House Hunters Renovation - General Discussion

[truther]

Re: the Chicago couple....there are so many things that are for show. For instance, they had to know there were major plumbing issues as every sink and toilet in the walk through had blue take across them. My feeling is they knew plumbing would have to be replaced. The third floor was surely a surprise but my gut tells me the plumbing was only a surprise for camera.

Agreed.  I've owned two homes in Chicago and I've had to deal with code enforcement issues more than I ever imagined.  In fact this episode was a little painful to watch because it hit so close to home.  Some of the stuff I've dealt with is simply insane.  The whole enforcement system in Chicago exists to 1) make money for the city's coffers, 2) provide jobs for the bureaucracy, and 3) ensure good building practice.  In that order.

 

But they clearly knew going in that the building was virtually a gut rehab.  They said so!  We saw lots of problems, including off-limits bathrooms and extensive water damage, and the realtor stressed that there were many problems that were lowering the asking price.  There's no doubt they knew going in that the plumbing was defective.

 

Also, they'd need a whole slew of permits to combine units, rehab electrical and plumbing, and bring a rental unit up to code.  They'd need an architect and building engineer and, obviously, a lawyer.  And the architect/engineering plans would be submitted as part of the permit application.  People sometimes try to avoid that painful process and instead do everything under the table, but if you're going on a popular TV show that's probably not a good idea. 

 

So having said that I'm not shocked if the 3d floor issue was a surprise to them, but the resolution almost certainly will involve them paying some kind of fine.  A hefty fine, no doubt, which again is sort of the whole idea.  

[MsTree]

RE: the 3rd floor unit being on hold...wouldn't the owners have had to submit their plans in order to get a building permit? IOW, if the city ok'd a permit to build, why would they then slap a cease & desist on the project??  It makes no sense (to me) to approve a building permit only to take it away once the reno is under way.

[truther]

I don't remember the precise chronology on this ep, and what they show isn't going to be the full story regardless, but didn't they change their plans?  I thought they were originally going to just reno the inside.  Then once they got in there and started poking around they realized it would be better to just demo the whole thing and rebuild from scratch.  What seems like an obvious response to changed conditions will, to the inspectors, seem like unauthorized new construction.

 

So that's why some of us are skeptical about the homeowners being surprised about the plumbing, but not skeptical about the city coming in with these absurd demands about the third floor after the work had been done.

 

It's also important to understand how opaque the whole communication process is.  In our case -- and I'm speaking now as the condo board president, not simply a homeowner -- a city building inspector would come by, look things over, maybe say a few things verbally, but then submit a written report weeks or even months later.  The report, not the verbal statements, were what was binding and it was just a couple sentences that referenced whatever code section was at issue with a terse statement about why it was being violated.  "Construction must comply with submitted plans," or "railings must be made safe for intended use" or something.  Usually it was really, really tough to figure out what exactly the inspector was actually talking about and of course they weren't available to answer questions.   

[sheetmoss]

After doing a bit of Google Maps sleuthing I found the location of the recent Chicago hse featured, as of an Oct 2015 Streetview, the 3rd flr still wasn't completed. It's still wrapped in Tyvek and the front window opening is enclosed in plastic.

Edited January 18, 2016 by sheetmoss

[juliet73]

I can't believe how over budget they went!! And the 3rd floor still needs to be completed?!!? I'm sure they will never get most of that money back when they decide to sell. With all the money they dumped into this house, they could have gotten a beautiful house that needed minimal,if any work. Considering he's a lawyer and she's a structural engineer, neither one of them seemed to have any common sense.

[ChelseaNH]

I'm wondering if they actually went over budget, or if they planned to spend more from the outset and some of the budget angst was for drama.  That would depend on the average price for a renovated home in their area.

 

I was thinking they shouldn't skimp on the money to fix up the rental suite, but then how much money would a renter pay to live in a construction zone?

[izabella]

The way I understood the third floor issue, their contractor told them they had to rebuild it because it was actually supported by the deck rather than being part of the house.  So they rebuilt the third floor entirely so it was part of the house, but then were told that the extent of the work they had done was not a "renovation" but a "new build."  And they weren't approved for a new build because that style of house, a frame house, couldn't be taller than 2 stories.

