S04.E19: Last-Minute Resistance

[WendyCR72]

After encouraging her sister to spend a night out with friends, Burgess wakes to find that Nicole never made it home. As the guilt begins to eat at Burgess, the team in Intelligence bands together to make finding Nicole their main priority. The case kicks into high gear when she is found clinging to life in an El station.

[Laurie4H]

Call me insensitive but I can't feel much sympathy for a mother who gets drunk and goes willingly into a car with 2 strangers and drinks something they give her....in this day in age with so many sick individuals out there, you need to take some responsibility when it comes to keeping yourself safe.

[Chas411]

Marina has finished filming now so no more fun spot the bump games during episodes.

[dreamcatcher]

5 hours ago, Laurie4H said:

Call me insensitive but I can't feel much sympathy for a mother who gets drunk and goes willingly into a car with 2 strangers and drinks something they give her....in this day in age with so many sick individuals out there, you need to take some responsibility when it comes to keeping yourself safe.

Ok I hate this kind of thinking because you're putting blame on the victims. And her being a mother doesn't mean she isn't allowed to drink anymore. Yes we all know that there are many sick people out there and most importanlty, as this episode highlighted, there are guys who really don't believe that "no means no" and that pushing women beyond their limits isn't rape. We need to be aware of these things to protect ourselves, but I would never blame a woman for going through something so terrible just because she happened to be the one to fall in a monster's (because they definitely aren't human) path.

Do we know whether Marina plans to come back? I don't want her to leave permanently!

I loved this episode. They used all the characters pretty evenly,Marina was BRILLIANT and I think Sofia did an amazing job too. Especially during the interrogation scene! And I love all the Burzek (little) scenes.

[Laurie4H]

I never said you aren't allowed to drink if your a mother but you shouldn't be getting so drunk you can't think clearly.

[FnkyChkn34]

6 hours ago, dreamcatcher said:

I loved this episode. They used all the characters pretty evenly,Marina was BRILLIANT and I think Sofia did an amazing job too. Especially during the interrogation scene! And I love all the Burzek (little) scenes.

This was a good episode, I agree.  I liked Erin and Kim undercover, and I'm not really the biggest fan of Kim.  Erin and Jay being back to "normal" in the interrogation scene was nice to see as well.

I feel like they didn't really use everyone evenly though.  It seemed to me like Jay, Al, and Voight had smaller roles.  One thing I noticed is that Jay was at the club, watching Erin and Kim, but then when they all stormed the apartment, he wasn't there - Ruzek broke the door, and then he, Atwater, Voight and Al ran to Kim.  Erin arrested the other guy in the living room.  I just thought to myself, "that's weird, Jay was out with them but now must be waiting in the car?"

I know the message of this episode was definitely "no means no" but I just hope that some people don't see it and get other ideas.  That guy who gave the seminars is a vile, horrible monster.  I hope people like him don't exist in real life, but I'm sure they do.  This had "ripped from the headlines" written all over it.

[dreamcatcher]

3 hours ago, Laurie4H said:

I never said you aren't allowed to drink if your a mother but you shouldn't be getting so drunk you can't think clearly.

The thing is, she wasn't. She thought she was going to another party with her friend and then she was drugged. She didn't choose to get drugged and there was nothing she could do to avoid this or getting raped while she was passed out.

10 minutes ago, FnkyChkn34 said:

This was a good episode, I agree.  I liked Erin and Kim undercover, and I'm not really the biggest fan of Kim.  Erin and Jay being back to "normal" in the interrogation scene was nice to see as well.

I feel like they didn't really use everyone evenly though.  It seemed to me like Jay, Al, and Voight had smaller roles.  One thing I noticed is that Jay was at the club, watching Erin and Kim, but then when they all stormed the apartment, he wasn't there - Ruzek broke the door, and then he, Atwater, Voight and Al ran to Kim.  Erin arrested the other guy in the living room.  I just thought to myself, "that's weird, Jay was out with them but now must be waiting in the car?"

I know the message of this episode was definitely "no means no" but I just hope that some people don't see it and get other ideas.  That guy who gave the seminars is a vile, horrible monster.  I hope people like him don't exist in real life, but I'm sure they do.  This had "ripped from the headlines" written all over it.

You're right that not everyone had an equal amount of screentime, but that can't happen with such a large cast. It just that most of the times, Erin/Jay and voight get more screentime than everyone else (and I don't mind because I absolutely love them, but I've seen a lot of people commenting on that). So in this episode they tried to give more time to the other characters and I liked that. Since I get to have many scenes with Jay in each episode, I don't mind seeing less of him if that means that other fans get more of their faves too!

That's the thing, there are many cases like this on the news all the time. And as I said, it is true that some people think that when a woman says no she's just playing hard to get/playing games with you. That's a topic I feel strongly about which is why I'm impressed they handled it quite nicely. I mean they've had other rape cases as well, but in this episode they highlighted the fact that there are so many people out there with that mentality-and I think they added the other guy, the "accomplice" to show that there are people who truly don't understand that they are doing something wrong. Which I guess is what makes this so terrifying.

