Tara Ariano June 15, 2016 Share June 15, 2016 Quote Hodiak tackles a new case involving missing young women in the Season 2 opener, which combines three episodes. Also: Charmaine takes on a risky undercover operation; and Manson and his growing family move into the home of their new benefactor. Link to comment
ShadowHunter June 17, 2016 Share June 17, 2016 Dennis Wilson Tex Watson when they showed up all I thought of was the events they would lead us to. I don't think Emma was involved in the murders I feel like they want us to think that. I know she was covered in blood but that could have been through walking around the house. Seeing the bodies was awful. Charlie was not at the house though. I see Emma is pregnant and she still seems to be his favorite. Hodiak is one of the few things that can make me laugh durning this show. I feel like I am watching Mulder without the alien obsession. Shafe: You drinkin again? Hodiak: I don't care what anybody says you are going to be a good detective.. 1 Link to comment
Primetimer June 17, 2016 Share June 17, 2016 Sarah D. Bunting doesn't really love the show, but this friendship might keep her hangin' on. View the full article 2 Link to comment
profreader June 17, 2016 Share June 17, 2016 I also really loved Karina Longworth's Manson series -- I'd read Helter Skelter before and some other Manson-related things -- but nothing wove all the threads together like her approach. I was intrigued by the idea of Aquarius -- now maybe I'll get around to watching it. 1 Link to comment
LakeGal June 17, 2016 Share June 17, 2016 I enjoyed that they showed the Dateline episode before Aquarius tonight. It was eerie they started the show with a scene from Sharon Tate's house that looked just like the real photos we had just seen when Keith Morrison was showing them. 2 Link to comment
helenamonster June 17, 2016 Share June 17, 2016 16 minutes ago, LakeGal said: I enjoyed that they showed the Dateline episode before Aquarius tonight. It was eerie they started the show with a scene from Sharon Tate's house that looked just like the real photos we had just seen when Keith Morrison was showing them. I watched the Dateline special too. I find the approach of that show in general to be more exploitative than informative/enlightening, and it got a little cheesy at times, but it put me in the right mood for the show, which is absolutely 100% creeped out. It was nice to see Bugliosi, may he rest in peace. And I'm curious to see how this whole Leslie Van Houten situation shakes out. I really hope she's kept locked up. I thought the flashforwards to the Tate murders were excellent and appropriately terrifying. While this show likes to take creative license, it seems like they're trying to be as accurate as possible with the specifics, which I appreciate. Although did Atkins try to tie up Sebring and Tate in Tate's bedroom? I just finished Helter Skelter and could have sworn they were all brought out to the living room. I also thought the nursery was untouched; Linda Kasabian saw that the window was open (because it had just been painted), but told the others that it was closed in the hopes that they'd just leave. My copy of Helter Skelter is on my Kindle so it's more difficult to skip back and reference things than if I had a hard copy. When I saw the promo for this season and that Manson was at the Tate house, I was ready to get all upset because one of the biggest reasons why this case has endured in the public consciousness for so long is because he wasn't there and managed to convince people go out and brutally murder strangers on his behalf. But if it's all part of the more "creative license" of the show that doesn't change too much of real life events...I can let it slide. Also, pregnant Emma...I hope Manson's not the father but he probably is because we can't have nice things. One more nitpicky thing and then I swear I'm done: I'm gonna go ahead and guess that this show couldn't get Tara Lynne Barr back this season to play Patricia Krenwinkel, so now we have to pretend that "Katie" from last season wasn't her and that this new "Patty" actually is. Smooth, Show. You could have just recast the part, I found that whole awkward transition very awkward. I missed Hodiak and all his world-weary cynicism. I'm also glad Charmain is ok and she and her fabulous hair have lived to sleuth around another day. I've heard a lot of good things about that You Must Remember This podcast and I want to give it a listen...but I house-sit this house over the summer that reminds me of 10050 Cielo Drive (isolated, has a pool and a guesthouse, no AC so we have to keep the windows open) and it's creepy enough staying there without worrying about some deranged hippies coming through the window, so I'll save it for the fall. 1 Link to comment
