Morning Joe: All Episodes Talk

[Mumbles]

Just as a follow-up to the warm and fuzzy interview with the Koch Brothers a couple of weeks ago - here is an article about the extent to which they maintain intelligence on groups that go against the way they envision the way the world should be:

http://www.politico.com/story/2015/11/the-koch-brothers-intelligence-agency-215943

Aw but they're great guys!

[NextIteration]

I'm still fuming about the Koch Bros contribution to my daughter's very liberal college and she's secretly on the hunt about just where that money went.

 

Their contributions to universities and colleges makes me sick.  Persuade them early, of course.

[oakville]

Joe is wearing a suit today. serious show. They are in Washington. Mika is not on set yet. Joe said the Pentagon is being tougher on ISIS than Obama. Joe said the Pentagon supports Hollande position on more military strikes on Isis. Joe said Obama is on his own path & doesn't want to admit that their are special forces on the ground in Isis. Russia & France want the USA to do more. Jim said they don't want all the planes fliying at once.

 

Putin supports Assad but Obama wants him out of power. Putin doesn't care about civilian deaths so he can bomb Raqqa more than the USA>

[oakville]

Joe said Lindsay Graham & John Mccain were right to want to keep a permanent force in Iraq of 10-20K troops. They say this would have prevented Isis in Iraq.

 

John Kerry had to apologize for saying that Charlie Hebdo was a legitimate terrorist target. Christie said Kerry should shut up & get some sleep.

 

Joe said everyone he talks to said he was right about Obama & Kerry mishandling this crisis.

 

Jim Mackshevski said Obama is irritated with sending troops back to Iraq. Obama wants to finish his term by  ending the wars in Iraq & Afhanistan.

[Maire]

I used to dislike Cokie Roberts but now she is the only one on the panel making sense re: immigration.

[teddysmom]

Joe said Lindsay Graham & John Mccain were right to want to keep a permanent force in Iraq of 10-20K troops. They say this would have prevented Isis in Iraq.

 

You know what else would have prevented Isis, Joe? NOT INVADING IRAQ IN THE FIRST PLACE.

 

Joe said everyone he talks to said he was right about Obama & Kerry mishandling this crisis.

 

 

By everyone he means Mika, his reflection in the mirror, and the voices in his head. 

[Eliot]

I used to dislike Cokie Roberts but now she is the only one on the panel making sense re: immigration.

 

The minute I saw her face on the screen this morning I realized she looks EXACTLY like The Grinch.

 

John Kerry had to apologize for saying that Charlie Hebdo was a legitimate terrorist target.

 

Of course that was not at all what he said, but that is lost in the echo chamber.

[Ruby25]

Joe said Lindsay Graham & John Mccain were right to want to keep a permanent force in Iraq of 10-20K troops. They say this would have prevented Isis in Iraq.

Not invading Iraq also would have prevented ISIS in Iraq.

[MulletorHater]

You know what else would have prevented Isis, Joe? NOT INVADING IRAQ IN THE FIRST PLACE.

 

 

 

Shhhh....not so loud!  You know, nothing can go against Jeb's! Bizarro World narrative that his smirking big brother "kept us safe," which was followed with enthusiastic applause.

 

Since Joe and his ilk are so gung-ho about "boots on the ground," perhaps his children should be the first to leave their privileged lives behind and volunteer for the front lines.  Or, Joe should take them himself.

 

I wonder how Bloviating Joe and his wannabe Bond villianness feel about Trump's latest comments re: Syrian refugees.  I've come to think that this orange-colored bewigged fool could stand on his head nude on their desk, and they would still find a reason to defend him and give him tongue baths.

[teddysmom]

Since Joe and his ilk are so gung-ho about "boots on the ground," perhaps his children should be the first to leave their privileged lives behind and volunteer for the front lines.  Or, Joe should take them himself.

 

I tweeted at him that exact thing - You gonna drive your sons to the Recruiting Office, Joe?  

[oakville]

I tweeted at him that exact thing - You gonna drive your sons to the Recruiting Office, Joe?  

