Governor Mike Pence: 2016 Vice President-Elect

[PatsyandEddie]

4 hours ago, callmebetty said:

I actually took it as a bad joke. They know about Lincoln, just a bad joke.

Haha! Yeah a really BAD joke. 

[aradia22]

Quote

I wondered what he would have thought about Hamilton's message, too.  But, I have mixed feelings about the way he was treated.  I have no problem with the statement from the cast--it's an important issue-- and the extra cheering/ovations during certain lines, but booing?  It's yet another thing that makes democrats look like sore losers.  It was a social night out, so just ignore him (If his presence is announced, don't applaud--dead silence or weak applause can be a killer, I'd imagine). 

I feel like I should point out that Hamilton can draw particularly rowdy crowds. There have been reports on other boards about people singing along and standing ovations throughout the show and that kind of thing. So while it could have happened at any show, I think it was even more likely at this show where the crowd can already be pretty vocal.

Also, at Hamilton (and possibly at other shows) "celebs" may leave a little before intermission or before curtain call to avoid the crowds. I think he should have stayed to hear what BVD was saying but I don't think he was running away. There have been plenty of stories of notable people seeing shows who slip away for security or privacy reasons. Barbra Streisand wants to see a show sometimes without talking to people at intermission. You know what I mean?

[oakville]

7 hours ago, DollEyes said:

My verdict: love it! Seeing the cast of Hamilton put Pence on blast was epic. The people who booed Pence paid good money-and given Hamilton's caliber and popularity, lots of it-to avoid people like Pence, not to be distracted by him sitting in front of them. Other Republicans like George W. Bush and Paul Ryan have seen the show, but they didn't inspire the well-deserved reaction that Pence got. Even better is that according to reports, Pence overheard everything that Brandon Victor Dixon said after he left, so Pence's running away backfired, big-time. It reminds me of the ending of Dangerous Liasons, when the Marquise was booed at the Opera:

Dangerous Liasons Ending

I find it unusual that the cast would speak out to a member of the audience at any play. Did the cast explain why they didn't give the same treatment for President Bush, Paul Ryan or any other prominent Republicans? Is the cast allowed to call out politicians from the Democrats if they don't agree with a policy they are supporting ? Is this a new policy at other plays in NY? I am Canadian, so I can't recall anyone from the cast calling out politicians at any plays that I have attended.

[windsprints]

Quote

 I have no problem with the statement from the cast--it's an important issue-- and the extra cheering/ovations during certain lines, but booing?  It's yet another thing that makes democrats look like sore losers.

The cast immediately asked the audience to stop booing and they did. 

Quote

I find it unusual that the cast would speak out to a member of the audience at any play.

Its not the norm.  Personally I have no issue with what they did. They politely asked him to hear them out. He headed for the door and they spoke and said thank you at the end.

[oakville]

20 minutes ago, aradia22 said:

I feel like I should point out that Hamilton can draw particularly rowdy crowds. There have been reports on other boards about people singing along and standing ovations throughout the show and that kind of thing. So while it could have happened at any show, I think it was even more likely at this show where the crowd can already be pretty vocal.

Also, at Hamilton (and possibly at other shows) "celebs" may leave a little before intermission or before curtain call to avoid the crowds. I think he should have stayed to hear what BVD was saying but I don't think he was running away. There have been plenty of stories of notable people seeing shows who slip away for security or privacy reasons. Barbra Streisand wants to see a show sometimes without talking to people at intermission. You know what I mean?

Does the cast get a list of celebrities that will be attending the play that evening before the show? It must be hilarious if they are allowed to complain about any celebrities that are in the audience. . Is Hamilton a regular play or can the crowd get involved and shout at the actors. It sounds like a riot My daughter wants to see Hamilton when we visit NY.

Just now, windsprints said:

The cast immediately asked the audience to stop booing and they did. 

Its not the norm.  Personally I have no issue with what they did. They politely asked him to hear them out. He headed for the door and they spoke and said thank you at the end.

This was very polite of them to not ask the crowd to not boo VP Pence. I wonder if Pence had thought of posing for selfies before the show? It's so interesting that the cast knew that Pence was in the the audience that night.

[WendyCR72]

Was it the proper time for the Hamilton cast to take such a stance? Perhaps not.

But I will say this: It was not the cast booing Mr. Pence, but the audience. And as far as I could see, the message was said in a respectful manner. And it was said politely to not boo, that the show was about love. And it even makes a sort of sense it come about as it did as the play is framed in politics itself.

And while Mr. Pence may have the right to see a play, let's face it: Once one goes into politics, privacy is basically over. So if citizens do see a politician, especially one in office that may/will have the fates of many Americans in his or her hand, I can understand privacy giving way to trying to communicate those concerns.

So maybe it was in poor taste, but I also get why it occurred as it did, especially given the hate-filled campaign Trump ran, and the reputation that precedes Mr. Pence, too.