ShadowHunter June 17, 2016 Share June 17, 2016 Steven Parent had he driven away 5 minutes earlier or stayed inside with William Garretson. Do not get me wrong everyone had a brutal death they did not deserve. I just feel he never gets talked about as much as Sharon Tate does or the other victims for that matter. My mind sometimes wanders to him more. Evan in 69 he didn't get spoken about as much. Where is Leslie Van Houten? Has she not shown up yet or have I sucked at paying attention. 1 Link to comment
shapeshifter June 17, 2016 Share June 17, 2016 On June 15, 2016 at 11:23 AM, Tara Ariano said: Quote Hodiak tackles a new case involving missing young women in the Season 2 opener, which combines three episodes. Also: Charmaine takes on a risky undercover operation; and Manson and his growing family move into the home of their new benefactor. There was one commercial break here at one hour and 30 minutes. I guess that might be for the beginning of the "third" episode. Does anyone know if there was a third titled episode? Or did they just use bits from it for the 2-hour, commercial-free airing? Anyway, watching over the air without a DVR, this was too long for our bladders, LOL. Duchovny's on-screen charisma seems to be carrying the show. I doubt it will last the 5 or 6 seasons he/they originally envisioned. Link to comment
PugLoaf June 17, 2016 Share June 17, 2016 I am sad they didn't release the whole thing to binge like last year but even more sad it seems they are choosing not to release it to hulu at all? Link to comment
kassygreene June 17, 2016 Share June 17, 2016 It was three episodes crammed into two hours minus about 90 seconds for the newsbreak... NBC has three episodes up now at 43 minutes each - the extra time would be title sequence, credits, and perhaps some "previouslies". 1 Link to comment
shapeshifter June 17, 2016 Share June 17, 2016 2 hours ago, kassygreene said: It was three episodes crammed into two hours minus about 90 seconds for the newsbreak... NBC has three episodes up now at 43 minutes each - the extra time would be title sequence, credits, and perhaps some "previouslies". Thanks. According to the website (http://www.nbc.com/aquarius/episodes) those first 3 episodes are: S02.E01: I'm So Tired 2016.06.16 S02.E02: Happiness Is A Warm Gun 2016.06.16 S02.E03: Why Don't We Do It In The Road 2016.06.16 I'll message the mods about possibly changing the thread title to reflect them all. Link to comment
halgia June 17, 2016 Share June 17, 2016 1 hour ago, shapeshifter said: I'll message the mods about possibly changing the thread title to reflect them all. Done! :) 1 Link to comment
shapeshifter June 17, 2016 Share June 17, 2016 2 minutes ago, Dougal said: Done! :) Please don't hate me, but I think "Helter Skelter" should be "I'm So Tired." I could sing the first few lines, if that would help. ;) 1 Link to comment
reggiejax June 17, 2016 Share June 17, 2016 (edited) I know it is futile of me to resist nitpicking, so I'll make it quick. Manson at the crime scene after the fact has become a part of the lore, but I for one believe it to be untrue. This is a relatively recent addition to the story, but one that has no corroboration whatsoever, and if you think about it, really makes no sense. Former Family members retelling the tale, and clearly adding and embellishing, are responsible for this becoming part of the story, and I think it managed to stick because it added an additional touch of creepiness to the murders. As if any more was needed. Ralph Church, Charlie's former fellow inmate, is completely fictional. And suffice it to say, nothing like what happened to Church and his associates ever happened in real life. Not even close. As for Patricia Krenwinkel, I guess they had to recast, but I don't know why they thought they could pull one over on anyone who had watched season 1, where Krenwinkel, going by her Family name "Katie" was clearly already present. As she would have been, having been one of Manson's first recruits. His third to be exact. At least they got the part about Krenwinkel being the link to Dennis Wilson right. Although she was not a friend, she was picked up hitchhiking by Wilson and, as these things went in the 60's, she invited the rest of the Family to Wilson's house. Quote Steven Parent had he driven away 5 minutes earlier or stayed inside with William Garretson. Do not get me wrong everyone had a brutal death they did not deserve. I just feel he never gets talked about as much as Sharon Tate does or the other victims for that matter. My mind sometimes wanders to him more. Evan in 69 he didn't get spoken about as much. It is surprising how in these famous cases, there tends to be a forgotten victim. Here it is Steven Parent. In the OJ case, it is Ron Goldman. In the Kennedy assassination it is Officer Tippit. Quote Where is Leslie Van Houten? Has she not shown up yet or have I sucked at paying attention. Since they have only shown us scenes of the Tate murders, where Van Houten was not present, I guess they didn't feel the need to show her just yet. In real life, I believe she was already part of the Family by the time that is "the present" in Aquarius (early 1968). And unlike Krenwinkel, she was not portrayed in season 1. Edited June 18, 2016 by reggiejax 1 Link to comment