 

If I got that right, that tells me the previous owners added an illegal third story to that house, and I would really be surprised if that wasn't caught at some point during the buying process, like during a building inspection.  It sure should have been!  How could any home inspector look at that house and not notice the third story was not actually a third story?  If they bought that house without an inspection, that was a huge mistake.

Edited January 19, 2016 by izabella

[KittyS]

I started watching that one, but then I saw the blue that they were going to use in the kitchen and I just said "no" and changed the channel.

I started watching that one, but then I saw the blue that they were going to use in the kitchen and I just said "no" and changed the channel.

That's a shame because the blue in the kitchen ended up being quite lovely, especially with the white cabinets and dark floors.

[sheetmoss]

The way I understood the third floor issue, their contractor told them they had to rebuild it because it was actually supported by the deck rather than being part of the house.  So they rebuilt the third floor entirely so it was part of the house, but then were told that the extent of the work they had done was not a "renovation" but a "new build."  And they weren't approved for a new build because that style of house, a frame house, couldn't be taller than 2 stories.

 

If I got that right, that tells me the previous owners added an illegal third story to that house, and I would really be surprised if that wasn't caught at some point during the buying process, like during a building inspection.  It sure should have been!  How could any home inspector look at that house and not notice the third story was not actually a third story?  If they bought that house without an inspection, that was a huge mistake.

No, the third story was perfectly legal to start - I guess you could probably say it was grandfathered in after laws were changed meaning it could stay a three story frame,

I guess the dispute is now, yes the 3rd flr as is was unsafe but does the grandfathered law cover an all new 3rd story rebuild?

Edited January 19, 2016 by sheetmoss

[twinks]

While I did like the reno, I don't see how it added any charm or character. I don't know anything about the neighborhood, but I doubt I would even look at that house. Nothing about it said Victorian to me.

[sheetmoss]

While I did like the reno, I don't see how it added any charm or character. I don't know anything about the neighborhood, but I doubt I would even look at that house. Nothing about it said Victorian to me.

Lincoln Square is a hot area so it was a good investment

Zillow estimates --I know, I view their estimates with  a grain of salt, has other  places on their block & nearby  going for $1.2-1.3 million

[izabella]

Yes, they'll do well on resale, as long as they can sort out the third floor issue.  If they can't, their only option is to tear that down, and then build the bedrooms downstairs in the rental unit, making it a single family home. 

 

As to Victorian, the style is Victorian, albeit the facade has been stripped of all its Victorian character, or it's been covered over by that siding.  You see a lot of that in Chicago and San Francisco; sometimes people have the money to restore the old facades on those buildings to their former glory, but that's expensive.  It looks like all that remains from the Victorian style is the bay windows in the front.  Very little inside had anything to do with Victorian decor, especially that new kitchen, so I don't know what the homeowner was going on about.

[paloma58]

I am trying to find the Chicago episode, especially since they were in Lincoln Square. I have lived there almost 20 years....actually just put my condo on the market. When I bought in 1996, the neighborhood was just starting to be renovated. Don't want to say gentrified, since LS was full of great homes, not exactly well tended - think gramma and gramps having lived in the house for 50 years. Anyway, my new condo (apt building conversion) fellow owners were laughed at by the long time neighbors, since we were 'overpaying'. Well, if I get my asking price, I will realize close to 200% profit. Not bragging, just confirming the area is hot

I am trying to find the Chicago episode, especially since they were in Lincoln Square. I have lived there almost 20 years....actually just put my condo on the market. When I bought in 1996, the neighborhood was just starting to be renovated. Don't want to say gentrified, since LS was full of great homes, not exactly well tended - think gramma and gramps having lived in the house for 50 years. Anyway, my new condo (apt building conversion) fellow owners were laughed at by the long time neighbors, since we were 'overpaying'. Well, if I get my asking price, I will realize close to 200% profit. Not bragging, just confirming the area is hot

[chessiegal]

If you have a smartphone or tablet, you could try downloading the HGTV app. You can find recent episodes there to watch. You have to sign in through your cable provider, but I've found it a good way to catch recent episodes I missed  or didn't record. They only make them available for a time, probably 2 weeks or so, I think.

