Tori and Bobby: Whine Time!

[Heathen]

I saw spoiler activity on this thread, and I thought for sure Tori had been fecundated yet again. 

[BitterApple]

Tori's kids are adorable.

[cereality]

5 yrs out of college for Bobby, 5 yrs married - so age 27 and damn he’s aged. He’s not aging as badly as Chad but he’s close. Granted some of it is that even 5 yrs ago it was clear he had the kind of hairline that’d recede. But I’m guessing having 4 kids in 5 yrs on an office manager’s salary (I know Kelton has given him a fancier title but essentially that’s what he is) is the source of some stress. But hey their precious family has just begun per their anniversary post - so bring on another 5 kids.

At least they both appear content with their lives, mind blowing as it would be for normal 26-27 yr olds to have 4 kids under 4. None of Carlin/Evan/Whit’s woohoo party party, acting like they missed out on their 20s. These two seem wired for a life where dad comes home from work and it’s all about dinner, baths, bible, and bed. Honestly Bobby never seemed like he liked Tori that much when they were dating - just needed a godly wife as he was graduating Christian college and needed sex and kids asap, any other godly woman would’ve fit the bill. I feel like the slog and exhaustion of kids is what keeps them going bc how much time is there to interact with each other - so the kids give him purpose/happiness. 

[andromeda331]

3 hours ago, cereality said:

5 yrs out of college for Bobby, 5 yrs married - so age 27 and damn he’s aged. He’s not aging as badly as Chad but he’s close. Granted some of it is that even 5 yrs ago it was clear he had the kind of hairline that’d recede. But I’m guessing having 4 kids in 5 yrs on an office manager’s salary (I know Kelton has given him a fancier title but essentially that’s what he is) is the source of some stress. But hey their precious family has just begun per their anniversary post - so bring on another 5 kids.

At least they both appear content with their lives, mind blowing as it would be for normal 26-27 yr olds to have 4 kids under 4. None of Carlin/Evan/Whit’s woohoo party party, acting like they missed out on their 20s. These two seem wired for a life where dad comes home from work and it’s all about dinner, baths, bible, and bed. Honestly Bobby never seemed like he liked Tori that much when they were dating - just needed a godly wife as he was graduating Christian college and needed sex and kids asap, any other godly woman would’ve fit the bill. I feel like the slog and exhaustion of kids is what keeps them going bc how much time is there to interact with each other - so the kids give him purpose/happiness. 

I often wonder if Bobby wishes he looked around more then just picked Tori. He never seemed like he was ever that into her and after marriage working with Kelton seemed to be the only bright spot in his life. It's probably Kelton and the kids now. He might actually be happy had he done that. 

[ozziemom]

Tori seems to have grown up in a way that Carlin hasn’t. Back on the TV show Tori was as loud and obnoxious as Carlin but the little we see of her now, she’s more like Erin or Michael. Maybe she really hated the attention being on her? And now she & Bobby have settled into a life that suits them both together.

[Heathen]

9 hours ago, cereality said:

5 yrs out of college for Bobby, 5 yrs married - so age 27 and damn he’s aged. He’s not aging as badly as Chad but he’s close. Granted some of it is that even 5 yrs ago it was clear he had the kind of hairline that’d recede. But I’m guessing having 4 kids in 5 yrs on an office manager’s salary (I know Kelton has given him a fancier title but essentially that’s what he is) is the source of some stress. But hey their precious family has just begun per their anniversary post - so bring on another 5 kids.

At least they both appear content with their lives, mind blowing as it would be for normal 26-27 yr olds to have 4 kids under 4. None of Carlin/Evan/Whit’s woohoo party party, acting like they missed out on their 20s. These two seem wired for a life where dad comes home from work and it’s all about dinner, baths, bible, and bed. Honestly Bobby never seemed like he liked Tori that much when they were dating - just needed a godly wife as he was graduating Christian college and needed sex and kids asap, any other godly woman would’ve fit the bill. I feel like the slog and exhaustion of kids is what keeps them going bc how much time is there to interact with each other - so the kids give him purpose/happiness. 

I think some of Bobby's aging is his long, thin face. He looks like Randy Travis to me, and RT looked older even when he was in his twenties. 

But yeah, four kids in less than four years would do me in. 

[BitterApple]

Bobby looked like he was regretting his life choices not too long ago, so either Tori settled down or he's resigned himself to making the best of things. 

I'm a little surprised he's onboard with "leaving it up to the Lord" when it comes to family size, though. By all appearances, he grew up comfortably. Does he really want to go the Chad and Erin route where he's stacking kids up in a starter home like cord wood? Kelton did him a solid by giving him a job, so as long as Tennessee Standard stays booming, he'll at least have a steady paycheck. 

[cereality]

Agreed as opposed to Chad he is better off in that he’ll have a steady paycheck, but the reality is that Kelton can’t (or won’t) pay his office manager 100-200k just bc that’s how his best friend was accustomed to living. By the looks of the Smiths’ home, it is pretty clear that he grew up with a dad making six figures+ which goes pretty far with only 3 kids. His sister has even mentioned before that their dad is a great investor and taught her - yet I’m pretty sure Bobby isn’t in a situation where he’s got a fully funded corporate 401k, nor in a situation where he can be like - eh we have 5k in savings just sitting around at yr end, let’s throw that in the S&P. His situation is 4 kids in a 3 bedroom house with more kids coming most likely.

Wonder if he regrets that his wife is the fertile myrtle of the Bates; easier to talk the talk of - as many as god gives us - when your wife has high risk pregnancies or can’t get pregnant so in your heart of hearts you know you’ll max out at 0-6 kids. I don’t think we’ve heard that Tori even has the clotting issues of her sisters (maybe?), doesn’t seem like getting to 10 kids will be any problem.

