When Calls The Heart - General Discussion

[redpencil]

On 4/21/2020 at 1:33 PM, allonsyalice said:

Honestly! They haven’t even done anything really significant with Fiona’s character. Shes always in the background, connecting the main characters. 
altho, if the actress is leaving because she’s bored, I wouldn’t be surprised. 

Exactly why they should drop the stupid triangle, go down the Elizabeth/Lucas path permanently, and start a storyline between Nathan and Fiona. Everybody else is already paired off (Clara/Jesse, Lee/Rosemary); the show could use a secondary romance storyline, so I don't know why they can't figure this out. It's so obvious to me. I really don't like Elizabeth with Nathan at all for all the reasons everyone has covered, but feel like Nathan and Fiona could be really fun.

[SnarkySheep]

On 4/21/2020 at 9:13 PM, izabella said:

Why is that? 

Because in those days, once a woman married, it was considered the responsibility of her husband to support her...

[bybrandy]

On 4/21/2020 at 8:17 PM, enduringforce said:

Right just like a widow with a baby wouldn't have been allowed to be a teacher either but at least we would have had a Happy Ever After for Jack and Elizabeth.

I guarantee you that my great-grandmother was a widow with a baby who taught school in Georgia in this time period.   

Edited April 24, 2020 by bybrandy

[enduringforce]

11 hours ago, bybrandy said:

I guarantee you that my great-grandmother was a widow with a baby who taught school in Georgia in this time period.   

Oh I believe you because there is no law that a strong women won't defy if it's unjust but it does not mean the law did not exist. The 'marriage bar' laws had terms like 'never been married' to deny jobs to women who were either widows or divorcee's. It was only in 1964 that those laws were legally abolished.

Quote

A marriage bar is the practice of restricting the employment of married women. Common in Western countries throughout the 1900s, the practice often called for the termination of the employment of a woman on her marriage, especially in teaching and clerical occupations. Further, widowed women with children were still considered to be married at times, preventing them from being hired, as well.[1][2][3]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marriage_bar

Equality is a still being fought for and many to this day don't think a women has a right to her own body regarding health, dress and 'lifestyle.'

 

 

Edited April 24, 2020 by enduringforce

[allonsyalice]

On 4/22/2020 at 10:17 PM, redpencil said:

Exactly why they should drop the stupid triangle, go down the Elizabeth/Lucas path permanently, and start a storyline between Nathan and Fiona. Everybody else is already paired off (Clara/Jesse, Lee/Rosemary); the show could use a secondary romance storyline, so I don't know why they can't figure this out. It's so obvious to me. I really don't like Elizabeth with Nathan at all for all the reasons everyone has covered, but feel like Nathan and Fiona could be really fun.

I get what you're saying! but Fiona is way better than Negative Nathan! What has she done to deserve that Grumpy Gus?

[sharifa70]

Auuuugh why? There couldn’t have been less chemistry in that hug if one of them had been one of Rosemary’s dressmaker’s dummies. They. Have. Nothing. In common.

Rosemary was the star of this episode for me. “You can call me Rosemary” was fantastic in the face of Susannah’s awfulness. 

 

[scenicbyway]

3 hours ago, sharifa70 said:

Auuuugh why? There couldn’t have been less chemistry in that hug if one of them had been one of Rosemary’s dressmaker’s dummies. They. Have. Nothing. In common.

Rosemary was the star of this episode for me. “You can call me Rosemary” was fantastic in the face of Susannah’s awfulness. 

 

Why is she literally throwing herself (that hug in front of the whole town) at a guy who she has nothing in common with?  Why can’t he tell her just to leave him alone?  He’s only talking to her because of Ally or Bill are pushing him to.

I wondered if the hug and Lucas’ sad look was supposed to mirror last year’s dance with Lucas and Nathan’s sad look?  The thing is, they aren’t equal circumstances, last year she really didn’t know either guy.  This year she’s been on dates with Lucas, they’ve gotten to know each other, he’s made his intentions known.  Nathan has done nothing but yell at her and use her for help with Ally.  And yet all of her looks are for Nathan, it makes no sense.

Looking at the DVD cover they’ve even given Kevin second billing with the “and” distinction which gives away where this is heading if even the character’s actions don’t.

[bybrandy]

Yes, it is obvious that the show thinks we're supposed to be rooting for Nathan.. which begs the question of why they've given us no reason to root for him?   The guy who orchestrated library date, however, is totally capable of asking Elizabeth out while a horse exists.... just saying.   If they want me to root for Nathan they've got to give me a reason other than Red Serge.  And a better show (and maybe eventually on this show) the gun shot would give Elizabeth pause.   Does she really want to go down that road again?   Maybe her love for Nathan is enough to overcome that would be a good story but as a widow of a mountie husband the fact that she might lose Nathan the same way should be a concern.   

Rosie's "You can call me Rosemary" line of the night.

Somehow Fiona is going to end up running the oil company.    And I guess she and Lucas will develop feelings for each other through that work?  Maybe?   

[dubstepford wife]

This was the last episode of the season right?  So that's it until either Christmas or they might do a season seven filmed in like, summer for a fall premiere, if world events permit it?  And if they're not filming until the fall of this year, they're done until next spring?

I don't envy y'all who are still watching, because man this sounds frustrating.  I get the Cliff's Notes version here and even that seems like too much time invested.  And from the sound of it this thread is more fun than the show at this point.

[scenicbyway]

15 minutes ago, dubstepford wife said:

This was the last episode of the season right?  So that's it until either Christmas or they might do a season seven filmed in like, summer for a fall premiere, if world events permit it?  And if they're not filming until the fall of this year, they're done until next spring?

I don't envy y'all who are still watching, because man this sounds frustrating.  I get the Cliff's Notes version here and even that seems like too much time invested.  And from the sound of it this thread is more fun than the show at this point.

They normally begin filming in August but who knows what this year will bring.  I suspect we’ll not see anymore new Hallmark movies until November or later.  I think they’ll prioritize Christmas movies over all else since that’s their money maker and they can’t film for the foreseeable future.

[StaceyNotStacie]

This triangle is absolutely aggravating. Elizabeth and Nathan have no chemistry. He makes no effort whatsoever in his relationship with Elizabeth. Even when he asked her to dinner, he was hesitant and then instead of waiting for an answer, he told her to think about it. Lucas has put in more effort in getting to know Elizabeth. He’s asking her out and setting up dates. If it wasn’t for Allie being a student, I doubt that Nathan and Elizabeth would really interact outside of a cordial hello. 
 

