S01.E05: Ten Years Gone

[CooperTV]

Quote

Flashbacks reveal a haunting connection between Marshall and the early migration. Meanwhile, Jude investigates a mysterious disappearance, and Sophie risks her life and career to help Reece save her daughter.

Promo

[Dowel Jones]

So now we have a plotline where future Elizabeth Jennings Rebecca wants to eliminate any possibility of an Apex gene being carried through time.   This could get ugly, but DHS guy is definitely the weak link, here.  I think he's got a red shirt coming to him.

Poor ol' Marshall.  To quote the band The Lovin' Spoonful, "You better go home, son, and make up your mind."

[Lily H]

Well. That changes everything. Lindauer, dead Steve Harris character, woman-whose-name-I-don't-remember who shot Agent Ren, and all the rest of the First Wave, turn out NOT to be the bad guys at all. In fact, Lindauer wussed out on carrying out his assigned kill because the guy had a kid. Was that delay the reason their plan failed, or did they just miscalculate completely? And now Plan B seems to involve quite the slaughter. Things just got very interesting. Glad they finally cleared up some of the Marshall mystery.

[paulvdb]

Maybe the development of Apex is just inevitable and others would take over the work of the people they killed. Just like the death of Miles Dyson didn't stop Skynet from being built in the Terminator franchise.

[TigerLynx]

46 minutes ago, paulvdb said:

Maybe the development of Apex is just inevitable and others would take over the work of the people they killed. Just like the death of Miles Dyson didn't stop Skynet from being built in the Terminator franchise.

There are different theories about time travel.  Some believe if you change one thing, you change everything.  Others believe you can change one thing, and it will result in a better or worse outcome.  Then there is the theory that you can't actually change anything,  It's possible that traveling back in time, and doing what they do in the past results in the very future they are trying to avoid.

I think there are good, bad, and grey characters in each group.

It's kind of funny that shows keep doing these "the future is so horrible, certain groups of human beings become such monsters" SLs, because history has shown human beings are already capable of some truly monstrous despicable actions especially when it comes to one group of humans oppressing another group.  They don't need special powers developed in the future to commit mass murder.  It's already been done hundreds of times in the past.

[mertensia]

I wondering if the blood that got drawn from Reece that has the doctor going "I wonder what else this is good for" is the beginning of Apex.

[Netfoot]

3 hours ago, mertensia said:

I wondering if the blood that got drawn from Reece that has the doctor going "I wonder what else this is good for" is the beginning of Apex.

Something of a paradox, wot?!

[Accidental Martyr]

1 hour ago, icemiser69 said:

That doctor has "Frankenstein" written all over her. 

That said, the woman that has a heart problem might no longer have a heart problem if she injects herself with it.

Rebecca scares the crap out of me.  I don't care how good her intentions may be, she is one desperate woman.

It was pretty amazing that Reece could not only diagnose her heart problem but also determine that was the reason her mother abandoned her as a baby.

[TigerLynx]

2 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

That doctor has "Frankenstein" written all over her. 

That said, the woman that has a heart problem might no longer have a heart problem if she injects herself with it.

Rebecca scares the crap out of me.  I don't care how good her intentions may be, she is one desperate woman.

The road to hell is paved with good intentions, and deciding you need to murder innocent people to prevent a horrible future is not exactly a good intention in the first place.  The oppressed are becoming as bad as the monsters they were trying to escape.  Look at how bloody the French and Russian revolutions were.  I keep thinking of BTVS.  There was a prophecy that said the Master Vampire would rise, and Buffy had to defeat him.  It turned out that in order to rise, the Master Vampire had to drink Buffy's blood.  Master Vampire, "Prophecies are tricky things.  If you hadn't have come here, I couldn't have risen."

The whole point to Frankenstein's Monster is that Dr. Frankenstein is the monster.  He was experimenting with things he didn't understand, and couldn't control.  Then he abandoned his creation, and when his creation tracked him down, and started to kill innocent people, Dr. Frankenstein still didn't tell anyone what was really going on.

