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Felicity Smoak: Bitch With Wifi


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I have noticed the difference between "Am I just Oliver's love interest? Can I have a life outside of...?" and what they're actually selling us on the show. When I read that synopsis for Felicity's journey in season 3 it seemed more mopey, like her decision was taken away from her and now she's looking for an alternative. But the show is allowing me to see that even though Oliver (technically) ended it, she's walked away twice now. She's taking control of her life, making plans to live it and not holding back because of Oliver. It doesn't seem like she's thinking "Can that even happen?" as it seems she's saying "That is what I want and I'm going for it." Personally I love it and I've been crying for something similar to happen since season 2, when she told Barrles she spends all her time with Oliver. It actually seems, and someone has mentioned this, that

Sara's death

has affected her the most in terms of direction as a character and what she craves in her life. Lovin' it.

Edited by ArrowLimbo
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I'm not sure it was all that low-level either, but in any case, she clearly made enough of an impression on her colleagues that Oliver was pointed in her direction when he needed help.

 

I'm really excited to see what her new role is going to be at QC. It must be fancy, since Ray mentioned her high salary. I'm already salivating as I imagine all the new shoes she'll be able to buy.

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The question, really, is why Felicity needed Oliver and his work to inspire her in the first place.  She knows she's brilliant, and she has the academic credentials to back her up, so why was she working such a low-level job at QC in the first place?  I hope we'll find out a bit more in this regard in the upcoming Felicity episode.

I was at an alumni committee meeting Tuesday and this question came up.  The college is really hard to get into and everyone who made it in was at the top of their class.  One of the questions raised at the meeting was that why was it only men standing for governance positions when there were more women admitted than men?  There are various hypotheses but my guess is that even though women know they're very smart, most haven't been encouraged to take leadership roles or maybe to believe that they're worthy of them.

 

Which would be in keeping for someone like Felicity.  She had enough self-esteem and courage to get out of Las Vegas and into MIT, maybe with the encouragement of her teachers, but she doesn't think she's good enough to be management material.  

 

Maybe working for Ray will help her realize just how good she can be, and not just in terms of hacking.

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The question, really, is why Felicity needed Oliver and his work to inspire her in the first place.  She knows she's brilliant, and she has the academic credentials to back her up, so why was she working such a low-level job at QC in the first place?  I hope we'll find out a bit more in this regard in the upcoming Felicity episode.

 

Do you remember her speech in City of Blood last year? How she was telling Oliver how you can't just accept things in life? She said something along the lines of "If I'd accepted my life, then I would be a cocktail waitress in Vegas and I never would have gone to college, I never would moved miles away to work at Queen Consolidated. And I never would have believed some crazy guy in a hood could make me believe that I was just more than some IT girl."  Felicity's always had an awareness of how smart she is -- but maybe she was just never ambitious with those smarts. She never saw the scope of her talent until Oliver started asking her to do these crazy favors for him. 

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So, I absolutely loved all the interactions between Oliver and Felicity in 302. I think the conversation they had about dying was overdue. But at the same it's hard for me to reconcile the Felicity from 302 with s02's Felicity. I get that losing a close friend (I'll pretend the show actually bothered to develop Team Arrow's relationship with Sara) can remind a character of their own mortality. It's a common trope to use (though I usually see it being used to give characters a reason to bone). I knew Sara's murder to have that effect on Oliver (the show touched on that very well imo) but not on FELICITY of all people.

Her speech from 222(?) told us exactly what being on Team Arrow meant to her. Before that, she makes it explicitly clear that she understands and accepts that dying was a very real possibility. She didn't balk at being part of Oliver's loony plan to stop Slade even though she had no way of knowing that it would work or that Oliver would be able to save her. She was actually PROUD of getting shot. Not to mention her being willing to take a needle to the neck so Oliver wouldn't have to kill Count Vertigo. It's not even a time skip thing because, in 301, she wakes up bloody on the Foundry's exam table. So what changed?! When the hell did it change?

I kinda fanwanked in the 302 thread about the circumstances surrounding Sara's murder during forcing her to reevaluate but I don't think that completely explains it. I'm honestly trying to figure it out because if this is just about her mortality, it doesn't make much sense to me. Maybe it's because she lacks a support system outside of Team Arrow? Maybe it's more about Oliver/Diggle's mortality? That fits s02 Felicity. She cried for Moira who was mean as hell to her. She only knew/worked with Sara for a couple of months and she could barely keep it together. It's easy to imagine Oliver/Diggle being the next one lying dead on that table. At the moment, Felicity doesn't have anyone she could turn to after Sara or if it had been Oliver/Diggle. There doesn't seem to be anyone in her life who would notice, which is sad considering that that someone probably wouldn't even know the full story behind her sadness/grief. It's been obvious since s01 that Felicity is no island and nothing like the other people in/around Team Arrow. It's hard for her to put on a brave face and focus on the mission when something like this happens. If it was just about her own mortality, I think she would have quit Team Arrow or something. But that's not what happens. So I'm thinking it's a combo of the no support system/Team Arrow mortality thing. Maybe. I don't know...

