Season 7 Finale Special - Check Up With Dr. Drew, Part 2

[Lemons]

On ‎6‎/‎26‎/‎2016 at 4:40 PM, shelley1005 said:

I more look at Adam as the problematic factor since they got pregnant.  Chelsea struggled to get her education in order and get on track, but what she didn't struggle at is being a damn good mom to Aubree from basically the moment she was born.  Can't say that for Adam then, anytime in between or now.  

Chelsea was always a good mother and wanted to be a mother and Adam made it clear that he didn't want to be a father.  But he is coming around.  Chelsea has shown consistent improvements and Adam has shown sporadic improvement.  Most people don't want to see people they dislike to do well but he is finding his way.  Adam will never be a boy scout but he found a vocation he does well in, somehow managed to not blow all his money and he bought a house, and he loves his children. 

1 hour ago, Lm2162 said:

She was 16...I'd actually say that being incredibly insecure and desperate for a guy as ANY 16 year old girl is pretty much par for the course, unfortunately.

No, not ANY 16 year old.  Luckily only a small minority of teen girls will go so far as to let a boy treat them in an abusive way because they are desperate for a guy. 

[Lemons]

27 minutes ago, ghoulina said:

Yup. Even if you have very loving, involved parents - there's cliques at school, and unrealistic expectations from celebrities and the media, body shaming, boys being pigs, etc. I went to the park with my little kids on Sunday and three girls around 12-13 showed up. I was listening to them off and on and there were very obvious Mean Girl dynamics going on. One girl was the clear leader and she often put the other two down, in a "joking" way, but they never did the same to her. At one point they were going on the see-saws, and the "leader" girl remarked that the other girl couldn't ride with her because she (leader) was only 100 lbs and other girl was "probably 150lbs!" That girl was NOT 150lbs. All of them were normally shaped for girls at/around puberty. That crap starts so young and it terrifies me as a mother of a little girl! 

 

It starts young.  One problem is that so many parents are so unaware.  I loved fashion and got best dressed in high school.  My mother always emphasized to me that just because I loved to dress up doesn't mean everyone else likes to.  Some people are fine wearing the same thing every day.  She emphasized not excluding anyone.  If someone wants to join in, let them.  Some mothers were the opposite, mean girls who never grew up, grooming mini mean girls, wanting their girls to be popular over anything.    

[shelley1234]

Adam continues to treat his children like toys that he likes to be around when it is convenient.  That isn't being a parent.  I know baby sitters with more responsibility than Adam can show.  Being a mostly shitty human being instead of a completely shitty abusive piece of shit isn't something that should get awards and prizes.  

[HeySandyStrange]

6 hours ago, Lemons said:

No, not ANY 16 year old.  Luckily only a small minority of teen girls will go so far as to let a boy treat them in an abusive way because they are desperate for a guy. 

Wow, that is a very, very, very simplistic view of abuse. It isn't just pathetic losers who "let" themselves be abused, by the way; plenty of intelligent and successful people end up in abusive relationships. Abuse happens and continues on in relationships for so many reasons that to imply it is just because someone "lets" it happen is very offensive and frankly, very obtuse.

[SneakyCentipede]

AAAANNNNYYYYWAYYY....So Addie's great Escape was finally acknowledged. While Leah was "cleaning" bwahaha. 

She still seemed to get a good spin.

Thoughts?

[Mkay]

1 hour ago, SneakyCentipede said:

AAAANNNNYYYYWAYYY....So Addie's great Escape was finally acknowledged. While Leah was "cleaning" bwahaha. 

She still seemed to get a good spin.

Thoughts?

I like how everyone interrupted her so that she couldn't tell us the true story instead of Germy's exaggerated one. 

[Elizabeth9]

Wait a minute...hold up...everyone keeps referring to Adam as a teenager when they got pregnant.  Does this mean he is the same age as Chelsea?  What is she, 24?  Christ, I thought Adam was closer to 30, and even then, a rough 28.  

