S02.E09: Episode 9

[ToukieSmith]

I think that's a good point.  But in a society that values the individual over the collective, isn't it human nature to protect yourself and your family?  Wouldn't it be suicide not to do so?  If you're in a society that values the collective, then it's probably easier to do the right thing.

 

I agree.  As I watch this show, I have thought about how terrible these people have acted, but then again, I don't think I would do anything different than they did to be honest.  I would like to think that I would do right by people, but I don't think I have met the circumstance that has truly tested me yet.

Edited March 3, 2016 by ToukieSmith

[represent]

 

I think this is a big oversimplification.  There's nothing that would ever justify rape, which is what Eric is suspected of.  There are all kinds of legal lesser degrees of murder.  Taylor was drugged against his will, raped, bullied relentlessly, beaten up by four guys, and then roughed up and threatened by one of his abusers.  Therefore, he was actually attacked three times by the same person/people.  Taylor most likely has PTSD, and was hallucinating.  We assume that Taylor went to the school to shoot the four people on his list, but he definitely rejected that impulse and was leaving school property when he was accosted.  With all of the ridiculous "stand your ground" laws that exist, this is one of the few instances where I don't have a problem with a shooting justified as self-defense.  And we don't really know if Taylor planned on pulling the trigger - the scene was filmed ambiguously.

I agree with every word.

[stagmania]

I was on board last week with the switch to the focus on the shooting, but now I just feel lost in this narrative. There are too many disparate threads, and they're not coming together for me. A lot of the side plots from earlier in the season feel like pointless diversions now, and this episode pulled too many 180s on characters to make them suddenly hatable. I don't really understand what I'm supposed to be taking from this, other than everyone is awful and no one gets any kind of justice.

[izabella]

I don't even get how Eric with a coach standing right in front of him was allowed to leave the school without the school day legally being over. I know from even my own high school experience that sometimes, depending on your program from year to year, certain students do officially end their days earlier than others and yes, can legally leave the premises. But that didn't seem to be the case in this scene with Eric.

 

I think we were seeing them at basketball practice, which is usually after school hours.

[Woebegone]

I think this is a big oversimplification.  There's nothing that would ever justify rape, which is what Eric is suspected of.  There are all kinds of legal lesser degrees of murder.  Taylor was drugged against his will, raped, bullied relentlessly, beaten up by four guys, and then roughed up and threatened by one of his abusers.  Therefore, he was actually attacked three times by the same person/people.  Taylor most likely has PTSD, and was hallucinating.  We assume that Taylor went to the school to shoot the four people on his list, but he definitely rejected that impulse and was leaving school property when he was accosted.  With all of the ridiculous "stand your ground" laws that exist, this is one of the few instances where I don't have a problem with a shooting justified as self-defense.  And we don't really know if Taylor planned on pulling the trigger - the scene was filmed ambiguously.

 

I think there are a few mitigating scenarios for rape from a moral standpoint, if not necessarily a legal one. If both partners were equally intoxicated for example or if one party didn't know or fully understand that the other party wasn't able to consent.

 

But let's look at it from another angle. Say we were introduced to Taylor much earlier in the timeline, before the party so that the only thing we knew about him was that he was cheating on Evy and was even planning on taking her to a party so he can cheat on her there. Is there any justification for his behaviour then? A lot of people think she's awful because she won't let it go, but I don't think that what he did to her should be forgotten just because he was raped in the same way that I don't think that what Eric did to Taylor should be forgotten just because his mom is awful.

[jb1183]

Evy can be a bit much at times and I think the actress overacts a tad, but I don't fault her for still holding a lot of anger at Taylor, even with all that's happened. Even if we give him somewhat of a pass for being an insecure teen struggling with his sexuality, bringing her to the party for the thrill of having sex with a guy right under her nose was an astonishingly callous thing to do. Sure, it's uncomfortable to see Taylor have more things heaped on him than he already has at this point, but I get where she's coming from. She's been hurt and betrayed a lot worse than half the other characters throwing themselves pity parties on this show. I'm looking at you, Dan Sullivan and Eric's mom.