[aguabella]

My guess (.02 worth!) is that the Chicago / Lincoln Square couple made 2 major mistakes, as follows:

 

I suspect the attic had received a minor update within the last 10 years.  (Everybody notice the basic kitchen and bathroom?)  So, that tells us that someone, during that work, probably ran HVAC and plumbing, within those walls, to set up that 3rd floor rental unit.  A permit would have definitely been required. 

 

The contractor demonstrated the poor workmanship during the episode so that tells me it wasn't permitted / inspected.  They probably needed to shore up the structure at that time to satisfy the building code in effect at that time.  Given the above, I have a feeling the couple failed to pull permits before they closed escrow.  (Mistake #1)

 

Turning to the budget, it appears they made a mistake I've mentioned on previous renos:  who was managing the overall project?  They must have had an architect.  The architect could have either functioned as project manager, if qualified, or referred them to another professional.  (Sometimes professionals like the wife make this very mistake b/c they believe they can handle the project mgmt but aren't qualified.) 

 

Without a project manager, I'm guessing they only made a rough estimate for their budget and failed to consider the hidden walls behind the renovated attic.  The wife did mention that their 200K estimate included some structural work and system upgrades.  So, again, like previous episodes, they simply guesstimated the budget.  (Mistake #2)  

 

WRT the HHR episode, itself, they would have known about the plumbing and electrical upgrades b/c that equipment's accessible / visible in the basement for both their home inspector and contractor.  (The electrical's pretty much a given the bldg's age, BTW.)  I have a feeling they estimated those items and then bumped that up to 100K, assuming a fairly generous contingency.  The wife, after the "decision" scene, mentioned that their 200K budget included structural work.

 

Here's the problem - whenever you're dealing with hidden areas, i.e. the attic, plus a 100+ y/o structure, you need an oversized instead of a generous contingency!  The lack of a permit would have been a major warning sign, if they'd pulled them.  If it had been one of my properties, I would have estimated the known items (plumbing and HVAC upgrades, including the contingency) and then set aside double that, if possible.  

 

Granted, I'm looking at this project with the benefit of hindsight but the above is my typical starting point.  If it had been my property, the starting point would have been 200K for the building upgrades alone.  That's no kitchen or rental unit, i.e. none of the visible work.

 

Turning to the rental unit - what changes would the typical, professional landlord do to that unit?  Probably nothing, quite frankly.  Sure, the kitchen was lousy but it had the Lincoln Square location, including terrific transportation access.  And, it would have photographed and shown fairly well b/c of the paint job and floors.  If the rent's $1,500 / month currently, why sink in 20K or more for an add'l $300 / month?  BTW, they didn't show the bathroom, IIRC, so it probably needed work, too. 

 

If someone wanted to do a minor update on that unit, I would suggest selling the oversized s/s refrigerator, assuming it's fairly new (they sell well) and replacing it with a reasonably sized apartment fridge.  Then, how about a little DIY carpentry to both build in the frig and complete / finish out the existing cabinetry?  I'd try to keep it at 5K or less, including some minor updates to freshen up the (unseen) bathroom, assuming it's (at least) in working order.  Add in a floating island in the center plus some staging for the photos and showings.  Done!

 

ETA:  given that LS location plus the 1st floor's condition, I believe that unit would rent, now.  If they restart construction, they could grant their tenant a minor rent adjustment.  Or, if they rent it now, simply set up a short -term, e.g. 6 month or m-t-m lease.  That way, the lease can be easily terminated if/when construction begins.  Sometimes it's better to forgo monthly rental income during a construction period - it just makes life easier.

Edited January 20, 2016 by aguabella

[aguabella]

I am trying to find the Chicago episode, especially since they were in Lincoln Square. I have lived there almost 20 years....actually just put my condo on the market. When I bought in 1996, the neighborhood was just starting to be renovated. Don't want to say gentrified, since LS was full of great homes, not exactly well tended - think gramma and gramps having lived in the house for 50 years. Anyway, my new condo (apt building conversion) fellow owners were laughed at by the long time neighbors, since we were 'overpaying'. Well, if I get my asking price, I will realize close to 200% profit. Not bragging, just confirming the area is hot

I am trying to find the Chicago episode, especially since they were in Lincoln Square. I have lived there almost 20 years....actually just put my condo on the market. When I bought in 1996, the neighborhood was just starting to be renovated. Don't want to say gentrified, since LS was full of great homes, not exactly well tended - think gramma and gramps having lived in the house for 50 years. Anyway, my new condo (apt building conversion) fellow owners were laughed at by the long time neighbors, since we were 'overpaying'. Well, if I get my asking price, I will realize close to 200% profit. Not bragging, just confirming the area is hot

 

Congratulations on your resale!  Yes, it's a great area.