[neatoburrito]

2 hours ago, Elizabeth9 said:

Wait a minute...hold up...everyone keeps referring to Adam as a teenager when they got pregnant.  Does this mean he is the same age as Chelsea?  What is she, 24?  Christ, I thought Adam was closer to 30, and even then, a rough 28.  

He has the attitude of a sulky 15 year old with no manners or social skills to speak of, combined with the unfortunate receding hairline of a man in his late forties.

[Christina87]

They also make you feel like you couldn't do better if you left them, and they're very skilled in this manipulation. Once someone says something horrible about you so many times, you start to believe it's true, no matter how ridiculous it is. So Adam calling her fat, crazy, dumb, and whatever else he said started to feel true after a while, usually because there are tiny hints of truth (usually you have done something kind of crazy, but it was a direct response to something off-the-wall that they did). Thankfully, you usually learn to see earlier warning signs after a relationship like this, and it looks like Chelsea has learned that lesson. However, I see her constant neediness about her looks to be an unfortunate scar from Adam. 

[ghoulina]

1 minute ago, Christina87 said:

 

They also make you feel like you couldn't do better if you left them, and they're very skilled in this manipulation. Once someone says something horrible about you so many times, you start to believe it's true, no matter how ridiculous it is. So Adam calling her fat, crazy, dumb, and whatever else he said started to feel true after a while, usually because there are tiny hints of truth (usually you have done something kind of crazy, but it was a direct response to something off-the-wall that they did). Thankfully, you usually learn to see earlier warning signs after a relationship like this, and it looks like Chelsea has learned that lesson. However, I see her constant neediness about her looks to be an unfortunate scar from Adam. 

 

Yup. If Chelsea was really insecure, there's a good chance she WOULD stay with him even if he was nasty to her. Because she had someone. She had a date for Saturday nights. It's really sad, but there are a lot of girls like that. Also, emotional abuse doesn't start off at 100%. It can be slow and subtle until you're in the thick of something you didn't see coming. There can be ebbs and flows. He might have buttered her up for awhile, then turned around and got nasty. It's all about manipulation, and inexperienced, insecure teen girls are very easy to manipulate. 

[guilfoyleatpp]

When you're young you don't give much thought to the qualities that make a good father...even if you're looking to become a mother and a family. The best of relationships go through a 'what the fuck have I done?' period after a child is born.  Things that you don't think will bother you when you don't have children are suddenly magnified once you do. 

Whether it's partying too much or not being social enough, working all the time or not working at all, playing video games, leaving shit in the sink, not putting clothes in the hamper, not finishing projects to completion - whatever little thing you've noted about your partner, even as a grown adult, takes on a whole different meaning when you bring a child into the mix.

Do I think a 16 year old or an 18 year old or a 20 year old has the best tools to make appropriate choices? In most cases, no. There are always people that do make it work, but they mature together and actually work at relationships. A baby complicates things. It's hard work. It isn't work for a teenager. 

And the boys are in the same position - does a 16 year old living at home and still in high school make a good mom and partner? She can be, but it takes A LOT of work and support. When you're young you don't have much perspective and experience in knowing what to worry about and what to let go of. We see very brief glimpses into these girls post-partum lives and they're mostly slanted to making the mom "the good guy" but I can think of a couple instances where my 40+ year old self was like "yeah, she should just let that go."  Some things aren't worth fighting over - and yet when you've just had a baby, you're exhausted and scared and hormonal, it seems like something to make drama over.

[neatoburrito]

I never knew about Adam's DV charges, ugh, I hate him even more now. He was always so nasty to Chelsea. When she used to try and stand up for herself only for him to cut her back down with a mean comment, it was heartbreaking to watch. I remember he used to call her stupid a lot, like she'd ask him why he wasn't around for Aubree more and he'd just reply with "Why are you so dumb?" It disgusted me how he spoke to her, and I can imagine it was a thousand times worse when the cameras weren't around. 

