Hopes and Fears: How Will We Survive This Island? (Speculation WITHOUT Spoilers)

[akiss]

He has to keep having those early adventures.  That's how he got the experience points to become Season One Arrow.

 

One thing really interesting to me is how you can see the shape of pre-Olicity Arrow over the course of the first 13 episodes.  Figure in some sad, lesser world, Emily Bett Rickards (I refuse to abbreviate names.  It can be confusing and feels mildly disrespectful.  It doesn't that much longer to type the extra letters) had her two scenes in Episode 1.03 and then disappeared into Canadian obscurity.  At that point figure that Walter would have had some random minion do his investigation and ultimately hand off the book to Oliver after Walter was kidnapped.  Meanwhile, Oliver would have been going to different, somewhat quirky, Queen Consolidated experts making up excuse for whatever weird, potentially dangerous thing he wanted to know.

 

Figure that in 1.14 Oliver would likely have wound up in either Laurel or Thea's car, bringing one of them into the fold much faster.

 

As is, I'm kind of glad things worked out as they did.

Actually, I think that things would have gone differently. Some of the plot points would be the same and some would go another way. I do think that Laurel might have learnt Oliver's secret identity sooner, but not in 1.14. What would they do about the lack of chemistry and the awful backstory, though?

[dtissagirl]

Actually, I think that things would have gone differently. Some of the plot points would be the same and some would go another way. I do think that Laurel might have learnt Oliver's secret identity sooner, but not in 1.14. What would they do about the lack of chemistry and the awful backstory, though?

 

I think they would have kept trying to find a replacement love interest for the long run. Perhaps Helena would've been redeemed earlier, or McKenna would have stuck around longer, or maybe they would've given Oliver the LI of the week, until one clicked enough for a studio executive to notice.

Edited January 7, 2016 by dtissagirl

[statsgirl]

I think they were looking for someone to replace Laurel as his love interest at that point.  Maybe McKenna would have found him in her car, maybe a rehabilitated Helena further down the line.

 

ETA:  or exactly what dtissagirl was saying as I was typing this.

Edited January 7, 2016 by statsgirl

[Happy Harpy]

I think they were looking for someone to replace Laurel as his love interest at that point.

Taking this to the relationships thread, since it's past discussion.

[Starfish35]

Just now I was thinking about a possible Laurel death, and how that would tie in with Sara time traveling, and now I have a scenario in my head for her exit that I'm completely in love with. :( And I'm irrationally annoyed because I know there's no chance whatsoever of it playing out like in my head. :) It's probably just as well - I think my scenario is likely horribly unoriginal. Lol.

Does anyone else ever have that problem, of thinking up scenarios of how you want something to play out on the show, and then being disappointed when it doesn't happen that way, or is that just me?

Edited January 8, 2016 by Starfish35

[wonderwall]

Just now I was thinking about a possible Laurel death, and how that would tie in with Sara time traveling, and now I have a scenario in my head for her exit that I'm completely in love with. :( And I'm irrationally annoyed because I know there's no chance whatsoever of it playing out like in my head. :) It's probably just as well - I think my scenario is likely heavily cliched. Lol.

 

WELL DON'T LEAVE US HANGING :p What's your scenario?

[Starfish35]

I'm feeling like I got this from a Doctor Who episode or something. I think it's the one where Rose saves her dad, now that I think about it.

Anyway, it would basically play out kind of like that. Sara would be Rose and Laurel would be Pete. Laurel would come very near to being killed at the beginning of the episode, except out of nowhere she's saved by Sara! Because Sara's been time traveling and finds out that Laurel died at this moment in time. But then everything goes wrong, and they realize that for the timeline to be set right, Laurel has to go back to that moment and not be saved, so she makes the choice to do that. So she gets to die a hero, by her own choice.

