S04.E11: We're All Crazy Sometimes

[helenamonster]

Quote

After bringing in an incredibly unique and complicated spinal surgery, Dr. Aaron Glassman challenges the residents for an opportunity to join him in the operating room. Meanwhile, Shaun and Morgan disagree on how to treat a comatose patient with a cancerous tumor.

Original airdate: 3/8/21

[Annber03]

Yeeeeeeeah, seems a lot of us predicted that ending was coming. Hm. Curious to see how they'll deal with that.

I am glad that Shaun did make the right decision regarding that guy, though. Certainly don't need that whole hassle on top of everything else going on with them right now. 

The story with the couple was very emotional. I'm glad they got a chance to say a proper goodbye, at least. And Jeffrey reaching out to hug Glassman at the end was touching, too. 

Nice to see Claire playing guitar and singing again :). And Morgan and Park inch ever closer to something happening between them. It's only a matter of time, isn't it? 

[thuganomics85]

I like to imagine Elizabeth Mitchell's casting came from her just wanting a gig where she can lie in bed for all of it and even pretend to be asleep for half.  Best payday ever!  In all seriousness, she did great work with what she was given; as did Michael B. Silver (another one of those actors I've seen in tons of stuff) as her husband; and I like that their story played out in a bittersweet way, where she couldn't be saved, but they at least got a second chance to say their final good-byes.  It was also a good use of Reznick here and it was fun seeing her and Shaun paired off again.

Kind of surprised that Glassman's case ended well, because I was worried that it was going to blow up in his/their face.  I'm glad it worked out, but I think Andrews wasn't wrong that Glassman had personal reasons for wanting to take on a case that was that unpredictable and dangerous.  Curious to see what is in store for him.

Hey, after I said last episode that Asher seem to be falling behind the other newbies, he actually gets to shine big time here!  Good for him!  And his reaction to finally eating a cheeseburger was great.

As much as I love Claire, even I was thinking "That was obvious" when she easily got picked to be one of Glassman's surgeons for the case, because they usually have her a step ahead of everyone else.  Then again, knowing this show, that could very well mean that some bad shit is heading her way very soon.  As for Park, I guess it is in character that he would perform what was expected of him the right way, but played it too safe and be overshadowed by the likes of Asher, who was willing to take that risk.  Park needs to learn that sometimes you've got to step out of your comfort zone!

The seeds for a potential Reznick/Park romance continues to grow and... I'm surprisingly kind of warming up to it?

So, yeah, that ending.  Can't say I'm really happy about that.  Shaun and Lea being parents and Shaun learning to be a father aren't exact on the top of my lists for things I really want to see here.

Another two weeks until the next episode?  I guess they're just trying to stretch this out due to the shorten season.

[KaveDweller]

I figured the coma woman was going to wake up when I recognized Elizabeth Mitchell. That was a really sad story, but at least the husband got to say goodbye. I don't know how accurate that story was, but the brain seems like such a weird thing. A ruptured tumor can reawaken it after 10 years of no activity? And how creepy to wake up in the middle of surgery when you don't even remember going into surgery.

Did that young man with the back issue not have parents or family? Someone has been supporting him all these years, seems weird they were not there. I was glad the surgery worked after Glassman kind of pressured him into it. I am wondering where they are going with Glassman, since I think Andrews had a point, and I am not convinced Glassman felt satisfied at the end.

This show really doesn't need a baby.

[Annber03]

23 minutes ago, thuganomics85 said:

Kind of surprised that Glassman's case ended well, because I was worried that it was going to blow up in his/their face.  I'm glad it worked out, but I think Andrews wasn't wrong that Glassman had personal reasons for wanting to take on a case that was that unpredictable and dangerous.  Curious to see what is in store for him.

I was seriously expecting both cases to end tragically. At one point I was like, "They've had a lot of good luck with patients lately, at least one of these stories is definitely not going to end well tonight." 

And agreed that Andrews did have a valid point about Glassman. The bit about him marrying Debbie was a bit of a personal jab, but even then....it did tie into his bigger point. Especially when you consider some of the tension Glassman and Debbie have been going through lately. That's not to say Glassman doesn't love her, but it is a sign that maybe they rushed in a little too soon. 

[preeya]

58 minutes ago, KaveDweller said:

This show really doesn't need a baby.

