S02.E03: Hugs Can Be Deceiving

[vims]

This was the first episode that didn't work for me. I think they actually undid some of the beautiful Suzanne character work from S1. I've told people that for S1 you come for Crazy Eyes and stay for Suzanne but this episode is just all Crazy Eyes. It's the first time I've felt that the flashbacks got in the way of the character development. There's nothing in them that we hadn't already inferred and I still don't feel like I know Suzanne. The small exception that it more explicitly says that part of Suzanne's mommy issues have to do with lacking a black mother figure, which of course sets her up to be seduced by Vee.

 

On one hand I think Jenji Kohan is being smart by not giving us what we've come to expect from the flashbacks. There's no redemptive backstory; there's just crazy. But on the other I think it's a shame to reduce Suzanne to that and by attributing some of her problems to her white family, the focus is not on Suzanne but on her mother. I'm still thinking about this and it feels like a disservice to the character.

 

My opinion is also colored by how Suzanne is used in the rest of the season. And maybe it's okay since sometimes crazy is just crazy and that's all there is but it was disappointing.

[ganesh]

Well, I do expect a flashback is designed to help me understand a particular character better, which I have. So far, what I'm seeing is that some of these women just never could catch a break, which is sad, but it's interesting. 

[annlaw78]

 

The thing that made me really irritated was Suzanne's mother just showing up with her to the birthday party uninvited. That other mother would have been justified for a verbal smack down in saying look, it's not about race, it's a party for six year olds and other girls have older sisters not attending, but thanks for calling me a racist. Suzanne's mom is oblivious. She's protected Suzanne for so long she didn't see she's forced her into situations that she shouldn't even be in.

This is totally how I felt.  I didn't see this as a race issue, but as a "why are you bringing your fourth-grader to my kindergarten-aged daughter's birthday party?"  My sister and I had about the same age gap growing up, and there was no expectation that she and I would have the same circle of friends, and she never "tagged along" to my sleepovers, and I was certainly persona non grata at hers!  Suzanne was an "other" at that party, but it had more to do with her age than her race.  Suzanne's creepy story probably would have had some of her peers laughing -- there's a reason why vampire books, Goosebump books, and other paranormal fiction is so popular in upper elementary and young adult.  But to much younger girls, it was scary.  If they were trying to use that scene to show Suzanne's being marginalized and "otherized" by the pretty white girls because of her race, I don't think it works with that scene. 

[bravelittletoaster]

I think the problem is that Suzanne was developmentally behind, so she's at a developmental age closer to the other girls without being at their biological age.  That was what I gleaned from that scene, anyhow.

[kitcloudkicker]

This is totally how I felt. I didn't see this as a race issue, but as a "why are you bringing your fourth-grader to my kindergarten-aged daughter's birthday party?" My sister and I had about the same age gap growing up, and there was no expectation that she and I would have the same circle of friends, and she never "tagged along" to my sleepovers, and I was certainly persona non grata at hers! Suzanne was an "other" at that party, but it had more to do with her age than her race. Suzanne's creepy story probably would have had some of her peers laughing -- there's a reason why vampire books, Goosebump books, and other paranormal fiction is so popular in upper elementary and young adult. But to much younger girls, it was scary. If they were trying to use that scene to show Suzanne's being marginalized and "otherized" by the pretty white girls because of her race, I don't think it works with that scene.

I took it as showing that the mom was so sensitive to racial "othering" that she was completely missing other social cues - as well as developmental issues that Suzanne was having. Basically white guilt gone overboard, well intentioned but ultimately problematic and doing no favors for Suzanne.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

My sister and I were two grades apart and we never expected to be invited to the other's friends' birthday parties. The few people who invited us both to their birthday parties were our two neighbors because we all played together. But my mom never would have shown up with me at my sister's friend's party and told the mom that I was coming too. While I understand Suzanne's mom wanting her to be included, that's really not a great way to go about doing it. I think her mom had the best of intentions but didn't know how to deal with a lot of these situations.

[millennium]

There's no redemptive backstory; there's just crazy. But on the other I think it's a shame to reduce Suzanne to that and by attributing some of her problems to her white family, the focus is not on Suzanne but on her mother. I'm still thinking about this and it feels like a disservice to the character.

 

 

 

With some folks, crazy's all there is.  This is a woman who stalked Piper in a somewhat predatory manner last season and deliberately urinated on the floor outside her bunk.   Why she's in minimum security and not confined to a psych ward is beyond me.  

[Skittl1321]

 

Why she's in minimum security and not confined to a psych ward is beyond me.

 

That was explained last season- rich parents and a great lawyer.