Edited January 8, 2016 by Starfish35

[Guest]

Anyway, it would basically play out kind of that. Sara would be Rose and Laurel would be Pete. Laurel would come very near to being killed at the beginning of the episode, except out of nowhere she's saved by Sara! Because Sara's been tin traveling and finds out that Laurel died at this moment in time. But then everything goes wrong, and they realize that for the timeline to be set right, Laurel has to go back to that moment and not be saved, so she makes the choice to do that.

 

 

Well this is just rude and evil because now I want it to happen but it won't and my hopes, there go my hopes! :(

 

No but seriously, that's a pretty great idea. Too good for the Arrow writers though. Smh.

[wonderwall]

@Starfish35 that's probably a better idea than what the writers would come up with :p Now I'm ready to be disappointed. THANK YOU FOR THAT. Although I did ask for it so...

[Starfish35]

Lol! Well, I'm glad I won't be alone in my anticipated disappointment. :)

So how would everyone else kill Laurel (or other character of choice) off? We've discussed who will be killed off and who we want to be killed off. So how would you kill off the person you want to see in the grave?

Edited January 8, 2016 by Starfish35

[Sakura12]

I like that idea @Starfish35. Laurel dies a heroic death for her fans and the rest of us would be rid of her. 

 

I'm still mad that Sara's return was wasted on Laurel. She barely spoke to anyone else. She was friends with all of them but nope, in order for Laurel to have a purpose Sara can't talk to anyone else including her own father. 

[wonderwall]

Lol! Well, I'm glad I won't be alone in my anticipated disappointment. :)

So how would everyone else kill Laurel (or other character of choice) off? We've discussed who will be killed off and who we want to be killed off. So how would you kill off the person you want to see in the grave?

 

Lmao. I agree with Sakura12, I'd have her have a heroic death (for her fans because I'd feel bad for them if they killed Laurel off because she was an idiot). I'd want her to die trying to save her father. I think it would be rather apropos considering Laurel's main role on the show was to either fight with/make up with/support her family. Most of her scenes were with them. Not only would that help kick off Quentin's role next season, but it would also give her and her father a good moment before she dies. 

Edited January 8, 2016 by wonderwall

[Starfish35]

Even if my Sara/time travel scenario doesn't happen (which, let's face it, it won't - lol), I want to see Laurel die a heroic death, assuming it's her. Ideally I would like to see her in a scenario where she makes a conscious choice to sacrifice herself to save people, maybe just her dad, maybe everyone. I don't like the character, but if they do kill her off, I don't want it to be stupid, like so many things with her turn out to be. Let her go out in a big damn hero blaze of glory. I do NOT want to see her die a helpless victim, like Shado, Moira, and Sara.

Edited January 8, 2016 by Starfish35

[Morrigan2575]

I'm pretty sure that whoever ends up being the Death, it will be heroic, it usually is for Arrow.  

 

Tommy died saving Laurel

Moira sacrificed herself to save Thea

Oliver and Thea "died" fighting Ra's Al Ghul

 

The only one that wasn't given a heroic death was Sara in 301 and that's because they tossed her out like garbage in favor of Laurel...my how the times have changed.  

[BkWurm1]

I look at where Laurel is at as a character and I start thinking, yeah, they really could kill her off, couldn't they. But then I try to imagine how they kill her off and even though all the elements are pre written: heroic death, fighting uber evil guy, saving father- I can't actually imagine Laurel sacrificing herself like that.

[Morrigan2575]

I look at where Laurel is at as a character and I start thinking, yeah, they really could kill her off, couldn't they. But then I try to imagine how they kill her off and even though all the elements are pre written: heroic death, fighting uber evil guy, saving father- I can't actually imagine Laurel sacrificing herself like that.

Don't think of it as the sacrifice, think of it as the arrogance.   Laurel KNOWS (in her bones) that she's the only one capable of doing this because she's a HERO!

[johntfs]

Lol! Well, I'm glad I won't be alone in my anticipated disappointment. :)

So how would everyone else kill Laurel (or other character of choice) off? We've discussed who will be killed off and who we want to be killed off. So how would you kill off the person you want to see in the grave?

