Show Spoilers and Book Talk

[Atlanta]

I thought I remember John being sort of aroused at being with someone who looked like Jamie. IIRC, he referred to it as his blood mixing with his or something? She did threaten to out him if he didn't do her this favor, but I don't think she would have carried it out. She knew he'd be a safe person to play engagement with until they find Roger. Her and LJG did become good friends. 

I hope this show doesn't go into much with Stephen Bonnet. If I never hear that name again, it won't be too soon.

[melody16]

I think this might be the correct topic to address my (only) concern about Murtagh being alive.  I love showMurtagh and his scenes with Jamie and even Claire have been among some of my very favorite.  But I am worried if they intend on featuring him in season 4 and beyond, including Fraser's Ridge, that his presence will impact Jamie's relationships with Roger, Young Ian, and even Fergus.  I am re-reading Fiery Cross and the development of Jamie and Roger is so crucial to the plot.  Also, Jamie's relationship and love for Young Ian and Fergus is so so important.  Has anyone else had similar thoughts?

[Nidratime]

Here's a brief clip of Claire and Joe from next week's episode:

http://www.harpersbazaar.com/culture/film-tv/a12767600/outlander-season-3-episode-5-clip/

[Atlanta]

Here's another which is totally diff from the book (I was expecting Brianna to say she was transferring to MIT)

http://www.eonline.com/videos/264952/outlander-exclusive-first-look

[Nidratime]

Interview with Richard Rankin:

Richard Rankin on Reprising His Role as Roger Wakefield in “Outlander,” and What the Future Holds for Him and Brianna

https://www.sony.com/en_us/richard-rankin-outlander-interview/

************

Quote

Here's another which is totally diff from the book (I was expecting Brianna to say she was transferring to MIT)

So was I, but I can see how she might need to take a break to reassess not only whether she wants to continue to follow in her "father's" footsteps studying history, but -- since it's 1968 -- I'm sure it's also a nod to the uproar at universities about the Vietnam War, Civil Rights, Women's Rights, the murders of Dr. King and Bobby Kennedy. It *was* a time when students were sometimes abandoning their studies and running off to Haight Ashbury or wherever, joining the counter culture. That being said, I always got the impression that Bree became a history major because of her father, and the love of it he shared with her, and not because she, herself, would've necessarily chosen it in his absence. Her mother is more practical and scientific minded, so I suppose Bree inherited that as well.

[FnkyChkn34]

Quote

Question: Outlander reader here. I’m concerned about Season 3 being only 13 episodes long. Voyager has so much going on and so many different locations (and timelines!), did the creators have to cut out a lot of the book to stay in 13 episodes? Any other cool tidbits to share on the upcoming season? —Katie
Ausiello: You’ve already seen how much the show is condensing the decades that Claire and Jamie are apart — the entire Dunsany storyline, for instance, was contained in Sunday’s episode — but we asked Caitriona Balfe how events that take place after Mr. and Mrs. Fraser’s reunion might play out… especially the sprawling chunk of the novel that takes place in the Caribbean. (Caveat: We’ve promised Starz not to reveal some crucial spoilers, so her answer reads accordingly.) Referring to one Jamaica-set scene from the book that is not in the series, the actress says, “When you’re reading the book, it’s like dreaming. You see the film in your head, and you can get away with so many more things in book form than you can if you’re showing it. And I think if we were to show this kind of interaction with [REDACTED] and [REDACTED]… I don’t know that that would work.” (And if you remind me later this season, I’ll fill in the quote so you know exactly what she was talking about.)

https://tvline.com/2017/10/03/sandra-oh-greys-anatomy-season-14-cristina-returning/

Are they talking about the scene where Jamie and Claire watch the sun rise over the harbor with the dolphins?  Because I have a beautiful image in my mind, and I'd personally hate for them to get that wrong.  Or are they talking about Lord John and Willoughby and the murder?  Hmm....

 

ETA:  Spoilers for multiple shows if you click the link.  Grey's Anatomy, New Girl, etc.

Edited October 4, 2017 by FnkyChkn34

[theschnauzers]

Here:s a hint — why did Claire and Jamie go to Jamaica in the first place?

[FnkyChkn34]

32 minutes ago, theschnauzers said:

Here:s a hint — why did Claire and Jamie go to Jamaica in the first place?

I get all of the islands they landed on confused. :)

But it's the crocodile scene, isn't it?  I didn't like that part in the book, so I tried to forget it...

[Nidratime]

That a whole part with the Reverend and his sister, especially when Claire meets up with the sister and the escaped slaves was bizarre.  Also, the bit beforehand with that man whose wife died and they have a sort of "mad tea party," that was also bizarre. Most of Jamaica was pretty out there, really.

