paulvdb August 21, 2020 Share August 21, 2020 Quote Lucifer toys with a murder victim while Chloe and Maze investigate the death. Meanwhile, Amenadiel cleans up the club, and Linda mothers a genius. Link to comment
Peace 47 August 21, 2020 Share August 21, 2020 (edited) I posted on another message board some speculation last year that Mr. Said Out Bitch’s murder would be the connective tissue for the first episode of this season to link Lucifer in hell with goings on topside, and it was such a delight to have predicted something correctly about a show. (Showrunners doing something logical doesn’t make it boring: it’s nice when they follow a through-line.) Also delightful to see “Lee” back where he belongs in the first episode of the season, although kind of sorry he died. They really left his hell loop situation hanging. I was really feeling the Chloe/ Maze dynamic at the start (what a great team that they finished each other’s sandwiches ... I mean sentences!), and thought that was a great angle that they would go a little codependent on each other in their time of need. In another universe where the show wasn’t built around Deckerstar, I would have shipped them together, too. Unfortunately, then, it really left a bad taste in my mouth that Chloe said she wanted to step back from her partnership with Maze when the case gave her the realization of the week (TM). Granted, Chloe has to work through a lot of stuff, but leaving Maze out in cold when she is suffering over the loss of Eve is not where it’s at, girl. And it feels seriously in danger of retread that Maze gets shat upon yet again and lashes out in unproductive ways. It seems like Chloe, Lucifer, Dan and Eve have all at one time or another used her and failed to put Maze first when she needed it. Michael was whistling the “crime solving devil” song from season 2 when he came in. Don’t know how he knew that. ETA: At the gambling table in the hell loop, during the first shot when the camera lingered on the one woman in the foreground, the thought that came to my mind immediately was, “That’s Ildy Modrovich (the showrunner).” I’ve never seen her before, to my knowledge, so I don’t know what possessed me to think that, but I’m pretty sure that was her, after checking out a pic. Edited August 21, 2020 by Peace 47 4 Link to comment
Helena Dax August 21, 2020 Share August 21, 2020 Omg, so the Lucifer who was with Chloe wasn't Lucifer? Didn't see that coming! The bit about Hell being built on people's guilt still sounds wrong to me, but I guess we have to assume it makes sense. Link to comment
roamyn August 21, 2020 Share August 21, 2020 4 hours ago, Peace 47 said: I posted on another message board some speculation last year that Mr. Said Out Bitch’s murder would be the connective tissue for the first episode of this season to link Lucifer in hell with goings on topside, and it was such a delight to have predicted something correctly about a show. (Showrunners doing something logical doesn’t make it boring: it’s nice when they follow a through-line.) Also delightful to see “Lee” back where he belongs in the first episode of the season, although kind of sorry he died. They really left his hell loop situation hanging. I was really feeling the Chloe/ Maze dynamic at the start (what a great team that they finished each other’s sandwiches ... I mean sentences!), and thought that was a great angle that they would go a little codependent on each other in their time of need. In another universe where the show wasn’t built around Deckerstar, I would have shipped them together, too. Unfortunately, then, it really left a bad taste in my mouth that Chloe said she wanted to step back from her partnership with Maze when the case gave her the realization of the week (TM). Granted, Chloe has to work through a lot of stuff, but leaving Maze out in cold when she is suffering over the loss of Eve is not where it’s at, girl. And it feels seriously in danger of retread that Maze gets shat upon yet again and lashes out in unproductive ways. It seems like Chloe, Lucifer, Dan and Eve have all at one time or another used her and failed to put Maze first when she needed it. Michael was whistling the “crime solving devil” song from season 2 when he came in. Don’t know how he knew that. ETA: At the gambling table in the hell loop, during the first shot when the camera lingered on the one woman in the foreground, the thought that came to my mind immediately was, “That’s Ildy Modrovich (the showrunner).” I’ve never seen her before, to my knowledge, so I don’t know what possessed me to think that, but I’m pretty sure that was her, after checking out a pic. Michael was whistling the theme. It’s not just from S2. I’d like to know how he knew that was the right time to step into Lucifer’s shoes. I agree with Chloe’s decision to step back from Maze. She needs to heal, and having Maze around all the time isn’t good for her. She can’t be responsible for Maze’s feelings. It’s not on Chloe to heal Maze from Eve. And Maze tried to kiss Chloe, as well. Making an overture that obviously made Chloe uncomfortable. Also Lauren German looks terrible. Maybe that’s consciously planned, but she’s far thinner than usual , the brown hair is drab, and she has unflattering make up. it looked like Lee was going up to his parent’s house in the Hell Loop, so maybe he got over his guilt. Linda was driving me nuts with all the helicopter parenting. Amenadiel is great, as usual. A little over protective, but it’s his first baby and after the Caleb stuff last season, I can live with it - as long as it’s not a recurring theme. Does Dan seem a little too eager to fill his life with anything that will fill the void? It’s a little jarring to go from broody, angry Dan two months ago, to the cheerful, upbeat new age guy here. Awe poor Maze. While I feel for her in some respects, she needs to have other hobbies & friends, other outlets. Why doesn’t she just ask Amenadiel to take her home? Destroying Lucifer’s piano was not only reckless & unhealthy, it pissed me off that a beautiful instrument was destroyed. Not to mention Lucifer will be upset. 1 Link to comment
Peace 47 August 21, 2020 Share August 21, 2020 7 minutes ago, roamyn said: Michael was whistling the theme. It’s not just from S2. I’d like to know how he knew that was the right time to step into Lucifer’s shoes. The theme song to the show is non-diegetic, I think. So no one in the world of the show has ever heard it, other than when Lucifer sang it to Chloe in S2. I think where I got it wrong was that I thought Chloe was reacting with recognition to the actual tune, and I was probably wrong about that. I thought that she reacted as though she were trying to clock Lucifer’s song and whether it was really him. But I was probably jumping the gun and she might have been just reacting to the sound of another person in the room (inexplicably whistling). Or should could have just recognized “Lucifer’s” whistling any tune. It was pretty convenient for Michael to show up right then but depending on his goals, he might have just been waiting for the right dramatic moment. 1 Link to comment
tennisgurl August 21, 2020 Share August 21, 2020 As soon as Lucifer gave the whole "the only thing that kept me going was you" speech, I knew it wasn't him. As much as he loves Chloe and can be a big sap, that just doesn't sound like him. Fun starting out with Lee again, and I ended up feeling kind of bad for him, and hoped that he could break his hell loop. Last season was a big step up in quality from the season before last, so I am hoping that we can keep the momentum up. This seemed like a good start to the season, they established a new premise for the season, showed what everyone is up to, and they gave us a crime of the week but also with enough changes to format to make things more plot relevant for the first episode. I do wonder how long Lucifer will stay in Hell with this impostor around, I like the idea of exploring Hell, but I dont want him separated from the rest of the cast for too long. I hope that we can see more of Hell now, seeing some of the demons this episode was fun, especially when the the demon possessed the dead guy to talk to Chloe. "Is that Mazekeen?" It might be cool to have a few more demons around. *Sigh* I really wish that I was more invested in Chloe/Lucifer, considering its basically the very foundation of the show. I dont dislike them and their big epic love affair that spans the heavens or whatever exactly, especially after last season did some damage control from the awful Caine/Chloe plot, but its still probably one of the least interesting aspects of the show for me. The Maze and Chloe partnership was fun, even if Maze was apparently getting the wrong idea. I think that Maze really throws herself into things and people to deal with her loneliness and not knowing her place in the universe, and I hope that this season she can figure out a way to be more self reliant. She gets so deeply invested in people, and when they dont act the way she wants them to or they leave, she just cant handle it. It doesn't hurt that she is stuck always being the bridesmaid and never the bride, never the first choice. Dan is trying so hard to be all put together, that it comes off as more manic than zen. Its great that he is trying to improve himself, especially considering how angry and miserable he was last season, but he still clearly hasn't dealt with his stuff. I do always love his scenes with Amenadiel, who is having an interesting start to the season. He wants to make things better for his super cute little baby nephilim, and in a positive way, but isn't sure how. 4 Link to comment
