These Spoilers Suck: Bitter Speculation About SPN Spoilers

[shoetingstar]

20 hours ago, Terese said:

Really? Jason? That would have been amazing and scary. Yeah, the actress for Cassie probably wasn't available. I remember being far more convinced of their love and a genuine relationship than with Lisa. Lisa was fine, but felt a little forced compared to Cassie. I have all the DVDs and just started season 1 a couple nights ago. Mostly, cause I wanted to remember what I loved about the show. This season has made me almost forget. I will watch  Route 666, soon. 

Jason would have been so fun and scary! Jensen and Megalyn had great chemistry despite all the other issues.

20 hours ago, Aeryn13 said:

IMO Cassie would have been even weirder than Lisa because she pretty much made it clear at the end of the episode that she had zero interest or investment in a relationship. I figure she wouldn't even remember his name by the time of Seadon 5.

Lisa was awkward as well but at least they re-introduced her in Season 5 before the Finale. They needed to have done even more to reintroduce Cassie.

In the context of the episode, it was revealing what Dean LONGED for though. As for their actual status:
Cassie Robinson : This was a better good-bye than last time.
Dean Winchester : Yeah well, maybe this time it'll be a little less permanent.
Cassie Robinson : You know what? I'm a realist. I don't see much hope for us, Dean.
Dean Winchester : Well, I've seen stranger things happen. Helluva lot stranger.
Cassie Robinson : [smiling sadly]  Good-bye, Dean.
Dean Winchester : I'll see you Cassie. I will.

Bittersweet, but this would have been easy enough to pick up. She couldn't see how she fit in the reality of Dean's world. When one person has doubts, the other can try to comfort them. Dean did not have the experience to really enlighten her. How does a hunter have a committed and long-distance relationship? He really didn't have any hopeful examples to offer.  Either way he did promise to see her again. Dean doesn't make promises he doesn't keep and again, he doesn't lie to Cassie.

19 hours ago, Terese said:

Maybe. A one weekend stand versus a more lengthy, but doomed one, both ages ago.  I don't remember too much about the Route 666 episode or how they said goodbye.  I remember one or both felt some distrust or hurt from the past? A misunderstanding that could have been resolved with communication? I guess I'll find out upon rewatch. I feel the attraction for Lisa was perhaps less her, and more about Ben and the idea of family. And as I reall when they parted in season 6, Lisa even emphasized Dean as being a role model for Ben. 

In fact, when I think of Dean with someone, it would be the waitress in Monster Movie. Much like I think Sam with Sarah, or some one like her. Eileen is good though. Someone who gets it, their lives and isn't afraid of it, or expects them to choose between it or them. But, mostly, they don't get to have that kind of love in their lives. It's just not compatible.

When Dean told her the big family secret, she thought Dean was lying and trying to break-up with her, so she rejected him first. Earlier in the episode they decided they would try. 

Besides Dean having no chemistry with Lisa (very odd for Jensen!), it always seemed like he's commitment was tied to Ben. That he would not have been in touch if she didn't have that kid he thought could be his. WHO is Lisa? I wish they had invested in her. Her one grace was that she accepted Dean, hunter and all. Would she have been as forgiving if he hadn't saved her son or she didn't have a son?

13 hours ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Totally O/T for this thread but since we're on the subject... Lisa made more sense because Ben is Dean's son. I will not be accepting arguments at this time.

😛

LOL! Dean is with you on that, in spite of the Lisa denials

12 hours ago, tessathereaper said:

I agree. Cassie it seems was ready to move on, that seeing Dean again let her work through whatever lingering issues she had about how it ended. Sure now she knew he wasn't crazy but she just had different aims in her life and she was sensible enough to see that it wasn't something she saw working out.

There really would have been no reason for Dean to go back as I'm sure he was able to move on afterwards too, now that it was a good clean break, Cassie knew the truth, knew he wasn't crazy but still didn't see it working out between them. With Lisa, their first meeting which was probably just before Sam had left to go to college(Dean took a 5 day roadtrip while Dad and Sam cleaned up the aftermath of a banshee case in Florida), it had been something that had been a fun, amazing weekend for both of them, who were both a bit wild and they both remember each other very fondly("greatest night of my life Dean" and Gumby Girl, due to her uh... flexibility LOL ie. the sex was amazing and that was all either of them had been looking for at the time). 

They re-meet up under different circumstances years later and when they are at different places in their lives, more mature.  Lisa even at the end of her initial appearance suggested she might have been willing to see if there was a possibility for something more between her and Dean.  She kissed him and said "if you want to stick around for a while, you're welcome to stay."  So it would make sense for Dean to start to see her as someone who "might have been" except, at the time well, he was going to get dragged to hell in less than a year. And he had grown fond of her son Ben too.

So to me it made sense, he understandably would have put Cassie in the finished business category and moved on, as one tends to do in those circumstances, whereas Lisa had sort of left the door open just a little bit.

