S03.E04: Sweet Sixteen

[TomGirl]

Jazz turns 16

I love, love, LOVE Noelle.  She is a total sweetheart.  Jazz is lucky to have a friend like her.

[jacksgirl]

Hesitant to talk about Jazz' weight because many adolescent girls struggle so much with self esteem and our society often portrays unrealistic body images. That being said, everyone, including Jazz seems to realize that she needs to watch her weight. That brunch food was gross. Add some fruit, veggies, a smoothie, salad, something healthy. Yes, she has awful table manners too. Also, the hair removal tech misspoke for a split second and corrected herself. Jazz needs to chill. It was a mistake. The whole world isn't against you Jazz.  Grrr, at times I really dislike her.

[VioletNevermind]

I love Noelle's kindness and her graceful attitude.  That sort of easygoing, measured demeanor works in just about any situation.  Her handling of the misgendering from the hair removal tech will serve her well in life and possibly be a good lesson for Jazz.  Every little injustice does not have to be blown up into a Socially Significant Teaching Moment.  The tech corrected herself immediately and Noelle chose to pick her battles and let it go.  I know several adults who would do well to follow her example.  I also liked the way Noelle gently reminded Jazz that every transgender youth has not had the comparatively "easy" journey to their teen years that Jazz has enjoyed.  The fact that her family even had the money to pay for the hormone blockers is quite significant, as well as something that I don't think Jazz fully realizes yet.  I'll blame that ignorance on her age . . . for now.  

I don't like the way Jazz says that she "doesn't have any friends."  What about those two lovely girls who took her out to the doughnut place on her birthday?!  What about the group that took her out (well, tried, anyway) to the ice skating rink?  We've seen many examples of perfectly nice people approaching Jazz with friendly openness and she pushes them away.  I'm with Jeanette for once: Jazz is definitely in need of therapy, if only to work on her maturity and social skills.  She may have turned 16, but she certainly doesn't act like it.  That being said, Jeanette needs to stand down a little bit and stop expecting Jazz to enjoy socializing the way she does.  I am a true-blue, shy, unassuming introvert from birth (an INTJ for those of you who know what I'm referring to) and I would have hated it if my parents had tried to force their extroverted ways on me.  I have a daughter the same age as Jazz and believe me, the more Mom pushes and needles and hovers and suggests, the more Teen Daughter will dig in her heels and refuse to listen.  In short, you can drive Teen Daughter to therapy, but you can't force them to actively participate.

All of this being said, I'm still solidly Team Jazz, but I truly think this show is a bad idea for her.  I can't imagine allowing my daughter to film a show for national television that points out the fact that her penis is two inches long, then expecting her to be able to go to school and interact normally with her classmates.  It just boggles my mind and makes me throw some major side eye her parents' way.

Edited July 13, 2017 by SuzyLee

[TomGirl]

OMG, Grandma and Grandpa at the drag show, Grandpa in the tiara...  I love these people!  They are totally good sports.

Loved the pics of little girl Jazz at the end of the episode.  What an adorable child!

[ArmenianGirl]

I like Jazz but she is definitely spoiled and has some unrealistic expectations. She is used to getting what she wants. She is perfectly happy with her mom driving her around the rest of her life and has no desire to drive herself. She said something about it being her mom's job. My mother would have never let me get by with saying crap like that. I do like Jazz and her family but I believe she has been indulged too much.  She has gotten away with a lot of things that shouldn't be excused just because she is transgender. I'm glad the father does seems to be voice of reason at times realizing that they shouldn't rush into things just because Jazz wants everything NOW.

[pinkelephant3]

I said this in another post but meant to put it here...I get she's going through a lot...but man is jazz a whiney little bitch to everyone around her. Just because she's different doesn't give her the right to be mean to everyone around her. 

[seasons]

Please excuse me if I missed something, but why was there a birthday party for a 16 year old - any 16 year old - at a drag show? Their lives are so full of Jazz's very real issues - maybe just get away from it for awhile?

