S12.E11: Unbreak My Heart

[Eolivet]

I really liked this episode, but I'm so torn as to why. It didn't really change my feelings about Jackson and April (who I've always liked) -- from their first real "fight" on the plane, it was clear that they had really not discussed the important issues and were coming from very different backgrounds, and neither was willing to bend to the other. April saw it as Jackson not supporting her -- Jackson saw it as her bulldozing over his feelings. I thought that scene was smart, because it foreshadowed the eventual thing that broke them up: April not understanding why Jackson couldn't support her (in a way), and Jackson seeing April as once again bulldozing over his feelings. I mean, it's really what's to be expected of two characters that not only had an impulsive marriage, one surprise pregnancy and suffered a terrible loss. They had very little relationship foundation to begin with (evident to me in the plane scene) and when two characters start a marriage where you wonder if they're going to make it one flight and still remain together, it's almost a miracle they lasted so long.

 

And at the same time...ARGH. They break my heart. Their relationship feels so real to me and I really enjoy the two actors together. I feel like Grey's details the breaking down of a relationship of two people who still love each other, at heart, better than any show on television. As others have mentioned, they did it with Cristina and Owen, and Callie and Arizona. Only this time, I find myself hoping against hope that they'll find their way back together. I can't explain it rationally -- I feel like they're so different, and they challenge each other's worldview by simply being themselves -- that I just want it to work for them. Despite all of their problems, they are the (albeit dysfunctional) love of each other's lives. I have to root for that -- despite my better judgment.

 

I also think this is different than Cristina and Owen. There's no impasse (having kids vs no kids). What broke Jackson and April apart wasn't religion, it was external events. Their issues are bigger than themselves, but I don't believe they're insurmountable. It will take work and time and new approaches to things, but I can't help it. I want those two dysfunctional kids to make it work. Not today, not tomorrow, but eventually.

 

And it's all because of the actors. They take the story of a sad, broken relationship, and against all odds, they make me believe that it just might someday have a happy ending.

[Artymouse]

I really liked this episode, but I'm so torn as to why. It didn't really change my feelings about Jackson and April (who I've always liked) -- from their first real "fight" on the plane, it was clear that they had really not discussed the important issues and were coming from very different backgrounds, and neither was willing to bend to the other. April saw it as Jackson not supporting her -- Jackson saw it as her bulldozing over his feelings. I thought that scene was smart, because it foreshadowed the eventual thing that broke them up: April not understanding why Jackson couldn't support her (in a way), and Jackson seeing April as once again bulldozing over his feelings. I mean, it's really what's to be expected of two characters that not only had an impulsive marriage, one surprise pregnancy and suffered a terrible loss. They had very little relationship foundation to begin with.

I also think this is different than Cristina and Owen. There's no impasse (having kids vs no kids). What broke Jackson and April apart wasn't religion, it was external events. Their issues are bigger than themselves, but I don't believe they're insurmountable.

And it's all because of the actors. They take the story of a sad, broken relationship, and against all odds, they make me believe that it just might someday have a happy ending.

I agree with pretty much your entire post. What was so frustrating to me was how little April was willing to bend, especially in the face of Jackson's willingness to compromise a bit.

And the plane scene was just nuts. As a Christian, I can't imagine asking a person who is an atheist to pretend to be Christian, and expect them to lead the family in prayer. I mean, seriously! I'm pretty sure that as Christians, we aren't supposed to be OK with lying; yet April was expecting him to lie about what she perceives to be the most important thing in the world. So in rewatching this episode and filling in some of the blanks about their relationship, it's hard to imagine their marriage succeeding long-term, even if they had not experienced such a tragedy.

[Biggie B]

This episode made me understand April's POV more, and made me think that Jackson should have been more vocal in his pain over Samuel.

 

Wouldn't his pain be automatically implied? If you child dies, I think it's safe to assume with just about 100% certainty that you are in pain, whether you scream it from the roof tops or lapse into numb silence or do anything in between. 

 

I completely understand what April did - totally get it. But as others have mentioned, if she had even JUST ONCE acknowledged to her husband that she was sorry for the effect her actions had on him, I might have been able to throw her a small bone. I think she needed to do what she needed to do, but it rankles me that she took no responsibility for the shitstorm her actions created back home. She sort of earned this divorce. And if she does go all the way with this pregnancy (because heaven forbid that anyone on a soap opera have a problem-free, easy, normal pregnancy), I hope she doesn't screw with Jackson's access to the baby.

[Shellie]

Was anyone else bothered by the clanking of the chopsticks?  I've never heard chopsticks clank against plates before.   I kept wondering what they were made of, but even if they were made of some nice material like porcelain, I wouldn't think they would get banged against the plate like that.  It sounded like the sound effects of silverware.  

[dr pepper]

*&^%$#@! Shonda! Why does she hate happy couples so much? We see them develop, then either someone dies, or someone does something that throws the gears out of alignment and the whole relationship devolves to an ugly crash. Please stop.

[sking24450]

Wouldn't his pain be automatically implied? If you child dies, I think it's safe to assume with just about 100% certainty that you are in pain, whether you scream it from the roof tops or lapse into numb silence or do anything in between. 

 

 

I agree.  And more to the point, Jackson has vocalized his pain to April before.  In the episode she came back to work and wanted to jump his bones at every opportunity while trying to convince him she was fine, Jackson told her at the end of the episode that he was struggling every day to keep it together.  And this episode showed me that it didn't matter what Jackson vocalized about his pain because unless he expressed it the same way as April she can't acknowledge it.  April told him that he wasn't dying about the death of their child like she was because he appeared to be coping.  