↑THIS 1000X

[rmontro]

I've got to be honest, I've never been a big fan of the Dr. Glassman character.  But if you don't like him after this episode, there's something wrong.

When Shaun said to Lea "You've been a bit... crazy", I thought he was going to call her a bitch lol.

1 hour ago, KaveDweller said:

I figured the coma woman was going to wake up when I recognized Elizabeth Mitchell.

I spent the whole episode trying to figure out where I had seen her before, so I looked her up after watching it.  She's been in several things I've seen (and several I haven't).  But I really recognized for playing Linda McCartney in The Linda McCartney Story.

[Power-Aspie]

2 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

So, yeah, that ending.  Can't say I'm really happy about that.  Shaun and Lea being parents and Shaun learning to be a father aren't exact on the top of my lists for things I really want to see here.

 

57 minutes ago, preeya said:

THIS 1000X

Oh yeah! Of course, in a show dedicated to representing and normalizing autism, the audience can’t be bothered with the autistic lead having a private life or God forbit, having a child.

If you have a problem with that, you probably have been watching the wrong show from the beginning. I'm so sick of this ableism.

[bros402]

2 hours ago, KaveDweller said:

Did that young man with the back issue not have parents or family? Someone has been supporting him all these years, seems weird they were not there. I was glad the surgery worked after Glassman kind of pressured him into it. I am wondering where they are going with Glassman, since I think Andrews had a point, and I am not convinced Glassman felt satisfied at the end.

He said he was in a long term care facility, so I am guessing he is on California Medicaid and they are paying for his long term care facility

11 minutes ago, Power-Aspie said:

Oh yeah! Of course, in a show dedicated to representing and normalizing autism, the audience can’t be bothered with the autistic lead having a private life or God forbit, having a child.

If you have a problem with that, you probably have been watching the wrong show from the beginning. I'm so sick of this ableism.

I have autism. Shaun doesn't seem like he is ready to have a kid at this point - he doesn't have much of a support system built up - his support system is pretty much Dr. Glassman, Lea (when she isn't the source of an issue), or him hefting his issues upon coworkers. However, the coworkers might be happier to help with an adorable baby - and that could lead him to see a therapist or pursue social skills therapy.

However, he also isn't at the point in his career where he can afford to have a child - the salary of a 3rd year resident (at San Diego Medical School) is almost $64,000 - https://medschool.ucsd.edu/som/surgery/education/residency/general-surgery/Pages/salary.aspx

The average total debt for med school grads is around 250k.

Lea is probably earning a bit more, but probably just enough to support them with California prices. It looks like the average salary for a health care information technology specialist is $96,000 in California - https://www.salary.com/research/salary/posting/health-care-information-technology-salary/ca

So they two of them are earning ~$160,000 if they are lucky.

The MIT Living Wage calculator pegs the cost of living for two adults with one child at almost $111,000 in San Diego - https://livingwage.mit.edu/metros/41940 - and that doesn't even factor in student loans. If they had planned for the pregnancy, it probably would've been better for Shaun and Lea to wait until Shaun wasn't a resident.

[possibilities]

I'm more worried about Leah being a responsible parent than Shaun. You know Shaun will learn every single thing about parenting, and he will want to do better than his horrible parents, so he does understand about things that Leah has never even come close to experiencing. But I tend to hate it when shows add babies, I can't think of a single time it didn't turn out to be annoying, so it's hard to root for it to happen here. I think Leah is too flaky to be a parent. On another show, which didn't revolve around Shaun being a surgeon, I'd want him to be a stay at home parent while Leah goes to a job to bring home a paycheck and get her away from the kid who she's too flaky to attend to anyway.

[rmontro]

38 minutes ago, Power-Aspie said:

Oh yeah! Of course, in a show dedicated to representing and normalizing autism, the audience can’t be bothered with the autistic lead having a private life or God forbit, having a child.

It's got nothing to do with autism, it's this:  How many shows do you know that got better by having a baby?  This is a medical show, a baby is just a distraction.

[Power-Aspie]

In real life, Lea got pregnant at the worst moment possible:

• Shaun hasn’t secured a post-residency position yet; he even isn’t the frontrunner in that race but Claire.
• Shaun even lacks the ambition to actively participate in that race.
• Lea’s career is on the raise.
• How the young and unprepared couple could take care of a baby is open to questions.
• How will the couple achieve work-life balance with Shaun working long shifts while Lea holds a 9-5 office job?
• Shaun’s ASD is bound to complicate the situation further.