Fable June 17, 2016 Share June 17, 2016 I’m glad to see this show back. I didn’t realize it was on until I logged into PTV and saw the show title in orange and bolded. Thank goodness because my summer show TV plate has been slim pickings so far. I was a little puzzled about the scenes with Emma and Charlie being at the crime scene since we know things didn’t go down that way, and it will be interesting to see how the show runners tie this in. I think Hodiak is great character, but most of my love so far is going to Charmain and Shafe who are really putting themselves out there in the scheme of things. I am impressed that this show is both dark and funny at the same time. Charmain telling Shafe about her cover story about him to Roy was gold. I am glad that it looks like Claire Holt will have a meatier role this season. 1 Link to comment
shapeshifter June 18, 2016 Share June 18, 2016 1 hour ago, Fable said: I was a little puzzled about the scenes with Emma and Charlie being at the crime scene since we know things didn’t go down that way, and it will be interesting to see how the show runners tie this in. Several posters have asked variations of this question. Isn't there a disclaimer at the beginning of each airing stating that this is a fictional account? I think that gives them poetic license to place Manson at the scene. But maybe it will turn out that they are just imagining he's there, telling them what to do. Regardless, Emma is totally fictional, right? I see her as us, the audience. She often reacts to Charlie with more reservation than the others. But she's also drinking the Koolaid. Link to comment
helenamonster June 18, 2016 Share June 18, 2016 20 hours ago, ShadowHunter said: Steven Parent had he driven away 5 minutes earlier or stayed inside with William Garretson. Do not get me wrong everyone had a brutal death they did not deserve. I just feel he never gets talked about as much as Sharon Tate does or the other victims for that matter. My mind sometimes wanders to him more. Evan in 69 he didn't get spoken about as much. Where is Leslie Van Houten? Has she not shown up yet or have I sucked at paying attention. I agree, there's something especially sad about Steven Parent's death (though I think all the deaths were horrific in their own individual ways). He was the youngest victim, and had the least to do with anything that was going on, which is saying a lot, considering all the victims were essentially murdered at random. He was at Garretson's to try to sell him a radio, for God's sake. It's awful beyond words. According to Van Houten's Wikipedia, she met Manson in summer of '68, joining the Family with Catherine Share. Also, this isn't really nitpicking, but it's something I've always wondered...I know they did tests to determine that Garretson was telling the truth when he said he didn't hear the murders because he was listening to music (and sound travels wonky in a canyon), but is it safe to assume that no one inside the Tate house heard Parent being shot? If they did, presumably they'd go out to investigate or they'd try to call the cops (the phone lines were cut but at least they'd try), and they'd be more on guard for intruders coming into the main house. For people wondering where the episodes started and ended, you could tell by the flashforwards, cuz it looks like they're going to bookend every episode this season. 2.1 started and ended with Emma and Manson at the Tate house. 2.2 started with Tate and Sebring talking in her bedroom and ended with Atkins and Krenwinkel holding them down. 2.3 started with Watson shooting Parent and ended with Watson waking up Frykowski. I also laughed out loud at the moment when Manson met Watson, found out his name was Charles, and then immediately said, "Yeah, that's not gonna work." The way the show is portraying it, I don't think Emma and Manson were there when the murders went down, which I would definitely have a huge problem with. The time stamp was 4:22am, and didn't the murderers book it out of there pretty fast once they were done? They didn't hang around like they did at the LaBiancas, I think cuz Linda Kasabian told them she heard someone coming to get them to leave. It looks like the two of them came by later to clean up or make more of a mess or whatever. Emma's inclusion in the events is interesting because as it stands now, she appears be taking on a Linda Kasabian type role: a sort of outsider who didn't really understand what she was getting into and who saw the whole thing go down but didn't actually participate and feels super guilty about it. Kasabian was also pregnant at the time of the murders, though not as heavily as Emma is, and by the time of the murders Emma will have been with the Family for almost two years, whereas Kasabian was only there for a month. Anyway, it'll be interesting to see the two characters interact. 1 Link to comment