[windsprints]

Quote

It's so interesting that the cast knew that Pence was in the the audience that night.

I don't think its at all unusual that they knew. The show is impossible to get tickets for so it had to be arranged by someone. There was also likely additional security in place so the cast may have been notified as to why.

[aradia22]

Quote

Does the cast get a list of celebrities that will be attending the play that evening before the show? It must be hilarious if they are allowed to complain about any celebrities that are in the audience. . Is Hamilton a regular play or can the crowd get involved and shout at the actors. It sounds like a riot My daughter wants to see Hamilton when we visit NY.

My understanding from reading some articles is that Pence asked for last minute tickets so yes, they knew. Some celebrities can blend in (Broadway celebrities, actors who aren't super big names anymore) and so they might get tickets like regular folks and not be bothered too much while seeing a show. But then there are some people who need to travel with security and I'm sure that involves some arrangement with the theatre. There are times celebrities might have to come in through a different entrance or something. 

No, the audience cannot get involved at Hamilton. They do because some "fans" are rude and inconsiderate of people seeing the show for the first time but it's not an audience interaction show. If you're looking for that, go see Shear Madness. Audience members getting called out from the stage is a rare occurrence but theatre is a communal experience. There are BC/EFA collections. People on their phones might get called out by actors. Some shows like Disaster and Waitress have had special nights. When you go into the theatre, you need to be receptive to what's being put forth.

[oakville]

1 hour ago, windsprints said:

I don't think its at all unusual that they knew. The show is impossible to get tickets for so it had to be arranged by someone. There was also likely additional security in place so the cast may have been notified as to why.

Isn't it a security risk for the cast to notify the audience that the VP Elect is in the audience & point him out at the end of the show ? Do they screen the audience on Broadway NY for weapons? It would be a disaster if any member of the audience had a weapon & used it in the theater. Will the Secret Service get involved in the matter?

1 hour ago, aradia22 said:

My understanding from reading some articles is that Pence asked for last minute tickets so yes, they knew. Some celebrities can blend in (Broadway celebrities, actors who aren't super big names anymore) and so they might get tickets like regular folks and not be bothered too much while seeing a show. But then there are some people who need to travel with security and I'm sure that involves some arrangement with the theatre. There are times celebrities might have to come in through a different entrance or something. 

No, the audience cannot get involved at Hamilton. They do because some "fans" are rude and inconsiderate of people seeing the show for the first time but it's not an audience interaction show. If you're looking for that, go see Shear Madness. Audience members getting called out from the stage is a rare occurrence but theatre is a communal experience. There are BC/EFA collections. People on their phones might get called out by actors. Some shows like Disaster and Waitress have had special nights. When you go into the theatre, you need to be receptive to what's being put forth.

Thanks!. I wouldn't want to make a faux pas.

[PatsyandEddie]

No doubt the SS was present. He would be entitled to protection so he would arrive with a small herd and he'd be noticed. Word would filter backstage. I don't see why they would get involved. Nothing illegal happened. Are people now not allowed to have opinions ? 

[oakville]

1 hour ago, WendyCR72 said:

Was it the proper time for the Hamilton cast to take such a stance? Perhaps not.

But I will say this: It was not the cast booing Mr. Pence, but the audience. And as far as I could see, the message was said in a respectful manner. And it was said politely to not boo, that the show was about love. And it even makes a sort of sense it come about as it did as the play is framed in politics itself.

And while Mr. Pence may have the right to see a play, let's face it: Once one goes into politics, privacy is basically over. So if citizens do see a politician, especially one in office that may/will have the fates of many Americans in his or her hand, I can understand privacy giving way to trying to communicate those concerns.

So maybe it was in poor taste, but I also get why it occurred as it did, especially given the hate-filled campaign Trump ran, and the reputation that precedes Mr. Pence, too.

I can understand why the cast of Hamilton thought it was OK to make a statement to VP elect Pence that they were concerned about his policies. Did they try to have a meeting with him before or after the show, to discuss their concerns?. It would be a nice gesture for VP Prence to agree to a meeting with them to listen to their concerns.

However,  I wonder if other plays in the USA will now be compelled to make political statements at the end of each show if they find out that there are politicians in the audience that they don't agree with.

Some people attend plays, movies etc to get away from thinking about politics, so they might be shocked by the statements  of the actors.

[oakville]

6 minutes ago, PatsyandEddie said:

No doubt the SS was present. He would be entitled to protection so he would arrive with a small herd and he'd be noticed. Word would filter backstage. I don't see why they would get involved. Nothing illegal happened. Are people now not allowed to have opinions ? 

I agree that the actors are entitled to opinions. I would hope that the theater patrons would have to go through security to make sure that they don't have weapons if the VP is present.

It's weird that the cast pointed out the VP, when he wasn't supposed to be there. If there was no screening before the event, & the cast says "look who's here", it would be very dangerous if a member of the audience had a weapon.