From the perspective of storytelling, this is just the right moment for Lea to be pregnant. It will provide new challenges with high stakes to the couple, and it might provide Shaun with a cause to fight for his job at St. Bonaventure in the last year of his residency.

Finally, parenthood with ASD has not been covered a lot. Even science only recently has begun to investigate it.

The show can boldly go where few have gone before: normalizing the idea that autistic individuals can be parents.

[Annber03]

1 hour ago, bros402 said:

Shaun doesn't seem like he is ready to have a kid at this point - he doesn't have much of a support system built up - his support system is pretty much Dr. Glassman, Lea (when she isn't the source of an issue), or him hefting his issues upon coworkers. However, the coworkers might be happier to help with an adorable baby - and that could lead him to see a therapist or pursue social skills therapy.

This is where I'm at on this issue, too. I believe Shaun and Lea would make great parents-yeah, Lea's had her flighty moments, but she has also had moments of being responsible and serious when needed, too, and I think she would buckle down and handle the responsibility well. And Shaun, we know he's longed for a family of his own, and I would love to see him get that. He's great with kids and I think he'd be a wonderful, caring father :).

But yeah, with these two, I've just always felt there's still stuff they haven't fully addressed or dealt with, and I can see where a baby, at this stage, would further complicate some of those issues. Having said that, however, there's plenty of other people who've become parents rather unexpectedly and made it work, so I think these two could do the same. And I like your suggestion about help and added support. Indeed, that's always good for any parent to have, and I imagine Shaun and Lea would welcome it. 

I also like @Power-Aspie's post about normalizing autistic parents and exploring the new challenges a baby would bring. If they do go that route, I hope we do get some good stories surrounding that topic out of this :). 

[Power-Aspie]

1 hour ago, rmontro said:

This is a medical show, a baby is just a distraction.

All medical dramas I have ever seen dove into the private lives of the main protagonist. There’s office politics, workplace sex, there's relationship drama.

This whole talk about The Good Doctor veering away from its path when the autistic lead character’s private life is touched is nothing more than a poor evasive defense to hide the ableism and prejudice against people with ASD.

Edited March 9, 2021 by Power-Aspie

[Starchild]

Anyone else wondering why Shaun wasn't asked to participate in Glassman's surgery? Doctors do work on more than one case at a time, after all. I get it from a show perspective (A and B storylines), but in-show it doesn't make sense.

[statsgirl]

The only person on this show in a stable enough relationship to become a parent is Andrews. Even Glassman's is too much of a mess.

Generally TV dramas give a couple a baby when they've run out of ideas for what else to do with them. Anyone want to bet that there will be a medical emergency with the fetus?

[PinkRibbons]

If everyone waited until it was the right time to have babies, the human race would die out. Also, babies aren't nearly as expensive as they seem - there's an entire industry trying to sell us on a high-end baby lifestyle when really you can get by on hand-me-downs, coupons and a lot of love and attention. My parents had my sister about fifteen minutes after they arrived in the US and they did fine. My mother breastfed (which at the time was shocking) and since she was born in July in California, she didn't wear much more than a diaper for the first three months. Said sister is now a highly paid medical professional, as is her husband, and they both have massive debt. Doesn't stop them from giving their young children a wonderful life. The most expensive part is daycare while both parents work, but it's attached to the hospital they work for.

3 minutes ago, Starchild said:

Anyone else wondering why Shaun wasn't asked to participate in Glassman's surgery? Doctors do work on more than one case at a time, after all. I get it from a show perspective (A and B storylines), but in-show it doesn't make sense.

Yes, every second of the storyline. Not only was I surprised by Shaun not being in the running, I was honestly kind of horrified that they didn't have him in the room just in case during surgery. The man has an uncanny understanding of body structure and the patient was practically a jigsaw puzzle.

