S05.E02: 50% Off

[nodorothyparker]

Airdate 2020.02.24

Quote

Jimmy's promotional stunt has unintended consequences as Nacho takes extreme measures to earn Lalo's trust. Mike loses his temper.

 

[Dianaofthehunt]

Awww, the poor garden gnome 😢

[Ohwell]

I hope Nacho and his dad survive this mess.

[CarCarHouse]

Was the Real Estate Agent Windy (Wendy) from Breaking Bad?  

[Sharper2002]

Mike yelling at Kaylee hurt my feelings through the screen. 😢

 

[Lonesome Rhodes]

How utterly heartbreaking to see Mike being so broken, in his core, that he didn't have it in him to simply love his granddaughter.  That was a display of an irredeemable man.  For all his awesomeness, I saw a wretched person.  That was as ugly as it gets.  I hated it.  Props to Gilligan and Banks.

With Saul on such a tight schedule, Suzanne should have called him on his BS.  Trial?  Cool.  How many clients you gonna serve while I see to it the process is as drawn out as possible.  Tell me again about your outrageous proposal.  Then, when the proper equity was restored in the relationship (she held ALL the cards), they could negotiate realistic terms which would serve her well, and her office.

TPTB were forced to resort to a TV trope, namely, no sound made as a perp (in this case, Nacho) leaped to a roof with a bunch of cops right there.  The move Ignacio made was completely congruent with known circumstances.  No issues at all with the attempt.  The physics?  Unpossible.

I am impatient with the whole Kim "will she/won't she."   The disdain of the realtor as she shut the door behind them was a fun bit, though.

Lalo meeting with Hector was chillier than those Modelos he drank with Nacho.  Oh, boy.

I am thrilled BCS has returned.  This ep, however, was a bit of a nothingburger to me - with the notable exception of the evil within Mike rearing up.

 

Edited February 25, 2020 by Lonesome Rhodes

[Dev F]

I rarely get too amped about Breaking Bad callbacks or the nitty-gritty details of the crime storylines, but this week's twist is pretty ingenious . . .

We're meant to think, right, that Domingo isn't actually a rat -- that Lalo is going to use him to feed Gus's dealers to the DEA?

That's an awfully clever retcon.

It also means that Jimmy's boneheaded stunt is actually responsible for the downfall of Gus's entire empire, since it set in motion the only chain of events -- Domingo becomes an informant and ultimately gives up his own cousin, Jesse's partner Emilio, to the DEA -- that would bring together Jesse and Walt. So it's probably not an accident that, as folks on Reddit have already been pointing out, the idiot duo's bender in the teaser ends with the image of the poor garden gnome with half his face torn off.

Edited February 25, 2020 by Dev F

[WritinMan]

So many commercials....

[cheetahchirps]

25 minutes ago, Sharper2002 said:

Mike yelling at Kaylee hurt my feelings through the screen. 😢

 

I know he hates any reference to his son, but Mike made a big mistake there. No kid ever forgets being dressed down by their grandparent, and that’s another incident to ruin Kaylee’s warm memories. 

This was the first time I’ve ever found Tio to be cute, when he was sipping that awful concoction. I guess Lalo being removed from his indiscriminate murdering ways makes him more appealing, since I can’t help but like him.

It was good to see Ocho Loco again being hilariously dumb, and Nacho becoming a leader with initiative. 
 

This episode was a return to the usual high standards, after wrapping up some plot lines from the premier, and extremely enjoyable.

 

[LittleIggy]

2 hours ago, Sharper2002 said:

Mike yelling at Kaylee hurt my feelings through the screen. 😢

 

That was heartbreaking.

I really wanted some Mexican food after seeing Lalo cooking. 😋

[gallimaufry]

Man, that intro with the two idiots was insufferable.  It was great to make the point about the impact of Saul's 50% off promotion but did it need nearly 3 minutes?  Especially when it doesn't look like they'll even be clients.

The rest of the episode was good.  I liked the scene with Kim thawing a little although it feels like just putting off the inevitable... I love how taciturn Kim can be but usually we can see her thought process.  However, it's becoming harder to see how she's justifying this.  There are so many things in the air - how Mesa Verde react to the bank footprint changes, how Rich reacts to Saul and how it reflects on Kim, how her PD clients react to a new "speedy justice" option...

