S04.E10: The Last Ship

[green]

Rollo won this in a big way. Live to die in a shithole or live where you can create your legacy. What culture stands now? Certainly not one by the Vikings. Paris came out quite well.

If the show is following history, we are about to see some very nasty stuff from Ivan the boneless. Probably some pretty grotesque things, which is one reason I despise the savagery society of the Vikings.

Watching the battle scene, Rollo definately saved Ragnar and also called off the attack to let them go. He knew he accomplished the defense of Rome and it was "mission accomplished".

No we turn back to Wessex. Oh how nasty that is going to be.

 

Ivar, NOT Ivan.  He isn't Russian.  Sorry, don't mean to "shout" but someone else mentioned this above and we are still getting Ivan every time.  And a lone, individual psychopath isn't just native to Scandinavia in the 800's.

 

The Christians of that day were just as savage at times and often with each other as well as they warred one against the other.  And also more hypocritical because their teachings were suppose to be based on love, mercy and forgiveness.  The Vikings were raised with battle glory as their highest virtue and only real path to their heaven world so they were at least living up to their cultural standard.

 

What culture stands today?  If you mean England today?  Well that would be a meld of Saxon and Viking actually.  And the Viking strand comes from two directions via both Ragnar and Rollo.

 

The whole idea of the show's "meta" story arc is the meeting of two cultures which happens throughout history.  And wherever this has happened throughout the world and down the ages it usually follows the pattern we see here:

 

1. A few far seeing people in these cultures show interest and curiosity (Ragnar, Ecbert, Athelstan) while others (Floki, Athelwulf) distrust the "other" immediately and hate the whole other people because they feel them a threat to their nice little cultural/religious rut of their lands and fear change.

 

2.  Something always seems to happen to let the haters hate and have their way.  Fear is like a disease running the course of mankind age after age.  Incidents, personalities what or whoever stop the peaceful growth of the two cultures and wars and savagery on BOTH sides takes hold.

 

3.  It takes a long and bloody time but finally the two cultures start to seep into each other and they get melded and folded together producing a sum bigger than their original parts.

 

That is so much what history is all about.  And what this show is all about.  And though the process is long and bloody and brutal; in the end anyone not willing to integrate cultures that have run into each other will be left behind in the ashes of history no matter what people thought of them back in their day.

Edited April 24, 2016 by green
Spoiler tags

[formerlyfreedom]

A reminder - please take discussion of actual history out of the episode topic. See this note for the explanation. Thank you.

[Guest]

Ivar, Ivar, bo-bivar
Banana-fana fo-fivar
Fee-fi-mo-mivar
Ivar!

 

heh

[millennium]

I believe though in the big history sweepstakes

Rollo wins handily over Ragnar - IMO Ragnar, who died in a snake pit and may actually historically be more legend than real can't compare to Rollo who started a powerful line that continues to this day and has influenced European history for centuries. Normandy became significant really quick after being given to Rollo.

 

Except he's not that Rollo.

[magdalene]

 

Except he's not that Rollo

Replying in the history thread....

[LilyoftheValley]

Well I know I am a little late to the party here, but I liked the time jump.  I thought it made perfect sense in the arc of the story, and quite frankly, Rollo and Ragnar were bordering on a spy versus spy plot if the story did not move on to something else.  In most shows I watch I do not like so many new characters and killing off old ones, but I think that Vikings does it very, very well and it fits in perfectly with the main theme of the story, which so many television shows like.  Vikings is not really about badass vikings conquering the world; it's about everything you lose on the quest for power and wealth. This show has a true emotional heart, which is shocking to me because most shows that focus heavily on battles and violence totally neglect that part.  

 

I am glad that the story is going to shift more to Ragnar's grown sons.  I think it will be more interesting than watching Ragnar go on yet another journey to get all those things he thinks will make him finally satisfied but that never do.  Now we can see how Ragnar handles dealing with the sons he wanted more than nothing else, barely raised, abandoned, yet who will expect to be great leaders and warriors (just 'cause!).  