[VioletNevermind]

3 minutes ago, seasons said:

Please excuse me if I missed something, but why was there a birthday party for a 16 year old - any 16 year old - at a drag show? Their lives are so full of Jazz's very real issues - maybe just get away from it for awhile?

I hated this.  She's 16, for God's sake.  There's plenty of time ahead for stuff like that.  I tend toward the traditional in a lot of ways, but I can cut loose and I have been to not one, but two drag shows (one birthday and one bridal shower) where I thoroughly enjoyed myself.  They can be a source of great, raunchy, bawdy fun . . . for adults.  Yes, Jazz has had to grow up a little faster than normal due to the issues she's dealing with, but tonight was another good example of how immature Jazz really is.  (And really, TLC?  Having the whole family, grandpa included, attend the show together?  Give me a break.)

[jacksgirl]

So much to comment on.

1. Jeanette needs to get a job, her whole life is Jazz.

2. Whatever discussions go on at therapy need to be between Jazz and her therapist. 

3. Am assuming a letter from a therapist needs to not just be a letter but a recommendation that a patient is emotionally ready for surgery. She is not.

4. Not sure if a drag show is appropriate for a 16 year old. 

5. Due to Jazz' age, maturity, emotional stability and the serious nature of transgender youth, it's time to pull the plug on this show. Give us an update in 2 years.

Edited July 13, 2017 by jacksgirl

[Caracoa1]

I'm definitely Team Jazz but that girl needs to start respecting her parents....and she does need therapy.  I would calmly tell her that until she gets into regular therapy and begins changing her attitude that no surgery will be happening on my dime. I was happy to hear Jeanette comment that she has a husband and 4 children but that Jazz is the most demanding.

[Ravello]

I haven't been to one but surely a strip club is adult only.  How did a 16 year old get in, TLC must have pulled strings.  After this episode I am convinced Jeanette needs therapy herself and Greg needs to end this TV exposure.  

Jazz has the emotional maturity of a grade school kid.  Puberty was suppressed and maturity did not happen.  She is not ready to drive, date, be on a TV show, visit strip clubs or have any surgery.   The mother spent years trying to convince viewers life was hunky dory and Jazz had a rosy future.  This pretense has been blown up. 

[woodscommaelle]

2 hours ago, TomGirl said:

I love, love, LOVE Noelle.  She is a total sweetheart.  Jazz is lucky to have a friend like her.

Jayleen too. They're both good people.

One of the twins looked like Christian Siriano tonight.

I LOVED LOVED LOVED the doctor. I think Jazz did, too. 

[Cotypubby]

31 minutes ago, Ravello said:

I haven't been to one but surely a strip club is adult only.  How did a 16 year old get in, TLC must have pulled strings.  After this episode I am convinced Jeanette needs therapy herself and Greg needs to end this TV exposure.  

Lips isn't a strip club, it's a drag show. I've been to the NYC one, I didn't realize it was a franchise.

[TomGirl]

32 minutes ago, Ravello said:

 

I haven't been to one but surely a strip club is adult only.  

 

A drag show doesn't typically involve stripping or anything overtly sexual.  The ones I've seen primarily feature singing, dancing and some stand-up comedy, as well as celebrity impersonations.

[seasons]

Jazz was really unbearable in this episode. The way she was with that therapist, chewing on stuff...  with her mother - just too much IMO. A brat is a brat. 

Perhaps they are so worried that she will harm herself that they give in. I get that. But I'm afraid it is starting to backfire. 

Getting the same feeling when I had to stop watching "My Big Fat Fabulous Life". Used to root for Whitney but she became so obnoxious it was upsetting me.  Now I'm starting to feel that way about Jazz. I can't begin to imagine what she is going through but this is an even bigger mess.

 

Good grief, it was the mother's idea to go to the drag club! " It's a little dirty, a little frisky...."  WTH? With your grandparents? 

The dad needs to grow a pair.

