S08.E03: The Long Night

[Bannon]

59 minutes ago, Friendly kitty said:

I don’t think Jaime still loves Cersei. I think he already understood that she does not love him and may never have loved him. So if she begins to weave intrigues and becomes the cause of killing many innocents, especially now, after the Great Battle, then Jaime can kill her. He used to kill for her, now he will stop her. The circle closes.

But the name of the song does not fall under this law of ownership. There are a lot of movie episodes that are called a line from a song...

But why did she kill herself so stupidly? I still understood if she would die for a just cause, fighting, fleeing from the dead ... And so it looked silly and strange.

She was ancient, supernatural cosmetic effects notwithstanding, and likely very, very, very, tired. Her life's work was finished, the battle won. Time to meet her God.

[Bannon]

Again, I want to watch the Ian McShane episode again, with it's theological (primarily dealing with the religion of Southern Westeros) themes, and it's role of setting The Hound more firmly on the path to redemption. The Hound, of course, along with Beric (Lord of Light worshipper) saved Arya (Many Faced God trainee), who in turned destroyed the NK, as Bran watched on, after warging around a bit. I may be nuts, but I suspect Bran is the key to uniting all these people and their conflicting religions. Makes me think more about the corrupt (under a thick veneer of faux piousness) High Sparrow story arc, which to me was always a fascinating subplot. 

There's a chance these writers are going to accomplish something special in these last 3 episodes. That's my hope, anyways.

[tv-talk]

4 hours ago, Oscirus said:

Im a bit numb about the Arya killing the nightwalker thing. I guess its fine but eh, this era of subverting expectations is taking it's toll on the stories of today.

What were the expectations? That Jon kill him? Meh. It's gotten pretty ridiculous with Jon waltzing thru thousands of undead enemies like a walk in the park. At least Arya is a trained assassin with more skills than the rest of them combined. I dont think her killing NK was off at all as it was basically established that with the right weapon the undead disintegrate. From the beginning Arya was all about Needle and the Water Dance, no she isnt a hulking knight but it's in character that she was able to take out so many undead and the NK himself- she's like a fencer and given it just takes one cut to kill them it made sense.

[Bali]

3 hours ago, LadyPenelope said:

Cersei was absolutely right to sit this one out. Now the WW are gone, and her enemy’s army is vastly depleted. However, the decision did cost her Jaime, and that may be an even bigger loss than she currently realises if he comes back to kill her. I’m still assuming/hoping it will be him, although if we are talking about who deserves to kill her, the answer is clearly Tyrion. 

But was she right? Yes, her army is all fresh and new. But the North probably would have just stayed North if it weren't for her saying, "Sure I'll come help. Pysch" Now, the North is pissed again. And probably a bit cocky. I mean, they're gonna be all "We just defeated an army of reanimated corpses. You think you scare us now? Nothing is scarier than what we lived through. You are meaningless, Little Evil woman."

[mammaM]

11 hours ago, taurusrose said:

Who says Cersei was right?  I hope that hateful bitch gets the shock of her life when winter comes for her ass.

I should have said "seems right". Or at least in her mind, I can imagine her thinking, "see, they didn't need my army, they just wanted to weaken me". At one point I wanted NK to win, just to wipe the smirk off Cersei's face😂. 

I can't find where I read it, but I read a posting that said in season 1 it was mentioned that it took 4-6 weeks to get from Winterfell to King's Landing, and "our heros" should spend that time getting the word out that Queen Cersei wouldn't fight for her people, make her own army turn against her. Again, sorry for not finding the original post, but I think I could like that happening 😁

[tv-talk]

I really  hope the show stays true to what just happened and the North are now a bunch of raggedy-ass vagabonds and a gimpy dragon that couldnt last 3 days vs the might Cersei has assembled. She was right and has gained a massive advantage, someone will have to take her down from within.

[Bali]

1 hour ago, LadyPenelope said:

I agree that he still loves her and doesn’t want her dead. But I think thematically that him killing her and then dying himself makes sense - they were born together, they will die together. Killing the mad king was an act of heroism misconstrued by the world as something evil; it would be fitting if he killed the mad queen in an act that the world would see as heroic and he would feel to be his greatest tragedy. Plus I’m a romantic! 

