S06.E02: The Corsican

[preeya]

As Liz and the Task Force race to stop an imminent bombing by an elusive Blacklister, Red has an encounter that will change the trajectory of his life forever.

[edhopper]

My absurdity meter broke about a quarter of the way through when the courrier gave the Corsican everything that was keeping him alive and then the authorities, after seeing the courrier dead didn't change the codes or invalidate his badge, I guess cause cell phones didn't exist. It got more absurd from there.

And Liz betrayed Red why?

[Passepartout]

Liz is becoming a major league self righteous bleep these days. But that's just me. Really can't sympathize with her or Red for that matter. Feel bad for the cop who did his job only in arresting Red. And the feds to claim credit when the locals did the dirty work. Not the first show nor will be the last. As really me thinks that US Attorney who is running for Governor may also just arrested Red to claim credit as Harold says to boast her political statue. Thinks that she may be also doing something wrong or could be just doing her job.

Red will be ticked off when he knows and finds out it was Liz. Or maybe Liz was just saying it and someone else could had turned him in. Just keeping an open mind however.

[VinceW]

The writers invested two episodes at the end of last season in the Samar/Aram relationship leading to a marriage proposal, but after two episodes this season, not even a word or look between them on screen makes no sense. Instead, viewers get endless "not my father" dialogue between the rogue sisters which is just a weak premise to put forth for an entire season. IMO. Raymond giving Liz that disk while sitting on the park bench at the end last week suggests that the writers plan to keep him in prison for some time while the FBI keeps busy tracking those bad guys on that surgery list.

Edited January 5, 2019 by VinceW

[Brian Cronin]

6 hours ago, Passepartout said:

Red will be ticked off when he knows and finds out it was Liz. Or maybe Liz was just saying it and someone else could had turned him in. Just keeping an open mind however.

It seems like Jennifer is really the one who pushed Liz to turn Red in. I bet that the season will end with Liz and Jennifer at odds with each other and Liz and Red will team-up once again. 

[edhopper]

And what part of an immunity deal says you can still be arrested anytime and go to jail?

Red has been openly walking around free all this time, This is the first cop to recognize the most wanted man in America?

[Loandbehold]

First off, I'm used to Red's speeches to bad guys, usually before killing them. But, what the hell was his speech in the General Assembly room? He's always had a dream to address the world's leaders about the benefits of LSD and his hatred of Timothy Leary? Certainly Dembe, and later Liz, couldn't give two shits about what he was saying. 

2 hours ago, edhopper said:

And what part of an immunity deal says you can still be arrested anytime and go to jail?

Red has been openly walking around free all this time, This is the first cop to recognize the most wanted man in America?

Most immunity deals will say they become null and void should you either lie to the prosecutors, stop cooperating, or commit any further criminal acts. It's not the same as a pardon. They can't use the testimony or evidence the witness provided, but they can prosecute you for your original crimes based on evidence found separate to such information. And they can certainly prosecute you for any crimes you committed after signing the agreement.

As for the local cop's arrest (yay NYPD), he didn't seem to know who Red was. It was the other cop who arrived at the scene who identified Red. I thought that was weird b/c, as a far as I know, it's not illegal to buy pretzels from a vendor. Even if one is purchased w/o mustard. 

[saber5055]

Word to your post, Loandbehold. And thanks for reminding me of Red's speech to the UN assembly, which was a great time killer and, who knows, maybe was Spader's way of getting his personal opinions heard. Like I said, who knows. It was a great time pad in any case.

All of a sudden FBI isn't able to "steal" prisoners from the local PD? Geesh, that happens all the time on tv. Now Cooper's task force can't? Okay then. And yeah, Red's been walking all over the world shooting people but has never been ID'd or caught on CC camera anywhere. Okay then x2.

I thought Lizzie's reaction to the bomb MAYBE going off was to cover her face with her hands and leave them there for an extended period of time was hilarious if not incredibly stupid. If only she'd leave them there for the rest of the season.

If Lizzie was going to bust Red, she could do it while sitting in Cooper's office with Mr. Cooper. I mean, "Call me Harold." WTH, she has to call NYPD? Please.

Lizzie's new-found sister is all gangsta. So she doesn't want to be a waitress any more. What's her new occupation then, gang lord? If she hated her job so much, why didn't she take advantage of the guy who took care of her ... I've already forgotten his name, the one who killed Tom. That was all so long ago! Anyway, he should have set her up as a receptionist at a nail salon or SOMETHING. Or hey, maybe put her through college?

So Red does one nice thing and Lizzie is all verklempt about what a great guy he is. Alrighty then.