I really liked the scene with Mike and Kaylee and the new actress for Kaylee is great.  I really liked Nacho finding a way to prove his worth to Lalo.  I loved Howard's far-too-short cameo and really want to see more of him.  Very intrigued to hear why he wants to meet with Jimmy.   Great stuff with the DA.

However, the balance of the show feels really off at the moment.  For four years, our leads have been Jimmy, Kim and Mike and we followed even the tiny minutiae of their lives and emotions.  But Mike and Kim were relatively small parts of this and obviously Jimmy is now inhabiting a very different role.  I'm glad Nacho is stepping up -- it's overdue and his arc is great.  And none of it is bad.  But it does feel abruptly very different from what's gone before.  I don't want the show to become Cartel Wars with Jimmy, Mike and Kim subplots. 

[shapeshifter]

6 hours ago, Lonesome Rhodes said:

TPTB were forced to resort to a TV trope, namely, no sound made as a perp (in this case, Nacho) leaped to a roof with a bunch of cops right there

I might be wrong, but I think the cops were making enough noise to cover “poor Nachito’s” moves. Plus, doesn’t the flat, stucco-type roof block sound? 
For me, the TV trope was when Nacho broke out the window (which was pretty loud) at exactly the same moment the cops broke down the reinforced door (louder sound).

 

 

6 hours ago, cheetahchirps said:

know he hates any reference to his son, but Mike made a big mistake there. No kid ever forgets being dressed down by their grandparent, and that’s another incident to ruin Kaylee’s warm memories. 

Maybe Mike was purposely alienating Kaylee because he was afraid just knowing him would kill her like it did his son/her father? If so, this is a set up for Mike not interacting with her anymore —instead supporting her financially only. 

[Blakeston]

i was hoping this episode would provide an explanation for the "Gus puts lousy drugs on the street" stuff from the previous episode.

Gus's story about how Werner stole two keys of product from him - and thus he had to replace it with lousy street drugs - was a lie. Werner never stole any drugs from him.

I guess the idea is that Gus wanted an explanation for Lalo about why Mike was looking for someone named Werner Ziegler. And so he came up with the "Werner stole drugs" story, and intentionally put some bad drugs on the street to back the story up.

But wouldn't it make more sense for Gus to just say that Werner had stolen some drugs, and Mike hunted him down and retrieved them? That way Gus wouldn't have damaged his own reputation, and disappointed Don Eladio.

And why on earth would Gus reveal that Werner was there for a construction project?

Edited February 25, 2020 by Blakeston

[NYCFree]

1 hour ago, Blakeston said:

i was hoping this episode would provide an explanation for the "Gus puts lousy drugs on the street" stuff from the previous episode.

Gus's story about how Werner stole two keys of product from him - and thus he had to replace it with lousy street drugs - was a lie. Werner never stole any drugs from him.

I guess the idea is that Gus wanted an explanation for Lalo about why Mike was looking for someone named Werner Ziegler. And so he came up with the "Werner stole drugs" story, and intentionally put some bad drugs on the street to back the story up.

But wouldn't it make more sense for Gus to just say that Werner had stolen some drugs, and Mike hunted him down and retrieved them? That way Gus wouldn't have damaged his own reputation, and disappointed Don Eladio.

And why on earth would Gus reveal that Werner was there for a construction project?

I don’t know the reasons behind all of Gus’ tale, but I do know why Gus had to reveal Werner was there for a construction project. Last season, when Lalo called Werner and pretended to be one of Mike’s guys, Werner told Lalo he had left detailed instructions. When Lalo pressed for details, Werner told him the men should “complete the south wall.”

My speculation about the bad drugs were that he had to have a reason to “confess” to Don Eladio and stop Lalo from investigating. He had to give the Salamancas a reason to complain, so that he could “explain” Werner and Mike’s hunt for him. 

[ShadowFacts]

This was better than the premiere but still not up to the standard of the previous seasons for me. I did enjoy the juxtaposition of Jimmy (he will always be Jimmy, just doing business as Saul) living his best life, fast on his feet, schmoozing the courthouse personnel, wheeling and dealing vs. Mike being the worst PopPop ever. I took it to be the combo of having just killed Werner and Kaylee wanting good memories of her dad that pitched him into the darkness, but I hated him for it. It made me wonder if he ever acted like that as a father to his son. If I were Kaylee's mom, that would be the last babysitting gig Mike ever did.