Rosemary and her Mary Poppins apron were absolutely adorable. For a character that was overbearing and somewhat annoying when she debuted, she has quickly become one of my favorites. 
 

I’m glad Fiona is sticking around. I wonder what her story will be once the show returns. My guess is that she goes to work with Lucas at the oil company and we get some sort of a quadrangle. I wouldn’t mind seeing her with Nathan if they’re going to put her with a main character. I think she could draw out his personality (if he has one) and I think her interactions with Allie could be fun. 

[lookeyloo]

25 minutes ago, Stacey1014 said:

This triangle is absolutely aggravating. Elizabeth and Nathan have no chemistry. He makes no effort whatsoever in his relationship with Elizabeth. Even when he asked her to dinner, he was hesitant and then instead of waiting for an answer, he told her to think about it. Lucas has put in more effort in getting to know Elizabeth. He’s asking her out and setting up dates. If it wasn’t for Allie being a student, I doubt that Nathan and Elizabeth would really interact outside of a cordial hello. 
 

Rosemary and her Mary Poppins apron were absolutely adorable. For a character that was overbearing and somewhat annoying when she debuted, she has quickly become one of my favorites. 
 

I’m glad Fiona is sticking around. I wonder what her story will be once the show returns. My guess is that she goes to work with Lucas at the oil company and we get some sort of a quadrangle. I wouldn’t mind seeing her with Nathan if they’re going to put her with a main character. I think she could draw out his personality (if he has one) and I think her interactions with Allie could be fun. 

I'm wondering if Carson will rethink his love for Faith? Those two don't have chemistry either.

[norcalgal]

2 hours ago, bybrandy said:

Yes, it is obvious that the show thinks we're supposed to be rooting for Nathan.. which begs the question of why they've given us no reason to root for him?   The guy who orchestrated library date, however, is totally capable of asking Elizabeth out while a horse exists.... just saying.   If they want me to root for Nathan they've got to give me a reason other than Red Serge.  And a better show (and maybe eventually on this show) the gun shot would give Elizabeth pause.   Does she really want to go down that road again?   Maybe her love for Nathan is enough to overcome that would be a good story but as a widow of a mountie husband the fact that she might lose Nathan the same way should be a concern.   

Rosie's "You can call me Rosemary" line of the night.

Somehow Fiona is going to end up running the oil company.    And I guess she and Lucas will develop feelings for each other through that work?  Maybe?   

ITA to all this. 

Even given the many great points all of you have made WRT the efforts Lucas v. Nathan have done to court Elizabeth, I still ship her with Nathan just because I think the pair are more aesthetically pleasing.  Yes, I know...so, so, shallow of me.  

And not to hijack this, but others have pointed out Kevin's long face and how it's not attractive. It's weird how I find that pleasing in Kevin, but not in the actor who played Stefan in The Vampire Diaries, a show I've just finished binge-watching. Maybe because Kevin's face is long but narrow, unlike Paul whose face is long but kind of lion-ish?  Anyway, beauty as they say, is in the eye of the beholder. 

56 minutes ago, Stacey1014 said:

[snip]

I’m glad Fiona is sticking around. I wonder what her story will be once the show returns. My guess is that she goes to work with Lucas at the oil company and we get some sort of a quadrangle. I wouldn’t mind seeing her with Nathan if they’re going to put her with a main character. I think she could draw out his personality (if he has one) and I think her interactions with Allie could be fun. 

Because this show is so unrealistic in many ways, I was so afraid that the show would present a happy outcome for Fiona when she stood up for herself with her boss. Even NOW, women are still getting the short end of the stick in the workplace, so it would have been the most unbelievable thing in this show EVER if Fiona did the "I am woman, hear me roar" routine but still got to keep her job. So, it was realistic that she was fired. I really hope they keep the character on the show. I just love her spunk and charm. In fact, now that I think about it, I think she may just be my favorite character on the show.

30 minutes ago, lookeyloo said:

I'm wondering if Carson will rethink his love for Faith? Those two don't have chemistry either.

I should be careful what I wish for because when Carson first came on the show, I almost immediately shipped him and Faith (who was on the show first).  But the characters never had chemistry and still don't even though they are officially a couple.  Man oh man, if Nathan and Elizabeth are Endgame, I hope I don't come to regret my choice.

Does anyone know what's supposed to be the age difference between between Lee and his sister?  For her to have a HS kid and another in college is quite the age gap between the Coulter sibs.  No mention has ever been made of multiple stillborn babies in between Lee and his sister so how could she have basically fully grown kids?  Even if Lee & Rosemary had a child soon after their marriage, the age between their kid and Susanna's would be at least a decade.  

I have a feeling there won't be a Christmas episode this year because of the COVID-19 shutdown and how it may have impacted filming. I don't know for sure if there was even supposed to be a Christmas episode, but unless they can film it in record time, doubtful this staple will happen.

[scenicbyway]

1 hour ago, dubstepford wife said:

This was the last episode of the season right?  So that's it until either Christmas or they might do a season seven filmed in like, summer for a fall premiere, if world events permit it?  And if they're not filming until the fall of this year, they're done until next spring?

I don't envy y'all who are still watching, because man this sounds frustrating.  I get the Cliff's Notes version here and even that seems like too much time invested.  And from the sound of it this thread is more fun than the show at this point.

They normally begin filming in August but who knows what this year will bring.  I suspect we’ll not see anymore new Hallmark movies until November or later.  I think they’ll prioritize Christmas movies over all else since that’s their money maker and they can’t film for the foreseeable future.

[brighteyes]

Totally agree with everyone's points on the finale. I was so surprised they added in another "non-date but really a date" with Lucas - it was crazy romantic and they had some legit chemistry in that scene, another reason to be so frustrated by the end of the episode. It made me feel even more sorry for Lucas when she went to hug Nathan - who didn't even look happy to be hugging her! I know he just lost a fellow Mountie so of course that must be emotional, but he literally had no reaction. 