[chaifan]

5 hours ago, mertensia said:

I wondering if the blood that got drawn from Reece that has the doctor going "I wonder what else this is good for" is the beginning of Apex.

Yes!  I was thinking the same thing.  So are the Apex gene people being tracked down by Rebecca & the Originals a group that only exists because Reece came back in time in the first place?  Or are there people existing in the show's "now" that already have the Apex gene, who will now be targets for Rebecca & the Originals? 

I really liked this episode, as it did a lot to move the plot forward and now we see how it will develop from here.  Our bad guys are actually good guys, sort of. 

I still wonder if there's a story behind the deputy.  They keep almost going there, making me think he's got a whole other something going on, but then he turns out to be just a normal guy. 

[TigerLynx]

54 minutes ago, chaifan said:

I still wonder if there's a story behind the deputy.  They keep almost going there, making me think he's got a whole other something going on, but then he turns out to be just a normal guy. 

I think the deputy may be a sleeper agent, and he isn't supposed to act until all the players are present.  Whatever the original plan was, it didn't work.  More people came through including Reece an Apex, and the future doesn't seem to have changed, at least not the way they wanted it to.  Dutch (I know that's not his name, but whenever I see him I think Dutch from The Shield) didn't kill the guy he was supposed to.  Then there is Mr. my numbers were completely correct.  If something went wrong, it's not my fault guy.  Because in the history of mankind no one has ever been off even a little bit in their calculations.  Also, the doctor now has Reece's blood, and the antidote.  I'm still leaning toward what these people did in traveling to the past played a part in how the future comes about.  They aren't the cure.  They actually caused the problem.

[meira.hand]

12 hours ago, Lily H said:

Glad they finally cleared up some of the Marshall mystery.

I am still confused because how can anyone from the future know about him. The only possibility is that someone from the first arrival group met him and left a message in a prearranged place (like they did in the Frequency series). 

[Lily H]

3 minutes ago, meira.hand said:

The only possibility is that someone from the first arrival group met him and left a message in a prearranged place (like they did in the Frequency series). 

Oh, I LOVED that show! The locket is now gone and I only remember seeing a very brief glimpse of the pic, but I had been thinking it's also possible that he is Hannah's ancestor and the locket was passed down in the family. But in that case, would someone have known enough to tell her to look out for him?

[Dowel Jones]

5 hours ago, icemiser69 said:

I envy those who have the ability to recall just about everything on a moments notice. 

I'm not that good.  The Terror has me completely flummoxed.  However, I watch on Comcast, which has a DVR feature that has most of the important cast members identified by their characters.  It makes for easy reference.

I wonder if the unknown subplot is that Team Rebecca tracks down the Apex ancestors, in order to become Apex ancestors themselves?  Meet the new boss, same as the old boss?

[Haleth]

Well, that's twice I've been surprised by this show so I'm revising my original opinion that there was nothing new here. First time was last week, killing off Emma, and now this week when we find out the stereotypical, agenda hiding government bureaucrat is actually a good guy.  I'm still on the fence about the storyline and the acting, but for now it's holding my interest. 

[shapeshifter]

1 hour ago, Haleth said:

I'm still on the fence about the storyline and the acting, but for now it's holding my interest. 

Yeah, I'm still leaning over the fence in the direction of quitting the show.

So Marshall just magically remembers the people in front of the car on the night of the fatal car crash now?

[Ziggy]

On 5/1/2018 at 1:35 AM, Dowel Jones said:

Rebecca wants to eliminate any possibility of an Apex gene being carried through time.

 

On 5/1/2018 at 9:42 AM, icemiser69 said:

Rebecca scares the crap out of me.  I don't care how good her intentions may be, she is one desperate woman.

I am very confused ... I thought Rebecca was Caleb's wife?  (Caleb is the one protecting Hannah and answered Marshall's phone.)  One of the refugees?  I think you guys are talking about the woman from the earlier migration who shot Emma?  I can't seem to find her name.  I don't think she's listed on imdb ...