[tennisgurl]

I really should have seen this one coming, the show is really going hard in Shaun and Lea going through various things couples go through, and an unexpected pregnancy is a classic for a show that wants to shake up a shows dynamic. I rolled my eyes at the reveal at first, but thinking about it more I think that it could be interesting. Babies often just seem to be added to shows to add some random drama when the writers are bored and cant think of any others ways to keep the show fresh, or if an actress is pregnant, but sometimes it works as a natural development for the characters and story. Since so much of the show is about Shaun living with autism and how that affects his life, him becoming a parent could be an interesting idea. I would prefer if it happened later, after exploring more of his relationship with Lea more and they were actually planning on a baby, but I like the idea of Shaun being a father. He would be a great father, you know he would read every parenting book in the world and we have seen that he is good with kids and likes them, and it could lead to him more exploring his feelings about his own horrible father and useless mother and his parental figure Glassman and how all of them and his experiences would affect his parenting. Plus, I don't think we have seen a lot of depictions of autistic people being parents in the media, so that would be really nice to see explored. 

I do hope that the show does still stay a medical show first and foremost though, and that the show doesn't totally turn into a show about Shaun being a parent. I think they can strike a balance between the family and the medical cases, but it could be a challenge. 

Both cases were really good, I always like Elizabeth Mitchell and I knew that they wouldn't have hired her just to play a comatose person so obviously she was waking up, but I thought that she might stay alive. The story with her and her husband was very bittersweet, she still ended up dying after getting her husbands hopes up, but they were allowed to speak again one more time and she got to tell him to live his life so maybe he can finally move on. I was worried that we would get two sad endings after so many wins lately and that the kid with the spinal issues would die after Glassman talked him into going through with the surgery, so I was released when he made it, and him asking Glassman to be his first hug was a really sweet ending. 

Glad to see Claire singing again, and bonding with Asher. We have focused more on the other newbies a bit lately so it was good seeing Asher get a win and some nice character stuff. In general we had a lot of good interaction between characters, with Morgan and Shaun working together, Andrews and Glassman, and we continue to move forward with Morgan/Park which...well we'll see how it plays out. 

[greekmom]

9 hours ago, rmontro said:

It's got nothing to do with autism, it's this:  How many shows do you know that got better by having a baby?  This is a medical show, a baby is just a distraction.

Agreed. I was just going to post the same thought. I would love for them to dive into so many issues that ASD people need to deal with on a daily bases, but having a kid. Way to kill a show.

[Power-Aspie]

25 minutes ago, greekmom said:

I would love for them to dive into so many issues that ASD people need to deal with on a daily bases, but having a kid. Way to kill a show.

The show has been diving into these thinkgs my people have to deal with on a daily basis for three and a half years now - it is the basic premise of "The Good Doctor". But a baby is a taboo now for you?

Why? Uncomfortable with the idea of autistic folks being parents?

[statsgirl]

I am uncomfortable with a couple whose relationship is as shaky as Shaun and Lea's having a baby.

They have been together for less than a year and are still learning how to navigate the basics with each other. But mostly I hate couples on TV shows having babies because the show doesn't know what else to do with them and I feel that this is the case here. It's not like either have been yearning for a child for years as Melendez was.

[Granny58]

11 hours ago, Power-Aspie said:

All medical dramas I have ever seen dove into the private lives of the main protagonist. There’s office politics, workplace sex, there's relationship drama.

This whole talk about The Good Doctor veering away from its path when the autistic lead character’s private life is touched is nothing more than a poor evasive defense to hide the ableism and prejudice against people with ASD.

or, babies are just a bore on medical dramas.  

3 hours ago, PinkRibbons said:

If everyone waited until it was the right time to have babies, the human race would die out. Also, babies aren't nearly as expensive as they seem - there's an entire industry trying to sell us on a high-end baby lifestyle when really you can get by on hand-me-downs, coupons and a lot of love and attention. My parents had my sister about fifteen minutes after they arrived in the US and they did fine. My mother breastfed (which at the time was shocking) and since she was born in July in California, she didn't wear much more than a diaper for the first three months. Said sister is now a highly paid medical professional, as is her husband, and they both have massive debt. Doesn't stop them from giving their young children a wonderful life. The most expensive part is daycare while both parents work, but it's attached to the hospital they work for.

you are 100% correct.   My parents were poor and yet here we are, 60+ years later.  

[Granny58]

3 hours ago, Starchild said:

Anyone else wondering why Shaun wasn't asked to participate in Glassman's surgery? Doctors do work on more than one case at a time, after all. I get it from a show perspective (A and B storylines), but in-show it doesn't make sense.