I've said before that because I know it's what the writers have been hinting at, I wouldn't mind if Elizabeth ended up with Nathan - but if we only had a reason to root for them to be together, which we really don't have right now other than having parenting in common. Lucas was struggling with Henry and the oil business, yet still went out of his way to make things right when Elizabeth confronted him about it (which I think was a bit uncalled for - I'm glad she admitted it). Then he set up a sweet date to celebrate her book deal and then bought out Henry's business, which I'm sure he did to help the townspeople but I really think he did it in part to make Elizabeth happy. He goes out of his way every time to make her happy but even after all that, she broke his heart and went after Nathan, who took forever to ask her out and when he finally did, she didn't even answer him. You would think after she hinted to him so many times about it that she would have said yes immediately. It's so frustrating! If I were Lucas, I switch my sights to Fiona like some of you have already said. I think they'd make a great couple and she's a girl who knows what she wants - she would probably appreciate the romantic gestures a bit more. 

4 hours ago, scenicbyway said:

I wondered if the hug and Lucas’ sad look was supposed to mirror last year’s dance with Lucas and Nathan’s sad look?  The thing is, they aren’t equal circumstances, last year she really didn’t know either guy.  This year she’s been on dates with Lucas, they’ve gotten to know each other, he’s made his intentions known.  Nathan has done nothing but yell at her and use her for help with Ally.  And yet all of her looks are for Nathan, it makes no sense.

Has anyone watched the ET interview with Erin, Chris, and Kevin? It's long but really interesting - one thing they said was that last year, "Lucas got the dance but Nathan got the glance" and now this year "Nathan got the embrace but Lucas got the sad face". So I think they are trying to mirror last year. From the interview, it actually seems like the love triangle is still going on, and Chris even mentioned that Lucas was confident this year with Elizabeth but he may have to up his game next season because now he has competition. So they were acting like it's still not completely resolved (even though it's obvious she wants to be with Nathan). It makes sense because while I can see him being respectful towards her feelings and moving on, I can also imagine if there's no Christmas episode, them starting next season kind of where we left off here. Maybe Nathan is still grieving over his lost colleague so he won't have taken Elizabeth on the date yet, which may give Lucas another opportunity to continue courting her. 

7 hours ago, sharifa70 said:

Rosemary was the star of this episode for me. “You can call me Rosemary” was fantastic in the face of Susannah’s awfulness. 

Yes the very best part!! Susannah's attitude was so ridiculous - why would make such a long trip to see your brother if you don't even want to talk to him? 

[sharifa70]

8 hours ago, lookeyloo said:

I'm wondering if Carson will rethink his love for Faith? Those two don't have chemistry either.

I totally agree with this. Every time I see Fiona and Carson I think about how Faith and Carson were basically talked into being together by their friends. They have no chemistry and Faith just simpers all the time. Fiona doesn’t simper. She’s smart and independent and she should totally take over as mayor.

9 hours ago, dubstepford wife said:

I get the Cliff's Notes version here and even that seems like too much time invested.  And from the sound of it this thread is more fun than the show at this point.

Ha! This thread is definitely more intelligent than the show (and more fun).

At this point I’m so freaking annoyed with Elizabeth. Put her with Nathan, show, if all that matters is the uniform.  She doesn’t deserve Lucas anyway if she can’t see that his actions scream “I care for you and will put you first” so much louder than Nathan’s glowering and scolding. He should’ve taken that promotion. Stupid Allie.

[andromeda331]

Of course it was Nathan. He did nothing all season and yelled at her of course he's the one she picks. I still don't understand either why their giving us nothing to root for Nathan. They've had ten episodes to give us something and didn't. They have nothing in common, he never acts like he's really into her, they don't talk about anything but Ally and he's done nothing. He couldn't even ask her out because of a horse was making sounds. All we needed was at least one thing. While Lucas has done everything. He's wooed her, his learned her interests, he's helped her with her writing and in getting published and he arranges dates based on what Elizabeth would love. Celebrating her book deal was really nice and very romantic. Why didn't Nathan ask to dinner to celebrate her book deal? They are just so awkward. Why didn't he ask her questions when he heard about the book deal? Ask her about the book? Something. He just stood there awkwardly. As much as I hated his remark a couple episodes back calling her competition he made it seemed like that he was going to at least start doing something to woo her but since then has done nothing. When they started this triangle I assumed she'd ended up with Nathan but didn't think it would be due to him not having to do anything. 

Rosemary is awesome! I love her insisting Susanna call her Rosemary and then her going to the hotel tell to talk to her. I'm really not sure what we're suppose to think about Susanna but I didn't like her. Why did she travel all that way to stay an hotel and leave the next day? She didn't want to talk to him at dinner or when he came by the hotel. Why did she come all the way when she wasn't going to try. Also, I'm not sure its fair to be so mad at her brother when he didn't know how sick their parent (was it their father?) was and he wouldn't tell her. She said it was because the parent didn't want her to tell Lee.  I get she was stuck between keeping her word to a dying parent or breaking it to tell him. But how was that Lee's fault. I hope their visit to her and her family means Rosemary still gets her trip.

I know I shouldn't question the timeline but Rosemary said Lee almost died last week. So being generous in a week they tracked down Lee's sister even though he didn't even know where she was, makes a call, she hangs up and then ends up arriving in town a week later? That's pretty fast turnaround for someone who didn't even live in Canada.

I'm glad Fiona's staying but hopes she gets a better love interest then what's his name. I wouldn't mine seeing Carson and Faith break up either. I liked them in the beginning and thought they'd be interesting together but they really haven't been. Their kind of boring.

I also thought that him buying out Henry would somehow be portrayed as "bad" and that's how she ends up disliking him or something prior to the shooting even though Henry's really giving him no choice. I'm glad that didn't happened although I was annoyed with Elizabeth for being mad at him and making an assumption before talking to him which she did apologize for. But that was kind of crappy on her part. She's known him for awhile and he's talked to her about his problems with Henry. Plus never gets mad at Nathan when he's actually been a jerk. 

[brighteyes]

3 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

As much as I hated his remark a couple episodes back calling her competition he made it seemed like that he was going to at least start doing something to woo her but since then has done nothing. When they started this triangle I assumed she'd ended up with Nathan but didn't think it would be due to him not having to do anything. 

Exactly, even though I didn't like him considering her a competition (something Lucas never thought her as - remember the Bachelorette party when Nathan lied to get her attention? And when Nathan pretty much told Lucas they were both competing for "the town"?) I thought he might step up his game instead of sulking the rest of the season after that. 

3 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

I'm really not sure what we're suppose to think about Susanna but I didn't like her.