Edited May 2, 2018 by Ziggy
Clarifying Caleb

[Haleth]

I'm confused about names too.  I thought she was Eve?

[Ziggy]

7 minutes ago, Haleth said:

I'm confused about names too.  I thought she was Eve?

I'm so glad I'm not the only one!

[mjc570]

1 hour ago, Ziggy said:

I'm so glad I'm not the only one!

me, too!  I could have sworn LIndauer referred to her as Eve, but she (assuming it's the same person, hard to tell from the picture) is listed as Rebecca.  I can't even remember Caleb's wife

[shapeshifter]

I think Rebecca(?), who is from the first wave of time travelers, is the wife of the long haired guy in the second wave (maybe named Caleb).

 

Editing to correct: Red haired woman (Not Rebecca!) played by Melinda McGraw is from the group of people who arrived in 2008 from some time around 2178.
In the future she was married to Paul (long haired guy) who arrived from the future in 2018.
Now she is married to someone else and has a couple of kids, none of whom, AFAICT, we have seen.

Edited May 3, 2018 by shapeshifter

[MaggieG]

What was up with the girl at the end who was branded? Are we to assume she is a carrier for the Apex gene?

This show is definitely hooked me

[paulvdb]

9 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

I think Rebecca(?), who is from the first wave of time travelers, is the wife of the long haired guy in the second wave (maybe named Caleb).

I'm also bad with names, but if I remember correctly Caleb is the black guy. The husband's name is Paul and I only remember that because that is also my name.

[Ziggy]

2 hours ago, paulvdb said:

I'm also bad with names, but if I remember correctly Caleb is the black guy. The husband's name is Paul and I only remember that because that is also my name.

Right!  Caleb is the one who stood up to creepy, rapey guy who threatened Hannah.

[ursula]

On 5/1/2018 at 8:10 AM, mertensia said:

I wondering if the blood that got drawn from Reece that has the doctor going "I wonder what else this is good for" is the beginning of Apex.

Bingo. 

This is my exact thought. That this time travel thing is a closed paradox and all those guys coming back in time will (unknowingly) create the future that they are trying to prevent.

(Much like how in the first Terminator movie, Kyle Reese ? went back in time under orders from John Connor --- to become John Connor's father; and the Terminator was destroyed in Cyberdyne, leaving a piece of its arm that was now reverse-engineered.

Whoever came up with the idea of this show is a big Terminator fan).

4 hours ago, MaggieG said:

What was up with the girl at the end who was branded? Are we to assume she is a carrier for the Apex gene?

Is it just me or did this girl/her story literally appear this episode?

Edited May 2, 2018 by ursula

[peachmangosteen]

15 minutes ago, ursula said:

Is it just me or did this girl/her story literally appear this episode?

Not just you. She literally just appeared in this ep, along with the 2 doctors and/or nurses that were treating her.

There's so many characters like fuck please don't keep adding 10 every ep!

Anyway, I still unashamedly love this show and I really hope it's doing well enough that it gets a second season.

ETA: For what it's worth, the ABC site has Caleb's wife listed as Rebecca. It does not have the first arrival, red-haired lady listed as part of the cast.

Edited May 2, 2018 by peachmangosteen

[KaveDweller]

1 hour ago, ursula said:

Is it just me or did this girl/her story literally appear this episode?

 

I was so confused by that. I thought that one doctor was handling everything and that Leah was the only patient. Is this another little girl that came through the portal alone? If not, where are her parents? At first I thought she was some little kid in a different location and the doctors didn't know she was part of the migration. But it looks like she's in the same place. 

This show is drastically increasing the number of storylines to keep track of. I like it.

Edited May 2, 2018 by KaveDweller

[TigerLynx]

1 hour ago, ursula said:

This is my exact thought. That this time travel thing is a closed paradox and all those guys coming back in time will (unknowingly) create the future that they are trying to prevent.

If desperate red haired lady's plan to go bigger means killing even more people with the Apex gene, then I can understand why future Apex carriers have such contempt and no concern for regular humans.