Weren't attendees at political rallies for Trump & Clinton subject to security screening this year?

Does the Secret Service get to screen attendees at events if a member under protection will be present ?

[maraleia]

1 hour ago, oakville said:

I find it unusual that the cast would speak out to a member of the audience at any play. Did the cast explain why they didn't give the same treatment for President Bush, Paul Ryan or any other prominent Republicans? Is the cast allowed to call out politicians from the Democrats if they don't agree with a policy they are supporting ? Is this a new policy at other plays in NY? I am Canadian, so I can't recall anyone from the cast calling out politicians at any plays that I have attended.

His anti-LGBT and anti-women's reproductive choice policies in Indiana is why he was called out. He has been called the worst governor for minorities and women across the board in modern history and that's saying something. Also, he is suing to keep his emails hidden and everyone is saying that he either is a closet case or forced women to get abortions.

Also, he is getting paid by us taxpayers so we are his boss.

One more thing, the cast was notified that he would be in the audience ahead of time, hence the statement that Brandon read. Questioning why this happened is another way of normalizing him and his vile policies that hurt actual people.

[aradia22]

https://twitter.com/BrandonVDixon/status/799977281875755008

According to BVD maybe Pence did stop to listen?

[oakville]

9 minutes ago, maraleia said:

His anti-LGBT and anti-women's reproductive choice policies in Indiana is why he was called out. He has been called the worst governor for minorities and women across the board in modern history and that's saying something. Also, he is suing to keep his emails hidden and everyone is saying that he either is a closet case or forced women to get abortions.

Also, he is getting paid by us taxpayers so we are his boss.

One more thing, the cast was notified that he would be in the audience ahead of time, hence the statement that Brandon read. Questioning why this happened is another way of normalizing him and his vile policies that hurt actual people.

Thanks for the comment . I am not American, so I am not used to politicians being called out at theater performances. I know some politicians get booed at sporting events, but I always thought the theater was classier. 

I wonder if this will become the norm during the Trump Presidency that they will be booed if any member of the administration attends any public events.

[FuriousStyles]

I dont see any problem with the cast of Hamilton making a statement to the VP.  The statement itself wasnt even bad.  But I feel like this is kind of like why people have a problem with the very notion of the Black Lives Matter movement.  I'm just hearing a lot of shut up and how dare you question the status quo.  There was a piece on Donald Trump I was watching on Fox News...then I got to watching something on my DVR...when it ended the tv went back to Fox.  There is some lady on there....never seen her in my life, but she immediately reminded me of Sally Langston on Scandal.  I'd bet money this lady on Fox is who they modeled that character after.  Anywho, I couldn't find the remote fast enough so I caught a little snippet of what she was screeching about.  I heard her use the term "reverse racism" and was curious what the hell she was talking about. Wouldnt you know it, she's talking about what happened at the Hamilton Play.  How Pence was bullied and everyone involved should be ashamed.  First of all, I wish death to the person who came up with the ridiculous term "reverse racism".  There's no such thing.  It kind of implies that white people have a monopoly on being racist ?? so if it happens to them then its "reverse".  No its still just racism.  Secondly, nothing in the statement was derogatory to the VP.  It was just asking him to remember to serve ALL of us....and given his stance and actual policies he's implemented its not hard to see why anyone would feel the need to address him.

Mike Pence was a part of a Presidential campaign unlike any other anybody has seen in our lifetimes.  It was built on racism, misogyny,  xenophobia, and just overall intolerance.  You cant run a campaign like that and then expect high fives and kumbaya from everyone.  There was nothing normal about this campaign season, so yes people arent going to have a normal reaction to it and go on like business as usual.  I HOPE everyone voices their opinions to Pence and Trump everywhere they go.  

Edited November 20, 2016 by FuriousStyles

[windsprints]

Quote

 

I would hope that the theater patrons would have to go through security to make sure that they don't have weapons if the VP is present.

It's weird that the cast pointed out the VP, when he wasn't supposed to be there. If there was no screening before the event, & the cast says "look who's here", it would be very dangerous if a member of the audience had a weapon.

 

Theaters check bags on the way in, sometimes more lax than others.  I'm sure with Pence attending they did more thorough checking.  As mentioned above the Secret Service was there and there was likely an increased NYPD presence.  IMO, the cast did nothing to put him in danger.

[oakville]

24 minutes ago, windsprints said:

Theaters check bags on the way in, sometimes more lax than others.  I'm sure with Pence attending they did more thorough checking.  As mentioned above the Secret Service was there and there was likely an increased NYPD presence.  IMO, the cast did nothing to put him in danger.