I didn't like her either and honestly, I don't understand what the point of her character was. They should have used her screen time to expand on Lee and Rosemary's current storyline instead. After Lee's accident and him realizing life is short, he should have brought up adoption and children: "life is short and we want kids so let's not wait any longer and go to Brookfield to adopt from the orphanage!" That would have been a great way to connect back to When Hope Calls as well and generate some more interest there. I can't believe we went through another season of them being childless and not even discussing other options. 

3 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

I was annoyed with Elizabeth for being mad at him and making an assumption before talking to him which she did apologize for. But that was kind of crappy on her part. She's known him for awhile and he's talked to her about his problems with Henry. Plus never gets mad at Nathan when he's actually been a jerk. 

It's so frustrating to see her get mad at Lucas for the smallest of things that aren't actually terrible - yet Nathan can act the way he has and she still wants to be around him. It really seems she's been trying to find something wrong with Lucas as an excuse to pick Nathan. She's looking too hard for red flags on one guy when the other guy in the literal red uniform is showing all the negative signs instead. 

[enduringforce]

They are making a travesty of the Elizabeth character, no longer just a teacher, and mother to a young son with the love of her life. She is now thirsty for two men’s attention and not even caring for her son. It’s horrible how they are playing Elizabeth like she is a teenager and playing high school games with boys. Neither man does she have any chemistry with and neither care at all for her child or would be a good father. How horrible.

[allonsyalice]

4 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

Of course it was Nathan. He did nothing all season and yelled at her of course he's the one she picks.

Not to sound all preachy, but literally Hallmark is teaching women to be with men who don’t respect them 😬 I’m not sure Nathan has ever been even a little to Elizabeth. All he does is brood and get mad when other people do stuff without him. I know I’m probably reading too much into this but, come on! Has Nathan ever once done a nice thing for Elizabeth? Has he taken interest in what she finds interesting? Has he had a conversation with her about something thats not Ally related for like two minutes? Does he have the personality of literally anything other than the feeling of when you accidentally step in a wet spot with your sock feet? 

Lucas, on the other hand, cares about Elizabeth as a person and also has interests and things to do. He has a sweet business, he takes an interest in what Elizabeth likes and he helps her with things and sure they have a rough patch but I think he actually has her interests in mind. Not only did he GET HER A LIBRARY! he also GOT HER A BOOK DEAL. 

But, yeah. I’d rather go for the Wet Sock personality who glowers and grumps all the time. No match between the two at all!

 

[sharifa70]

6 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

she hangs up and then ends up arriving in town a week later? That's pretty fast turnaround for someone who didn't even live in Canada.

OK, I spent way too much time on this. Bellingham is roughly 20 miles south of the WA/BC border (which I knew, being a more-or-less PNW native). What I didn’t know was where Fictional Hope Valley is actually supposed to be. Found a wiki page that sets it near the real Alberta town of Robb, which is a mere 500 miles or so from Bellingham. So, assuming she’d even find space on a train because of the freaking war, it would be about a day’s ride (which I’m basing on a 1912 timetable of a 21-hour trip from Chicago to Boston, which is about twice as far but on the fastest train).

I really need to get to sleep.

1 hour ago, allonsyalice said:

Does he have the personality of literally anything other than the feeling of when you accidentally step in a wet spot with your sock feet? 

This. Wet socks are the worst! 

[scenicbyway]

10 hours ago, allonsyalice said:

Not to sound all preachy, but literally Hallmark is teaching women to be with men who don’t respect them 😬 I’m not sure Nathan has ever been even a little to Elizabeth. All he does is brood and get mad when other people do stuff without him. I know I’m probably reading too much into this but, come on! Has Nathan ever once done a nice thing for Elizabeth? Has he taken interest in what she finds interesting? Has he had a conversation with her about something thats not Ally related for like two minutes? Does he have the personality of literally anything other than the feeling of when you accidentally step in a wet spot with your sock feet? 

Lucas, on the other hand, cares about Elizabeth as a person and also has interests and things to do. He has a sweet business, he takes an interest in what Elizabeth likes and he helps her with things and sure they have a rough patch but I think he actually has her interests in mind. Not only did he GET HER A LIBRARY! he also GOT HER A BOOK DEAL. 

But, yeah. I’d rather go for the Wet Sock personality who glowers and grumps all the time. No match between the two at all!

 

Yes to all of this!  She and Lucas actually have a relationship—dates, the library, the book deal, her helping with his business.  They are in each other’s lives.

If Ally didn’t exist there would be no reason for them to interact.  In fact, would she even want to know the new Mountie if he didn’t have a niece?

It’s just mind boggling that this is the route they are taking.  I did find it interesting that she didn’t immediately accept his invitation after telling him to ask her out.

As for Lee’s sister...yet another plot hole.  Was it to show us that she had grown kids so obviously they were too old to have a baby?  I think Rosemary was supposed to be Jack’s age.  I don’t know about Lee but the actor that plays him is 50 something.  They just seem to whine about not having a kid but don’t do anything about it even when orphans are in town.

[bybrandy]

32 minutes ago, scenicbyway said:

Yes to all of this!  She and Lucas actually have a relationship—dates, the library, the book deal, her helping with his business.  They are in each other’s lives.

If Ally didn’t exist there would be no reason for them to interact.  In fact, would she even want to know the new Mountie if he didn’t have a niece?

It’s just mind boggling that this is the route they are taking.  I did find it interesting that she didn’t immediately accept his invitation after telling him to ask her out.

As for Lee’s sister...yet another plot hole.  Was it to show us that she had grown kids so obviously they were too old to have a baby?  I think Rosemary was supposed to be Jack’s age.  I don’t know about Lee but the actor that plays him is 50 something.  They just seem to whine about not having a kid but don’t do anything about it even when orphans are in town.

Yeah, I don't know why they haven't done  a big crossover Christmas episode with Lee and Rosemary adopting from the orphanage.  

But Lee's age is pretty immaterial about whether they can have kids physically speaking.   

But my guess is they have him playing early 40s.   He said he got out of town as soon as he could so about 18.   And he hadn't seen his sister in about 20 years so 38... But maybe a bit older if they saw each other when he eventually turned up after their father died (after the funeral because he did't make it back for that) he could be a little older/early 40s.  But she said she looked after their dad for a couple of years.  Assuming she got married pretty quickly after their dad died and got pregnant immediately she could have an 18 year old... in college... and one in high school.   