[FnkyChkn34]

46 minutes ago, dreamcatcher said:

You're right that not everyone had an equal amount of screentime, but that can't happen with such a large cast. It just that most of the times, Erin/Jay and voight get more screentime than everyone else (and I don't mind because I absolutely love them, but I've seen a lot of people commenting on that). So in this episode they tried to give more time to the other characters and I liked that. Since I get to have many scenes with Jay in each episode, I don't mind seeing less of him if that means that other fans get more of their faves too!

That's the thing, there are many cases like this on the news all the time. And as I said, it is true that some people think that when a woman says no she's just playing hard to get/playing games with you. That's a topic I feel strongly about which is why I'm impressed they handled it quite nicely. I mean they've had other rape cases as well, but in this episode they highlighted the fact that there are so many people out there with that mentality-and I think they added the other guy, the "accomplice" to show that there are people who truly don't understand that they are doing something wrong. Which I guess is what makes this so terrifying.

Well said on both points!

[CheshireCat]

12 hours ago, Laurie4H said:

Call me insensitive but I can't feel much sympathy for a mother who gets drunk and goes willingly into a car with 2 strangers and drinks something they give her....in this day in age with so many sick individuals out there, you need to take some responsibility when it comes to keeping yourself safe.

Those are certainly things that were instilled into me as a child - don't go anywhere with strangers, don't accept anything from strangers, so she may have acted irresponsibly. But we all do things we shouldn't do sometimes. Fact is, it doesn't justify rape or makes it her fault in any way. She was raped, plain and simple, and I think that is the only thing that matters.

[MakeMeLaugh]

Al has had a lot of time on the Other Chicagos (fine by me--if he wants to come to my suburb I'll be glad to make him dinner). 

I am loving Burgess now--what is wrong with me?? I'm even okay with Ruzek. WTF?

MML Son did some Chicago clubbing in his youth and the birthday party barhopping rang true from what he reported to us (not so much the predatory behavior by those pathetic men). Mr MML was literally cheering at Voight's last scene. 

[MissLucas]

I liked Voight's take on gender relations, both in content and delivery.

This is now the third time I see a crime show dealing with a case involving some dude teaching pick-up seminars. They all turned out to be either criminals or 'just' real douche-bags. Talk about a job with a really shady reputation.

[FnkyChkn34]

38 minutes ago, MakeMeLaugh said:

I am loving Burgess now--what is wrong with me?? I'm even okay with Ruzek. WTF?

I'm not entirely loving either one yet, but I am tolerating them more than before. :-)  Marina did a great job in last night's episode.

Edited April 6, 2017 by FnkyChkn34

[Vella]

So Kim's sister goes out for a fun night with friends and gets raped and hurt so badly she has to have surgery. One friend dies. We see detectives interview one of the friends who is horrified to learn what happened after she left and the others are interviewed off screen. 

Here's my problem: why was nobody at the hospital with Nicole? Why were none of the other women sitting with their friend? That last scene, post-surgery, was especially glaring. The show took the time to do an on screen interview, they couldn't get the same actress to be in the hospital room when Kim shows up? Not even a reference that a friend was just getting coffee or went to get the daughter to bring her by? Nicole was alone the entire time when Kim was working? Really show? Sloppy writing.

And that scene where Kim talks tough and brags about her cop gang in front of the husband just does not sit well with me.  It's like she couldn't stand up to him on her own and I hate when the show goes overboard with the justification of cops using threats to get their way.

[Mars477]

4 hours ago, MissLucas said:

I liked Voight's take on gender relations, both in content and delivery.

This is now the third time I see a crime show dealing with a case involving some dude teaching pick-up seminars. They all turned out to be either criminals or 'just' real douche-bags. Talk about a job with a really shady reputation.

Pick Up Aristry is founded on the principle that a guy can whittle down a girl's self esteem and fulfill conditions X Y and Z and they'll get laid, like women are female shaped robots who don't actually have a conscious decision over who they sleep with.  It's an inherently sleazy and misogynistic "industry".

What it really is is a way for losers to rationalize the fact that they're getting laid much less than they think they deserve, by directing the blame to "Those Bitches" who won't drop trou the instant they say hi.  Pretty pathetic.

That said, being the family of someone on the Intelligence unit must preclude getting any kind of life insurance.  I'm terrified of what the show will do to Atwater's siblings the moment the writers remember they exist, especially since the cliches are already preformed and the story writes itself.

[greyhorse]

How many times must we watch a show centered around one of these pick-up guys and their business?  I can't remember what else I was watching in the past year, but I seem to recall that it was pretty much the exact same storyline.

I don't frequent these forums much lately, so I had no idea that Burgess was pregnant until last week when it was pretty obvious with the baby bump.  Now of course, the natural "I need some time off" and she'll disappear for a while.  I do hope the actress comes back.

[Kel Varnsen]

7 hours ago, Vella said:

Here's my problem: why was nobody at the hospital with Nicole? Why were none of the other women sitting with their friend? That last scene, post-surgery, was especially glaring. The show took the time to do an on screen interview, they couldn't get the same actress to be in the hospital room when Kim shows up? Not even a reference that a friend was just getting coffee or went to get the daughter to bring her by? Nicole was alone the entire time when Kim was working? Really show? Sloppy writing.