I think she'd have gotten rid of him much sooner if she hadn't wanted Aubree to have two parents together. I got the impression she felt like she owed it to Aubree to try as hard as she possibly could to salvage some kind of family unit with Adam. Eventually she realized he was always going to be a douche no matter how hard she tried, because he doesn't care about anyone but himself. I don't fault Chelsea for that one bit, people can criticize but she always had Aubree's best interests front and centre in her mind, which is a damn sight more than can be said for Leah and Jenelle, even Kail sometimes. I'm sure with hindsight she wishes she'd never tried so hard to keep Adouche, but hindsight is 20/20 isn't it.

[Elizabeth9]

1 hour ago, neatoburrito said:

I never knew about Adam's DV charges, ugh, I hate him even more now. He was always so nasty to Chelsea. When she used to try and stand up for herself only for him to cut her back down with a mean comment, it was heartbreaking to watch. I remember he used to call her stupid a lot, like she'd ask him why he wasn't around for Aubree more and he'd just reply with "Why are you so dumb?" It disgusted me how he spoke to her, and I can imagine it was a thousand times worse when the cameras weren't around. 

I think she'd have gotten rid of him much sooner if she hadn't wanted Aubree to have two parents together. I got the impression she felt like she owed it to Aubree to try as hard as she possibly could to salvage some kind of family unit with Adam. Eventually she realized he was always going to be a douche no matter how hard she tried, because he doesn't care about anyone but himself. I don't fault Chelsea for that one bit, people can criticize but she always had Aubree's best interests front and centre in her mind, which is a damn sight more than can be said for Leah and Jenelle, even Kail sometimes. I'm sure with hindsight she wishes she'd never tried so hard to keep Adouche, but hindsight is 20/20 isn't it.

If she felt that way- to try as hard as possible because of the kid, she certainly wouldn't be the first.  I know plenty of women who stuck in some pretty bad relationships for their kid(s).

[MargeGunderson]

21 hours ago, SneakyCentipede said:

AAAANNNNYYYYWAYYY....So Addie's great Escape was finally acknowledged. While Leah was "cleaning" bwahaha. 

She still seemed to get a good spin.

Thoughts?

Leah, next time come up with a more believable excuse.

[Christina87]

Splain, I wish I could like your comment 1000 times!!! It is so spot-on. Abusers are great at putting on a front until you get hooked, and then they let their true colors show. By that point, you are convinced they hung the moon. I remember my teen boyfriend putting the blame on me for EVERYHING, and then calling me stupid and crazy when I had a different opinion. His rudeness knew no bounds, and he broke up with me once because I left some clothes I'd changed out of at his place, and he thought it was me being "crazy" to have an excuse to come back, get them, and spy on him. He called me crazy, manipulative, and clingy for dumb things like that sooooo many times that I honestly started to believe those things were true. Not to mention that he would stand me up for dumb reasons and then get mad at ME for being a drama queen, and "too clingy." All of the adults in my life told me to run, but he would then put on a great front for a while. I didn't think I was good enough for anyone else, and continued to think that long after I finally ended it. I kept a diary to air my frustrations, and it makes me cringe to read it now. I ask myself how I could have so little self-respect, but I truly believed it was my own fault for being the "bad" one in the relarionship.

For probably another year, I would constantly ask dates if I was crazy or clingy. I never thought of myself as an abuse victim, but a decade of other relationships has shown me that these dynamics are far from normal, as no other boyfriend has ever treated me badly at all. Still, I see leftover signs, like worrying about texting a guy too much when I'm barely contacting him at all, and never initiating plans until I know him really well. Sorry for the novel, haha! I just think a lot of people don't understand emotional abuse, because they thankfully haven't walked in those shoes. Plus people deny they're being abused; I know I would have 100% put the blame on myself for our relationship problems if you'd asked me back then. That was one of the reasons I liked this show when it started; I identified with Chelsea but felt so, so bad for her because as bad as my guy was, Adam is 100 times worse!!!