Kavan's 49 and a decade between character and actor isn't all that unusual.   How old Rosie is would be more immaterial to their physical ability to have children.   Pascale Hutton is 40 so if she's playing her age range and younger she's in potential childbearing years.  And when she went to Carson about it he didn't mention her age as a hindrance.  

But while I don't think this show needs more children, I really don't see how this show has alluded a lot to them wanting kids and being friends with people who run an orphanage without at least having the conversation about adoption.

 

[redpencil]

Quote

Of course it was Nathan. He did nothing all season and yelled at her of course he's the one she picks.

But she still hasn't really picked anyone, has she? She was just glad he didn't get shot. This stupid triangle is STILL GOING. It will never, ever die, apparently. I know the actors said in interviews that there would start to be clarity next season, but they've really butchered this whole thing. It's been at least a season and half, with what sounds like probably at least another half season to go before it's "resolved." That's way too long, especially for such a terrible one (not that there's such a thing as a good love triangle, but at least there are less terrible ones). Erin had a quote in an article about how triangles start to be hard on the audience if they go on too long. Yeah, we're WAY past that point here.

[norcalgal]

2 hours ago, redpencil said:

But she still hasn't really picked anyone, has she? She was just glad he didn't get shot. This stupid triangle is STILL GOING. It will never, ever die, apparently. I know the actors said in interviews that there would start to be clarity next season, but they've really butchered this whole thing. It's been at least a season and half, with what sounds like probably at least another half season to go before it's "resolved." That's way too long, especially for such a terrible one (not that there's such a thing as a good love triangle, but at least there are less terrible ones). Erin had a quote in an article about how triangles start to be hard on the audience if they go on too long. Yeah, we're WAY past that point here.

When they said next season, did they mean 2020-2021 season?

I guess I'm in a "love triangle" state of mind lately because I just finished binge watching The Vampire Diaries - another triangle that went on too long, and tried to jerk the audience making us think the female character would flip back and forth (added bonus: the triangle involved two brothers!).

[Stuffy]

I’d be more interested if they’d move it along. Elizabeth can get married, and we see her adjust to married life. We didn’t really get to see that. Also her spouse adjusting to being the only living father little Jack will have.  We’re basically on season two of the triangle. It’s past time to move on from this boring storyline. They’re not doing the triangle well enough for it to be interesting. 

[redpencil]

Quote

When they said next season, did they mean 2020-2021 season?

Yeah, they meant the next tv season (I can't remember what season we're on), whenever that will start. Usually starts in January/February? Don't know if it will be delayed or not.

Quote

I’d be more interested if they’d move it along. Elizabeth can get married, and we see her adjust to married life. We didn’t really get to see that. Also her spouse adjusting to being the only living father little Jack will have.  We’re basically on season two of the triangle. It’s past time to move on from this boring storyline. They’re not doing the triangle well enough for it to be interesting. 

Yes, exactly! I have my preference of who it is (Lucas!) but even if it doesn't go my way, at least it would be covering new ground.

[Stuffy]

16 hours ago, redpencil said:

Yes, exactly! I have my preference of who it is (Lucas!) but even if it doesn't go my way, at least it would be covering new ground.

I’m pro-Lucas too.  I just randomly decided to see what people were saying on Facebook. I never read show comments, but I decided to see what they were saying. Anyway, I was shocked when they were pro-Nathan. 

Edited April 30, 2020 by Stuffy

[dubstepford wife]

Just a (cynical) guess, but I'm thinking they're Team Nathan because they basically see him as Jack re-cast.  Elizabeth and Jack intially didn't get along either and Jack was a jerk to her...for one episode.  If anything I always thought the showrunners ended that whole thing a bit too early.  But Nathan's bad personality has been going on for two seasons now and he doesn't even have a reason to be nasty, he just kind of is.  And there doesn't seem to be the same playful back-and-forth banter, Elizabeth just takes it like the milquetoast she has become.  But hey, he looks good in red* and that's all that matters, right?

*=subjective, of course.

[SusanwatchingTV]

I'm really reluctant to post here because clearly I'm in the serious minority, but maybe I'm not alone... so here goes:

I still prefer Nathan to Lucas.  Lucas still gives me the creeps.  I can't help it. They must have done too good a job with the creepy intro of him as a possible bad guy.  He just looks creepy, he tries way too hard to please Elizabeth. It's like he's made it his mission to get to her, and yet does he even know she has a kid? (I mean, I know he does, but he doesn't seem like the father-type and hasn't seemed to make any effort to get to know the kid while wooing her.) I feel like he wants her, but I don't see him being in love with her.  I'm sure I'm wrong, and y'all are right.  He must love her, but the way he acts just creeps me out.  Every scene they write he's on the edge of creepy with shifty ways.  You later always find out he's not after all, but you've spent the entire episode being suspicious of him.  I just don't find that attractive. I'm not arguing that he hasn't done things that seem great, but I'm just constantly suspicious of his motives, that's all.

Nathan, on the other hand, seems to be a guy who is in love, but doesn't really want to be. He fought it at first, and still fights it in his own mind. He cares, but he's trying not to (which is what makes him grumpy), but then he has to give in and admit that he does.  He always seems to be struggling a bit to "just be friends" but then he can't deny his feelings, and especially when Elizabeth gives him a look and bats an eyelash his way.

I will admit, though, that they've not done a great job of letting them develop a real relationship over time they way they should have.  It's been a mess... both guys are not well written, imho.  Oh, and I definitely agree that the kid is horrible.  I don't know why they've made her so unappealing.  She should have been younger and a lot cuter.

Anyway, I'm really only hate watching until this show ends, so I don't really care which one she chooses... but I felt like I should point out why some might not like Lucas.

 

Edited April 30, 2020 by SusanwatchingTV

[lookeyloo]

2 hours ago, SusanwatchingTV said:

I'm really reluctant to post here because clearly I'm in the serious minority, but maybe I'm not alone... so here goes:

I still prefer Nathan to Lucas.  Lucas still gives me the creeps.  I can't help it. They must have done too good a job with the creepy intro of him as a possible bad guy.  He just looks creepy, he tries way too hard to please Elizabeth. It's like he's made it his mission to get to her, and yet does he even know she has a kid? (I mean, I know he does, but he doesn't seem like the father-type and hasn't seemed to make any effort to get to know the kid while wooing her.) I feel like he wants her, but I don't see him being in love with her.  I'm sure I'm wrong, and y'all are right.  He must love her, but the way he acts just creeps me out.  Every scene they write he's on the edge of creepy with shifty ways.  You later always find out he's not after all, but you've spent the entire episode being suspicious of him.  I just don't find that attractive. I'm not arguing that he hasn't done things that seem great, but I'm just constantly suspicious of his motives, that's all.