The currently alive Andy Diggle is shot by a zombie version of Deadshot, who now calls himself Deadershot.

[kismet]

Well I think I want LL to die a Heroic Death but I sorta want her to be doing it in her That's so Laurel Stupidity.... Like her intention was to be heroic and save her father, but then she showed up to the wrong factory & was killed.  Or perhaps she can leap in front of a bullet that was meant for QL, but was so off target it wasn't even close to hitting him.

 

Or maybe she just jumps off a building and everyone forgets to throw her a rope. Because seriously how many times can you jump off a roof and not bother to bring your own rope to not plummet to your death?

[way2interested]

Well I think I want LL to die a Heroic Death but I sorta want her to be doing it in her That's so Laurel Stupidity.... Like her intention was to be heroic and save her father, but then she showed up to the wrong factory & was killed.  Or perhaps she can leap in front of a bullet that was meant for QL, but was so off target it wasn't even close to hitting him.

 

Or maybe she just jumps off a building and everyone forgets to throw her a rope. Because seriously how many times can you jump off a roof and not bother to bring your own rope to not plummet to your death?

That last point always perplexed me because, even though I admittedly did think it always looks interesting (and I did like that shot in 402), I always felt so strange seeing Laurel just jump off of buildings and catching the ladder or waiting for Oliver to catch her or shoot her a rope, since I was wondering when did Laurel get all of this confidence that these things would be waiting for her? Especially since none of the training that she even seemed to have had anything to do with jumping off of buildings.

 

Anyway, I honestly can't picture how Laurel would die, if she would be the one in the grave. Nothing seems quite right to me, the only one I could even fathom would be a death a la Deadshot where she's on an exploding building saying goodbye to Lance in a parallel to the s1 finale when Lance thought he was going to die. 

[kismet]

That last point always perplexed me because, even though I admittedly did think it always looks interesting (and I did like that shot in 402), I always felt so strange seeing Laurel just jump off of buildings and catching the ladder or waiting for Oliver to catch her or shoot her a rope, since I was wondering when did Laurel get all of this confidence that these things would be waiting for her? Especially since none of the training that she even seemed to have had anything to do with jumping off of buildings.

The one thing LL has never lacked for is confidence. Confidence is one of her character strengths.... she knows in her bones that she will survive every leap, jump, fall and battle. In many ways she reminds me of how obnoxious & naive Buzz Lightyear was in the first part of Toy Story, until he was faced to come to reality that he was really a toy and not a space cadet. I keep waiting for her to get a similar realization that even though she wears a mask, she is not infallible or unbreakable, something bad can happen to her. I want something to shake her out of her overconfidence... But then I realize that the Arrow writers will never write her in a way that is not over-confident or obnoxious. And KC will always play LL as overconfident and arrogant, so even if they ever wrote a humble moment for LL, KC would just overact it or disregard the direction.

 

And she never really had any training, so for my own viewing preference, I have decided never to question where her "talents" or "skills" come from, I just assume she watched a cool youTube and decided to act it out.

Edited January 9, 2016 by kismet

[BunsenBurner]

Well I think I want LL to die a Heroic Death but I sorta want her to be doing it in her That's so Laurel Stupidity.... Like her intention was to be heroic and save her father, but then she showed up to the wrong factory & was killed.  Or perhaps she can leap in front of a bullet that was meant for QL, but was so off target it wasn't even close to hitting him.

 

Or maybe she just jumps off a building and everyone forgets to throw her a rope. Because seriously how many times can you jump off a roof and not bother to bring your own rope to not plummet to your death?

 

1000 thumbs up!!

[Primal Slayer]

The one thing LL has never lacked for is confidence. Confidence is one of her character strengths.... she knows in her bones that she will survive every leap, jump, fall and battle. In many ways she reminds me of how obnoxious & naive Buzz Lightyear was in the first part of Toy Story, until he was faced to come to reality that he was really a toy and not a space cadet. I keep waiting for her to get a similar realization that even though she wears a mask, she is not infallible or unbreakable, something bad can happen to her. I want something to shake her out of her overconfidence... But then I realize that the Arrow writers will never write her in a way that is not over-confident or obnoxious. And KC will always play LL as overconfident and arrogant, so even if they ever wrote a humble moment for LL, KC would just overact it or disregard the direction.