Joe told the secretary of defense that he did consider joining the army when he was in college. He offered 2 years of service but they wanted a longer term commitment. Joe declined because he wanted to go to law school. Joe is a true patriot:)

[stormy]

For Joe and all his war-loving friends, I highly recommend CNN"s "Blindsided: How ISIS Shook the World" with Fareed Zakaria.

Then, shut up.

[suomi]

I'm reading Joe Meacham's Bush The Elder bio. He writes that uring the '88 campaign

 

Trump mentioned his availability as a vice-presidential candidate to Lee Atwater. Bush thought the overture "strange and unbelievable."

 

Since I recently learned of Joe's political aspirations I expect to be having nightmares about a Trump/Scarborough ticket someday.

[oakville]

I'm reading Joe Meacham's Bush The Elder bio. He writes that uring the '88 campaign

 

 

 

 

Since I recently learned of Joe's political aspirations I expect to be having nightmares about a Trump/Scarborough ticket someday.

I was thinking of getting Meacham's book for Xmas. Is it worth buying?

 

Trump/Scarborough would be a hilarious but scary ticket.

[suomi]

I was thinking of getting Meacham's book for Xmas. Is it worth buying?

I think so. I've reached the beginning of the '88 campaign, and Kindle tells me I'm at the 30% mark. Thus far it has mostly been familiar territory except for the detailed background of earlier Bush/Pierce generations. The use of his and Barbara's diary entries along with the Meacham interviews are adding some flavor to the familiar. My impression is that there was much (unacknowledged) inner conflict because of certain standards he was raised to revere versus his ambition. I'm conflicted as well because of my prejudice that any CIA director is at least dirty if not filthy, yet ol' Poppy seems like a good guy. With 70% of the book to go, I'm hoping that the remainder will reveal lesser known material and insights.

[oakville]

Thanks Suomi! I will buy the book. I always liked him because he was a WW2 vet like my dad.

[oakville]

Monday Morning Joe ranted today against President Obama for downplaying the ISIS threat. Joe said Obama is living in a bubble & is detached from reality. Joe was commenting on a NY Times report that the Pentagon was editing reports on ISIS to make them look not as bad. This would make Obama happy. Joe said the military should stop trying to edit the intelligence reports & should tell Obama the true facts. They didn't show any evidence of the "edited" reports. Joe said the Pentagon edited reports to make the Iraq war look better than it was during the Bush presidency. It's surprising that the military would do this.

 

More polls. Trump is back in first place. Carson is falling & Rubio & Cruz are gaining.

[Landsnark]

Good God, Joe was ranting this morning.  I just flicked the channel over and half watched for a moment and he was in full bloviation.  He was shouting down others, bullying, ignoring anything anyone said.  He claims that there is a long line of Democrats who tell him they agree with Joe's withering, aggressive reaction to Obama's benign comments.

President Obama's comments are so measured and adult, I just can't think of where Joe finds the energy and anger in opposition.

Edited November 23, 2015 by Landsnark

[Eliot]

I know. What's Obama supposed to do? Run around screaming and freaking out?

[teddysmom]

I know. What's Obama supposed to do? Run around screaming and freaking out?

 

The only reason Joe is doing this is because he wants to get on the good side of Trump.  Remember how he kissed Christie's ass when he was thought to be the front runner?  Now he's moved on to Trump, Joe will try to hitch his wagon to whatever idiot he thinks will give him a job in the WH.   

[Dagny]

I know. What's Obama supposed to do? Run around screaming and freaking out?

 

He wants Obama to go off the deep end and start rounding up people who have funny names and look different. It makes people FEEL better. It doesn't help in the long run, but FEELINGS are better than logic.

[ShuFace88]

 

 

For Joe and all his war-loving friends, I highly recommend CNN"s "Blindsided: How ISIS Shook the World" with Fareed Zakaria.

Then, shut up.