 

On a side note I wish Ragnar would have had some daughters (like he did in real life).  It could have added an extra dimension to the show that I think would have been interesting.  

Edited April 24, 2016 by LilyoftheValley

[green]

Well I know I am a little late to the party here, but I liked the time jump.  I thought it made perfect sense in the arc of the story, and quite frankly, Rollo and Ragnar were bordering on a spy versus spy plot if the story did not move on to something else.  In most shows I watch I do not like so many new characters and killing off old ones, but I think that Vikings does it very, very well and it fits in perfectly with the main theme of the story, which so many television shows like.  Vikings is not really about badass vikings conquering the world; it's about everything you lose on the quest for power and wealth. This show has a true emotional heart, which is shocking to me because most shows that focus heavily on battles and violence totally neglect that part.  

 

I am glad that the story is going to shift more to Ragnar's grown sons.  I think it will be more interesting than watching Ragnar go on yet another journey to get all those things he thinks will make him finally satisfied but that never do.  Now we can see how Ragnar handles dealing with the sons he wanted more than nothing else, barely raised, abandoned, yet who will expect to be great leaders and warriors (just 'cause!).  

 

On a side note I wish Ragnar would have had some daughters (like he did in real life).  It could have added an extra dimension to the show that I think would have been interesting.  

 

About daughters.  Well they did have Gyda in Season 1.  And his conversation by the water addressed to her after she died is still one of the most moving scenes in the whole series.  That scene can be seen on YouTube here and concludes with one of the most famous lines from the series ... "I will stroke your long and beautiful hair again with my peasant hands."

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihU0E3ptOSk&noredirect=1

Edited April 24, 2016 by green

[jnymph]

Ugh.

Underwhelming mid season finale if you ask me.

I'm tired of the Vikings repeatedly going back to Paris & getting their asses handed to them; whilst nobody ages much in the interim. Wouldn't it take a decade or 2 to rebuild armies & ships????

I found it hard to care about the Boys of Lothbrook. And The Real Housewife of Kattegut Aslaug.

And No one cares about little Siggy? Wish Bjorn would shown some mild interest in his only child.

The first 2 seasons were phenomenal

[Captanne]

OMG, green.

 

The video of Ragnar saying farewell to Gyda is followed by his farewell to Athelstan.  I think we can mark death of loved ones as a point of great significance for Ragnar -- and the death of Athelstan as an actual pivot point.  He's never been the same.   (At least for me -- the lack of Athelstan's council has led to these sieges of Paris which don't go well.  The irony is that it's Athelstan who brought news of Paris to Ragnar in the first place.)

[Nukester]

Without this becoming a spoiler, how close is this series following factual history?

[Nukester]

Ivar, NOT Ivan.  He isn't Russian.  Sorry, don't mean to "shout" but someone else mentioned this above and we are still getting Ivan every time.  And a lone, individual psychopath isn't just native to Scandinavia in the 800's.

 
I think it's the auto spellcheck kicking in. It kicks my ass on this iPad. Ivar seems to always get turned to Ivan

Other than that, great post

[Nukester]

Another question. What ever happened to pimp Hubbard? Is he dead?

[formerlyfreedom]

Without this becoming a spoiler, how close is this series following factual history?

 

Nukester, check out this topic - that is where discussion about actual history vs the show is happening.

[Ohwell]

Another question. What ever happened to pimp Hubbard? Is he dead?

Probably just skipping out on child support. 

Edited April 24, 2016 by Ohwell

[green]

 

I think it's the auto spellcheck kicking in. It kicks my ass on this iPad. Ivar seems to always get turned to Ivan

Other than that, great post

 

Ah okay.  "Smart" keyboards on cell phones are a pain too.

 

I second saoirse's link to that thread.  Come join us.