[lianau]

6 hours ago, FnkyChkn34 said:

I get all of the islands they landed on confused. :)

But it's the crocodile scene, isn't it?  I didn't like that part in the book, so I tried to forget it...

So do I  . Isn't it  either bat shit , John  or Geilis  ?

[FnkyChkn34]

4 hours ago, Nidratime said:

That a whole part with the Reverend and his sister, especially when Claire meets up with the sister and the escaped slaves was bizarre.  Also, the bit beforehand with that man whose wife died and they have a sort of "mad tea party," that was also bizarre. Most of Jamaica was pretty out there, really.

That's what they can cut for time.  All of that.

[Nidratime]

Well, I don't know. Some of it is so out there that I would love for it to make the screen. We can all drink and take drugs and see it as a hallucinatory experience! ;-)

[GHScorpiosRule]

I suspect it will be cut out because it’s not grounded in reality-something Moore has said he wants this show to be.

[Nidratime]

Then, he'd be dishonoring the story. That *is* the story on Jamaica. It's all wackadoodle. And there's not much of it that's sane.

Edited October 5, 2017 by Nidratime

[toolazy]

11 hours ago, theschnauzers said:

Here:s a hint — why did Claire and Jamie go to Jamaica in the first place?

To find Young Ian, right? They had reason to believe that he'd been sold in Jamaica.  I'm going to guess that they cut out some of the bit with the voodoo ceremonies and the preacher's sister and the crocodile.  Or maybe they'll cut out any mention of what Geillis did with Ian and the ground-up gemstones.   Honestly, there's a lot they can cut out that I won't miss at all.  But honestly, I don't care because I can't wait for 17th century Claire with her curly hair and natural eyelashes.

3 hours ago, Nidratime said:

Then, he'd be dishonoring the story. That *is* the story on Jamaica. It's all wackadoodle. And there's not much of it that's sane.

Is it "dishonoring" the story? Or is it just reworking it into something that makes sense for a 13-episode season of television?

[Petunia846]

7 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

I suspect it will be cut out because it’s not grounded in reality-something Moore has said he wants this show to be.

Damn. I'll be sad if they cut the part in DOA (I think) when Claire gets lost in the woods and the ghost walks her shoes back to the house so Rollo can track her. That might not be grounded in reality, but it's damn good story. Gives me shivers every time.

[Nidratime]

Quote

Is it "dishonoring" the story? Or is it just reworking it into something that makes sense for a 13-episode season of television?

If they take out all the things you list in your post, they'll be pretty much not telling the story. They've left *some* parts out and reordered things in the past, but all those elements you list *is* the story on Jamaica. Jamaica's culture was strange and other worldly to a group of West Europeans. Otherwise, they might as well have never left Scotland.

[Nidratime]

This person is playing Madame Jeanne:

https://17463306921283182029.googlegroups.com/attach/5b5889ba7ff7/IMG_20171005_145822.jpg?part=0.1&view=1&vt=ANaJVrGiiRkk6UUVuEVvNDaSdWB7OQe0XFAbLtyzlP5aKC3yWSOD6rWlNcQIcojQPRHZvfybio_Zn_S4ADxbnU-kS7zcnwI0VamVITw8Y9nAtnLFZvdYZVk

[GHScorpiosRule]

11 hours ago, Nidratime said:

Then, he'd be dishonoring the story. That *is* the story on Jamaica. It's all wackadoodle. And there's not much of it that's sane.

There's all the hijinks on the seas, as once again, Claire and Jamie are separated. But I've seen scenes of them on the beach, so I'm fairly certain I'll be okay with it. Plus Cait has said this season is "more romantic" and I believe both she and Sam have said "more love/sex scenes."

As for dishonoring the story? I just go back to season one and how Claire's "Witch Trial" commenced. That it was actually another highlander who saw Claire and the Waterhorse, and it freaked him out. And hosebeast was never there in the buik.  But in the show, they just had Rupert tell the story, as a...legend and story.  Then there was the episode "Lallybroch" or was it the one right after? That wasn't in the buik at all. The Scots who took over Lallybroch? Right before Jamie was taken to Wentworth, and before "The Search."

[DittyDotDot]

7 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

As for dishonoring the story? I just go back to season one and how Claire's "Witch Trial" commenced. That it was actually another highlander who saw Claire and the Waterhorse, and it freaked him out. And hosebeast was never there in the buik.  But in the show, they just had Rupert tell the story, as a...legend and story.  Then there was the episode "Lallybroch" or was it the one right after? That wasn't in the buik at all. The Scots who took over Lallybroch? Right before Jamie was taken to Wentworth, and before "The Search."