[BabyBBQKendall]

I really hoped for April to be redeemed this season but I'm not sure what could break through to her now short of catastrophic brain trauma. I know many have loathed Kepner since she arrived but I've always been a fan and this character assassination is tough to swallow. Her current lack of empathy seems almost pathological, especially when directed at the person she is supposedly fighting for. I'm not seeing a way back for her at this point.

Edited February 29, 2016 by BlindMaryIngalls

[aprilbabe]

One more thing, a couple who lost their kid to a GENETIC disorder should have been careful with sex and a potential second knock up but you know condoms break....

From my understanding it possible it's due to a genetic disorder or it's possible it's due to a spontaneous mutation that happens in either the female or male before conception. (It's very rare and can happen to anybody. )If it's the former, then there is no reason to believe it would happen to them again. It was basically a fluke the first time. It happening once does not make it more likely to happen again.

But they never specified which case it was for Japril.

[Eolivet]

One thing I noticed and realized I forgot to say (and if anyone else said it before, apologies) is that when April was signing the papers, the camera focused in briefly on some writing above that said "list names of any children." Heh. Clever one, writers.

[aprilbabe]

One thing I noticed and realized I forgot to say (and if anyone else said it before, apologies) is that when April was signing the papers, the camera focused in briefly on some writing above that said "list names of any children." Heh. Clever one, writers.

Also someone did a screenshot of the divorce papers and it showed Jackson actually hadn't signed yet. Not sure if that means something or just an error on the directors part.

[Apocalypse Cow]

Wouldn't his pain be automatically implied? If you child dies, I think it's safe to assume with just about 100% certainty that you are in pain, whether you scream it from the roof tops or lapse into numb silence or do anything in between. 

 

 

Grief does strange things to people; thoughts aren't always rational. April was unable to resume her everyday life when Jackson was.  It is possible to that she took that to mean that Jackson was not as impacted as she was. I'm not one to wallow in grief and have been told that it makes me seem cold and uncaring, and I can imagine that she took Jackson's resuming of his life and work to mean that he was moving on in his grief, or that it wasn't that traumatic to him.  A rational person could see that he was dealing with his grief in his own way, but like I said, grief can make one irrational.  And April has never been a super rational person to start with.

[RachelKM]

Grief does strange things to people; thoughts aren't always rational. April was unable to resume her everyday life when Jackson was.  It is possible to that she took that to mean that Jackson was not as impacted as she was. I'm not one to wallow in grief and have been told that it makes me seem cold and uncaring, and I can imagine that she took Jackson's resuming of his life and work to mean that he was moving on in his grief, or that it wasn't that traumatic to him.  A rational person could see that he was dealing with his grief in his own way, but like I said, grief can make one irrational.  And April has never been a super rational person to start with.

All of this makes sense to me.... while she was in the midst of it.  What I find so bizarre is that, now that she's back and allegedly largely healed, she has no ability to reflect on the situation.  As you say, April has never been particularly rational to begin with.  But that ,even in retrospect, she has no concept or clue of what Jackson went through or that her manner of processing her grief hurt him is utterly unaccountable except to think that she is generally incapable of empathy and/or a total narcissist. 

 

I give people a lot of lead when grieving.  It's not rational and is not a thing that can be easily "managed."  So being selfish or lashing out, even doing whatever it takes just to survive, all of that makes sense to me.  And in that, I found April sympathetic.  It's her behavior afterward and her continued selfishness that I find unsympathetic. 

Edited March 1, 2016 by RachelKM

[izabella]

I also found it weird that, even after the marriage counseling they did (which we did not see), April still couldn't see past the end of her own nose. 

[Apocalypse Cow]

All of this makes sense to me.... while she was in the midst of it.  What I find so bizarre is that, now that she's back and allegedly largely healed, she has no ability to reflect on the situation.  As you say, April has never been particularly rational to begin with.  But that ,even in retrospect, she has no concept or clue of what Jackson went through or that her manner of processing her grief hurt him is utterly unaccountable except to think that she is generally incapable of empathy and/or a total narcissist. 

 

I give people a lot of lead when grieving.  It's not rational and is not a thing and can be easily "managed."  So being selfish or lashing out even doing whatever it take just to survive, all of that makes sense to me.  And in that, I found April sympathetic.  It's her behavior afterward and her continued selfishness that I find unsympathetic. 

I agree--- I can understand her grief, but not her inablilty to see Jackson's side to everything. I generally find April to be stunted as far as maturity... she is often self-centered and entitled. I think that there is great potential for growth for her, but this is Grey's... so... yeah. lol

[Apocalypse Cow]

All of this makes sense to me.... while she was in the midst of it.  What I find so bizarre is that, now that she's back and allegedly largely healed, she has no ability to reflect on the situation.  As you say, April has never been particularly rational to begin with.  But that ,even in retrospect, she has no concept or clue of what Jackson went through or that her manner of processing her grief hurt him is utterly unaccountable except to think that she is generally incapable of empathy and/or a total narcissist. 

 

I give people a lot of lead when grieving.  It's not rational and is not a thing and can be easily "managed."  So being selfish or lashing out even doing whatever it take just to survive, all of that makes sense to me.  And in that, I found April sympathetic.  It's her behavior afterward and her continued selfishness that I find unsympathetic. 