 

In the end, I think Anne is really the only character I take no issue with and who has done or tried to do the "right" thing at every turn. As much as other characters and Taylor himself keep bringing up Anne "leaving him", it sounds like she had mental health issues that needed to be treated and she placed him in the care of people she trusted until she got herself stable. She didn't abandon him on a street corner to fend for himself, so it bugs when people act like that was anything other than responsible and loving parenting.

Edited March 4, 2016 by jb1183

[Madding crowd]

I don't think every little bit needs to be explained, but they at least have to follow through with what we actually see. Last week they had the scene where Coach makes an excuse to go into Leslie's office when she wasn't there-it was never explained why. That's the kind of thing that is annoying. It is true that people don't always get answers to things (why someone was murdered or raped for example), but it doesn't make good storytelling to throw out so many things and not follow through on them.

 

I still can't imagine why they dragged Sebastian in at the last moment. Couldn't he do his hacking from his own house? Then to drag his poor daughters around and make them stay in sleazy motels so he can help a person he doesn't know? 

 

I also don't like the idea (which they did last year too), of switching characters around so they are bad guys one week and good guys the next. I don't believe Terri would get this attack of conscience or that Mrs. Coach would be so aggressive. Of course we all want to protect our children but there are ways of doing that without threatening other people.

 

I still don't like the inclusion of the principal of the other school; and when he was attacked for helping Taylor I wanted him to say: I will always help any student or parent that comes to me. Of course there are probably other students out there we cannot reach because I am unaware of their problems due to insufficient staff and funding. It didn't have to be a racial thing.

 

I will watch the finale but don't see how they can do anything that will make me feel good about the story. Last season ended with many deaths, and I don't want to see that again. 

[represent]

 

In the end, I think Anne is really the only character I take no issue with and who has done or tried to do the "right" thing at every turn. As much as other characters and Taylor himself keep bringing up Anne "leaving him", it sounds like she had mental health issues that needed to be treated and she placed him in the care of people she trusted until she got herself stable. She didn't abandon him on a street corner to fend for himself, so it bugs when people act like that was anything other than responsible and loving parenting.

But I think Taylor acknowledged in his own way that he understands why she had to leave him. I got that when he said something about when you  love someone you may feel like you have to leave them in order to avoid bringing them down with you. To me that told me that he gets that his  mother was trying to protect him by going away. That's all that matters IMO, that Taylor, her son, gets this. He doesn't sound like he blames her at all.

 

I think that's his logic for not putting up much of a fight. He just wants to fade away because he doesn't want to drag his mother down any further. 

 

But he's a boy, he has NO idea what a mother's love is all about. 

Edited March 4, 2016 by represent

[Dowel Jones]

It seems to be that the reason for the juxtaposition of the two schools is that behind the surface events, the scheming and plotting were the same at either school.  I really think that Chris Dixon was set up by the Monica the guidance counselor, who I think is looking to slide right into his job as he exits.  Consider the focus of the camera on her MS degree in Education Management during their meeting.  Then there was the two closeups of her after the board hearing, and Leslie, after the Leyland Board voted to dissolve itself.  Both showed more than a touch of triumph.  Leslie, in fact, seemed to be channeling Darth Vader for a moment there.  Quite a change from the view of her at the end of the episode where the DNA evidence was revealed to her.  I do harbor some thought that she is not free and clear yet.  Maybe the trustee will fire her.

 

My Spanish isn't perfect, but basically the woman (counselor? administrator? teacher?) was asking Evy if she had told the principal that she was touched, and Evy said, no, she didn't tell anyone, that it doesn't matter and would only make things worse.

 

Nor mine, but what I got after repeated listening and CC was something like this:

 

Counselor:  I have to ask you to tell me about the boy who touched you. Did Mr. Dixon ask you what happened?"

Evy:  No

C:  Why didn't you tell anyone?

E:  I saw what happened to my friend.  It's not important to anyone and will only make things worse, so I am not going to say anything. 

 

I'm missing the reason why Leyland would offer her a settlement.  Was it because the party could be considered a school sanctioned event?