[angora]

It struck me that, even beyond her mental health issues, Suzanne is at a disadvantage when it comes to socializing in prison.  She's in Litchfield's highly racialized "tribal" system in which she's expected to "stick with her own," but her flashbacks suggest she was brought up almost exclusively around white people.  She never seemed to fit in there, but she's not quite able to fit in here either.  I wonder what it was like for her when she first arrived in prison - if it was hard to get used to the expectation that she wasn't to hang out with the white inmates, if she was excited to find a black community and saddened when they didn't fully accept her either, and so forth.  The game the others were playing was such a sad, clear indication of the way they tolerate her without really including her.  No wonder she was ripe for Vee's manipulations.

[millennium]

That was explained last season- rich parents and a great lawyer.

 

Thank you, I must have missed that.   

[Veruca Assault]

I didn't remember any of Suzanne's story of her family from last season either. I think I'm going to have to go back and rewatch some of it.

[bravelittletoaster]

Basically they're in Fucksgiving and then she tells Piper a bit more about them and being sent to Psych in...I'm going to say episode 11? The one after Trisha's death.

Edited June 14, 2014 by bravelittletoaster

[Veruca Assault]

Thanks @bravelittletoaster , I'll check that episode out!

[DrLar]

By Suzanne saving Piper, not only once but twice. 

 

One for stopping her and preventing the kill (she wasn't going to stop

The other for making it look like they fought each other so more extra SHU time and possibly added sentence.

I'm still wondering how much time they'll add to Piper for lying under oath..

[halgia]

On Suzanne going to the birthday party: yes, of course it was completely inappropriate to bring a 10-year-old to a 6-year-old's birthday party. But my impression, based on the way her mom blew up, is: Suzanne was excluded from the social events that would actually have been appropriate, probably in fact thanks to a mix of her "weirdness" and some racism, but that her mom interpreted as only racism. After dealing with that for years, this event that she can shoehorn Suzanne into is an opportunity to get Suzanne invited somewhere, even if it's not really the right place, because she's not getting to go to the right places.

Also, right up to the last scene I was wondering if they were really going to pretend that Vee's cigarettes stayed good sitting in an electrical outlet for years. Made me happy that they addressed that at the end. :)

Nobody smokes anymore.  Most of the time I can fanwank it but in prison shows it gets kinda glaring. 

The CDC says that "more than 293 billion cigarettes were purchased in the United States in 2011" – that's almost a thousand per person in the population. In 2005 20% of adults smoked, 80% of those every day. Lots of people smoke.

[Misstify]

The poor saps huddling outside the entrance to my office building in any weather would agree…people smoke.

[lucindabelle]

Do we know what suzanne is in for?

I watched last year and thought her parents were old people. Am I misremembering? Also don't remember hearing about a sister then.

Larry continues to annoy.

[Princess Sparkle]

The CDC says that "more than 293 billion cigarettes were purchased in the United States in 2011" – that's almost a thousand per person in the population. In 2005 20% of adults smoked, 80% of those every day. Lots of people smoke.

ChaosTheroy can correct me if I'm wrong, but I interpreted what they meant as no one on tv smokes anymore, not that people in general don't smoke anymore. That's why it's glaring that no one on a prison show smokes, until cigarettes made an appearance in this episode.

Edited June 22, 2014 by Princess Sparkle

[annlaw78]

 

I watched last year and thought her parents were old people. Am I misremembering? Also don't remember hearing about a sister then.

Yes, they recast her parents.  They were older (60+) in the first season.  In this ep, they still appeared "young" (maybe early 40s?) in 2001. 

Edited June 24, 2014 by annlaw78

[lucindabelle]

Thanks, that clears that up. Because the people at the high school graduation which was only 14 years ago didn't look like they could be senior citizens 15 years later. I wonder if they originally conceived of her character as older, so her parents would be too. I mean, she's only in her early 30s. Do we know what she did to go to jail?

[InternalParadox]

I really hope they do more background on Suzanne, even another flashback episode focused on her young adult life, because this episode gave me no clue as to what she could have done to end up in a federal prison. I know that isn't a given with any character's flashback on this show, but we usually get some ideas.

Suzanne mother hit a huge pet peeve of mine: parents who are in denial about their kids' special needs and outright refuse to let other people try to help. I once worked with an autistic kid who's parents not only insisted that he only attend regular education classes but even signed him up for an elective drama class just to prove how "normal" he was. Special ed has a bad rap, but over the last 20 years or so things have improved by leaps and bounds, especially for autistic and emotionally disturbed children. There have been some studies showing that even kids with Downs Syndrome can develop (yes, develop) near-to-normal IQ levels with early intervention and quality education.

