S05.E17: Breaking Point

[Jaded]

Quote

The death of a well-known Alderman, who is known for his urban revitalization efforts, leads Intelligence to investigate the corruption that haunts his neighborhood; Olinsky begins to feel pressure after Woods gives him an ultimatum.

[milner]

A hair on a body and a witness at night do not make a murder charge/case. All Al needs to do is keep quiet. But sadly we finally get an episode about Al and he still only speaks a couple of dozen words.  I hope he doesn’t solve the issue with suicide. Voight needs to step up. 

[doLLish]

Boring episode.

I don't like what they're trying to do with Olinsky and Voight. Fix it and get Woods out of here OMG. This character has completely overstayed his welcome. End it.

[mysticalflute]

Good God. Denny Woods is the worst character on this show. So tired of him. I honestly had no sympathy for him when his daughter died a few weeks ago and I'm rooting for Voight as more time goes on.

Given this was the death of an alderman, I'm surprised that this episode was so boring.

[LittleIggy]

I effing hate Woods. Too bad his stupid daughter pulled through.

[Guildford]

So I guess that's the end of the Ruzek storyline then, Woods has moved on, Ruzek is off the hook and we will never hear about the sister again.

I don't blame Al for being pissed off with Voight, he's covered his ass on more than once over the years I am tipping and that's the thanks he gets...I'd be happy for Al to hang him out to dry tbh.

And yes, Woods has been around far too long.....I guess we've got what? 4 more episodes of this nonsense to go.

[CheshireCat]

8 hours ago, Guildford said:

I don't blame Al for being pissed off with Voight, he's covered his ass on more than once over the years I am tipping and that's the thanks he gets...I'd be happy for Al to hang him out to dry tbh.

It was the killer of Olinsky's partner who they put at the bottom of the Chicago River or the lake, whichever body of water that was. And Olinsky and Voight seemed in sync about how to handle the interrogation of the guy who was involved in the bombing in the first cross over. Generally, Voight and Olinsky pretty much seemed to be in agreement of how to handle things. and Voight has respected when Olinsky didn't want to "go there". But I think Olinsky is guilty of a lot more than "ass covering".

[peacheslatour]

I haven't watched this show yet but I do like cop shows, is it anything like the dreadful Blue Bloods or more like Hill Street Blues?

[VinceW]

10 hours ago, Guildford said:

So I guess that's the end of the Ruzek storyline then, Woods has moved on, Ruzek is off the hook and we will never hear about the sister again.

I don't blame Al for being pissed off with Voight, he's covered his ass on more than once over the years I am tipping and that's the thanks he gets...I'd be happy for Al to hang him out to dry tbh.

And yes, Woods has been around far too long.....I guess we've got what? 4 more episodes of this nonsense to go.

Agree. Olinsky has helped cover up the Voight 'street tax' fund over the years. Olinsky is in trouble now because he helped Voight move the body of his son's killer.  He had nothing to do with the original killing. Erin is at risk as well because she tried to stop Voight from the revenge killing. Voight made the killer dig his own grave before his self confession, but the body had to be moved later after Erin realized the location was uncovered by the brass while she was under surveillance.  Voight is the one who needs to fix things in order to keep Olinsky from trouble.  It can't all be about protecting Erin at this point.  I am sure Voight realizes that and he will call in a favor to get rid of the evidence.

Edited March 15, 2018 by VinceW

[Xeliou66]

I guess I’m the only one rooting for Woods in this storyline. Voight needs to go down, he’s a crooked, murdering scumbag,    Woods is dirty but Voight is worse and more dangerous, Woods hasn’t murdered anyone. Woods was right when he told Al that Voight wouldn’t take the fall for him, Al shouldn’t take the fall for Voight, he isn’t worth it. It’s also absurd how nothing has happened really, not only did Ruzek escape completely from either getting fired or having to turn on Voight, but Olinsky would be charged with murder based on the DNA evidence alone if this was real life, any halfway decent investigator would do that. If Peter Stone was in Chicago still he would have Olinsky charged with and indicted for murder, he would be suspended from the force and then he would have to choose whether to risk everything for Voight or to turn on him. I have no idea how Voight will get out of this jam but he shouldn’t, he’s a fascist, evil piece of shit asswipe who represents the worst in American policing, and it would be absurd to have everyone escape from this unscathed, I feel like the only way for Voight to not go down is for the show to get rid of Olinsky, and Olinsky doesn’t deserve to take the fall for what Voight has masterminded. 