 

Do you mind if I use your sale as an example?  I posted recently, probably on the Tiny House Hunters thread, about the dangers of considering a personal residence as an investment.  I also mentioned that historically RE usually provides poor annualized returns if/when properly compared to other investments.

 

So, my point is that many people hear about deals like yours, completed in a sellers' market.  They consider the gross sale figures only, i.e. the 200% top line, and mistakenly believe RE is a terrific investment. 

 

You held your property for 20 years.  Also, we don't know how much you spent in upgrades along the way plus maintenance, not to mention your ongoing carrying costs (piti).  If we wanted to calculate your actual return, we'd have to consider both your sales proceeds plus 20 years worth of costs.  Then, we could compare it to other investments with a reasonable degree of accuracy.

 

Anyway, thanks for allowing me to use your great news as an example.  (Stepping off soapbox, lol)  Again, congratulations!  Good luck with your move and new home! 

Edited January 20, 2016 by aguabella

[paloma58]

No problem using my situation as an example. Yes, I did some reno/upgrades along the way. Kitchen and bath remodel. Place came w hardwood floors, replaced white appliances w new whie appliances and since the countertops I wanted I could only find in granite, a semi Holy Trinity. But I also kept in mind that the building is almost 100 years old, so stainless appliances were not even considered. And I hate stainless anyway. I really wish I could just pickup and relocate the unit....

[aguabella]

No problem using my situation as an example. Yes, I did some reno/upgrades along the way. Kitchen and bath remodel. Place came w hardwood floors, replaced white appliances w new whie appliances and since the countertops I wanted I could only find in granite, a semi Holy Trinity. But I also kept in mind that the building is almost 100 years old, so stainless appliances were not even considered. And I hate stainless anyway. I really wish I could just pickup and relocate the unit....

 

Your kitchen sounds beautiful, paloma58!  The s/s won't make any difference.  The location is the most important factor.  Given your neutral colors and everything in good, working order, although I'm not a LS realtor, I would hope / expect your unit to sell quickly.  

 

As you probably know, the best thing for you to do now is clean, clean and then, clean again!  Best of luck! 

Edited January 20, 2016 by aguabella

[sheetmoss]

It's also available on Amazon for $1.99/$2.99

 

Season 7, Episode 9
The Never-Ending Renovation

Chicago newlyweds Lindsay and Tyler are searching for a home in the city where they can start a family together. But while she wants a Victorian with vintage charm and an open floor plan, he'd rather have a bungalow with more separated rooms. Finding a place that suits them both that's also close to transportation and in their budget will be no easy task for agent Todd Szwajkowski. But eventually they'll find a place they think has great potential, though it may turn out to be a potential for disaster. They'll face plumbing issues, structural issues, and budget issues, all before they even finish demo. As problem after problem piles up, designer Susan Klimala and contractor Allyson Case will try to drag this project toward the finish line. And in the end, even being wildly over budget won't stop them from loving their completely transformed new home.
See Tune-In Times
Upcoming Airings See Full Schedule

    Saturday
    Feb 6

    11am | 10c

[paloma58]

Thanks, sheetmoss. I will tune in. Aguabella, my realtor did not think the appliances would be an issue, since everything I did was done with the style and tenor of the building. The stager also liked what I had done. I have never cleaned as much in my life. Fortunately, I have a wonderful, supportive Energizer Bunny of a sister who did 80% of the painting, etc. Every time she left my house, her car was full of stuff to go to the shelter, Amvets,etc. She'd hold something up and give me 10 seconds to close.... Keep, toss,donate. And I had to had to have a good reason for the keeps. I could not have done it w/o her. She is even storing stuff in her garage for me. She is a keeper. I just took her on a cruise to thank her!