Edited April 24, 2016 by green

[LiveenLetLive]

Ratings were really good for this season and the show has already been renewed so I am happy about that, but Fimmel at least deserves some acting honors, the man is terrific as Ragnar.

[Raachel2008]

I hate the Parisian cast.   They come off effete, phony and weak

 

 

I wonder if that was in the writing or it was a directing kind of decision: they just look weak or corward all the fucking time and we know that the Franks were weak  or they wouldn't have survived, Rollo or no Rollo. It is plain stupid, and it weakens the *show*. Agreed on Morgaine, though, not a good actress, at least not the right casting there. But I guess that last name worked wonder during her audition, assuming she had one.

 

I think we are almost done with Rollo and the Franks, not only Rollo's arc is done, but Clive Standen has a new show. 

 

The time jumps are what will drive me away from this show. Lagertha, Auslaug, Bjorn, Helga, Ragnar, Rollo, they all look the same, yet now all the "kids" are looking around 18/20 y-old. It was stupid when Bjorn went from cute kid to six-pack Alexander Ludwig, is is even more stupid now.

 

What was really missing during the Rollo/Ragnar fight was some much needed "talk".

[TobinAlbers]

Can't help it but victorious Rollo returning home to the cheers of the crowd and the happy waiting arms of his wife made me happy for the lug. Unfortunately, I think this will be his personal pinnacle and he will now go down the same journey of longing for the old, better days before he made the grab for power like Ragnar. Sure he may go on to much great political success, but emotionally and psychologically Rollo is now going to be constantly looking over his shoulder for enemies, constantly having to save the city and prove himself to the Emperor and his wife. For some reason I really think this moment he will remember as the happiest of his life even if it was the day he said goodbye forever to his brother and the Viking any of life.

Boy howdy did those Franks decimate the Vikings. Rollo may have been predicatable in his attack, but his side's power over the Viking's fury won the day.

Interesting that Magnus is now a key pawn in all of this. The Lothbrok brothers were all interested in the news. Will it be that Ragnar and Co. go to Wessex to retrieve the brother and use him as a means of a foothold in Mercia or just go to Wessex to take out Ecbert.

I'm kind of bummed we don't get to see Aethelwulf's reaction to Kwenthrith's death or that she was pregnant with his child. According to her only Ecbert and later Judith knew. Obviously neither would be inclined to tell him she was pregnant and definitely not that Judith killed her although he'd definitely know that her death was orchestrated to cement Ecbert's hold on the crown. However, I do wonder if Aethelwulf would've taken Magnus under his wing to honor his connection with Kwenthrith. Interested to see what's what in Wessex later this year.

[BitterApple]

The time jumps are what will drive me away from this show. Lagertha, Auslaug, Bjorn, Helga, Ragnar, Rollo, they all look the same, yet now all the "kids" are looking around 18/20 y-old. It was stupid when Bjorn went from cute kid to six-pack Alexander Ludwig, is is even more stupid

I know. For people living in a harsh Scandinavian climate in the dredges of the Dark Ages, they're remarkably smooth skinned and wrinkle free. They've aged Ragnar pretty well, but everyone else looks the same. Kattegat must've had one hell of a dermatologist.

[SingleMaltBlonde]

I know. For people living in a harsh Scandinavian climate in the dredges of the Dark Ages, they're remarkably smooth skinned and wrinkle free. They've aged Ragnar pretty well, but everyone else looks the same. Kattegat must've had one hell of a dermatologist.

Maybe she's born with it or maybe it's Maybelline...or Neutrogena.

[Captanne]

The more I think about it, the more I think this last episode made a tactical error by not showing us what came of Lagertha.  On another thread, (praising Fimmel's acting, as it happens), I noticed that Ragnar's turning points seem to be at the death of someone important to him.  Namely, the incredibly moving farewell scene to his daughter, Gyda, who dies of plague early on.  And again, the death of Athelstan seems to have been a pivotal change in Ragnar's life.  (It's only after Athelstan's death that he starts making very bad tactical decisions, results in deep injury, which results in his addiction.)  