[watcher1006]

Woods is clearly trying to get Olinsky to turn on Voight but I don't see any way in the universe of this show that that would ever happen. As for Ruzek, Woods has figured out that his loyalty is to Voight and that any attempt to use Ruzek against Voight is going to get back to Ruzek's boss.

6 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

I guess I’m the only one rooting for Woods in this storyline. Voight needs to go down, he’s a crooked, murdering scumbag,    Woods is dirty but Voight is worse and more dangerous, Woods hasn’t murdered anyone. Woods was right when he told Al that Voight wouldn’t take the fall for him, Al shouldn’t take the fall for Voight, he isn’t worth it. It’s also absurd how nothing has happened really, not only did Ruzek escape completely from either getting fired or having to turn on Voight, but Olinsky would be charged with murder based on the DNA evidence alone if this was real life, any halfway decent investigator would do that.

I thought hard about whether I wanted to go back to watching this show the following fall after the finale "Start Digging" two years ago. The message seems to be that "old school" policing is good as long as you don't get caught. The methods they used - burning the face of Kevin's accomplice on the stove, shooting an unarmed guy in the knee, going to organized crime figures to capture Kevin (no doubt with some implied quid pro quo) goes against the whole idea of humane community policing, and it is improbable that Voight has gotten away with it all for so long.

[CheshireCat]

1 hour ago, watcher1006 said:

Woods is clearly trying to get Olinsky to turn on Voight

Now that you're saying it out loud, that doesn't even make sense if I consider what I said above. Olinsky was obviously involved in at least one extrajudicial killing as well. I'm sure Woods has heard rumors. So, thinking that someone would turn on his long-time colleague and partner under those circumstances makes no sense unless you go investigate them and then make them a deal which obviously isn't the case.

 

1 hour ago, watcher1006 said:

I thought hard about whether I wanted to go back to watching this show the following fall after the finale "Start Digging" two years ago.

Back then, I wanted them to definitely say what happened. It was more likely than not that Voight had done it after the premiere of the following season, but there was still the possibility that he hadn't and I've come to accept it and thought that was okay. I didn't want them to revisit it because of the dilemma that they're facing now: how do they handle it? Voight was/is a dirty cop but he's loyal and protecting his people. He was an anti-hero and I still liked him and I liked that I didn't have to judge him and that the show didn't really judge him. Not saying definitely whether or not he killed Justin's murder was an integral part of that and I think they should have left it at that.

[FinnishViewer]

11 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

I haven't watched this show yet but I do like cop shows, is it anything like the dreadful Blue Bloods or more like Hill Street Blues?

I would describe this as 'The Shield' -light. You have protagonists who often use dirty tricks to make their cases, although I think Voight is not quite there compared to Vic Mackey.

[peacheslatour]

12 hours ago, FinnishViewer said:

I would describe this as 'The Shield' -light. You have protagonists who often use dirty tricks to make their cases, although I think Voight is not quite there compared to Vic Mackey.

Thanks! So kind of like NYPD Blue, where they used a lot of lies and deception to get confessions?

[CheshireCat]

4 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

Thanks! So kind of like NYPD Blue, where they used a lot of lies and deception to get confessions?

I think it's more strong-arming and bending the rules than lying.

[momtoall]

Just started watching this series.  Caught previous seasons on cable.  Maybe it's because I've watched five seasons in the matter of a couple on months but it seems that every season two to three episodes are devoted to some higher-up trying to get Voight.  Do the writers think viewers find this compelling?   I feel it's lazy writing.  Surely they can fill episodes with something other than "Voight's career is in peril again".

[mommalib]

Voight needs to go down eventually. He need to be held accountable.

[Raja]

On 3/15/2018 at 11:45 PM, FinnishViewer said:

I would describe this as 'The Shield' -light. You have protagonists who often use dirty tricks to make their cases, although I think Voight is not quite there compared to Vic Mackey.