I'll be honest I was a bit of a Dean/Ellen shipper(not in that I really shipped them but it was something that made some sense to me),  I always through she made way more sense than Jo, because despite Dean being younger, he had a lot more "mileage" on him, in a way that was more similar to Ellen.   Dean was just at such a different place in life than Jo and had known what it was like to have so many heavy responsibilities on him, while Jo was still at the "romanticizing hunting" stage when they first met. There was only about 5 years difference in their ages but it may as well have been a couple decades in terms of life experience.

ETA:  Actually I agree about the waitress in Monster Movie too, she and Dean were really cute together.  Pamela too, it was always funny to me that Dean seemed to have more chemistry and women who seemed "more right" for him than any of his actual "love interests"(actual or proposed) the show gave him.  Lisa IMO actually came the closest out of the love interest/potential love interest category for me as they had a sexy, comfortable vibe to me.  But even there it wasn't quite it.  

SAM: I'm guessing you guys worked things out?
DEAN: We'll be working things out when we're ninety. So what happened?

This could be seen as wholly negative, or a figure of speech? or he could perhaps see a future?...

I think in general some folks have been too hard on Cassie, she was a great team with the brothers. By this episode the audience saw how Heroic Dean was. Cassie did not have that luxury when he told her the truth. She had to go on his word about something she didn't know about. And he was leaving. Lisa got to see first hand what Dean was about when he saved her son. 

Ooooh, I liked Jamie too. I like Jo too, I wish she had been older though. 

[Terese]

8 minutes ago, shoetingstar said:

Jason would have been so fun and scary! Jensen and Megalyn had great chemistry despite all the other issues.

In the context of the episode, it was revealing what Dean LONGED for though. As for their actual status:
Cassie Robinson : This was a better good-bye than last time.
Dean Winchester : Yeah well, maybe this time it'll be a little less permanent.
Cassie Robinson : You know what? I'm a realist. I don't see much hope for us, Dean.
Dean Winchester : Well, I've seen stranger things happen. Helluva lot stranger.
Cassie Robinson : [smiling sadly]  Good-bye, Dean.
Dean Winchester : I'll see you Cassie. I will.

Bittersweet, but this would have been easy enough to pick up. She couldn't see how she fit in the reality of Dean's world. When one person has doubts, the other can try to comfort them. Dean did not have the experience to really enlighten her. How does a hunter have a committed and long-distance relationship? He really didn't have any hopeful examples to offer.  Either way he did promise to see her again. Dean doesn't make promises he doesn't keep and again, he doesn't lie to Cassie.

When Dean told her the big family secret, she thought Dean was lying and trying to break-up with her, so she rejected him first. Earlier in the episode they decided they would try. 

Besides Dean having no chemistry with Lisa (very odd for Jensen!), it always seemed like he's commitment was tied to Ben. That he would not have been in touch if she didn't have that kid he thought could be his. WHO is Lisa? I wish they had invested in her. Her one grace was that she accepted Dean, hunter and all. Would she have been as forgiving if he hadn't saved her son or she didn't have a son?

LOL! Dean is with you on that, in spite of the Lisa denials

SAM: I'm guessing you guys worked things out?
DEAN: We'll be working things out when we're ninety. So what happened?

This could be seen as wholly negative, or a figure of speech? or he could perhaps see a future?...

I think in general some folks have been too hard on Cassie, she was a great team with the brothers. By this episode the audience saw how Heroic Dean was. Cassie did not have that luxury when he told her the truth. She had to go on his word about something she didn't know about. And he was leaving. Lisa got to see first hand what Dean was about when he saved her son. 

Ooooh, I liked Jamie too. I like Jo too, I wish she had been older though. 

My problem with Lisa was that Dean had to gloss over his past and lie about his present concerns. When she asks him if he is alright, he seems to feel the need to tell her he is. When she is questioning why he is on the phone, he lies and tells her he is arranging a poker game. He tells her he is looking for a hammer in the garage.

Why is that? What was lacking in their relationship that he couldn't be honest. 

Additionally, her reaction to Sam being back was so selfish. They save the world! Sam didn't just die. He went to Hell! This was the happiest moment in Dean's life and she thought only of their relationship being affected. 

[DeeDee79]

23 minutes ago, shoetingstar said:

I think in general some folks have been too hard on Cassie, she was a great team with the brothers. By this episode the audience saw how Heroic Dean was. Cassie did not have that luxury when he told her the truth. She had to go on his word about something she didn't know about. And he was leaving. Lisa got to see first hand what Dean was about when he saved her son. 

Replying in the All Episodes thread to be safe.

[shoetingstar]

2 minutes ago, Terese said:

My problem with Lisa was that Dean had to gloss over his past and lie about his present concerns. When she asks him if he is alright, he seems to feel the need to tell her he is. When she is questioning why he is on the phone, he lies and tells her he is arranging a poker game. He tells her he is looking for a hammer in the garage.

Why is that? What was lacking in their relationship that he couldn't be honest. 

Additionally, her reaction to Sam being back was so selfish. They save the world! Sam didn't just die. He went to Hell! This was the happiest moment in Dean's life and she thought only of their relationship being affected. 

These are EXCELLENT questions!