That is reassuring to know. I am Canadian, so I was worried about attending events in NYC if the audience could bring weapons to events where senior elected officials were present.I suppose the cast felt it was OK to point out elected officials in attendance as long as they knew that there would be no violence at events that were participating in. However, if there is proper security sc

[AmandaPanda]

It's also important to note that the statement BVD read was written by Lin-Manuel Miranda, who is no longer performing in the play. That means the cast got enough advance notice for LMM to write up a statement for BVD to read. Also, Javier Munoz (who is currently performing the role of Alexander Hamilton) is an openly gay Latino man who is also HIV-positive. So, Trump and Pence's policies are basically made to oppress him. Most of the cast members of Hamilton have been fairly politically active, so it would have been pretty weird if they had not done something to address Pence in the audience.

4 hours ago, oakville said:

Does the cast get a list of celebrities that will be attending the play that evening before the show? It must be hilarious if they are allowed to complain about any celebrities that are in the audience. . Is Hamilton a regular play or can the crowd get involved and shout at the actors. It sounds like a riot My daughter wants to see Hamilton when we visit NY.

Good luck getting tickets! It's pretty much sold out through the end of next year. 

[oakville]

6 hours ago, AmandaPanda said:

It's also important to note that the statement BVD read was written by Lin-Manuel Miranda, who is no longer performing in the play. That means the cast got enough advance notice for LMM to write up a statement for BVD to read. Also, Javier Munoz (who is currently performing the role of Alexander Hamilton) is an openly gay Latino man who is also HIV-positive. So, Trump and Pence's policies are basically made to oppress him. Most of the cast members of Hamilton have been fairly politically active, so it would have been pretty weird if they had not done something to address Pence in the audience.

Good luck getting tickets! It's pretty much sold out through the end of next year. 

Thanks for the information. This forum is so helpful !. I am not as afraid to see a play in NYC now. I wonder if you could buy tickets on StubHub to see Hamilton?

[ikmccall]

31 minutes ago, oakville said:

Thanks for the information. This forum is so helpful !. I am not as afraid to see a play in NYC now. I wonder if you could buy tickets on StubHub to see Hamilton?

StubHub has tickets for $1000 each but I don't know how long you will have to wait to see the show

[inkworks]

9 hours ago, oakville said:

Thanks for the comment . I am not American, so I am not used to politicians being called out at theater performances. I know some politicians get booed at sporting events, but I always thought the theater was classier. 

I wonder if this will become the norm during the Trump Presidency that they will be booed if any member of the administration attends any public events.

I hope so. They deserve to be booed.

I hope the American people take every opportunity to let these guys know that they don't agree with their racist, sexist, bigoted policies.

[Tara]

Oh my.  This all getting so very sad to me.  Labelling Mike Pence as racist, bigot, and sexist and then using it as justification for bad behavior is not what this country is about. 

At least when the anti-Obama people went on their 8-year rant, it was easy to avoid it.  Just don't tune in to Fox News.

But all this self-righteous vitriole by supporters of the candidate who lost is everything this country is NOT about.  The people voted and chose their president.  That's life.  If everyone takes it upon themselves to ignore our democratic voting process, then what?  

We can justify it all we want as being fair, as being, well, this election is different, and on and on.  It's just plain sad.  

Work towards voting him out next time.  Get involved in local politics, anything but this name calling.  I do not think this will be a white nationalist administration.  I think that is this administration's opponents fueling racial fires.  It worries me.  

Convincing ourselves that the people in charge are all morally corrupt, hateful people is ridiculous. At any rate, speaking to Mike Pence with the assumption that he will not treat all Americans fairly the way that cast did was silly.  IMO

[slf]

40 minutes ago, Tara said:

Oh my.  This all getting so very sad to me.  Labelling Mike Pence as racist, bigot, and sexist and then using it as justification for bad behavior is not what this country is about. 

At least when the anti-Obama people went on their 8-year rant, it was easy to avoid it.  Just don't tune in to Fox News.

But all this self-righteous vitriole by supporters of the candidate who lost is everything this country is NOT about.  The people voted and chose their president.  That's life.  If everyone takes it upon themselves to ignore our democratic voting process, then what?  

We can justify it all we want as being fair, as being, well, this election is different, and on and on.  It's just plain sad.  

Work towards voting him out next time.  Get involved in local politics, anything but this name calling.  I do not think this will be a white nationalist administration.  I think that is this administration's opponents fueling racial fires.  It worries me.  

Convincing ourselves that the people in charge are all morally corrupt, hateful people is ridiculous. At any rate, speaking to Mike Pence with the assumption that he will not treat all Americans fairly the way that cast did was silly.  IMO

I'm sorry but I disagree that if gay people choose to non-violently express their fear and anger at a VP who supports conversion therapy and has attempted repeatedly to rob them of the right to marry then, well, they're just being self-righteous and exhibiting bad behavior. Black men and women are not obligated to be polite to someone who trucks with the Klan and who have attempted to perpetuate the myth that blacks are responsible for the majority of white homicides. Latino@s are not obligated to be polite to someone who thinks they should be rounded up and deported. Muslims are not obligated to be polite to someone who wants to force them to register. Mike Pence's hurt feelings and this idea that 'good behavior' must always be exhibited by people, even in extremely dangerous times when their rights, well-being, and even their lives are at risk, really don't fucking matter, in my opinion. 