I think a part of him will always love her. He has always known what she really is. But he's grown a bit and now wonders if what she is is an okay thing. I think that when he turned his back on her to fight alone, it hurt him deeply. Then there's this other woman that he has opened up to. She is noble and good. He may not love Brienne of Tarth, but he wishes that his Cersei could be that good. At some point in the next three episodes, he will finally realize that no, his Cersei will never be that good.

Also, I don't think Cersei was ever pregnant. I think she said that as a way to continue to control him. She didn't drink the wine Tyrion offered, because Poison is her favorite. She assumed he poisoned her glass. In the end, I would mind a Mags Bennett moment where she goes to pour herself a glass and someone is in there as she's drinking saying, "Oh, it was already in the glass." But I'm still hoping, "The North Remembers" is the last words she hears.

I'm a romantic too, but I guess I draw the line at banging your twin.

[Clanstarling]

3 hours ago, steelyis said:

If she had it coming then Tormund, The Hound and Jon Snow have it coming too. And unlike Melisandre none of them killed children, directly or indirectly, to help save the world. Killing Melisandre after the war would have been empty, petty revenge. It was time to let it go and move on.

Plus, I have a feeling Davos wouldn't have held Stannis accountable for his role in Shireen's death if he was still alive. And I'm not here for Davos constantly blaming Melisandre for Stannis's greed and weakness. It's the thing I hated most about Davos during that story line.

There's "after the war" and then there's "had some time to come down from the frenzy of the battle" after the war. I mean, it hadn't even been 24 hours. Give the man a minute. It's not like he raced after to her to cut her down before she essentially dissolved.

It was my take that Davos did indeed hold Stannis accountable, finally, when he burned Shireen, but it's a blur at this point.

[Drogo]

Arya to Tywin re: Harrenhal:  It wasn't just Aegon Targaryen- it was his sisters, too.  One of his sisters was a great warrior with a Valyrian Steel sword she called Dark Sister. 

A girl has a name, and they'll remember yours for centuries to come, Arya.  

[Bryce Lynch]

33 minutes ago, Clanstarling said:

There's "after the war" and then there's "had some time to come down from the frenzy of the battle" after the war. I mean, it hadn't even been 24 hours. Give the man a minute. It's not like he raced after to her to cut her down before she essentially dissolved.

It was my take that Davos did indeed hold Stannis accountable, finally, when he burned Shireen, but it's a blur at this point.

Stannis was already dead when Davos found Shireen's  pyre and the burnt stag toy he made for her.  I guess we will never know, but I think Davos would have killed Stannis, if Brienne had not already done her duty.   

It seemed like during and after the battle, Davos began to have mixed feelings towards Melisandre.   I don't think he could ever forgive her for what she did to Shireen.  But, he seemed to appreciate what she did to help win the battle as well as her raising Jon from the dead.   

Edited April 30, 2019 by Bryce Lynch

[tv-talk]

21 minutes ago, Bali said:

In the end, I would mind a Mags Bennett moment

Lowkey maybe best show ever and absolutely best series finale, appreciate the reference!

[GatorDeb]

On 4/28/2019 at 7:35 PM, Ottis said:

That was terrible. An hour of disappointment and “what the hell is happening?” followed by 10 minutes of “how long can we stretch this out” then about 10-15 minutes of good stuff with one nice moment (Theon) and one great moment (Arya). What a waste of a cast of characters. And the sneaking around stuff was stupid, in a battle against endless waves of dead. I know they used it to break up action but it should have been a long, frantic retreat. Also... go Lady Mormont. ADD: If the producers think Arya saving the day was “misdirection,” they are nuts. She had a secret anti dead weapon made, for crying out loud. 

She killed the NK with the dagger used in season 1 to try and kill Bran.

[terrymct]

14 hours ago, LadyChaos said:

Sansa was literally ORDERED by that KitN that she seems to value so much, to pick up arms and learn to fight.  Instead she disobeyed an direct order from her King, and decided that she could do what she wanted.   I bet she was wishing down in that crypt that she knew what to do with that dragon glass dagger.