 

17 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

Thanks! So kind of like NYPD Blue, where they used a lot of lies and deception to get confessions?

The Shield is what immediately pops to mind only Intelligence Unit hasn't gone full out to crime for personal gain but like how the Strike Force started by framing the guilty. On the other hand Chicago PD has gone full scale torture of suspects and I don't remember that from anything except the first few years of the Hawaii 5-0 reboot with their  creative enhanced interrogations. From Homicide Life on the Street through the recently cancelled Major Crimes using deception was a feature of closing cases.

 

With city officials looking the other way from the torture room because another big case popped up is another call back to The Shield. The Law & Order mother-ship is about the only franchise showing the justice system excluding evidence when the torture or overly enthusiastic deception happened. One reason fro the Chicago Justice to fail was trying to start another show like Law & Order but not taking down some of the biggest criminals in Chicago, the PD Intelligence squad.

[FinnishViewer]

Quote

Thanks! So kind of like NYPD Blue, where they used a lot of lies and deception to get confessions?

If you really squint, you might see some NYPD Blues DNA in it, but while they also use lies and deception, they also use a lot of stuff that either are straight up torture, or close to it to close their cases. They also concentrate mostly on one case in each episode, unlike NYPD Blues where the detectives would investigate 2, or even 3 cases in an episode. There's also more action with gunfights and car chases.

[VinceW]

8 hours ago, Raja said:

.....taking down some of the biggest criminals in Chicago, the PD Intelligence squad.

Biggest criminals seems an exaggeration.  The torture extremes only come into place when it becomes personal.  Olinsky (daughter);  Voight (son Justin murdered);  Antonio (son kidnapped); Burgess (sister sexual assault)   The surveillance cameras installed in the cage room has ended the in house torture for the most part this season.  Voight and Olinsky are old school; Run from a cop, you get a beating. Shoot at a cop, you get killed. 

Edited March 17, 2018 by VinceW

[Dvldj]

I barely watched this episode. It was painfully boring. I even missed the son of the alderman being killed because I was half-ass watching it. Sadly, this show is not what it used to be and I'm finding it harder and harder to tune in.

On 3/14/2018 at 11:10 PM, milner said:

But sadly we finally get an episode about Al and he still only speaks a couple of dozen words. 

Man! When they called him out in the first part of the show I got super excited like "Ah man! An Olinsky-driven episode!" only to have those hopes dashed with a supposed murder charge/investigation against him (UGH!) 

I'm in accord with everyone in saying there is no way Voight is going to step in front of this bullet for Al even though he'd not be in this mess had it not been for Voight in the first place. He expects (demands) loyalty from his team but when the tables are turned and it's his ass on the line can we really expect him to step up? I highly doubt it. It was interesting watching the wheels turn in Al's head as he listened in on Hank's interrogation. It was like he was seeing his future and knew what needed to be done. Hank was speaking from the heart and he knew it. I really hope he finds a way to save himself. I really don't want to lose Al (despite the fact he barely has a part in the show as it is anyway).

Curious, did Hank know Al was about to stick his hand in the cookie jar when confiscating that drug money? I have a sense that he does since he knows Al needs it for his defense (hence the reason he tasked Al with getting it to evidence). And is he going to use this in some way against Al? Or is he hoping that this money keeps Al close to him and on his side because now he can afford that high-powered attorney that can get him free of this mess?

Woods...you have one foot out the door buddy. Here, lemme give you a shove.

[Raja]

2 hours ago, Dvldj said:

 

Curious, did Hank know Al was about to stick his hand in the cookie jar when confiscating that drug money? I have a sense that he does since he knows Al needs it for his defense (hence the reason he tasked Al with getting it to evidence). And is he going to use this in some way against Al? Or is he hoping that this money keeps Al close to him and on his side because now he can afford that high-powered attorney that can get him free of this mess?

Woods...you have one foot out the door buddy. Here, lemme give you a shove.

Of course he did, Sergeant Voight has in own stash for such things in the torture room. Stealing from criminals for the greater good as they see it.