I agree--- I can understand her grief, but not her inablilty to see Jackson's side to everything. I generally find April to be stunted as far as maturity... she is often self-centered and entitled. I think that there is great potential for growth for her, but this is Grey's... so... yeah. lol

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

Grey's Anatomy Of A Marriage
A sometimes tedious, yet always emotional, twelve-year journey through April and Jackson's relationship.

[Guest]

Ugh, I could hardly follow this episode. I don't know if it's because I don't regularly watch the show anymore or because of the rewind concept. Probably some of both.

 

I'm mad at Derek all over again for re-hiring her in his first act of chief.  So many stupid plotlines could have been avoided if they had left her fired. She's such a selfish character.  

 

I also think their relationship story is one that has really hurt from all the time jumps.  

[Biggie B]

I give people a lot of lead when grieving.  It's not rational and is not a thing and can be easily "managed."  So being selfish or lashing out even doing whatever it take just to survive, all of that makes sense to me.  And in that, I found April sympathetic.  It's her behavior afterward and her continued selfishness that I find unsympathetic.

 

 

Yes, add me to the list of those who agree that in the midst of the horror of Samuel's death, April could pretty much do whatever she needed to do. But now that the dust has settled, she's unable for even a moment to say, "I had to bolt, but jeez, yeah, Jackson, I did leave you high and dry, and that must've been brutal for you." And that pisses me off about the character, because I have usually pictured her as someone who is able to find fault with herself and who's more humble.

[moonorchid]

April found more empathy for penny in ep 5 then in her husband!

I love April and this episode was like a huge slap in the face in terms of her characterization. This isn't the girl I've known up to now. It's been a really tough pill to swollow.

[readster]

Yes, add me to the list of those who agree that in the midst of the horror of Samuel's death, April could pretty much do whatever she needed to do. But now that the dust has settled, she's unable for even a moment to say, "I had to bolt, but jeez, yeah, Jackson, I did leave you high and dry, and that must've been brutal for you." And that pisses me off about the character, because I have usually pictured her as someone who is able to find fault with herself and who's more humble.

That's exactly it. Both Mrs. Readster and I said that about her. Jackson trying to deal with it was focusing on his job, which he has admitted he is pretty good at. Sometimes that happens. I had to go through a period about 8 years ago that was very devastating and people even asked me if I should take time off. I told them that this was how I had to deal with it and if I didn't surround myself in work and a community event I loved doing. I was going to fall apart completely. Yet even after all this time, April is: "You coped and moved on." When really, he didn't and then leaving him during that time, thinking he was going to be fine. That made Jackson feel he lost both his son and wife at the same time. He had no one, I agree that then he had to play April's card and be completely dramatic about it. Yet, in the long run, you want to smack April upside the head because she can't see the forest through the trees.

[taanja]

i hate episodes like this. like i don't really get what specifically i'm supposed to get. Like they were always apart? they always fought? 

 

April not telling Jackson she's pregnant is kind of shadypants. 

 

It is episodes like this that make me NOT watch this show regularly. Too much April and her shrill voice. Just. No. I couldn't make it more than 15 minutes. I have no fucks to give.

[candall]

I wouldn't want to be married to her either.

 

On the plane, April was furious because Jackson told her, flatly, that the conversation was over.  Well, I bristle, too, when I want to discuss something and the other person refuses to engage, but that wasn't the situation.  She'd asked him over and over and over and he'd repeatedly said no, he wasn't going to fake out her parents by pretending to be Christian.  So really what she wanted was just to continue arguing until she wore him down--which also seemed to be her M.O. for the divorce discussions.

 

How exhausting.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

So really what she wanted was just to continue arguing until she wore him down--which also seemed to be her M.O. for the divorce discussions.

 

How exhausting.

That was also her MO when she finally came back. He let her stay at their place temporarily but then she refused to leave. Remember the night he came home from work and she was making dinner and acting like nothing had happened? He told her he just wanted to eat his burrito and go to bed and she just kept at him. Finally he told her that she needed to move out while he was at work the next day and she said she wouldn't leave because she wasn't giving up on their marriage. Even then she was using that bulldozer technique. She thought if she refused to leave, eventually Jackson would relent and say, "Fine, stay and we'll just go back to the way things were." That conversation really stuck in my head because until then, Jackson had tried to be polite about things but she just kept at him so much that he said he felt like he was being stalked because she wouldn't leave him alone. When he told her that he was going to change the locks while she was gone, she said she would break down the door with an ax. At that point, I concurred with Jackson when he told her to listen to herself because she sounded like a crazy person.

 

What really annoys me about April and this kind of behavior is that it is a very self centered and immature attitude to have. When you boil it down to the basics, what she was doing was the equivalent of a bratty toddler who tries to wear people down to get what they want. Maybe it's just me, but I want a husband who actively WANTS to be with me, not someone who is around because he's so tired of being browbeaten with the same question.

 

Can I have a cookie?

No.

Can I have a cookie?

No.

Can I have a cookie?

No.

Can I have a cookie?

No.

Can I have a cookie?

No.

Can I have a cookie?

No.

Can I have a cookie?

No.

Can I have a cookie?

No.

Can I have a cookie?

No.

Can I have a cookie?

No.

Can I have a cookie?

No.

Can I have a cookie?

No.

Can I have a cookie?

FINE, here's a cookie. Just shut up!

Yay, I got a cookie!

[dmc]

"It had solidified. I was angry at April for leaving the way she did, and nothing revealed here changed or tempered that anger."

