patient die to save the other and it just felt wrong.  I mean, sure, I get the logistics and numbers where not in the comatose guy's favor, but... let's be real here.  On this show/universe, so many patients managed to overcome near impossible odds and come out in one piece, and it's not wrong for Shaun to do everything in his power to do what he does best.  And yet, I felt like I was suppose to not want him to and, again, it just felt wrong.

Again though, the acting was great: especially the always reliable Derek Webster as the father.  Although I'm starting to wonder if his entire closet is filled with military uniforms, because he always tends to play someone in the military whenever I see him.  That or an FBI agent!  I guess he just has that type of look (and voice) that casting directors love for that type of character!

So, Reznick is now basically taking over the clinic?  Good luck with that, buddy!  She may be playing nice with you now, but Salen will probably not be a fun boss!

Speaking of which, so not only are Andrews and Salen already hooking up, but he's basically even assisting her with mind games, in order to get other doctors to fall in line with whatever she wants.  What the hell, Andrews?!

Lim didn't have much to do here, but she did get at least one great bit with her reaction to Asher's "Maybe me and my dad can reconcile if he gets cancer!" quip.

On one hand, Glassman seems to be at a better place now in Paradise and he was dead on about Lea falling into the trap of treating Shaun less as a fellow adult (like she use to) and more as a child/infant.  On the other hand, there has to be a way he can still do this and at least occasionally keep in contact with Shaun.  A mere Facetime would work, Glassman! 

[amarante]

9 hours ago, bros402 said:

Yeah - the 100% treatment (and nothing is 100%, so saying that is just irresponsible) was experimental, so no way it would be covered by insurance. It should have at least been offered to her - who knows, she could've had a rich uncle who would've paid for it out of pocket. If they didn't have a proton beam machine, I bet another hospital in not-Nicole-Sullivan's hospital system has one - since it is used primarily for prostate cancer (I think), and they are testing it on new things all of the time.

Except that this show often has some form of what would be experimental treatment as a major plot point. 

With the exception of the specifically pro bono cases like the ex-girl friend who flew there for treatment ALL of the patients have insurance and all elective procedures need to be cleared by an insurance company.

Hospitals like the one depicted do not even treat people without insurance - if they need emergency care, they are shipped out for further treatment when they are medically stable. Some insurance companies don't even have these kinds of facilities in their network. I am in Los Angeles and for awhile Cedars Sinai was not in many insurance plans because insurance companies didn't want to cover the higher fees they charged. 

Not to beat a dead horse, but the only reason this unrealistic portrayal of actual medical economics was written, was to provide some kind of moral dilemma to underscore blonde doctor's ruthlessness. She was always ruthless but this is the first time she has been shown to have acted against the best interests of her patients. In fact she sacrificed her hands in order to save the pregnant patients.

[circumvent]

I didn't pay much attention to this episode but having Shaun, an autistic man, hold a book that was supposedly written by parents of autistic people of some so-called expert is typical written-by-and-for-neurotypical bullshit. Why would Shaun need to read a book about how non-autistic people think autistics should be treated and seen by the rest of the world. So ridiculous.

Leah is infantilizing Shaun and is getting insufferable. 

[Driad]

15 minutes ago, circumvent said:

Leah is infantilizing Shaun and is getting insufferable. 

Getting?  IMO she always has been.

[possibilities]

1 hour ago, circumvent said:

I didn't pay much attention to this episode but having Shaun, an autistic man, hold a book that was supposedly written by parents of autistic people of some so-called expert is typical written-by-and-for-neurotypical bullshit. Why would Shaun need to read a book about how non-autistic people think autistics should be treated and seen by the rest of the world. So ridiculous.

Leah is infantilizing Shaun and is getting insufferable. 

I thought Glassman was reading the book, and the only reason Shaun had it in his hands was that Glassman left it on the car's passenger seat, and Shaun had to pick it up in order to sit there.

I still didn't like it, though. I think we were supposed to be touched that Glassman was educating himself about autism, because he thought of Shaun as his son. But the thing to do is read books by autistic people, not by their parents. It's still showing that someone else is the source of wisdom. 

I'm also kind of pissed that doctors are portrayed as not knowing anything about autism. But that's probably realistic, sadly enough. There are plenty of folks in the profession who aren't paying attention and don't care.

[KaveDweller]

On 11/15/2021 at 11:47 PM, possibilities said:

I'm all for Glassman going to live his best life in MT, and giving Lea what-for over her behavior, but to stand Shaun up for the tux fitting and completely stop taking his calls is a bit much. He could at least say what's up. Totally ghosting him is rude and unkind, even if you're not the father figure of someone whose own parents abandoned them.

Glassman should be allowed to move wherever he wants, but I agree, TELL Shaun you won't be around anymore. And it would be nice if he still goes to Shaun's wedding, but if he's not planning to tell Shaun that too. 

18 hours ago, possibilities said:

Salen said they'd have to buy the equipment and it was so expensive that it would cost more than the clinic would make off the contract for the patient's business, thus she didn't think it was worth it to the hospital to do it, and apparently Resnik agreed.