I have no official answer, but I have a kernel of an idea.  I do transcription of operative reports and I notice that there are blocks of time when residents seem to be "assigned" to attendings as they will spend the entire day or days with the one attending.  So if that is a thing, then maybe that's all this way (if the writers were even thinking along those lines as opposed to just involving more characters).  

[hula-la]

When my cousin got pregnant, our family's first thought was "shoot, now we're stuck with him", him being her partner. That was my first thought when Lea announced she was pregnant, that we're now stuck with her. I look forward to seeing Shaun as a father, just not with her.

[rmontro]

3 hours ago, Power-Aspie said:

Why? Uncomfortable with the idea of autistic folks being parents?

Again, it's nothing to do with autism.  I would be just as unexcited about Park and Morgan having a kid.  I just don't think babies generally add much of anything to a show.  It's not like the babies are going to be getting Emmys or acting out impressive dramatic scenes.  It's just going to be a cause of wondering who's watching the kid while Shaun and Lea are at work, or scamming tow truck drivers.

Don't get me wrong, it's not going to ruin the show for me, I'm just not impressed.

[preeya]

14 hours ago, Power-Aspie said:

 

Oh yeah! Of course, in a show dedicated to representing and normalizing autism, the audience can’t be bothered with the autistic lead having a private life or God forbit, having a child.

If you have a problem with that, you probably have been watching the wrong show from the beginning. I'm so sick of this ableism.

My comment has nothing to do with autism. I absolutely hate drama shows where they introduce babies into the mix. You can bet the whole pregnancy/delivery/post-delivery will have nauseating plot-lines that have been done ad infinitem on other shows and will have nothing to do with autism.

Just my opinion.

[Fable]

I’m on the fence with the upcoming pregnancy storyline.  I agree that it could be interesting to see how Shaun navigates parenthood.  However, I think Shaun and Lea still have a lot to learn about each other, which doesn’t mean they can’t be good parents, but I personally never find that babies add anything interesting to most shows.  I guess we will see. 

I don’t like the idea that one partner should get behind another when they don’t fundamentally agree.  I think Shaun handled that fairly well though.  I’m glad he didn’t forfeit his values entirely for her. 

[chitowngirl]

19 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Another two weeks until the next episode?  I guess they're just trying to stretch this out due to the shorten season.

Bachelor finale next week

[rmontro]

I wonder is Shaun and Lea are going to get married now?

[greekmom]

7 hours ago, Power-Aspie said:

The show has been diving into these thinkgs my people have to deal with on a daily basis for three and a half years now - it is the basic premise of "The Good Doctor". But a baby is a taboo now for you?

Why? Uncomfortable with the idea of autistic folks being parents?

My son is ASD. Why are assuming shit?? You know what they say about assume - makes an ass of you before me.

Plus as everyone knows babies just get left off camera anyways most of the time. Mom and dad are at work. Where is the baby? Oh no one knows. 

[KaveDweller]

16 hours ago, Power-Aspie said:

All medical dramas I have ever seen dove into the private lives of the main protagonist. There’s office politics, workplace sex, there's relationship drama.

This whole talk about The Good Doctor veering away from its path when the autistic lead character’s private life is touched is nothing more than a poor evasive defense to hide the ableism and prejudice against people with ASD.

I don't think it's fair to say not wanting to see a baby storyline is prejudice against ASD. I think you'd see the same reaction if any female character was pregnant. If anything, it is prejudice against babies.

I like seeing Shaun's private life and I think Shaun would be a good father. I just don't think the show will do a baby storyline well. Shaun's ASD is an interesting aspect of the show, but its strength is the medical part.

To your point about other medical shows, on The Resident, a character is pregnant and when it was announced everyone was talking about how they hope the writers don't let the baby ruin the show. I remember on Grey's Anatomy when Jo and Alex got married, there were tons of posts about how they hoped they didn't make Jo get pregnant. Babies are unpopular as a plot device because they either take over the show or they get shipped offscreen and you constantly wonder who is taking care of it.

[rmontro]

1 hour ago, KaveDweller said:

I like seeing Shaun's private life and I think Shaun would be a good father. I just don't think the show will do a baby storyline well. Shaun's ASD is an interesting aspect of the show, but its strength is the medical part.