 

I immediately assumed Lagertha had died in the battle at Paris because of Ragnar's ensuing sabbatical for six years.  I've read here that Lagertha lived -- which, if true, leaves Ragnar's hiatus un-explained.

[millennium]

The big battle ended up being as intense as I expected, even if I kind of knew where it was heading.  As powerful as the Vikings are, it just feels like the Franks have the home-field advantage, and in particular, Rollo just seems to be several steps ahead of Ragnar, and it cost them. 

 

Ragnar was thinking with his heart, not his head.   Not to mention his head was pretty messed up on drugs.    It seemed to me the battle was Ragnar's to lose, and he did.    The Vikings had the element of surprise and they struck so fiercely that the Franks initially wanted to retreat.   Maybe a better coordinated attack -- one predicated on more than a drug-fueled "Let's get that traitorous bastard Rollo!" -- would have succeeded. 

[millennium]

The more I think about it, the more I think this last episode made a tactical error by not showing us what came of Lagertha.  On another thread, (praising Fimmel's acting, as it happens), I noticed that Ragnar's turning points seem to be at the death of someone important to him.  Namely, the incredibly moving farewell scene to his daughter, Gyda, who dies of plague early on.  And again, the death of Athelstan seems to have been a pivotal change in Ragnar's life.  (It's only after Athelstan's death that he starts making very bad tactical decisions, results in deep injury, which results in his addiction.)  

 

I immediately assumed Lagertha had died in the battle at Paris because of Ragnar's ensuing sabbatical for six years.  I've read here that Lagertha lived -- which, if true, leaves Ragnar's hiatus un-explained.

 

Just a thought on this, with reference to the historical Ragnar:

 

It's possible the "death" in this instance may have been Ragnar's own.   There is a version of the historical Ragnar's death that says he died of cholera and injuries after a siege on Paris.   I'm sure the writers know this.    In Vikings, Ragnar's disappearance after the defeat may be a symbolic death of the old drug-addled Ragnar, while his return may signal a rebirth of sorts.  

Edited April 25, 2016 by millennium

[BitterApple]

I think Ragnar needed to be off his game because the Vikings had to lose in Paris. That's the way it played out in reality and people would've lost their shit if Hirst deviated that dramatically from the historical record. The drug withdrawal angle was the perfect way to make that happen.

Ragnar wasn't thinking with a clear head, nobody stepped up to challenge his authority and the group took a hit as a result.

[millennium]

I think Ragnar needed to be off his game because the Vikings had to lose in Paris. That's the way it played out in reality and people would've lost their shit if Hirst deviated that dramatically from the historical record. The drug withdrawal angle was the perfect way to make that happen.

Ragnar wasn't thinking with a clear head, nobody stepped up to challenge his authority and the group took a hit as a result.

 

I really wanted to see Paris burn though.   I know the history, still I was encouraged by Ragnar's portage strategy which I simply loved, as improbable as it may have seemed.

[BitterApple]

I really wanted to see Paris burn though. I know the history, still I was encouraged by Ragnar's portage strategy which I simply loved, as improbable as it may have seemed.

I hear you. It could've been epic. I was just commenting based on what I read on the Vikings FB page. There's a lot of purists over there who stroke out every time the show doesn't follow history down to the letter.

Edited April 26, 2016 by BitterApple

[cmr2014]

Can't help it but victorious Rollo returning home to the cheers of the crowd and the happy waiting arms of his wife made me happy for the lug. Unfortunately, I think this will be his personal pinnacle and he will now go down the same journey of longing for the old, better days before he made the grab for power like Ragnar. Sure he may go on to much great political success, but emotionally and psychologically Rollo is now going to be constantly looking over his shoulder for enemies, constantly having to save the city and prove himself to the Emperor and his wife. For some reason I really think this moment he will remember as the happiest of his life even if it was the day he said goodbye forever to his brother and the Viking any of life.