THIS if I cannot get over it, I don't expect Jackson too. The worst people in relationships are the ones that bolt when things get tough.

Also Jackson telling burn girl that they are a team. Jackson is such a good doctor. I have forgotten how much I like him because he is so buried under that Kepner crap.

[Daisy]

And it's like April can't even frigging buy a clue about that, and we're supposed to technically be on her side? (That's the way I feel she's being written). That Jackson is wrong for being mad at April. Which. screw that #TeamJackson. 

 

Like honestly. I understand that April needed to find herself and heal because of Samuel's death, but she gave zero thought to what Jackson needed too. And every time he brings it up - April brushes it aside with but I needed to go away. Why can't you understand that. Which - ironically, he does. What she can't understand is that she went away, and he needed her, period. And she came back, and left him alone again, and then expected to be tralalalallala LIFE IS WONDERFUL. 

 

Then gets mad that Jackson is like, "no you stupid cow, life isn't wonderful, we have the constant arguments forever, and I need out." and she can't respect that. (and again - not telling him about the baby. bad. BAD. I doubt v. much that Jackson would stay because of the baby, (but I know April will play it off like such). but Jackson should know.). 

[BabyBBQKendall]

I don't think we're supposed to be on April's side here. I think we're supposed to see her as tragically deluded. The dialog from Jackson is all "You never listen", "you're not hearing me", "you never apologise", etc. They've put a mental block on her that inhibits both empathy and insight. Even getting divorced hasn't cracked her, so I can't imagine what they have coming down the pike as an actual wake-up call.

Edited March 2, 2016 by BlindMaryIngalls

[lamadeleine]

 

Even getting divorced hasn't cracked her, so I can't imagine what they have coming down the pike as an actual wake-up call.

 

Well, if they stay true to the Grey's Anatomy mold, April will undoubtedly have to have a near-death experience..that's usually how characters on this show achieve their much needed clarity.

 

 

[kingshearte]

I didn't hate this episode as much as I thought I might, given how over this couple I am, but they both did a really good job with the material, and the individual moments were really nice in some cases. I think this is one (of the many) storylines that were seriously harmed by the post-Derek-death time jump, because this kind of loss is such a monumentally huge thing in someone's life, and to have basically just zoomed past it only to peek back at isolated moments after the fact? Does them all a disservice.

 

I'm sympathetic to April up to a point. I get that she did what she needed to do to survive, but seriously. Even now, when you have indeed successfully survived and are presumably thinking a little more clearly, you still can't acknowledge that he had/has needs too? Yes, he probably should have communicated his needs better, but even after he did state explicitly how he felt and what he went through, there was still no real acknowledgement of that from April. There was shock, but that came across like it was honestly the first time she'd even thought about his feelings and the fact that he had any. Even the fact that she thought he was "fine" is disturbing to me. Do you really know each other so little that you can't tell the difference between someone actually being fine (and how, incidentally, do you even relate to someone who would actually be legitimately fine after that kind of loss?) and someone putting on a brave face? Basically, like others have said, the whole thing really just emphasized the fact that, although they have great chemistry and can be good friends, they are not right for each other.

 

Here's a hint, April - when you keep fighting about the exact same thing, something is wrong because whatever you are fighting about isn't getting fixed or resolved or addressed. For the record, I hate the idea that marriage is work. It's not when you are with the right person. Mr. EB and I have been together for a million years and I have never considered our relationship work (and I don't mean that in a medicated Stepford Wife "but I love doing laundry!" kind of way). There have been a handful of times when I was like ugh, I have to drive you to the airport at this ungodly hour, but that's the extent of it. A relationship should make you happy, not make you miserable. A relationship should not be constant fighting. And enjoying sex with the other person isn't a reason to stay together.

Yes! OMG, sometimes I feel like I'm the only one who thinks the idea that relationships are hard work is ridiculous. It takes communication, empathy, understanding, and compromise from time to time, but if it actually takes work just to stay functional? No thank you.

 

Oh, and on the subject of communication, one of my biggest TV relationship pet peeves is the tendency for couple to have "conversations" that go something like this.

Person 1: I think that–

Person 2: I know what you're going to say, so I'll just skip to the part where I get super pissed off about the thing that you didn't even say.

Person 1: ...

 

Callie's pretty bad for that, and April did it at least once in this episode, and it drives me crazy. Communication has to involve not just using your own words, but allowing room for the other person to use theirs, too. Gah!

[Anela]

*&^%$#@! Shonda! Why does she hate happy couples so much? We see them develop, then either someone dies, or someone does something that throws the gears out of alignment and the whole relationship devolves to an ugly crash. Please stop.

I know! I really wish she would just let at least some of them be happy. 

[Joana]

They're happy as long as they're not given any screen time, like Bailey and Ben. If the show ever decides to focus on them, you know they're toast. 

[Bort]

13 hours ago, doram said:

The "no premarital sex" scene might have been a cute scene, if April hadn't already gone through the "no premarital sex" arc with Matthew where she affirmed that she had resolved to no longer compromise her values anymore. I guess Japril shippers could use that as proof that April found Jackson more irresistible than Matthew, but it seemed more like proof that Jackson brought out the worst in her. I frankly disliked that scene most of all.

From what I remember, during her engagement to Matthew, April, having already discovered the joys of sex, was kind of hot to trot (there was that whole analogy about the carnival and riding the rides) and if it hadn't also been Matthew's thing for there being "no premarital sex," I think she would broken that one back then too.