Edited July 1, 2016 by Christina87

[GreatKazu]

On 6/30/2016 at 6:10 AM, Elizabeth9 said:

Wait a minute...hold up...everyone keeps referring to Adam as a teenager when they got pregnant.  Does this mean he is the same age as Chelsea?  What is she, 24?  Christ, I thought Adam was closer to 30, and even then, a rough 28.  

He is a year older than Chelsea. He is 25 years old.

 

On 6/30/2016 at 5:06 PM, Christina87 said:

Splain, I wish I could like your comment 1000 times!!! It is so spot-on. Abusers are great at putting on a front until you get hooked, and then they let their true colors show. By that point, you are convinced they hung the moon. I remember my teen boyfriend putting the blame on me for EVERYHING, and then calling me stupid and crazy when I had a different opinion. His rudeness knew no bounds, and he broke up with me once because I left some clothes I'd changed out of at his place, and he thought it was me being "crazy" to have an excuse to come back, get them, and spy on him. He called me crazy, manipulative, and clingy for dumb things like that sooooo many times that I honestly started to believe those things were true. Not to mention that he would stand me up for dumb reasons and then get mad at ME for being a drama queen, and "too clingy." All of the adults in my life told me to run, but he would then put on a great front for a while. I didn't think I was good enough for anyone else, and continued to think that long after I finally ended it. I kept a diary to air my frustrations, and it makes me cringe to read it now. I ask myself how I could have so little self-respect, but I truly believed it was my own fault for being the "bad" one in the relarionship.

For probably another year, I would constantly ask dates if I was crazy or clingy. I never thought of myself as an abuse victim, but a decade of other relationships has shown me that these dynamics are far from normal, as no other boyfriend has ever treated me badly at all. Still, I see leftover signs, like worrying about texting a guy too much when I'm barely contacting him at all, and never initiating plans until I know him really well. Sorry for the novel, haha! I just think a lot of people don't understand emotional abuse, because they thankfully haven't walked in those shoes. Plus people deny they're being abused; I know I would have 100% put the blame on myself for our relationship problems if you'd asked me back then. That was one of the reasons I liked this show when it started; I identified with Chelsea but felt so, so bad for her because as bad as my guy was, Adam is 100 times worse!!!

You were being victimized and it reads that you carried on the effects of that abuse for quite some time afterwards. Glad to read you got out of that relationship. I am sure in your mind you felt you stayed in it longer than you wish you had. Those mind-playing games the abusers play can really make one feel inadequate, insecure, and fearful. We feel we were to blame for their behavior. Splain explained it very well.

Adam had constant run-ins with the law for DUIs, underage drinking and drug possession. He almost killed two elderly people when he slammed his car into them because he was driving like a maniac on the road. This guy is bad news. I feel for his daughters because they are now having to deal with this douchebag. He is going to continue to hurt their feelings, disappoint them on a regular basis, and not make them a priority. But then, that is what abusers do.

[Katt]

When he hurt those people, he had no driving license and therefore, no insurance, right? Has he never been to jail? It seems like he should have been there a few times by now. Rather Jenelle-esque. 

[Christina87]

On July 2, 2016 at 1:53 PM, GreatKazu said:

He is a year older than Chelsea. He is 25 years old.

 

You were being victimized and it reads that you carried on the effects of that abuse for quite some time afterwards. Glad to read you got out of that relationship. I am sure in your mind you felt you stayed in it longer than you wish you had. Those mind-playing games the abusers play can really make one feel inadequate, insecure, and fearful. We feel we were to blame for their behavior. Splain explained it very well.

Adam had constant run-ins with the law for DUIs, underage drinking and drug possession. He almost killed two elderly people when he slammed his car into them because he was driving like a maniac on the road. This guy is bad news. I feel for his daughters because they are now having to deal with this douchebag. He is going to continue to hurt their feelings, disappoint them on a regular basis, and not make them a priority. But then, that is what abusers do.