Edited July 13, 2017 by seasons

[MegD]

The more I watch this show, the more I dislike Jazz. Greg & Jeanette really have raised a wretched, entitled, spoiled brat of a daughter. The second I was able to, I got my permit and I was always behind the wheel learning to drive. I didn't want my parents driving me around like a servant. She also needs to close her mouth when she chews. It's disgusting. Even though her father said it was gross, no one dared to remind her that she's behaving inappropriately. But they never call her out on any of her inappropriate behavior. Her behavior with her mother and with the therapist was also ridiculous. I get that they are afraid she'll self-harm, but I think she's also decided that she can use that fear as a method of control over her family. She's quick to turn to vague "I'm going to hurt myself" threats when she might have to do something she doesn't want to do or is uncomfortable in a situation. Her parents need to start calling her on her behavior and not keep backing down and giving her whatever she wants.

 

So another doctor tells her that the penile inversion isn't going to work and the use of the colon is going to be necessary. She still on the penile inversion. There's no way she hadn't gone googling before this. She just wants what she wants and nothing else will be good enough. For her own sake, I hope that she doesn't have the surgery until she's emotionally ready for it. She's clearly not emotionally ready, but I don't think her mother is either. Jazz seems to have glossed over that she's going to need to see two therapists before she can her surgery who have to sign off on her readiness for it mentally and that she's physically ready to have the procedure. Somehow, I feel like she's going to end up on Botched because she's so insistent that she's going to control the type of surgery she has and when she has it. She's still too giggly and clearly seems fixated on how it will look, without understanding that a large portion of the surgery will concern areas that no one will ever see.

 

She also needs to climb off her crucifix. Not everything is a slam against the transgender community. I know that there are a lot of ways that transgender individuals are mistreated, however, not everything is a reason to climb on your soapbox, especially if it didn't bother Noelle and she was the one who was actually the recipient of misgendering. This is another time where Jazz has demonstrated that she's so busy being very aggressive towards force the world to accept her as she is, with no regard to anyone else. There are lots of reasons that someone may use the wrong gender pronoun, including Mya's brother's feelings that Mya was this new sister and not the brother he remembers, malicious reasons, and just some accidental misuse, among other things. I'm in front of a judge on a regular basis. I know I've called the female judges "sir." I've done the same with other attorneys and officers. It's not intentional, it's just an occasional "my brain runs faster than my mouth and I have been in front of male counterparts. Noelle raised a very important point that Jazz hasn't had to worry about passing where other transgender kids have had to but that passing has come at a serious cost in terms of her surgery, although she doesn't seem to acknowledge that.

 

The birthday parties were weird. First, they had the bizzaro brunch and then the family drag show. Just because she may like a food, doesn't mean she should have them all at once. While the drag show may not have been adult only, it was just weird to go with her grandparents. She's really terrible to say that she has no friends. Who were the kids at the ice rink? What about Noelle & the other friend who gave her presents and donuts at the donut shop? Are they chopped liver? It really feels like Jazz wants to be the "lonely mistreated child" and in order to do so she's shoving all of her friends away. It's really sad and I can't blame her friends from trying to escape this train wreck. They would be well suited to end this trainwreck and let her grow up away from the spotlight.

[Quilty]

Jazz is a spoiled rude impatient brat.

[bref]

I know a LOT of teenagers who were unbearable snots for a few years. I was one of them. :) Jazz's behavior, although I agree it is bratty, does not seem offscale to me or particularly out of the ordinary for her age. 

I also had a daughter who was prone to self harm for a while and it is pretty terrifying. I tend to have a lot of empathy for Jeannie. I think she has to balance an awful lot of stuff.

Edited July 13, 2017 by bref

[RemoteControlFreak]

9 hours ago, jacksgirl said:

Hesitant to talk about Jazz' weight because many adolescent girls struggle so much with self esteem and our society often portrays unrealistic body images. That being said, everyone, including Jazz seems to realize that she needs to watch her weight. That brunch food was gross. Add some fruit, veggies, a smoothie, salad, something healthy. Yes, she has awful table manners too. Also, the hair removal tech misspoke for a split second and corrected herself. Jazz needs to chill. It was a mistake. The whole world isn't against you Jazz.  Grrr, at times I really dislike her.