Nathan, on the other hand, seems to be a guy who is in love, but doesn't really want to be. He fought it at first, and still fights it in his own mind. He cares, but he's trying not to (which is what makes him grumpy), but then he has to give in and admit that he does.  He always seems to be struggling a bit to "just be friends" but then he can't deny his feelings, and especially when Elizabeth gives him a look and bats an eyelash his way.

I will admit, though, that they've not done a great job of letting them develop a real relationship over time they way they should have.  It's been a mess... both guys are not well written, imho.  Oh, and I definitely agree that the kid is horrible.  I don't know why they've made her so unappealing.  She should have been younger and a lot cuter.

Anyway, I'm really only hate watching until this show ends, so I don't really care which one she chooses... but I felt like I should point out why some might not like Lucas.

 

I think I agree with you. In my experience the flashy guy isn’t the one for the long haul. Someone like Nathan seems like the kind of guy who would be there always. I think both actors are attractive enough. I know it is Hallmark and all but the books are nothing like this show. I still can’t get over how clean they are and no horse poop in the streets! 

[SusanwatchingTV]

36 minutes ago, lookeyloo said:

I think I agree with you. In my experience the flashy guy isn’t the one for the long haul. Someone like Nathan seems like the kind of guy who would be there always. I think both actors are attractive enough. I know it is Hallmark and all but the books are nothing like this show. I still can’t get over how clean they are and no horse poop in the streets! 

So true!  I laugh at how over dressed and well coiffed they are.

Lucas is good looking, and I've liked him in Hallmark movies and things, it's just the way they write him. Same with Henry - they write him to be bad, and he was very bad at the beginning, so I just have a hard time seeing him as a guy that could be counted on for a woman, especially a woman of that day and time.

There's the whole saloon owner and gambler thing, too.  In that day (from what I've read) the local school teacher with a young son would not have taken up with such a man.  It's just not what I see the Elizabeth we've known all along doing.  She's more the "I want a hero because I am a hero" type.

But again, just my opinion. I get that others don't see it. That's fine.  We all come with our own pov.

[bybrandy]

3 hours ago, SusanwatchingTV said:

(I mean, I know he does, but he doesn't seem like the father-type and hasn't seemed to make any effort to get to know the kid while wooing her.)

Literally every time he runs into her and she's holding little Jack he says hi to little Jack.  He acknowledges little Jack way, way, way more than Nathan.   That doesn't mean he should or shouldn't be the one, but like literally he is so nice to little Jack every time they see each other and I fee like Elizabeth rarely has Jack with her when she sees Nathan.   

[SusanwatchingTV]

10 hours ago, bybrandy said:

Literally every time he runs into her and she's holding little Jack he says hi to little Jack.  He acknowledges little Jack way, way, way more than Nathan.   That doesn't mean he should or shouldn't be the one, but like literally he is so nice to little Jack every time they see each other and I fee like Elizabeth rarely has Jack with her when she sees Nathan.   

Okay.  I just haven't noticed anything more than a hi.  Maybe I've missed other interactions?... not that Nathan has much interaction with him either, but Nathan has been presented as a selfless guy who has basically given up his independence to take care of another man's child, though she is his kin.  He's a person who puts the needs of others ahead of his own.  That's attractive to me and makes him seem like he'd be a better father figure. I realize that I'm weird and wrong in the eyes of most here, but I'm just pointing out a different pov so those who find it strange might understand the way the other side thinks on it.

[norcalgal]

3 hours ago, SusanwatchingTV said:

Okay.  I just haven't noticed anything more than a hi.  Maybe I've missed other interactions?... not that Nathan has much interaction with him either, but Nathan has been presented as a selfless guy who has basically given up his independence to take care of another man's child, though she is his kin.  He's a person who puts the needs of others ahead of his own.  That's attractive to me and makes him seem like he'd be a better father figure. I realize that I'm weird and wrong in the eyes of most here, but I'm just pointing out a different pov so those who find it strange might understand the way the other side thinks on it.

 

17 hours ago, SusanwatchingTV said:

I'm really reluctant to post here because clearly I'm in the serious minority, but maybe I'm not alone... so here goes:

I still prefer Nathan to Lucas.  Lucas still gives me the creeps.  I can't help it. They must have done too good a job with the creepy intro of him as a possible bad guy.  He just looks creepy, he tries way too hard to please Elizabeth. It's like he's made it his mission to get to her, and yet does he even know she has a kid? (I mean, I know he does, but he doesn't seem like the father-type and hasn't seemed to make any effort to get to know the kid while wooing her.) I feel like he wants her, but I don't see him being in love with her.  I'm sure I'm wrong, and y'all are right.  He must love her, but the way he acts just creeps me out.  Every scene they write he's on the edge of creepy with shifty ways.  You later always find out he's not after all, but you've spent the entire episode being suspicious of him.  I just don't find that attractive. I'm not arguing that he hasn't done things that seem great, but I'm just constantly suspicious of his motives, that's all.

Nathan, on the other hand, seems to be a guy who is in love, but doesn't really want to be. He fought it at first, and still fights it in his own mind. He cares, but he's trying not to (which is what makes him grumpy), but then he has to give in and admit that he does.  He always seems to be struggling a bit to "just be friends" but then he can't deny his feelings, and especially when Elizabeth gives him a look and bats an eyelash his way.

I will admit, though, that they've not done a great job of letting them develop a real relationship over time they way they should have.  It's been a mess... both guys are not well written, imho.  Oh, and I definitely agree that the kid is horrible.  I don't know why they've made her so unappealing.  She should have been younger and a lot cuter.

Anyway, I'm really only hate watching until this show ends, so I don't really care which one she chooses... but I felt like I should point out why some might not like Lucas.

 

Hi SusanWatchingtv, you're not weird, and "wrong" is subjective. I've posted many times that I'm Team Nathan, mostly because I like the aesthetic of Nathan/Elizabeth more than Lucas/Elizabeth. I just feel the former couple "look" better together. I repeat again that I am shallow in this regard. And I repeat again that I prefer Kevin's physical appearance over that of Chris, but that's not to say Chris is ugly. 