Sansa is the Lady of Winterfell.  She spent the time organizing the practicalities of moving people into the castle and preparing for war.  That's where her skills are and she applied them.

This reminds me of a scene this week from another show called Billions.  The owner of an investment fund was talking to a firefighter who represented a union that had their retirement money with the investment fund.  The owner promised to be down in the trenches protecting the union's money.   The firefighter said that in a war there are different roles.  Someone in the trenches is looking through the sight of his or her weapon and has a very limited view of the battle.  There needs to be people up above the trenches who take more of a bird's eye view.  I see Sansa in this bird's eye view role related to logistics and practicalities.  

After some thought, I didn't see her actions in the crypt as cowardice either.  She was reacting to the shock of her ancestors reanimating and trying to kill her.  Quickly, though, she got past that...as did Tyrion.   They pulled out their daggers and got to business.  

[Bryce Lynch]

18 minutes ago, terrymct said:

Sansa is the Lady of Winterfell.  She spent the time organizing the practicalities of moving people into the castle and preparing for war.  That's where her skills are and she applied them.

This reminds me of a scene this week from another show called Billions.  The owner of an investment fund was talking to a firefighter who represented a union that had their retirement money with the investment fund.  The owner promised to be down in the trenches protecting the union's money.   The firefighter said that in a war there are different roles.  Someone in the trenches is looking through the sight of his or her weapon and has a very limited view of the battle.  There needs to be people up above the trenches who take more of a bird's eye view.  I see Sansa in this bird's eye view role related to logistics and practicalities.  

After some thought, I didn't see her actions in the crypt as cowardice either.  She was reacting to the shock of her ancestors reanimating and trying to kill her.  Quickly, though, she got past that...as did Tyrion.   They pulled out their daggers and got to business.  

I am by no means a Sansa basher, but compared to the other brave women, who fought in the battle, like Dany, Brienne, Lyanna Mormont, Alyss Karstark and of course her baby sister Arya, Sansa might come across as weak to the Northerners.  

She brings value in other ways, but the North values courage.  I think her status and influence might drop after the battle.  I don't think the Northern lords will murmur in support,  in the background, if Sansa publicly criticizes Dany or Jon again.  

[DesertCyclist]

26 minutes ago, terrymct said:

She was reacting to the shock of her ancestors reanimating and trying to kill her.

Is that what was happening?  I couldn't see shit.  The lighting was worse than any night scene in TWD.

[Bannon]

51 minutes ago, tv-talk said:

I really  hope the show stays true to what just happened and the North are now a bunch of raggedy-ass vagabonds and a gimpy dragon that couldnt last 3 days vs the might Cersei has assembled. She was right and has gained a massive advantage, someone will have to take her down from within.

The North has a highly trained assassin, who can quite likely easily pass through enemy lines, and assume the appearance of someone who is allowed to be close to Cersei, Quburn, the Commander of the G.C., etc.. Frankly, what the Winterfell survivors should do is send no ravens anywhere, allowing a rumor to spread that they all died, and send Arya south to KL, by quickest means possible, in the appearance of an elderly person. Upon getting to KL, she should take the face of a someone who will not look out of place near KL's leadership. Then wait. Meanwhile, assuming the dragon can still fly while it heals, Jon or Dany should fly nightime recon missions, for the purpose of locating Euron's fleet and the exact position and features of the G.C..

Cersei has large conventional military power, but her rule is extremely brittle, with no followers who have any loyalty to her beyond the short term transactional, and war is, in the end, an extension of politics. She is extremely vulnerable to a decapitation strike. 

[GodsBeloved]

31 minutes ago, Bryce Lynch said:

I am by no means a Sansa basher, but compared to the other brave women, who fought in the battle, like Dany, Brienne, Lyanna Mormont, Alyss Karstark and of course her baby sister Arya, Sansa might come across as weak to the Northerners.  

She brings value in other ways, but the North values courage.  I think her status and influence might drop after the battle.  I don't think the Northern lords will murmur in support,  in the background, if Sansa publicly criticizes Dany or Jon again.  

I never got the impression the North saw Sansa as less than/not courageous when they knew she didn't fight on the battle field at BoB so I'm not sure they will think less of her/value her less because she isn't Arya, Brienne, Lyanna Mormont, Alyss Karstark or Daenerys.