[SnarkySheep]

I found it hard to believe that Voight would really have put ALL of his money into his grandson's trust fund. Even if he did think he might be arrested at any moment and wanted to hide/save it, he also had to have thought that it was a strong possibility he wouldn't get arrested, or might have some emergency beforehand. Since when is Voight not prepared?

On a lighter note, anyone catch how Voight recommended "one of my" lawyers? I literally laughed out loud. It makes you wonder how many lawyers the guy's had over the years.

I'm also wondering how they will get around the fact that Lindsay's character was brought into things again. On the one hand, I'm glad they did, because it's realistic; but on the other, I highly doubt Sophia Bush is planning to make an appearance, But now that she and Olinsky were supposedly seen together, as he said, it really would just be a matter of time til someone puts it together. Lindsay would be subpoenaed, made to return for questioning, etc. Are they maybe going to claim this happened off screen?

[CheshireCat]

22 minutes ago, SnarkySheep said:

 Lindsay would be subpoenaed, made to return for questioning, etc. Are they maybe going to claim this happened off screen?

They could do that or they could claim she's undercover. Wasn't that the original job offer, that the FBI wanted her to go undercover, or am I imagining things? She could have been back when Al talked to her and now she could be back under. Depending on the case, I think that a subpoena would have to wait and/or they'd have to fight it out in court which would also take some time.

[FnkyChkn34]

42 minutes ago, CheshireCat said:

They could do that or they could claim she's undercover. Wasn't that the original job offer, that the FBI wanted her to go undercover, or am I imagining things? She could have been back when Al talked to her and now she could be back under. Depending on the case, I think that a subpoena would have to wait and/or they'd have to fight it out in court which would also take some time.

I think she's undercover with ICE or USCIS?  The FBI does make more sense, but for some reason, I was under the impression that she went to go work for immigration...

I also think Al was referring to years ago when they moved the body; I don't think Al (or anyone) has seen her recently.  

Sophia might have hated the job, but she gained a lot of fans - she might come back for a cameo just for them.

[CheshireCat]

15 minutes ago, FnkyChkn34 said:

I think she's undercover with ICE or USCIS?  The FBI does make more sense, but for some reason, I was under the impression that she went to go work for immigration...

ICE makes absolutely no sense. Maybe DHS? One of the alphabets anyway, the point is, she got offered an undercover job ;-)

 

Quote

I also think Al was referring to years ago when they moved the body; I don't think Al (or anyone) has seen her recently.

Didn't Al inform her about the investigation a few episodes ago though when it first came up? It didn't sound like he left a message for her so she would have to not have been undercover for that.

 

Quote

  Sophia might have hated the job, but she gained a lot of fans - she might come back for a cameo just for them.

As far as I know, she loved the actual job. She said something about having had to leave her dream job, if memory serves. I don't think she'd come back though because of how her exit went down and the choices NBC made. Maybe if they met her demands but I'm leaning towards no.

Edited March 19, 2018 by CheshireCat

[12catcrazy]

So what is the end game here?  Are the showrunners  trying to get rid of the 2 "old" guys (Olinsky and Voight) and just have a show with the young pretty people and their soap operas (sort of like Chicago Fire)?  Or is this going to wind up this season's cliffhanger : who is going to take the fall - Olinsky or Voight - neither or both?  

[Raja]

1 hour ago, 12catcrazy said:

So what is the end game here?  Are the showrunners  trying to get rid of the 2 "old" guys (Olinsky and Voight) and just have a show with the young pretty people and their soap operas (sort of like Chicago Fire)?  Or is this going to wind up this season's cliffhanger : who is going to take the fall - Olinsky or Voight - neither or both?  

I think the end game is Sergeant Voight being brought to justice.  NBC can't guarantee future seasons but Wolf may have enough good will that he gets the head up that this will be it. So every season will have that legal monster hanging over his head ready to drop when Wolf gets the word that a  cancellation order is coming down. As they have already replaced squad members here and there and some others might get sacrificed to the story before the last series finale.