In a lot of ways Jazz is a spoiled brat.  This episode showed that.

She thought it was fine to eat like a pig and burp at the table and her parents just laughed.  If the editing is accurate, the laser tech corrected the incorrect pronoun right away.  It didn't seem intentional. Also, the battle about going to therapy could be handled much more simply by her parents.  They need to tell her that it's simple:  if she doesn't go to therapy, she doesn't get surgery.  She can choose not to have surgery if she really does not want to go to therapy.  Those are the doctor's rules, not her parents.  It's not a debate or open for discussion.   Jazz obviously has learned that she can manipulate her parents by whining and pouting and flipping out.

 In-keeping with the current fashion, her parents would rather label her bad behavior as something clinical, like social anxiety, that's in need of therapy, rather than analyzing what they are doing as parents to enable this behavior. This takes any responsibility away from both Jazz and her parents because they can hide behind the diagnosis.

 Jazz is going to be in big trouble as she grows up if she expects that the whole world will cater to her as much as her over-indulgent parents do.

Edited July 13, 2017 by RemoteControlFreak

[jacksgirl]

Yes, bref, I agree totally with all you said. Isn't that even more reason for Jazz to go to therapy? Maybe Jeanette and Greg should go too (Not joint with Jazz- at least not yet).

[sATL]

I agree with what the Dad said last week. The surgery is something for Jazz to consider when she is 18. Defer going to college one year.

 Focus, if that is possible, for Jazz to be a teenager.  Jeanette - you and your parents - need to start getting off of the parent-of-a-minor-child bus, and start figuring out your life as an empty nester.  Maybe your 'cuz the counselor can work you in for a session?

If I had thrown a tantrum in the car with one of my parents, b/c they told me to do something, they would have pulled over, and the speech you have began " you're not to grown for me to ... " - you know the rest... ☺

Yes, some teens are late in driving, but that is usually because (1) family economics don't have wiggle room for a newly licensed teen driver/car, or, (2) they are in so many activities that some else drives , just so homework gets done.

Speaking of which, what kind of grades does this child get? What else does she do in high school ? Jazz needs to realize that other teens don't want to hear about her situation all of the damn time. Yes, it was wrong, but I think that is a reason her middle school/freshmen buddies drifted away. She wants the surgery before college but she needs to FIRST worry about getting into college. One almost needs a full resume' of something done in HS to even get into a decent college.

I have a feeling her siblings were glad to get away from "its all about Jazz" and to go off college.

Edited July 13, 2017 by sATL

[RemoteControlFreak]

36 minutes ago, sATL said:

Yes, some teens are late in driving, but that is usually because (1) family economics don't have wiggle room for a newly licensed teen driver/car, or, (2) they are in so many activities that some else drives , just so homework gets done.

I know several teenagers that were in no rush to get their drivers license. In all three cases, they were only children with stay-at-home parents that had free time and the willingness to chauffeur them wherever they wanted to go at any time. Jazz obviously fits this model. She's not an only child, but she's the only child living at home.

Also, WTF is Jazz talking about when she says she wants "a pretty vagina?" Does she realize what a vagina is or where it's located? It's not visible. 

Edited July 13, 2017 by RemoteControlFreak

[Granny58]

I'm late to watching this program with any frequency, so maybe this has been addressed.  I hear a lot about estrogen therapy, but what about progesterone?  Is that needed?  Also, Kita seems quite lovely and you would never guess she is transgender.  Has it ever been discussed if she delayed puberty?  If she didn't, then that could be encouraging for Jazz to accept some testosterone for a while to "develop" a little bit, including a libido.   She may not miss it now, not knowing what it is, but I'm pretty sure it will be wanted in the future.  