 

Joe obviously did not watch this.  The two major points I took away from "Blindsided" were:

 

1.  Our invasion of Iraq after 9/11 directly led to the creation and rise of ISIS.

2.  Putting "boots on the ground" in Syria is exactly what ISIS wants.

 

Do Joe or any of his Republican cronies ever think about what happens after we invade Syria?  Where will the next rogue terrorist group pop up then?  Joe said that the terrorists always die when we invade but how many American soldiers die also?  At least Barnicle responded to the poll on millenials by asking if they were planning on going to fight in Syria.

 

I forget the man's name but they had an expert on ISIS on who said the reason he thinks ISIS is perpetrating more attacks now is because they are losing their territory in Syria and Iraq.  Doesn't that back up what Obama was saying about them being contained?  I think the president is correct in calling them the "JV' team and saying they're a bunch of guys with guns and a social media presence.  Why would we want to give ISIS the satisfaction of thinking they are on our level?

 

Once again, I am relieved that Obama is the president.  He is talking a calm and rational approach to the threat from ISIS.  Panicking and overreacting would only play into ISIS's hands.  

 

 

Joe told the secretary of defense that he did consider joining the army when he was in college. He offered 2 years of service but they wanted a longer term commitment. Joe declined because he wanted to go to law school. Joe is a true patriot:)

 

My husband and 2 of his friends were in the Army Reserves while also going to law school at the same time.  One weekend a month and two weeks in the summer leaves plenty of time to both serve your country and go to school.  Nice try, Joe!

Edited November 23, 2015 by ShuFace88

[oakville]

The only reason Joe is doing this is because he wants to get on the good side of Trump.  Remember how he kissed Christie's ass when he was thought to be the front runner?  Now he's moved on to Trump, Joe will try to hitch his wagon to whatever idiot he thinks will give him a job in the WH.   

That's a very good observation. In 2011, prior to Christie's announcement not to run, Mika said she was on the phone with him discussing his decision. Mika & Joe were vey close to Christie. They were very upset that he did not run. I do wonder if they would have joined his campaign?. Joe's love of Trump knows no bounds. He is comparing him to Reagan. Wasn't Reagan a two term Governor of California before he ran for President?.

 

I forgot to mention that they showed the polls between Hillary vs the GOP contenders. Hillary is losing to everyone except Fiorina. How is that possible? Trump was beating her by 6 points?

[teddysmom]

I forgot to mention that they showed the polls between Hillary vs the GOP contenders. Hillary is losing to everyone except Fiorina. How is that possible? Trump was beating her by 6 points?

 

I would imagine it depends on who they're polling.   It sounds like it's skewing Republicans, because I can't think of a single Democrat, or person in their right mind, who would vote for Donald Trump over any of the three Democratic candidates. 

[teddysmom]

Monday Morning Joe ranted today against President Obama for downplaying the ISIS threat. Joe said Obama is living in a bubble & is detached from reality. Joe was commenting on a NY Times report that the Pentagon was editing reports on ISIS to make them look not as bad. This would make Obama happy. Joe said the military should stop trying to edit the intelligence reports & should tell Obama the true facts. They didn't show any evidence of the "edited" reports. Joe said the Pentagon edited reports to make the Iraq war look better than it was during the Bush presidency. It's surprising that the military would do this.

 

I heard about US Intelligence and the Pentagon  editing these reports several months ago.  

[NextIteration]

I don't even need to watch Blindsided to know that our invasion of Iraq led directly to the rise of Daesh.  Bagdadi told the soldiers that were holding him that he'd "See the in New York" when he was released from detention.  He was in detention with all the previous Iraqi Army leaders that landed there after the de-Ba'athification of Iraq under the scum L. Paul Bremer.

 

Why Joe pretends to not understand these basic facts is bullshit (he does) he's just spewing the GOP talking points, as he always does.

 

Now that they are conflating Daesh terrorists with Syrian refugees (not one of the terrorists in the Paris attacks was Syrian), I can't do anything but shake my head.  Didn't Americans learn about conflation of events when we invaded Iraq because 9/11?

[Eliot]

I would imagine it depends on who they're polling.   It sounds like it's skewing Republicans, because I can't think of a single Democrat, or person in their right mind, who would vote for Donald Trump over any of the three Democratic candidates. 

 

It was a FOX News poll, so, yeah.