I don't think it will dishonor the story to leave out some of the whack-a-do, but I am always a little disappointed when I hear Moore say they're avoiding some of the more fantastical aspects of the books to keep the show more grounded. IMO, the way Diana weaves in some of these fantastical bits of folklore into the story is very grounded to the time travel aspect of the story--like the water horse. I kinda miss some of the "magic" that was woven into the books, myself.

[GHScorpiosRule]

8 minutes ago, DittyDotDot said:

I don't think it will dishonor the story to leave out some of the whack-a-do, but I am always a little disappointed when I hear Moore say they're avoiding some of the more fantastical aspects of the books to keep the show more grounded. IMO, the way Diana weaves in some of these fantastical bits of folklore into the story is very grounded to the time travel aspect of the story--like the water horse. I kinda miss some of the "magic" that was woven into the books, myself.

Oh I totally agree! About being disappointed that Moore would leave out the more magickal and fantastical stuff, because it is part of the series. I was just saying we may not see it based on what he's said in the past about "reality" being on this show.

[Nidratime]

Dishonor is a weird word. I guess I mean disrespect the story or something like that.

I mean, taking one or two things out because it's too difficult to translate from page to screen or too costly is one thing, but to leave multiple parts of the story out -- which all happen in one location, basically one after the other -- begs the question, what story are you telling? Leaving out the voodoo scene or condensing it, leaving out all the activity on that island, leaving out the "situation" involving what Geillis did ... what's left? That *is* the story. Without it, you don't have the back half.

[lianau]

maybe it's just me but how grounded in reality can a story containing time travel be ?

[toolazy]

17 hours ago, Grashka said:

(starting with the Island of Convenient Meetings

That is just a warm-up for the Eastern Seaboard of Convenient Meetings that we see in the later books. 

9 hours ago, lianau said:

maybe it's just me but how grounded in reality can a story containing time travel be ?

There is the fact of time travel, but we don't really see it.  There are no woo-woo effects or anything.  Moore was pretty adamant about avoiding any of that.  All we see is a quick edit and Claire lying on the ground.  Luckily, he has made no attempt to reproduce the experience on-screen because it would wind up being incredibly lame.  

That said, the show has definitely managed to bring the atmospherics - just think of the scene in the very first episode of the women dancing at the stones.  That was weird, beautiful and creepy all at the same time.  

[WatchrTina]

19 hours ago, Grashka said:

the Island of Convenient Meetings

I support this characterization of the island and of Jamie's unexpected reunion with his naturalist friend, and with his wife who jumped overboard in a storm, and with his semi-shipwrecked crew.  But for sheer Dickensian-level implausible coincidences, nothing will ever top the deep-in-the-swamp meet-up of injured-and-feverish William and his "cousin" Ian-the-Mohawk.  That one made me scoff so hard I strained something.

Edited October 6, 2017 by WatchrTina

[lianau]

1 minute ago, WatchrTina said:

I support this characterization of the island and of Jamie's unexpected reunion with his naturalist friend, and with his wife who jumped overboard, and his semi-shipwrecked crew.  But for sheer Dickensian-level implausible coincidences nothing will ever top the deep-in-the-swamp meet-up of injured-and-feverish William & his "cousin" Ian-the-Mohawk.  That one made me scoff so hard I strained something.

convenient  yes , but I still love the scenes between those two .

[koboldin]

On 10/4/2017 at 9:59 AM, Nidratime said:

Interview with Richard Rankin:

Richard Rankin on Reprising His Role as Roger Wakefield in “Outlander,” and What the Future Holds for Him and Brianna

https://www.sony.com/en_us/richard-rankin-outlander-interview/

************

So was I, but I can see how she might need to take a break to reassess not only whether she wants to continue to follow in her "father's" footsteps studying history, but -- since it's 1968 -- I'm sure it's also a nod to the uproar at universities about the Vietnam War, Civil Rights, Women's Rights, the murders of Dr. King and Bobby Kennedy. It *was* a time when students were sometimes abandoning their studies and running off to Haight Ashbury or wherever, joining the counter culture. That being said, I always got the impression that Bree became a history major because of her father, and the love of it he shared with her, and not because she, herself, would've necessarily chosen it in his absence. Her mother is more practical and scientific minded, so I suppose Bree inherited that as well.

You know, if you think about it, Brianna really did take off time from school in the books - she stayed in Scotland through the fall of 1968, in what would have been her Junior(?) Fall semester. 