[Bort]

@doram, that's right, I forgot that happened as well. I stand corrected! Still doesn't bother me, though, the circumstances of Matthew vs Jackson were much different: big huge wedding event months away vs eloping the next day and had already done it in the past anyway.

[apn85]

Gosh yes, this episode (I was happy to get the Jackson/April time. It's no secret these two are my favorites...) had me wanting to beat my head against a wall. There was SO much about it that left me thinking, "WTH?!"

I didn't think it showed April in a positive light at all. I don't necessarily think it was meant to, so mission accomplished. I do love April, but she's not perfect by any means. I could understand the need to go overseas the first time. It was hard to really know how they were doing after Samuel given the time jump and lack of scenes in the few episodes after the one where Samuel passed away. I felt like April struggled in the aftermath, but I am not sure to the degree this episode showed. I also felt like there was a definite disconnect between her and Jackson in the grieving process in real time, so that part of the episode made sense. So I understood the need to go "do something" but I started losing understanding when it just kept going on and on. What I think was supposed to be 3 months turned into a year. She came back, Jackson was thankful to have her back, all seemed to be better.

Then we decided to go again. And that is when I just completely lost all understanding. Especially when the man stood there and told her that if she went, he would not be waiting when she returned. AND THEN SHE WENT ANYWAY!!!! That is the point where I fell off the wagon. I could make excuses for her up until that point. I am not sure what she found by going back for a few months after she had been there a year, but whatever, they had to break them up somehow, lol. 

The only problem I had with Jackson during all of this was him being so adamant that he wanted a divorce and then he slept with her. I chalk it up to him being a man that hadn't had sex in two forevers, but come on! He wanted the divorce and then he sleeps with her and decides ok maybe we can work it out. Which, for me, the only time he seemed like he thought maybe they could work things out was when he was sleeping with her. The rest of the time, and the few therapy sessions they went to, he seemed pretty certain that divorce was definitely what he wanted. So that was the only problem I had with him. I felt like he gave her mixed signals when he really didn't have to. He could have just served her the papers on the front end and been done with it. Again, whatever, she had to get knocked up somehow, lol. 

As for the actual episode.....

The scene on the plane made me cringe. It was SO out of character. April has done a lot of things, but that was just too much. Yes, religion has always been a factor with them, but not to that degree. I hated that scene. 

The scene where April was sitting in the nursery was heartbreaking, but I also felt different from what we saw in real time. Maybe not, I do recall Jackson telling Catherine that April wanted space and her telling him April wanted the illusion of space vs. actual space so maybe that is what the writers intended to get across, I dunno. If anything, I guess it gave me another perspective as to why she went overseas the first time. If you believe things went as that scene showed then it did look like April was in this deep depression while Jackson was able to pull himself together enough to continue living, so it would make sense that she would try to pull herself out of it. Even if Jackson was covering his grief up for her sake, she was seeing something different and reacted to that. 

Lastly, and this still hasn't happened.....I just wish April would apologize. Like really, truly apologize. Recognize her mistakes, recognize that she hurt and essentially abandoned him, and just put herself on the line without getting defensive or telling him how he didn't understand and just say she was sorry. Accept whatever response he gives her, be it forgiveness or not. I do believe that despite his anger, that Jackson still loved her even when she came back from overseas the second time. I might be delusional, but I still believe that he loves her. I think that is why he struggled so much this season and was so angry. It might not have been a quick fix, but I believe if she had admitted she was wrong and apologized that the outcome would have been very different. Now it's just a big damn mess and she still hasn't just laid it out and apologized to him. Even Sarah Drew has pointed that out as something she doesn't understand about April. 

I have no idea what is going to happen with them going forward. I don't know if April's NDE in the finale was more for her or for Jackson. I will be disappointed if Jackson is suddenly smitten with her again just because she gave birth to his child and almost died in the process. Jumping in without thinking has been the root of their issues, so I just really hope that doesn't happen. He was already softening up where April was concerned, so I just don't know what it will be like now that their baby is here. As is typical with them, I am sure they'll be on different pages no matter what TPTB have planned. 

[apn85]

You make good points!

I would have to go back and watch again, but it was just horribly out of order and made little sense. I was confused by a lot in 12x11 and specifically how we got from Jackson wanting to work it out to serving her divorce papers at work. Which that in itself...."Would you lower your voice?" Sometimes I think even Jackson forgets exactly who he is dealing with....April only has a couple levels when reacting to stuff. Frighteningly calm and Point of No Return. Those are his choices. Once she gets to that point, she doesn't give a shit. You cannot talk her down. I mean damn Riggs figured that out about her yet Jackson acted shocked by her behavior all season. 

On 7/4/2016 at 9:34 AM, doram said:

I think in general, the writers don't pay much attention to the Japril relationship and specifically April as a character so they just make their dynamic and her be anything it needs to be to suit the plot. It hails all the way from the start when she's a virgin for non-religious reasons, and she even has a long-term crush on Alex and wants to sleep with him - to her suddenly becoming a born-again Christian.

So very true!! 

Which going back to the old days - I always feel like I am on a cloud of my own when it comes to this very topic with other fans. I think even their relationship came out of nowhere. Yes, I know and recall Jackson and April being good friends. I remember them hanging together the majority of the time, living together at Meredith/Derek's, even when they were all going to various places for interviews before they took their boards I recall Jackson and April on the same flight to wherever. I remember them leaving to catch their plane together while the other three remained at the airport bar. So I remember those moments and acknowledge them. Still, though, I never saw them hooking up coming. I never really noticed any obvious flirtation between the two. I honestly just saw two good friends. Maybe I was just dense, but I never got that they were headed in that direction based on any interaction they had prior to when she kissed him and he was happy to oblige. So even the beginning of them, for me, was out of the blue. 