Again, I am not saying they did the right thing. I can't stand Salen on any level and I've never liked Resnik either. But she did her financial analysis explicitly. It was wrong, it was bullshit, but I think it was spelled out that it was cheaper and easier to short-change the patient than to help her, purely on a dollars basis. She didn't care about making the patient happy. She cared about not spending the money to buy the equipment and not complicating the conversation with options for the patient. the least effort to get the contract was all that mattered to her. Patient care is a hassle to Salen.

 

This is why people always need to get second opinions when they are diagnoses with series illnesses or conditions. 

1 hour ago, circumvent said:

I didn't pay much attention to this episode but having Shaun, an autistic man, hold a book that was supposedly written by parents of autistic people of some so-called expert is typical written-by-and-for-neurotypical bullshit. Why would Shaun need to read a book about how non-autistic people think autistics should be treated and seen by the rest of the world. So ridiculous.

Shaun wasn't reading the book, it was Glassman's book. Shaun picked it up when he got in the car. I think the point was Glassman was thinking of Shaun as his son.

There may be better ways Glassman could have tried to help, but he was at least trying. Shaun seemed pleased about that.

 

[circumvent]

10 hours ago, possibilities said:

I still didn't like it, though. I think we were supposed to be touched that Glassman was educating himself about autism, because he thought of Shaun as his son. But the thing to do is read books by autistic people, not by their parents. It's still showing that someone else is the source of wisdom. 

I'm also kind of pissed that doctors are portrayed as not knowing anything about autism. But that's probably realistic, sadly enough. There are plenty of folks in the profession who aren't paying attention and don't care.

Absolutely. An autistic person would have more insights about another autistic person. I cannot count how many people have reached out to a friend to tell her how much reading her stuff helped them (as parents) to understand better their autistic children. And they often point out to the professionals they saw throughout the years that failed miserably when trying to "help" - because it usually means trying to "fix", modeling in neurotypical characteristics.

Doctors are among the worst because until a few years ago, at least, no medical school even mentioned autism in their general curriculum. And they are usually patronizing and arrogant, as if they know everything. I have personally seen and experienced what could be called horror stories about doctors and the treatment of friends who are disabled, many autistic. 

[tennisgurl]

The ending with Asher and Shaun telling the father about all the people his sons organs helped was sweet, although I do question some of the implications of the story. One of the big fears that people have about being organ donors is that doctors will be quicker to pull the plug on them to get their organs, and while they made it clear that the patient was basically dead anyway, Park pressuring Shaun to stop working on his patient to get to his heart faster seems to play right into that fear. I also like that Asher and Shaun were the ones to be involved with the father/son story, as they both of plenty of father issues of their own. 

I think its great that Glassman is living his best life, but that doesn't mean he should totally ignore Shaun, this doesn't have to be all or nothing. He could at least return his calls and pop by for big wedding events. I am glad that he called Leah out about treating Shaun like a kid though.

Of course Salen sits around the office playing the ukulele like the wanna be manic pixie dream girl she is, she's this awful mix of overly quirky and horribly selfish. And I don't mind that Morgan is ambitious, I hate that ambition is so often punished by media, but putting her career over her patient was a really shitty things to do. 

Edited November 18, 2021 by tennisgurl

[izabella]

28 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

The ending with Asher and Shaun telling the father about all the people his sons organs helped was sweet, although I do question some of the implications of the story. One of the big fears that people have about being organ donors is that doctors will be quicker to pull the plug on them to get their organs, and while they made it clear that the patient was basically dead anyway, Park pressuring Shaun to stop working on his patient to get to his heart faster seems to play right into that fear.

I completely agree.  I am signed up as an organ donor, but these kinds of stories really do give me pause.   It's very easy to wonder if doctors will give you the best care if they know you're a donor.

[possibilities]

On 11/17/2021 at 12:34 AM, Zonk said:

Let's assume the hospital doesn't have the equipment and blonde doctor has to tell the patient that she is refering her to a hospital that does, is the patient then going to go "What?! You won't buy million dollar equipment just for me and treat me here?! Instead you are giving me a referal to a top notch hospital?! You bitch! Not only am I not going to give you the contract, I'm going to ruin you!"

Does that sound like a realistic reaction?

I think it would be unreasonable, but I also think Salen and Resnik didn't want to risk it. For them, there was no benefit to giving the patient any idea that someone else might be able to do something more than they would, because they didn't care about her vision, they just wanted her money. So for them, keeping it simple was the quickest and easiest and least risky way to get what they wanted.

I kind of hope the patient finds out they knew of the other option, and then sues them or at least withdraws her business and publicizes their actions. It might be what gets Salen booted from her position, and thus ends her time on the show! The last thing the hospital would want is for her "Ethicure" management to become a publicly exposed unethical sham. 

I actually kind of am looking forward to this happening, but I don't know if that's what the show is planning.

[ForReal]

On 11/19/2021 at 11:24 PM, possibilities said:

I think it would be unreasonable, but I also think Salen and Resnik didn't want to risk it. For them, there was no benefit to giving the patient any idea that someone else might be able to do something more than they would, because they didn't care about her vision, they just wanted her money. So for them, keeping it simple was the quickest and easiest and least risky way to get what they wanted.