I hate to say this, because I'm sensitive to how single moms are portrayed: Were they trying to say she was the stereotypical desperate single mother trope? Desperate to have a man in the house, etc... Therefore, the only one who would accept Dean being a hunter? But the more I think about it, she didn't have to deal with Dean hunting in the beginning. He wasn't hunting for the majority of their relationship, was he? He was Mr. suburban neighborhood Dad for that time. Either way, they didn't bother to give Lisa any real:

[Terese]

2 minutes ago, shoetingstar said:

These are EXCELLENT questions!

I hate to say this, because I'm sensitive to how single moms are portrayed: Were they trying to say she was the stereotypical desperate single mother trope? Desperate to have a man in the house, etc... Therefore, the only one who would accept Dean being a hunter? But the more I think about it, she didn't have to deal with Dean hunting in the beginning. He wasn't hunting for the majority of their relationship, was he? He was Mr. suburban neighborhood Dad for that time. Either way, they didn't bother to give Lisa any real:

Lol. That was a great movie, btw!

So, what are your thoughts on the current season? I detest Chuck being a petty, obsessed lunatic and every retcon required to make him so. 

[shoetingstar]

5 minutes ago, Terese said:

Lol. That was a great movie, btw!

So, what are your thoughts on the current season? I detest Chuck being a petty, obsessed lunatic and every retcon required to make him so. 

Yes, it's awesome. And fits with the Supernatural theme! I think I might watch again soon.

I really dislike the route they took with God!Chuck. However, if it was well written....Well, then I could be engaged.. The Chuck is God revelation was such a great twist. But they can't take something good and keep it good. Feels like they have beat it until it submits to being a cliched clunky mess. In general the Heaven plot started as intriguing and promising and then they just made some unfortunate decisions. Like Demons being stronger than Angels, Castiels' powers randomly coming and going... 

 

[Terese]

2 minutes ago, shoetingstar said:

Yes, it's awesome. And fits with the Supernatural theme! I think I might watch again soon.

I really dislike the route they took with God!Chuck. However, if it was well written....Well, then I could be engaged.. The Chuck is God revelation was such a great twist. But they can't take something good and keep it good. Feels like they have beat it until it submits to being a cliched clunky mess. In general the Heaven plot started as intriguing and promising and then they just made some unfortunate decisions. Like Demons being stronger than Angels, Castiels' powers randomly coming and going... 

 

I loved the whole idea of Chuck stepping aside so his children could grow up, while returning only at great need to help them help themselves. That was Supernatural; free will, conscience and cleaning up any mess you made. Now Chuck is presented as the writer and Sam and Dean are ...actors? Puppets? Hamsters? Pick a metaphor.

Angels were weakened, and Castiel has been destroyed.  So sad.

I too should rewatch Identity and Get Out, which I also saw you reference. I loved our hero, Chris.

[Aeryn13]

The way Natalie Fisher teases this next episode, I expect Dean-bashing and Sam-saintifying to the highest order.

[Terese]

14 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

The way Natalie Fisher teases this next episode, I expect Dean-bashing and Sam-saintifying to the highest order.

I'm calling it, Aeryn. We have not been watching the real Sam and Dean or their world since Moriah. Mirror Universe. In every single episode, we have had poorly rehashed versions of far better stories, out of character behaviors(Dean handing his cell phone over to a stranger, by example), regression of characters, retcons of stories and events that we absolutely know are not true(Anael and Ruby knowing each other, by example)  It is the only plausible explanation for this season.

Edited October 29, 2020 by Terese

[tessathereaper]

3 hours ago, shoetingstar said:

Jason would have been so fun and scary! Jensen and Megalyn had great chemistry despite all the other issues.

In the context of the episode, it was revealing what Dean LONGED for though. As for their actual status:
Cassie Robinson : This was a better good-bye than last time.
Dean Winchester : Yeah well, maybe this time it'll be a little less permanent.
Cassie Robinson : You know what? I'm a realist. I don't see much hope for us, Dean.
Dean Winchester : Well, I've seen stranger things happen. Helluva lot stranger.
Cassie Robinson : [smiling sadly]  Good-bye, Dean.
Dean Winchester : I'll see you Cassie. I will.

Bittersweet, but this would have been easy enough to pick up. She couldn't see how she fit in the reality of Dean's world. When one person has doubts, the other can try to comfort them. Dean did not have the experience to really enlighten her. How does a hunter have a committed and long-distance relationship? He really didn't have any hopeful examples to offer.  Either way he did promise to see her again. Dean doesn't make promises he doesn't keep and again, he doesn't lie to Cassie.

When Dean told her the big family secret, she thought Dean was lying and trying to break-up with her, so she rejected him first. Earlier in the episode they decided they would try. 

Besides Dean having no chemistry with Lisa (very odd for Jensen!), it always seemed like he's commitment was tied to Ben. That he would not have been in touch if she didn't have that kid he thought could be his. WHO is Lisa? I wish they had invested in her. Her one grace was that she accepted Dean, hunter and all. Would she have been as forgiving if he hadn't saved her son or she didn't have a son?

LOL! Dean is with you on that, in spite of the Lisa denials

SAM: I'm guessing you guys worked things out?
DEAN: We'll be working things out when we're ninety. So what happened?