I have to imagine in his private moments he does regret rushing to marry Tori. I mean thankfully for him he loves dad life + Tori has calmed down now that she’s not around Carlin (bc when he was courting he appeared to actively dislike her - remember the engagement, he looked like he wanted to drive away and his parents would’ve been like yep let’s go we’ll drive you). But at the end of the day she is still dumb and uneducated, what is there really to talk about besides who needs a diaper or church? This isn’t a girl who even knows what an investment is. It was super obvious to everyone (including his parents - who still appear not to like Tori nor their life and in turn we’ve seen Tori just pretends they’re not there) that he was rushing in bc omg SEX, WIFE. He just needed to marry, bestie Kelton had a godly girl w 87 sisters, great go w one of them and live life with bestie Kelton. Don’t think he calculated that he’s w Kelton from 9-5, 5-9 daily + weekends is gonna be with the wife not Kelton who has his own family, extended family etc.

[3 is enough]

Tori does have the clotting issue. It wasn't apparent until her second pregnancy.

[Heathen]

2 hours ago, 3 is enough said:

Tori does have the clotting issue. It wasn't apparent until her second pregnancy.

It hasn't slowed her rate of reproducing, though. 

Edited December 19, 2022 by Heathen

[Salacious Kitty]

6 minutes ago, Heathen said:

It hasn't slowed her rate of reproducing, though. 

Didn't stop Erin either, until she had other health issues. Tori will probably be pregnant by the end of the year, if she isn't already. 🙄

[Heathen]

2 hours ago, cereality said:

Agreed as opposed to Chad he is better off in that he’ll have a steady paycheck, but the reality is that Kelton can’t (or won’t) pay his office manager 100-200k just bc that’s how his best friend was accustomed to living. By the looks of the Smiths’ home, it is pretty clear that he grew up with a dad making six figures+ which goes pretty far with only 3 kids. His sister has even mentioned before that their dad is a great investor and taught her - yet I’m pretty sure Bobby isn’t in a situation where he’s got a fully funded corporate 401k, nor in a situation where he can be like - eh we have 5k in savings just sitting around at yr end, let’s throw that in the S&P. His situation is 4 kids in a 3 bedroom house with more kids coming most likely.

Wonder if he regrets that his wife is the fertile myrtle of the Bates; easier to talk the talk of - as many as god gives us - when your wife has high risk pregnancies or can’t get pregnant so in your heart of hearts you know you’ll max out at 0-6 kids. I don’t think we’ve heard that Tori even has the clotting issues of her sisters (maybe?), doesn’t seem like getting to 10 kids will be any problem.

I have to imagine in his private moments he does regret rushing to marry Tori. I mean thankfully for him he loves dad life + Tori has calmed down now that she’s not around Carlin (bc when he was courting he appeared to actively dislike her - remember the engagement, he looked like he wanted to drive away and his parents would’ve been like yep let’s go we’ll drive you). But at the end of the day she is still dumb and uneducated, what is there really to talk about besides who needs a diaper or church? This isn’t a girl who even knows what an investment is. It was super obvious to everyone (including his parents - who still appear not to like Tori nor their life and in turn we’ve seen Tori just pretends they’re not there) that he was rushing in bc omg SEX, WIFE. He just needed to marry, bestie Kelton had a godly girl w 87 sisters, great go w one of them and live life with bestie Kelton. Don’t think he calculated that he’s w Kelton from 9-5, 5-9 daily + weekends is gonna be with the wife not Kelton who has his own family, extended family etc.

I didn't really follow the Bateses when the Smiths were courting. Was Tori as over-the-top, attention-whoring, irritating as Carlin? What changed besides kids? 

I don't understand why Bobby doesn't go the vocational route like Kelton. It would give him something else in common with Kelton, plus his office pay isn't going to support 16 kids, or however many Tori ends up having. Unless Kelton overpays him to keep the Smith kids from living in Bates-style poverty. 

11 minutes ago, Salacious Kitty said:

Didn't stop Erin either, until she had other health issues. Tori will probably be pregnant by the end of the year, if she isn't already. 🙄

It did stop Erin. She had three miscarriages in short order before Carson. 🙄

[Salacious Kitty]

Tori was horrible when they were courting. The thing I remember most was her clamoring for the ring. Bobby's parents seemed particularly irritated.

[ozziemom]

1 hour ago, Salacious Kitty said:

Tori was horrible when they were courting. The thing I remember most was her clamoring for the ring. Bobby's parents seemed particularly irritated.

Wasn’t KJ just as bad about the ring? It was annoying. Tori and Carlin always seemed to be paired up on the couch for TV questions on BUB. Both loud and totally dumb acting, like Carlin is now, just with Evan instead of Tori.

[cereality]

1 hour ago, ozziemom said:

Wasn’t KJ just as bad about the ring? It was annoying. Tori and Carlin always seemed to be paired up on the couch for TV questions on BUB. Both loud and totally dumb acting, like Carlin is now, just with Evan instead of Tori.

KJ was awful about the ring and even moreso about him moving to Rocky Top. I think he had considered having Tori move down to Fla. or he considered moved to Tenn. after they were married - which was a whole 7 months after his graduation or 3 mos after engagement. So it's not like he was talking about being long distance for 5 more yrs. Kelly went on and on about having him move to Tenn RIGHT AWAY after graduation - I mean she needed this $hit locked down ASAP. And then was like oh you're gonna be at our house all the time anyway, you don't need an apt [lest he or his parents say no I need to build up my savings for a few months pre marriage so I can't move], we have a sweet friend from church with a trailer. I mean the trailer stood in the middle of some field, pitch black to get to after dark bc it wasn't parked at a house or RV park, but Kelly and Tori "convinced/bullied" Bobby into saying yep this is great. I mean Bobby at that point was only thinking with his pants.