 

I think that the one of the big points of Ragnar's return was that we are supposed to remember that he didn't "seek" power. If the Earl had allowed him the opportunities to explore to the west, he would have jumped at the offer and given away most of the plunder. King Horick was power-hungry and used passive-aggressive tactics to try to defeat Ragnar until he felt compelled to resort to overt aggression, and then Ragnar was forced to take him out.

 

I don't think Ragnar was ever interested in power -- he's interested in knowledge. When he returned to Kattekat, he offered the sword -- first to his sons, and then to anyone in Kattekat -- and no one wanted to touch it.

 

In one of the earlier drug-fueled scenes, he's looking back on his life to the time when he was happy -- a farmer living with Lagertha and his son and daughter, and his whole life lies ahead of him. Now, he has power, a heartless wife, and a bunch of non-descript sons. He played his best game in Wessex and was betrayed by Ecbert He tried again in Francia and was betrayed again, this time by Rollo who he has saved over and over again.

 

On another note, I think that the Chinese woman was poisoning Ragnar on the orders of Auslag. I initially thought that we were supposed to kind of think that she was giving him opium, but that makes no sense. Opium poppies don't grow in Scandinavia, and she would have no way to know the medicinal properties of the local herbs. It makes much more sense that Auslag taught her how to make some sort of concoction to feed to Ragnar, and promised her something valuable in return.

Edited April 26, 2016 by cmr2014

[green]

On 4/26/2016 at 2:26 AM, cmr2014 said:

 

I think that the one of the big points of Ragnar's return was that we are supposed to remember that he didn't "seek" power. If the Earl had allowed him the opportunities to explore to the west, he would have jumped at the offer and given away most of the plunder. King Horick was power-hungry and used passive-aggressive tactics to try to defeat Ragnar until he felt compelled to resort to overt aggression, and then Ragnar was forced to take him out.

 

I don't think Ragnar was ever interested in power -- he's interested in knowledge. When he returned to Kattekat, he offered the sword -- first to his sons, and then to anyone in Kattekat -- and no one wanted to touch it.

 

In one of the earlier drug-fueled scenes, he's looking back on his life to the time when he was happy -- a farmer living with Lagertha and his son and daughter, and his whole life lies ahead of him. Now, he has power, a heartless wife, and a bunch of non-descript sons. He played his best game in Wessex and was betrayed by Ecbert He tried again in Francia and was betrayed again, this time by Rollo who he has saved over and over again.

 

On another note, I think that the Chinese woman was poisoning Ragnar on the orders of Auslag. I initially thought that we were supposed to kind of think that she was giving him opium, but that makes no sense. Opium poppies don't grow in Scandinavia, and she would have no way to know the medicinal properties of the local herbs. It makes much more sense that Auslag taught her how to make some sort of concoction to feed to Ragnar, and promised her something valuable in return.

 

I agree with your post about Ragnar not seeking power.  That was the whole point with Ragnar being a protagonist in many ways.  He did seek saga-like fame in battle early on and especially knowledge.  But unlike all the other rulers or would be rulers in this show; he never sought power.  Power seemed to flow to him on it's own through others actions.  He pointed that out some in his speech before the sucessful attack on Paris when he told everyone to shut up.  He was king not because he wanted to be king or asked to be king.  But he was king now and he would lead as was his duty so put a sock in it already, hah.

Anyway a brilliant summation cmr2014. 

 

But I have to respectfully disagree with the last paragraph regards Yidu.  She gave him betel nuts.  That was why you saw the red on his teeth and at times dripping down his chin.  And it had nothing to do with Aslaug since Aslaug doesn't even know what betel nuts are. 