Yeah, I mean I'm pretty sure we all like Shaun as a character, and enjoy seeing his private life.  From what I've read here, Lea is not quite so popular, but her character is much improved since her early days on the show.

[bros402]

22 hours ago, Power-Aspie said:

In real life, Lea got pregnant at the worst moment possible:

• Shaun hasn’t secured a post-residency position yet; he even isn’t the frontrunner in that race but Claire.
• Shaun even lacks the ambition to actively participate in that race.
• Lea’s career is on the raise.
• How the young and unprepared couple could take care of a baby is open to questions.
• How will the couple achieve work-life balance with Shaun working long shifts while Lea holds a 9-5 office job?
• Shaun’s ASD is bound to complicate the situation further.

From the perspective of storytelling, this is just the right moment for Lea to be pregnant. It will provide new challenges with high stakes to the couple, and it might provide Shaun with a cause to fight for his job at St. Bonaventure in the last year of his residency.

Finally, parenthood with ASD has not been covered a lot. Even science only recently has begun to investigate it.

The show can boldly go where few have gone before: normalizing the idea that autistic individuals can be parents.

I don't think this show is the best one to cover something like this - this show tends to not portray autism well at all. Adding a baby just feels weird - it's what shows do to make some drama. It'd be weird if anyone was having a baby - Lim, Claire, Glassman, Park, Park's kid - especially since even though this is taking place after the pandemic - they are filming during one, so if the pregnancy ends up making it to term, we are gonna see a lot of dolls.

I'm guessing the writers couldn't think of anything big (even though it is the midpoint of Shaun/Claire/Resnick/Park's residencies) for drama, so they went, "Uhhhh, how about a baby?"

I just hope they get some actual people with autism to consult on this, otherwise it is going to not go well, like a lot of their other autism related plot points.
 

13 hours ago, Starchild said:

Anyone else wondering why Shaun wasn't asked to participate in Glassman's surgery? Doctors do work on more than one case at a time, after all. I get it from a show perspective (A and B storylines), but in-show it doesn't make sense.

I guess it was so Glassman could have his pectus excavatum moment? But yeah, Shaun would've been the best choice to be in there. That's one thing he is excellent at.

Also, did Shaun's question distract Lim so she cut the tumor?

[rmontro]

22 minutes ago, bros402 said:

even though this is taking place after the pandemic - they are filming during one, so if the pregnancy ends up making it to term, we are gonna see a lot of dolls.

Good point.

I guess Shaun and Lea were having too much sex for their own good  🙂

[Power-Aspie]

7 hours ago, bros402 said:

I just hope they get some actual people with autism to consult on this, otherwise it is going to not go well, like a lot of their other autism related plot points.

Mark Rozeman, one show's writers, has ASD himself. He's credited for Quarantine Part Two, Trampoline, Fractured, Fault, and the upcoming Teeny Blue Eyes. He was involved as staff writer in many other scripts as far as I remember the end credits.

So, I may suggest that the problem is not the depiction of autism in the show, but your individual perception of ASD.

Edited March 10, 2021 by Power-Aspie

[cinsays]

18 hours ago, statsgirl said:

I am uncomfortable with a couple whose relationship is as shaky as Shaun and Lea's having a baby.

They have been together for less than a year and are still learning how to navigate the basics with each other. But mostly I hate couples on TV shows having babies because the show doesn't know what else to do with them and I feel that this is the case here. It's not like either have been yearning for a child for years as Melendez was.

I am surprised that Sean would not have been wanting to use birth control until they are more settled.

[Power-Aspie]

29 minutes ago, cinsays said:

I am surprised that Sean would not have been wanting to use birth control until they are more settled.

They sure do use birth control. It was established as early as in 3.15 Unsaid:

Quote

CARLY: Those two are getting pregnant tonight.
SHAUN: Yeah. They should get a room. So they can make out in private.
CARLY: Oh, my God. It's Lea.
SHAUN: She's not getting pregnant. She definitely uses protection. Every time one of her boyfriends would come over, she... She would...
CALRY: That's okay. I don't need the details. [...]

But Lea also has been portrayed to be forgetful about things: her very first scene in 4.01 Frontline Part One has her searching for her ID badge in Shaun's apartment. She also said that about herself in 2.06 Two-Ply (or not Two-Ply): "I know I forget stuff a lot."