I have all kinds of ideas about how I'd like this season to end. I doubt any of them will play out though.

OH: Best character this episode was the bomb maker. He was all kinds of cool, right up there with the DMV guy.

[NeenerNeener]

4 hours ago, Loandbehold said:

As for the local cop's arrest (yay NYPD), he didn't seem to know who Red was. It was the other cop who arrived at the scene who identified Red. I thought that was weird b/c, as a far as I know, it's not illegal to buy pretzels from a vendor. Even if one is purchased w/o mustard. 

After watching this episode I watched the movie Molly's Game, and at one point towards the end she went to buy a pretzel from a NY street vendor and I yelled "No, stay away from the pretzel cart!" at my tv.

I'm afraid this show will end as a tragedy, with this Red being a deep undercover CIA agent using Original Red's identity to infiltrate all the various criminal organizations in the world and report back to the CIA, and he'll die trying to save Elizabeth. 

Where I'm getting confused on the backstory is Mary Louise Parker. Was she Original Red's wife or this Red's wife? She talked to current Red like she had been married to him, but you'd think Original Red's wife would recognize an imposter.

[preeya]

Ressler has The Corsican in his direct line of fire, doesn't take the shot, and of course, the perp gets away. Not only does he get away, but can't be located. What happened to Aram's tracking skills.  GMAFB

[tljgator]

For some reason (probably my intense dislike of her), I felt like maybe Liz and Red were running a long con on the sister (who, in turn, feels a bit like she's running a con on Liz). But then I thought this show probably isn't that twisty/well-planned, and the sister doesn't seem like much to have concern with (wherever she was during that phone call with Liz seemed dodgy, though, and her shady father figure who kicked it last season gives me some pause).

Neener, I like your thoughts on thisRed -- especially since the "memories" keep saying thatRed was perfect and a magically great dad in counter to this one, so it's probably backwards (and then the writers will pat themselves on the back for being ever so clever about it later on). *shrugs*

[seacliffsal]

I fast forwarded the bomb in the briefcase while Red was giving a speech at the U.N.  Total time killers.

This could be really interesting with Red in prison.  He could create a new crime cartel while waiting for his trial. And his new syndicate will find out new sister is fake and that Liz turned him in...

[ottoDbusdriver]

7 hours ago, Loandbehold said:

But, what the hell was his speech in the General Assembly room? He's always had a dream to address the world's leaders about the benefits of LSD and his hatred of Timothy Leary? Certainly Dembe, and later Liz, couldn't give two shits about what he was saying. 

Seriously, what the hell was that all about ?  Especially the LSD part.

2 hours ago, preeya said:

Ressler has The Corsican in his direct line of fire, doesn't take the shot, and of course, the perp gets away. Not only does he get away, but can't be located. What happened to Aram's tracking skills.  GMAFB

There were so many WTF moments in this episode.  

-- The Corsican not only had his face changed to setup a new identity, but had it changed to imitate a very specific person.  What are the odds that his hair and basic head structure would also match this Turkish courier ?  So much so as to match his ID badge.
-- The Corsican was plucking out stitches and applying some touch-up makeup and was good to go -- he would have had bruising for many many days if not weeks after surgery.
-- Ressler not shooting the Corsican was just stupid, even for this show.  At least wing him in the leg to put him down, and then tend to the wounded.  FFS !
Ressler had a clean shot at the Corsican after the Corsican let go of the 2nd person -- what was he waiting for ? Christmas ?
-- Jennifer hiding in the closet.  Seriously ?  Is this 'Love Lucy' or 'Three's Company' ?  The time from when Red knocked to when Lizzie answered the door, it was a full 30 seconds.  No, that's not suspicious at all.  Come on, Red knows everything and I'm sure he knew that Jennifer was there.  He has to have had Lizzie's place under surveillance 24 x 7, and would know of Jennifer's comings and goings.  Has Lizzie learned nothing from previous episodes ?
-- Globalism ?  That's the Corsican's beef with the world.  Man, that is pretty weak.
-- UN security guy: "Who are you people ? What's going on here ?"  Considering that he already knew Lizzie was from the FBI and apparently DHS had some pull with the US SecGen who had some pull with his boss and Lizzie was telling him and his staff to GTFO because of the bomb, why would he even question "who they were ?".
-- How did the Corsican shoot the security guard with the security guard's own gun, if the Corsican didn't have a gun to begin with.  How did he get the drop on the guard ?
-- Aram playing the pronoun game while on the phone with Ressler and Lizzie.  That was just embarrassingly stupid, even for this show.
-- Lizzie being all verklempt at the end while drinking scotch.  She can't imagine what Red will do ?  Well, we know he won't kill because he has done everything in his power to keep Lizzie alive all this time.  Maybe Lizzie just has limited imaginative abilities.