 

On a somewhat lighter note, Sebastian really, really needs to brush up on his dating skills.

[stagmania]

Evy can be a bit much at times and I think the actress overacts a tad, but I don't fault her for still holding a lot of anger at Taylor, even with all that's happened. Even if we give him somewhat of a pass for being an insecure teen struggling with his sexuality, bringing her to the party for the thrill of having sex with a guy right under her nose was an astonishingly callous thing to do. Sure, it's uncomfortable to see Taylor have more things heaped on him than he already has at this point, but I get where she's coming from. She's been hurt and betrayed a lot worse than half the other characters throwing themselves pity parties on this show. I'm looking at you, Dan Sullivan and Eric's mom.

 

I never got the impression that Taylor brought Evy to the party "for the thrill"; I don't think he had any malicious intentions toward her or was actively trying to humiliate her. She was kind of like a security blanket for him. She made him feel safe in an environment where he didn't feel he fit in, and was a cover he could point to to "prove" his sexuality, which probably felt like a necessity given the risk he was taking meeting up with another guy at the party. Of course, that's selfish of him, but it's something a lot of kids do when they're struggling with their sexual identities. Evy's initial anger made sense to me, but given all that's happened to Taylor since and how well the situation turned out for her, she just came off as petty and mean last night.

 

By the same token, I thought the scene with Mother Sullivan and Anne was just plain weird. Given the concerns she had previously about her daughter's lack of empathy and understanding of consequences, I would think her focus right now would be on really engaging with her and trying to understand why she was dealing drugs, not threatening another mother whose son hasn't even given up any information. Why go over there to create an enemy for no reason? The ridiculous plea for undeserved sympathy, followed immediately by vitriolic threats, just didn't track with me at all.

[preeya]

Huffman's husband, William H. Macy is one of the stars of SHAMELESS. That said, Huffman's character, Leslie Graham on American Crime is truly, SHAMELESS. What a P.O.S.

[Neurochick]

It seems to be that the reason for the juxtaposition of the two schools is that behind the surface events, the scheming and plotting were the same at either school.  I really think that Chris Dixon was set up by the Monica the guidance counselor, who I think is looking to slide right into his job as he exits.  Consider the focus of the camera on her MS degree in Education Management during their meeting.  Then there was the two closeups of her after the board hearing, and Leslie, after the Leyland Board voted to dissolve itself.  Both showed more than a touch of triumph.  Leslie, in fact, seemed to be channeling Darth Vader for a moment there.  Quite a change from the view of her at the end of the episode where the DNA evidence was revealed to her.  I do harbor some thought that she is not free and clear yet.  Maybe the trustee will fire her.

 

 

Yes, and that's why education sucks so badly.  No one's there for the kids, they're all there to be politicians all of them are about ME, ME, ME.  I didn't like that guidance counselor from the first episode.  I think it would be funny if she doesn't get the principal job and it's given to another black person.  It's like, 'see you did all that, for nothing.'   If these people want to be selfish go into another profession, like drug dealing.

[starri]

I don't know if they're intending to do this, but part of me wonders if there's not also some commentary on sex ed bound up in this.  Even in the most benign (and by that I mean least bad) interpretation of the rape, Eric is guilty of not understanding how consent works.  John Oliver did a long piece about it recently, and I keep being reminded of it.

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

Hell Is Other People On American Crime
As things fall apart in the season's penultimate episode, everyone scrambles for cover and stages counter-attacks.

[jb1183]

I never got the impression that Taylor brought Evy to the party "for the thrill"; I don't think he had any malicious intentions toward her or was actively trying to humiliate her. She was kind of like a security blanket for him. She made him feel safe in an environment where he didn't feel he fit in, and was a cover he could point to to "prove" his sexuality, which probably felt like a necessity given the risk he was taking meeting up with another guy at the party. Of course, that's selfish of him, but it's something a lot of kids do when they're struggling with their sexual identities. Evy's initial anger made sense to me, but given all that's happened to Taylor since and how well the situation turned out for her, she just came off as petty and mean last night.