 

Why Joe pretends to not understand these basic facts is bullshit (he does) he's just spewing the GOP talking points, as he always does.

 

What boggles my mind is that he can sit there straight-faced and claim that it was our withdrawal from Iraq that led to the rise of ISIL. Not the invasion (because that happened under the GOP, of course). Ugh. I don't know why I still watch this dreck.

[oakville]

It was a FOX News poll, so, yeah.

 

 

 

 

What boggles my mind is that he can sit there straight-faced and claim that it was our withdrawal from Iraq that led to the rise of ISIL. Not the invasion (because that happened under the GOP, of course). Ugh. I don't know why I still watch this dreck.

 

I could understand a Fox news poll skewing the GOP vote a bit, but it was baffling how everyone was beating Hillary. I think some GOP candidates like Kasich & Rubio would do better than Hillary but it's weird that Carson ,Cruz or Trump would be leading Hillary.

 

I think that the situation in Iraq was relatively calm before the withdrawal of all US forces in Iraq. Apparently, the Shia Muslim President,Maliki had got rid of many Sunni generals in Iraq.  The Sunnis in western Iraq aren't happy with Shia rule from Baghdad.

 

It's a messy situation in the Middle East.

[suomi]

There was criticism as well as commentary at the roundtable this morning re Trump's "Muslim tailgate party" claims. Joe elevated commentary to criticism by putting words in others' mouths (Mika). Joe minimized and deflected any/all less than positive thoughts/statements from everyone re Trump's claims. Paraphrasing; "Republicans make wild claims every four years." I gotta give Mika some credit because she stated her position/commentary "for the fourth time" and each time Joe batted it away. Just, wow. Asshole.

[NextIteration]

I think that the situation in Iraq was relatively calm before the withdrawal of all US forces in Iraq.

 

How so?  We completely destabilized Iraq politically.  What would be the measure of calm?  Less then 20 suicide bombers a day somewhere in the country?

 

I think it's important to always step back and remember that many of the Middle Eastern countries were mostly drawn on maps by the British with no consideration given to the ethnicities, culture and religion of the people inside their lines on paper.

 

The minute we pulled out of Iraq, it was going to devolve into a civil war.  Like it or not, strongmen like Hussien, kept an unlikely country stable, with atrocities of course, but contained.

[teddysmom]

I could understand a Fox news poll skewing the GOP vote a bit, but it was baffling how everyone was beating Hillary. I think some GOP candidates like Kasich & Rubio would do better than Hillary but it's weird that Carson ,Cruz or Trump would be leading Hillary.

 

You have to understand that most Republicans would cut off their own arm before voting for a Clinton.  And as it has been stated by several people on several occasions, never underestimate a person's desire to vote against his own best interest to prove a point.  

[Landsnark]

Joe and that shrew Peggy Noonan were in ecstasy criticizing the true villain of these horrible terrorist attacks, US President Barack Obama.

Trump's campaign has gone full-on insane.  His hateful rhetoric isn't even masked any longer.  How long until he just uses flat-out, un-nuanced pejoratives to describe minorities?

 

I wonder how Joe will bend the narrative to explain how it's a show of weakness that President Hollande flew to visit President Obama?

[NextIteration]

Joe and that shrew Peggy Noonan were in ecstasy

 

You forgot that wretched "journalist" Ron Fournier.

[teddysmom]

You know I kinda hope Trump gets the GOP nomination.

 

Hillary Clinton will eat him alive.  Talk about bringing a knife to a gun fight.   She won't even break a sweat. 

[SFoster21]

You know I kinda hope Trump gets the GOP nomination.

Hillary Clinton will eat him alive. Talk about bringing a knife to a gun fight. She won't even break a sweat.

My lady is a force! Rise up like Medusa and turn them all to talcum powder! Edited November 24, 2015 by SFoster21

[stormy]

I agree that it would take hell to freeze over before some republicans would vote for Hillary. However, I think they would stay home before they voted for Trump or Carson.

It's pretty pathetic to think that republican leaders convened on the eve of President Obama's first inauguration on how to stop him from succeeding no matter what but they all sit by watching Trump, the fake republican, drive the bus into the ditch.