Finally, it was aluded almost every episode this season that the couple has a healthy sex life and the Pearl Index isn't about jewelry.

This story arc has been in the making since 3.10 Friends and Family, when Glassman talked with Lea about her becoming a parent one day in that motel room in Wyoming. That was the episode that set the wheels into motion for Shaun and Lea becoming a romantic couple.

Edited March 10, 2021 by Power-Aspie

[Power-Aspie]

15 hours ago, bros402 said:

I'm guessing the writers couldn't think of anything big (even though it is the midpoint of Shaun/Claire/Resnick/Park's residencies) for drama, so they went, "Uhhhh, how about a baby?"

The pregnancy story arc has left a long trail of foreshadowing:

• 3.10 Friends and Family: Glassman talks with Lea about parenthood and asks her about her plans.
• 3.11 Fractured: Glassman asks Shaun if he used protection while sleeping with Lea the night before (without having sex).
• 3.15 Unsaid: Shaun tells Carly that Lea is not getting pregnant because she always uses protection.
• 4.01 Frontline Part 1: expectant single mother without support system. Lea forgot her ID bage at Shaun's apartment.
• 4.02 Frontline Part 2: same single mother gives birth; Park delivers and nurses the baby, his conversations with Kellan setting the topics of work-life balance and expectant parents being insecure.
• 4.04 Not the same: expectant single mother, pregnant with twins while her own body tries to kill one fetus, her boyfriend left her after suggesting an abortion; woman had already an abortion with 15; the doctors discuss to abort one fetus to save the other; Shaun finally delivers one baby early. Jordan reveals that she chose career over motherhood.
• 4.06 Lim: woman surprised by unplanned pregnancy, chooses elective abortion; Jordan reveals that she had an abortion herself; empath Rose, an old lady, gets morning sickness because her nurse is pregnant.
• 4.08 Parenting: a father has stepped down from parenthood and plays “coach” instead; Glassman claims that Shaun and Lea’s relationship is moving too fast; the episode title with an A-plot about Lea's parents claiming that she doesn't think ahead.
• 4.09 Irresponsible…: a couple is surprised by an unplanned pregnancy, originally planning on termination but keeping it.

Can't really say you haven't been warned, folks...

Edited March 10, 2021 by Power-Aspie

[Starchild]

I don't think I would consider every single episode dealing with a child or pregnancy to be foreshadowing events in the characters' lives. It's a medical show and children/pregnancies are bound to figure in some of the cases presented for drama. Only the ones that seem to have a reflective impact on the characters, especially a lasting one, could probably be considered foreshadowing.

[statsgirl]

Shaun demands order and precision to an almost extreme degree in many parts of his life. He knows that Lea can be very haphazard about things. It feels like a writing manipulation that he would leave birth control to her.

[PinkRibbons]

There is no such thing as fool-proof birth control. It's entirely possible that Shaun and Lea took all precautions and got pregnant anyway.

Also, to clear up a misconception I run into almost every time a TV character gets pregnant: you cannot assume every woman is on hormonal birth control. It's medication like any other, it can have side effects or be a bad pairing with a pre-existing condition like hypertension. A friend of mine tried every single hormonal birth control on the market and had a different bad side effect with each one until her gynecologist told her that she'd be just as well served using condoms and spermicide.

Lea didn't have to forget anything, Shaun didn't have to be careless. If you have sex, you risk conception even if you do everything right.

[Power-Aspie]

6 hours ago, Starchild said:

I don't think I would consider every single episode dealing with a child or pregnancy to be foreshadowing events in the characters' lives. It's a medical show and children/pregnancies are bound to figure in some of the cases presented for drama.

You're right. But when you compare the numbers of cases with seasons 1 to 3 (18-20 episodes each), you'll notice a significant rise in pregnancies and abortions in the first 10 episodes of season 4 alone.

 

Edited March 10, 2021 by Power-Aspie
correction

[greekmom]

Things I rather see than a pregnancy storyline (from any of the characters):

Park/Reznick relationship

Claire Brown finally finding someone

Lim mentoring one of the newbies.