The rest of the drug stuff, don't care anymore. Gus being all sinister in the rearview mirror, over it. Nacho leaping tall buildings in a single bound, silly. Why are they all sitting in a car doing a play-by-play within view of the police?

[teddysmom]

3 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

Maybe Mike was purposely alienating Kaylee because he was afraid just knowing him would kill her like it did his son/her father? If so, this is a set up for Mike not interacting with her anymore —instead supporting her financially only. 

Except on Breaking Bad, which happens post Better Call Saul, Mike babysits for Kaylee all the time.  He was just upset remembering that he told his son how to deal with the bad cops, and it got him killed, and about having to kill Werner, who he knew was a good person who made one bad mistake. 

People get upset about one thing and take it out on someone who did nothing to them. 

10 hours ago, WritinMan said:

So many commercials....

I know!! WTF. 

[teddysmom]

4 hours ago, gallimaufry said:

I really liked Nacho finding a way to prove his worth to Lalo

Do we know how Nacho knows Saul? I can't recall if we do. Was it back first season when Tuco & Company kidnapped Saul and the two skateboarding kids and took them to the desert?  I need to rewatch the last half of S4. 

It seems some aren't aware of  the Gilligan & Co art form of long intros that may not seem relevant but end up being so.   

Spoiler

I thought the culdesac where the two idiots crashed the for sale sign was where Hank & Marie live. 

 

[shapeshifter]

44 minutes ago, icemiser69 said:

What a waste of a perfectly good ice cream cone.

Oh, I know! And it was the most clearly identifiable on-screen of the most popular flavors: mint chocolate chip. ☹️

 

Edited February 25, 2020 by shapeshifter

[Bryce Lynch]

4 hours ago, gallimaufry said:

Man, that intro with the two idiots was insufferable.  It was great to make the point about the impact of Saul's 50% off promotion but did it need nearly 3 minutes?  Especially when it doesn't look like they'll even be clients.

The rest of the episode was good.  I liked the scene with Kim thawing a little although it feels like just putting off the inevitable... I love how taciturn Kim can be but usually we can see her thought process.  However, it's becoming harder to see how she's justifying this.  There are so many things in the air - how Mesa Verde react to the bank footprint changes, how Rich reacts to Saul and how it reflects on Kim, how her PD clients react to a new "speedy justice" option...

I really liked the scene with Mike and Kaylee and the new actress for Kaylee is great.  I really liked Nacho finding a way to prove his worth to Lalo.  I loved Howard's far-too-short cameo and really want to see more of him.  Very intrigued to hear why he wants to meet with Jimmy.   Great stuff with the DA.

However, the balance of the show feels really off at the moment.  For four years, our leads have been Jimmy, Kim and Mike and we followed even the tiny minutiae of their lives and emotions.  But Mike and Kim were relatively small parts of this and obviously Jimmy is now inhabiting a very different role.  I'm glad Nacho is stepping up -- it's overdue and his arc is great.  And none of it is bad.  But it does feel abruptly very different from what's gone before.  I don't want the show to become Cartel Wars with Jimmy, Mike and Kim subplots. 

I was just wrapping up a phone conversation to watch, and I thought that opening scene was an extended promo for some new, crappy AMC show.  It felt nothing like BB or BCS and was awful.

I thought the house hunting scene was a total waste of time.  They could have at least given us a nice callback by having the realtor be the one who got Marie arrested.  

I thought the Mike and Kaylee scene was a good idea, but poorly executed.  I didn't buy MIke going off on her that hard and that fast.  I would have bought it more if he tried to get her to change the subject, but she kept insisting on asking about her father.   

The poker scene was OK. Now we know how Crazy-8 got his nickname.  I took it that he was losing on purpose to kiss up the scary boss.

Lalo was less cartoonish in this episode.  

I liked Saul's plea bargaining on the bluetooth and asking Ericsen for a "lightning round".  But, the stuck elevator scam was obvious and cliched and not worthy of this show. 

The idea that criminals would commit extra crimes and get caught because they have a 50% discount on legal fees was absurd.   If you had a 50% off coupon from a doctor, would you intentionally break your leg to get the discount?

Nacho going back to get the drugs, while the SWAT team was about to break down the door was cartoonish.   

I like Mike's ugly wakeup scene.  It seemed like a callback to Walt waking up that way a few times, usually with broken glasses and a cut over his eye.  

I liked seeing Howard, but wanted more of him.  