[RemoteControlFreak]

29 minutes ago, Granny58 said:

I'm late to watching this program with any frequency, so maybe this has been addressed.  I hear a lot about estrogen therapy, but what about progesterone?  Is that needed?  Also, Kita seems quite lovely and you would never guess she is transgender.  Has it ever been discussed if she delayed puberty?  If she didn't, then that could be encouraging for Jazz to accept some testosterone for a while to "develop" a little bit, including a libido.   She may not miss it now, not knowing what it is, but I'm pretty sure it will be wanted in the future.  

This Wikipedia article explains hormone replacement for male to female transgenderism.  

Who is Kita?

[SunnyBeBe]

I have learned a lot about transgender issues, including hormone treatment and surgeries, but, I still may stop watching the show.  It's just too annoying and sad to see Jazz act so immature and rude.  IMO, she acts that way, because she is allowed to act that way. Her parents have created who she is and now are perplexed.  It's really a no brainer. 

  Her entitled and spoiled behavior does not serve her well and in fact that kind of thing can handicap a child.  I know of college age students who act that way and they have trouble in school, because they can't adapt to roommates. (Can't compromise or share.) They can't obey rules of the school.  (They want to do things their own way.  And people don't understand them.)  They can't hold a job. (They have their own way of doing things and are misunderstood. They can't take instruction if it's not convenient for them.)  They are super sensitive and blame others when they are the ones at fault.  I'm not sure who Jazz will be prepared for the real world.  She may actually need a couple of years in order to prepare for college. Maybe, some community college classes to get her started. 

I wonder how the transgender community feels about Jazz being an ambassador.  I'd have to grit my teeth and bear it.  

It's a little sad really.  When a person is very opposed to therapy.....it usually means that they really need it.  Good point above about how the doctors will require two recommendations from psychologists that Jazz is ready for surgery.  Jazz may not accept it, but, I don't think she's even close to getting those recommendations.  So, her surgery may be many years away.  

I also think that Jazz's behavior this season is going to bring her a lot of backlash.  This may be her last season.  That would be a wise decision, imo. 

[Granny58]

1 hour ago, RemoteControlFreak said:

Who is Kita?

She was the African American woman speaking with Jazz.  

[Ravello]

Regarding Jazz and weight issues, we must remember Jazz is a biological male and always will be.  She will never be a nymph like delicate person.  She eats like a teenage boy, which she is.  

I totally agree this should be the last season to film and her father needs to pull the plug on social media, TV and all public appearances.  I'm seriously concerned about her mother promoting unhealthy activities.  Call the birthday party a drag show or strip club- it makes no difference. People were throwing money at the performers to take off their clothes, even if they don't strip all the way down.  Any parent arranging this type of event needs serious help. 

  I wonder how she does in school, sometimes oppositional kids like this refuse to go.  Academics should be her focus, not flying around the country investigating surgery.  Rebuilding her bottom will not be a magic bullet.  There is research out there that indicates depression remains a huge issue after trans surgery.  

[IOU Payne]

Jazz is acting like a spoiled little snowflake and her parents need to get her into the real world ASAP.  I suggest a job flipping burgers or scooping ice cream, the kind of job 16-year-olds typically get.   She can upgrade to barista when she turns 18.  She should also have to get to work on her own (bike, walk, bus or drive) .  I'd go so far as to ask her to contribute towards the co-pay on her bottom surgery with money she earned (i.e., not TLC $$$). 

Greg and Jeanette will only be helping their daughter by expecting more from her IMO.  

[sATL]

7 minutes ago, Ravello said:

 

  I wonder how she does in school, sometimes oppositional kids like this refuse to go.  .  

Does she go to a traditional 4 yr public HS, private school,  or is she home schooled ? It know the scene would be burred out, but I don't think I ever seen a building, desk, locker, etc

Edited July 13, 2017 by sATL

[jnymph]

Noelle is such a sweet, lovely soul.   Jazz was rude not to mention her as a friend. (as well as Jayleen and the others in the skating group, all seem supportive and kind.)