[Haleth]

Speaking of children, there was a young child with the original travelers. He/she was wrapped in a blanket and was being carried by an adult, presumably the father. I wonder if that is someone we already met in present time.

[shapeshifter]

8 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

Editing to correct: Red haired woman (Not Rebecca!) played by Melinda McGraw is from the group of people who arrived in 2008 from some time around 2178.
In the future she was married to Paul (long haired guy) who arrived from the future in 2018.
Now she is married to someone else and has a couple of kids, none of whom, AFAICT, we have seen

I posted this^^ edit after rewatching the credits that come near the opening. Hulu wasn't happy with me, so I didn't get them all.

[mythoughtis]

22 hours ago, TigerLynx said:

If desperate red haired lady's plan to go bigger means killing even more people with the Apex gene, then I can understand why future Apex carriers have such contempt and no concern for regular humans.

Well, if I were being systematically hunted because of a gene in my DNA that made me stronger - I’d probably enhance it as much as possible too. So i could turn the tide in my favor. So yes, EVE - this is all your fault. 

Edited May 3, 2018 by mythoughtis

[ursula]

With all these speculations about the Doctor and Eve sort of kick-starting the events that lead to the Rise of the Apex, I feel I will be sorely disappointed if the show doesn't end up being a Closed Loop.

[jhlipton]

11 hours ago, ursula said:

With all these speculations about the Doctor and Eve sort of kick-starting the events that lead to the Rise of the Apex, I feel I will be sorely disappointed if the show doesn't end up being a Closed Loop.

The problem with Closed Loops is that makes the entire show or movie irrelevant.  If time is a closed loop, we could just stay home in our bathrobes and eat Cheerios.

[peachmangosteen]

What is a closed loop? I usually try to avoid time travel shows tbh because I never understand what's going on lol.

[Netfoot]

22 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

What is a closed loop?

In this context, a circular sequence of cause & effect.  

Example:  There was an egg which hatched into the chicken which time-traveled into the past to lay the egg which hatched into the chicken which time-traveled into the past...

[shapeshifter]

10 hours ago, jhlipton said:

 

22 hours ago, ursula said:

With all these speculations about the Doctor and Eve sort of kick-starting the events that lead to the Rise of the Apex, I feel I will be sorely disappointed if the show doesn't end up being a Closed Loop.

The problem with Closed Loops is that makes the entire show or movie irrelevant.  If time is a closed loop, we could just stay home in our bathrobes and eat Cheerios.

This could be a closed loop with a loop hole. That is: Some of the characters realize that the actions in 2018 that are intended to prevent the genocide of the future are actually the events that will bring about the future genocide, and so these characters act to stop the planned actions.

@ursula, I'm happy to spend more time home in my bathrobe, but I am going to assume "Cheerios" was autocorrect for "chocolate."

[jhlipton]

14 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

I am going to assume "Cheerios" was autocorrect for "chocolate."

LOL -- the "Cheerios" was mine, but I'm happy with your autocorrect.

[Efzee]

On 3-5-2018 at 11:49 PM, mythoughtis said:

Well, if I were being systematically hunted because of a gene in my DNA that made me stronger - I’d probably enhance it as much as possible too. So i could turn the tide in my favor. So yes, EVE - this is all your fault. 

Technically, it's Lindauer's (?) fault, because he didn't kill his target because the man was a father. If he had, then Eve presumably wouldn't have come up with this more radical idea of killing everyone with the gene. I'm also just going to assume her "new" husband and child(ren), she herself and none of the first wave refugees are carriers, otherwise she might not be such an advocate of this plan.

I wonder how they're going to go about this plan. How could they possibly determine everyone who has the gene? And why trust Lindauer and others to actually kill all these innocents, especially when he couldn't kill his initial target and Numbers!Guy was ready to call it quits. Maybe Eve and the woman holding a gun on Numbers!Guy should just execute the carriers of the Apex gene, at least they both look intent on doing whatever they think is needed. They can off the rest, to ensure no one betrays/stops them.