This one was a little better than the premier, but still not very good.  

 

 

 

[gallimaufry]

13 minutes ago, teddysmom said:

Do we know how Nacho knows Saul? I can't recall if we do. Was it back first season when Tuco & Company kidnapped Saul and the two skateboarding kids and took them to the desert?  I need to rewatch the last half of S4. 

Yep; and he was trying to con the Kettlemans.

[Bryce Lynch]

23 minutes ago, icemiser69 said:

I hate to get all technical, but shouldn't a tree house be built in a tree?   It should have been called a playhouse, not a tree house.

What a waste of a perfectly good ice cream cone.

I liked that house that Kim and Jimmy were walking through.   That said, there seemed like a lot of wasted interior space which could have been used for a complete second floor rather than such an open area ground floor which diminished the size of the second floor.

I hope nothing happens to the cute dog.

I think we all knew the elevator was intentionally stopped between floors before Jimmy and the D.A. exited the elevator.

Um, the house was made out of wood and wood comes from trees.  Therefore, it was a treehouse! :)

[Bryce Lynch]

3 hours ago, Blakeston said:

i was hoping this episode would provide an explanation for the "Gus puts lousy drugs on the street" stuff from the previous episode.

Gus's story about how Werner stole two keys of product from him - and thus he had to replace it with lousy street drugs - was a lie. Werner never stole any drugs from him.

I guess the idea is that Gus wanted an explanation for Lalo about why Mike was looking for someone named Werner Ziegler. And so he came up with the "Werner stole drugs" story, and intentionally put some bad drugs on the street to back the story up.

But wouldn't it make more sense for Gus to just say that Werner had stolen some drugs, and Mike hunted him down and retrieved them? That way Gus wouldn't have damaged his own reputation, and disappointed Don Eladio.

And why on earth would Gus reveal that Werner was there for a construction project?

I thought that whole plan to put out the bad drugs was convoluted. 

As for revealing that Werner was there for a construction project, Mike overheard Werner on the phone, telling Lalo that they were about to pour the concrete for the south wall.   After Mike took the phone from Werner, and didn't respond to Lalo's questions, Lalo said, "Michael, is that you?".  

So, Mike and Gus knew that Lalo knew that Werner was there for a construction project and that someone named Michael was involved.  

[nodorothyparker]

I had forgotten all about Nacho's role in the Kettlemen story.  The last time Jimmy and Nacho's stories intersected in any way that I could remember was Mike calling in Jimmy to extricate Pryce, the dumbest pill seller ever, from the situation he created when he called the cops after Nacho robbed his house of his hidden drug money and baseball cards. Even then I don't believe they shared a scene together.  Regardless, I hope we're finally nearing the end of feeling like we're watching completely separate shows that happen to share a universe and a time slot as the plotlines begin to converge.

I still think when this show is really firing there's little any better on TV, but it's felt like it's been having some balancing problems these first two episodes as we begin to make the turn into the home stretch.  The pacing was better on this one for me, and less just The Ongoing Saga of the Family Salamanca Now Starring Lalo.  A little of him goes a long way, and I'm still here primarily for the Jimmy to Saul story.

The two discount Skinny Pete and Badger wannabes at the beginning were a decent homage to one of Gilligan's favorite recurrent themes: unintended consequences.  If they hadn't been causing a commotion banging on that drainpipe, Krazy 8 wouldn't have been up on that ladder trying to fix it when the cops showed up and Nacho now wouldn't be needing Jimmy/Saul, criminal lawyer  The pieces are lining up enough now that this has to be the point where Saul begins his association with the bigger deal movers and shakers he clearly had ties to when he entered the BB story.

Kim and Jimmy looking at the giant white house made me sad, and not just for my distaste for the very stark super modern architecture so prevalent on the show.  Jimmy's talking about hosting movie nights with all the trimmings, but like when Chuck was suddenly talking about dinner parties with friends after years of living like a mylar wrapped squatter shut-in, it completely ignored the obvious.  He doesn't really have any friends, and certainly not even any associates he'd probably want to invite home to hang out with Kim.  And we know what the respectable legal community will soon think of Jimmy if they don't already.  It was also a bit of a callback to when Jimmy was fresh off winning his place at Davis & Main and they were wistfully talking about getting a nice place somewhere with a smoker out back, back when everyone but Chuck was still hopeful Jimmy wouldn't take the fast track down.  Kim's still hanging in there, but you can see she's fraying.