Thank you! I appreciate it. I do feel that I stayed in it waaaaay too long, but he seemed so irreplaceable because of his mind games! I wish I'd had the perspective back then to know how abusive that behavior was. At least once you learn, you know not to make the same mistake again!

Edited July 4, 2016 by Christina87

[ReadMeLattice]

On 7/2/2016 at 9:15 PM, Katt said:

When he hurt those people, he had no driving license and therefore, no insurance, right? Has he never been to jail? It seems like he should have been there a few times by now. Rather Jenelle-esque. 

He is in many ways the male equivalent. No feelings for others. 

[radishcake]

I hid a bunch of posts due to having to hide a few then massive amounts of quoting of the hidden posts. If your post is missing that's why. 

Time outs today for this continued bashing of each other. If you can't use the ignore feature as we've suggested time outs will be given for infighting.

[DNR]

MTV should cancel this show and these women should move on with their lives. But I guess the show makes money ? Leah, Kailyn & Jenelles lives are a wreck so viewers love it. I find myself really pissed off watching Leah and Jenelle. 

Speaking of Jenelle - I can't post in her thread at all and can't figure out why. I have so much to get off my chest !!!! Lmao

[DNR]

On June 29, 2016 at 3:27 PM, Lemons said:

Chelsea was always a good mother and wanted to be a mother and Adam made it clear that he didn't want to be a father.  But he is coming around.  Chelsea has shown consistent improvements and Adam has shown sporadic improvement.  Most people don't want to see people they dislike to do well but he is finding his way.  Adam will never be a boy scout but he found a vocation he does well in, somehow managed to not blow all his money and he bought a house, and he loves his children. 

No, not ANY 16 year old.  Luckily only a small minority of teen girls will go so far as to let a boy treat them in an abusive way because they are desperate for a guy. 

I always get the impression from Adumb that if he wasn't scheduled for MTV filming with Aubree , he'd probably see her very sporadically.  But this is a tv show and I don't know these people. He seems to not really enjoy or take advantage of the time spent with his daughters ( what we are shown) Missed the dance , NEVER calls or skypes/FaceTime with her, Always hypnotized by the cellphone like a 14yo while his daughter calls his name x10.  Let's hope Aubree pulls a Cats in the Cradle on him in his old age ( sorry dad too busy!)

[CofCinci]

52 minutes ago, DNR said:

I always get the impression from Adumb that if he wasn't scheduled for MTV filming with Aubree , he'd probably see her very sporadically.  But this is a tv show and I don't know these people. He seems to not really enjoy or take advantage of the time spent with his daughters ( what we are shown) Missed the dance , NEVER calls or skypes/FaceTime with her, Always hypnotized by the cellphone like a 14yo while his daughter calls his name x10.  Let's hope Aubree pulls a Cats in the Cradle on him in his old age ( sorry dad too busy!)

Correct.  If MTV $$ was not provided to Adam in exchange for playing the role of "father" on the series, he would be completely absent from the child's life. 

Luckily, Aubree has the best mother in the series and many in her family who are there to love and nurture the child. 

[CandysWrapRoom]

On 6/23/2016 at 7:20 AM, DoctorWhovian said:

What bugs me the most about the Chelsea/Adam/dance thing is that there is this underlying assumption that so many people seem to have, that simply because she's the mom, she is responsible for telling the dad about school functions. It's sexist and it's gross. Men are 100% equally as capable as being informed as to school and extra curricular activities. If they were married or dating, and their relationship works where she tells him of these things and makes sure that he goes, then that's fine. But they aren't. He is an independent adult. He has equal ability to get the information from the school as Chelsea.

This.  F'ing THIS.