When his parents showed up to move him in they looked pissed. Like turned off by their son's decision in that - we didn't raise you to marry a country hick and go live in a trailer. And even when they visited G/K's home they looked like they couldn't wait to leave with feral Jeb/Jud/grandkids running all over, the general sty of a house that G/K keep etc. They were similarly displeased at the wedding - esp when Tori stopped the ceremony for like 5 min bc she got the giggles when saying the vows??! Will never forget after the ceremony they asked his parents how they felt or something and Bobby's dad goes "well he got hitched." It was the type of emotion that you have when you go to a coworker's wedding out of obligation and you see it as a - well it's a night out and dinner/cake; most certainly is NOT the reaction that people have when their oldest child gets married.

But his parents have never been impressed with her or her family. For the engagement, Bobby proposed someplace in the NC mountains, like a 2-3 hr drive away. He made the mistake of having his parents ride in the car with him and Tori, having made obvious to Tori that this was the engagement trip. Kid you not she acted like a 5 yr old the entire day - "are you gonna propose now" "now?" "now?" "where is the ring" "is it in this pocket" "is it in this jacket?" I mean at one point his dad sarcastically said something like "do you get the concept of - need to know?" and it went over dumb Tori's head and she didn't shut up. And uh Tori did you WANT him to propose when he stopped to pump gas on the way into the mountains or while parking the car to hike up the mountain or when chowing down on a sandwich?

As with all engagements, Kelly and groom's mom went to "decorate" the proposal spot and Bobby's mom was trying to figure out where to hide the ring so that when Bobby arrived, he'd find it ASAP - poor woman looked like she wanted to throw the ring over the scenic mountain overlook so he couldn't propose. And again post engagement they asked the parents how they felt and again dad says something like - "well it's not every family he could marry into and get 20 inlaws" - lol. Yeah they don't like her. And even now, in the 1-2 visits we've seen, Tori basically doesn't speak to them, they basically stay out of Bobby and Tori's way, frankly Bobby just hangs with Tori - not even including his parents or encouraging the grandkids to go to his parents, and they basically try to engage their grandkids here or there.

[ozziemom]

49 minutes ago, cereality said:

KJ was awful about the ring and even moreso about him moving to Rocky Top. I think he had considered having Tori move down to Fla. or he considered moved to Tenn. after they were married - which was a whole 7 months after his graduation or 3 mos after engagement. So it's not like he was talking about being long distance for 5 more yrs. Kelly went on and on about having him move to Tenn RIGHT AWAY after graduation - I mean she needed this $hit locked down ASAP. And then was like oh you're gonna be at our house all the time anyway, you don't need an apt [lest he or his parents say no I need to build up my savings for a few months pre marriage so I can't move], we have a sweet friend from church with a trailer. I mean the trailer stood in the middle of some field, pitch black to get to after dark bc it wasn't parked at a house or RV park, but Kelly and Tori "convinced/bullied" Bobby into saying yep this is great. I mean Bobby at that point was only thinking with his pants.

When his parents showed up to move him in they looked pissed. Like turned off by their son's decision in that - we didn't raise you to marry a country hick and go live in a trailer. And even when they visited G/K's home they looked like they couldn't wait to leave with feral Jeb/Jud/grandkids running all over, the general sty of a house that G/K keep etc. They were similarly displeased at the wedding - esp when Tori stopped the ceremony for like 5 min bc she got the giggles when saying the vows??! Will never forget after the ceremony they asked his parents how they felt or something and Bobby's dad goes "well he got hitched." It was the type of emotion that you have when you go to a coworker's wedding out of obligation and you see it as a - well it's a night out and dinner/cake; most certainly is NOT the reaction that people have when their oldest child gets married.

But his parents have never been impressed with her or her family. For the engagement, Bobby proposed someplace in the NC mountains, like a 2-3 hr drive away. He made the mistake of having his parents ride in the car with him and Tori, having made obvious to Tori that this was the engagement trip. Kid you not she acted like a 5 yr old the entire day - "are you gonna propose now" "now?" "now?" "where is the ring" "is it in this pocket" "is it in this jacket?" I mean at one point his dad sarcastically said something like "do you get the concept of - need to know?" and it went over dumb Tori's head and she didn't shut up. And uh Tori did you WANT him to propose when he stopped to pump gas on the way into the mountains or while parking the car to hike up the mountain or when chowing down on a sandwich?

As with all engagements, Kelly and groom's mom went to "decorate" the proposal spot and Bobby's mom was trying to figure out where to hide the ring so that when Bobby arrived, he'd find it ASAP - poor woman looked like she wanted to throw the ring over the scenic mountain overlook so he couldn't propose. And again post engagement they asked the parents how they felt and again dad says something like - "well it's not every family he could marry into and get 20 inlaws" - lol. Yeah they don't like her. And even now, in the 1-2 visits we've seen, Tori basically doesn't speak to them, they basically stay out of Bobby and Tori's way, frankly Bobby just hangs with Tori - not even including his parents or encouraging the grandkids to go to his parents, and they basically try to engage their grandkids here or there.

Oh I had forgotten all that! That was so ridiculous, KJ at her most obnoxious.