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I get that losing a close friend (I'll pretend the show actually bothered to develop Team Arrow's relationship with Sara) can remind a character of their own mortality. It's a common trope to use (though I usually see it being used to give characters a reason to bone). I knew Sara's murder to have that effect on Oliver (the show touched on that very well imo) but not on FELICITY of all people.

 

On the one hand I understand what's driving her to look for more in her life but on the other had I don't, not if I think back at what drove Felicity to the team and kept her there. 

 

The Felicity I understood from seasons 1-2 would have been dedicated to finding Sara's killer, moved by her death, concerned about the team and Oliver's lack of obvious emotion, but I don't really know what Sara's death has to do with Felicity's life choices.  When Felicity cried about Moira, she was crying for Oliver but that didn't happen here.  It became about her which is good but also feels like it came from nowhere. Then again, I don't know much about her life, just that at one point she did say (maybe in a deleted scene so that might not count) that she felt at home in the Arrowcave.  

 

I'd understand if she was taking this new job because it's a good job that pays really well.  But her choice to work for Ray is now part of this angst about not wanting her life to pass her by and not wanting to die in the Arrowcave or something and that's the part I'm not completely sure about.  Ray offered to listen to her problems and I suppose that's not something Oliver is offering her because he's too busy being a leader, so maybe this is also the beginnings of her getting interested in Ray.  ls she still reeling because Oliver has backed off romantically and she doesn't want to deny herself happiness like he is?  Maybe she doesn't want to die violently like Sara did?  Except she was so proud to get her battle scar, her bullet wound, and to be a warrior in her own way like the rest of the team.  I don't know.  I usually have a tough time understanding why some of the events on the show are happening and what's generally motivating these characters, but it's the CW so I should probably lower my expectations.

 

The difficulty is that Felicity hasn't been given much of a life outside of the team, but now that the show is trying to give her one, it feels a little forced.  If I saw Felicity as dissatisfied with her life or the team or with Oliver for a few episodes, if I saw her question how much she's devoted her life to the team while not having a life of her own or enough money to make a life of her own, then I'd get that Sara's death was the straw that broke the camel's back.

 

I didn't see that initial frustration or her desire to want more or whatever is motivating her so it feels to me that they're forcing Sara's death to impact Felicity.  I like that she's making her own decisions and wanting more because frankly it makes completely sense for her to want to work for Ray (he's hot and smart and witty and I like their chemistry), but the show skipped a few steps that would have made this story work for me.  Arrow does like to skip ahead without the build up I'm used to or would want so it's nothing new.  However, it takes me out of the show. I'm all for Felicity getting a life but it's weird that Sara's death, which should affect Oliver and Laurel the most, seems to affect Felicity so much if not just as much as them when she doesn't have that history with this character.  I think I'd prefer it if someone in her life or her past shook her up this much.

Edited by Betweenthisandthat
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I'm pretty sure that Felicity's decision to go and work for Ray had less to do with Sara's death itself and more to do with Oliver's whole "I must be a feelingless robot and die young" shtick.  I wrote a post in the episode thread to this effect, which I won't re-hash here.

 

Bottom line, though, is that this show is rushing through too much story in too little time and not doing any of it justice.  Why they cram so much into every episode and refuse to deal with things properly, I don't know, but I think it confused the audience, who had a week's wait between episodes, rather than a few hours like the characters did, and so didn't necessarily take into account that what we're seeing is both the aftermath of Oliver & Felicity's romance ending and the aftermath of Sara's death.  One can't say that Felicity's reactions are just because of Sara or just because of Oliver, because everything happened at once, and I think it was all too much for her.  Which is fair enough.  It's all too much for me too.  Two thumbs down to the writers for pacing their story so terribly.

Edited by Ceylon5
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@KenyaJ, I would like to propose marriage to you and this post.

 

My personal headcanon about Felicity (insecurity and intimacy-aversion) also mean that she's really stretched herself out of her comfort zones, put herself so far out there with Oliver. And now she's reeling that back in, partially as a defense mechanism.