 

It is now happily post-Yidu time so no longer a spoiler.  In an interview with showrunner Michael Hirst he said the orginal storyline was suppose to be a Ragnar-Yidu romance but we can thank Travis Fimmel talking Hirst out of that.  Fimmel apparently told Hirst that he didn't feel that Ragnar would be interested in some spring-autumn romance at that time of his life.  What he needed was a close, trusted friend like Athelstan had been he could confide in.  Yidu, for her part apparently, wanted to keep Ragnar close to her and kept him on the betel nuts longer than medically needed for his wounds until she had him hooked.  Why she wanted to keep him "close to her"  Hirst didn't explain this phrase further maybe since it makes little sense.  So no wonder people keep trying to read something logical into this when there just wasn't any logic to the whole thing it seems. 

 

I had no idea about any of this myself until I read the interview.  So what I see after readin git is that they were kind of tweaking that storyline on the fly so I think that was why it made so little sense in the end.  Sometimes we forget making a show is such a collaborative process and things do get changed on the fly and not all holes are filled in perfectly.  But anyway, nowhere does Hirst mention that Aslaug was involved in any of it.

[Captanne]

Like Ragnar, I was happy to (figuratively, in my case) strangle Yidu to get her off our screen and out of our lives.  That was a strangely gratifying scene on a lot of levels.  

 

(I have to be honest, I'm having a really hard time with this drab new format.  I can't tell what's new and what isn't, and navigation is impossible.  I feel blind, stumbling around in a fog of grays and whites and outlines.  Until I can crawl along finding the string I left behind in this marker-less labyrinth, I'll probably not post as much as I did simply because I can't.) 

[Ohwell]

1 hour ago, Captanne said:

(I have to be honest, I'm having a really hard time with this drab new format.  I can't tell what's new and what isn't, and navigation is impossible.  I feel blind, stumbling around in a fog of grays and whites and outlines.  Until I can crawl along finding the string I left behind in this marker-less labyrinth, I'll probably not post as much as I did simply because I can't.) 

I don't post as much either.  Everything just feels so -- off. 

[Nukester]

I use my iPad, and these forums are terrible.  Can't find direct replies and you have to scroll so much!   It really is an odd forum program they are using

[Captanne]

Weird -- I exclusively use my laptop or desktop.  I just assumed it was awful for me because it was being designed for mobile technology.  But, a lot of hard work is going into the re-design so I'm sure they know what they are doing.

 

Okay, that's off topic.  I apologize.

Edited April 30, 2016 by Captanne

[formerlyfreedom]

Please stick to episode talk in here. Thank you.

[pootlus]

Can anyone point me to a site with young/older pictures of Ragnar's sons by Aslaug? Ivar is obvious, and I thought that I had the others figured but apparently not.  I didn't realise that the one who looks like Erlunder is Sigurd (which is disappointing because as soon as I saw him I thought "looks too much like Erlunder, needs to die" and I like Sigurd).

The aging up of the men while the women remain ageless is just getting weird. Surely Ragnar, Aslaug, Lagertha (because she survived, dammit) and Floki are all fifty-ish after this latest jump, and Helga can't be far behind?  I can buy that age for the two men but not the women (in fact the makeup on Fimmel has been excellent).

Damn the show for making Floki likeable again!  I swore I'd never like the weasel again after he killed Athelstan. Looking forward to the expedition to the med with Bjorn, Floki and Helga (and presumably Torvi).

I think I'm done with Paris now.  Be happy if they let Rollo (who also seems to have not aged) go off to his historical future and leave us with the Vikings and the English (who I can't give up because Linus Roache is awesome, plus I want to see Alfred grow up).

Wonder which of Ragnar's sons will pick up the sword - Ivar looked to be the only one with the guts.  Perhaps the historical future of Ragnar

Spoiler

being killed by being thrown into a pit of vipers (which sounds daft) will be metaphorical, and the vipers will be his sons...

Part of me hopes that Ragnar makes it to the end of the show - as much as I like Bjorn (and the actor has done a terrific job in mimicing his screen father's mannerisms), the show wouldn't be the same without Fimmel who I agree with LiveenLetLive needs to start getting some acting awards. How he didn't for his eulogy to Athelstan last year is still something of a mystery.