The people did vote, and they voted for HRC. Donald Trump won via electoral college. I disagree that that is democratic. I do agree that all of this is sad.

This is a white nationalist administration by virtue of it consisting of white nationalists. By virtue of Trump keeping Adolf Hitler's speeches in a cabinet beside his bed and retweeting statements made by known white supremacists and including the head of a white nationalist party on his list of California delegates. Donald Trump is corrupt. The man just settled a lawsuit for $25 million for scamming people and them promptly bragged that he was fined way less than he should have been.

The cast spoke out respectfully on behalf of the millions of poc and gay Americans that Pence will never listen to, will ignore, will shut down. And I think it was brave of them to do so.

[AmandaPanda]

Also, Mike Pence has not said anything about his feelings being hurt. The only person demanding an apology is Donald Trump, who was not present at the theater. BVD even said that Mike Pence stopped to listen to what they had to say as he was leaving. I disagree with everything the man stands for, but he actually understands how a politician is supposed to act in this situation. In other words, not like a giant whiny baby.

[oakville]

1 hour ago, Tara said:

Oh my.  This all getting so very sad to me.  Labelling Mike Pence as racist, bigot, and sexist and then using it as justification for bad behavior is not what this country is about. 

At least when the anti-Obama people went on their 8-year rant, it was easy to avoid it.  Just don't tune in to Fox News.

But all this self-righteous vitriole by supporters of the candidate who lost is everything this country is NOT about.  The people voted and chose their president.  That's life.  If everyone takes it upon themselves to ignore our democratic voting process, then what?  

We can justify it all we want as being fair, as being, well, this election is different, and on and on.  It's just plain sad.  

Work towards voting him out next time.  Get involved in local politics, anything but this name calling.  I do not think this will be a white nationalist administration.  I think that is this administration's opponents fueling racial fires.  It worries me.  

Convincing ourselves that the people in charge are all morally corrupt, hateful people is ridiculous. At any rate, speaking to Mike Pence with the assumption that he will not treat all Americans fairly the way that cast did was silly.  IMO

I think it would have been nice for Mike Pence to meet the cast prior to the show & listen to what they have to say. It is important for the new administration to listen to concerns of those people that are afraid of their policies.

[Tara]

^^^^I agree.  And it would have been better if the cast had asked him to come backstage, rather than that one-way "conversation."

Edited November 20, 2016 by Tara

[inkworks]

32 minutes ago, Tara said:

^^^^I agree.  And it would have been better if the cast had asked him to come backstage, rather than that one-way "conversation."

They did it the way they did to make it clear to everybody that they disagree with what Mike Pence stands for.

No point doing it behind closed doors. Now more than ever we have to publicly support the minorities that this administration threatens.

[slf]

2 minutes ago, inkworks said:

They did it the way they did to make it clear to everybody that they disagree with what Mike Pence stands for.

No point doing it behind closed doors. Now more than ever we have to publicly support the minorities that this administration threatens.

Precisely. They were given an excellent opportunity to utilize their platform and speak on behalf of tens of millions whose voices are being shut out by the President-Elect. I thought the address was eloquent, respectful, hopeful, and generous. Which is a great deal more than Pence and Trump have been.

And I mean, it's Hamilton. Did he actually think the people who've worked so hard to bring that to life and turn it into the enormous success it is now wouldn't express themselves politically? I'd say "this is how America got started!" but the truth is if our founding fathers had protested the tax this way we'd still be British. Trump and Pence need to grow up. You threaten internment camps then the least you can expect is some booing.

[Tara]

They don't know what Mike Pence stands for.  This is all bullshit.

I got into so many arguments with my family during the Obama years.  The ridiculous emails that would be passed around, all with half-truths, some just blatant lies.  The most dangerous ones were those that had just enough truth to make Obama's opposers frightened and angry.  At the end of the day, we all survived Obama's terms as President.

I am preparing myself now for the ridiculous Trump emails.  

We will survive Trump, too.  Maybe.  :)

[slf]

2 minutes ago, Tara said:

They don't know what Mike Pence stands for.  This is all bullshit.

Unfortunately, they do. That's the problem.

[KIMBERLYANN11]

14 minutes ago, Tara said:

They don't know what Mike Pence stands for.  This is all bullshit.

 

Please share then.  Educate me. Just saying bullshit doesn't work.

[oakville]

46 minutes ago, Tara said:

They don't know what Mike Pence stands for.  This is all bullshit.

I got into so many arguments with my family during the Obama years.  The ridiculous emails that would be passed around, all with half-truths, some just blatant lies.  The most dangerous ones were those that had just enough truth to make Obama's opposers frightened and angry.  At the end of the day, we all survived Obama's terms as President.

I am preparing myself now for the ridiculous Trump emails.  