 

By the same token, I thought the scene with Mother Sullivan and Anne was just plain weird. Given the concerns she had previously about her daughter's lack of empathy and understanding of consequences, I would think her focus right now would be on really engaging with her and trying to understand why she was dealing drugs, not threatening another mother whose son hasn't even given up any information. Why go over there to create an enemy for no reason? The ridiculous plea for undeserved sympathy, followed immediately by vitriolic threats, just didn't track with me at all.

I may be conflating the Evy aspect with other things that were said, but I thought a big part of the choice to hook up at the party was the risk and thrill factor. Maybe Evy's presence wasn't specifically part of the "thrill," but I feel comfortable in categorizing bringing her there as a reckless disregard for her. If the planned encounter hadn't gone in a catastrophically wrong direction, would he feel as bad about it as he does now? I don't know. But my heart absolutely goes out to Taylor. No foolish or selfish decision justifies what has happened to him.

 

When I saw the previews at the end of last week, I thought Mrs. Sullivan was going to Anne out of a crisis of conscience. That character arc seems more appropriate given how her character has been developed so far, so I was definitely surprised by how that played out instead. And, yes,  it's one of the few character moments throughout that hasn't rang true.   

Edited March 4, 2016 by jb1183

[gunderda]

 

Why was there no translation of what Evy told that woman(forgot her name, the one who apparently wants to be the next principal)? 

 

I think they want it to be as close to real life as possible.  In real life you aren't privy to every conversation.  If you don't know the language then you don't get to know what they're talking about.  

 

I think they did the same thing last season.  

[preeya]

I think they want it to be as close to real life as possible.  In real life you aren't privy to every conversation.  If you don't know the language then you don't get to know what they're talking about.  

 

I think they did the same thing last season.  

OK, but in real life you also don't get extreme closeups of everyone in your viewing spectrum. Together, the lack of translations of another language, and extreme closeups, make this show very annoying to watch.

Edited March 4, 2016 by preeya

[ToukieSmith]

 

When I saw the previews at the end of last week, I thought Mrs. Sullivan was going to Anne out of a crisis of conscience. That character arc seems more appropriate given how her character has been developed so far, so I was definitely surprised by how that played out instead. And, yes,  it's one of the few character moments throughout that hasn't rang true.

 

This rang true to me.  Mrs. Sullivan, faced with her child getting into life altering trouble, decided to take control of the situation.  Her first tactic was to be nice to Anne to see how much mileage she could get by being nice.  Once she realized that Anne's wall was not coming down, she went into bitch mode.

 

Mrs. Sullivan is a nice woman.  She sees how other people are manipulating a situation and she advised her husband correctly.  At the same time, once scandal came to her door step, she became the person that she cautioned her husband about.

[Glade]

I really thought for a moment that Kevin/his mother were at the police station reporting the assault to the police.  What a letdown, that I really thought these assholes might do something decent for once.

 

A real hacker would have just hacked Leyland and posted it online, never contacting Anne (let alone on a cell phone!! if the guy knows about tor, he also knows you never say that on a phone! now Anne could be arrested for complicity/conspiracy to hack), showing up in town, or laying out his actions in cartoon villain monologues at bars.  If this is actually supposed to be a reference to what Anonymous did in the Stuebenville rape case, they did a poor job of it.

Edited March 4, 2016 by Glade

[Broderbits]

Glade said:

 

A real hacker would have just hacked Leyland and posted it online, never contacting Anne (let alone on a cell phone!!

 

I agree. First they wrote Sebastian as a righteous hacker trying to do some good, now he's bragging, being sloppy, and using this situation to pick up chicks. It's going to get him caught and maybe implicate Anne.

[izabella]

I really thought for a moment that Kevin/his mother were at the police station reporting the assault to the police.  What a letdown, that I really thought these assholes might do something decent for once.

 

Their police officer friend should be thrown in jail for obstruction of justice.  WTF, he is so willing to cover everything up for his buddies, never mind who gets hurt and who is out there committing crimes.  And wasn't he the one who released Anne's medical records to the public?

 

Actually, this show clearly has an axe to grind about the police.  They have been useless this whole time, with seemingly no interest in investigating anything, and have actively prevented any investigations.