I kind of hope the patient finds out they knew of the other option, and then sues them or at least withdraws her business and publicizes their actions. It might be what gets Salen booted from her position, and thus ends her time on the show! The last thing the hospital would want is for her "Ethicure" management to become a publicly exposed unethical sham. 

I actually kind of am looking forward to this happening, but I don't know if that's what the show is planning.

Same! I'm thinking this will come back to bite both Salen and Resnik and get them both off the show. I know a show needs villains to rail against, but this just isn't working for me. I need characters to have redeeming qualities or at least sympathetic qualities so I can hate to love them or love to hate them, but Salen and Resnik are just annoying. 

[Leeds]

On 11/17/2021 at 3:57 PM, possibilities said:

I still didn't like it, though. I think we were supposed to be touched that Glassman was educating himself about autism, because he thought of Shaun as his son. But the thing to do is read books by autistic people, not by their parents. It's still showing that someone else is the source of wisdom. 

 

So if your child/parent/sibling/friend is autistic/alcoholic/has cancer your point of view isn't valid, only theirs?  Okay then.

[izabella]

Glassman has been mentoring Shaun for a long time.  I'm sure he's done lots of research over the years, and has probably read a lot of different papers and books from different perspectives.  Maybe he was reading a parents' book because he needed some perspective from other parents on how to let go when your child is an adult and getting married.  He told Leah, treat Shaun like an adult.  Maybe that's what Glassman learned from the book in the chapter titled "Butt Out Unless Someone Hunts You Down in Montana for Advice."

[aemom]

On 11/16/2021 at 7:00 PM, judyri said:

Both of them.  Resnick didn't even suggest it just so she could get Glassman's job.

But, from the look on her face, I don't think that she was feeling very good about herself.  I would not be surprised to see that addressed in a later episode.

[KaveDweller]

On 11/21/2021 at 5:47 PM, izabella said:

Glassman has been mentoring Shaun for a long time.  I'm sure he's done lots of research over the years, and has probably read a lot of different papers and books from different perspectives.  Maybe he was reading a parents' book because he needed some perspective from other parents on how to let go when your child is an adult and getting married.  He told Leah, treat Shaun like an adult.  Maybe that's what Glassman learned from the book in the chapter titled "Butt Out Unless Someone Hunts You Down in Montana for Advice."

I think the book was from a flashback to when Shaun was in med school. They had been arguing about whether Shaun should go tell a professor he was wrong. But either way, I agree it's possible Glassman has done different types of research over the years. It certainly would be good if he did. As others have mentioned reading books by autistic people would give a good perspective, but I don't think there is anything wrong with also wanting to see what other parents have to say.

But for all we know the book could have been written by someone with autism. The title referred to how to interact with an autistic child, but that doesn't mean it is written by parents. Anyone could write a book and give it that title. 

Edited November 24, 2021 by KaveDweller

[Bookworm 1979]

On 11/21/2021 at 3:09 PM, Leeds said:

So if your child/parent/sibling/friend is autistic/alcoholic/has cancer your point of view isn't valid, only theirs?  Okay then.

I'm not disabled, but my husband is. I know one issue they have is that no one listens to disabled people.  People who are not disabled will act like experts on what to do to help out the disabled, but when the actual disabled community tries to comment they're pretty much told to be quiet.  

[bros402]

On 11/22/2021 at 10:23 PM, Bookworm 1979 said:

I'm not disabled, but my husband is. I know one issue they have is that no one listens to disabled people.  People who are not disabled will act like experts on what to do to help out the disabled, but when the actual disabled community tries to comment they're pretty much told to be quiet.  

ANd sometimes doctors don't like to listen to us - my first appointment with my oncologist he asked my medical history, I gave it to him along with my medications and their dosages, and he looked at my parents and asked them if I was right.

Of course now he knows me and knows that, yes, I was accurate - but it is an issue a lot of medical professionals have. They don't ask disabled people if it is correct, their first assumption is that something must be incorrect

[limecoke]

Not a bad episode but I’m so confused about a couple of things. I thought the young mans organs were smashed to smithereens so wondering how, what was it, 63 organs could have been donated? Also, the young boy had a heart transplant and yet comes out of anesthesia in his room, sitting up, no O2, no tubes coming out of everywhere, no IV, no ICU nurse hovering while pulling out a vent??? Really? Come in, show, at least try. 
 

I absolutely do not like Salen or anything about her. May her story arc be of short duration.
 

Edited December 21, 2021 by limecoke

[bros402]

8 hours ago, limecoke said:

Not a bad episode but I’m so confused about a couple of things. I thought the young mans organs were smashed to smithereens so wondering how, what was it, 63 organs could have been donated? Also, the young boy had a heart transplant and yet comes out of anesthesia in his room, sitting up, no O2, no tubes coming out of everywhere, no IV, no ICU nurse hovering while pulling out a vent??? Really? Come in, show, at least try. 
 

I absolutely do not like Salen or anything about her. May her story arc be of short duration.
 

skin and retina and other parts are donated