We will survive Trump, too.  Maybe.  :)

I think it's best not to discuss politics with some family members. I remember the chaos at US Thanksgiving in 2000, when no one knew if Gore or Bush would be the President.

[oakville]

1 hour ago, inkworks said:

They did it the way they did to make it clear to everybody that they disagree with what Mike Pence stands for.

No point doing it behind closed doors. Now more than ever we have to publicly support the minorities that this administration threatens.

 Did Pence ask to see the cast before the show to say Hello? Did the cast invite him to an after party, so they could chat with him ?. It would have been an amazing opportunity for both sides to try and discuss their differences. Personal relationships can help ease tensions on both sides. I read that there was a backlash against the cast of Hamilton on twitter. That's so sad.

[mythoughtis]

Pence has now said he was not offended. He has been a politician for a while now. He understands that his constituents, even those not voting for him, have a right to bring their concerns directly to him anytime they see him.  We are all equal here, it's not 'off with their heads' for daring to tell him their thoughts.   The statement was after the curtain call, so the actors didn't break character to do this.  Trump is the one that thinks he rules the citizens, rather than working for them as their national representative. 

[backformore]

20 hours ago, AmandaPanda said:

If they really want to boycott and have already purchased tickets, I'd be more than happy to take those tickets off their hands. In the interest of their freedom of speech and all...

Yeah, well call me if you need a date!

[windsprints]

I doubt Mike Pence was shocked. Its not the first time he's been booed. He was booed in the spring in his home state of Indiana. 

Quote

At least when the anti-Obama people went on their 8-year rant, it was easy to avoid it.  Just don't tune in to Fox News.

Or go on Facebook. Or twitter.  Or the internet in general.

Edited November 20, 2016 by windsprints

[backformore]

18 hours ago, oakville said:

I find it unusual that the cast would speak out to a member of the audience at any play. Did the cast explain why they didn't give the same treatment for President Bush, Paul Ryan or any other prominent Republicans? Is the cast allowed to call out politicians from the Democrats if they don't agree with a policy they are supporting ? Is this a new policy at other plays in NY? I am Canadian, so I can't recall anyone from the cast calling out politicians at any plays that I have attended.

Hamilton is a political play.  speaking to a politician in the audience of another play might be weird and inappropriate, but what was said at the Hamilton curtain call was in keeping with the theme and viewpoint of the play.   And if you read what they said - it was not confrontational or insulting.  It was a simple plea for equality. 

[DollEyes]

18 hours ago, oakville said:

I find it unusual that the cast would speak out to a member of the audience at any play. Did the cast explain why they didn't give the same treatment for President Bush, Paul Ryan or any other prominent Republicans? Is the cast allowed to call out politicians from the Democrats if they don't agree with a policy they are supporting ? Is this a new policy at other plays in NY? I am Canadian, so I can't recall anyone from the cast calling out politicians at any plays that I have attended.

If a Democrat was involved in what is IMO the most arrogant, ignorant, toxic, divisive and downright disgusting American Presidential campaign in modern American history-which IMO, Trump and Pence were and GWB and Paul Ryan weren't-then they should and I think would be called out.

Edited November 20, 2016 by DollEyes

[backformore]

4 hours ago, Tara said:

Convincing ourselves that the people in charge are all morally corrupt, hateful people is ridiculous. At any rate, speaking to Mike Pence with the assumption that he will not treat all Americans fairly the way that cast did was silly.  IMO

Not so silly.   As mentioned in a post above by @AmandaPanda, an actor in the play is Latino, gay and HIV positive.   As governor of Indiana,   Pence slashed funding to stop the spread of HIV-AIDS -  and has been blamed for HIV and hepatitis outbreaks in that state.

Pence's health policies to blame for outbreaks

At the same time, he advocated for "conversion therapy"  to change gay people straight - a treatment which includes electric shocks , and is discredited and seen as dangerous by the World Health organization and the American psychiatric Association. 

Considering those two things in his past, I think the " assumption that he will not treat all Americans fairly "  is a fairly logical assumption. 

[stillshimpy]

Quote

Oh my.  This all getting so very sad to me.  Labelling Mike Pence as racist, bigot, and sexist and then using it as justification for bad behavior is not what this country is about.

 

Mike Pence is responsible for those labels.  They weren't bestowed upon him without validity.  He has passed laws that are disgustingly sexist.  He is a misogynist.  He supports racist platforms.  He is a racist and a bigot by the very definition of those words. He is a homophobe of the first order. He's one of the founding members of  the Official Club for Homophobes as he supports fucking conversion therapy. 

And beyond all of that Civil Disobedience is not merely the right of people in a democracy it is the obligation of members of a free society to enact it in the face of anything that contradicts, opposes or erodes the very principles this nation was founded upon.  