 

And she never really had any training, so for my own viewing preference, I have decided never to question where her "talents" or "skills" come from, I just assume she watched a cool youTube and decided to act it out.

 

They did make sure to address Laurel being shaken and defeated, of course it isn't nearly as much as she is confidant in herself but it happens(ed)

Edited January 9, 2016 by Primal Slayer

[tarotx]

I just randomly found some interesting Comic stuff. I think it's the direction they should go with Felicity's code name.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aurakles

He has the mission to "bring order and meaning where incoherence reigns" and is Alias is Oracle and spelled as Oracle and not Aurakle. But then I looked up Aurakle and found The Aurakles are a race of light based entities. Light is something felicity has been associated with.

http://www.comicvine.com/aurakles/4060-60205/

That brought me to Halo since "Aurakle" redirects there.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halo_(comics)

Halo is a gestalt of a human woman named Violet Harper and an Aurakle, an ancient energy-being resembling a sphere of iridescent ligh

 

Halo is also associated with light outside of comics.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/halo

 

So maybe they will Call felicity "Oracle" but have it Aurakle. Or call her Halo. 

[kismet]

Halo is nice but it causes Beyonce to be running through my head.

I also wonder if its trademarked by the video game...

But I guess we'll find it out soon.

[Chaser]

I would even take Alias as her code name. It's straight forward and has no hidden meaning, but I would take it over Oracle or Overwatch.

[wonderwall]

Codenames I wouldn't mind:

 

• Firewall
• Beacon
• Codebreaker
• Halo (someone mentioned it and I kind of like it)
• Proxy (even though we know this won't happen)

[BkWurm1]

I'm starting to be afraid that this is going to be one of those seasons that will be an agony to watch the first time around because we won't know if something will stick or not. That does leave me with the hope of sometime over the summer doing a rewatch and enjoying it knowing everything will be okay.

Crosses fingers.

[kismet]

I'm starting to be afraid that this is going to be one of those seasons that will be an agony to watch the first time around because we won't know if something will stick or not. That does leave me with the hope of sometime over the summer doing a rewatch and enjoying it knowing everything will be okay.

Crosses fingers.

I fear this too. It will be like Alias s3 -- except there is no overarching mystery to figure out. It's just all misery awaiting us on ARROW. And we know that the writers are creatures of habit, which means most stuff won't actually move to a resolution until the last 4 episodes anyway. So there are about 9 episodes who's sole purpose may be to challenge the audience's patience & tolerance.

 

The problem too... is after a season like this, the show can lose a lot of steam & direction. It was already wobbly after s3, seemed to regain it's footing and now it's teetering again. I just fear that this season is going to crash & burn worse than s3. At least s3 for the majority was for plot purposes, so it explained why it was so bad. They seem to be making an effort to make s4 more character based. It's plotty, but everything can be linked back to known character traits. There have been very few OOC moments in s4 to wave away the the propping/plotting moments, if they keep that trend s4 may be more detrimental to the characters and I'm not sure I can tolerate that. Fingers crossed the game-changing is an actual growth curve in the writers room to writing better scripts & stories. They steal from enough sources, you think they might actually learn something one of these times.

[kismet]

Sadly no, it's gonna be piped on it, and last day of lab will be Tuesday the day before so.. once it's done it's done.

and I can't give her a different codename cause i'm doing it for both of them so Oliver would be "Oliver Arrow Queen" (with each word in a different language: english chinese and russian) and Felicity would be "Felicity _____ Smoak" (done in binary- Which is going to be a pain! but so be it)

I'll try the ep's once my sketch is done, maybe they'll be nice. I feel like Stephen will be the best option to reveal the name.. if i'm nice enough.