As for Lucas's creep factor, I don't see it. I view the character as being sincere in wooing Elizabeth, maybe verging just a tad on the side of trying too hard. Lucas is no longer shifty the way he was when first introduced to the show. I've written before that WCTH turned him into a white hat because they wanted to introduce a love triangle, so they can't have Lucas being untrustworthy when his rival is a Mountie! Too bad, as I'd like the show to have someone with more of an edge to them...

As for Nathan, if I look hard, I may see it as you do: that he tries to resist the pull to Elizabeth, but ultimately can't. The heart wants what it wants. Right now, I'm not sure why he's attracted to her, except on the surface level. Also, ,maybe because she's Ally's teacher? As many others have written on this forum, the show really needs to start developing more of a true relationship for these two if they are going to be Endgame. Just saying "you matter to me" (Nathan), or giving longing looks (Elizabeth) is not enough.

 I just hope that next season will be the final season. I'm not quite hate-watching WCTH, but continue with it just to see how the show ends. I was there from the very beginning (even watched the two hour prequel movie with what'shername from Lost as the "Elizabeth" character), so I'll stick with it to the bitter end.

[brighteyes]

12 hours ago, SusanwatchingTV said:

Okay.  I just haven't noticed anything more than a hi.  Maybe I've missed other interactions?...

Nathan has held Jack before, in the Christening episode last season. Other than that, I don't think we've actually seen Elizabeth holding Jack around Nathan. She has however bumped into Lucas on the street holding Jack (when she went to shop for Clara's bachelorette party, he saw them and said "How are two of my favorite people doing?") and on their trip to Union City he asked about him during their picnic ("You're thinking of little Jack, aren't you?"). He also had a quick scene with him during the library's grand opening, showing him the Peter Rabbit book and then that scene in the mercantile where Jack is playing with the toys on the shelves while he discusses Elizabeth's novel with her. So she's just had more scenes with Lucas and Jack together and they've discussed him. It doesn't mean Lucas likes Jack more, just that it's been an uneven representation on the show's part, in my opinion. I would have loved to see both men having more scenes interacting with Jack since one of them will end up becoming his stepfather. 

9 hours ago, norcalgal said:

As for Lucas's creep factor, I don't see it. I view the character as being sincere in wooing Elizabeth, maybe verging just a tad on the side of trying too hard. Lucas is no longer shifty the way he was when first introduced to the show.

I agree. I've been Team Lucas from the start, but I think either of the men would look great with Elizabeth as a couple. I don't see Lucas as a creep either because I think that "shady" storyline has passed and it was a whole season ago - Jesse used to be a "bad" guy but now he's one of the good ones. Same with Carson, everyone was suspicious of him and now he's the town doctor with no bad qualities. I think even Bill was a suspect at one point - I think I remember Jack arresting him for something. Lucas is just maybe trying a bit too hard with Elizabeth but he did say outright at their first dinner that he would work hard to win over the woman he believes to be his soulmate, so he's really been honest about literally everything this season, from Henry's business to courting Elizabeth. 

9 hours ago, norcalgal said:

As many others have written on this forum, the show really needs to start developing more of a true relationship for these two if they are going to be Endgame. Just saying "you matter to me" (Nathan), or giving longing looks (Elizabeth) is not enough.

I've said it before but I wouldn't mind seeing Elizabeth end up with Nathan if we had a reason to root for them together. I think they need to step it up next season with Nathan if they want to make their endgame believable. It's just a TV show but from their interviews even the actors seem to want some kind of interesting material to work with. Some conflict would be nice or just some real story progression instead of filler episodes. Now that he's asked her out I hope they actually show a date between Nathan and Elizabeth or some scenes together discussing something other than Ally. Maybe even show Lucas upset with Elizabeth because he's hurt that she went to hug Nathan the day after their "non-date" in the library. 

Edited May 2, 2020 by brighteyes

[ctlady]

Just finished binging the last 6-7 episodes of Who Will Elizabeth Choose.....er....When Calls The Heart.  Here are my brutally honest thoughts....

I found the entire 'Elizabeth has two suitors' plot nauseating.  Only in Hope Valley can a a young widowed mom be the most eligible woman in the county.  Frankly, I found Fiona more appealing and worthy of a suitor than Elizabeth's 'oh, golly gee' personality.  Really, watching Nathan and Lucas have a polite pissing match over her was hard to watch.

Wherever she was - there they BOTH were.  If she was with one, the other wasn't far from spying distance.  She walks by, in town just as they both happen to be outside their respective places of employment.  It was perfectly stalker creepy. I actually enjoyed the episode where Lucas took her to Union City to see Virginia Woolfe so there was no chance of running into broody Nathan. 

I really wanted her to end up with Lucas because - ugh, not another mountie.  Then again, we don't really know if she did indeed 'choose'.  I'm believing she hugged Nathan out of relief that he wasn't the one shot to death and - yeppers - there's not-inside-running-his-bar Lucas to witness said hug.  I need to move on because this entire scenario really irked me.

Okay - I'm going there - little Jack is one funny looking baby.  I said it.  I'm sorry, but that baby who plays him has a weird evil-ish look in some scenes.  And can the writers quite having him called 'little' Jack?  'Big' Jack is gone so there's only one Jack.  No need to differentiate.  And what's with casting a very blonde baby who has 2 brunette parents?

Carson/Faith - glad that's over too.  I thought the chemistry was about as exciting as water boiling.  Forgive my shallow crudeness, but I never thought the actress attractive.  Even if I did, there was just nothing there that made me want to root for them.  They were the most boring flavor of vanilla there was

Jesse/Clara - I could say the same as Carson & Faith, but not as much.  Just....nothing interested me.  Not even the wedding prep

Lee & Rosemary - While her dramatic sing-songy voice tends to bug me as well as Lee having to pacify her most times (the scene where she called Lee all frantic about whether he found 'little' Jack's stuffed toy because , you know, the man has nothing better to do than to run around town looking for a stuffed toy when - you know - he has a mill to run. [eye roll/] they were by far the most palpable for me to watch

Bill - other than doing 'judgy' things and running the restaurant (which they need to and should rename - he really didn't have any dedicated storylines because - you know - it was All.About.Elizabeth this season

Henry - I really liked the oil co drama, especially with him and Lucas.  I had hoped he hadn't gone back to nefarious ways, but rather he just bit off more than he could chew and was too proud to say so.  Now that Lucas bought him out, and Fiona is out of a job and remaining, perhaps she can find employment there .  Maybe also keep Henry on in some capacity as the entire business was his idea and maybe they can bring in an oil consultant seeing that neither he nor Lucas knows the oil business

 

 

Edited May 12, 2020 by ctlady

[The Ringo Kidd]

11 hours ago, ctlady said:

Okay - I'm going there - little Jack is one funny looking baby.  I said it.  I'm sorry, but that baby who plays him has a weird evil-ish look in some scenes.  And can the writers quite having him called 'little' Jack?  'Big' Jack is gone so there's only one Jack.  No need to differentiate.  And what's with casting a very blonde baby who has 2 brunette parents?