reggiejax June 18, 2016 Share June 18, 2016 (edited) Quote Isn't there a disclaimer at the beginning of each airing stating that this is a fictional account? I think that gives them poetic license to place Manson at the scene. But maybe it will turn out that they are just imagining he's there, telling them what to do. What is portrayed is Manson and Emma arriving a few hours after the murders and adding, subtracting and rearranging things at the scene. In real life it has been alleged Manson, by himself, did this. However it is one of those things that cannot be proven. Or disproven for that matter. Though I think if "you can't disprove it" is the strength of the argument, there is no argument. But that is another discussion for another day. Suffice it to say that the show has chosen to take this rumor to heart and portray it, and using it as a chance to give special, fictional, snowflake Emma more to do. Frankly Emma's continued presence is what takes me out of the whole thing. She only exists as an excuse to connect Hodiak to Manson, which worked in season 1, but this season we are three episodes in, and Hodiak has yet to even give Manson a thought, let alone interact with him. So who needs Emma? There are plenty of interesting real life people in the Manson family who could be given some airtime. Squeaky Fromme for one. The previous versions of Helter Skelter have skimped on Squeaky. Not too sure about the other film versions of the Manson Family, like Manson's Lost Girls, but I know I would rather find out about Squeaky than Emma. Or Bobby Beausoliel, or Bruce Davis, or Leslie Van Houten. Edited June 18, 2016 by reggiejax 2 Link to comment
tennisgurl June 18, 2016 Share June 18, 2016 I am really confused about how this season is being distributed. I found the first episode online, but I do not see the other two. Were they shown live? Are they on the NBC website? I is confused! I watched the whole first season on Netflix last week, I finished the whole thing in two days, and I really liked it, so I am really excited to watch it "live" this summer. I love constant weariness of Hodiak, and DD is just so much fun to watch. I continue to worry for Charmain and Shafe, who are getting in deeper and deeper into the whole crazy crew. My love of the soundtrack of this show is never ending. I missed out on the 60s by a long shot (born in 1989) but I have always found it to be a really interesting decade, and the music is just wonderful. 1 Link to comment
shapeshifter June 18, 2016 Share June 18, 2016 3 hours ago, tennisgurl said: I am really confused about how this season is being distributed. I found the first episode online, but I do not see the other two. Were they shown live? Are they on the NBC website? I is confused! I watched the whole first season on Netflix last week, I finished the whole thing in two days, and I really liked it, so I am really excited to watch it "live" this summer. I love constant weariness of Hodiak, and DD is just so much fun to watch. I continue to worry for Charmain and Shafe, who are getting in deeper and deeper into the whole crazy crew. My love of the soundtrack of this show is never ending. I missed out on the 60s by a long shot (born in 1989) but I have always found it to be a really interesting decade, and the music is just wonderful. I'm glad you appreciate my generation's music, tennisgurl. I think you can view all three of the episodes that were broadcast the other day here: http://www.nbc.com/aquarius/episodes 1 Link to comment
Lostinthehouse June 18, 2016 Share June 18, 2016 The whole fictionalization of the Manson Family murders just pulls me out of the entire story. I finally watched the 2-hour episode today and almost instantly deleted it when the opening scene had Manson and this "Emma" person at the Cielo Drive crime scene. I'm glad I persisted for one reason only: David Duchovny. Whether Mulder or Hodiak, this guy's got it. Yeah, reggiejax, where is Squeaky Fromme? And they had better bring Leslie VanHouten in pretty darn quickly since she participated in the LaBianca murders - which, by the way, occurred the night following the Cielo Drive murders. I'll continue to DVR it and watch it until I can't stand any more fiction. I don't believe these heinous events need retelling since they are so well known and loathed by everyone. But a fictionalized accounting just seems to glamorize the whole thing, which is heinous in itself. Link to comment