This could be seen as wholly negative, or a figure of speech? or he could perhaps see a future?...

I think in general some folks have been too hard on Cassie, she was a great team with the brothers. By this episode the audience saw how Heroic Dean was. Cassie did not have that luxury when he told her the truth. She had to go on his word about something she didn't know about. And he was leaving. Lisa got to see first hand what Dean was about when he saved her son. 

Ooooh, I liked Jamie too. I like Jo too, I wish she had been older though. 

I wasn't talking about that scene, I was talking about the scene at the end of the episode where she actually says she doesn't see them working out.  I can't see any reason not to take her word for it.  And I did think Dean and Lisa had chemistry, I could easily imagine them some uh good times and having fun together. They also felt comfortable, which for a long term relationship "comfortable" is probably a lot more important than sparks.  Dean NEVER claimed to be in love with Lisa in Season 3(during Kids are Alright or the dream episode) or when he went to her in Season 5(he just said when he imagines himself happy, he imagined himself with her).   But he was interested in seeing what would happen and they did spend a year together which is actually in the end a lot longer than he was ever with Cassie.  

I never had a problem with Cassie not believing him in the first place, it was understandable she'd think he was nuts, but once she did believe him and got to see what he did, she still said she didn't see it working out. 

So my point was Cassie basically was ready to move on and let Dean know it.  She knew her own mind and her own temperament and what she wanted out of her life.  It's not like they had a long term relationship either, they only knew each other, tops, a couple months, if that.  Seems to  me Dean told her because the relationship was getting ready to cross that line into something potentially more serious(and even serious relationship don't always last forever or always end in marriage/kids what have you) and he wanted her to go into it with full knowledge(unlike the way Sam runs his "outside" relationships) of what was involved precisely so she could make this very choice - is this an aspect she would want to deal with as part of her life because it would always be part of his.  And now that she believed him and saw what he did, she could respect him for it, but make the choice it wasn't what she wanted for her life.

Cassie very nicely let Dean know she didn't see a point in investing anymore time into it.  Dean like a mature person who respects someone would likely listen to that. 

Lisa on the other hand, showed she was interested in seeing if there was any potential but at the time Dean was going to be dragged to Hell at the end of the season so...  So it makes sense that when he started thinking about what it would be like to have that sort of life, he'd think about it with Lisa.  There isn't anything wrong with him considering Ben part of the package because Ben was part of the package.  You marry or have a serious relationship someone with a young child, esp as sole custodial parent, you basically are signing up to become a parent to that child to some degree.  I mean Linda was the love of Paul McCartney's life and the fact that she was a mother was part of her attraction, seeing what she was like as parent, how she juggled her kid with the rest of her life, etc.  He lived a crazy, rock star life but he wanted to settle down so really in a way not too unlike a hunter looking to settle down.  Of course it's a lot more complicated for Dean.  🙂

But in any case, Dean and Lisa tried it and it didn't work, though maybe if everyone else had been honest with Dean from the start they'd have had a better chance.  I think it was more because Dean told Lisa he was giving up hunting and would settle down but then felt guilty when he didn't quite live up to it because he would still check things out if he thought there was something supernatural going on or secretly research things, etc and that's why he wouldn't always tell her what he was doing.  I wouldn't really necessarily put that on Lisa, she obviously knew he was dealing with some things, and it seemed like for the most part she let them go in a good natured way.  I didn't think she ever was portrayed as desperate, she was an attractive women and probably not lacking for opportunities but it was hard to find someone who she really liked and who was also good with Ben and so could move on to a more serious stage.  I would imagine that is something a single parent needs to take into consideration because if the person can't be good with your kid, well your kid has to come first.

Edited October 29, 2020 by tessathereaper

[Icarus]

https://variety.com/2020/tv/features/supernatural-misha-collins-castiel-empty-deal-sacrifice-final-words-1234818267/

Very spoilery article re Castiel.

[ILoveReading]

I figure this ep will be pretty paint by the numbers.

Sam and Dean wlll argue about Jack and his need to complete the final ritual.  Dean leaves with Jack (probably behind Sam and Cas's back.).  Cas freaking out about Jack wants to run after them, Sam calms him down and they want to find another way.   So Cas conveniently remembers the key to Death's library is in the bunker.  Sam conviently doesn't get mad at Cas for the lie.  Death shows up and they get into a fight.  Sam convinetly finds the right death book (because that one will be important) and they find a better way. 

Meanwhile Dean is being short tempered with Jack and they come upon Adam, who teaches Dean a very special lesson in a very anvilious mirror.  Jack gets injured in whatever ritual it is. Dean brings Jack back and Cas goes to look after Nougat while Sam tells Dean they need to talk.  Dean gets beligerent and argues with Sam.  They may or may not come to blows.  

Amara shows up.  She says some stuff.  Everyone but Dean is on board. 

Scene ends with Sam making the you've always protected me speech, followed by why won't you protect Jack. Dean probably spouts some nonsense that he's jealous of Jack becasue Sam and Cas like him better (okay not really, but I wouldn't put it past these writers. )

I'm dreading the whole, Dean's anger is explained thing but he ends up on board

Dean realizes he is wrong, begs forgiveness and agrees to follow Sam's lead and Sam saves the day.