This baby is a dead ringer for my chiropractor.

Every time he shows up my wife and I shout “chiropractor baby.”

It’s hilarious!

[sharifa70]

15 hours ago, ctlady said:

And what's with casting a very blonde baby who has 2 brunette parents?

Nothing particularly weird about that: my parents were both tow-heads before they ended up with dark brown hair by the end of elementary school. My brother and I both stayed blond(e). Only ones in the family, actually - everyone else on both sides is dark-haired. Genes are strange.

But yeah, little Jack does look like he could maybe be hiding some evil tendencies. Maybe his middle name is Damien and next season is going to become a completely different show. I mean, there must be a reason we never see a pastor...

[The Ringo Kidd]

8 hours ago, sharifa70 said:

But yeah, little Jack does look like he could maybe be hiding some evil tendencies. Maybe his middle name is Damien and next season is going to become a completely different show. I mean, there must be a reason we never see a pastor...

Maybe he can team up with Rosemary’s Baby which I predict comes next season.

[izabella]

On 4/27/2020 at 9:32 AM, bybrandy said:

Somehow Fiona is going to end up running the oil company.    And I guess she and Lucas will develop feelings for each other through that work?  Maybe?   

I sure hope so!  I am one who thinks Elizabeth and Nathan are both super boring and deserve each other.  Lucas deserves someone more interesting than Elizabeth, and he and Fiona would be great together.

[humbleopinion]

Elizabeth will marry the Tedious Nathan because he comes with a ready made live in baby sitter...even if it is that eye rolling, can't be bothered Allie so the couple can off load Little Jack for grown up time....exit stage left Jack and Allie......

[SnarkySheep]

On a random side note - exactly how far away is Hamilton supposed to be?? It seems like it's far away when they want it to seem that way, yet close enough for people to hop a train and just show up in Hope Valley when they want that, too... 😁

[allonsyalice]

2 hours ago, SnarkySheep said:

On a random side note - exactly how far away is Hamilton supposed to be?? It seems like it's far away when they want it to seem that way, yet close enough for people to hop a train and just show up in Hope Valley when they want that, too... 😁

im 45.6% sure they're talking about Hamilton, Ontario, would would make it days' worth of a ride (roughly two, I think. this number is bought to you by the calgary-->toronto bus i took once) 

[SnarkySheep]

Watching some old episodes on Netflix --

I have long since accepted this show's many historical inaccuracies, at least in terms of things like hairstyle and clothing, as I've read articles that state the difficulties involved in being more accurate. Ok, fine. But does the show not have interns with access to Google? It shouldn't be so difficult for TPTB to realize things like, no, Julie wouldn't be in trouble for driving without a license, because cars were still so new in 1911 that driver's licenses weren't actually a thing yet. 

Google is your friend, show.

[dubstepford wife]

I don't know why Google News felt the need to tell me this (I'm guessing because I've commented here and cookies are a thing), but it looks like filming the next season is starting soon.

This show is never going to end, I'm convinced.  As long as Erin Krakow sticks with it, it's going to continue.  Place your bets on how other main characters will join Jack in meeting their own untimely and somewhat bizarre offscreen ends when the actors decide to leave.  I'm going with, Nathan will get stung by a bunch of bees a la Macauley Culkin in "My Girl," Rosemary will adopt a baby, experience two seconds of happiness, and then fall off a horse, leaving Lee to be a single Dad, and Little Jack will turn into Michael Myers and stab Allie.

[ouinason]

Is it bad that I feel a tiny zing of glee every time I think of the WCTH uber "Halmark" fandom's reaction to DL's gay actor character on the Rookie?  I feel like a bad person, but then again, hehehehe.  He could not have picked a more opposite character and audience.

[sharifa70]

On 7/11/2020 at 10:50 AM, dubstepford wife said:

Little Jack will turn into Michael Myers and stab Allie.

I’m kinda thinking maybe Elizabeth will finally snap when Allie comes whinging to her yet again about yet another g-d “Uncle Nathan doesn’t understand me” complaint and stab her herself. This will result in a grateful town not only not prosecuting her, but making her their Supreme Empress.

[SnarkySheep]

On 8/18/2020 at 1:03 PM, ouinason said:

Is it bad that I feel a tiny zing of glee every time I think of the WCTH uber "Halmark" fandom's reaction to DL's gay actor character on the Rookie?  I feel like a bad person, but then again, hehehehe.  He could not have picked a more opposite character and audience.

My main question has long been why did DL leave a show that literally centered on him, in order to join a show where he's just an occasionally recurring character. Did he hate WCTH that much?

[dubstepford wife]

5 hours ago, SnarkySheep said:

My main question has long been why did DL leave a show that literally centered on him, in order to join a show where he's just an occasionally recurring character. Did he hate WCTH that much?

We'll never know for sure but I'm guessing it was a death of a 1000 cuts.  WCtH had probably gotten very boring/monotonous for him, especially considering it had become the Abigail show.  I can't imagine he enjoyed doing paint-by-numbers Christmas movies, and stuff like "Christmas Cookie Matchup" honestly seems very cringey and humiliating.  And the Bill Abbott regime of zero diversity and kowtowing to the One Million Moms might have bothered him.

I haven't seen The Rookie so I can't comment on his character there but if it's a gay actor then at least it's something different and a little more challenging.  And he's only a recurring character on a moderately successful show now but this way he's much freer to go to auditions, or maybe write or try his hand at directing, or do theater.  Actors are artists, they want to do things that feel creative.

It's just a shame that his character had to be killed off.  If he only wanted to appear occasionally then I get why they did -- a Hallmark show can't *not* focus on romance (because that's all that matters in women's lives, right?) -- but still, it's sad.  I've long maintained that the correct thing to do was end the show and just focus on the spinoff.