[Heathen]

1 hour ago, cereality said:

KJ was awful about the ring and even moreso about him moving to Rocky Top. I think he had considered having Tori move down to Fla. or he considered moved to Tenn. after they were married - which was a whole 7 months after his graduation or 3 mos after engagement. So it's not like he was talking about being long distance for 5 more yrs. Kelly went on and on about having him move to Tenn RIGHT AWAY after graduation - I mean she needed this $hit locked down ASAP. And then was like oh you're gonna be at our house all the time anyway, you don't need an apt [lest he or his parents say no I need to build up my savings for a few months pre marriage so I can't move], we have a sweet friend from church with a trailer. I mean the trailer stood in the middle of some field, pitch black to get to after dark bc it wasn't parked at a house or RV park, but Kelly and Tori "convinced/bullied" Bobby into saying yep this is great. I mean Bobby at that point was only thinking with his pants.

When his parents showed up to move him in they looked pissed. Like turned off by their son's decision in that - we didn't raise you to marry a country hick and go live in a trailer. And even when they visited G/K's home they looked like they couldn't wait to leave with feral Jeb/Jud/grandkids running all over, the general sty of a house that G/K keep etc. They were similarly displeased at the wedding - esp when Tori stopped the ceremony for like 5 min bc she got the giggles when saying the vows??! Will never forget after the ceremony they asked his parents how they felt or something and Bobby's dad goes "well he got hitched." It was the type of emotion that you have when you go to a coworker's wedding out of obligation and you see it as a - well it's a night out and dinner/cake; most certainly is NOT the reaction that people have when their oldest child gets married.

But his parents have never been impressed with her or her family. For the engagement, Bobby proposed someplace in the NC mountains, like a 2-3 hr drive away. He made the mistake of having his parents ride in the car with him and Tori, having made obvious to Tori that this was the engagement trip. Kid you not she acted like a 5 yr old the entire day - "are you gonna propose now" "now?" "now?" "where is the ring" "is it in this pocket" "is it in this jacket?" I mean at one point his dad sarcastically said something like "do you get the concept of - need to know?" and it went over dumb Tori's head and she didn't shut up. And uh Tori did you WANT him to propose when he stopped to pump gas on the way into the mountains or while parking the car to hike up the mountain or when chowing down on a sandwich?

As with all engagements, Kelly and groom's mom went to "decorate" the proposal spot and Bobby's mom was trying to figure out where to hide the ring so that when Bobby arrived, he'd find it ASAP - poor woman looked like she wanted to throw the ring over the scenic mountain overlook so he couldn't propose. And again post engagement they asked the parents how they felt and again dad says something like - "well it's not every family he could marry into and get 20 inlaws" - lol. Yeah they don't like her. And even now, in the 1-2 visits we've seen, Tori basically doesn't speak to them, they basically stay out of Bobby and Tori's way, frankly Bobby just hangs with Tori - not even including his parents or encouraging the grandkids to go to his parents, and they basically try to engage their grandkids here or there.

That's a damn shame. The Smith grandparents are those kids' only chance to see how normal people live. 

Is the Kelly/Gil house really that bad? Like "white socks instantaneously turn brown" bad? Now I need to go clean something. 

[Meow Mix]

Kelly was obnoxious with every potential son in law demanding to know when they were going to lock it down.  I would have been mortified if my mother did that.  She made her daughters look like used cars she was trying to get off the lot before the wheels fell off or something.  She started it with Michael really nagging Brandon to death.  

As for Tori, the biggest problem I had with her was her attitude at her shower.  She clearly didn't want the big shower that Kelly did, but instead of being an adult about it and either sucking it up or standing up to her mother to get what she wanted, she behaved horribly.  She showed up late, then sat there with a scowl on her face and refused to participate.  She had to open gifts and she just looked at each one and tossed it aside while Bobby tried to be gracious.  He should have called it off right there.

[BitterApple]

2 hours ago, Meow Mix said:

 

As for Tori, the biggest problem I had with her was her attitude at her shower.  She clearly didn't want the big shower that Kelly did, but instead of being an adult about it and either sucking it up or standing up to her mother to get what she wanted, she behaved horribly.  She showed up late, then sat there with a scowl on her face and refused to participate.  She had to open gifts and she just looked at each one and tossed it aside while Bobby tried to be gracious.  He should have called it off right there.

Tori was absolutely horrid. I get that not all women are into the bridal circus, but showers are de rigueur. She could've sucked it up to make her mother happy, not to mention she's the one benefitting at the end of the day. 

[andromeda331]

3 hours ago, Meow Mix said:

Kelly was obnoxious with every potential son in law demanding to know when they were going to lock it down.  I would have been mortified if my mother did that.  She made her daughters look like used cars she was trying to get off the lot before the wheels fell off or something.  She started it with Michael really nagging Brandon to death.  

Yeah, she was really horrible nagging Brandon too. Even though they were courting and Brandon had to wait first because of some class he was taking in Texas and after that he wanted to wait a little longer to save up some money for marriage. Kelly of course had no understanding of that. 

[cereality]

I actually have no recollection of their wedding shower, but I do remember Tori's awful behavior in wedding planning and at the wedding itself. But if she behaved that way at the shower too, damn she went out of her way to alienate her MIL, who I imagine was attending, starting day one.

She was ATROCIOUS re wedding planning. They met with the aunt who makes all their cakes [I think for free as a wedding present] and the aunt was asking questions about what they liked and Tori was basically like IDGAF, who cares, this is stupid - like a 4 yr old brat. Way to be gracious to this aunt who is doing the hard work to gift you a cake for free that your cheapskate daddy would otherwise have to pay $500+. Seriously how hard is it to say - we like vanilla or chocolate, we like fruit in a cake or no fruit, flowers/no flowers for decor - just to give some ideas. It's even ok if you have no idea but politely just say - we don't know what we want, what do you recommend/what's popular and let the aunt ask questions to figure out what you'd like.