[ByaNose]

Super nice couple tonight and they actually liked each other. Novel concept. Although, I thought it was funny how each of them would cry when the other said or did a sweet thing for each other. They enlarged their kitchen and added a sun room. The only problem I had with the kitchen was that the island was so small and only a two seater. The couple repurposed a old bar and painted it the same gray as their lower cabinets and we're thrilled with the results. And, his parents bought the family an new paranormal and then son cried and hugged his parents. It was almost too much. LOL!!!

P.S: they had a $40,000 budget but it ballooned to over $70,000 which didn't seem to phase them too much.

[biakbiak]

I was sort of surprised that opening up the atrium made the other two rooms up to code because I wouldn't want to be trapped in that space in a fire but I guess the smoke could escape.

[Peanutbuttercup]

Nice couple last night -- though by the end I was thinking of them as The Weepies. Monique reminded me of Jenna Fischer (Pam from The Office). Even their dog was cute. The kitchen reno wasn't offensively bad or anything but it was the same old/same old, Holy Quadrinity of HGTV kitchen re-design: farmhouse sink, stainless steel appliances, subway tile backsplash, white shaker cabinets. Okay, they deviated a little tiny bit with making some of the cabinets gray shaker cabinets instead of white shaker cabinets.

It was refreshing that when needed structural renovations came up, they didn't whine or even roll their eyes, just stated how important it was to do it for safety reasons.

[RemoteControlFreak]

Odd that the Culver City couple didn't seem to think it was a big deal that their child's bedroom had no windows until it was pointed out that it was a safety issue. 

[DownTheShore]

I thought they were a really nice couple, too. I had to check and make sure I was watching HGTV, because they were so reasonable and sensible that I thought I had a different channel on!

[NYGirl]

So I just watched the Chicago couple.  I can't believe they went so far over their budget.  I didn't think I'd like the blue in the kitchen but it turned out nice.  I was coming here to ask where they were going to sleep but I see there was a guest room on the second floor.  However, if they are not done yet..where the heck is the kid sleeping?

[Pjxf99]

And, his parents bought the family an new paranormal and then son cried and hugged his parents. It was almost too much. LOL!!!

 

Okay, I just watched this episode and I can't remember what his parents bought for them.  But I'm dying to know what 'paranormal' was supposed to be, before autocorrect!

 

I really wanted to dislike all the crying, but they were just so darn adorable!

[sheetmoss]

The husband of the Culver City couple reminded me of Sylvester from the TV series Scorpion

[NYGirl]

Paranormal = piano.

 

Yes he did remind me of Sylvester too!  I liked them but he did seem like a teeny bit of a whiner.  I didn't see the whole episode..probably the last 15 minutes.

Edited January 24, 2016 by NYGirl

[juliet73]

I liked the Culver City couple! It was refreshing to see a couple that was willing to compromise for their spouse instead of being a selfish jerk. I hated the 2 different colored cabinets in the kitchen. They should have just used all grey. Are farmhouse sinks usually almost $3k? If it were me and I needed to stick to my budget, I would be fine with a $500 sink. I don't understand these people who spend so much money on lighting and appliances, which in turn causes them to go so over budget. There are less expensive alternatives out there.

[ByaNose]

Okay, I just watched this episode and I can't remember what his parents bought for them.  But I'm dying to know what 'paranormal' was supposed to be, before autocorrect!

 

I really wanted to dislike all the crying, but they were just so darn adorable!

As, God is my witness, I know I typed piano. I wouldn't even know how to type paranormal. LOl!! I swear ever since I got my iPad Air 2 the typing and/or auto correct is crazy. Granted, I'm getting older at 51 and maybe my eyes are going I'm seriously getting worried about my typing skills. Anyhoo, the piano was a nice gift but it was funny how the mother, father & son started crying.

[Empress1]

There were a lot of tears this ep, weren't there? Husband, husband's parents, and wife all cried. I did like them though, and it was interesting to see how his being 6'7" affected the house hunt. I dated a guy who was 6'6" and lived in a small apartment and he had to have a handheld shower head in order to bathe. He didn't fit in the bathtub either, and he had a king-sized bed in a very small room so it basically took up the whole space.