I feel like ever since they started out it has been constant back and forth. The subject changed, but that has always been the story between them. April on one side, Jackson on the other. For the love of all that is holy, I hope and pray that maybe....just MAYBE....in Season 13 we can do something different with them for a change. Seeing as how they are parents now, maybe they'll finally grow up and realize that even though they don't agree on much, it isn't about them anymore. 

Though the way things go, this season the fight will be about who gets more sleep during their week with the baby, who gets to go out more, etc. It'll be something! Always is!

[BabyBBQKendall]

Quote

Then there was Jackson being revolted by April's hug and calling her "weird" after the shooting - another retcon. This scene must have taken place after the "April is outed as a virgin" episode and by then the two were very close friends; Jackson even got into a fight with Alex over her and specifically told Lexie that "April is the only friend I have here now". That whole scene looked like something from fan fiction AU. 

I think this scene took place between her being outed as a virgin (7x03) and Jackson punching Alex (7x08). Jackson was one of the ones laughing at her for being a virgin, so they can't have been too close at that point.

 

On 05/07/2016 at 0:34 AM, doram said:

This is part of why the whole 12x11 episode and the "evolution" of their dynamic in season 12 makes no sense. There is no bridge between the scene where they're giddy about fooling around in on-call rooms and the scene where Jackson serves April papers in the ER. The scenes literally follow one after the other (both occurring while Meredith's recovering from her attack) and there's no explanation of how they went from one state to the other.

I agree it wasn't enough, but there was a bridge between them the fooling around and April getting served- Jackson and April arguing by the car after a therapy session. Jackson calls out April for never taking responsibility or apologizing. She continues to be pissed off. It seems that he's had his fill- he knows she's never going to get it, so he's out.

As a Japril fan, I was happy to have the screentime, and SD and JW were so enthusiastic about the episode that it seemed kind of ungrateful to complain- but honestly, 12x11 was a bit of a mess. Some of those flashbacks got April totally wrong, they were writing her from the perspective of Season 12 April, as she is now, overly defensive and insensitive, rather than how she was portrayed from Seasons 6-10.

April's reasoning for leaving/coming back/etc has never made sense. She was only shown in a handful of scenes after the baby death episode, mostly seeming to be doing OK, then there was a shot of her looking at babies in the hospital nursery and she needed to go off to war for a year. Then she comes back, decides to leave again (it's her "calling"), but then, offscreen, somehow she decides she needs Jackson (or rather, her marriage) so much she's willing to become practically a stalker? Terrible writing.

12x11 would have been a wonderful opportunity to retcon some sense into this storyline, but they missed it.

Edited July 15, 2016 by BlindMaryIngalls

[apn85]

On 7/14/2016 at 10:38 PM, BlindMaryIngalls said:

Some of those flashbacks got April totally wrong, they were writing her from the perspective of Season 12 April, as she is now, overly defensive and insensitive, rather than how she was portrayed from Seasons 6-10.

You hit the nail on the head with this right here!

April has changed SO much in the last couple seasons that in order to do something like 12x11 they had to be super meticulous when writing her character and they just weren't. I've never known what scene it was (either they didn't say or I missed it), but I remember during the promo surrounding the episode it was mentioned that SD had a really difficult time with one of the scenes....so much so that it just wasn't working for her. She couldn't understand April's side of it or where she was coming from. It was JW that pulled her aside and I think explained his understanding of April in that scene and they were able to move forward. Now I may have specifics about that wrong, but it says something when the actress doesn't even understand the character's actions!! 

[BabyBBQKendall]

Not 100% sure, but I think it was the scene where they fight with the fortune cookies. April was so callous in that fight that it really made no sense, because she was supposed to be fighting for her marriage, so she just came off as really dense at continuing to not understand why Jackson is pissed at her.

SD has always been a big April cheerleader, so it does say something that she was having difficulties bringing the motivation in that scene.

Edited July 20, 2016 by BlindMaryIngalls

[apn85]

 I could see it being that scene for sure. I think the part that stung the most for me in that particular scene was when April said, "What pisses you off so much? That I chose to go after the thing I needed to heal or that the thing I needed wasn't you?" 

Nope.  

I love April, but that was just.....nope. If you were trying to salvage your marriage then the very last thing you want to scream at your husband is how you didn't need him and he should basically get over the fact that he is upset that you left him for a solid year. Way to go. You're patching that right on up.

If that was the scene, then JW must've been ready to go to lunch. I don't see how *anyone* would have an understanding of that scene, but whatever scene it was, he is who got through to her so they could carry on filming. 

[BabyBBQKendall]

That line was so jaw-droppingly insensitive that I thought it was going to be revealed that April was suffering some hitherto unknown mental or emotional condition, but I guess we are supposed to take it on her word that she is all healed now. (Even if she still suffers from a transplanted personality.) 

[apn85]

I couldn't believe that entire argument. Not to mention him initiating sex at the end of it. Like really, dude? I would have walked straight out of the place and not looked back. If only we could have blamed it on an unknown mental/emotional condition. Which I think she totally had, but had completely convinced herself she was fine. I will not be surprised one bit if they go that route this season. After everything with Samuel, the divorce, the crazy delivery, having a brand new baby and hormones shifting to and fro - I could see her having some type of emotional snap/PTSD/whatever. Maybe not, but it'd be so typical. 