And then at the wedding reception, she literally said to Bobby every 5 seconds - can we go, ok let's go, are you ready, let's go, let's go, let's go, are you ready, let's get out of here. At one point she was tugging on his suit sleeve like a toddler. I though the virgin GROOM was supposed to be the horny one needing to get it on RIGHT NOW, while the bride was supposed to be more discrete and slow it down so guests wouldn't think OMG they're leaving ASAP bc SEX. IIRC their reception was just cake/punch not a meal, so as soon as the cake was cut, it was - obligation over. Meanwhile Bobby was the one trying to be gracious, shake some hands and greet as many guests as possible. It's like you're 21-22, not a toddler, do you really not understand that Bobby's family and school friends have flown from Fla, your own grandparents had to haul ass from the Carolinas, the gracious thing would be to spend a few minutes with each of them??

Her bratty behavior is the product of - G&K's brainwashing OMG if you have a vag of course you MUST DREAM about your wedding day [I mean Alyssa smiles proudly already when her girls play wedding]. Like NO not every woman cares about weddings. Yet of course they are allowed to have no personality and no original thoughts. In the real world Tori and Bobby would've been the couple that would've just done a destination wedding - even on the beach in Fla - where she'd just buy a dress and otherwise they'd pick a wedding package offered by a hotel and whatever flowers/cakes/etc. went with that and be done.

[Heathen]

2 hours ago, BitterApple said:

Tori was absolutely horrid. I get that not all women are into the bridal circus, but showers are de rigueur. She could've sucked it up to make her mother happy, not to mention she's the one benefitting at the end of the day. 

I have to say, Eff Kelly. It's not Tori's or anyone else's job to make Kelly happy, not to mention Kelly and her idiot husband pimped out their children for cash and fame. Kelly should have been working to make Tori happy. 

[andromeda331]

18 hours ago, Heathen said:

I have to say, Eff Kelly. It's not Tori's or anyone else's job to make Kelly happy, not to mention Kelly and her idiot husband pimped out their children for cash and fame. Kelly should have been working to make Tori happy. 

I agree. I hated how Tori behaved but if she didn't want a shower or any of the wedding stuff they should have respected Tori's wishes. Also, my parents deserved it by being great parents and sucking it up for me on things they didn't want to do but did so for me as I did for them. Kelly has never done anything to deserve any of her kids sucking it up for. She's been a horrible mother all there lives making her daughters especially Michael do all of the work of raising, educating, and taking care of Kelly's kids. They cooked the meals, did the laundry all while Kelly did absolutely nothing. Everything in Kelly's live as been to do what Kelly wants and to make her happy. She didn't want to raise her kids. So she didn't.  She didn't want to cook or clean she didn't. She didn't want to educate her kids. She didn't. She wanted her daughters to dress a certain way. They did. She wanted them to court and marry anyone who came by. They did. Tori wanted to wait until she graduated college to marry. Kelly didn't and got her way. Katie wanted to be a nurse. She suddenly changed her mind. When Alyssa had surgery Kelly didn't stick around to help at all. When any of her children had their first grandchild, again she didn't stick around to help. She didn't even return home when her two youngest sons set their laundry room on fire, nor did she even bother to make sure they were properly looked after. Kelly takes advantage of Chad's skill for free work. Kelly uses her sisters for wedding cakes and flowers. She used and still uses Michael to do whatever Kelly wants. When has Kelly ever sucked it up for any of her kids? 

 

[Meow Mix]

@andromeda331I agree completely.  My problem with Tori's behavior was that other people got hurt or were made uncomfortable in the process.  I couldn't care less how Kelly felt about any of this, but my guess is that she was totally oblivious as usual.  

[zenme]

With 5 million kids and counting, teaching then manners and how to be decent human beings is, I guess, asking too much. Why have that many if you’re not gonna raise them properly?

[cereality]

Funny how we rarely see Bobby or Tori, yet on an IG posted by Law you can hear Gil saying “anyone else, Bob?” and you can hear Bobby clear as day saying “when I met Tori I was startled to learn she had another boyfriend.” I imagine it was one of those, let’s sit in a circle and discuss how our relationships are the BEST ever for the zillionth time. Just think it’s funny that these people are 28, married for 5 yrs and all there is ever to talk about is reminiscing about courting, weddings etc. Sure people look back sometimes but most 28 yr olds are more excited to talk about vacations, new job opportunities, potential moves they’d like to make etc rather than just thinking about how putting a ring on it and having punch and cake was the high point of life.

[Salacious Kitty]

26 minutes ago, cereality said:

Funny how we rarely see Bobby or Tori, yet on an IG posted by Law you can hear Gil saying “anyone else, Bob?” and you can hear Bobby clear as day saying “when I met Tori I was startled to learn she had another boyfriend.” I imagine it was one of those, let’s sit in a circle and discuss how our relationships are the BEST ever for the zillionth time. Just think it’s funny that these people are 28, married for 5 yrs and all there is ever to talk about is reminiscing about courting, weddings etc. Sure people look back sometimes but most 28 yr olds are more excited to talk about vacations, new job opportunities, potential moves they’d like to make etc rather than just thinking about how putting a ring on it and having punch and cake was the high point of life.

Tori is due for another pregnancy. Let's see if she avoids the cameras in SC. 