Edited April 30, 2019 by GodsBeloved

[Bannon]

The more I think about it, the more sense it makes for Arya to integrate herself into the G.C., and start assassinating their command structure. They are, in the end, mercenaries, and they will abandon Cersei if the cost of staying by her side becomes too chaotic.

Edited April 30, 2019 by Bannon

[paigow]

There is a theory that the timing of Arya in the library happened well before the Night King ever made it Bran - which gave her time to wait in a tree... This seems flawed to me...what better opportunity for a kill is there than the target facing a desperate Theon??

[Uncle JUICE]

Does anyone think we're done seeing Daario Nohaeris? Wasn't he affiliated with the golden company at one point? Also, I guess the show doesn't really have the history of the Golden Company from the books, I won't talk too in depth about it here, but it's not exactly a slam dunk alignment for Lannister goals. Spoiler below.

Spoiler

They were founded by a Targaryen bastard child. 

9 minutes ago, GodsBeloved said:

I never got the impression the North saw Sansa was less than/not courageous when they knew she didn't fight on the battle field at BoB so I'm not sure they will think less of her/value her less because she isn't Arya, Brienne, Lyanna Mormont, Alyss Karstark or Daenerys.

There's so few Northern lords left, they can't afford to start nitpicking nobility over who was where in the battle, as far as I can see. I kinda think no matter what Sansa did, people would find some fault in it. Cersei was in the Red Keep with poison and an executioner during the Blackwater Bay battle, she seems to have suffered no backlash from her loyalists. 

[MissLucas]

Sansa made sure Winterfell was a safe haven for all who managed to get there and provided food and shelter to all the refugees and reinforcements flocking to Winterfell. In other words she did exactly what the Lady of Winterfell had to do. Girlpower is great but I'm getting a bit tired of people overlooking that even tiny bears and assassins need food, shelter and awesome cloaks in order to kick ass at their best.

[Absurda]

I have no problem with Sansa being in the crypts.  She's not a fighter and doesn't need to be, as others have noted, she has her own very important skill set.  It just seemed like she was in full on pout mode while she was in the crypt which didn't look good on her.  Surely, she could have arranged for the people in the crypt to be doing something to take their minds off of what was happening.  Maybe preparing bandages for the wounded when it was over, mixing medicines, something? 

Regarding the dragons, I don't know if we've seen any indication that Rheagon is transferring loyalty from Dany to Jon.  They are both Dany's dragons, Rheagon is just on loan.

For Melissandre, to echo what she said about Beric:  The LOL kept her alive for a purpose.  She's fulfilled that purpose.

[Bryce Lynch]

20 minutes ago, GodsBeloved said:

I never got the impression the North saw Sansa as less than/not courageous when they knew she didn't fight on the battle field at BoB so I'm not sure they will think less of her/value her less because she isn't Arya, Brienne, Lyanna Mormont, Alyss Karstark or Daenerys.

I'm not saying they are going to hate Sansa or disrespect her.  But, I suspect her opinions are not going to carry as much weight as they did before, especially regarding Daenerys.   It's not so much that they are going to look down at Sansa as much as they are going to admire Dany, Arya, and Brienne more.   

[Bannon]

28 minutes ago, MissLucas said:

Sansa made sure Winterfell was a safe haven for all who managed to get there and provided food and shelter to all the refugees and reinforcements flocking to Winterfell. In other words she did exactly what the Lady of Winterfell had to do. Girlpower is great but I'm getting a bit tired of people overlooking that even tiny bears and assassins need food, shelter and awesome cloaks in order to kick ass at their best.

Absolutely. There is a cliche in military study; "Amateurs study strategy and tactics. Professionals study logistics".

Cliches quite often become cliches because they are true. The person who is ultimately responsible for logistic performance stands second to no leader in terms of military success or failure.

[Bryce Lynch]

25 minutes ago, MissLucas said:

Sansa made sure Winterfell was a safe haven for all who managed to get there and provided food and shelter to all the refugees and reinforcements flocking to Winterfell. In other words she did exactly what the Lady of Winterfell had to do. Girlpower is great but I'm getting a bit tired of people overlooking that even tiny bears and assassins need food, shelter and awesome cloaks in order to kick ass at their best.