[shapeshifter]

44 minutes ago, icemiser69 said:

What a waste of a perfectly good ice cream cone.

ETA: There were a lot of possible interpretations regarding Saul’s holding onto and letting go of the ice cream cone:

1. He could have cavalierly hopped in the car with the ice cream to indicate he was on their team (as the “criminal” lawyer)
2. Dropping the ice cream only after looking at Nacho and seeing Nacho motion to ditch the ice cream before getting in the car implies Saul is intimidated, or
3. …Saul is (pretending?) to show respect for Nacho —perhaps because he wants to gain points with Nacho, or
4. …Saul wants to make the other dudes think they have him intimidated 
5. choose your own ice cream adventure 

[Bryce Lynch]

1 minute ago, shapeshifter said:

ETA: There were a lot of possible interpretations regarding Saul’s holding onto and letting go of the ice cream cone:

1. He could have cavalierly hopped in the car with the ice cream to indicate he was on their team (as the “criminal” lawyer)
2. Dropping the ice cream only after looking at Nacho and seeing Nacho motion to ditch the ice cream before getting in the car implies Saul is intimidated, or
3. …Saul is (pretending?) to show respect for Nacho —perhaps because he wants to gain points with Nacho, or
4. …Saul wants to make the other dudes think they have him intimidated 
5. choose your own ice cream adventure 

I thought it was simply that Nacho gave him a "You're not bringing that ice cream cone into my car." look.   I was thinking, what's the big deal?  If Saul got ice cream on the upholstery, he could get it replaced at his Dad's shop.  

Totally off topic, but it reminded me of The Office ("Dinner Party"), when Andy took a lick from Angela's ice cream cone and she rolled down the window and slammed it against his car door.  

[ShadowFacts]

7 minutes ago, nodorothyparker said:

Kim and Jimmy looking at the giant white house made me sad, and not just for my distaste for the very stark super modern architecture so prevalent on the show.  Jimmy's talking about hosting movie nights with all the trimmings, but like when Chuck was suddenly talking about dinner parties with friends after years of living like a mylar wrapped squatter shut-in, it completely ignored the obvious.  He doesn't really have any friends, and certainly not even any associates he'd probably want to invite home to hang out with Kim.  And we know what the respectable legal community will soon think of Jimmy if they don't already.  It was also a bit of a callback to when Jimmy was fresh off winning his place at Davis & Main and they were wistfully talking about getting a nice place somewhere with a smoker out back, back when everyone but Chuck was still hopeful Jimmy wouldn't take the fast track down.  Kim's still hanging in there, but you can see she's fraying.

Edited February 25, 2020 by ShadowFacts

[teddysmom]

28 minutes ago, gallimaufry said:

Yep; and he was trying to con the Kettlemans.

Thanks!!  

[Bryce Lynch]

1 minute ago, ShadowFacts said:

 

I was thinking that maybe some of Kim's associates would come for movie night.  As for Saul, it would probably just be Huell and maybe Ernesto.  Maybe he could invite the ADA and some of his clients, too. :)

[ShadowFacts]

2 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

I was thinking that maybe some of Kim's associates would come for movie night.  As for Saul, it would probably just be Huell and maybe Ernesto.  Maybe he could invite the ADA and some of his clients, too. 🙂

My edit went into the ether, but yes, Kim might have a few friends. We just never see any.

[teddysmom]

4 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

I thought it was simply that Nacho gave him a "You're not bringing that ice cream cone into my car." look.   I was thinking, what's the big deal?  If Saul got ice cream on the upholstery, he could get it replaced at his Dad's shop.  

Totally off topic, but it reminded me of The Office ("Dinner Party"), when Andy took a lick from Angela's ice cream cone and she rolled down the window and slammed it against his car door.  

Agree it was Nacho saying You're not dripping ice cream all over the car.  Are Nacho & his Dad back on good terms?  He probably doesn't want to have to ask him for favors. 

FYI the BCS podcast is up with first episode and they have 2 for El Camino.  WOOHOO. 

Do you listen to Office Ladies podcast? It's so funny to hear how sweet and funny Angela Kinsey is, since Angela Martin has such a stick up her butt. 

The opening when Victor (?) went in the restaurant where Nacho's father was, had me a nervous wreck.  Then after BCS I finished watching last episode of The Outsider so my nerves are completely shot. 