[Myrelle]

4 hours ago, Aeryn13 said:

The way Natalie Fisher teases this next episode, I expect Dean-bashing and Sam-saintifying to the highest order.

I just read it and yup, it sure does sound like Dean is getting thrown under the bus once again so that others can shine, and sadly, I think that even Amara will be made to have a part in doing that, too. Sad, but not really surprising at this point. 

Sadly again, everything I'm reading only makes me feel more strongly than ever that the sidelining of Dean within the last big fight has indeed begun and the last episodes of the series will see him apologizing(again and some more), but this time to Jack, to Sam, to Cas and possibly even to anyone else they decide to pull out of the woodwork only so he can be ready to do all the crying over everyone else's oh-so-big and brave sacrifices.

I honestly feel like the series is already over for me after reading most of the stuff that's out there right now.

I'll still watch for the Ackting, but I don't see any surprises coming at all.

I might be surprised if they give Dean something to do other than to just die with Sam(if that), seeing as they are  just giving us another version of the S5 finale as I've felt all season long-only adding the NougatBaby in as yet another saintly character that Dean has done wrong(I might have thrown up in my mouth a little when I read in that interview that both Sam and Dean each give Jackiepoo yet another all thankful and appreciative of his big sacrifice speech-each of them, not together-oh joy. Can't wait for those. 🙄

 

 

 

[gonzosgirrl]

3 hours ago, ILoveReading said:

Scene ends with Sam making the you've always protected me speech, followed by why won't you protect Jack. Dean probably spouts some nonsense that he's jealous of Jack becasue Sam and Cas like him better (okay not really, but I wouldn't put it past these writers. )

I'm dreading the whole, Dean's anger is explained thing but he ends up on board

Dean realizes he is wrong, begs forgiveness and agrees to follow Sam's lead and Sam saves the day.

Didn't Sam give a similar speech exhorting Dean to let him take the lead on the BMOL attack? I've blocked so much from my memory, but this seems familiar.

I don't think I can take one more 'let's teach Dean a very speshul lesson'. Ugh.

I can't watch live tonight and I am not even a little bit sorry. It makes me sad to feel that way so close to the end.

[Casseiopeia]

So Jack is going on a Magical Mystery Tour via mushrooms?

[Aeryn13]

3 hours ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Didn't Sam give a similar speech exhorting Dean to let him take the lead on the BMOL attack? I've blocked so much from my memory, but this seems familiar.

I don't think I can take one more 'let's teach Dean a very speshul lesson'. Ugh.

I can't watch live tonight and I am not even a little bit sorry. It makes me sad to feel that way so close to the end.

I'm pretty sure from one of the promos that not only will Dean headbut and punch Sam but also pull a gun on him. One promo is edited to make it look like he will pull a gun on Chuck but if you slow it down, you see that it's not. You can see it is a figure wearing the shirt Sam wears in this ep. Ultra character-bashing mode activated.

I'm sure that is the "shocking moment" Fisher teased. And it will be the culmunation of angry/broken/failure Dean who is unable to believe in his autonomy.

I would even expect his "sweet speech" to Nougat to be all about himself, so he can be free of Chuck - no mention of the world - while Sam acknowledges the world.

And afterwards Sam the martyr, with a bleeding nose, will give a sweet speech to Dean. 

I mean, doesn't this all sound awesome? If you hate the character, I mean.

[gonzosgirrl]

Sadly, @Aeryn13 that sounds right up Glynn's alley since she drank the koolaid (after exactly one Dean-friendly episode).

[Myrelle]

51 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

I'm pretty sure from one of the promos that not only will Dean headbut and punch Sam but also pull a gun on him. One promo is edited to make it look like he will pull a gun on Chuck but if you slow it down, you see that it's not. You can see it is a figure wearing the shirt Sam wears in this ep. Ultra character-bashing mode activated.

I'm sure that is the "shocking moment" Fisher teased. And it will be the culmunation of angry/broken/failure Dean who is unable to believe in his autonomy.

I would even expect his "sweet speech" to Nougat to be all about himself, so he can be free of Chuck - no mention of the world - while Sam acknowledges the world.

And afterwards Sam the martyr, with a bleeding nose, will give a sweet speech to Dean. 

I mean, doesn't this all sound awesome? If you hate the character, I mean.

I'd give my eye teeth for one of these screeners, when they're given out, to be sent to a blogger who sees Dean as a character completely unto himself and not just as an extension of Sam or any kind of a shipper(or even to one of the Deanfans at this site, for that matter, because there are some here who are easily as adept at writing as some of the present bloggers for this show that I've read in the more recent years)and then we might get a different take on Dean finally losing it-something I've actually wanted to see for years on this show because both the character and the actor who plays him have fucking been owed that for years every for every time the asshat writers on this show take him down a dark road and never pay it off in that way.

And I know that Jensen would rock that so hard so I'm going to watch tonight keeping that in mind and try and forget all about these biased blogger previews-because the way they slant things to their way of viewing the show is putting me in such a bad mood.

And FWIW, pretty much every time that Dean has punched Sam or even beat the snot out of him, it felt very cathartic to me.