[green]

pootlus, Ubbe is the one with the beard cause he is the oldest.  The second son with the weird to me spelled name I can't pronounce either looks like the oldest one but with no beard.  Once he gets old enough to grow one I will be clueless about those two again.

I can't find how to "like" posts in this format so give you all "likes" by saying it here.  I'm sure they will have a way eventually; they are still tweaking it.  I see the ability to bold is back again so it is a work in process.   (Can't wait until they tweak away these silly cartoon bubbles and make our posts look adult again).

[formerlyfreedom]

1 hour ago, green said:

I can't find how to "like" posts in this format so give you all "likes" by saying it here.

The heart symbol is the new "like," FYI.

[Nukester]

13 hours ago, pootlus said:

Damn the show for making Floki likeable again!  I swore I'd never like the weasel again after he killed Athelstan. Looking forward to the expedition to the med with Bjorn, Floki and Helga (and presumably Torvi).

I think I'm done with Paris now.  Be happy if they let Rollo (who also seems to have not aged) go off to his historical future and leave us with the Vikings and the English (who I can't give up because Linus Roache is awesome, plus I want to see Alfred grow up).

Oh not to worry.  Floki will not seem so nice soon enough.  Not much to like about that twerp. 

I believe they are done with Rollo for the most part.  He won and deserves it.  Besides things point to the story returning to England.   Ragnar has a score to settle.  

[EighteenTwelve]

Does anyone know where I can find a picture of Floki from the end of this episode, so I can figure out what the runes on the side of his head say?  It starts with "Loki" but I couldn't get anything else.

[Harald Hardrada]

On ‎3‎/‎5‎/‎2016 at 10:39 AM, green said:

pootlus, Ubbe is the one with the beard cause he is the oldest.  The second son with the weird to me spelled name I can't pronounce either looks like the oldest one but with no beard.  Once he gets old enough to grow one I will be clueless about those two again.

I can't find how to "like" posts in this format so give you all "likes" by saying it here.  I'm sure they will have a way eventually; they are still tweaking it.  I see the ability to bold is back again so it is a work in process.   (Can't wait until they tweak away these silly cartoon bubbles and make our posts look adult again).

LOL  I couldn't tell them by their name except for Ivar due to his wagon.

[Babalooie]

Ubbe kind of has short spiky hair.  Hvitserk's hair is parted down the middle.  Sigurd is the blonde.  We all know Ivar, as you said.  Hope this helps.

[green]

Thanks, Babalooie.  Still can't give a thumbs up or whatever it is now called on here.  In some threads I see the icon to do that but not here or on other threads.  This site is still really dicey.  I get a pop-up every time I come here that I keep saying I don't want to see.  Something about "pushing" something to me.  Liked the old look better.  Sorry but I liked the way I could go to someone quoting me to see what they said etc way better than this no option format.  On Vikings in the off season that isn't too much of a problem but active shows I just will be avoiding now I guess.  And I really hate the cartoon bubble look.

[BitterApple]

I'm still not sure how Ivar ended up with black hair considering his parents are both blondes, but um, okay. I guess Hirst wanted him to stand apart from his brothers, which I get, but IMO, he's not remotely believable as Ragnar and Aslaug's son.

[Babalooie]

BITTERAPPLE, I had a Danish neighbor with brown-haired children and I asked him if that was common, and he said that it was.  We always see the blonde Scandinavian stereotypes on television and in movies.   We can assume that Ivar got the hair from a few generations back on either side.  I have one son 5'8" and one 6'6"  -  same two parents.

Edited May 28, 2016 by Babalooie

[mccartygirl]

Am I the only one who wants to see Bjorn and Rollo go at it? Bjorn used to bug but I love his arc now. 