[CheshireCat]

3 hours ago, Raja said:

I think the end game is Sergeant Voight being brought to justice.  NBC can't guarantee future seasons but Wolf may have enough good will that he gets the head up that this will be it. So every season will have that legal monster hanging over his head ready to drop when Wolf gets the word that a  cancellation order is coming down. As they have already replaced squad members here and there and some others might get sacrificed to the story before the last series finale.

It's also possible that they've decided to write out Voight/Beghe after all. I guess, we'll see.

[12catcrazy]

Frankly, I think it's Voight/Beghe who really makes this show.  I like Jon Seda but if he gets promoted to Voight's job I'm probably out.  I've got to say when this is actual about crimes and solving cases, I like the show but when it's about the members' personal angst and bed hopping, it's just not my thing.  As CheshireCat said, "I guess we'll see".

[VinceW]

On 3/19/2018 at 1:30 PM, Raja said:

I think the end game is Sergeant Voight being brought to justice.  NBC can't guarantee future seasons but Wolf may have enough good will that he gets the head up that this will be it. So every season will have that legal monster hanging over his head ready to drop when Wolf gets the word that a  cancellation order is coming down. As they have already replaced squad members here and there and some others might get sacrificed to the story before the last series finale.

Voight always supports his team when things get personal for any team member. Voight leaving the show seems very unlikely. IMO. 

Spoiler

Episode 18 Mar 21, 2018 Ghosts
Upton brings back an old undercover identity to help take down a meth ring spearheaded by a former criminal contact. And with pressure from Woods mounting, Voight calls in a favor for Olinsky.

Edited March 20, 2018 by VinceW

[FnkyChkn34]

On 3/19/2018 at 5:28 PM, 12catcrazy said:

Frankly, I think it's Voight/Beghe who really makes this show.  I like Jon Seda but if he gets promoted to Voight's job I'm probably out.  I've got to say when this is actual about crimes and solving cases, I like the show but when it's about the members' personal angst and bed hopping, it's just not my thing.  As CheshireCat said, "I guess we'll see".

Right, but behind the scenes, Beghe is rumored to be the big problem. It may not matter if he makes the show on screen, if he's ruining it off screen. 

[WendyCR72]

On 3/15/2018 at 3:05 PM, peacheslatour said:

I haven't watched this show yet but I do like cop shows, is it anything like the dreadful Blue Bloods or more like Hill Street Blues?

Neither. Think "The Shield" except watered down for broadcast TV.

[Dvldj]

On 3/17/2018 at 11:45 PM, Raja said:

Of course he did, Sergeant Voight has in own stash for such things in the torture room. Stealing from criminals for the greater good as they see it.

Sadly, he no longer has that stash. He mentioned to Al that he put it all into a trust for his grand baby when the body of Justin's killer was found (in the likelihood he gets arrested). That was why he was unable to help Al with his defense attorney fee.

I'm thinking he is somehow going to use that against Al. I know they've each taken their share but the whole thing just seemed a bit shady to me in that moment.

[Raja]

7 minutes ago, Dvldj said:

Sadly, he no longer has that stash. He mentioned to Al that he put it all into a trust for his grand baby when the body of Justin's killer was found (in the likelihood he gets arrested). That was why he was unable to help Al with his defense attorney fee.

I'm thinking he is somehow going to use that against Al. I know they've each taken their share but the whole thing just seemed a bit shady to me in that moment.

So Sergeant Voight already made the turn from stealing to aid the police mission to stealing for personal gain

[watcher1006]

4 hours ago, Raja said:

So Sergeant Voight already made the turn from stealing to aid the police mission to stealing for personal gain

Yes, I was bothered by this move by Voight. He crossed a line by doing that. I can't believe he wouldn't be able to find some way to help Olinsky.

[Xeliou66]

Voight is such an epic piece of shit, he demands everyone be loyal to his crooked ass but just watch, he certainly won’t take the bullet for Al now although Al’s only in this shitstorm because of Voight. Al doesn’t deserve to have his life ruined by Voight, 

Voight needs to go down, I don’t see how anyone can pull for him, I’m hoping the show will end with his downfall, that’s why I am one of the only fans pulling for Woods in this storyline. 

[Lyanna19]

No matter what happens I don't see Al ratting on Hank. Sorry, but Al is loyal to a fault...