Agree with others, Jazz is turning from a friendly, articulate pre-teen into a horridly entitled teen-age brat.    I never heard of a teenager not wanting to drive !!!  Since when is it cool to have your Mom cart you around? 

I love Greg, but he really needs to grow a pair and put Jazz in her place.  Jeanette is far too "all about Jazz" mindset.   

Still love the Grandparents Jack and Jackie : )  Jazz is so fortunate to have such warm loving supportive people in her life. 

[SunnyBeBe]

6 minutes ago, Ravello said:

Regarding Jazz and weight issues, we must remember Jazz is a biological male and always will be.  She will never be a nymph like delicate person.  She eats like a teenage boy, which she is.  

I totally agree this should be the last season to film and her father needs to pull the plug on social media, TV and all public appearances.  I'm seriously concerned about her mother promoting unhealthy activities.  Call the birthday party a drag show or strip club- it makes no difference. People were throwing money at the performers to take off their clothes, even if they don't strip all the way down.  Any parent arranging this type of event needs serious help. 

  I wonder how she does in school, sometimes oppositional kids like this refuse to go.  Academics should be her focus, not flying around the country investigating surgery.  Rebuilding her bottom will not be a magic bullet.  There is research out there that indicates depression remains a huge issue after trans surgery.  

I agree about this being a very inappropriate choice for a teen.  I wonder if part of it was due to a ratings concern.  Maybe, the producers suggested it.  Still.....it's so bizarre to me......I can't fathom anything so inappropriate.  

[VioletNevermind]

7 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I agree about this being a very inappropriate choice for a teen.  I wonder if part of it was due to a ratings concern.  Maybe, the producers suggested it.  Still.....it's so bizarre to me......I can't fathom anything so inappropriate.  

I was so astounded at the choice of venue for a 16-year-old's birthday party that I felt compelled to visit the Lips website.  The minimum age is actually 16.  I just have no words for that.  I'll file it under 'different strokes for different folks!'  Folks that aren't my own 16-year-old daughter.

Edited July 13, 2017 by SuzyLee

[SunnyBeBe]

I had a friend who took her son out to eat at Hooter's for his 16th birthday!  I thought it was outrageous.  A few friends refused to join them.  I wasn't invited and was glad.  I wouldn't have gone. He turned out to be a fine young man, so no harm done.  Still.....I'd be embarrassed as a parent to use such poor judgment.  If Jazz's therapist know about this, (I suppose they might, since it's on tv.)  I would think it might put a flag on her file for concern.  As a professional and she's a minor.....very concerning, imo. 

[Scarlett45]

8 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I had a friend who took her son out to eat at Hooter's for his 16th birthday!  I thought it was outrageous.  A few friends refused to join them.  I wasn't invited and was glad.  I wouldn't have gone. He turned out to be a fine young man, so no harm done.  Still.....I'd be embarrassed as a parent to use such poor judgment.  If Jazz's therapist know about this, (I suppose they might, since it's on tv.)  I would think it might put a flag on her file for concern.  As a professional and she's a minor.....very concerning, imo. 

While I think 16 is a bit young for a drag show bday I wouldn't agree about Hooters. It's a family restaurant- they have high chairs! You see more skin at the beach than you do at Hooters but of course people make choices for their own family. I wouldn't even think Hooters would be something others would find offensive.

 

I dont think Jazz has a weight problem at all. I think that we are used to seeing very thin young women on tv which she is not, she looks normal to me (if perhaps a little top heavy). Perhaps this is my own perception coming out, but as someone who's been either overweight or obese since the age of 2yrs old, I hate to see young people who are a normal weight picked on. I got more harrasment for being a fat child from adults than I do being a fat adult from adults. The idea that because you're young you're supposed to be thin is something I've never understood. 