kassygreene June 19, 2016 Share June 19, 2016 7 hours ago, tennisgurl said: I am really confused about how this season is being distributed. I found the first episode online, but I do not see the other two. Were they shown live? Are they on the NBC website? I is confused! I watched the whole first season on Netflix last week, I finished the whole thing in two days, and I really liked it, so I am really excited to watch it "live" this summer. I love constant weariness of Hodiak, and DD is just so much fun to watch. I continue to worry for Charmain and Shafe, who are getting in deeper and deeper into the whole crazy crew. My love of the soundtrack of this show is never ending. I missed out on the 60s by a long shot (born in 1989) but I have always found it to be a really interesting decade, and the music is just wonderful. The episode you found online (and you don't say who the ISP is) - is it more than 43 minutes long? Could you possibly have the version that matched Thurssday's broadcast? Both NBC & Comcast are offering the first three episodes separately, but others may vary. The music was good, but the last half of the sixties was often scary for me (born in '56). I lived in an university town, and I spent a lot of time fearing the inevitable riots (which, btw, never happened at that uni). 1 Link to comment
tennisgurl June 19, 2016 Share June 19, 2016 30 minutes ago, kassygreene said: The episode you found online (and you don't say who the ISP is) - is it more than 43 minutes long? Could you possibly have the version that matched Thurssday's broadcast? Both NBC & Comcast are offering the first three episodes separately, but others may vary. I found it on Xfinity, and it was 43 minutes long. I am just going to use the NBC link that shapeshifter kindly posted! 1 Link to comment
helenamonster June 19, 2016 Share June 19, 2016 Yeah, I hope they do some focus on Squeaky eventually, if not this season then in the future. She usually gets thrown into adaptations to check off the "this is the one that tried to kill President Ford" box, but she was kind of the de facto leader of the Family during the trial. Link to comment
izabella June 19, 2016 Share June 19, 2016 (edited) Sadie seems to take on the leader role, when Charlie isn't around. Or maybe she just does that with Emma? Anyway, she seems the most hostile of all the women. I turned 2 in 1969, and was born in Europe, so I really don't know much about Manson and his cult. Maybe I've grown jaded after growing up in South Side Chicago in the 80's when gang wars became a big thing in large cities, and in these days when mass murder shootings are unfortunately a regular occurrence in this country, but these Manson murders don't seem especially shocking. Tragic, yes. Shocking, less so. ETA: John Wayne Gacy, who raped and killed over 30 boys and young men and buried them under his house in the crawl space...those were was the shocking murders when I was a kid, and then Jeffrey Dahmer, who raped, murdered, and ate his 17 victims came along. Edited June 19, 2016 by izabella 3 Link to comment
thuganomics85 June 19, 2016 Share June 19, 2016 Finally got around to this. Man, three hours in a row? A lot to take in, but I enjoyed most of it. Kind of bummed that it looks like NBC won't be having it available to binge like they did last season, because this is one of those shows were I think it works better to see a few episodes in a row, and not have to wait a week or so for the next one. Off the top of my head: glad that Chairman is still alive, because I had worried that her cliffhanger last week was incase Claire Holt wouldn't be available with her other show, but I'm glad it seems to be working out for now. Her going undercover and getting even close to Roy though, means she is probably going to be even in more danger now. Shafe makes detective, but it looks like it is already putting a strain on his relationship with his wife. I hope all the talks about The Black Panthers means Bunky/Gaius Charles will be showing back up soon. Ken continues to be an impressive fuck-up, who manages to keep getting by. Hodiak is still a hoot, and I don't see what he sees in Grace. I was cracking up when she broke up with him and was going on about how bad he was, and all I could think was "Well... it's not like your current husband is much better, so maybe you should be yelling at yourself for your sucky tastes." about it. The stuff with the Mansons was kind of weird at first with them introducing that former cellmate of Charlie's, and neutering Charlie for a bit, until he struck back. But it seems like it is back to picking up now with them going to Dennis' house and the introduction of Tex. And those flash-forwards are certainly leading to a very bad time for most everyone. 2 Link to comment
txhorns79 June 20, 2016 Share June 20, 2016 Quote Shafe makes detective, but it looks like it is already putting a strain on his relationship with his wife. I hope all the talks about The Black Panthers means Bunky/Gaius Charles will be showing back up soon. I'm amazed the Panthers are continuing to associate with a woman who is married to a white cop. I would think that would hit all their buttons. 1 Link to comment