 

[Chaos Theory]

I am more curious then ever where Kim is in all this.   She loves Jimmy but she is increasingly uncomfortable with Saul.   I can see the same tragedy with Jimmy and Kim as with Walt and Skylar.   
 

This whole series has always been to me about the effect of unintended consequences.   The domino effect of an action on the world around you.  Jimmy is both street smart but also incredibly naive.  I don’t think he thought the 50% off deal would ever actually come to fruition the way it did.  
 

Plus yeah....Mike and his granddaughter.   She just wanted to know more about her dad and Mike so full of rage..... 

[Bannon]

20 minutes ago, nodorothyparker said:

I had forgotten all about Nacho's role in the Kettlemen story.  The last time Jimmy and Nacho's stories intersected in any way that I could remember was Mike calling in Jimmy to extricate Pryce, the dumbest pill seller ever, from the situation he created when he called the cops after Nacho robbed his house of his hidden drug money and baseball cards. Even then I don't believe they shared a scene together.  Regardless, I hope we're finally nearing the end of feeling like we're watching completely separate shows that happen to share a universe and a time slot as the plotlines begin to converge.

I still think when this show is really firing there's little any better on TV, but it's felt like it's been having some balancing problems these first two episodes as we begin to make the turn into the home stretch.  The pacing was better on this one for me, and less just The Ongoing Saga of the Family Salamanca Now Starring Lalo.  A little of him goes a long way, and I'm still here primarily for the Jimmy to Saul story.

The two discount Skinny Pete and Badger wannabes at the beginning were a decent homage to one of Gilligan's favorite recurrent themes: unintended consequences.  If they hadn't been causing a commotion banging on that drainpipe, Krazy 8 wouldn't have been up on that ladder trying to fix it when the cops showed up and Nacho now wouldn't be needing Jimmy/Saul, criminal lawyer  The pieces are lining up enough now that this has to be the point where Saul begins his association with the bigger deal movers and shakers he clearly had ties to when he entered the BB story.

Kim and Jimmy looking at the giant white house made me sad, and not just for my distaste for the very stark super modern architecture so prevalent on the show.  Jimmy's talking about hosting movie nights with all the trimmings, but like when Chuck was suddenly talking about dinner parties with friends after years of living like a mylar wrapped squatter shut-in, it completely ignored the obvious.  He doesn't really have any friends, and certainly not even any associates he'd probably want to invite home to hang out with Kim.  And we know what the respectable legal community will soon think of Jimmy if they don't already.  It was also a bit of a callback to when Jimmy was fresh off winning his place at Davis & Main and they were wistfully talking about getting a nice place somewhere with a smoker out back, back when everyone but Chuck was still hopeful Jimmy wouldn't take the fast track down.  Kim's still hanging in there, but you can see she's fraying.

Exactly. The purpose of the house showing scene was to demonstrate the emptiness of Jimmy's life, now become Saul. The choice of the home was good writing, because no architecture screams souless void like poorly executed modernism.

[Pike Ludwell]

We know from BB Crazy 8 became a DEA informant. Maybe this is the time for it to happen. Maybe we'll see Hank in an episode soon!

Edited February 25, 2020 by Pike Ludwell

[Bannon]

Gosh, it seems obvious to me that Mike is plummeting again into a bottomless depression; the self medication with alcohol, and the self loathing manifesting itself as rage directed at someone he loves most.

I've always said this is the saddest television show I've ever watched, which is remarkable, given it is one that has made me laugh so often.

Edited February 25, 2020 by Bannon

[Bannon]

Also, I've always loved how this show accurately illuminates how our criminal justice system is in large measure just a machine, designed for the purpose of cranking out guilty pleas, without regard for real justice or the public good.

[Pike Ludwell]

6 hours ago, gallimaufry said:

Man, that intro with the two idiots was insufferable.  It was great to make the point about the impact of Saul's 50% off promotion but did it need nearly 3 minutes?  Especially when it doesn't look like they'll even be clients.

Yeah. I kept feeling offended almost that they would subject me to that degree of stupidity for so long. It was sort of along the lines of that "Windy" scene that opened an episode of BB, but that one worked. This one didn't.

[peeayebee]

It was very sad when Mike yelled at Kaylie, but I couldn't really be mad at him. We all know the reasons he reacted like he did. He will bury this pain deep down so he won't hurt his granddaughter anymore.