So, Sansa did the grocery shopping, while Dany, Arya, Brienne, Lyanna and Alyss Karstark fought wight, White Walkers and the Night King. :)

I'm not saying Sansa wasn't valuable or that she is going to be seen as a coward, but I doubt the North will still see her on the same level as those great warrior women.   

She is sort of like Sam Tarly (though he at least tried to fight).  He has done crucial things behind the scenes without which the war could not have been won.  But, he is not going to be admired like Jon, and the others who fought better and more bravely.  

[Drogo]

19 minutes ago, Absurda said:

Regarding the dragons, I don't know if we've seen any indication that Rheagon is transferring loyalty from Dany to Jon.  They are both Dany's dragons, Rheagon is just on loan.

She should probably repossess Rhaegal and loan him to Arya instead. 

[VCRTracking]

15 minutes ago, taurusrose said:

Without Lyanna's sacrifice that giant would have done far more damage than he did, possibly bashing in the door to the crypt so that all those wights could get in and kill everybody holed up there; so don't down play the Little Bear's death. But I do agree with the part in bold.

Geez, aren't we tired of these facetious remarks yet?  If we're going to blame Jon for everything that goes wrong in Westeros, let's blame him for the NK even reappearing. Hell!  Why stop there?  Blame him for his father choosing his mother and producing him.

As someone has already pointed out, these people are in a fight for their lives not taking a leisurely walk through the park.  Each person had a job to do and babysitting each other wasn't part of it.

Yes.

I get the impression that the northerners show deference to Sansa because of who she is, not because they think she's particularly outstanding in any way.  My opinion of course.

To be honest, they'd probably feel that way about any lady head of a house, whether they were competent or not. Being an efficient administrator is an underappreciated job in any time or place.

Sansa's problem is she toots her own horn about it. She should be like Joan Holloway on Mad Men. To some she's just eyecandy, sashaying through the halls but she actually is a great office manager and keeps the agency running smoothly. She never brags about it(probably because she has other things like her looks to be proud of)The people who can see past that do know how invaluable she is at running the place and respect her.

I'm really glad it was actually a tiny minority blown up by Twitter outrage, because I really feel most people were like "YESSS!" when Arya had her moment.

'Game Of Thrones’: Who Called Arya Stark A ‘Mary Sue’? No One

Edited April 30, 2019 by VCRTracking

[Constantinople]

3 hours ago, kokapetl said:

Did Jon and Dany have a dragon collision due to low visibility? I couldn’t quite see.

Damn dragons need TCAS (traffic collision avoidance system)

Edited April 30, 2019 by Constantinople

[shrewd.buddha]

The characters seem to have developed much stronger plot armor ever since they ran out of the source material books. Now the writers appear to be factoring in fan appeal when deciding who dies - - in terms of how, when and with what degree of reverence. 

The Night King finally got beyond the Wall ... but was defeated at the first stop?!? 
After eight years of "Winter Is Coming" hype, I will be disappointed if the story goes back to the petty power struggles to decide who will sit on the Iron Throne. 
 

[Bryce Lynch]

11 minutes ago, shrewd.buddha said:

The characters seem to have developed much stronger plot armor ever since they ran out of the source material books. Now the writers appear to be factoring in fan appeal when deciding who dies - - in terms of how, when and with what degree of reverence. 

The Night King finally got beyond the Wall ... but was defeated at the first stop?!? 
After eight years of "Winter Is Coming" hype, I will be disappointed if the story goes back to the petty power struggles to decide who will sit on the Iron Throne. 
 

I think it might be more that certain characters have plot armor because they still have things they need to do.

Dany - must battle Cersei

Jon - must work out his Iron Throne claim situation and relationship with Dany, and probably fight Cersei, as well.

The Hound - Clegane Bowl

Arya - Scratch Cersei off her list or die trying?

Jaime - possibly killing Cersei, relationship with Brienne

I was a little surprised that they didn't kill off someone like Podrick or Brienne for heartbreak effect.  But I understand why most of the characters weren't killed.  