 

I think Jazz needs to show her parents more respect and watch her attitude. Had I dared cop that tone with my Mom I would've had the black smacked off of me. I know a lot of teens are mouthy and grow out of it, but I think Jazz is over indulged some by virtue of being the baby and trans- in my Sib Group we talk about how parental guilt causes parents to baby their children unnecessarily. Jazz isn't disabled but she does have "additional needs" and faces social challenges, which I'm sure her parents feel guilty about. As a transwomen stastically she's more likely to experience violence and discrimination, I think her parents maybe unconsciously over indulge her because they know how unkind the world can be to those who are trans. Of course no parent is perfect and they are doing their best. 

Edited July 13, 2017 by Scarlett45

[Scarlett45]

26 minutes ago, sATL said:

Does she go to a traditional 4 yr public HS, private school,  or is she home schooled ? It know the scene would be burred out, but I don't think I ever seen a building, desk, locker, etc

I think Jazz goes to a private 4 years HS. She isn't homeschooled. I doubt the school would allow filming so that doesn't concern me. 

[Ina123]

Loved the scene with Grandma's "helmet hair". It reminded me of the movie "Steel Magnolias" and Sally Field's "helmet hair". LOL.

[okerry]

Without reading any other comments yet for this ep: Jazz is getting increasingly obnoxious, but how can that be a shock to anyone? Jazz is an adolescent who is trapped in the hormonally wrecked body of a child. How is that better than coming to terms with her natural body and postponing surgery until it can actually give her the results she says she wants?

One thing I do agree with Jazz on: No therapist is going to be able to solve that problem.

[sATL]

3 minutes ago, Scarlett45 said:

I think Jazz goes to a private 4 years HS. She isn't homeschooled. I doubt the school would allow filming so that doesn't concern me. 

true..I was just curious... going back to earlier comment how about deep is Greg's pockets... and health ins. coverage. Some pvt independent HS do come at a dear cost. And there was a scene Jazz was sitting in a living room with 3-4 other girls and she mentioned something to the effect "they go to another school"

[okerry]

12 hours ago, seasons said:

Please excuse me if I missed something, but why was there a birthday party for a 16 year old - any 16 year old - at a drag show? Their lives are so full of Jazz's very real issues - maybe just get away from it for awhile?

ITA. I love drag queens myself and would have loved that show, but those are for adults. Sixteen is not an adult.

It's truly bizarre how Jazz is both over- and under-sexualized, all at the same time. No wonder she's getting to be a bigger mess with every show.

Edited July 13, 2017 by okerry

[sATL]

6 minutes ago, Ina123 said:

Loved the scene with Grandma's "helmet hair". It reminded me of the movie "Steel Magnolias" and Sally Field's "helmet hair". LOL.

any one want to take bets on it is 100% all her's ? No weave, add in pieces, partial wig, etc ? I would admit I was trying to see her scalp, edges, hairline last night.

Edited July 13, 2017 by sATL

[okerry]

11 hours ago, seasons said:

Good grief, it was the mother's idea to go to the drag club! " It's a little dirty, a little frisky...."  WTH?

I have to wonder if things like this are an almost subconscious effort to bring out Jazz's normal sex drive - which isn't appearing since it was suppressed with powerful hormone blockers. Sorry, Mom, you can't have it both ways.

[Scarlett45]

8 minutes ago, okerry said:

ITA. I love drag queens myself and would have loved that show, but those are for adults. Sixteen is not an adult.

It's truly bizarre how Jazz is both over- and under-sexualized, all at the same time. No wonder she's getting to be a bigger mess with every show.

Yeah, I love drag queens too. Great idea for her 18th or 21st but not 16. I'm not a prude by any means, and don't think children need to be sheltered from nude art in a museum r anything like that, but Jazz would benefit more from meeting some older transwomen as mentors and being able to learn from their WISDOM than going to drag shows. 