Has BINARY been thrown out as a possibility for the codename? Your post inspired me to think it might be an option for FS.

[Morrigan2575]

I don't think it has but, I LOVE it!

[Trini]

Wait -- so they killed off Waller on the show; should we expect Boomerang to get killed off too? (Maybe on The Flash) Katana? (No!) I assume it's partly because of the movie versions coming soon. What other Suicide Squad characters have shown up on Arrow?

[statsgirl]

I assumed they killed off Deadshot and Waller because Will Smith and Viola Davis are big stars.  It might not be the same for characters played by lesser known actors.

[Starfish35]

I am actually really afraid for Katana now. :(

[Sakura12]

I still don't get people that say that DC is smarter not having a shared universe when the outcome is the same. At least with Marvel having one active character makes sense with it being a shared universe. What's DC's excuse? Do they think people are dumb and can't handle having two different actors playing the same character.(when the characters would not even be the same being it's a different universe)

 

There is no reason to kill off Arrow's characters for the movies. 

Edited February 2, 2016 by Sakura12

[dtissagirl]

Do they think people are dumb and can't handle having two different actors playing the same character.(when the characters would not even be the same being it's a different universe)

It's worse than that. They thought people were dumb enough to not understand that the Oliver Queen in the Smallville digital comics wasn't the same Oliver Queen in Arrow + Arrow digital comics. So they ordered him removed from the Smallville comics for half of the run.

[Sakura12]

It's worse than that. They thought people were dumb enough to not understand that the Oliver Queen in the Smallville digital comics wasn't the same Oliver Queen in Arrow + Arrow digital comics. So they ordered him removed from the Smallville comics for half of the run.

 

Seriously? What is wrong with them? 

[rtalive]

I really like how grown up in his personal life is Oliver  this season. I hope they don't ruin it and make him take stupid decisions again. I just hope they make him more clever as a person and as a professionalist in what he does best - fight crime. He has to think more in advance, plan and investigate, not just wait for something to happen and then deal with the consequences. I like the fact that there are very smart women around him, but he as the most experienced person dealing with evil should take the lead and make the important decisions which are not influenced by emotions all the time. I want him to stay in a healthy relationship and still win the fight with the big bad. I think that all the unnecessary drama and killing off characters just make the show skin deep. It's the easy way to keep people watch, instead of some really compelling stories about villains, fighting crime,bringing  justice, finding love, hope and so on, which we have occasionally in some episodes.

I also like the writers  to bring back the detail of the scenes, mass scenes, street, news, police, ordinary people. All the characters these days look isolated from the other world. We only see the main characters and not any other people to create realism.

 

[kismet]

Another reason I want Laurel in the grave, people can stop ignoring what is going on the show in favor of citing comics.

Seriously, the whole Olicity is going to break up and Oliver and Laurel are going to get back together is so tiring. Have these people never watched an episode of TV ever? Every couple has at least one break up for drama purposes before getting back together. And there is zero in show reason to believe that Oliver and Laurel are getting back together.

This is gonna sound crazy... So it could be related to the fact that I have been up for a little over 24hrs at this point. But you know what I want. -

I want them to break up O/F and give us this great epic romance between O/L for at least a half of a season, if not longer.

 

I want them to do it. I challenge them to write me at least 10 episodes of Epic GA/BC romance. No recastings, no magical character pollyjuice. Just SA & KC acting out the amazing romantic plots & musings of the Arrow Writers room. We can have cheating & soulmate angst. Lost souls finding each other through the midst of their own romantic foolery and headstrong temper tantrums. I want them to do it and then I want them to see what the ratings are like.

 

Perhaps FS can take an extended break to Australia to work on her company's holdings ala Walter in s1. Or perhaps she joins Rip for a mission or two. I would even concede her going to CC to help with whatever dumb decision BA has made this week. Or so they can't blame the ratings drop on FS being absent from the show. Let's keep her on and have her be OQ's ex but still good friend. They can banter, but absolutely no heart eyes or indications of reconciliation. Perhaps we can give FS a stable LI not looking for a spin-off that is better cast and written as whole character and not just OQ-lite.