 

For a moment there, he had the ability to control or impact every area of her life. She took a shitty job that she hated because she was helping him to hopefully get his company back, at which point she'd work for him again. She worked for him on Arrow stuff, and as you said, he just proved that that work is done at his will. What social life she has seems to revolve around Team Arrow. And her romantic life presumably revolved around him too, once she'd let herself believe they might be together someday. At any moment, a decision from Oliver could seriously impact any one of those areas. And now I think she's taking the reins back in at least her professional life, because that's the one area that he can't be involved in anymore.

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I have a question guys. If it's obvious that Laurel won't tell Captain Lance about Sara anytime soon, do you think Felicity would? And if she does, would you be offended? Or would this negatively impact how you see her? 

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I was actually thinking about this earlier. My first reaction was it isn't her place (even though he needs to know). But I got to thinking about it from Lance's POV:  he knows Felicity works with Arrow + he knows his daughter works with Arrow = Felicity probably knows his daughter. He seems to have a good rapport with Felicity. Taking that into consideration, I wouldn't hate if Felicity told Lance. I also wouldn't hate if Arrow told Lance. I just think he needs to know and if Laurel won't tell him, someone needs too.

 

It certainly wouldn't make me hate her, but she has reached that level of favorite for me where everything is a little biased.

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I have a question guys. If it's obvious that Laurel won't tell Captain Lance about Sara anytime soon, do you think Felicity would? And if she does, would you be offended? Or would this negatively impact how you see her?

Considering that I'm furious at the idea that they hide his daughter's death from him, it certainly wouldn't impact negatively my view of her.

 

But I believe it would be OOC for Felicity to go to Quentin and tell him behind Laurel's back. If the character is still allowed to behave as she did for 2 season and not like a Pod People, she'd confront Laurel about it, and probably explain the many reasons why it's a terrible idea that can't possibly work on the long term; and convince Laurel to tell the truth. A bit like she did with Moira, but imo she wouldn't use the same kind of ultimatum. I believe that Felicity is very fond of Quentin and sees him a bit as a father figure, but she isn't unconditionally loyal to him as she is to Oliver. I don't see her intervening in the Lance family business unless she has no choice.

 

OTOH, if Quentin talks in front of Felicity about Sara, how he misses her, how he hopes she's happy and well and how he longs to see her again, I can't imagine that Felicity will be able to keep a poker face. I can't imagine that Lance won't understand what it means, and either get Felicity to confirm, either go to Laurel for confirmation. This would be 100% faithful to who Felicity is, and I think this would only make me love her more; and resent any character who might blame her or throw barware at her -just an example at random- for not shamelessly lying to Quentin's face.

Of course, it would mean that Quentin and Felicity could have scenes together again...but it isn't going to happen, is it? Too much father/daughter kind of chemistry there, I guess...*whistling*

Edited by Happy Harpy
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OTOH, if Quentin talks in front of Felicity about Sara, how he misses her, how he hopes she's happy and well and how he longs to see her again, I can't imagine that Felicity will be able to keep a poker face. I can't imagine that Lance won't understand what it means, and either get Felicity to confirm, either go to Laurel for confirmation. This would be 100% faithful to who Felicity is, and I think this would only make me love her more; and resent any character who might blame her or throw barware at her -just an example at random- for not shamelessly lying to Quentin's face.

Of course, it would mean that Quentin and Felicity could have scenes together again...but it isn't going to happen, is it? Too much father/daughter kind of chemistry there, I guess...*whistling*

This was actually the scenario I've been thinking of. I don't think Felicity would go out of her way to tell Quentin the truth, but if he's talking about Sara in front of Felicity, I can totally see Felicity burst at the seams... 

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Hmm. That's a good question. I'm assuming since Quentin wasn't at the secret funeral, Laurel told Team Arrow that she just couldn't tell her father, and explained WHY. So I'd expect everyone on Team Arrow to respect her choice, but also to keep prodding her to tell Quentin.

 

The other option for me would be everyone is assuming Laurel already told Lance, and so I could see either Arrow or Felicity accidentally spilling it.

 

But Felicity actively thinking Laurel is wrong and going to Quentin herself? I don't think that's happening. It's way  too much Felicity vs. Laurel antagonizing for this show to sustain.

Edited by dancingnancy
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Since I want Lance to adopt Felicity and be her dad, I'm all for her telling him about Sara. Basically, though, I don't care who tells him, even if it's Roy, the guy deserves to know and mourn his daughter.

LOL, I almost wrote the same thing! Er, actually, I was going to write that I wanted him to "disown Laurel and adopt Felicity instead", because I'm a petty and vindictive person.

Hey, maybe

Quentin will fall madly in love with Mommy Smoak?So much potential for fun.

Ah, but Arrow just does gloomy now.