Edited July 13, 2017 by Scarlett45

[okerry]

57 minutes ago, sATL said:

Does she go to a traditional 4 yr public HS, private school,  or is she home schooled ? It know the scene would be burred out, but I don't think I ever seen a building, desk, locker, etc

I don't know for sure, but I'm betting Jazz has been "home-schooled" for a while now - meaning Jeanette lets Jazz stay home and do whatever Jazz wants. We'll probably find out about that later.

[SongbirdHollow]

Jazz: WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT WHAT JUST HAPPENED!!!

Noelle: (confused) What just happened?

 

LOL

 

Jazz is a normal brat. Congratulations to her mom who is obsessed with Jazz having a normal childhood. In this respect you succeeded. ?

 

Drag queens are great. I sideeyed it for a 16 yo but I remember being into Rocky Horror at that age so ?‍♀️

[greekmom]

2 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I wonder how the transgender community feels about Jazz being an ambassador.  I'd have to grit my teeth and bear it.  

It's a little sad really.  When a person is very opposed to therapy.....it usually means that they really need it.  Good point above about how the doctors will require two recommendations from psychologists that Jazz is ready for surgery.  Jazz may not accept it, but, I don't think she's even close to getting those recommendations.  So, her surgery may be many years away.  

I also think that Jazz's behavior this season is going to bring her a lot of backlash.  This may be her last season.  That would be a wise decision, imo. 

I would think that Caitlyn Jenner would be a worse choice over Jazz. 

I agree with alot of posters above about her attitude.  It was like watching Twitney on MFFL. Nice gal season 1. Insufferable bitch later on.  

Just pull the plug TLC and update us in a few years with a special.  I am done even hate watching.

[jnymph]

15 minutes ago, SongbirdHollow said:

Jazz: WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT WHAT JUST HAPPENED!!!

Noelle: (confused) What just happened?

 

LOL

 

LOL as well.  I almost forgot Noelle said that........ she's great, love her. 

 

1 hour ago, okerry said:

Without reading any other comments yet for this ep: Jazz is getting increasingly obnoxious, but how can that be a shock to anyone? Jazz is an adolescent who is trapped in the hormonally wrecked body of a child.

Agreed.  Jazz is at that awkward obnoxious teen stage, with additional pressures. 

[Granny58]

1 hour ago, jnymph said:

Agree with others, Jazz is turning from a friendly, articulate pre-teen into a horridly entitled teen-age brat.    I never heard of a teenager not wanting to drive !!!  Since when is it cool to have your Mom cart you around? 

my son had no interest in driving (still doesn't....only does what he has to), BUT I told him he NEEDS to learn so he can deal with life.   Yep, he did it.  

[jnymph]

14 minutes ago, Granny58 said:

my son had no interest in driving (still doesn't....only does what he has to), BUT I told him he NEEDS to learn so he can deal with life.   Yep, he did it.  

Wow. The times are a changin' I guess !     

Back when I was 16 ( a hundred years ago) it was so very uncool to have your parents take you places.    

[Scarlett45]

21 minutes ago, jnymph said:

Wow. The times are a changin' I guess !     

Back when I was 16 ( a hundred years ago) it was so very uncool to have your parents take you places.    

Me too (I'm 31), also I think it depends on the family dynamics. I wasn't allowed to take public transit (over protective mom) and if I didn't learn to drive I would've been at home or depending on friends because my Mom wasn't going to drive me around. She wanted me to run HER errands (grocery, dry cleaning etc). 

[surveyandprotect1]

2 hours ago, sATL said:

true..I was just curious... going back to earlier comment how about deep is Greg's pockets... and health ins. coverage. Some pvt independent HS do come at a dear cost. And there was a scene Jazz was sitting in a living room with 3-4 other girls and she mentioned something to the effect "they go to another school"

I wanted to share a little bit of inside info but again not be too specific.

 

Jazz attends a charter (public, but more independent) high school. She is not homeschooled.

 

The town in which filming occurs has 2 public high schools and 1 charter. Its common to have friends split between the schools.

 

Greg is a successful attorney, but I can't comment about health insurance coverage.

 

I'm not going to give away any more than that but I can confirm the above as true.