And that scene where Kim talks tough and brags about her cop gang in front of the husband just does not sit well with me.  It's like she couldn't stand up to him on her own and I hate when the show goes overboard with the justification of cops using threats to get their way.

It wasn't too much of a stretch for me to believe her friends weren't there. I have never been in a situation like that but i can see how she might not want to face her other friends. Not only because of what happened to her, but because the other friend died.

As for the thing with the husband that kind of bugged me too. Mostly because crappy husband doesn't automatically mean crappy dad. And the daughter might have wanted to see her dad.

Also is that Burgess's house they are staying in? That place is giant. Is Chicago really cheap or something because Erin is a detective and her place wasn't that big.

[Guildford]

Voight was fascinating in this. When he was talking to that guy at his seminar he was so calm and I was waiting for him to just snap, it was un-Voight like and so perfect but you knew he wasn't going to walk away from the POS and when he poked Voight in the chest we all knew what was coming.

Burgess going off the rails was enough. And boy did she have a moment. What an awesome episode for her. 

I loved Ruzek in this, he was protective & peed off but stayed 100% professional (even if you could sense he was teetering) that sweet little thigh touch when Burgess was about to go off at the lawyer was perfect. I even tolerated Lindsay this week, she wasn't as annoying and miserable as she usually is.

Jay's manslut scene was hilarious and a nice light point in a dark episode....maybe, just maybe he's getting his personality back now that he's free. Here's hoping.

Let's see if they give the Burzek fans the deleted scene, considering they caved in to the Linstead fans last week.

[jewel21]

On 4/6/2017 at 8:15 AM, Laurie4H said:

I never said you aren't allowed to drink if your a mother but you shouldn't be getting so drunk you can't think clearly.

I forget how high her alcohol blood count was but it apparently wasn't high enough to pass out and not remember. It was the drugs in her system that messed her up.

I really enjoyed this episode. It was well done and well acted. I actually enjoyed Burgess in it and Ruzek. Then again, I've always had a soft spot for Ruzek. The apartment scene with Erin and Burgess was well done too and I was so surprised when she swallowed the drink. It was pretty bad ass, as was her beating the shit out of her sister's rapist. I really hope she'll come back after she has her baby.

[dreamcatcher]

10 hours ago, Guildford said:

Voight was fascinating in this. When he was talking to that guy at his seminar he was so calm and I was waiting for him to just snap, it was un-Voight like and so perfect but you knew he wasn't going to walk away from the POS and when he poked Voight in the chest we all knew what was coming.

Burgess going off the rails was enough. And boy did she have a moment. What an awesome episode for her. 

I loved Ruzek in this, he was protective & peed off but stayed 100% professional (even if you could sense he was teetering) that sweet little thigh touch when Burgess was about to go off at the lawyer was perfect. I even tolerated Lindsay this week, she wasn't as annoying and miserable as she usually is.

Jay's manslut scene was hilarious and a nice light point in a dark episode....maybe, just maybe he's getting his personality back now that he's free. Here's hoping.

Let's see if they give the Burzek fans the deleted scene, considering they caved in to the Linstead fans last week.

Oh yes I loved that scene with Voight! I was expecting him to snap too but this scene proved why he deserves to run Intelligence. He got the guy's trust so it was a brilliant move. But I can't say I didn't enjoy their last scene too. Go Voight!

Aaand the manslut scene was great too! Jesse is brilliant in these light-hearted scenes. He can do drama but I think he deserves more scenes like this one.

[Raja]

On 4/6/2017 at 5:02 PM, greyhorse said:

How many times must we watch a show centered around one of these pick-up guys and their business?  I can't remember what else I was watching in the past year, but I seem to recall that it was pretty much the exact same storyline.

I don't frequent these forums much lately, so I had no idea that Burgess was pregnant until last week when it was pretty obvious with the baby bump.  Now of course, the natural "I need some time off" and she'll disappear for a while.  I do hope the actress comes back.

Hawaii 5-0 ran one in that case the seminar guy hired prostitutes to pose as women falling for the method in the big con to have proof of the success of his game. His client then went on a killing spree to get back the girl he think he woo'd with the method. 

[FnkyChkn34]

On 4/7/2017 at 9:14 PM, Guildford said:

Let's see if they give the Burzek fans the deleted scene, considering they caved in to the Linstead fans last week.

I think they actually caved to Sophia Bush, not the fans.  If she hadn't tweeted anything, no one would have ever known.  But, that scene was important for Jay's storyline.  Is the deleted Burzek scene important to a storyline?  (IMO, they aren't even together, and are boring anyway.  Sorry.  The less of Kim the better for me.)

[Guildford]

8 hours ago, FnkyChkn34 said:

I think they actually caved to Sophia Bush, not the fans.  If she hadn't tweeted anything, no one would have ever known.  But, that scene was important for Jay's storyline.  Is the deleted Burzek scene important to a storyline?  (IMO, they aren't even together, and are boring anyway.  Sorry.  The less of Kim the better for me.)

No need to be sorry. Everyone is entitled to like or dislike whoever they like.....personally I would throw a party if Lindsay disappeared permanently. I could not care less about her character, father, mother or miserable upbringing....but that's just me. Talk about boring.