 

I was a little confused about the atrium, but it ended up looking nice. And I liked the wine rack that the wife found and refinished - they did a nice job with it. I also liked that they incorporated her grandmother's light fixture - I thought that was a nice touch.

[truther]

They totally knew going in that the window-less bedrooms weren't up to code.  That's a basic thing and their realtor would have noticed it immediately, to say nothing of the home inspector or the lawyer who did the closing or anyone else involved.  Especially for a place listed at $1.3 million.  

 

It looked like they just trashed the old kitchen even though it was all perfectly good stuff, just not to their tastes.  I really hope they managed to reuse it or something.  

Otherwise they were nice.  

[laredhead]

Truther, I agree about the kitchen demo.  I was cringing when they were tearing apart the cabinets and shattering the granite.  Maybe the cabinets were not top grade, but surely they could have been donated to Habitat or another charitable organization for reuse by others.  Can granite counters be removed in large pieces for reuse as well?  

[Pjxf99]

I know a couple where the husband is also very tall.  I wasn't around when they were house hunting, but right now they're looking for a car.  Apparently they have limited choices about which car they can get to accommodate his height, and whatever they buy will almost definitely have to be modified in some way. 

 

Stuff I don't think about, being 5'4"

[MoreCoffeePlease]

The Culver City couple are one of my favorites.  I liked how the husband told the wife he knew the house wasn't her style, but that he would make sure that she got what she wanted in the home and that they would be happy there.  sniff, sniff      I knew they would get that house since ceiling height was so important for him, which I get.  The daughter was precious.

 

I agree with a previous poster that I would have wanted a bigger kitchen island somehow, and yikes, that sink was super-expensive!

 

Back to the Chicago reno, if I recall correctly, wasn't the refrigerator in the corner behind the peninsula?  That is, you would have to walk all the way behind the peninsula to get to the fridge.  If that is the case, I think that is a bad location.  The blue cabinets were a little bright for me, but did look nice in the end.  I just read that blue cabinetry, although much deeper and darker, is the hot new thing in kitchen design.

[aguabella]

They totally knew going in that the window-less bedrooms weren't up to code.  That's a basic thing and their realtor would have noticed it immediately, to say nothing of the home inspector or the lawyer who did the closing or anyone else involved.  Especially for a place listed at $1.3 million.  

 

It looked like they just trashed the old kitchen even though it was all perfectly good stuff, just not to their tastes.  I really hope they managed to reuse it or something.  

Otherwise they were nice.  

 

Although I definitely agree that the Culver City buyers would have known about the bedroom issue before closing, you might be surprised about the other parties' skill levels.  (No offense to my friends in the business.)  Real estate is a profession with relatively easy entry and a plethora of part-timers.  In my experience, an overwhelming majority of realtors basically believe if you throw up a closet - presto, chango, it's a bedroom!  (Wrong!)

 

IIRC, their realtor claimed the home had been sitting on the market for at least a year;  the bedroom situation could have been the problem.  I reviewed their tour carefully and only counted 2 bedrooms, i.e. the two masters.  If the listing agent properly advertised it on MLS as a 2,600 sf home with 2 bedrooms, it would have been excluded from most buyers' searches.  For that reason, I'd expect most realtors to input the home on MLS as a 3 or 4 bedroom and try to explain it away in the comment section.  In any event, wouldn't most potential buyers be very disappointed if they toured that home, expecting 4 bedrooms?

 

I tried to check out their neighborhood (in the background) and the other homes appeared similar to each other.  They might have been included in a tract, built and sold earlier than the HHR home.  The 2 masters makes me wonder if that home was on infill, built as a one-off or "build to suit" home.  If so, its unique style and floor plan could make it tough to find good comps.  Appraisers don't want to be code police but they do use FNMA regulations and would have only included 2 bedrooms.  Although their main considerations are location and square footage, that appraisal would most likely include a negative valuation adjustment.

 

Unfortunately, many buyers would purchase that home at its discounted price and simply use it illegally.  If/when they begin remodeling, however, then they must comply with current code.  So, I was happy their darling daughter wouldn't be sleeping in a fire trap. 

 

ETA - you're right, they trashed the kitchen.  Too bad these sellers don't do demo themselves in order to carefully remove cabinets for donation or reuse.