thuganomics85 August 22, 2020 Share August 22, 2020 I wonder what is going to piss off Lucifer the most when he finally returns: this Fake Lucifer stringing Chloe along, Maze destroying his piano, or Amenadiel turning Lux into a drug free zone! Enjoyed the Chlo/Maze duo and I did like that they were a pretty effective team in their own way. That said, I do see why Chloe might want to take a step back for now, because I do think both of them aren't really addressing their current issues right now over Lucifer's absence (and Eve for Maze), and Maze in particular seems to be making assumptions that Chloe doesn't agree with. Hopefully they'll figure things out soon. Or, at the very least, come back together once they figure out the whole Fake Lucifer thing. Speaking of not addressing their issues, Dan's new self-help phase is totally going to backfire on him eventually. Dude might be all smiles now, but he's still clearly in a lot of pain. Linda seems to be going into over-protective parent mode, but I guess knowing our baby is part angel would do that do you. I do wonder if Charlie will end up being smarter than the norm or if it's just all in Linda's head. Can't say I'm really interested in the whole "Ella keeps falling for the wrong type of guy" storyline. I really like Aimee Garcia, but they never seem to be able to fully get a handle on this character. Great seeing Lee again. The actor really works well opposite of Lucifer/Tom Ellis. While it was only a few moments, Ellis did a really good job at making it clear that the "Lucifer" at the end wasn't the same guy, but convincing enough that I can buy Chloe falling for it (especially since she is in a vulnerable place right now, when it comes to him.) Noticed that Scarlett Estevez is only a guest now, but hopefully we'll still get some good Trixie moments. Even when she was a regular, she still wasn't in all of the episodes, so I won't make too much out of it yet. Glad that the show is back and looking forward to seeing where this all goes! 3 Link to comment
StarBrand August 22, 2020 Share August 22, 2020 I believe it's a tradition to have every season opener involve Said Out Bitch Guy. The fact he was dead, in a hell loop was a bit of a surprise to me. It was a nice trick with both Lucifer and Chloe (in different dimensions), working on the same case, and Lucifer sending a message via a demon in the guy that got run over. ("Is that Masakeen?) Link to comment
Fireball August 22, 2020 Share August 22, 2020 17 hours ago, tennisgurl said: *Sigh* I really wish that I was more invested in Chloe/Lucifer, considering its basically the very foundation of the show. I dont dislike them and their big epic love affair that spans the heavens or whatever exactly, especially after last season did some damage control from the awful Caine/Chloe plot, but its still probably one of the least interesting aspects of the show for me. I wish I was invested even just a little bit in the Chloe/Lucifer epic love affair, but I'm not. I still don't understand why Lucifer fell for her?!?! To me Chole is soooo bland and just there. I also don't know what the end game is? Lucifer and Chole married, white picket fence, kids? I'm in the minority probably but I find Lucifer more interesting when his devil side pops up and less interesting when he's love sick over Chole. I actually prefer Lucifer when he's off doing his own thing and not stuck with Chole. 22 hours ago, roamyn said: Also Lauren German looks terrible. Maybe that’s consciously planned, but she’s far thinner than usual , the brown hair is drab, and she has unflattering make up. I never thought Chole looked really great. But I agree this season is even worse. The hair, thinness, and overall she just looks bad. I guess it could be to show how depressed Chole is from losing Lucifer. However, seeing Chole kind of self destruct is blah to me. When she and Maze where going out getting drunk apparently something they were doing on a regular basis all I was thinking was Chole you have a young daughter and a job... 15 hours ago, thuganomics85 said: Linda seems to be going into over-protective parent mode, but I guess knowing our baby is part angel would do that do you. I do wonder if Charlie will end up being smarter than the norm or if it's just all in Linda's head. Linda and her Charlie is "special" comment to everyone and their comment of "every parent thinks their kids is special". And Linda no no you don't understand Charlie really is "special" And everyone's reaction was funny. I do feel bad for Charlie growing up he's going to have so much pressure to be extra smart and special. I wonder if he'll end up taking after his mom's human side and just end up being regular. 4 Link to comment
Gummo August 22, 2020 Share August 22, 2020 Geez, I'm always in the minority on Lauren German. I thought the more subdued hair color and makeup looked much better and more natural. Overall, a great start to the season. Going to watch more today and feeling good about the Netflix era continuing at a high level of quality. 5 Link to comment
DoctorAtomic August 22, 2020 Share August 22, 2020 To be fair, the show has consistently shown that Chloe and Dan share custody. She can go out on nights where he has the daughter. 3 Link to comment
rainsmom August 23, 2020 Share August 23, 2020 Party scene on the boat: Put on your masks, people! Social distance! What is this, Hell? Oh. First scene with Chloe: Who IS that? If you told me that they had recast Chloe, I'd have bought it completely. She doesn't look anything like herself. Ella is still annoying. Maybe she'll be less so now that she's getting laid. Loved Lucifer's storyline. So glad to see Trixie. Dreading the baby. 3 Link to comment