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This reminds me of that interview with PB when he was asked who he would most like to grab lunch with (Laurel or Sara) and he choose Felicity.

 

I want more scenes between Lance and Felicity. Since Laurel is all ragey with revenge, I would like to see Felicity take Lance out to lunch. Just to check up on him.

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I think in this case I wouldn't approve of Felicity telling Quentin about Sara. I had no problems when she told Oliver Moira's secret about Malcolm Merlyn. It was something he needed to know not just as Oliver but also the Arrow. It was something that could impact Team Arrow. I don't see that in this case.

 

I do like the scenario upthread with Quentin mentioning Sara and Felicity looking stricken and Quentin putting two and two together. That way, no one has to actively spill secrets (stupid though they may be).

 

And yes to more Quentin/Felicity scenes. I love their chemistry and dynamic.

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Another one that loved the Quentin/Felicity dynamic.  They both really respected each other and their scenes were always so nice.  If she was very close to Quentin - maybe.  But just maybe.  I do think she would reiterate to Laurel that she should tell Quentin, but I don't see her going around Laurel to do so.  Especially since Laurel must have told them that he doesn't know because his health is too fragile.  I don't even like to think about it.  The writer's could definitely take the tarnish off Felicity by having her do that and Quentin dying.  (spits 3 times)

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Hey, maybe

Quentin will fall madly in love with Mommy Smoak?So much potential for fun.

Ah, but Arrow just does gloomy now.

Oh please god no, then Oliver would've essentially been with all of the Lance daughters (And yes, Oliver will be with Felicity at some point, it's glaringly obvious that he will). 

 

nope. No. Noooooo

Edited by wonderwall
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I hate the keeping Quentin in the dark storyline so much that no, I wouldn't judge her at all if she told him. But when Roy showed her the letter Thea left him, she specifically told him that Oliver needed to know and that he needed to hear it from Roy. So, I'm guessing she's out of the revealing other peoples' secrets business. But I think Quentin will find out by accident, either by Oliver or Felicity offering their condolences, thinking that Laurel had already told him.

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 But when Roy showed her the letter Thea left him, she specifically told him that Oliver needed to know and that he needed to hear it from Roy. So, I'm guessing she's out of the revealing other peoples' secrets business. But I think Quentin will find out by accident, either by Oliver or Felicity offering their condolences, thinking that Laurel had already told him.

But Roy listened to Felicity and went to Oliver. I can't see Laurel stopping long enough to even hear what Felicity has to say much less consider the advice.

 

If Quentin does find out from Felicity then I think it would be because it would show on her face. But I don't think there will be much Quentin/Felicity interaction now (sadly) since Felicity is off working with Ray and Quentin calls Oliver directly.  I'm still guessing he'll find out when 

Nyssa shows up looking for Sara.

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But Roy listened to Felicity and went to Oliver. I can't see Laurel stopping long enough to even hear what Felicity has to say much less consider the advice.

 

Oh, I don't think what Roy actually did matters, and I don't think Felicity would give that advice to Laurel - she probably thinks Laurel already told Quentin.

 

When Roy showed Felicity the letter and she told him that he needed to show it to Oliver, Roy gave her a pleading look like he was hoping she would do it for him, since Oliver would be less likely to get angry at Felicity, i guess. That's when she told Roy that Oliver needed to hear it from him, and I thought the purpose of that scene was a callback to her telling Oliver about Merlyn being Thea's father, and also to let us know that she wasn't going to get in the middle of revealing a secret again (at least one that she didn't uncover).

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I have a question guys. If it's obvious that Laurel won't tell Captain Lance about Sara anytime soon, do you think Felicity would? And if she does, would you be offended? Or would this negatively impact how you see her? 

 

I feel like it's something Felicity would do but I hope she doesn't. There's people out there who think Felicity was wrong to confront Moira and then tell Oliver about Thea's parentage so there really doesn't need to be another similar situation where they give the haters more ammo. 

 

Plus it's just a way to get Laurel to dislike her and I doubt they'd want that. At least I hope they don't! 

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Interesting.

 

I thought the Roy/letter/Felicity scene was to show that Roy and Felicity are now close (to justify Roy being the one to hug Felicity all through this episode instead of Oliver), and that with Roy becoming part of the Team, he needed to man up and do his own dirty work (reveal that he knew Thea wasn't just travelling).

 

I'm sure someone at the burial asked where Quentin was, if not Felicity then Roy or Diggle. Laurel would either have to spill that she didn't tell him or lie that she had but he was too sad to come.

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Yay. Looking forward to this. :) And yes, she does look gorgeous. So is the hair down a new thing this season?