Mike Pence wants to take away the rights of gay men and women.  He wants to have them subjected to a terroristic form of psychological "conversion" because for some fucking reason he believes he understands the sexual identity of perfect strangers more than the actual person does.  That is an outrage of the first fucking order and I'm prouder than hell that the cast of Hamilton decided they were not throwing away their shot to speak directly to a person who attempts through his legislation to actively fucking dehumanize them. 

Considering what was on the line, how personally painful that must have been for all of them, a diverse cast with players who are also LGBTQ , they were the souls of politeness but they do not owe him some faux reverence for his position. 

Edited November 20, 2016 by stillshimpy

[windsprints]

[callmebetty]

2 minutes ago, windsprints said:

Wasn't Obama also heckled by a Thing supporter at a Hillary rally? Where Thing said Obama yelled at the guy or something ?

[Ceindreadh]

1 hour ago, mythoughtis said:

Pence has now said he was not offended. He has been a politician for a while now. He understands that his constituents, even those not voting for him, have a right to bring their concerns directly to him anytime they see him.  We are all equal here, it's not 'off with their heads' for daring to tell him their thoughts.   The statement was after the curtain call, so the actors didn't break character to do this.  Trump is the one that thinks he rules the citizens, rather than working for them as their national representative. 

I have a smidgen less disrespect for the guy. Granted he may just have said that so as not to look bad, but at least it shows he's enough of a grownup to be able to not immediately go on a Twitter rant for a perceived slight. 

[callmebetty]

3 minutes ago, Ceindreadh said:

I have a smidgen less disrespect for the guy. Granted he may just have said that so as not to look bad, but at least it shows he's enough of a grownup to be able to not immediately go on a Twitter rant for a perceived slight. 

He didn't need to. I don't think Pence cared, not only by the booing (I'm sure that's happened before ) but even by what was said. 

All he needed to do was tell Thing and the rest took care of itself. He knows how thing reacts, it's too bad it took Pence this long to make a comment . 

[SmithW6079]

On 10/18/2016 at 8:05 AM, Darian said:

Good topic!

Pence is an anti-LGBTQ, misogynistic, theocrat. Any one of those things is disqualifying in my eyes. Pence is dangerous, truly and completely dangerous. And in this case, "heartbeat away" only means officially: Donald Trump Reportedly Plans to Delegate All Domestic and Foreign Power to his VP

Yes, Pence the Putrid scares me more than Don the Con. Trump and his family are going to loot America for all they can get out of it, but Pence and his fellow Dominionists are going to do their damndest to turn America into a Christian theocracy -- the Christian States of America. 

On 11/19/2016 at 9:32 AM, Shannon L. said:

I wondered what he would have thought about Hamilton's message, too.  But, I have mixed feelings about the way he was treated.  I have no problem with the statement from the cast--it's an important issue-- and the extra cheering/ovations during certain lines, but booing?  It's yet another thing that makes democrats look like sore losers.  It was a social night out, so just ignore him (If his presence is announced, don't applaud--dead silence or weak applause can be a killer, I'd imagine). 

I hope that Pence and Trump are booed every single time they appear in public. Fuck the high road. Don the Con paved the way by being a no-class vulgarian, so you reap what you sow. Let him get on Twitter every time to whine and complain. I'm hoping "Very unfair!" becomes a badge of honor by the dissidents.

5 hours ago, Tara said:

Oh my.  This all getting so very sad to me.  Labelling Mike Pence as racist, bigot, and sexist and then using it as justification for bad behavior is not what this country is about. 

At least when the anti-Obama people went on their 8-year rant, it was easy to avoid it.  Just don't tune in to Fox News.

But all this self-righteous vitriole by supporters of the candidate who lost is everything this country is NOT about.  The people voted and chose their president.  That's life.  If everyone takes it upon themselves to ignore our democratic voting process, then what?  

We can justify it all we want as being fair, as being, well, this election is different, and on and on.  It's just plain sad.  

Work towards voting him out next time.  Get involved in local politics, anything but this name calling.  I do not think this will be a white nationalist administration.  I think that is this administration's opponents fueling racial fires.  It worries me.  

Convincing ourselves that the people in charge are all morally corrupt, hateful people is ridiculous. At any rate, speaking to Mike Pence with the assumption that he will not treat all Americans fairly the way that cast did was silly.  IMO

Actually, Trump lost the popular vote by about 1,000,000 votes. And, I'm sorry, but "convincing ourselves that the people in charge are all morally corrupt hateful people is ridiculous" is disingenuous to the nth degree, especially after the way conservatives and Republicans treated Barack Obama in the previous eight years.

Steve Bannon is a white nationalist who has the president-elect's ear. This will most certainly be a white nationalist administration. The KKK and other alt-right groups have given two white-sheeted thumbs up that Bannon will be as close to the president as he is.

3 hours ago, Tara said:

They don't know what Mike Pence stands for.  This is all bullshit.