Like others, I didn't like the sequence with the two meth heads going on their crazy crime spree just because they had a 50% off lawyer promise. Yes, they were stupid, and their stupidity multiplied every time they got high, but I just wasn't entertained.

Poor Krazy 8, getting stuck up on the ladder just when the drugs come falling out of the drainpipe. I love how he got his name, since "Krazy 8" suggests someone who is scarily crazy rather than someone who folded when he shouldn't have.

Yes, it was obvious that Jimmy had arranged for the elevator to stop so he could wheel and deal with Suzanne, but I still enjoyed their bargaining. It's always nice to see Jimmy being a good lawyer for his clients.

[teddysmom]

1 hour ago, Bryce Lynch said:

The idea that criminals would commit extra crimes and get caught because they have a 50% discount on legal fees was absurd.   If you had a 50% off coupon from a doctor, would you intentionally break your leg to get the discount?

You're applying logic to a couple 20 year old meth heads.   They aren't exactly Danny Ocean & Company. 

The opening montage is classic Gilligan/Gould.   And it was relevant, as it lead to the scene with the drain pipe being clogged, Crazy 8 getting caught, Nacho getting in good with Lalo. 

[teddysmom]

I remember Nacho stealing from Pryce and Mike being involved getting Saul to get him off,  (Mark Proksch who is now an Energy Vampire on What We Do In The Shadows), but I don't recall how Nacho was involved with the Kettlemans. To the interwebs! 

 

 

[Bannon]

22 minutes ago, Pike Ludwell said:

Yeah. I kept feeling offended almost that they would subject me to that degree of stupidity for so long. It was sort of along the lines of that "Windy" scene that opened an episode of BB, but that one worked. This one didn't.

The "Wendy" cold open in BB was so effective because of a perfect choice in music, the relentlessly upbeat, albeit kinda' empty, top 40 hit from the '60s, paired to the visuals of a character, Wendy,  who the viewers had come to know, descended into abject squalor, having her life destroyed via the addiction that Walt and Jesse are promoting. It's one of the best few minutes of t.v. I've ever seen, and without a word of dialogue.

Last night's cold open doesn't come close, of course, having none of the irony of its predecessor, and the 50% off gimmick being a bit clunky. Not being as good as the "Wendy" open, is not harsh criticism, however, and although I didn't love it, it did illuminate the social and human cost of the illicit drug trade, and I appreciate that these writers never lose sight of that.

[peeayebee]

16 minutes ago, Bannon said:

Not being as good as the "Wendy" open, is not harsh criticism...

Is it 50% as good?

[ShadowFacts]

37 minutes ago, peeayebee said:

It was very sad when Mike yelled at Kaylie, but I couldn't really be mad at him. We all know the reasons he reacted like he did. He will bury this pain deep down so he won't hurt his granddaughter anymore.

Damage done though. He didn't just fly off the handle and then get a grip. She wouldn't come out of her room and eat, he was already coming out the door when Stacey got out of her car, wouldn't respond to her question, was still enraged. I feel like his ugly outburst would have a person immediately apologizing to their grandkid, and maybe we just didn't see that, but he was unapologetic to Stacy. We know Kaylee comes around to some extent because we see them together in Breaking Bad (although Kaylee is de-aged, lol), but I imagine his relationship with Stacy takes a hit that it may never recover from. I can't remember exactly back to BB but I think there was some indication that they were not on good terms.

[teddysmom]

12 minutes ago, peeayebee said:

29 minutes ago, Bannon said:

Not being as good as the "Wendy" open, is not harsh criticism...

Is it 50% as good?

I think it's because we didn't know the knuckleheads from last night, and we had gotten to know Wendy.  We didn't have anything invested in them. If it had been Skinny Pete & Badger, it would have been much more effective. 

[Bannon]

I do wish the digital de-ageing technology pioneered in Scorcese's The Irishman could be used by Gilligan& Co.. I love Jonathan Banks' work on this show, but it's getting pretty noticeable that he's playing 20 years younger than his age.

[gallimaufry]

The teaser could have worked if it was edited way down and had better music.  I mean, it would have been a lot cheaper to film and more interesting just to have a montage of the debris and aftermath of lots of crimes and then have them waking up and realising: hey, 50% off!  Instead, the punchline was kind of known from the start.  And looking back, it was more than 3 minutes... over half the time Mike got this whole episode.  Peeayebee said it best: 

51 minutes ago, peeayebee said:

but I just wasn't entertained.