[Constantinople]

I think Melisandre may be one of a select club of characters to die or natural causes / old age:

• Hoster Tully (old age) (though he was more of a prop than a character since he only appeared as a corpse)
• Lyanna Stark (childbirth)
• Maester Aemon (old age)

Not sure if there are any others

[Drogo]

21 minutes ago, shrewd.buddha said:

After eight years of "Winter Is Coming" hype, I will be disappointed if the story goes back to the petty power struggles to decide who will sit on the Iron Throne. 

Winter came and left.  Well, the snow's still there at least. 

1 minute ago, Constantinople said:

I think Melisandre may be one of a select club of characters to die or natural causes / old age:

• Hoster Tully (old age) (though he was more of a prop than a character since he only appeared as a corpse)
• Lyanna Stark (childbirth)
• Maester Aemon (old age)

Not sure if there are any others

Viserys Targaryen had a sudden heart attack during his coronation.

[Uncle JUICE]

33 minutes ago, Constantinople said:

Damn dragons need TCAS (traffic collision avoidance system)

AVIATION BROS!

I think Rhaegal might even have needed T2CAS (traffic and terrain), the guy was scraping trees at one point. 

[Bannon]

11 minutes ago, Constantinople said:

I think Melisandre may be one of a select club of characters to die or natural causes / old age:

• Hoster Tully (old age) (though he was more of a prop than a character since he only appeared as a corpse)
• Lyanna Stark (childbirth)
• Maester Aemon (old age)

Not sure if there are any others

Janos Slynt died when Jon decided his insubordination act had become very, very, old....

.....I'm here all week...tip your bartenders and wait staff..try the veal...

[MissLucas]

38 minutes ago, Constantinople said:

Damn dragons need TCAS (traffic collision avoidance system)

I wanted to honor this with a screen cap shot of Davos trying his best at dragon air traffic control. But screen cap albums for this episode are more or less a collection of black thumbnails 😁

[Drogo]

2 minutes ago, Bannon said:

Janos Slynt died when Jon decided his insubordination act had become very, very, old....

The Tyrell family died from chronic inflammation. 

[Bannon]

6 minutes ago, Drogo said:

The Tyrell family died from chronic inflammation. 

Maybe Joffrey died because the Heimlich was never invented in Westeros.

[Bali]

4 minutes ago, Drogo said:

The Tyrell family died from chronic inflammation. 

Several died of an extremely high fever:

• Margery Tyrell    
• The High Sparrow
• Loras Tyrell
• Dickon Tarly
• Papa (Douche) Tarly
• Papa Tyrell
• All of those pesky slavers
• A whole buncha wights                                                                              

[Bryce Lynch]

2 hours ago, tv-talk said:

I really  hope the show stays true to what just happened and the North are now a bunch of raggedy-ass vagabonds and a gimpy dragon that couldnt last 3 days vs the might Cersei has assembled. She was right and has gained a massive advantage, someone will have to take her down from within.

While I agree that Cersei probably made the correct, pragmatic decision, given that she is determined to hold on to her stolen throne, and that the playing field has been leveled considerably, I think you probably underestimate what Dany has.

She has two full grown dragons, which could wipe out Cersei's 20,000 Golden Company troops (even if they had elephants).  She still has some Unsullied, and I wouldn't be surprised if we find that some of the Dothraki retreated from the battle in a different direction and will return to Winterfell.   I also suspect the North and many from other regions of Westeros will rally behind her.  

I think Cersei's main assets are her cunning, deceit and ruthlessness.  She might trick Dany, Tyirion, etc. again, though I doubt it.  More likely, she will use the innocent people of Kings Landing as human shields against Dany's dragons and count on her mercy to protect her.

Of course, in addition to the two dragons, Dany's side has an Arya, who can sneak behind enemy lines and finally scratch Cersei off her list.  

[Drogo]

7 minutes ago, Bannon said:

Maybe Joffrey died because the Heimlich was never invented in Westeros.

Alcohol poisoning. Tragic and so common. 

I heard Ned Stark developed a brain bleed. 