 

Let's do it! I'm game for it. The writers think they are so talented at writing amazing love story let's see them do it. Doing it all on their own, no assistance from natural actor chemistry. I just want it out of everyone's systems. The writers need to let go of the pre-manufactored Loliver stories, so they can actually write for Olicity. The audience that has been jonesing for a L/O pairing can finally get their wish and see just how powerful their viewership is. The Felicity Fans can finally see a strong FS independent of OQ.

 

And I can perhaps finally either learn to love the show again or finally let it go. I can't take another season or even half a season of them putting lipstick on the pig to cover their writing deficiencies. They want to play Russian Roulette with their audiences emotions, I'm willing to ante up. But I came to play... go big or go home... so I say give me OQ & LL star-crossed soulmates being the justice you can't run from and let's see if they fail the city or not.

 

Honestly, they probably don't have the balls to kill off LL or let O/F be happy, so let's try something new in the upcoming episodes.

Edited February 5, 2016 by kismet

[tv echo]

Wasn't that Season 1 - culminating in the O/L sex scene that one reviewer described as two pieces of cardboard rubbing up against each other?

Edited February 5, 2016 by tv echo

[kismet]

Wasn't that Season 1 - culminating in the O/L sex scene that one reviewer described as two pieces of cardboard rubbing up against each other?

Nope, they chickened out and went tropey love triangle route. I want pure OQ/LL making it work one misguided decision & epic gamechanging twist after another together as a unit. I want them thrown through the ringer to prove their relationship is strong.

 

Well they've had 4 years to improve their sex scene writing skills, so I hope they took notes. Plus now it will be shoulder pads, pleather & buckles rubbing up against each other, a completely different scene altogether.

Edited February 5, 2016 by kismet

[AyChihuahua]

I...kind of love it? Because yeah, by far the biggest reason for O/F's popularity is the actors' chemistry. It's a crutch the writers have come to rely on. So take away the crutch and see how they do.

Also, ratings would go in the toilet, which would make me laugh, and maybe Guggie really would get fired, which IMO would be the #1 best thing that could happen to the show. I know a lot of people here hate Laurel, and I don't particularly care for her either, but while she was, to me, the very worst thing about S1 and S2, her negative effect on the show was utterly dwarfed by the 10,000 other huge problems in S3, and so far she's nowhere near the worst thing about S4, either. Everything I hate about the show, except for the crappy stunts, is Guggie's fault. I personally would promise never to complain about Laurel again if Guggie (and Bamford) were canned.

[Starfish35]

I would walk away from the show and never look back if they did that. Sorry kismet. I'm not an Olicity shipper but I loathe Lauriver with a deep and burning passion.

[kismet]

I would walk away from the show and never look back if they did that. Sorry kismet. I'm not an Olicity shipper but I loathe Lauriver with a deep and burning passion.

No need to apologize!! I'm not a shipper of either couple. I really do enjoy Olicity, but it's not the major reason I started watching the show. It is why I tuned back in after s2 got plotty. The ILU was ballsy, it's sorta the last ballsy thing they did that was positive and not about killing off a cast member. But I loved the promise of chemistry and I enjoyed s1 & s2 which had them flirty & not together. I loathed s3 which intentionally kept the characters from interacting at all in any capacity to avoid inadvertent chemistry that contradict badly plotted plot. And I hate how the writers are ruining stories with potential in s4, just so they can have a just-in-time break-up/make-up for sweeps. So O/F together is not what solely keeps me tuning into the show. It is why I read fan fic though. :) And honestly, I'm struggling in the present to figure out why I still care about the show.