[Fishslap]

On 4/25/2016 at 0:39 PM, Captanne said:

The more I think about it, the more I think this last episode made a tactical error by not showing us what came of Lagertha.  On another thread, (praising Fimmel's acting, as it happens), I noticed that Ragnar's turning points seem to be at the death of someone important to him.  Namely, the incredibly moving farewell scene to his daughter, Gyda, who dies of plague early on.  And again, the death of Athelstan seems to have been a pivotal change in Ragnar's life.  (It's only after Athelstan's death that he starts making very bad tactical decisions, results in deep injury, which results in his addiction.)  

 

I immediately assumed Lagertha had died in the battle at Paris because of Ragnar's ensuing sabbatical for six years.  I've read here that Lagertha lived -- which, if true, leaves Ragnar's hiatus un-explained.

In a sense you could say that Rollo died I suppose. At least the one who was Ragnar's brother.

 

On 4/25/2016 at 8:07 PM, BitterApple said:

I hear you. It could've been epic. I was just commenting based on what I read on the Vikings FB page. There's a lot of purists over there who stroke out every time the show doesn't follow history down to the letter.

Well this is the wrong show for them then. Just the fact that Lindisfarne was attacked in 793 and the siege of Paris took place in 845 should have driven purists away a long time ago. Unless of course we pretend that Ragnar and Rollo were in their late 60s while attacking Paris.

 

On 4/25/2016 at 5:57 PM, millennium said:

 

Ragnar was thinking with his heart, not his head.   Not to mention his head was pretty messed up on drugs.    It seemed to me the battle was Ragnar's to lose, and he did.    The Vikings had the element of surprise and they struck so fiercely that the Franks initially wanted to retreat.   Maybe a better coordinated attack -- one predicated on more than a drug-fueled "Let's get that traitorous bastard Rollo!" -- would have succeeded. 

Well there is also of course the historical fact that Rollo, or Gange-Rolf as he became known, was effectively the first Duke of Normandy and that his great great great grandson was William the Conqueror. Rollo had to win the battle so he could reproduce at least.

[benteen]

I wasn't quite sure where to put this but two days ago I picked up the first issue of Vikings Uprising #1.  I missed the articles on this a few months ago but it tells the story of what happened after Ragnar returned from Paris and before the eight year time jump in this finale.  Lagertha is the main character.  It's very good.

[Kalliste]

I'm so sad to be up to date! What will I watch now?

I didn't mind this episode, the Rollo/Ragnar fight ended up pretty much how you'd expect. Rollo has been living the high life, healthy and not injured meanwhile Ragnar's been living rough and addicted. It would have been better if there wasn't so much fist fighting between them, I found that got old pretty quickly.

And I agree, why was there no cut to Lagertha! Boo show!

Aslaug I could have done without, I was hoping she wouldn't be around anymore, especially if Ragnar was MIA. She just had that smug look the whole time, ugh. Why didn't Bjorn take over and kick her to the kerb.

And agree that the sons all have a sketchy look about them. Like they could pounce at any second.

[LOA-maker]

how many years is it since the series opener? is it 30? I'm surprised that the Seer is still alive at that point, orthere isn't a new Seer.

Also who was King in Ragnar's absence? somebody had to be, and wouldn't he be committing some sin if he deserted and went back?

[LOA-maker]

On 4/25/2016 at 7:28 PM, BitterApple said:

I think Ragnar needed to be off his game because the Vikings had to lose in Paris. That's the way it played out in reality and people would've lost their shit if Hirst deviated that dramatically from the historical record. The drug withdrawal angle was the perfect way to make that happen.

Ragnar wasn't thinking with a clear head, nobody stepped up to challenge his authority and the group took a hit as a result.

I empathise more with Rollo than Ragnar now. in season one with Jarl Borg, Rollo was wrong. Now, Ragnar is wrong. Rollo is older and wants to lead. he should have made him an Earl somewhere or got him to lead a special fleet of ships to raid other lands. Ragnar was right to feel betrayed, but that doesn't undermine Rollo's need for fame too. it's what Norsemen do and want.