[floridamom]

I agree that most married 28 year olds look forward to their future. They don't look back yet as their isn't that much "living" to look back on. In their circles, IMO, the highlights of life have already been accomplished with courting, wedding, babies. Done, done and done. How sad, really.

[JAYJAY1979]

With the show long gone.. but recently watching sections of the show on Tubi... I finally came across the Tori engagement saga episodes this past week.

After reading in season 7 about how horribly she came across, I was expecting Carlin style dramatics.. and was surprised that it was the opposite of Carlin... and I think I find myself sympathizing with Tori in some cases.

From watching, I'm not sure if it was Tori's idea to move the wedding up to December.. or if it was UP Tv or Mama Kelly's idea, but I could tell it was going to be a disaster.  She was still in school so her mind wasn't going to be 100 % on the wedding.   So I'll break it down my thoughts based on some of the events.

Wedding Cake/Wedding dress:

Tori did state her wedding colors, what types of cake she wanted.. but I do think she could have just said chocolate or vanilla cake with a purple/lavender frosting. 

And I knew she had her heart set on wedding dress #1 because she was talking to the bridal lady Renee about a few alterations she wanted on the dress, yet Kelly/Carlin were trying to get her to do their preferred choice of wedding dress #2.   Thank gosh the bridal lady Renee kind of stepped in and backed up Tori's wish for wedding dress #1.  Also Alyssa/Whitney's both had a good suggestion to switch the color of the tuxedos for the men.

Wedding Shower:

After hearing Pious Erin's story about only 9 people showing up for her wedding show, I bet Tori was secretly hoping only 9 showed up to her party LOL.   Now everyone seemed to understand that Tori didn't really want the huge wedding shower nor to be center of attention... but Bridezilla Kelly just didn't care and put her daughter in a horrible position.   And if you don't suffer from anxiety, then you don't understand that you can't control how you act sometimes in those situations.

Bachelorette trip:

God Kelly was such a nag about wedding stuff non-stop when I think Tori wanted a few minutes to just enjoy the water and dolphins.  And Tori was very respectful with her wishes not to do the silver dollar painting and sat off with her phone in a comfy sofa with Kelly nagging her to come over and make new memories.  What I noted was Alyssa and Tori had a nice conversation about wedding registries, and Alyssa was low key and helpful with her advice on what to put on it.  

I can tell from watching the show that Kelly/Tori are not super close and that Tori/Gil are super close as father/daughter.  That's just my impression from watching these engagement episodes of Tori.

Edited July 24, 2023 by JAYJAY1979

[3 is enough]

So over on Reddit there is talk that the reason Tori and Bobby left Nashville and his ministry job is that he had some inappropriate relationships with some single moms at the church. A couple of posters who claimed to go to the church confirmed this, but of course I take this with a grain of salt.  However, it was brought up that the church’s Facebook page posted a nice welcoming message when he started, but no “sorry to see you go, you were great” post when he left, which they did for other departing ministers. 
 

I always assumed that Tori whined about missing home until Bobby eventually got so fed up he gave in, but this makes me wonder.  Also, their very minimal presence on social media could be partly due to keeping a low profile for possible damage control.

 

 

 

 

 

[cereality]

Been watching the whole thing play out on Reddit and wow - Tori must be stunned that all this came out. I mean they moved in March 2019 and while there was a reddit post buried someplace from 2 members of that church/school, no one made a big deal of it. So they could spin it as - oh we missed home, first kid, he needed to make $, wanted to work with bestie [though at that time it was bestie's uncle's co. bc Kelton didn't start his biz until almost a yr later] and all was forgotten . . . . 

I wonder who in the family knew. I assume G&K and she may have told Erin, but as of yesterday EVERYONE knows - Carlin, Katie, etc. and are all judging.

Does explain a lot. I mean he was NEVER interested in her, even a little bit; she was just loud and obnoxious and not his type when they were courting but he just needed to lock up a wife and was like NBD I'll just do life with bestie Kelton. He didn't consider that he wouldn't live with Kelton and Kelton would eventually be consumed by his own wife and fam and then when he was by himself with his annoying wife in Nashville, it took him all of 2 seconds to cheat. I question whether he hopped all the way in the sack with woman #2 of his life or if it was more getting way too friendly with the single moms, maybe some texts, maybe a kiss - and the church decided to nip it in the bud and "suggest" he move on.

Also explains why they have a baby yearly + Tori has calmed the hell down. I mean in this cult anything a man does is a woman's fault. So if he doesn't like loud and boisterous, you change. And a baby supposedly fixes all, give him a baby per year and he won't possibly stray. That worked out well for Joshie Duggar . . . though admittedly Bobby seems to really love dad life and Josh hated it; so maybe it is a joint decision that they'll get thru this marriage by having kids until Tori is in her 40s - meaning the last kid launches when they are in their 60s and life just goes by without them having to interact all that much with each other.

Also effed up that Gil recently preached a sermon about how men cheat with the ugly secretary at work despite having a beautiful wife bc the beautiful wife doesn't give them respect . . . . Way to blame your own daughter while defending your son in law. I don't believe G&K don't know - I have a feeling they go to G&K's church in huge part so Gil can keep an eye on Bobby and his interactions at church [bc at work he works with all men plus bestie Kelton is there to oversee him]. I feel like even amongst the other conservative siblings - Erin and Michael - they didn't attend daddy's church post marriage.

[BitterApple]

I saw the Reddit thread. I do think there's some sprinklings of truth to that rumor, and here's why:

They left Nashville after being there less than a year, with no real plan. In my experience, if one job isn't working out, you don't quit until you have something else lined up (especially with a wife and baby to support). Bobby's foray into plumbing felt desperate and rushed. His family is white collar and he doesn't strike me as the type who grew up working on cars and remodeling the kitchen with Dad. Attempting a trade is a pretty big course correction for a guy who studied finance. 