 

As for Lauriver, I will say that I never shipped them. But if I'm being honest, I did like the dynamic they set-up in s1 with LL & OQ being at odds but finding their way back together until of course the blackhole of SA/KC chemistry met the black matter of crappy writing and we go that horrible last 3rd of s1. So, it would be nice to see if the Arrow Writers can make the crap they dreamt up in s1 actually work now that both characters are fully realized masks.

 

MG seems to think he is best writer & showrunner in town (in probably all genres). So let's see if the talk can match the walk. I doubt he will even be able to keep the pace. The show & viewership would most likely tank. And I would most likely walk away. I still love OQ's hero's journey, so I might stick around longer. However, if the s4 FB are any indication, MG & co are even finding ways to screw up that journey. FBOQ should be getting darker to bring us to the pilot OQ, not getting more like present day OQ. But at least when I walked away, I could hold my head up knowing that I didn't stick around week after week, being bamboozled into watching one show while being fed the plotlines for a completely different show. I finally was able to see the show the writers intended to write.

 

I agree with @AyChihuahua, the writers have been using the chemistry of SA/EBR for too long to sell their crap plots. EBRs charisma couldn't sell RP. SAs charisma is failing the s4 FB. And I wonder what is gonna happen to all his heart eyes & puppy eyes when he is forced to reveal his big FOR PLOT secret kid. And KC, well she is the "lead" female star of the show, it's about time she earn her 2nd billing again. Besides if the ARROW writers are the amazing writers they seem to imagine they are, they should be able to overcome any chemistry or lack thereof. If not, they can just have someone hallucinate a dead character for plot exposition to fill in the blanks.

 

So I say remove the crutch and give the masses what they want. Even if it implodes the entire show as we know it. We can all walk away guilt-free. We loved the show when it was good and stayed around long enough to walk away, but not long enough to be buried in the crumbling heap of ego, bad characterization & epicly poor writing.

[lemotomato]

I wouldn't care if they only brought back L/O temporarily to get it out of their systems with Olicity as eventual endgame. I'd drop the show right away and never go back again. I put up with a lot on this show, but L/O is my deal breaker.

Also, making Laurel the love interest would give her more screen time, and just... no. No to any and all aspects of your scenario, kismet.

Edited February 5, 2016 by lemotomato

[Starfish35]

I......guess I don't really get it, kismet. I'm sorry. Attribute it to not having had my morning caffeine yet, but I feel like something is whooshing over my head.

I'd drop the show right away and never go back again. I put up with a lot on this show, but L/O is my deal breaker.

Deal breakers for me are Lauriver and killing Diggle. Either one....this show is done for me.

Edited February 5, 2016 by Starfish35

[Guest]

Kismet, that sounds like the worst idea ever. Do you have a fever? Are you okay? Have you gone to the dark side?

 

In all seriousness though, I can't think of anything worse than going back to O/L. I can watch a show without Olicity. I cannot watch a show with O/L. Deal breaker for me. 

[apinknightmare]

eh, never mind.

Edited February 5, 2016 by apinknightmare

[kismet]

I might have gone to the dark side... I might be over exhausted. I think I've just reached DD levels of fix-it with this show.... Part of me wants the show to die (metaphorically in the ratings), because I want the preconceived Loliver plots to finally go away. I want a rebirth with Olicity as endgame, but we will never get that until they have played out every last Loliver intended plot for plot's sake storyline.

 

Honestly, remove SA & EBR's chemistry, strip away the character names and in the bones of the writers' O/F couple stories for O/F are essentially O/L couple stories just covered in more appetizing sauce because of SA/EBR. They are giving us Loliver it's just covered in Olicity sauce.

 

OQ not fighting for FS in s3, because he wanted her to be happy. Its s1 all over again except starring RP & FS instead of TM & LL

FS just forgiving OQ no really explanation or grievances aired - complete LL/OQ on again/off again relationship merry-go-round

S2 OQ turning to SL for physical comfort when his emotions about his feelings for FS got to be too much, sound familiar - just no boat this time.