Travel shenanigans were all over the place -- Red criss-crossing the country to Hollywood and back, Ms. Holter venturing to D.C. and back.

Even worse was the soundtrack -- the music was so loud in spots you couldn't make out the dialog, and some of the music choices were just annoying.

On the plus side, we did get a 'Concierge of Crime' shout-out from Lizzie -- been a while since that was mentioned.

ETA: Still no sign of or mention of Agnes or the dogs.  Because Lizzie is a mom, dontcha know.

Edited January 6, 2019 by ottoDbusdriver

[edhopper]

8 hours ago, Loandbehold said:

 

Most immunity deals will say they become null and void should you either lie to the prosecutors, stop cooperating, or commit any further criminal acts. It's not the same as a pardon. They can't use the testimony or evidence the witness provided, but they can prosecute you for your original crimes based on evidence found separate to such information. And they can certainly prosecute you for any crimes you committed after signing the agreement.

Well since he was cooperating according to the lead of the task force, it will be interesting to see what they prosecute him for. and when I say interesting, I mean stupid.

[Brian Cronin]

4 hours ago, tljgator said:

For some reason (probably my intense dislike of her), I felt like maybe Liz and Red were running a long con on the sister (who, in turn, feels a bit like she's running a con on Liz). But then I thought this show probably isn't that twisty/well-planned, and the sister doesn't seem like much to have concern with (wherever she was during that phone call with Liz seemed dodgy, though, and her shady father figure who kicked it last season gives me some pause).

Oh, great call. I was thinking it would end with Liz and Jennifer at odds, but it didn't even occur to me that Liz could be turning in Red as a part of a scam to make Jennifer think that Liz is on her side while she isn't. Jennifer was definitely acting SUPER sketchy in this episode, so I think that has a very good chance of happening. Clever!

[Surrealist]

18 hours ago, Brian Cronin said:

It seems like Jennifer is really the one who pushed Liz to turn Red in. I bet that the season will end with Liz and Jennifer at odds with each other and Liz and Red will team-up once again. 

I don't trust Jennifer at all. She's too eager. She's definitely shady. I'm looking forward to the unraveling of this thread.

Edited January 6, 2019 by Surrealist

[Amerilla]

22 hours ago, Loandbehold said:

But, what the hell was his speech in the General Assembly room? He's always had a dream to address the world's leaders about the benefits of LSD and his hatred of Timothy Leary? Certainly Dembe, and later Liz, couldn't give two shits about what he was saying. 

 

I wondered how much of it was ad-libbed by Spader, but I may be wrong. Red has a history of spouting odd biographical trivia, so I could see that being the first thing that floated to his mind.  

But I think the point was that he was talking specifically about Cary Grant. When Liz asked him what the hell he was talking about with the LSD stuff, he went off on a seeming tangent about how Cary Grant had started out in a poor, working-class family and transformed himself into the model of a debonair Hollywood movie star. "Cary Grant" was a character that Archibald Leach constructed and embodied for decades. Who just happened to like to go on the occasional acid trip.

So a long, slightly amusing way to acknowledge that thisRed is a character build around the thatRed. 

18 hours ago, NeenerNeener said:

Where I'm getting confused on the backstory is Mary Louise Parker. Was she Original Red's wife or this Red's wife? She talked to current Red like she had been married to him, but you'd think Original Red's wife would recognize an imposter.

 

My guess is that MLP was Original Red's wife. They would have gone decades without seeing each other and Naomi believed Red abandoned her and Jennifer, so if presented with someone who looked like a much-older version of a long gone former husband, I could handwave her not realizing he was an imposter.  

There was a great Red monologue in one of the early seasons where he talked about coming home one Christmas Eve to find his wife and daughter murdered. In the very first season, he buys (and immediately blows up) a family home. So my guess is that Faux Red somehow got tangled up with Original Red, something Very Bad happened, and Faux Red ended up adopting Original Red's persona.

Although that's probably too straightforward for this writing team.  

Edited January 6, 2019 by Amerilla

[rur]

3 hours ago, Amerilla said:

I There was a great Red monologue in one of the early seasons where he talked about coming home one Christmas Eve to find his wife and daughter murdered. In the very first season, he buys (and immediately blows up) a family home. So my guess is that Faux Red somehow got tangled up with Original Red, something Very Bad happened, and Faux Red ended up adopting Original Red's persona.

Thanks for mentioning that. I'd been wondering if the site of the fire that Liz and her sister visited was also the site of the blown-up home, since it would've made more sense (to me) anyway, for the beach house to have been rebuilt after Liz's fire, but would still be a vacant lot for a couple of seasons. But then, again, that would have made sense, so . . .