It's interesting that when we've seen her in the foundry she's had her ponytail. She seems to be wearing it down outside though (her meeting with Ray, her trip to Central City, her first day of work).

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Maybe the hair down is when she's not being Oliver's Felicity.  it's Other Men Felicity.

 

She's wearing flats in the picture by the railway tracks. Smart girl, those heels could get you killed there.

 

I'm so excited for this episode. I love the idea of her working with Cisco and Caitlyn.  Felicity Smoak: Not just another love interest.

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These look amazing! I just want to skip the next episode and jump right to the crossover. Her hair looks great; as much as I love the pony she needs to change it up a bit. I can't wait to see her working with Team Flash. I'm actually more looking forward to the Caitlyn/Harrison/Felicity interactions then I am the Felicity/Iris ones.

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Now I'm thinking how EBR/Felicity can make all shows better. She can be Skye's hacker BFF on AoS, Cosima's BFF on OB, just put her on ALL THE SHOWS.

 

Someone should make a fan-video like this :)

Edited by drspaceman10
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Which would be in keeping for someone like Felicity.  She had enough self-esteem and courage to get out of Las Vegas and into MIT, maybe with the encouragement of her teachers, but she doesn't think she's good enough to be management material. 

This was actually a topic of conversation when I went to this seminar about Grad School vs Job (I'm a Junior Computer science double major with psych). There are actual statistics that back that up. For women, we tend to only apply for a job if we are confident about fulfilling 75-80% of the listed requirement. For men, if they feel they fulfil as low 35%, they will apply. So that's definitely a factor that affects the number of women at those jobs. 

 

@KenyaJ, I would like to propose marriage to you and this post.

I challenge you to a duel for that honour. En garde!

 

Ah, but Arrow just does gloomy now.

That should have been on the second poster with Oliver by himself.

 

Gorgeous.  They're really working that hair down.  In the 4th image (the one of her working on her laptop at the little desk LOL) looks like she's wearing flip flops?

Haha she totally is. I love EBR. With how strong the symbolism this show is, I guess this about breaking the mould of Felicity being Oliver's Felicity. Because if we think about it, the Felicity we have seen so far is the projection that Oliver has of her in his head. Now we get to see her from her own POV. For two seasons she has looked like the Felicity Oliver first saw. I enjoy it in a meta way because the writers are starting to think more about her character and letting her bring more to the table. 

I totally agree with KenyaJ, the nature of the death of Sara and the repercussions on if she were to lose the rest of Team Arrow make her think about what would happen if she were to be alone again. Cue to looking for outside sources of fulfilment just so her life is not dependent on 4 people who might or might not be there at the end.

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It is funny that Felicity Smoak will be out in the field on her very first outing in The Flash. On the other hand, they keep her hidden in the basement behind the computer in most episodes. This girl could do with some sunshine from time to time.

Another thing, in one episode of Flash, Felicity will have more female interaction (with both Caitlin and Iris West) than she has had in two seasons of Arrow. The only female character with which she has had dialogues in multiple episodes was Sara Lance and they too were few and far between (She has had half a scene with Moira in 2x08 and one full fledged scene in 2x13 and none with Thea or Sin).

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I'm more excited for The Flash 1x04 than I am for Arrow 3x04, it looks like Felicity is going to be really involved in 1x04.

 

It's pretty worrying that I'm more excited about an episode for a show I'm not really bothered about. The Flash is nice enough but hasn't really grabbed me yet but Arrow is not really working for me right now. Plus Flash 104 looks like Felicity has a chance to shine beyond her computers.

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It is funny that Felicity Smoak will be out in the field on her very first outing in The Flash. On the other hand, they keep her hidden in the basement behind the computer in most episodes. This girl could do with some sunshine from time to time.

Another thing, in one episode of Flash, Felicity will have more female interaction (with both Caitlin and Iris West) than she has had in two seasons of Arrow. The only female character with which she has had dialogues in multiple episodes was Sara Lance and they too were few and far between (She has had half a scene with Moira in 2x08 and one full fledged scene in 2x13 and none with Thea or Sin).

It's weird cause Flash has a lot less female characters (so far) than Arrow does. Felicity just doesn't really interact with them lol. 

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The Flash combines Barry's family and love interest into Iris, while Oliver has Thea and Laurel. Those are separate for both shows, at least in s1 and s2 in Arrow.

 

The Flash has Caitlin on the team so Felicity can interact with her.  And Barry introduces Felicity to Iris socially, which Oliver never really did with Felicity and the three women in his Oliver Queen life.

 

So while there are fewer women on The Flash than on Arrow, Felicity is able to connect with both women on The Flash whereas Sara was the first one with whom she really could on Arrow.

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