Edited March 4, 2016 by izabella

[sjohnson]

Actually, this show clearly has an axe to grind about the police.  They have been useless this whole time, with seemingly no interest in investigating anything, and have actively prevented any investigations.

That certainly describes the police in this story. The question, then, is whether this is so outlandish a portrayal of the police that this false premise makes the story itself equally outlandish, and irrelevant to any real questions about life, no matter its pretensions. 

 

I don't think the portrayal of the police is outlandish at all. I have my reservations about how well all this relates to real world school shootings, but yes, I do think in rape cases you get exactly this kind of behavior from the cops.

[EvilApplesauce]

Eric didn't report it, why would anyone look for him?

The man said that he had a wife and kids who were probably expecting him to come home that day. Besides that, if the man survived the attack, then why wouldn't he report himself to a hospital? If he died, has not 1 soul been down that road yet to stumble upon the body?

Edited March 4, 2016 by EvilApplesauce

[iMonrey]

 

Eric's innocence would pretty much depend on Taylor having lied.

 

Not necessarily. Taylor was drugged. Eric's version of the story was that Taylor "wanted it" and then freaked out afterwards. Both stories aren't mutually exclusive. Taylor did go to the party to hook up with Eric, but once he was drugged he was unable to control the situation and "freaked out." Eric just thinks he "freaked out" because he changed his mind about the encounter or whatever. I don't think Eric realized Taylor was drugged because Eric isn't the one who drugged him. They just have different perceptions of what happened.

[sugarbaker design]

Besides that, if the man survived the attack, then why wouldn't he report himself to a hospital? If he died, has not 1 soul been down that road yet to stumble upon the body?

 

 

He didn't die.  He didn't report himself to a hospital because he's a married closet case who physically attacked a high school boy that he met on Grindr.

Edited March 4, 2016 by sugarbaker design

[mansonlamps]

I have to say I disagree with the rape is always wrong, but murder can be okay assertions. What happened to Taylor was horrendous, but what he did is also unforgivable.

[EvilApplesauce]

He didn't die.  He didn't report himself to a hospital because he's a married closet case who physically attacked a high school boy that he met on Grindr.

YMMV, but to me it looked like Eric either slashed the man's throat, or ripped his eyeball out. I don't know how the man was going to hide his injuries or explain the blood in his car to his wife (some of it on the passenger seat came from Eric when he punched him). I just think that the show stretches the boundaries of believability by ignoring the outcome of that attack. Just because the man met Eric on Grindr and he was in the closet doesn't mean that he wouldn't seek medical attention and even possibly lie about randomly encountering a teenager (Eric) who tried to rob or carjack him.

Edited March 5, 2016 by EvilApplesauce

[myopinionisall]

I think the whole truth of the situation between Taylor and Eric lays in the first episode, where we see Taylor watching Eric play basketball at practice. Who in their right mind, if Taylor is as upset with Eric as Taylor states he is, watching Eric play basketball? It just doesn't make sense! This is before Taylor see's the pictures of him messed up. The first time we see Taylor trying to get his mother to stop her pursuit of what went on at the party was when he walk away from his mothers car after the with the headmaster. IMO if Taylors mother had dropped the subject, his mother would never have found out that Taylor and Eric were gay. At least not from this party. The guilty party in this story is Kevin and possibly Becca.

Edited March 5, 2016 by myopinionisall

[RedheadZombie]

I think the whole truth of the situation between Taylor and Eric lays in the first episode, where we see Taylor watching Eric play basketball at practice. Who in their right mind, if Taylor is as upset with Eric as Taylor states he is, watching Eric play basketball? It just doesn't make sense! This is before Taylor see's the pictures of him messed up. The first time we see Taylor trying to get his mother to stop her pursuit of what went on at the party was when he walk away from his mothers car after the with the headmaster. IMO if Taylors mother had dropped the subject, his mother would never have found out that Taylor and Eric were gay. At least not from this party. The guilty party in this story is Kevin and possibly Becca.

I don't think this is true. Taylor very clearly told Evy that the rape did happen.