I just hope the Halstead PTSD storyline is about him but I am not holding my breath.

As for the deleted scene.....I guess we will never know.

[SnarkySheep]

On 4/6/2017 at 9:53 PM, Kel Varnsen said:

Here's my problem: why was nobody at the hospital with Nicole?

The friends we could explain away by saying they popped in for a short time during visiting hours, then left. But I would agree that there should have been Mama Burgess, or at the very least some mention that she was coming/would be coming. We know she exists, as Burgess fairly recently made reference to the fact that she would be flying in to meet Ruzek. Certainly something like this would be important enough that she'd come back to sit with her daughter and care for her granddaughter?? But when Burgess said she would take that leave, she said that the two of them "had no one" besides each other. Huh.

[scarynikki12]

I think I would have liked this episode more if Burgess hadn't been part of the investigation.  Since it was to set up the maternity leave, I'd have rather seen her scenes be with her sister and niece, culminating in her talk with Voigt about how Nicole needs her and that she wants to help her with her recovery. 

I know all the other characters take part in investigations when something horrible happens to their loved ones but I hate it with them and I hated it here.  I can only assume that Voigt wanted Burgess to kill the rapist when they found him because there is literally no way, in reality or fiction, that she was capable of doing her job when her job was to hunt the man who drugged and raped her sister.  As we saw when she compromised the case by taking the shot, removing the camera, and then beating the shit out of the guy.  The team in general shouldn't have been on the case but Burgess in particular should have been far away.  I am so tired of this and other cop shows having horrible things happen to the family and friends of the main characters and then acting like it's fine for them to hunt down the assailants.  They cannot be objective.  That's common sense.  If this is the only thing they can think of for showcasing their actors' abilities then they need to hire new writers. 

[dreamcatcher]

5 hours ago, SnarkySheep said:

The friends we could explain away by saying they popped in for a short time during visiting hours, then left. But I would agree that there should have been Mama Burgess, or at the very least some mention that she was coming/would be coming. We know she exists, as Burgess fairly recently made reference to the fact that she would be flying in to meet Ruzek. Certainly something like this would be important enough that she'd come back to sit with her daughter and care for her granddaughter?? But when Burgess said she would take that leave, she said that the two of them "had no one" besides each other. Huh.

I don't really care about these details because it's just a waste of time and money. They would have to hire extra actors and remove more important scenes for something that in the end, doesn't even affect the story. If it was Kim, I guess it would make more sense to bring her mother in but still, it wouldn't be necessary. 

[Ailianna]

3 hours ago, scarynikki12 said:

As we saw when she compromised the case by taking the shot, removing the camera, and then beating the shit out of the guy. 

I agree generally with your points about he lack of objectivity in the case when it's *personal*!!!  But as to the bolded part, she took the camera with her to the room where the attempted rape was going to occur, so that wasn't a problem.  That's something she did right.  But I was thinking both purses should have had cameras, and they should have set them up with one watching the couch and one aimed at where it looked like the drinks were going to be made, so they might have gotten footage of the drugs being slipped in.  I get where she was coming from, because what they basically had up to that point was a couple guys trying to get a couple girls to take a drink.  Maybe in bad taste, but not criminal.  They needed a hell of a lot more to get charges on them.  Or even something that would be connectable to the rape kits, for example.  

What should have been done, though, is to provide both of them some method to take the drink (or look like they were taking the drink) in safety, whether that be taking something else to try to counteract the ketamine (I'm not a toxicologist, so not sure if there's such a thing or not), but there are ways to fake taking a drink.  But it should have been a more thought out plan than--we're hot--they'll pick us.  At least there was a show of a plan to divert them when they went for a different target, but Jay and Ruzek could only drive them off of two targets, or they'd be recognized.  SO not the greatest plan.

[MakeMeLaugh]

2 hours ago, Ailianna said:

But it should have been a more thought out plan than--we're hot--they'll pick us. At least there was a show of a plan to divert them when they went for a different target, but Jay and Ruzek could only drive them off of two targets, or they'd be recognized.  SO not the greatest plan.

True and good point and I thought the same; otoh if the guys had been at all cool or dateworthy they wouldn't even have been taking the predator course--all that women who look like Erin and Kim (both are hot babes according to Mr MML) have to do is smile at guys like that and they would be putty in their hands. I was also thinking about how happy women first approached by the predators would be to have guys like Jay or Ruzek suddenly appear at their sides vs those two losers.  

[FnkyChkn34]

2 hours ago, Ailianna said:

What should have been done, though, is to provide both of them some method to take the drink (or look like they were taking the drink) in safety, whether that be taking something else to try to counteract the ketamine (I'm not a toxicologist, so not sure if there's such a thing or not), but there are ways to fake taking a drink.  But it should have been a more thought out plan than--we're hot--they'll pick us.  At least there was a show of a plan to divert them when they went for a different target, but Jay and Ruzek could only drive them off of two targets, or they'd be recognized.  SO not the greatest plan.

I agree that their plan was very thin.  I guess it was just dumb luck that they pulled it off!  Kind of like most of their cases...