TattleTeeny June 20, 2016 Share June 20, 2016 Quote The whole fictionalization of the Manson Family murders just pulls me out of the entire story. I finally watched the 2-hour episode today and almost instantly deleted it when the opening scene had Manson and this "Emma" person at the Cielo Drive crime scene. I'm glad I persisted for one reason only: David Duchovny. Whether Mulder or Hodiak, this guy's got it. I find that, with shows mixing truth and fiction, I would prefer that they leave the fiction only to the parts we don't generally know--sort of like filling in blanks in a sense--and leave the facts as the facts. I can't articulate very well what I mean, but I agree with your first sentence so much! I felt like this while reading The Other Boleyn Girl and watching The Tudors or The Borgias. I'm sure, in this instance, I feel it even more because I've been fascinated by the Manson case since I was 12 and found my mom's copy of Helter Skelter. I kind of equate it to Rob Zombie's Halloween--he didn't change the existing story so much as he filled in blanks and expanded on the original, which, while awesome, was also stark in terms of who, what, why, etc. Also, yes to your last sentence too! He's always fabulous! Link to comment
OpieTaylor June 22, 2016 Share June 22, 2016 On 6/16/2016 at 8:30 PM, LakeGal said: I enjoyed that they showed the Dateline episode before Aquarius tonight. It was eerie they started the show with a scene from Sharon Tate's house that looked just like the real photos we had just seen when Keith Morrison was showing them. I learned on Dateline that Charles Manson was a small, short man. In the real photos, he looked so little. Hard to reconcile that with the power he had over all those followers. Link to comment
shapeshifter June 22, 2016 Share June 22, 2016 1 hour ago, OpieTaylor said: I learned on Dateline that Charles Manson was a small, short man. In the real photos, he looked so little. Hard to reconcile that with the power he had over all those followers. Like Napoleon. Also, he managed to survive prison, which probably taught him a thing or two about manipulation. 2 Link to comment
Anela June 23, 2016 Share June 23, 2016 I'm just starting to watch this, as well. I mean, this season. I watched five episodes last year, and gave up. I found it on-demand, because my DVR was full, and only showed 43 minutes of recording. Link to comment
helenamonster June 23, 2016 Share June 23, 2016 On 6/19/2016 at 11:29 AM, izabella said: I turned 2 in 1969, and was born in Europe, so I really don't know much about Manson and his cult. Maybe I've grown jaded after growing up in South Side Chicago in the 80's when gang wars became a big thing in large cities, and in these days when mass murder shootings are unfortunately a regular occurrence in this country, but these Manson murders don't seem especially shocking. Tragic, yes. Shocking, less so. ETA: John Wayne Gacy, who raped and killed over 30 boys and young men and buried them under his house in the crawl space...those were was the shocking murders when I was a kid, and then Jeffrey Dahmer, who raped, murdered, and ate his 17 victims came along. I think at the time that the murders happened it was very shocking because this was long before Manson-esque psychos started appearing on shows like Criminal Minds every week. The brutality of the murders, and their sheer randomness (there was absolutely no link between anyone at the Tate house or the LaBiancas, and people in LA were freaked that they could be next), was very and new and very scary. Also, I think once it was revealed who the killers were, people were thrown for even more of a loop. I remember talking to my nana about the murders, and she said the most shocking part was that Atkins, Krenwinkel, and Van Houten all looked like the girl who lived up the street that you asked to babysit your kids on Saturday nights. Their "wholesome, all-American girl" appearances contrasted with the savagery they were capable of was deeply disturbing to the American public at the time. People didn't generally believe that young women could commit crimes like that before these murders. But the reason I think these murders have endured in the national conscience almost 50 years later is that the whole saga of the Family is so unbelievably bizarre. Killers like Gacy and Dahmer obviously had higher body counts (and were arguably even more depraved in their methods), but we kind of "understand" serial killers in a psychological sense. They terrify us but we generally get what makes them tick, and at their core they're all very similar. There hasn't been a crime that even comes close to the complexity of the Tate-LaBianca murders in the past 50 years. I certainly wouldn't consider the murders shocking by today's standards, but they're endlessly fascinating in their own unique way. 4 Link to comment
GodsBeloved June 23, 2016 Share June 23, 2016 On June 19, 2016 at 8:26 PM, txhorns79 said: I'm amazed the Panthers are continuing to associate with a woman who is married to a white cop. I would think that would hit all their buttons. Kristin only volunteers at their breakfast program. She isn't a Black Panther so I wonder just how much they know about her personal life. 1 Link to comment
Recommended Posts