Loandbehold August 23, 2020 Share August 23, 2020 On 8/21/2020 at 8:39 AM, Helena Dax said: The bit about Hell being built on people's guilt still sounds wrong to me, but I guess we have to assume it makes sense. I think this was made clear during one of the season 3 episodes. It was a topic of discussion here that if a killer had no remorse, they wouldn't be in hell after dying b/c they don't feel guilt. Which doesn't seem that fair. I was really enjoying the Maze - Chloe partnership and hope they return to it. The interrogation scene was funny. Maze doesn't have to ask what the suspect truly desires to get answers. It's a shame we didn't get to see how Maze "convinced" the right person to give her the card game invite. I really don't want to see Maze brooding and holding grudges for episodes on end. I understand Chloe wanting to take a step back, especially after Maze kissed her, but we've seen the demon scorned story line enough. Charlie is adorable. And I love that the everything in the house, including the ceiling fan (!) is still bubble-wrapped. Oh, Dr. Linda, when even Det. Douche recognizes you're going over-the-top in how magical your baby is, even if he is half-angel, you need to take a step back. And, then Dan also diagnosed Amenadude's need to clean up all crime in Los Angeles, to make sure the world is safe for Charlie, starting w/ 3 year-old jaywalkers. Hey, you've gotta provide guidance when they're young. Trixie! Of course she would know how to get Charlie laughing. Can we get Ella a real plot and one that is more than "Why do I always fall for the bad boys?" I knew there would be an impostor Luci this season but was surprised when he appeared at the end to help out Chloe. Welcome back show. Looking forward to seeing where you go from here. 1 Link to comment
Peace 47 August 23, 2020 Share August 23, 2020 One thing that I kind of blew by and didn’t really consider on my initial watch was the scene before “Lucifer” appears In that kitchen, when Chloe and Lee Garner’s sister are pinned down by gunfire. Chloe was out of options and was going to sacrifice herself on the slim chance that Lee’s sister might be able to run away (although even that was unlikely to succeed). That was very brave of Chloe and pretty sad. That moment had no time to linger due to what came next, but I was just thinking about it. Interesting that Lucifer had opted not to go up to Earth when warned by the demons that something was going on with Chloe. If Michael hadn’t shown up when he did, Chloe would have died. I can’t remember if they ever said Lee “Mr. Said Out Bitch” Garner’s full name on the show before, but regardless, this was the first time I ever clocked it. Kept thinking of Lee Garner in Mad Men and “It’s toasted” whenever they mentioned his name. Link to comment
jewel21 August 23, 2020 Share August 23, 2020 I'm ashamed to admit this, but I don't remember this Lee character at all. I think I might need to do a re-watch or something. 4 Link to comment
Peace 47 August 23, 2020 Share August 23, 2020 1 hour ago, jewel21 said: I'm ashamed to admit this, but I don't remember this Lee character at all. I think I might need to do a re-watch or something. He also appears in the season premieres of seasons 2, 3, and 4, as a criminal that haplessly gets involved in Lucifer’s shenanigans. I have and continue to enjoy the running gag. I assume that they killed him this time because they thought S5 was going to be the last one. Hope they find a way to keep him around for S6. 1 5 Link to comment
GaT August 24, 2020 Share August 24, 2020 On 8/21/2020 at 5:00 PM, thuganomics85 said: Can't say I'm really interested in the whole "Ella keeps falling for the wrong type of guy" storyline. I really like Aimee Garcia, but they never seem to be able to fully get a handle on this character. She was so great in her first season, but after that, they just ruined the character, & she never came back from it. On 8/22/2020 at 8:52 AM, Fireball said: I wish I was invested even just a little bit in the Chloe/Lucifer epic love affair, but I'm not. I still don't understand why Lucifer fell for her?!?! To me Chole is soooo bland and just there. I also don't know what the end game is? Lucifer and Chole married, white picket fence, kids? Me either, they just don't have any romantic chemistry IMO On 8/22/2020 at 5:10 PM, rainsmom said: First scene with Chloe: Who IS that? If you told me that they had recast Chloe, I'd have bought it completely. She doesn't look anything like herself. She must have had a ton of work done, but I can't pinpoint what it was, I just know she looks nothing like she did. Quote Dreading the baby. Me too, I hate when they add kids to shows. 23 hours ago, jewel21 said: I'm ashamed to admit this, but I don't remember this Lee character at all. I'm glad I'm not the only one (only I'm not ashamed LOL).I keep reading comments about how happy people are to see Lee again, & I have absolutely no memory of him at all. 2 Link to comment
ProudMary August 25, 2020 Share August 25, 2020 20 hours ago, GaT said: She must have had a ton of work done, but I can't pinpoint what it was, I just know she looks nothing like she did. Agreed. I cant figure out which of her features has somehow been altered, but she looks like Jessica Biel to me now. Lesley-Anne Brandt looked amazing in the metallic silver dress she wore in the poker scene. Glad this show is back. I missed it so. Link to comment