As to the questions you think the prosecutor should ask Taylor, those are exactly the same questions historically used to blame the victim and paint them as a whore. I don't think that type of thing flies anymore when dealing with a rape allegation. A big percentage of rapes are date rapes. That means they were attracted to their rapist, knew their rapist, have already had or contemplated sex with their rapist. They probably also have computers and have looked at online porn. I don't see the relevance.

[jb1183]

Since this was suggested in a post I happened to see earlier: If there's one thing that I think the audience can accept conclusively at this point it's that Taylor is not being (and has not been) intentionally deceitful regarding what he experienced at the party. Whether there are other truths he is not aware of is still an open question, but to have Taylor suddenly be revealed as a liar would contradict everything we have seen of his story so far and does not seem like a direction this socially conscious show would go in.

 

As to whether Taylor should be questioned on whether he wanted to have sex with Eric and/or was attracted to him, we already know the answer is "yes" to both questions. In fact, I think part of why this was so painful for Taylor (besides the obvious trauma of sexual assault) is that he seems to have had real feelings for Eric. Between his "Eric made me feel safe" remark to the police, the look on his face when Eric called him to lure him to the rec center and then him immediately going over there despite that not being an especially wise choice, it's clear there was a strong pull on Taylor's end that went beyond casual hookup. I don't think it makes Taylor hypocritical or lessens the traumatic impact on him that he simultaneously feels abused and violated while continuing to struggle with feelings for the person he believes to be his violator. 

 

I rewatched some scenes from earlier episodes today and I found myself fixating on the detail of Eric having driven Taylor and Evy home from the party. It reminds me of one of those seemingly minor details in mystery stories that gets put out there a few times and not dwelt on too much that ends up being very significant later. Because it's not really a necessary part of the story. They could have just as easily written Evy as having called a cab or something to get them home. It seems to imply some level of care and concern on Eric's part. We'll see. I just hope lingering questions like that are adequately addressed in the finale rather than spending the whole hour on whether Kevin and Becca end up facing repercussions for their misdeeds.        

Edited March 6, 2016 by jb1183

[sjohnson]

Anne told the police at first she didn't know where Taylor was. If the police arrest her for obstruction, the court must find someone to handle Taylor's legal affairs. This could be exceedingly useful for the police in finding a happy resolution to the case so that Taylor pleads guilty without involving anyone else, like Kevin LaCroix, or especially, the investigators who covered up the assault. Then everything can be presented as just a lone psychopath/mentally ill person and nothing about the police or schools or society need be disturbed in any way. This seems so plausible a course of action on the cops' part it's already getting a little hard to see why they haven't done it on the show. It's obvious why they haven't investigated where the drugs came from of course. They don't want any exculpatory evidence to be found.

[myopinionisall]

I don't think this is true. Taylor very clearly told Evy that the rape did happen.

As to the questions you think the prosecutor should ask Taylor, those are exactly the same questions historically used to blame the victim and paint them as a whore. I don't think that type of thing flies anymore when dealing with a rape allegation. A big percentage of rapes are date rapes. That means they were attracted to their rapist, knew their rapist, have already had or contemplated sex with their rapist. They probably also have computers and have looked at online porn. I don't see the relevance.

I'm not trying to paint Taylor as a whore.  If I'm extremely upset with someone that has done some to me I certainly would not have gone to their basketball practice the next day and watched them play, it's the last thing I would have done, logically speaking.  The question about looking on the computer at porn sights, establishes the fact that he knew what gay anal sex was all about, and would give Taylor as to what to expect.  Now first time anal sex is extremely painful with or without lubricant.  I propose that Taylor did not really take that into consideration, if they were at home in a more private setting and the person on the top taking his time it can be a more enjoyable event, however, they were at a party where anybody could come in, so they were rushed, Taylors first time, had no time to take it slow and easily.  Taylor probable had a lot of pain from the act.  Now Taylor may have told Evy that he was raped, however he also told her that " he got down on a boy, and got messed up (drinking/drugs) as a cover."  Did he ever say No to Eric, or is he upset because first time anal sex without lube is ruff and painful?  Like Eric said he was already bussed about getting it on, he wanted it, and he said it via email and verbally.  You can't go back, after the fact, when you never said no, you knew what anal sex was all about and yell rape, it just won't stand.  Now some would say he was drugged, well it takes around 20 minutes before things start to take effect, that is before they are absorbed into the body.  So even if he took the alcohol and drugs before the sex, that is when he went in with Eric, he would not have been messed up enough to say NO.  When Taylor was beat up by Kevin's boys, Taylor probably felt betrayed by Eric.  The relevance or the computer is to show that Taylor knew or didn't know what to expect from anal sex, what he obvious didn't know was that first time anal sex without lube, and a longer time during the act, is painful and may be conscued by Taylor as rape!  However, in fact wasn't.