Tori is a miserable lifesuck. On the show, she constantly complained, emasculated Bobby, made unfavorable comparisons to her sisters' relationships, etc. Does that mean it's okay to cheat? No, but a guy desperate for some positive attention may start looking elsewhere. Which brings me to my next point:

Churches are notorious for these types of shenanigans. My FIL used to be an assistant pastor and my MIL told me women would flirt constantly, oftentimes right in front of her. To make matters worse, Bobby was a Youth Pastor which means lots of contact with moms and young women. 

I do agree with what some people commented on Reddit, that Bobby may not have had sex outside of his marriage, but perhaps some friendships were developing that were a bit too cozy and teetering on the edge of inappropriate. The fact that he didn't get any sort of good-bye party or well wishes is a huge tell. 

[GeeGolly]

Hmmm, that's a lot. So they were barely married and he was flirting around? Then he is a major, major, major scumbag in my book.

If its even close to true, too bad Tori didn't think she had the option to cut bait and run.

Of course maybe he was a big flirt in college with no intention of it going anywhere and he continued the same schtick at the church, but was too dumb to realize a married man flirting with married women is a whole different ball of wax, no matter if its 'innocent' or not.

[JAYJAY1979]

Emotional affairs are damaging.

I doubt they believe in marriage counseling because I'm sure both would benefit from it.

When looking at United Bates of America (original series)..Michaela was on an island of her own...while Erin, Alyssa and Tori were a trio...with Erin/Alyssa remarking how ditzy Tori was (i.e. mention was made at how inept she was in driving and following directions) and it seemed like a running joke (same with Erin and cooking).

I think Tori's place in the birth order amongst the girls was one of transition..between the responsible ones (Michaela, Erin, and Alyssa)..and the more care free daughters (Carlin, Josie, and Katie).  

Hearing this Reddit story..it makes sense why she hasn't gotten a YT channel..because less exposure means less chance of scandal coming out.

[AstridM]

3 hours ago, 3 is enough said:

So over on Reddit there is talk that the reason Tori and Bobby left Nashville and his ministry job is that he had some inappropriate relationships with some single moms at the church. A couple of posters who claimed to go to the church confirmed this, but of course I take this with a grain of salt.  However, it was brought up that the church’s Facebook page posted a nice welcoming message when he started, but no “sorry to see you go, you were great” post when he left, which they did for other departing ministers. 
 

I always assumed that Tori whined about missing home until Bobby eventually got so fed up he gave in, but this makes me wonder.  Also, their very minimal presence on social media could be partly due to keeping a low profile for possible damage control.

 

 

 

 

 

How did they define “inappropriate relationships?”

[3 is enough]

The original poster claimed to have gone to the school attached to the church. They claimed he was “ sleeping with single moms”. Another poster who claimed to be a church member said they could confirm the claim but added that it was really sad because he truly was great with the kids and doing his best to be a great youth minister.

Obviously the word of a couple of anonymous posters cannot be taken as proof, but his hasty departure combined  with the absence of any acknowledgement by the church points to something fishy. 
 

I tend to agree that he may not have actually slept with other women, but there may have been some flirting or emotional connections. 

[SMama]

When I clicked on this thread I was 100% certain it was a pregnancy announcement. Glad to be wrong. 

[Salacious Kitty]

Woah. I wonder how much truth there is to these rumors. 

[Heathen]

3 hours ago, BitterApple said:

I saw the Reddit thread. I do think there's some sprinklings of truth to that rumor, and here's why:

They left Nashville after being there less than a year, with no real plan. In my experience, if one job isn't working out, you don't quit until you have something else lined up (especially with a wife and baby to support). Bobby's foray into plumbing felt desperate and rushed. His family is white collar and he doesn't strike me as the type who grew up working on cars and remodeling the kitchen with Dad. Attempting a trade is a pretty big course correction for a guy who studied finance. 

These are fundies, though. They quit jobs -- decent jobs with health insurance -- to become "tree surgeons" when they decide they don't like having bosses. And that was with many children at home and no intention to ever prevent having more. In other words, fundies aren't known for thinking. I have always concluded that Tori couldn't handle being away from her idiot parents, and she talked Bobby into leaving Nashville. 

Bobby didn't study finance. He studied "Bible and youth ministry," which sounds like the fundie version of underwater basket weaving to me. Attempting any real job sounds like a big course correction for someone with Bobby's degree. 

1 hour ago, AstridM said:

How did they define “inappropriate relationships?”

For fundies, that could be anything from "talked to her alone after church" to "had a torrid years-long affair." 

This all needs to come with a boulder-sized grain of salt. 

[GeeGolly]

5 minutes ago, Heathen said:

For fundies, that could be anything from "talked to her alone after church" to "had a torrid years-long affair." 

This all needs to come with a boulder-sized grain of salt. 

It does seem odd he'd go from unmarried virgin, to married player.

I always figured they moved back home due to loneliness and money. It may have seemed abrupt to outsiders, but they might have been talking with the church for a while before they left.

I think Tori doesn't do SM because she's too lazy to learn more than how to do a post, they don't shill and (again) she's lazy as fuck. She has like 100 (4) kids under 5. She's probably lucky if she gets to shower a couple times a week.

[BitterApple]

Was it Kelton who studied finance? I could've sworn one of the two had some sort of business degree. 

[RebeccatheWriter]

8 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

Was it Kelton who studied finance? I could've sworn one of the two had some sort of business degree. 