[FnkyChkn34]

16 hours ago, Guildford said:

No need to be sorry. Everyone is entitled to like or dislike whoever they like.....personally I would throw a party if Lindsay disappeared permanently. I could not care less about her character, father, mother or miserable upbringing....but that's just me. Talk about boring.

I can see that; I don't care who her father is and I definitely don't care about Bunny.  But Lindsay is a better detective and a more believable female cop than Burgess, in my opinion.  I like the character of Erin in her professional capacity, and I do like the Linstead relationship mainly because I like Jay.  

I couldn't take Burgess seriously as soon as I saw that episode where she's directing traffic and just starts shaking her hips.  She looked absolutely ridiculous and unprofessional, and then every little bad decision she made after that stuck out like a sore thumb to me.  I think I wouldn't mind her if she had Nadia's position, but as a beat cop and detective?  Laughable.

I have no problem with either of the actresses - both seem like very nice and fun people, just from what I can gather on social media.

[Elliebab]

4 hours ago, FnkyChkn34 said:

I can see that; I don't care who her father is and I definitely don't care about Bunny.  But Lindsay is a better detective and a more believable female cop than Burgess, in my opinion.  I like the character of Erin in her professional capacity, and I do like the Linstead relationship mainly because I like Jay.  

I couldn't take Burgess seriously as soon as I saw that episode where she's directing traffic and just starts shaking her hips.  She looked absolutely ridiculous and unprofessional, and then every little bad decision she made after that stuck out like a sore thumb to me.  I think I wouldn't mind her if she had Nadia's position, but as a beat cop and detective?  Laughable.

I have no problem with either of the actresses - both seem like very nice and fun people, just from what I can gather on social media.

Erin isn't exactly "Miss Perfect". She came to work late, she was drunk on the job, she brings all her drama into work, She quit not once but twice, she quit IU to drink and party ( I don't care if she was grieving for Nadia), so yeah, before you start airing out everyone else's dirty laundry, look at Erin.

[CheshireCat]

15 minutes ago, Elliebab said:

Erin isn't exactly "Miss Perfect". She came to work late, she was drunk on the job, she brings all her drama into work, She quit not once but twice, she quit IU to drink and party ( I don't care if she was grieving for Nadia), so yeah, before you start airing out everyone else's dirty laundry, look at Erin.

Who said that Lindsay was perfect? What makes Lindsay so appealing to me and credible as a character is exactly that she isn't perfect. Burgess, on the other hand, comes pretty close to being perfect/comes pretty close to a Mary Sue. I like the potential the character has, I don't like how she's portrayed most of the time.

[FnkyChkn34]

48 minutes ago, Elliebab said:

Erin isn't exactly "Miss Perfect". She came to work late, she was drunk on the job, she brings all her drama into work, She quit not once but twice, she quit IU to drink and party ( I don't care if she was grieving for Nadia), so yeah, before you start airing out everyone else's dirty laundry, look at Erin.

First of all, exactly what @CheshireCat said.  I never said Erin was perfect.  And I agree with CheshireCat again that I like Erin because she isn't perfect.  

The first time Erin quit, it was to take a promotion to the Feds.  That's a good reason to "quit" in my opinion.  It's not like she just walked off the job for no good reason, and she considered it for a long time.  Arguably she walked off the second time, but so what?  Doesn't mean I'm going to hold it against her forever and dislike the character just because she was grieving.  (If we're going to hold that against Erin, then what is Burgess doing now?  She's just walking off the job too, but I'm not holding that against her.)  I don't actually recall Erin being drunk on the job - she rescued Jay after sobering up overnight, then returned under the careful eye of Voight.  Did I miss something?  I also disagree that Erin brings her drama to work; she specifically told Jay that they must act professional and leave their personal lives at home.  Burgess and Ruzek are the ones who brought their personal lives to the office.  I mean, he proposed in the locker room of all places...

So yeah, a lot can be said about all the characters.  But we like who we like.  Oh well.  

[dreamcatcher]

I know that we all have our opinions, but I think that when discussing shows, we shouldn't take into consideration what is "realistic"/what would happen in real life etc. We don't watch tv shows like CPD to see how real police works. If they used all the correct procedures, showed them wasting weeks trying to solve cases instead of one-two days, being completely professional etc. it would be incredibly boring. 

And as for Erin and Kim, I think I'm in the minority because I love both of them. But honestly? I've wanted to punch both of them more times than I could count. The writers do have a tendency to make Kim weak/an angel/perfect cop even when they show her doing stupid things etc. and sometimes Erin is too in-your-face. I don't think it's bad acting because I'm a huge fan of Sophia (and I started watching CPD because of her) and I think that she can do "tough" without being irritating. But as I said I loved her during the interrogation scene because it seemed genuine while a lot of times they make her blow up out of the blue and she's just too much. I know that this is a popular complaint, but it's like when they are writing a female character they give her ONE trait and they keep pushing it on us. Kim is a pure, innocent supercop, Erin is the tough supercop and in CF, Gabby is ehm, Gabby and Brett is just the sweet girl kinda lost in her own world.