My biggest fear now is that they're going to try to equate what Dean does here with what Jackie-poo did to Mary and if that's the reason they're doing it, then they can just fuck off again and some more.

And what's with Badd's tweet about magic mushrooms and who's  going to be under their influence?

I shudder to think.

 

Edited October 29, 2020 by Myrelle
Revision

[Aeryn13]

7 minutes ago, Myrelle said:

I'd give my eye teeth for one of these screeners, when they're given out, to be sent to a blogger who sees Dean as a character completely unto himself and not just as an extension of Sam or any kind of a shipper(or even to one of the Deanfans at this site, for that matter, because there are some here who are easily as adept at writing as some of the present bloggers for this show that I've read in the more recent years)and then we might get a different take on Dean finally losing it-something I've actually wanted to see for years on this show because both the character and the actor who plays him have fucking been owed that for years every for every time the asshat writers on this show take him down a dark road and never pay it off in that way.

And I know that Jensen would rock that so hard so I'm going to watch tonight keeping that in mind and try and forget all about these biased blogger previews-because the way they slant things to their way of viewing the show is putting me in such a bad mood.

And FWIW, pretty much every time that Dean has punched Sam or even beat the snot out of him, it felt very cathartic to me.

My biggest fear now is that they're going to try to equate what Dean does here with what Jackie-poo did to Mary and if that's the reason they're doing it, then they can just fuck off again and some more.

And what's with Badd's tweet about magic mushrooms and who's  going to be under their influence?

I shudder to think.

 

Obviously the magic shrooms are gonna be Adam and his hippie chick. Maybe Nougat takes them.

[Myrelle]

Just now, Aeryn13 said:

Obviously the magic shrooms are gonna be Adam and his hippie chick. Maybe Nougat takes them.

So like the comedic part of it then.

Figures that's what he chooses to tweet about. 🙄

 

 

[Myrelle]

56 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Sadly, @Aeryn13 that sounds right up Glynn's alley since she drank the koolaid (after exactly one Dean-friendly episode).

It seems like you won't last long as a writer on this show if you don't learn to drink that flavor of the koolaid pretty quick.

[gonzosgirrl]

1 minute ago, Myrelle said:

It seems like you won't last long as a writer on this show if you don't learn to drink that flavor of the koolaid pretty quick.

Perez made a sloppy tweet praising the trio of writers who joined SPN together four years ago. Him, McGlynn and Yockey. Of those three, Yockey at least didn't make me want to cringe on the regular - he was the most balanced of the group as far as the brothers go. McGlynn had her moment early on, but Perez sucked from the jump.

[gonzosgirrl]

1 hour ago, Aeryn13 said:

I'm pretty sure from one of the promos that not only will Dean headbut and punch Sam but also pull a gun on him.

I missed this part. So the pull-a-gun-on-Kaia nonsense is also being recycled. Do these writers have a single original thought between them?

[ahrtee]

9 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Do these writers have a single original thought between them?

No.

[BoxManLocke]

Made the mistake of watching the trailer for next week.

 

Is it really what people want, seeing that miserable, ragtag, bootleg Team Free Will, tackle on Dabb's shittier version of Death ?

Also is Chuck just gone now ? I'm super confused.

 

Fucking fake Bobby and Charlie are probably gonna suck up whatever screentime Castiel could have had as we're nearing the end too. Like who the hell would want them there. They're just puppets.

 

Have people just completely lost the ability to criticize this show after being fed the same mind-numbing content for years ? Because I feel completely disconnected to what the writers think will make people happy.

[ahrtee]

13 minutes ago, BoxManLocke said:

Have people just completely lost the ability to criticize this show after being fed the same mind-numbing content for years ? Because I feel completely disconnected to what the writers think will make people happy.

Obviously not, if you read this forum.  But the writers (and Dabb in particular) have either lost (or never had) the ability to give a shit what the people think or say.  Dabb is going to write his story his way, and anyone who doesn't like it is obviously stupid or has something against him personally.  

[shoetingstar]

Not sure which post to put this in? But if you haven't seen the episode tonight:

WHAT does this mean? If anything?

[/spoiler

 

Edited October 30, 2020 by shoetingstar

[Terese]

39 minutes ago, shoetingstar said:

Not sure which post to put this in? But if you haven't seen the episode tonight:

WHAT does this mean? If anything?

 

  Hide contents

 

[/spoiler

 

I am fairly certain that is next week, Despair.

[Aeryn13]

Since imdb was right about Amara being in this episode - way before we got the promo pics that spoiled it - Emily Swallow is listed for episode 20. As is Rob Benedict. 

This strikes me as odd since I`m pretty sure he wrapped after ep 19. And I don`t know if Emily went in for quarantine. Though it`s possible they shot something out of order. If they are small roles, it could be.

Alex Calvert isn`t in episode 20 apparently. So it`s possible ep 19 aka the Season Finale ends with talking Chuck down (or imprisoning him or whatever) and then they split again for short bits in ep 20. 

I`m still not counting out the "possession" rumour. We now saw how "unification" looks like. Kinda. Wouldn`t make sense if a human could hold either of them but whatever.   