I was disappointed in the entire Samuel story line, to be honest. I know SD pitched the idea to Shonda, but I have to wonder if she meant for it to go the way it went. I guess I just saw it as having potential to be a really powerful story line that could unfortunately resonate with a lot of viewers that have experienced a loss like that in their lives. They could have gone so many other directions besides making Jackson and April another statistic. 

Oh well, they still haven't called and asked me for my opinion. ;) 

Edited July 22, 2016 by apn85

[BabyBBQKendall]

Ever since April came back from the ME with a brand-new personality, I thought they were setting up for a PTSD or PPD storyline that would somehow explain everything. Especially when we heard there'd be a flashback episode. But the longer the season went on, the less likely it became. And it seems a bit late now (unless the traumatic delivery triggers something big). Now I think they were just going for some hamfisted "independent woman" storyline, which probably means that Kepner 2.0 is here to stay. 

Yeah, the Samuel "arc" has been disappointing. (Can I call it an arc? It's been dragging on for two seasons now) I don't think the baby dying was necessarily the part that sunk it, but they pinned all of Jackson and April's current relationship problems on a series of decisions that basically all happened offscreen or during timehops. I can almost give them the first separation, because they had to keep the characters in a holding pattern while Meredith was off having her sabbatical, but after that they just kept compounding the problem. We never had a good read on why April chose to leave the second time, or why she assumed they could just pick up where they left off when she came back. It makes it really difficult to relate.

Edited July 23, 2016 by BlindMaryIngalls

[apn85]

Oh you can call it an arc. Absolutely. I just meant they could have gone the route of them grieving and healing together rather than, as you described perfectly, all their problems playing out off screen. I know some of it had to do with SD having a baby and being on maternity leave right in the middle of all that. Also like you mentioned, they had to speed things along for the Meredith story line. I'm sure some of it couldn't be prevented. I just wish if they had gone there that they would have really done a great job with it. 

As for the PTSD/PPD thing.....see I could totally see them going there now. The delivery/fear of losing another baby/parenting a newborn/etc just tipped her right on over whereas she was able to keep it together (depending on what your definition of together may be....) just enough to where nobody really picked up on it. Also, that would just drag the crap on for another season! How typical would that be!

Another thing I thought was SO weird about the finale episode was the old lady that had dementia and stabbed her son? Her thinking Jackson was her husband and some of the things she said to him - totally meant for us to read between the lines but I couldn't figure out why. Like her saying to him something along the lines of "You were supposed to take care of me. That is what a husband does." and Jackson standing there looking all guilty. I cannot figure out why that whole exchange with the lady happened and those things were said to him unless they were trying to set something up. I would say just for the sake of humor, but there was just something about it. Up to that point - Jackson and April had come to an agreement about the baby and as far as we knew had been living amicably. They called the truce at Joe's a few episodes earlier and hadn't had a fight since. So that is the only thing. I just had the thought of something happening with April this season that could explain all of the before and he left her without seeing what was really going on. Not saying he wasn't justified. 

Though you are probably right....it's probably all this independent woman hear me roar April 2.0 shit. I am all for independent women. However, when it causes as much trouble as it has caused April....check yourself!

And Lord knows we see things all the time that seem like they mean something and it's never mentioned again. May have been all the old lady was in the finale. A way to keep Jackson occupied so he wouldn't be able to get to April at Meredith's. 

Edited July 23, 2016 by apn85

[Scatterbrained]

12 hours ago, BlindMaryIngalls said:

We never had a good read on why April chose to leave the second time, or why she assumed they could just pick up where they left off when she came back. It makes it really difficult to relate.

There was a brief convo between Jackson and Owen after her 1st return where Owen asks how things are, Jackson says they are weird/difficult and Owen says that it's a common problem of people returning home, that the two environments are so different it's hard to re-adapt (or something to that effect).  I agree though, that we the viewers could use a little "more".

7 hours ago, apn85 said:

Another thing I thought was SO weird about the finale episode was the old lady that had dementia and stabbed her son? Her thinking Jackson was her husband and some of the things she said to him - totally meant for us to read between the lines but I couldn't figure out why. Like her saying to him something along the lines of "You were supposed to take care of me. That is what a husband does." and Jackson standing there looking all guilty. I cannot figure out why that whole exchange with the lady happened and those things were said to him unless they were trying to set something up. I would say just for the sake of humor, but there was just something about it. Up to that point - Jackson and April had come to an agreement about the baby and as far as we knew had been living amicably. They called the truce at Joe's a few episodes earlier and hadn't had a fight since. So that is the only thing. I just had the thought of something happening with April this season that could explain all of the before and he left her without seeing what was really going on. Not saying he wasn't justified. 

Though you are probably right....it's probably all this independent woman hear me roar April 2.0 shit. I am all for independent women. However, when it causes as much trouble as it has caused April....check yourself!

And Lord knows we see things all the time that seem like they mean something and it's never mentioned again. May have been all the old lady was in the finale. A way to keep Jackson occupied so he wouldn't be able to get to April at Meredith's. 

I've thought about this a lot, too, and the only "clever" idea (term used loosely) is that April wanted him to go with her both times and he refused, so maybe he is starting to evolve his thinking from "she left me" to "I should have been there WITH her" because we need an evolution in order for them to get back together.