Edited January 28, 2016 by aguabella

[aguabella]

Truther, I agree about the kitchen demo.  I was cringing when they were tearing apart the cabinets and shattering the granite.  Maybe the cabinets were not top grade, but surely they could have been donated to Habitat or another charitable organization for reuse by others.  Can granite counters be removed in large pieces for reuse as well?  

 

The additional labor cost probably exceeds the tax deduction.  Too bad they didn't handle demo themselves.  Older kitchen cabinets usually make great garage storage but those relatively new cabs would have made a Habitat shopper ecstatic!

 

Granite can be preserved if carefully removed, in large enough slabs.  Unfortunately, the installers so their best to make those seams permanent.  Plus, the slabs' sizes and weight complicate its removal, storage and donation, exponentially!

 

The best idea is to schedule Habitat or other used appliance and/or construction supply vendors to partially demo the kitchen, removing whatever they like.  Then, homeowners stress over a possible delay to the reno schedule, etc.

 

So, too bad.  No wonder some DIYers troll neighborhoods for "Free" signs and return after dark to dumpster dive!

[laredhead]

The Austin, Texas couple last night made a few rookie mistakes when they bought that house.  They underestimated what remodeling cost and did not check if what they wanted to do could be done on their budget.  First, I am shocked at the prices of those houses that almost qualify for tiny house status.  From the looks of the houses in the background on each of the houses they looked at, the neighborhoods certainly did not look like what I would consider upscale.  I'm guessing the areas are older and have become popular with the younger buyers which accounts for the prices. The house they finally bought is just over 1,000 sf and they proceeded to turn it into a 2 bedroom house by removing the 3rd bedroom.  Granted, in that market there are probably enough young buyers w/o children who will jump on it when this couple decides to sell in a few years.  They could always save up some money and spring for adding a 3rd bedroom later because the back yard looked large enough for that.  The contractor was not exaggerating when he told them it would be about $5,000 to move the electrical service and other utilities because I had to do that with a house I bought a few years ago.  It looked like everything, including the A/C compressor was on that back wall.  Even though the wall between the kitchen and dining/living room was removed, I thought there could have possibly been an eating bar and counter installed that would have provided more prep space and a place for 2 people to eat when they didn't want to sit at the table.  The space would have still been open.  Finally, I really like the slab doors on the kitchen cabinets, but I probably would have gone for a light or medium wood stain which would have given the guy his Craftsman look and would still have been a mid-century item.  The cabinets should have been leveled and double checked when they were installed.  I think the contractor and cabinet guy were taking the easy way out instead of wanting to eat the costs of redoing them.  Those looked like nice, solid wood custom cabinets by the way.  I loved the man wanting a great laundry room and he certainly spent some money on the washer and dryer, $3000.      

[Pickles]

I did not like the Austin houses at all. The prices seemed really high. For two people, 1000 sq ft would be way too small for me! The house they chose was really unappealing. No garage. A backyard looking out onto power lines and an old storage shed. I would be hesitant to make a three bedroom house into a two bedroom house, but maybe it will not hurt them when they resell. Those bedrooms were small! The neighborhood definitely looked older.

[juliet73]

Austin couple drove me batty! The cabinet installer should have mentioned it wasn't level when it was first installed or used shims. They went $10k over budget. Did they really need $3000 washer and dryer and a $500 toilet? They could have gotten all three for half the price. And $600 for someone to paint that tiny bathroom?? They were willing to install the bathroom tile to save money,but not paint? They have more money than common sense. And I agree with the other poster that the kitchen should have had a breakfast bar.

[NYGirl]

Yes that cabinet installer situation was very strange.  I thought that everything is leveled from the beginning and checked every step of the way.  I kept dozing throughout the episode so I didn't see it from the beginning of the renovation.  I have it in my TiVo box so I have to check it out.

[aguabella]

I was sort of surprised that opening up the atrium made the other two rooms up to code because I wouldn't want to be trapped in that space in a fire but I guess the smoke could escape.

 

 

There were a lot of tears this ep, weren't there? Husband, husband's parents, and wife all cried. I did like them though, and it was interesting to see how his being 6'7" affected the house hunt. I dated a guy who was 6'6" and lived in a small apartment and he had to have a handheld shower head in order to bathe. He didn't fit in the bathtub either, and he had a king-sized bed in a very small room so it basically took up the whole space.