[isitpink]

I rewatched some scenes from earlier episodes today and I found myself fixating on the detail of Eric having driven Taylor and Evy home from the party. It reminds me of one of those seemingly minor details in mystery stories that gets put out there a few times and not dwelt on too much that ends up being very significant later. Because it's not really a necessary part of the story. They could have just as easily written Evy as having called a cab or something to get them home. It seems to imply some level of care and concern on Eric's part. We'll see. I just hope lingering questions like that are adequately addressed in the finale rather than spending the whole hour on whether Kevin and Becca end up facing repercussions for their misdeeds.

It would follow logic that Eric became upset with Taylor "acting like a little bitch" ie showing how incapacitated and out of control he was. He seems hung up on being manly, and I'm thinking Taylor's behavior after the hookup was out of control. This was a huge turnoff and Eric likely was afraid he would say or do something to give away their secret. Maybe he drove Taylor and Evy home and dumped them on the curb out of this fear and anger.

Edited March 6, 2016 by isitpink

[myopinionisall]

Since this was suggested in a post I happened to see earlier: If there's one thing that I think the audience can accept conclusively at this point it's that Taylor is not being (and has not been) intentionally deceitful regarding what he experienced at the party. Whether there are other truths he is not aware of is still an open question, but to have Taylor suddenly be revealed as a liar would contradict everything we have seen of his story so far and does not seem like a direction this socially conscious show would go in.

 

As to whether Taylor should be questioned on whether he wanted to have sex with Eric and/or was attracted to him, we already know the answer is "yes" to both questions. In fact, I think part of why this was so painful for Taylor (besides the obvious trauma of sexual assault) is that he seems to have had real feelings for Eric. Between his "Eric made me feel safe" remark to the police, the look on his face when Eric called him to lure him to the rec center and then him immediately going over there despite that not being an especially wise choice, it's clear there was a strong pull on Taylor's end that went beyond casual hookup. I don't think it makes Taylor hypocritical or lessens the traumatic impact on him that he simultaneously feels abused and violated while continuing to struggle with feelings for the person he believes to be his violator. 

 

I rewatched some scenes from earlier episodes today and I found myself fixating on the detail of Eric having driven Taylor and Evy home from the party. It reminds me of one of those seemingly minor details in mystery stories that gets put out there a few times and not dwelt on too much that ends up being very significant later. Because it's not really a necessary part of the story. They could have just as easily written Evy as having called a cab or something to get them home. It seems to imply some level of care and concern on Eric's part. We'll see. I just hope lingering questions like that are adequately addressed in the finale rather than spending the whole hour on whether Kevin and Becca end up facing repercussions for their misdeeds.        

I would like to say my heart goes out to both Taylor and Eric.  Both caught up into situations for the most part were beyond their control.  I have gone into what I think happened to Taylor and Eric, adnauseam.  In your second paragraph I have a problem when you say Taylor had a problem with his sexual assault.  In my view Taylor didn't know what to expect when you have anal sex without a lubricant and very little time to preform the act.  Taylor had real feelings for Eric and Eric for Taylor, I can only presume that they spent many times having sex with each other prior to going to the party.  The party was a cherry on top of what they where already doing, something new for them to do.  Murphy's law is certainly alive here, if something is going to go wrong, it will.  Another point that you brought up is poignant here is that Eric had driven Taylor and Evy home.  I also felt that Taylor was betrayed by his friend Eric.  I still think this whole thing could have been avoided if Taylor had said nothing to his mother about his perceived rape and just said he just got messed up with alcohol.    