[Scatterbrained]

Also, Patrick Dempsey's exit was announced 4/15 and Debbie Allen's Executive Director/Producer status was announced 5/15 (this new title means that she is on set all the time now, so writers can write her in at any time, instead of working around her availability).  I have a feeling that the Japril storyline is one that was altered with Dempsey's somewhat sudden exit.  With Allen's extra availability, Callie's exit, etc.. I think there will ever a stronger focus on Japril in season 13.

[BabyBBQKendall]

I thought the old lady was there to show how Jackson had failed as a husband. Which is bullshit for what we actually saw on the show, but whatever. 

[apn85]

3 hours ago, BlindMaryIngalls said:

I thought the old lady was there to show how Jackson had failed as a husband. Which is bullshit for what we actually saw on the show, but whatever. 

I agree with this! Which is why I was so confused. To watch up until that episode the overall feeling was that he had been the one left. April had been the one to leave and not be there for him when she should have been. For an entire season that has been the road we've traveled down, so it made no sense at all to me for those things to be said to him in the last episode. I thought don't leave me? That is what a husband does? IMO, he did what a husband should do in the aftermath of Samuel. Nonsensical. 

Scatterbrained: What you say makes sense. Maybe that was where they were going with it. Who knows! 

[BabyBBQKendall]

15 hours ago, Scatterbrained said:

 

I've thought about this a lot, too, and the only "clever" idea (term used loosely) is that April wanted him to go with her both times and he refused, so maybe he is starting to evolve his thinking from "she left me" to "I should have been there WITH her" because we need an evolution in order for them to get back together.

She didn't ask him to go the first time, did she? The second time, after she'd already made up her mind to leave him, was a wtf moment for me. Are we meant to have been hoping he'd say yes? But he did try to make the plane anyway. Apparently Jackson is a special kind of masochist. 

My feeling is they're retconning Jackson as a crappy husband to make the breakup seem more equitable. Their initial split was one-sided and it's hard to imagine how they get a reunion out of that. 

Edited July 24, 2016 by BlindMaryIngalls

[apn85]

Most likely. Rewriting history. They are super good at that!

And no, the first time she didn't ask him to go and it was supposed to just be for what? 3 months? Then she kept extending it. I think he had these feelings during that time also, he just didn't act on it and was trying hard to understand even though he was struggling. I remember when he heard explosions that time he was on the phone with her and they got disconnected and he couldn't reach her after that. He was freaking out inside. No clue if she was dead or alive. Arizona tells him that April lost a leg and she's having to learn how to walk again. He said if she lost a leg then I lost a leg too. Actually, poor guy lost both because with Samuel went April. When that happened he was basically by himself. Nobody really asked him how he was doing. I think that is all he wanted/needed.

I just don't like them trying to possibly turn any part back on him. I think you're right though. Prior to the finale, Jackson was very guarded with her. Wouldn't even allow himself to touch her. He was at the prenatal appointments, but I always got the impression it was for the baby and not April. I mean when Arizona did that whole pointless "I see something!" fiasco and April flipped out on her - Jackson never did walk over and comfort her. Granted, he didn't stop her from flipping out on Arizona, but I really noticed how wide the divide had gotten between them in that episode. Then she has to go and almost die in the finale. And here we go - back to square one. I don't know who it was directed at, but Jackson looked completely smitten in the final scene. I thought, "Well there he goes....." 

Season 13 will probably just be a continuation of the mess that is Jackson/April. I do love them together, but I hate the lack of progress. It's been the same argument (just different subject matter) the entire time they have been together. I never really know why I look so forward to the season premier, LOL

Edited July 24, 2016 by apn85

[Scatterbrained]

I stand to be corrected!  My username is TOTALLY legit.  

I had a different read on the prenatal appointment scenes.  To me it felt like he wanted to touch her, touch the belly, but, after the "it's my body, you have no rights" speech, AND the restraining order, didn't want to invade her space.  I thought he was just respecting what he thought were her wishes.  After the parking lot ceasefire where she let him feel the baby kick, they started to become friends again, but it's a tenuous relationship.  As far as not getting into the April-Arizona back-and-forth, I think he was more focused on attempting to read the medical information and make sense of it himself (and not freak out) and also let the girls hash it out amongst themselves since he knows they have a strong relationship with each other that he isn't really part of, to the point where Arizona was the first person to know about the baby, and is basically April's "person".  She's the confident and shoulder to cry on.  I don't think he wanted to get in the middle of that, or get caught in the middle of that.

I think they both have a problem with emotional honesty.  He has walls up and she feels inadequate and has a tendency to fail at her attempts at "doing the right thing".

[apn85]

I don't think you are scattered, LOL :) It's just simply different interpretations. I always enjoy reading how other people saw a scene. I'll discover things I never even thought about. 

I guess I saw it that way because, for example - Jackson's conversation with Ben. He's tried so hard to tell himself that he was over April. He went on that date. The scene where Ben and Jackson are talking about his troubles with Bailey and Ben tells him that's he's pissed but Miranda is the love of his life. "I mean you get it, you've got April!" Jackson's response, again, was him trying hard to be over her. So I guess I viewed all of that as more of the same - Jackson may have wanted to be more involved where she was concerned, but he had set boundaries. Be it respecting her wishes, convincing himself, or a combination of both - I just felt a pretty large divide by the end of the season. 

I agree 100% with the emotional honesty thing. They both have so many issues! Maybe one day they'll get it all figured out.