Ultimately, sometimes these things don't turn out as hoped.  It's just a shame if they're losing their magic touch going into the final stretch.

[Bannon]

9 minutes ago, ShadowFacts said:

Damage done though. He didn't just fly off the handle and then get a grip. She wouldn't come out of her room and eat, he was already coming out the door when Stacey got out of her car, wouldn't respond to her question, was still enraged. I feel like his ugly outburst would have a person immediately apologizing to their grandkid, and maybe we just didn't see that, but he was unapologetic to Stacy. We know Kaylee comes around to some extent because we see them together in Breaking Bad (although Kaylee is de-aged, lol), but I imagine his relationship with Stacy takes a hit that it may never recover from. I can't remember exactly back to BB but I think there was some indication that they were not on good terms.

Mike is just filled to the brim with self-loathing, and he is really struggling with how to live with people he cares about while hating himself as he does. It's just awful to watch, as well written and acted as it is. Eventually, of course, he decides to fully immerse himself in the moral filth of Gus', and then Walt's business, telling himself that it's something he can live with, because all the money is for Kaylee. Which of course makes his pursuit of moral self-degradation ultimately pointless. Just incredibly tragic, in the classical sense.

[MaryHedwig]

2 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

That said, there seemed like a lot of wasted interior space which could have been used for a complete second floor rather than such an open area ground floor which diminished the size of the second floor.

Executive houses are built like that are built with open area ground floors for entertaining, not so much for family living.

[Ohwell]

1 hour ago, teddysmom said:

I remember Nacho stealing from Pryce and Mike being involved getting Saul to get him off,  (Mark Proksch who is now an Energy Vampire on What We Do In The Shadows), but I don't recall how Nacho was involved with the Kettlemans. To the interwebs! 

 

 

Yeah, I don't recall either.

My problem with BCS (and some other shows is the long wait in between seasons, and I forget a lot of stuff that happened in previous seasons.

[gallimaufry]

Yes, I think the problem with Mike is there's no external need for him to be a part of Gus's business.  It is contrary to his character on such a deep level to do these things.  And so Kaylee & Stacey are almost Mike's Gretchen & Elliott -- they're a redemption he can't bring himself to embrace.  In Walt's case, he'd lose face; in Mike's case, he knows that either his relationship with his granddaughter will always be a lie or that one day Kaylee will have to live with the fact that Mike broke his own son.

Incidentally, just did a quick skim through and very, very (very) roughly, in episode 1 we had:

Gene - 13 mins
Jimmy and/or Kim - 19 mins
Cartel - 19 mins including only about 6-odd minutes of Mike

In episode 2, excluding the final scene which pulls Saul into the cartel:

Jimmy and/or Kim - 16 mins
Cartel (including teaser) - 21 minutes
Mike - 6 minutes

To be fair, the worlds will obviously overlap from next week.  Still,  while we all knew BCS would intersect with the cartel world, it's strange for 50% of the show to be in that world, near enough as much as Jimmy/Kim/Mike screentime put together in this one.  If this is what hey mean by "speeding up" as we get to the end, it just makes me wish they'd paced it out better.

"Breaking Bad" did a great job of adding characters like Gus, Saul, Mike, Todd and others but keeping the focus primarily on Walt, Jesse, Skylar and to some extent Hank.  I hope it balances out a lot more as the season progresses.

[teddysmom]

3 hours ago, Ohwell said:

eah, I don't recall either.

My problem with BCS (and some other shows is the long wait in between seasons, and I forget a lot of stuff that happened in previous seasons.

It's in the "Nacho" episode Season 1.  Nacho knew Kettleman had embezzled all that money from the county, and that it was in the house. He parked in front of the house to scope it out. Neighbor called in his van and plates. Jimmy knew he was going to rob them, so he warned them over the phone with the paper towel tube "sex robot voice" and they took off, staging their own kidnapping. Police pick up Nacho and he calls Jimmy to get him out as he thinks Jimmy set him up. 

Jimmy finds them out in the desert in their tent about 5 miles from their house singing camping songs, like B I N G O.  

He pulls open the tent flap and yells "Here's Johnny" and scares the living shit out of them, and he & Mrs K fight over the duffel bag and out comes all the money. 

(every epi that season ended in "O") 

 

 

Edited February 25, 2020 by teddysmom