Edited March 7, 2016 by myopinionisall

[myopinionisall]

On second thoughts, if Taylor was watching men on his computer having anal sex, he must not have noticed that these people/actors have done this many times, with each time you do it, it becomes easier and enjoyable, most people on the receiving side usually get off, thus both partners get off, in the real world this is what you want for your partner. I'm still not sure why Eric turned on Taylor and set him up for a beating, in this case in my opinion Eric is the bitch and should be ashamed of himself. He should have had enough balls to stand up to those four team players. Especially now that he's been outed. How can he live with his actions? In this season of American crime, you must use some character profiling, know about gay sex, know how long it takes alcohol and drugs to enter the body/blood stream, know why gays are so careful about being outed and know what measures they take to stay secret about their gayness, know something about human behavior and defensive behavior. Ho by the way no one should be surprised that Taylor wrote now Eric's name to be shot.

Edited March 8, 2016 by myopinionisall

[myopinionisall]

It would follow logic that Eric became upset with Taylor "acting like a little bitch" ie showing how incapacitated and out of control he was. He seems hung up on being manly, and I'm thinking Taylor's behavior after the hookup was out of control. This was a huge turnoff and Eric likely was afraid he would say or do something to give away their secret. Maybe he drove Taylor and Evy home and dumped them on the curb out of this fear and anger.

It's always been my opinion that both Taylor and Eric thought highly of each other.  After all they may have had multiple get together with each other.   Whether Taylor knew how painful first time anal sex was going to be is probable the case here, since this was probably their first time at anal  sex. Hopefully since this is the last episode we  will not be left hanging.  Wondering just what happened.  

Edited March 8, 2016 by myopinionisall

[formerlyfreedom]

Let's move on, please; saying the same thing over and over isn't adding to the conversation. Thanks.

[St. Claire]

The more horrendous Eric's mother is, the more I am impressed with Emily Bergl as an actress. I only met her for a hot minute when some of the kids on the theater trip I was chaperoning were waiting at the stage door for autographs, but she was gracious and friendly and seemed really down to earth (up to and including how she finished doing autographs and just hopped onto the subway instead of being driven somewhere). The fact that the woman who was so open on that NY street could channel such a hateful personality (I cannot think of anything that would cause me to reject my kid the way she did, and her baseless accusations against her ex-husband make me ill) and make it believable is noteworthy.

[The Mighty Peanut]

That certainly describes the police in this story. The question, then, is whether this is so outlandish a portrayal of the police that this false premise makes the story itself equally outlandish, and irrelevant to any real questions about life, no matter its pretensions. 

 

I don't think the portrayal of the police is outlandish at all. I have my reservations about how well all this relates to real world school shootings, but yes, I do think in rape cases you get exactly this kind of behavior from the cops.

 

Stubenville is a perfect example of this. IIRC the police reluctantly launched an investigation due to social pressure/Anonymous and they not only informed the teens they were going to be conducting a locker search at such-and-such a time, but just asked them to hand over their phones and gave them time to delete their texts and videos. Most of the recovered texts from that case were screenshots, info from Anonymous, and the infamous instagram post of the rapists dragging the passed out girl from one house to the next. It's been a long time since I thought about that case and I might have some of those details wrong, but the police did a terrible job investigating, at least during the initial stages.

Edited March 9, 2016 by The Mighty Peanut

[PQuinn]

The more horrendous Eric's mother is, the more I am impressed with Emily Bergl as an actress. 

She's said on Twitter how difficult it was to shoot her scenes; I agree with you, she's phenomenal. That scene with her husband at the kitchen table almost took the skin off my arms it was so brutal.

[mansonlamps]

The more horrendous Eric's mother is, the more I am impressed with Emily Bergl as an actress.

I only recently found out she went to my high school. So....yay? Haha we have so few famous alumni, I was actually excited for her.