[FnkyChkn34]

11 minutes ago, dreamcatcher said:

I know that we all have our opinions, but I think that when discussing shows, we shouldn't take into consideration what is "realistic"/what would happen in real life etc. We don't watch tv shows like CPD to see how real police works. If they used all the correct procedures, showed them wasting weeks trying to solve cases instead of one-two days, being completely professional etc. it would be incredibly boring. 

Even more boring would be when they are all on administrative leave for at least 30 days each, because all they do is shoot people...  

[Guildford]

8 hours ago, Elliebab said:

Erin isn't exactly "Miss Perfect". She came to work late, she was drunk on the job, she brings all her drama into work, She quit not once but twice, she quit IU to drink and party ( I don't care if she was grieving for Nadia), so yeah, before you start airing out everyone else's dirty laundry, look at Erin.

Not to mention throwing up in the locker room from her hangover after being late, going off alone & getting taken hostage when they are repeatedly told to have back up, running off into the woods leaving her shot partner in exposed in the middle of the night, ignoring Voight's command to stay in the station when Yates was after her, making everyone uncomfortable a few episodes back because of her 'bad mood' so much so that Voight noticed & had to 'talk' to Jay, the whole DNA 'he's not your father' convo...that happened at the station, the constant mother misery, playing handsey in the breakroom with Jay back in the warehouse episode. Refusing to take a urine test after shooting another cop because she knew she'd fail.....Yep....the poster child of professionalism right there. 

6 hours ago, FnkyChkn34 said:

Even more boring would be when they are all on administrative leave for at least 30 days each, because all they do is shoot people...  

And neither would we have the Intelligence Unit as it stands because the moment Erin & Jay shacked up they wouldn't be permitted to work together & I doubt they'd let the nepotism between Voight & Erin slide by either. Suspend reality....that's what watching a drama is all about.

[FnkyChkn34]

1 hour ago, Guildford said:

Not to mention throwing up in the locker room from her hangover after being late, going off alone & getting taken hostage when they are repeatedly told to have back up, running off into the woods leaving her shot partner in exposed in the middle of the night, ignoring Voight's command to stay in the station when Yates was after her, making everyone uncomfortable a few episodes back because of her 'bad mood' so much so that Voight noticed & had to 'talk' to Jay, the whole DNA 'he's not your father' convo...that happened at the station, the constant mother misery, playing handsey in the breakroom with Jay back in the warehouse episode. Refusing to take a urine test after shooting another cop because she knew she'd fail.....Yep....the poster child of professionalism right there. 

And neither would we have the Intelligence Unit as it stands because the moment Erin & Jay shacked up they wouldn't be permitted to work together & I doubt they'd let the nepotism between Voight & Erin slide by either. Suspend reality....that's what watching a drama is all about.

Running off into the woods when Jay was shot?  When was this?  Even if it wasn't Jay she was partnered with at the time, I can't recall anyone but Burgess and Roman being shot (maybe Roman was just severely beaten, I can't remember).  Jay was the one who wouldn't let the DNA results drop and brought up the conversations, and Jay was also the one talking about his grandfather's cabin and holding Erin's hand in the break room (keep in mind during a very slow morning when they were all bored, no harm and they also weren't "caught").  Erin can't be blamed for Bunny either, in my opinion.  She can't control her mother, that's been shown many times.  

The urine test must be a favorite of Chicago writers - Severide did the same thing in season 1.

I'm not sure that Jay and Erin would automatically not be allowed to work together at all.  We don't know their fraternization rules.  Also, Voight's nepotism is nothing compared to his criminal record, so... like we're all saying - reality doesn't apply. 

[betsyboo]

On 4/6/2017 at 11:06 AM, FnkyChkn34 said:

I know the message of this episode was definitely "no means no" but I just hope that some people don't see it and get other ideas.  That guy who gave the seminars is a vile, horrible monster.  I hope people like him don't exist in real life, but I'm sure they do.  This had "ripped from the headlines" written all over it.

This is how Dick Wolf used to do it before SVU became preachy and soapy and untenable.

On 4/8/2017 at 0:58 AM, jewel21 said:

I forget how high her alcohol blood count was but it apparently wasn't high enough to pass out and not remember. It was the drugs in her system that messed her up.

Her BAC was only .12 - you are correct it was the Ketamine that made her pass out. That BAC means maybe 3 drinks and while she may have been less inhibited, she certainly had all her decision-making faculties.  (until the Ketamine)

15 hours ago, Ailianna said:

I agree generally with your points about he lack of objectivity in the case when it's *personal*!!!  But as to the bolded part, she took the camera with her to the room where the attempted rape was going to occur, so that wasn't a problem.  That's something she did right.  But I was thinking both purses should have had cameras, and they should have set them up with one watching the couch and one aimed at where it looked like the drinks were going to be made, so they might have gotten footage of the drugs being slipped in.  I get where she was coming from, because what they basically had up to that point was a couple guys trying to get a couple girls to take a drink.  Maybe in bad taste, but not criminal.  They needed a hell of a lot more to get charges on them.  Or even something that would be connectable to the rape kits, for example.  

I thought both purses *did have cameras.

WTF with the balloon wallpaper!??!? Were they running a child porn website on the side?!!?!?