Yes. He had plans to start his own plumbing business or take over his uncle's business. He learned how to be a plumber from family and then went to school to study business.

[AstridM]

1 hour ago, 3 is enough said:

The original poster claimed to have gone to the school attached to the church. They claimed he was “ sleeping with single moms”. Another poster who claimed to be a church member said they could confirm the claim but added that it was really sad because he truly was great with the kids and doing his best to be a great youth minister.

Obviously the word of a couple of anonymous posters cannot be taken as proof, but his hasty departure combined  with the absence of any acknowledgement by the church points to something fishy. 
 

I tend to agree that he may not have actually slept with other women, but there may have been some flirting or emotional connections. 

Flirting is COMPLETELY different from having sex, imho. 

[RebeccatheWriter]

I can't see Bobby becoming a person like Hugh Hefner with seven bleach blonde girlfriends. However, I do find the leaving the church to be suspicious. Even if he left voluntarily under less than ideal (no notice or in the middle of a busy time) way, churches typically (not always) announce the leaving of an employee and wish them well publicly. "The Lord has called Bobby and Tori Smith back to her home." However, that silence says something.

I could see him having a fling or even just spending too much time with one woman but not a slew of them. Fundy definitions of things are very odd.

I know that the narrative has changed that Tori was shy and hated the camera and that is why they did not appear on the show as much after they returned to Anderson County. However, that doesn't really fit with what we saw of Tori in previous shows, including 19 Kids and Counting, as well as United Bates of America and early seasons of Bringing Up Bates. If she was shy, she did a great job of hiding it for 10 or so years. Lazy and apathetic, yes, but not shy. 

[AstridM]

26 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

It does seem odd he'd go from unmarried virgin, to married player.

I always figured they moved back home due to loneliness and money. It may have seemed abrupt to outsiders, but they might have been talking with the church for a while before they left.

I think Tori doesn't do SM because she's too lazy to learn more than how to do a post, they don't shill and (again) she's lazy as fuck. She has like 100 (4) kids under 5. She's probably lucky if she gets to shower a couple times a week.

I’ll give her credit for not exploiting her young kids on SM for millions of complete strangers. 

[65mickey]

I remember that Bobby had some type of ministry degree. So when he left the church in Nashville Kelton gave him a job because he wasn't qualified to do anything else. The posters on Reddit are anonymous and in the past there have been posters who claim to have personal knowledge about the Bates and it turned out to be nothing. So unless someone comes forward who is willing to be named I am not so ready to buy into this.  But we'll see if anything comes of this.

[Salacious Kitty]

12 minutes ago, AstridM said:

Flirting is COMPLETELY different from having sex, imho. 

Not for fundies. Sin is sin is sin. 

[P2C2E]

36 minutes ago, AstridM said:

Flirting is COMPLETELY different from having sex, imho. 

Not for fundies, or even the conservative Christian church. Flirting is equal to cheating. They don't believe that men and women are capable of friendship. Any relationship with the opposite sex is inherently romantic and possibly sexual. 

[cereality]

Yeah I mean fundies are low self esteem weirdos - to them chatting with another woman = cheating. I mean Katie just said recently that she gets soooo jealous when other women DARE chat with HER man and she views it as "cheating" by Trav if he engages. You'd think she meant some woman at church is having a 20 min convo with Trav after services and Katie is getting huffy. Nope she meant if the drive thru girl at McDonalds or Sbux DARES to go beyond hi and gets into - what are you doing this weekend or nice weather huh, Katie will pull her hand up and be like UH I'm his WIFE🤣. You're in NJ babe, act like a bitch too often while showing up at the same Sbux daily and guess what someone will "accidentally" sneeze or spit in your coffee.

But in any event ever since he arrived on the scene I have NEVER understood why a guy like Bobby marries a girl he clearly does not like who clearly also did not like him/wasn't a good match and just saw him as a ticket out of G&K's house.

Only explanations I can come up with - either he was a massive dick at PCC [and there are Reddit ppl who say he was an entitled asshole in college] so he was having no luck with the ladies and needed Kelton to introduce him. OR he had zero self esteem and was hanging with Kelton 24-7 who has had his life planned out since prob 9th grade. So when Kelton was getting engaged etc, Bobby panicked and was like OMG what if I can't find anyone, introduce me to any of Josie's sisters, I don't care, I can learn to love her . . . .

Bc it isn't uncommon for conservative southern guys to be in Bobby's position. They don't want sex before marriage so they marry as quick as possible after college. If they aren't graduating with a gf/fiance but are religiously minded, they go on a 2 yr mission trip or take up a ministry job like Bobby did and while at said job, they focus hard on finding a wife. It isn't typically that hard bc everyone at church is dying to introduce their daughter/cousin/sister to the cute young single pastor.

After the gf/fiance is locked up, they then use their connections to lock up a business job - under the guise of look this job is great but I won't be able to support my wife and kids on this. Bobby's dad is in a business job, so he likely had connections there, plus would've made connections with church guys. Not saying they end up being Fortune 500 CEOs but the southern good ole boy network always lands these guys in respectable middle/upper middle class careers like insurance, sales for a regional company, commercial real estate etc. And then they move on - have a wedding, have 2 kids, volunteer at church, coach their son's football, watch football on the weekends with a beer in hand.

Like Bobby could've had a life he actually wanted with a wife he liked who liked him back!?

Edited September 1, 2023 by cereality

[AstridM]

32 minutes ago, cereality said:

You're in NJ babe, act like a bitch too often while showing up at the same Sbux daily and guess what someone will "accidentally" sneeze or spit in your coffee.

We can only hope!