[teddysmom]

It's pretty pathetic to think that republican leaders convened on the eve of President Obama's first inauguration on how to stop him from succeeding no matter what but they all sit by watching Trump, the fake republican, drive the bus into the ditch

 

 

I don't think they're sitting by, they just don't know what to do. They don't have a real candidate that can discuss the issues.   There is no elder statesman, no one with any real experience in Congress doing anything but sounding like they're batshit crazy, so Trump looks pretty good to the base who say they like him "because he's a business man, he's not a politician".

 

Good luck with that when the shit gets real, idiots. 

[Landsnark]

I'm super curious now as to how Turkey shooting down a Russian jet is Obama's fault and Obama handled it badly?  Oh, dear... what would Ronnie do, Peggy?  Joe?  What would Ronnie do?  [sobs.  clutches pearls.]

[teddysmom]

Because he should have forced Russia to obey him? 

Edited November 24, 2015 by teddysmom

[MulletorHater]

Good God, Joe was ranting this morning.  I just flicked the channel over and half watched for a moment and he was in full bloviation.  He was shouting down others, bullying, ignoring anything anyone said.  He claims that there is a long line of Democrats who tell him they agree with Joe's withering, aggressive reaction to Obama's benign comments.

President Obama's comments are so measured and adult, I just can't think of where Joe finds the energy and anger in opposition.

 

 

I was thoroughly convinced years ago that President Obama's detractors want him to go full-on Samuel L. Jackson in "Pulp Fiction," so that they can claim he's an "angry Black man"--just so long as his anger isn't directed at them.  I've seen online memes in the last few days calling Obama Putin's "bitch," and worse.  To my way of thinking, the biggest bitches are those who are riding Putin's jock.  Evidently, they hate Obama more than they love this country which goes a long way toward explaining why Paul Ryan and a bunch of others conspired to thwart the new president at every opportunity the night of his first inauguration.  Obama has always struck me as the guy who takes the tortoise/hare approach to problems and is often the adult in the room.  He's always playing chess while others are playing checkers and Old Maid.

 

His foreign policy philosophy could be succinctly summed up as:  Keeping Americans off of Middle Eastern sand, fighting civil wars that have been going on for centuries, for people who don't want us there.  

 

They [the GOP] don't have a real candidate that can discuss the issues.   There is no elder statesman, no one with any real experience in Congress doing anything but sounding like they're batshit crazy, so Trump looks pretty good to the base who say they like him "because he's a business man, he's not a politician".

 

 

 

And, you know what?  They have nobody to blame but themselves for the dilemma they are in.  From Nixon's Southern Strategy to Trump's overt racism, the party has moved further and further to the right.  Kasich would probably be their best bet but he can't be heard above the din.  Notice that when Trump speaks--no matter how outrageous his comments are--the rest follow suit to prove their bona fides in batshit craziness.  As an added bonus, they even claim to watch videos that simply don't exist.  Even worst, they have governors who have (a) made their states hell holes; and (b) who are reviled by the citizens in their respective states actually believing that they should get their hands on the nation's purse strings.  Don't even get me started on the business owners who are fiscally irresponsible and who have driven storied companies into the ground.  But, yes...why don't we turn our nation over to them!  Special honors go to Jeb! who evidently thought his road to the nomination would be a cakewalk.  He's his "own man," but surrounds himself with the same neo-con advisers who got us into the mess we are in now.  

 

I read the New York Times' articles about Poppy Bush's dismay about the state of the race and his ire about how sleazy politics have become.  I realize that some see him as an elder statesman, but I was alive when he launched his own campaign and I have two words:  Willie Horton.  It was the ultimate in racial dog whistles and was employed quite effectively by the late Lee Atwater.  And, surely Poppy wasn't asleep when George II and his team trashed John McCain during the South Carolina primaries and when Secretary John Kerry (a decorated Vietnam War veteran) got swift-boated.  In fact, Jeb! wrote a letter to the Swift Boat Liars Club thanking them for their smear campaign.  And, now a decade later, Jeb! and his family have the audacity to be disgusted by Trump's shenanigans.  The whole lot of them need to go somewhere and take a stadium full of seats and retire from public life.  No more sons of Bushes in the White House!