If I can be shallow - (and this is STRICTLY SHALLOW I FULLY ADMIT IT) I wouldn't have given either of those guys the time of day. They had bad hair and dressed like shlubs and had ZERO game. (Now, aside from the absolute skeevishness of the instructor, *he* had some charisma.)

[Mars477]

Have to say, the whole "Policewoman drinking under duress from charming villain" thing reminds me of an episode of the 2007 NBC cop show, Life.  One of the first season episodes has the female lead begin an investigation into a man who she's pretty sure she heard confess to a rape at her Alcoholics Anonymous meeting.  She ends up held hostage by the rapist and forced to drink a giant bottle of vodka, but awesomely manages to remain lucid and turn the tables on her captor.

Of course, the episode structure is entirely different, and Sarah Shahi is ten times the actor that Marina Squerciati is.

Considering that Squerciati is really pregnant, why would Costuming have her wear a skimpy nightie in the opening scene where her niece wakes her up instead of, say, a baggy college sweater?  (Ok, there are two pretty obvious reasons why, from a certain perspective.)

Edited April 12, 2017 by Mars477

[FnkyChkn34]

4 hours ago, Mars477 said:

Considering that Squerciati is really pregnant, why would Costuming have her wear a skimpy nightie in the opening scene where her niece wakes her up instead of, say, a baggy college sweater?  (Ok, there are two pretty obvious reasons why, from a certain perspective.)

Especially because the night before, in the episode before, she told her niece that she was going to put on her pajamas and then they'd order pizza. Is that the outfit she was wearing when she opened the door to the delivery guy? 

[SnarkySheep]

Playing devil's advocate, I'd guess that Voight has been responsible for covering up a lot of Erin's "oops" moments. But, it has also crossed my mind more than once, would she even have the job she does if it weren't for him? It seems that most/all people in the district know about their relationship, so even if it isn't nepotism in the strictest sense, I would imagine there would have been some comments, if not outright forbidding, from TPTB.

Along those lines, how fair do you think Voight would be if any suspect ever hurt Erin on the job? I'm sure he'd pull a Burgess too, and certainly Crowley & company would have to know that.

[watcher1006]

On 4/11/2017 at 3:50 AM, scarynikki12 said:

I think I would have liked this episode more if Burgess hadn't been part of the investigation.  Since it was to set up the maternity leave, I'd have rather seen her scenes be with her sister and niece, culminating in her talk with Voigt about how Nicole needs her and that she wants to help her with her recovery. 

I know all the other characters take part in investigations when something horrible happens to their loved ones but I hate it with them and I hated it here.  I can only assume that Voigt wanted Burgess to kill the rapist when they found him because there is literally no way, in reality or fiction, that she was capable of doing her job when her job was to hunt the man who drugged and raped her sister.  As we saw when she compromised the case by taking the shot, removing the camera, and then beating the shit out of the guy.  The team in general shouldn't have been on the case but Burgess in particular should have been far away.  I am so tired of this and other cop shows having horrible things happen to the family and friends of the main characters and then acting like it's fine for them to hunt down the assailants.  They cannot be objective.  That's common sense.  If this is the only thing they can think of for showcasing their actors' abilities then they need to hire new writers. 

Well one can add to that that Voight her boss ended up praising Burgess for what she did, telling her that her thinking was right for the job. What's up with his reversals? First he tells her she's too close to the crime to do the undercover assignment with Lindsay, then he yields to her and has her do it. He calls her into his office to yell at her for her conduct then tells her she did the right thing. Is he so easily persuaded by his newest subordinate?

[FnkyChkn34]

14 hours ago, SnarkySheep said:

Along those lines, how fair do you think Voight would be if any suspect ever hurt Erin on the job? I'm sure he'd pull a Burgess too, and certainly Crowley & company would have to know that.

He'd do worse than a Burgess... where is Justin's killer?  

At least it's been said several times that Erin was a beat cop for a while and did work her way up, but I'm sure you're right that her relationship with Voight was a big influence.  But on the flip side, Al pulled Ruzek straight from the Academy, and Atwater, Burgess, and maybe Jay are all on Intelligence and younger than Erin.  So maybe experience doesn't really matter...

9 hours ago, watcher1006 said:

Well one can add to that that Voight her boss ended up praising Burgess for what she did, telling her that her thinking was right for the job. What's up with his reversals? First he tells her she's too close to the crime to do the undercover assignment with Lindsay, then he yields to her and has her do it. He calls her into his office to yell at her for her conduct then tells her she did the right thing. Is he so easily persuaded by his newest subordinate?

Yes, I didn't like Voight here.  Why does everyone bow to Burgess??  Platt does it, her patrol partners did it, and now Voight too?  Maybe she did what she had to do to get these rapists, but what if something went wrong or took much longer and she didn't make it to the hospital in time to get her stomach pumped?  She's a bit too impulsive too often, in my opinion.  They all can be once in a while, I'm sure, but she seems to be the worst so far.

[Kel Varnsen]

3 minutes ago, FnkyChkn34 said:

He'd do worse than a Burgess... where is Justin's killer?  