 

I was a little confused about the atrium, but it ended up looking nice. And I liked the wine rack that the wife found and refinished - they did a nice job with it. I also liked that they incorporated her grandmother's light fixture - I thought that was a nice touch.

 

Good points about the Culver City atrium so I wanted to expand on the issue.  You guys are correct; an atrium wouldn't be up to code.  (In RE, the word "atrium" usually consists of an enclosed patio that spans two floors.  This space did neither of those, according to my determination.)

 

For proper egress, the trapped party must be able to reach the outside.  The issue is sleeping thru a fire, losing consciousness, ultimately consumed by either smoke and/or flames.  By definition, an atrium, doesn't provide egress.

 

I noticed a quick camera shot of a breezeway on the side of the house, towards the pool, during the couple's initial home tour.  Later, I noticed the narrow "atrium" patio, between the den and child's bedroom doors.  I suspect the "atrium" was open on the other side, i.e. the 4th wall / side where the camera operator was standing to obtain those shots / camera angles.  The new, narrow patio was probably connected to the existing breezeway. 

 

If it were my home, I'd rename that area the patio connecting to the breezeway or simply, the breezeway.  Lose an atrium but gain egress - sounds like a terrific trade!

Edited February 1, 2016 by aguabella

[Pathetica]

/scream /scream So they walk into a kitchen that is probably from the 80's with white tiles. Tiles in O.K. condition, but she just can't have them because "they will be stained in a second." /scream 40 years tiles survive, but she can stain them in a second. What a dirty, messy lady she must be. One second. One.

[carrps]

Culver City! My home town. I couldn't figure out where they were, though.

 

I just watched the couple in the San Fernando Valley. What is the deal lately??? Everybody buys some crummy house, guts half of it, and creates a gigantic white kitchen that looks like every other gigantic white kitchen on the show. So boring.

[DownTheShore]

Yeah, I don't get the women who say they have always dreamed of having a white kitchen . My sister had one, with the black granite countertop and white subway tile backsplash. She paid an arm and a leg for that thing and it was the most boring, generic kitchen on earth. She loved it; I hated it.

If I was getting a kitchen redone, and if I had the money, I'd get a tile floor from here, even though I like vinyl:

http://www.theantiquefloorcompany.com/Products_for_Sale/

Edited February 13, 2016 by DownTheShore

[laredhead]

Did anyone see last night's episode about the couple in Long Beach, CA?  The wife was obsessed with all things gold colored.  One of the houses they toured looked like a fun house in places, and the crowning touch was the red claw foot tub with gold feet.  I thought they were going to buy that house just for the tub, but reason prevailed.  I don't know how HGTV editors/camera people make a 1,300 sf house look halfway spacious, but they do.  My son lived in a house of that size, and there is no way it could have ever looked as large as the house last night.  I noticed in the reveal that they had removed the wall between the dining room and kitchen, even though the wife did not want the open concept.  That helped make the space feel larger, IMO.  I would have foregone the gold fixtures and spent some $$ on curb appeal, but to each his own.  Evidently the house did not have central heat or A/C, and after removing the ceiling radiant heat I got the impression the master bedroom wasn't going to have a heat source.  I'm not familiar with the weather in southern California, but I don't know how radiant heat in the ceiling is going to keep a room warm since heat rises.  Seems to me, you would be keeping the attic warm and not the room below it.   

Edited February 14, 2016 by laredhead

[DownTheShore]

I thought that was odd, too. And wasn't it merely wires embedded in the ceiling? How safe is that?

[juliet73]

I watched the beginning and the reveal of the Long Beach episode. She reminded me of Sandra Bullock. Her love of gold and brass was odd. I'm not one for open concept, but I think it was a good idea that they removed the kitchen wall. They didn't say if they went over budget, but it was nice to hear that they put other projects (landscaping,etc) on hold because they didn't have enough money. These other people who go tens of thousands of dollars over budget to have everything completed drive me crazy!

[laredhead]

Juliet73, he said that they managed to stay around $60,000 by not doing the outside improvements after using the $$ they had budgeted for that to buy the gold finished fixtures and French doors in the bedroom.