[DittyDotDot]

14 minutes ago, koboldin said:

You know, if you think about it, Brianna really did take off time from school in the books - she stayed in Scotland through the fall of 1968, in what would have been her Junior(?) Fall semester. 

I believe that's the correct timeline for the show, but in the books, I believe Brianna was almost two years younger. In the book, when Frank made his threat, Bree was still in high school and I believe only 16 or 17 years old. As I recall, she was just starting her second year in college when they went to Scotland. 

But, yes, she did take some time off to reassess and eventually changed her major to Engineering. 

[GHScorpiosRule]

32 minutes ago, koboldin said:

Richard Rankin on Reprising His Role as Roger Wakefield

I have to just laugh at that title for the article, especially the word "reprising." It makes it sound like he was originally cast as Roger, then the role was recast, and now Rankin is back to playing Roger!

[toolazy]

21 minutes ago, DittyDotDot said:

I believe that's the correct timeline for the show, but in the books, I believe Brianna was almost two years younger. In the book, when Frank made his threat, Bree was still in high school and I believe only 16 or 17 years old. As I recall, she was just starting her second year in college when they went to Scotland. 

But, yes, she did take some time off to reassess and eventually changed her major to Engineering. 

Brianna was a senior in high school when Frank died so she was either 18 or on the verge of it.  That comes up during Frank & Claire's last fight.  Two years later, they go to Scotland, so she would have probably been about to start her third year.  

To be honest, I'm not sure if her age in the show is specificially mentioned anywhere.  

[koboldin]

6 hours ago, toolazy said:

Brianna was a senior in high school when Frank died so she was either 18 or on the verge of it.  That comes up during Frank & Claire's last fight.  Two years later, they go to Scotland, so she would have probably been about to start her third year.  

To be honest, I'm not sure if her age in the show is specificially mentioned anywhere.  

She rants to Roger in 2x13 that she was born in November 1948, meaning her mother was three months pregnant when she returned to Frank. 

[toolazy]

1 hour ago, koboldin said:

She rants to Roger in 2x13 that she was born in November 1948, meaning her mother was three months pregnant when she returned to Frank. 

Then she's about the same age in the books and the show.  

[koboldin]

6 minutes ago, toolazy said:

Then she's about the same age in the books and the show.  

Yes, she'd be 17 when she graduated in 1966 from high school and 19 when she, Roger, and Claire form the Scooby squad in the summer of 1968, after Gillian goes through the stones. 

[toolazy]

1 hour ago, koboldin said:

Yes, she'd be 17 when she graduated in 1966 from high school and 19 when she, Roger, and Claire form the Scooby squad in the summer of 1968, after Gillian goes through the stones. 

I just looked it up - she was 20 years and 4 months old when she and Claire go to Inverness.  Claire says, "Bree has another eight months to go" before she will be 21 and can drink legally in Massachusetts. 

[koboldin]

1 hour ago, toolazy said:

I just looked it up - she was 20 years and 4 months old when she and Claire go to Inverness.  Claire says, "Bree has another eight months to go" before she will be 21 and can drink legally in Massachusetts. 

Are you referring to the book? Because my dates are accurate for the show - where would I find in the books?

 

show time:

- April, 1948 Claire returns, pregnant

- November, 1948 Brianna born

- Beltane or summer solstice 1968, Gillian goes through stones 

- more than a month later, Claire and Brianna return to Boston

I will admit to not tracking the book time as closely, but I am very confident in the show timeline. 

[lianau]

 I just looked it up and found something interesting about this issue . My German version has her at about 19 1/2  and we get her age because Claire states that she can't drink alcohol until she's 21 and she still has over a year to go , with Roger thinking to himself (the chapter when he finds out that Frank isn't Brianna's biological father ) that Brianna is almost 20 . My English version contains @toolazy 's  description of Brianna  having  another 8 months to go to 21. 

Why the change ? Has this something to do with the change between US and British version ?

[koboldin]

1 hour ago, lianau said:

 I just looked it up and found something interesting about this issue . My German version has her at about 19 1/2  and we get her age because Claire states that she can't drink alcohol until she's 21 and she still has over a year to go , with Roger thinking to himself (the chapter when he finds out that Frank isn't Brianna's biological father ) that Brianna is almost 20 . My English version contains @toolazy 's  description of Brianna  having  another 8 months to go to 21. 

Why the change ? Has this something to do with the change between US and British version ?

It must harken to the ever frustrating editorial hiccups. In reviewing the Outlander wiki, it says date of birth 23rd Nov, 1948. That would match the timeline of 17 at high school graduation and 19 in the summer of 1968. The wiki page notes that the show production changed her school from MIT to Harvard. 