auntiemel August 26, 2020 Share August 26, 2020 On 8/21/2020 at 5:22 AM, Peace 47 said: IUnfortunately, then, it really left a bad taste in my mouth that Chloe said she wanted to step back from her partnership with Maze when the case gave her the realization of the week (TM). Granted, Chloe has to work through a lot of stuff, but leaving Maze out in cold when she is suffering over the loss of Eve is not where it’s at, girl. And it feels seriously in danger of retread that Maze gets shat upon yet again and lashes out in unproductive ways. It seems like Chloe, Lucifer, Dan and Eve have all at one time or another used her and failed to put Maze first when she needed it. I agree. I adore Maze, she's probably my favorite character, although there are several that I love (Maze, Lucifer, Linda, Amenadiel, Trixie, and Ella probably round out my top tier). And Lesley Ann Brandt is just So. Damn. GOOD! When those tears subtly shimmered in Maze's eyes while her words were saying Chloe was right, I just wanted to give her a big ol' demon hug! (Which she would probably want to take to the next level, and honestly, I would be fine with that, too! 😂) On 8/23/2020 at 10:34 PM, GaT said: She was so great in her first season, but after that, they just ruined the character, & she never came back from it. I actually loved the season when she had the storyline of having lost her faith...and really missing it, but still not being able to find it even though she was in pain from its absence, and becoming a little jaded about life and God because of that. Maybe it is just because that's a story I can relate to, and I think Aimee Garcia is adorable, and I'm a sucker for performances when generally-bubbly characters are in pain...I don't know. But I loved it. 5 Link to comment
sinkwriter September 16, 2020 Share September 16, 2020 On 8/22/2020 at 9:18 PM, Loandbehold said: Can we get Ella a real plot and one that is more than "Why do I always fall for the bad boys?" I will consider it a huge waste if the one true believer of all the characters ends up never finding out about Lucifer. I think that would be a huge thing for her character and a plot worth exploring. Especially if she goes into denial or truly cannot handle it - all the other characters so far have eventually gotten over it (for the most part). It would be more realistic if at least one of the main characters refused to believe it, or just lost their mind. Or something interesting! On 8/21/2020 at 7:22 AM, Peace 47 said: Also delightful to see “Lee” back where he belongs in the first episode of the season, although kind of sorry he died. They really left his hell loop situation hanging. On 8/23/2020 at 1:58 AM, Peace 47 said: He also appears in the season premieres of seasons 2, 3, and 4, as a criminal that haplessly gets involved in Lucifer’s shenanigans. I have and continue to enjoy the running gag. I assume that they killed him this time because they thought S5 was going to be the last one. Hope they find a way to keep him around for S6. For some reason I was waiting for him to finally realize he'd just been scared to face his family and that -- now that he acknowledges those fears -- he doesn't have to feel guilty anymore. And then he'd disappear from Hell right in front of Lucifer (or someone would come to take him to Heaven). I figured he was going to come to realizations about himself, showing more growth and readiness to let go of those emotional struggles than Lucifer was able to do during the same conversation (with Lucifer's own baggage). That was my hope for him, anyway. Maybe they could bring him back in S6 to let him wise up at long last and leave Hell once and for all, proving Lucifer's comment that people are there because of their own internal struggles and can actually leave anytime they're ready and able. 2 Link to comment
shrewd.buddha September 22, 2020 Share September 22, 2020 (edited) Did they ever solve the case of who killed Mr. Said Out Bitch? If it was revealed, it was not clear. To leave the case in limbo seemed like an odd choice for a police procedural show. Edited September 22, 2020 by shrewd.buddha Link to comment
wilnil September 24, 2020 Share September 24, 2020 On 9/22/2020 at 7:43 PM, shrewd.buddha said: Did they ever solve the case of who killed Mr. Said Out Bitch? If it was revealed, it was not clear. To leave the case in limbo seemed like an odd choice for a police procedural show. It was his former partners in crime, the ones who got into the shootout with Chloe. The dialogue was a bit rushed, but they said they killed him and took his hand to get the loot he owed them from a past job. 1 Link to comment
VartanFan October 20, 2020 Share October 20, 2020 Quote Did they ever solve the case of who killed Mr. Said Out Bitch? If it was revealed, it was not clear. To leave the case in limbo seemed like an odd choice for a police procedural show. I felt a bit lost in this also. Like...I finally got that it was former partners but I felt like someone had the money (like the sister, maybe). They really just made it so he spent all the money on gambling? Link to comment
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