[Loandbehold]

6 hours ago, Amerilla said:

But I think the point was that he was talking specifically about Cary Grant. When Liz asked him what the hell he was talking about with the LSD stuff, he went off on a seeming tangent about how Cary Grant had started out in a poor, working-class family and transformed himself into the model of a debonair Hollywood movie star. "Cary Grant" was a character that Archibald Leach constructed and embodied for decades. Who just happened to like to go on the occasional acid trip.

So a long, slightly amusing way to acknowledge that thisRed is a character build around the thatRed.

I hadn't made that connection. Interesting idea. I still want to know why Red felt the need to make the speech from the lectern and when he had no idea whether Liz would get to the room. The bomb could have exploded. Or, she could have gone after The Corsican. Or just to the lobby. Eh, I'm probably putting far more time into this than the writers did.

[VinceW]

On 1/5/2019 at 11:51 AM, Loandbehold said:

First off, I'm used to Red's speeches to bad guys, usually before killing them. But, what the hell was his speech in the General Assembly room? He's always had a dream to address the world's leaders about the benefits of LSD and his hatred of Timothy Leary? Certainly Dembe, and later Liz, couldn't give two shits about what he was saying. 

Per interview with show producer, it was learned that Red's speech was not actually filmed at UN building.  It seems that needed permissions were not forth coming after some negotiations.  It is interesting to note that 'Madam Secretary' filmed an episode at the actual UN facility with Elizabeth speaking to show extras in the audience. Of course, Tea Leoni had some leverage to get it done since her grandparents are lifelong supporters of UNICEF.

ETA:  Actress Téa Leoni represents the third generation of her family working to help the children of the world. Her grandmother, Helenka Pantaleoni, helped organize Women United for the United Nations and held the posts of vice president and liaison with UNICEF. In 1947, as part of a group that sought public backing for UNICEF, she co-founded the U.S. Committee for UNICEF and served as its president for 25 years. Anthony Pantaleoni, Leoni's father, currently serves on UNICEF USA's board. 

Edited January 8, 2019 by VinceW

[Destiny74]

Pardon me, newer viewer (last two seasons).

I can't imagine Red has been wanted for 30 years and does not have a thousand contingency plans in case he gets caught.  He'll be in custody only as long as he wants to be, whether he uses the law or some other means to free himself, he know exactly what he's going to do.

[Dowel Jones]

On 1/5/2019 at 3:27 PM, ottoDbusdriver said:

ETA: Still no sign of or mention of Agnes or the dogs.

Fast forward five years, and there is Agnes tucked in bed, and she looks up at Spader and says, "Tell me a story, Grampa.  Tell me about the FBI..."  Spader sighs, and says, "Once upon a time...."

I'm glad he picked Archibald Leach (anyone else channel the Jeopardy scene from Cheers?).  He could have picked Marion Morrison.

Edited January 8, 2019 by Dowel Jones

[anthonyd46]

On 1/6/2019 at 1:04 AM, Surrealist said:

I don't trust Jennifer at all. She's too eager. She's definitely shady. I'm looking forward to the unraveling of this thread.

 

Agreed that Jennifer is extremely shady and just a matter of time before the whole relationship between her and Liz comes to disagreements etc.

Edited January 8, 2019 by anthonyd46

[anthonyd46]

On 1/5/2019 at 6:27 PM, ottoDbusdriver said:

Ressler not shooting the Corsican was just stupid, even for this show.  At least wing him in the leg to put him down, and then tend to the wounded.  FFS !
Ressler had a clean shot at the Corsican after the Corsican let go of the 2nd person -- what was he waiting for ? Christmas ?

 

I know its like what 4 seasons? since his ex died, but they have just absolutely nowhere with his character since then (after Liz fixed him and the semhar fling didnt go anywhere). Now he's basically just this macho cop the can see through crap, but then instead of taking the crap down does things as in the post here. Why does this guy never get a storyline?

Edited January 8, 2019 by anthonyd46

[Johnny Dollar]

Red literally stops a major terrorist attack and saves hundreds of lives, yet Lizzie and her sister want to take him down to find out who he really is?  Not for revenge for killing their parents, but just to find out his identity?  Why would they even know who he was before he bacame Red?

Ressler’s sense of justice would be a lot more admirable if Red didn’t save him from a murder charge. And shoot the guy already!  You’re FBI not an EMT!

With the valuable intel Red has provided the feds, the idea that the Justice Dept wouldn’t overrule a federal prosecutor in this case is ridiculous. 