Brianna Outlander wiki page

[morgan]

3 hours ago, lianau said:

 I just looked it up and found something interesting about this issue . My German version has her at about 19 1/2  and we get her age because Claire states that she can't drink alcohol until she's 21 and she still has over a year to go , with Roger thinking to himself (the chapter when he finds out that Frank isn't Brianna's biological father ) that Brianna is almost 20 . My English version contains @toolazy 's  description of Brianna  having  another 8 months to go to 21. 

Why the change ? Has this something to do with the change between US and British version ?

How odd! I am guessing a translation error? The timeline change between US and British version has to do with when Claire goes through the stones, not when she comes back.  She always comes back the eve of Culloden, which is an historical date so doesn’t ever change, which means Bree is always born November of 1948.

[Dejana]

If Brianna was born in November 1948, then she couldn't already be 20 and 4 months in the spring of 1968, when the present day portions of Dragonfly In Amber take place. It seems like Bree was aged down in some editions where the editors were bugged by the math not lining up.

Bree's birthday is November 23? And she grew up in Boston--her 15th must have been pretty grim!

Edited October 7, 2017 by Dejana

[Nidratime]

Since this article talks about episode 6 as well as the episode just aired, I'll like to it here. SPOILERS for book readers who don't want to know how they're approaching the next episode.

Outlander: Why Claire didn't return through the stones

http://ew.com/tv/2017/10/08/outlander-claire-stones/

[Nidratime]

Here's another article that references episode 6.

'Outlander' Team Talks Bringing That Iconic Reunion to Life

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/outlander-season-3-claire-jamie-reunion-spoilers-1046611

[koboldin]

Spoiler

Was it ever rationally explained in the books why - WHY - the Fraser/Murray/Silkie stash of coins and stones was left on such a dangerous and far away island instead of being hidden in a secure but less deadly location??? I know, it's for plot, but come on! It's just so ... ugh. 

Hidden in spoiler just in case.

[Haleth]

I'm looking forward to seeing the Black Sails set being used as a stand in for Jamaica.  <claps excitedly>

[BryroseA]

As excited as I am for the upcoming reunion scenes I am, like, anti-excited for the introduction of Mr. Willoughby, which must follow shortly after. I really hated that part of Voyager (well, I didn't like a lot of the second half of Voyager, but the writing of Willoughby in particular.) I'm holding out hopes that the show will handle the character better, but I'm still really nervous. 

[koboldin]

5 hours ago, BryroseA said:

As excited as I am for the upcoming reunion scenes I am, like, anti-excited for the introduction of Mr. Willoughby, which must follow shortly after. I really hated that part of Voyager (well, I didn't like a lot of the second half of Voyager, but the writing of Willoughby in particular.) I'm holding out hopes that the show will handle the character better, but I'm still really nervous. 

Word. I have little love for the convoluted shenanigans in this part of the book, partly due to the terrible stereotype of this character and partly due to the sheer unnecessary pile on of circumstance that pushes the story into the Western Hemisphere. 

[Nidratime]

Going to link this interview with Toni Graphia here because she references events later in the season.

“Outlander” Executive Producer Toni Graphia On Writing Back-to-Back Episodes for Season 3

 

https://www.sony.com/en_us/toni-graphia-outlander-interview/

[Nidratime]

Don't think I've seen this article posted yet:

All The Way Home: A Look At The Role Of Sex In Outlander 03x06 “A. Malcolm”

https://popwrapped.com/all-the-way-home-a-look-at-the-role-of-sex-in-outlander-03x06-a-malcolm-

[AD55]

On 10/14/2017 at 10:02 PM, Nidratime said:

Going to link this interview with Toni Graphia here because she references events later in the season.

“Outlander” Executive Producer Toni Graphia On Writing Back-to-Back Episodes for Season 3

 

https://www.sony.com/en_us/toni-graphia-outlander-interview/

Two things especially jumped out at me.
 

Spoiler

 

1. "In the coming season, Roger's life will be upended because of his love of this girl and that's been interesting for us to explore. He's going to go through some huge, unbelievable challenges which will test everything about him as a person." -- I'll say (my emphasis). I guess there's no way of avoiding one of my least favorite parts of the entire series.

2. I think it's interesting that Graphia herself chose "Hard Rain." I had thought that was probably Bear McCreary. I'm among those who was really pleased with that choice, including using a cover with both a man and a woman singing.

 

[Nidratime]

Is this another new photo?

[toolazy]

3 hours ago, Nidratime said:

Is this another new photo?

That's a promo photo, not a production still, I'm pretty sure.  You can tell by her outfit.  Also her hair.

Edited October 18, 2017 by toolazy