There is no way that a kid like Suzanne could have gone through school in any decent school system (and I got the impression she might have attended fancy private school) in the 90's without a teacher suggesting diagnostic tests at the very least, and a full service special ed plan with an IEP (Individualized Education Plan) at most, but there is not much a school can do if the parents fight against that.

Once a kid on the autistic spectrum or suffering from emotional disturbances ages out of the system, well, I hate to say that its too late for them to get help, but I'm involved in the adult mental health community and there are so many people with autistic tendencies who can't get the proper therapies (occupational therapy, social skills specialties, Applied Behavioral Analysis, etc) because they weren't diagnosed young enough to be eligible for it, and there are very few therapists that specialize in treating autistic adults. Often they are misdiagnosed with other mental illnesses, including schizophrenia. It's really tragic, and in someone like Suzanne's case, it is an almost completely preventable tragedy.

I want to specify that I'm not diagnosing Suzanne (I don't have the credentials to diagnose anyone in rl, actually). She could suffer from a variety of conditions, and possibly from two or more co-occuring conditions. What's clear is that she had symptoms as a kid and her mom pushed her to "be normal" rather than get her proper help.

[ilovese4]

With some folks, crazy's all there is. This is a woman who stalked Piper in a somewhat predatory manner last season and deliberately urinated on the floor outside her bunk. Why she's in minimum security and not confined to a psych ward is beyond me.

Suzanne hasn't really had adequate therapeutic treatment that we have seen to say she's beyond help. I agree her flashbacks suggest her parents would have refused to get her the help she needs because of a sort of well meaning denial of her difference. I also agree that the direct contrast between her flashbacks and Taystee's show she still had a much better life than many other kids in 'the system'. Taystee is actually pretty well adjusted for someone who had no stable loving parent.

Most of the offenders or ex-offenders I have met smoke. It would be a little surprising if Polly or Larry smoke, but still not beyond the realm of possibility.

Edited June 26, 2014 by ilovese4

[Mindymoo]

My cousin had Downs and was mainstreamed like Suzanne, and just graduated high school. Big mistake. He barely learned anything, is hyper-aggressive, can't stand to be around people laughing because he assumes they are laughing at him, and his parents just wanted him to have a "normal" school experience, despite how detrimental it has been to his well being. Not that Suzanne had Downs, but he reminds me of her in that way. His parents have the "NOT MY CHILD!" attitude that Suzanne's parents have going on, along with massive discipline problems, and it's really a sad thing to see. It's unfortunate that we have parents out there that are so ill-equipped to deal with mental illness and mental disabilities. I love my cousin dearly, but can't spend more than five minutes with him because he is so manipulative and hyper-aggressive, and bringing this to his parents' attention either results in them scolding me or them screaming at and spanking him. It's a sad situation all around.

[Hanahope]

I get why Suzanne's mom wanted her to go to the sleepover party, but as a mother of two girls, I would never impose like that if one daughter got a sleep over and the other didn't.  its not really fair to the one daughter to impose the sister on her party unless invited, though sometimes I have asked ahead of time if it was ok.  But then, Suzanne's situation is a bit different (both color and disposition) so perhaps that was the best the mother could do.

 

Love how Piper's vision of Litchfield has changed when she got a taste of what other prison life is like.  Thought it was funny that Suzanne ended up helping her out by hitting her.  Piper has gotten cold.

 

I like how that reporter isn't giving up on the whole federal prison funding bit.  I hope eventually Fig gets taken down.  Hopefully he eventually gets to Piper.

 

Oh Red and Vee is going to be good.

 

I had no idea cigarettes got stale.  And do they even provide ingredients to make chocolate frosting?  Cake I can see, its just flour, sugar, eggs, baking powder and other staple type ingredients, but I can't see prison popping for powdered sugar and chocolate.

 

Oh and love Nicky keeping notes in trying to find a new 'wife.'

[Ceindreadh]

but I can't see prison popping for powdered sugar and chocolate.

 

Ordinary sugar, maybe grind it up a bit finer, with cocoa/drinking chocolate for flavouring. 

Might not be pefect but should be acceptable in a pinch. 

 

[Gudzilla]

 

Nobody smokes anymore.  Most of the time I can fanwank it but in prison shows it gets kinda glaring.

 

ChaosTheroy can correct me if I'm wrong, but I interpreted what they meant as no one on tv smokes anymore, not that people in general don't smoke anymore.

Don't watch The Leftovers. ;)

[Fisher King]

My heart breaks for Suzanne.

 

Vee is going to be the villainest villain yet.

 

I like the new Lone Wolf Piper.