[Bergamot]

21 hours ago, Aeryn13 said:

I'm pretty sure from one of the promos that not only will Dean headbut and punch Sam but also pull a gun on him. One promo is edited to make it look like he will pull a gun on Chuck but if you slow it down, you see that it's not. You can see it is a figure wearing the shirt Sam wears in this ep. Ultra character-bashing mode activated.

I'm sure that is the "shocking moment" Fisher teased. And it will be the culmunation of angry/broken/failure Dean who is unable to believe in his autonomy.

I would even expect his "sweet speech" to Nougat to be all about himself, so he can be free of Chuck - no mention of the world - while Sam acknowledges the world.

And afterwards Sam the martyr, with a bleeding nose, will give a sweet speech to Dean. 

I mean, doesn't this all sound awesome? If you hate the character, I mean.

Aeryn, you got it all exactly right. 😞 And next week we get Berens -- I can just imagine what he will come up with.

Jensen waited too long to pull the plug on this thing.

[Aeryn13]

2 minutes ago, Bergamot said:

Aeryn, you got it all exactly right. 😞 And next week we get Berens -- I can just imagine what he will come up with.

Jensen waited too long to pull the plug on this thing.

Berens is a woobie Cas stan so maybe he will be too focused on that. 

Looks like Sam comes up with the plan while I guess Cas will kill Death. And then somehow get taken by the Empty. Dean will just wibble over poor Cas. Which actually would be best case scenario from Berens.

Then 19 is by the Nep Duo. Which also is best case scenario at this point.

The Finale being by Badd again will just suck.

[Myrelle]

I'd still bet $ that Amara is going to possess Sam and that's the main reason that the series finale is Padalecki's "favorite episode ever", but at this point I couldn't care less what they do with his character.

What would be nice is if Amara's last words to Dean in this week's episode came to pass-that they will always help each other and that we might  actually get to see Dean helping her as well as she helping him in 19(which I think is the only one that holds any hope for Dean to really do something other than cry over other characters), even if she's still stuck inside Chuck.

But there's as good a chance that Amara will now be handed over to Sam for all the heroics because Drabbnatural and all.

A better chance of that actually now. 🤬

 

 

Edited October 30, 2020 by Myrelle
Revision

[gonzosgirrl]

3 minutes ago, Myrelle said:

But there's as good a chance that Amara will now be handed over to Sam for all the heroics because Drabbnatural and all.

A better chance of that actually. 

Especially now that she 'knows' that Dean 'betrayed' her.

[Bergamot]

4 minutes ago, Aeryn13 said:

Berens is a woobie Cas stan so maybe he will be too focused on that. 

Looks like Sam comes up with the plan while I guess Cas will kill Death. And then somehow get taken by the Empty. Dean will just wibble over poor Cas. Which actually would be best case scenario from Berens.

Then 19 is by the Nep Duo. Which also is best case scenario at this point.

The Finale being by Badd again will just suck.

Actually I hope you are right that Berens will be focused on the other characters. I would much prefer that he ignore Dean entirely. But as you say, I'm sure he will have Dean wibbling and blubbering and apologizing for not appreciating the awesomeness of Castiel.

[Myrelle]

4 minutes ago, Bergamot said:

Actually I hope you are right that Berens will be focused on the other characters. I would much prefer that he ignore Dean entirely. But as you say, I'm sure he will have Dean wibbling and blubbering and apologizing for not appreciating the awesomeness of Castiel.

🤮

Our only hope is the nepotism duo for sure.

Go figure.

Edited October 30, 2020 by Myrelle
Additions

[PAForrest]

8 minutes ago, Myrelle said:

I'd still bet $ that Amara is going to possess Sam and that's the main reason that the series finale is Padalecki's "favorite episode ever", but at this point I couldn't care less what they do with his character.

What would be nice is if Amara's last words to Dean in this week's episode came to pass-that they will always help each other and that we might  actually get to see Dean helping her as well as she helping him in 19(which I think is the only one that holds any hope for Dean to really do something other than cry over other characters), even if she's still stuck inside Chuck.

But there's as good a chance that Amara will now be handed over to Sam for all the heroics because Drabbnatural and all.

A better chance of that actually now. 🤬

 

Yeah, unfortunately with that horrible end for Amara in this episode, losing essentially all her agency to her brother (gag me), that remark about Sam being possessed by Amara now makes perfect sense. Well, it doesn't make any sense, but it's clear the set up was there for her smoke out of Chuckles and into someone else. And since she hates Dean now, Princess Samantha Sue is the likely candidate.

There is definitely no question anymore as to why Jensen disliked the finale the way the whole thing is spiraling down the drain.

[catrox14]

50 minutes ago, gonzosgirrl said:

Especially now that she 'knows' that Dean 'betrayed' her.

I'm holding out hope that Amara knew all along and allowed Chuck to absorb her to kill him in the end. I don't think she'll be angry with Dean here. She is stronger than Chuck. And i think she'll be forgive Dean, if she didn't know. Sadly, it's probably pointless hope.