[ItCouldBeWorse]

On 1/5/2019 at 8:51 AM, edhopper said:

Red has been openly walking around free all this time, This is the first cop to recognize the most wanted man in America?

 

On 1/5/2019 at 11:51 AM, Loandbehold said:

As for the local cop's arrest (yay NYPD), he didn't seem to know who Red was. It was the other cop who arrived at the scene who identified Red. I thought that was weird b/c, as a far as I know, it's not illegal to buy pretzels from a vendor. Even if one is purchased w/o mustard

Red told Liz that the beat cop ( who didn't recognize him) must have been told to look for a middle-aged white man who was carrying a gun. Maybe Liz also tipped off the police about the way Red was dressed.

As for why no other random police officer has recognized Red on the streets over the years, I have no answer.

[Loandbehold]

3 hours ago, Johnny Dollar said:

Red literally stops a major terrorist attack and saves hundreds of lives, yet Lizzie and her sister want to take him down to find out who he really is?  Not for revenge for killing their parents, but just to find out his identity?  Why would they even know who he was before he bacame Red?

Ressler’s sense of justice would be a lot more admirable if Red didn’t save him from a murder charge. And shoot the guy already!  You’re FBI not an EMT!

With the valuable intel Red has provided the feds, the idea that the Justice Dept wouldn’t overrule a federal prosecutor in this case is ridiculous.

Maybe they want to know if "Red" has or is a carrier for any genetic diseases.

I don't remember and have erased the episode from my DVR, but was the prosecutor called the US Attorney, Deputy or Assistant US Attorney. The former has a lot of latitude into which cases are brought. Basically only the Attorney General can overrule their decision. And, I don't know if the A.G. is aware of this deal. I don't believe the one Liz killed was aware.

[anthonyd46]

49 minutes ago, Loandbehold said:

Maybe they want to know if "Red" has or is a carrier for any genetic diseases.

I don't remember and have erased the episode from my DVR, but was the prosecutor called the US Attorney, Deputy or Assistant US Attorney. The former has a lot of latitude into which cases are brought. Basically only the Attorney General can overrule their decision. And, I don't know if the A.G. is aware of this deal. I don't believe the one Liz killed was aware.

Her podium says "Office of the United States Attorney District of New York" with a Department of Justice seal.

Therefore someone like this can't overrule the actual FBI can they?

Edited January 9, 2019 by anthonyd46

[Loandbehold]

7 hours ago, anthonyd46 said:

Her podium says "Office of the United States Attorney District of New York" with a Department of Justice seal.

Therefore someone like this can't overrule the actual FBI can they?

The FBI investigates. They are part of the Department of Justice. The Attorney General is above the head of the FBI. The FBI can present a case to an attorney who can choose not to prosecute. So, depending on how high she is (and in NYC, you have the Southern District and Eastern District that cover NYC. Southern District covers Manhattan.) So, if she is in charge of the DoJ office in NYC, she can overrule the FBI regarding prosecution of crimes that took place w/in her jurisdiction, unless the US A.G, overrules her. 

[anthonyd46]

6 minutes ago, Loandbehold said:

The FBI investigates. They are part of the Department of Justice. The Attorney General is above the head of the FBI. The FBI can present a case to an attorney who can choose not to prosecute. So, depending on how high she is (and in NYC, you have the Southern District and Eastern District that cover NYC. Southern District covers Manhattan.) So, if she is in charge of the DoJ office in NYC, she can overrule the FBI regarding prosecution of crimes that took place w/in her jurisdiction, unless the US A.G, overrules her. 

Ok so since this happened in New York Harold Cooper can't do anything to override her. 

[Dowel Jones]

You guys are inserting real life logic into the discussion.  Please stop.  :)  /s

[No 2 in our Hearts]

Why doesn't Red just go ahead and escape already? People being busted out of secure federal holding is as commonplace in The Blacklist universe as liquor store robberies.

Edited January 10, 2019 by No 2 in our Hearts

[anthonyd46]

4 hours ago, No 2 in our Hearts said:

Why doesn't Red just go ahead and escape already? People being busted out of secure federal holding is as commonplace in The Blacklist universe as liquor store robberies.

I'm sure he has a plan he had to know sometime in the last 30 years this was a possibility. Maybe escaping at this moment doesn't fit into his plan.

[Drusilla]

On 05/01/2019 at 7:54 PM, saber5055 said:

 

So Red does one nice thing and Lizzie is all verklempt 

I have all kinds of ideas about how I'd like this season to end. I doubt any of them will play out though.

 

verklempt, great word

My idea how the season ends is that it ends for good. This show is a holy mortifying mess.