My ex-husband and I share a google calendar where I place all relevant dates and times of all events involving our children as soon as I am aware of them.  This is far more than I should have to do.  If he wants to attend their events, well, it is not difficult for him to sign up for the mailing lists, newsletters, etc, that I receive.  Since he chooses not to, I go out of my way to make him aware of the information because it is what is best for my children however I do not spoon feed him nor nag him about it.  Even so, after he missed one too many things and one of my children asked him WHY, he said, "your mom didn't TELL ME." 

Come on, now.  Chelsea made Adam aware of the date of the event and that is all that he needed to figure out all by his little self.  There is no need for Chelsea to hold his hand.  He made his decision based on his priorities, end of story.

[pheebs]

On 6/24/2016 at 10:46 AM, Chicken Wing said:

As for Randy the Super Dad having four daughters have babies out of wedlock (is that really still an expression?), two of them while in high school? We don't know nearly enough about the Houska clan, their upbringing, their family values, their attitudes about sex and family or the mentality of young women in their part of South Dakota in general to make any judgments about that one way or the other. There are just too many factors in teen/unwed pregnancy to make any generalized assumptions.

Apologies for being late to the party, but it's a long, boring day at work, so.... I'm from eastern South Dakota as well. The bolding is mine and I'd like to share what seems to be a fairly common perception of teen-aged girls around here. I've worked with a lot of them over the years, (Restaurant Management.) Quite a few have gotten pregnant in High School, so much so that I used to joke that their must be fertility drugs in the food. When I would ask the girls why they didn't use birth control they all explained it to me, in varying forms, as such..."Why, only sluts use birth control! I mean, if you just get carried away in the moment and end up having sex, it's not your fault you get pregnant! It's not like, you know, planning to have sex. That's wrong." Not one of them ever considered adoption or abortion. All of the bad-boy douches they mated with, (most of them behaving like Adumb, by the way, entirely self-centered and entitled, which I blame on the bias here for boy children, mostly due to our rural/farming heritage,) left them entirely holding the bag, with quite a few asking to sign over parental rights immediately. I still see a few girls to this day, and not a one of them is involved with their baby-daddies.

That being said, my theory on why this is? Small town religious values, (even our biggest city only has 150, 000 people,) no sex-ed in schools, (abstinence, primarily,) and family is super-involved here, (plenty of support.) Our cost of living is quite low, making it easier to live on a lower income. (We also have the highest percent of working Mom's with children under 6 in the nation. 86%.) And, there really isn't much of a stigma, either, because it's so very common. Adumb isn't atypical for the way guys act out here. "Boys will be boys,"  "Stand by your man," and wanting to be married with kids in your 20's to your high school sweetheart seem to be theme I've heard over the years, also.

But, all girls in South Dakota don't act like this. Some get good grades, go to college, delay marriage and children, and have great careers. What do we call these girls? Former residents of South Dakota...

[MissMel]

I'm paraphrasing here, and have no idea if this fits, but the Bible does state that premarital sex is forbidden unless you intend to marry the person at the time you have sex. I wonder if this factors into not intending on getting pregnant. "But you know-uh, it's okay-uh that I got knocked up-uh because I didn't intend-uh on having sex-uh. But since-uh we did-uh, and I am-uh, we're-uh gonna married-uh! So it's all good-uh!"

That hurt to type. 

[BitterApple]

1 hour ago, MissMel said:

I'm paraphrasing here, and have no idea if this fits, but the Bible does state that premarital sex is forbidden unless you intend to marry the person at the time you have sex. I wonder if this factors into not intending on getting pregnant. "But you know-uh, it's okay-uh that I got knocked up-uh because I didn't intend-uh on having sex-uh. But since-uh we did-uh, and I am-uh, we're-uh gonna married-uh! So it's all good-uh!"

That hurt to type. 

I think it's just dumb teenage logic, like the girls who won't take birth control pills because they don't want to gain weight yet never stop to think about how pregnancy will pack on a good thirty pounds.