Edited November 24, 2015 by MulletorHater

[oakville]

The crisis is over. Joe is back to wearing fleece. Joe said Obama never admits when he is wrong. Joe mocked Obama over his handling of Syria & Isis. Cackles said her dad still likes Trump. Ratner defended Obama. Mika said Trump discussion of Muslims cheering the terrorist attacks on 9/11 will hurt him in the general election. Joe got mad at her & she put her head down & tried to read the news. Joe s very dismissive of Mika.

[Maire]

These jackals criticize Obama for his demeanor. What are they looking for? weeping and gnashing of teeth? At the same time they laugh approvingly at Trump and his bluster and craziness. The man is not right in the head but he is never criticized over demeanor.

 

I don't go to church anymore but when I listen to this show I am offering my suffering  for the souls in purgatory.

 

eta. There is an excellent article in today's Star Ledger from the AG who actually WAS in charge in NJ on 9/11 debunking Trump's claims.

www.nj.com

Edited November 25, 2015 by Maire

[QQQQ]

I would sooner vote for Scott Disick, the ShamWow guy, or Zsa Zsa Gabor than Donald Trump.

[ShuFace88]

I watched for 2 hours this morning to see Joe's reaction to the Chicago police officer being charged with murder for shooting an unarmed teenager 16 times.  I guess I missed the intelligent discussion they must have had on this.  Why waste time on something important when we have Trump videos to show and Obama bashing to do?

[NextIteration]

The whole lot of them need to go somewhere and take a stadium full of seats and retire from public life.  No more sons of Bushes in the White House!

 

Crushing applause, to your whole post but especially this.

[teddysmom]

Why waste time on something important when we have Trump videos to show and Obama bashing to do?

 

 

The fact that they have that pos Karl Rove AND Rudy Guiliani on their set proves what a bunch of GOP toadies they are. I wouldn't trust either one of those assholes to tell me what color the sky is, let alone have an intelligent unbiased discussion on foreign policy. 

[Landsnark]

For a blink, during the period when Rove was on, I saw Cackles and didn't immediately recognize her and thought she was attractive.  "The View" money is looking good on her.  And, she's learned how to apply makeup, how to hire a pro to do her hair well, and probably exercise/eat right.  She's evil and a ****, but money looks good on her... as it does on most.

Rove doesn't even know who will get the nomination and is 100% sure Trump is a clown.  Joe didn't like Rove's estimation.  Joe called Bush "the best leader I've ever seen" when he was a governor.  Called him a "great governor."
I cannot understand why I watch this show.  I hate it so much.

Edited November 25, 2015 by Landsnark

[LuciaMia]

 

"because he's a business man, he's not a politician".

Love how so many conservatives have in the past pushed the concept that "We need someone who can run this country like a business!"  And now they think they've got that 'someone' in Trump?   Now, how many bankruptcies has he gone through?

[slensam]

Love how so many conservatives have in the past pushed the concept that "We need someone who can run this country like a business!"  And now they think they've got that 'someone' in Trump?   Now, how many bankruptcies has he gone through?

Apart from the bankruptcies, what I knew of Trump while growing up in Jersey for thirty years or so is all the tacky shit he built in Atlantic City. He isn't some Rockefeller or even Perot for that matter. His taste and skills is that of a scumbag.

[teddysmom]

Apart from the bankruptcies, what I knew of Trump while growing up in Jersey for thirty years or so is all the tacky shit he built in Atlantic City. He isn't some Rockefeller or even Perot for that matter. His taste and skills is that of a scumbag.

 

 

I saw Ivanka (the daughter?) on GMA today, Amy Robach was interviewing her.  I couldn't believe either one of them could keep a straight face discussing him.  But I guess being the heir to a billion dollar empire will make you a little less critical of your father's racism, hypocrisy and just all around douchebaggery.

 

As far as Amy, I have no idea who she pissed off to get that assignment.