[Bannon]

3 hours ago, Bali said:

I think a part of him will always love her. He has always known what she really is. But he's grown a bit and now wonders if what she is is an okay thing. I think that when he turned his back on her to fight alone, it hurt him deeply. Then there's this other woman that he has opened up to. She is noble and good. He may not love Brienne of Tarth, but he wishes that his Cersei could be that good. At some point in the next three episodes, he will finally realize that no, his Cersei will never be that good.

Also, I don't think Cersei was ever pregnant. I think she said that as a way to continue to control him. She didn't drink the wine Tyrion offered, because Poison is her favorite. She assumed he poisoned her glass. In the end, I would mind a Mags Bennett moment where she goes to pour herself a glass and someone is in there as she's drinking saying, "Oh, it was already in the glass." But I'm still hoping, "The North Remembers" is the last words she hears.

I'm a romantic too, but I guess I draw the line at banging your twin.

(chanelling Monty Python tropes)

.....oh, let's not have an argument about who had extremely inappropriate intercourse with whom.....

[terrymct]

2 hours ago, DesertCyclist said:

Is that what was happening?  I couldn't see shit.  The lighting was worse than any night scene in TWD.

Yes, the bodies in the crypt boxes clawed their way out and came after the people hiding nearby.

When the episode started and it was dark, I paused the show and ran a color calibration on my TV I saw the various scenes just fine.  I have a flat screen that's about 5 years old.  If you watch the episode again, you might want to try that.

[Lady Iris]

15 hours ago, LadyChaos said:

Honestly, I think their battle tactic was to draw them in, then light the trenches, thinking the fire would keep them at bay.  I dont think they considered the the NK would have them fall on the fire so others could cross. 

That was a sneaky move!

[terrymct]

37 minutes ago, Drogo said:

Winter came and left.  Well, the snow's still there at least. 

Do we know for sure that winter has come and left?  There have been visions of snow in throne room at King's Landing.  The Night King might take advantage of the coming of winter rather than causing it himself.

[Delete]

On 4/28/2019 at 10:14 PM, Barbara Please said:

[BitterApple]

14 hours ago, Kate47 said:

I feel like, had they given Sansa a training scene, and had she managed to retain the knowledge in her first battle against the dead in the crypt, and had she managed to kill one or two dead Starks....

People would be crying out that she killed them too easily, that she's not a fighter, that she's a Sue.

It's literally a no win situation for her in the eyes of a lot of commenters, because Sansa is apparently terrible no matter what she does. 

I agree. I'm actually surprised to read so much criticism of Jon, Dany and Sansa because I thought they did everything they could under the circumstances. Dany and Jon used their WMD's to kill as many wights as possible, but they also knew the Night King had Viserion. It made sense for them to separate from the main action to try and eliminate that threat. 

As far as Sansa, she's not a trained soldier. I think the audience would've had an even bigger "Are you effing serious?" reaction if Sansa turned into G.I. Jane than if she did the sane (and smart) thing by hiding and living to fight another day. 

[Lady Iris]

Wait, so now the the NK is destroyed, the long winter is called off? Is that how this works? I always took Winter is Coming as a meteorological event. You know, its winter, its gonna be long. Like in Canada.

[FormerMod-a1]

2 minutes ago, Lady Iris said:

Wait, so now the the NK is destroyed, the long winter is called off? Is that how this works? I always took Winter is Coming as a meteorological event. You know, its winter, its gonna be long. Like in Canada.

I think the Night King makes winter worse and/or longer.  Although I've been confused on that, too.  DId he control the weather from beyond the wall?  It seems they've had bad winters before, even if it's been more than a few years, so was he doing that?  but it's been so long since the Night King and WW were around, and the wall built, that people didn't think they were real anymore.  So how all that works out, I don't know.  

[VCRTracking]

[Drogo]

3 minutes ago, Lady Iris said:

Wait, so now the the NK is destroyed, the long winter is called off? Is that how this works? I always took Winter is Coming as a meteorological event. You know, its winter, its gonna be long. Like in Canada.

Winter/weather will remain.  Winter/NK+AotD is over. 

They should really all head down to Highgarden for Winter, like how New Yorkers go to Florida for the season.  Not like anyone's using Highgarden, and it has the best lands.