[Bergamot]

10 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

I'm holding out hope that Amara knew all along and allowed Chuck to absorb her to kill him in the end. I don't think she'll be angry with Dean here. She is stronger than Chuck. And i think she'll be forgive Dean, if she didn't know. Sadly, it's probably pointless hope.

This would actually be a better story than what they probably have planned. Amara is a more interesting and original character than Chuck is. After this last episode, I wouldn't mind seeing her be the one to take out Chuck.

[KayCordingly]

So... what was the point of that scene with Chuck & Amara walking and him telling her that he didn't write about the connection she and Dean shared? If they're just going to kill her off like that? 

My speculation is that just when all hope is lost, Dean will be able to connect with Amara who is inside of Chuck and that's how they will ultimately beat him. Because it will be outside of chuck's plan and he won't be able to control it. Maybe it could mirror Swan Song, where Chuck is beating the crap out of Dean, but the connection awakens Amara and she takes control over Chuck and sacrifices herself to destroy both her and Chuck.

[gonzosgirrl]

9 hours ago, catrox14 said:

I'm holding out hope that Amara knew all along and allowed Chuck to absorb her to kill him in the end. I don't think she'll be angry with Dean here. She is stronger than Chuck. And i think she'll be forgive Dean, if she didn't know. Sadly, it's probably pointless hope.

I could deal with this ending. At least Amara is believable as a force that could kill Chuck. I have never bought into the idea that somehow a Nephilim, even the spawn of Lucifer, is somehow the most powerful being in existence. Yeah, the more I think about it, the more I like it. I wish I thought these writers could come up with it.

[Castiels Cat]

1 hour ago, KayCordingly said:

So... what was the point of that scene with Chuck & Amara walking and him telling her that he didn't write about the connection she and Dean shared? If they're just going to kill her off like that? 

My speculation is that just when all hope is lost, Dean will be able to connect with Amara who is inside of Chuck and that's how they will ultimately beat him. Because it will be outside of chuck's plan and he won't be able to control it. Maybe it could mirror Swan Song, where Chuck is beating the crap out of Dean, but the connection awakens Amara and she takes control over Chuck and sacrifices herself to destroy both her and Chuck.

I definitely think Amara is the key to defeating Chuck and Dean is key. He has the connection to her and Chuck pervs on him. She clearly is stronger than him. She simply has to want to do it. Dean willbe the reason. Tou hit the nail on the head.

Personally I  don't think she gave up in that moment either. She sees Chuck for exactly what he is and was absorbed to by time in that moment. She was blindsided by Dean's betrayal.. which I also think she will understand.

[Castiels Cat]

18 hours ago, Terese said:

I am fairly certain that is next week, Despair.

The only handprint I know is the one Dean used to have where Cas gripped him tight and raised him out of perdition.

[Terese]

2 hours ago, Castiels Cat said:

The only handprint I know is the one Dean used to have where Cas gripped him tight and raised him out of perdition.

Ah well, then it seems I am referring to a bloody handprint.

[Smad]

On 10/30/2020 at 2:19 PM, Aeryn13 said:

Since imdb was right about Amara being in this episode - way before we got the promo pics that spoiled it - Emily Swallow is listed for episode 20. As is Rob Benedict. 

This strikes me as odd since I`m pretty sure he wrapped after ep 19. And I don`t know if Emily went in for quarantine. Though it`s possible they shot something out of order. If they are small roles, it could be.

I don't think Amara will be back. That's why her ending pisses me off so much. This was posted by someone on the reddit episode discussion.

Quote

The actress who played the fangirling angel said that she filmed a scene with somebody who has been on the show since 2015 and it was their last episode. So, it doesn't look good for Amara.

 

Edited October 31, 2020 by Smad

[Aeryn13]

1 minute ago, Smad said:

I don't think Amara will be back. That's why her ending pisses me off so much. This was posed by someone on the reddit episode discussion.

 

It's very possible, of course. And imdb is not the most trustworthy source in the world. They did get some things right about SPN before so I'm not totally counting it out.

[starfishka]

11 minutes ago, Smad said:

I don't think Amara will be back. That's why her ending pisses me off so much. This was posted by someone on the reddit episode discussion.

 

Maybe Amara will be back but Rob will play her 🤷‍♂️

 

Edited October 31, 2020 by starfishka

[Res]

On 10/30/2020 at 9:49 AM, Myrelle said:

🤮

Our only hope is the nepotism duo for sure.

Go figure.

We really need to start a thread about Avoiding Dabb and company so we know what shows are going to suck before we start watching them.

[Bobcatkitten]

Emily posted a little clip in insta with Rob where he was calling them Amuck and he was mysterious about whether we would see her again. But I highly doubt it. 

[Castiels Cat]

4 hours ago, Bobcatkitten said:

Emily posted a little clip in insta with Rob where he was calling them Amuck and he was mysterious about whether we would see her again. But I highly doubt it. 

I think we will see her. She is stronger than Chuck. She cares about this world. She needs to take charge. 

[gonzosgirrl]

Ugh, I just saw that Speight is directing "Unity". I wonder who he will 'homage' this time?

I like Rich fine, but I think he sucks as a director. And of a Berens script? Double ugh.