At least it's been said several times that Erin was a beat cop for a while and did work her way up, but I'm sure you're right that her relationship with Voight was a big influence.  But on the flip side, Al pulled Ruzek straight from the Academy, and Atwater, Burgess, and maybe Jay are all on Intelligence and younger than Erin.  So maybe experience doesn't really matter..

If i remember from Chicago fire Jay was working under cover trying to shut down the organized crime group that was squeezing Molly's. So he was probably a detective before going to intelligence, or at very least someone with enough experience to be working under cover.

[FnkyChkn34]

9 minutes ago, Kel Varnsen said:

If i remember from Chicago fire Jay was working under cover trying to shut down the organized crime group that was squeezing Molly's. So he was probably a detective before going to intelligence, or at very least someone with enough experience to be working under cover.

I think you're right, I think he was already a detective - in vice, maybe?  He worked with Antonio, as far as I could tell.  But he got shot, and they say once you get shot, you get to pick your assignment.  He immediately picked Intelligence.  I'm not saying Jay isn't qualified - I think he's the most qualified after Voight, Al, and Antonio.  But I also don't know how old he's supposed to be; he's still young either way.  Ruzek and Burgess are the least qualified, in my opinion, but they are still there.  I guess my point was that at least Erin seems qualified, nepotism or not.

[betsyboo]

2 hours ago, FnkyChkn34 said:

I think you're right, I think he was already a detective - in vice, maybe?  He worked with Antonio, as far as I could tell.  But he got shot, and they say once you get shot, you get to pick your assignment.  He immediately picked Intelligence.  I'm not saying Jay isn't qualified - I think he's the most qualified after Voight, Al, and Antonio.  But I also don't know how old he's supposed to be; he's still young either way.  Ruzek and Burgess are the least qualified, in my opinion, but they are still there.  I guess my point was that at least Erin seems qualified, nepotism or not.

I *think* - and I could absolutely be making this up - But I think Jay got some leeway/credit/bump due to his time in the service.

[FnkyChkn34]

10 minutes ago, betsyboo said:

I *think* - and I could absolutely be making this up - But I think Jay got some leeway/credit/bump due to his time in the service.

That makes sense too; Rangers have extensive training and certifications.  I know that they use him as the sharpshooter/sniper when needed because of his military training.  (Al, too.)

[CheshireCat]

Jay is younger than Erin?

He's actually been a cop longer than Erin - when they're talking about driving, Lindsay says seniority rules and he points out that he's been on the job longer to which she responds that she's been in the unit longer.

My guess would be that Lindsay had to prove herself but that Voight pulled her into his unit once she had done so. Everyone else probably had a harder time getting into the unit. But, as was stated on the show, Voight believes in tough love, so I would think that he let her go through all of the training and her time as a beat cop like everyone else. If anything, he probably made sure that she had a tough training officer rather than a soft one.

[Kel Varnsen]

17 minutes ago, CheshireCat said:

My guess would be that Lindsay had to prove herself but that Voight pulled her into his unit once she had done so. Everyone else probably had a harder time getting into the unit. But, as was stated on the show, Voight believes in tough love, so I would think that he let her go through all of the training and her time as a beat cop like everyone else. If anything, he probably made sure that she had a tough training officer rather than a soft one.

I buy that. To make it into intelligence, Voight has to notice you and then once that happens you have to prove yourself to him. Erin would still have to prove herself but would already be on Voight's radar the day she became a cop. And i can totally see her insisting that she get the toughest training possible just to make sure she could be prepared for as much of the dangerous things that could possibly happen to a cop.

[FnkyChkn34]

38 minutes ago, CheshireCat said:

Jay is younger than Erin?

He's actually been a cop longer than Erin - when they're talking about driving, Lindsay says seniority rules and he points out that he's been on the job longer to which she responds that she's been in the unit longer.

My guess would be that Lindsay had to prove herself but that Voight pulled her into his unit once she had done so. Everyone else probably had a harder time getting into the unit. But, as was stated on the show, Voight believes in tough love, so I would think that he let her go through all of the training and her time as a beat cop like everyone else. If anything, he probably made sure that she had a tough training officer rather than a soft one.

Yep, I totally buy that too.

As for Jay, I guess we don't really know how old he is?  Erin is 32ish.  The actor in real life will turn 33 in a week or two, and Sophia Bush is 34.  So I don't know.  I know we had this age discussion over on the IMDb forums, but I can't remember the conclusion!  :-)  But Jay's background is always changing - someone pointed out that the dates on Ben's headstone don't match up with the dates that Jay says he was in the Middle East.  I remember Erin admitting in an episode that she bounced around for a bit after high school before becoming a cop, so we don't really know when she started.  Is a military requirement still a minimum of 6 years?

[Ailianna]

5 hours ago, FnkyChkn34 said:

 Is a military requirement still a minimum of 6 years?

Where did you ever get that?  It is possible to enlist for 2 years, 3, 4, 5, or to go through the military academies and have a commission afterward, which is a whole different kettle of fish.  And this has been true for at least 20+ years since I first signed up in the early 90s.  There's very little minimum to a voluntary enlistment, especially by the time everyone finishes training and is actually serving in a duty unit.