Some more storylines on the backgrounds of the newbies. Especially Dr. Asher

 

[Starchild]

8 hours ago, Power-Aspie said:

You're right. But when you compare the numbers of cases with seasons 1 to 3 (18-20 episodes each), you'll notice a significant rise in pregnancies and abortions in the first 10 episodes of season 4 alone.

 

Interesting. Now I don't recall details of most of these episodes. Do you recall which of these demonstrated an emotional impact (on Shaun and/or Lea specifically) outside of dealing directly with the patients i.e. something they "took home" with them?

[possibilities]

I guess we're assuming they will go through with becoming parents, and Leah won't have an abortion, but honestly I think from a character point of view, an abortion is the more realistic choice for Leah.

But I will concede that it would be nice to see a show take on and debunk the "autistic people can't be good parents" nonsense. I am skeptical about this show doing a good job of that, but we'll know soon enough.

Edited March 11, 2021 by possibilities

[KaveDweller]

2 hours ago, possibilities said:

I guess we're assuming they will go through with becoming parents, and Leah won't have an abortion, but honestly I think from a character point of view, an abortion is the more realistic choice for Leah.

I don't think it is definite they will go through with becoming parents. The preview made it look like she was considering abortion. Didn't she even refer to a choice? I know lots of shows avoid main characters having abortions, but they could also have her miscarry. It is just as much drama.

I give it 50/50 odds at this point.

[CarpeFelis]

I don’t even care about the whole baby issue. The thing about this episode that bugged me was Elizabeth Mitchell’s character’s condition. She had been found to be braindead and required life support, and yet this dopamine surge “kickstarts” her brain to full consciousness?! Wouldn’t a ruptured aneurysm resulting in a flatline EEG indicate enough structural damage to the brain that this would simply not be possible? This just made no sense to me whatsoever. (I’m not a doctor, but as an engineer I really want to know just how the hell this was supposed to work!)

[izabella]

Would she even be able to lift her head?  I'd imagine all her muscle would be completely gone after 10 years of nothing.

[Power-Aspie]

6 hours ago, Starchild said:

Do you recall which of these demonstrated an emotional impact (on Shaun and/or Lea specifically) outside of dealing directly with the patients i.e. something they "took home" with them?

This isn’t how foreshadowing on The Good Doctor works. Events are usually foreshadowed by rather insignificant or disjoined details. For example, Morgan’s rheumatoid arthritis was foreshadowed by her struggling to open a jar of pickles in 3.01 Disaster. And the earthquake was foreshadowed by Morgan discovering an earthquake kit in Claire’s trunk alongside her mother’s ashes in 3.04 Take My Hand.

What is remarkable about season 4 is the mere number of mentions and cases involving pregnancies and abortions, as well as work-life balance as an often-recurring theme with many characters and conversations.

The overarching theme for all characters in this season is obviously to cater more to their private lives than before and avoid being consumed by their demanding work.

[bros402]

21 hours ago, Power-Aspie said:

Mark Rozeman, one show's writers, has ASD himself. He's credited for Quarantine Part Two, Trampoline, Fractured, Fault, and the upcoming Teeny Blue Eyes. He was involved as staff writer in many other scripts as far as I remember the end credits.

So, I may suggest that the problem is not the depiction of autism in the show, but your individual perception of ASD.

Was Fault the one where Reznick and Park moved in together?

That episode wasn't too bad on the autism front - but there have been some episodes that are just bad at portraying autism. I guess that explains why that episode was better than some. Just remember, just because there's someone with autism in the writers room, that doesn't mean they'll make it realistic, they'll do whatever they want for drama.

It's best when the actor with the disability in question plays a character with that disability, i.e. Kayla Cromer on Everything's Gonna Be Okay and Micah Fowler on Speechless with their excellent portrayals of autism and cerebral palsy, respectively. Too bad we couldn't have that with this show. At least Freddie Highmore is a decent actor and isn't doing a horrendous portrayal of autism like Sia's movie Music.

15 hours ago, statsgirl said:

Shaun demands order and precision to an almost extreme degree in many parts of his life. He knows that Lea can be very haphazard about things. It feels like a writing manipulation that he would leave birth control to her.

Maybe they're the ~3% where condoms aren't effective - but you think Shaun would've freaked out about that, but that would've been more of a plot point for a "oh, Lea's not pregnant" episode leading into a "oh lets get pregnant!" arc