I got into so many arguments with my family during the Obama years.  The ridiculous emails that would be passed around, all with half-truths, some just blatant lies.  The most dangerous ones were those that had just enough truth to make Obama's opposers frightened and angry.  At the end of the day, we all survived Obama's terms as President.

I am preparing myself now for the ridiculous Trump emails.  

We will survive Trump, too.  Maybe.  :)

But they do, Blanche, they do. There's this funny thing called the public record, and Pence's actions as governor of Indiana and his tenure as a member of Congress are available for people to determine exactly the type of man he is. And on the record, he has stated:

Quote

 

Republican vice-presidential nominee Mike Pence last night gave Americans a very clear picture of who he is and has been as a pro-life governor and Congressman and who he would be as a leader of the country.

“I’m a Christian, a conservative and a Republican,” Pence said. “In that order.”

 

Nowhere does he say that he is an American, nor that he would be a leader for all Americans.

And the thing is, unlike Republicans, Democrats don't need to make shit up about Trump and Pence. All they have to do is review their records and their own words, and in Trump's case, his voluminous tweets.

2 hours ago, mythoughtis said:

Pence has now said he was not offended. He has been a politician for a while now. He understands that his constituents, even those not voting for him, have a right to bring their concerns directly to him anytime they see him.  We are all equal here, it's not 'off with their heads' for daring to tell him their thoughts.   The statement was after the curtain call, so the actors didn't break character to do this.  Trump is the one that thinks he rules the citizens, rather than working for them as their national representative. 

Funny how all the Trumpistas voted for Don the Con because he was an "outsider" (which is a lie anyway you look at it, given that he's a real estate developer who needed tax breaks and other government concessions that require schmoozing and other glad-handing with politicians), but seem to be OK with insider Pence.

Edited November 20, 2016 by SmithW6079

[PatsyandEddie]

26 minutes ago, callmebetty said:

Wasn't Obama also heckled by a Thing supporter at a Hillary rally? Where Thing said Obama yelled at the guy or something ?

Yes he was. He was heckled by an older gentleman in his blazer and medals. Obama stopped the crowd from booing and calmly suggested that the man was at the wrong rally and go find one for Drumpf instead. No one grabbed the man,punched him,spat on him etc. He was merely escorted out by police. 

Naturally the donald put his own spin on it which was the opposite of what reality was. 

[Macbeth]

3 hours ago, Tara said:

They don't know what Mike Pence stands for.  This is all bullshit.

Yea we really do.  to quote the man himself in 2000 he said: “Congress should oppose any effort to recognize homosexual’s as a ‘discreet and insular minority’ entitled to the protection of anti-discrimination laws similar to those extended to women and ethnic minorities.”

It is all out there to see.  Pence has an extensive record of bigotry.

[SmithW6079]

Jim Wright at Stonekettle Station points out that Pence could have responded to the Hamilton cast (and the audience) to address their concerns and indicate he was for all Americans. But he didn't. Because he's not.

http://www.stonekettle.com/2016/11/quacks-like-duck.html?m=1

Edited November 21, 2016 by SmithW6079

[FuriousStyles]

4 hours ago, backformore said:

Hamilton is a political play.  speaking to a politician in the audience of another play might be weird and inappropriate, but what was said at the Hamilton curtain call was in keeping with the theme and viewpoint of the play.   And if you read what they said - it was not confrontational or insulting.  It was a simple plea for equality. 

But that's the problem.  These rich white elites are having a huge problem with minority groups standing up for themselves and voicing their disapproval over whats going on. They dont want equality. Never have never will.  And they surely dont want you making things uncomfortable for them by pointing out how unfairly this country has treated certain segments of the population. 

People calling BLM a terrorist organization, condemning Colin Kaepernick for starting a trend of (silently) protesting the national anthem because of what's been going on, Trump saying the folks protesting his election were "professionals".  We can go back decades to what they did to MLK, Muhammad Ali, Malcolm X, Angela Davis and a host of other people who spoke out.  They were villified, some arrested and of course others murdered.  The Black Panthers were deemed by J Edgar Hoover, then head of the FBI as the "most dangerous threat to the internal security of the country".  An all out assault was launched to dismantle them....yet the KKK was left to terrorize blacks for centuries.  How is that possible? 

Anybody thinking minority groups are going to just bend over and smile nicely and leave this racist, xenophobic Admininstration to their own devices has another thing coming. 

What makes me so mad, is that there were serious threats made against Hillary Clinton not only by the nutjobs who support the GOP but by actual members of the Party!  Lets not forget that calls for a "revolution" and bloodshed were happening. I believe at one point Trump himself played coy with the idea and his ass kissers on the various talk shows had to defend and deflect saying thats not what he really meant....but it was.  Or at least he might have been hoping some freak supporter thought he meant it.  So IMO,  making a statement at a play or booing the VP is STILL a far cry from what I bet would be happening if the shoe was on the other foot.  People would be literally trying to kill Hillary.

Edited November 20, 2016 by FuriousStyles