FS turning to the next available OQ-lite bachelor that loves her, its s1 LL/TM all over again

Even the bulk of the s2 ILU, was a redeux of s1 hallway scene only with better acting

BMD - self-explanatory OQ/LL plot line from conception to delivery (definitely pun intended)

 

With the exception of 320, because that episode is too special to be tarnished by my rant. Take every major written relationship plot moment (not the subtle moments we all love), substitute LL in it (with better actor chemistry) and it works. I'm not trying to bring down Olicity, I'm just saying the writers are not writing for Olicity. We love Olicity, but its in the acting - not the writing. It's in what we bring to our interpretation of the relationship. The writers are writing for Loliver, and until they can get those plots out of their system - I want to be done watching OQ/SA & FS/EBR twist their characters to somehow make these inorganic plot lines work for the writers. So I'm hoping for the return of L/O (words I never thought I would type), if it means I may finally get a fully developed O/F in the writing & not just the acting. 

 

If the show sucks, it sucks - but at least it would be honest. I'm so tired of this show getting me excited and the pulling the rug out from under me. And on the positive, they could cast a really attractive LI for FS that we wouldn't have to spend every other moment loving him for his heart eyes and hating him for his plotty plot ways. We could just love him & EBR together until something tragic happens to him and we can get a OQ & FS reunion after a properly spaced grieving period to coordinate with sweeps of course.

 

BONUS PERK - Maybe if they finally get GA/BC legit romantic pairing for a few episodes, they might actually be willing & ballsy enough to kill off LL.

Edited February 5, 2016 by kismet

[Starfish35]

I guess where you're losing me is that it seems like you're assuming the writers' desire to write this particular type of draaaama-filled relationship means they'd rather be writing for Lauriver. And I don't believe that. I think they love Olicity. They just want Olicity their way. It seems like you're assuming that if they got all of the angsty beats out of their system with Lauriver, that they would write Olicity without the drama, and I don't believe that for even a millisecond. This is just how they write relationships, as aggravating as it might seem.

And secondly.....ok, I've admitted not being an Olicity shipper, so maybe my perspective on this isn't the same as a shipper's, but personally, Oliver returning to Laurel after being with Felicity would taint Olicity for me irrevocably. I may not ship them, but I'm never been against them. But being in a relationship with Laurel, and then going back to Felicity? Not enough "ughhhhh" in the world. Run Felicity. Run far far FAR away.

I guess, if I'm reading you right (and I'm not sure I am) you feel like them doing Lauriver and then ending it would mean you finally get the show you want. And personally I don't believe it would. It would just be more of the same, only worse. And it would kill the show for me, personally, so.....*shrug*

Edited February 5, 2016 by Starfish35

[tangerine95]

I don't think they've just replaced Laurel with Felicity and are just writing the same story with a different character.I think they adjusted their story a lot to move the romance focus to Olicity.I don't think this is the way they would have been writting L/O tbh especially them in a relationship.Imo they don't have a desire to go back to that relationship at all and I don't think it was hard for them to give it up.They pretty much gave up on it mid season 1 .

The love triangle and the I can't be with you beats in season 3 are just kinda classic superhero tropes it was clear Oliver was going to go through and I don't think it was weird for that to happen with Felicity.The baby mama stuff was introduced when Olicity was already their plan imo and if they did it with Lauriver in mind it wouldn't have happened while he was still with Laurel and I think once they weren't making the kid Connor they decided it would be a romantic stall.

They're just not that original and are doing classic TV drama stuff that all shows do with their main couple.Olicity actually gets less of that imo.I've seen stuff a lot worse then Oliver pretty much forced to lie to Felicity(i don't think he actually was forced and there was a simple solution but they want us to consider him forced).

Nothing that they have done with olicity has pissed me off that much tbh and I'm actually enjoying the show this season despite the BM drama which I'm just ignoring and waiting out and hoping we get growth from Oliver out of it, so I'm not at the stage of wishing they sink so low that they go back to L/O lol.Something like that would for sure ruin Olicity for me.

Edited February 5, 2016 by tangerine95