Disney Films

[Trini]

On 5/31/2019 at 9:05 PM, starri said:

But why does Disney in particular get this level of ire?  How many different Shakespeare adaptations have there been?  Or Dickens?  

I guess where I'm coming from is that I'd rather see the story told well, even if it is adapted from an earlier work.

Just to be clear; my previous comment was voicing my annoyance at yet another Grimm tale and not really about Disney. But yes, I'm also not interested in yet another A Christmas Carol unless it's doing something particularly different. (Like muppets!)

However -- Disney doing adaptations of their own adaptations is also annoying; and they have other properties that I think should be remade (if they must) before yet another Snow White.

[Spartan Girl]

If I may change the subject...

I've been thinking a lot about the Sultan in Aladdin in terms of how he ranks among Disney parents. On one hand, he is a sweet old man who genuinely loves his daughter. The writers could have done the usual sterotype of the Middle Eastern father who thinks daughters are only good for marrying off, but the Sultan isn't like that. Yes, he's pressuring Jasmine to marry, only at the same time he's admitted that he just can't bring himself to force her to marry someone she hates. It's not just the law, he just wants to make sure she's taken care of (although he fails to realize that she can take care of herself). Hell, his first reaction when Jafar tries to insert himself as a suitor is "But you're so old!" LOL, classic.

Yet at the same time....he's a terrible leader. Half the reason why Jafar was able to get away with crap for so long -- aside from the magical hypnizing snake staff -- was that the Sultan is the kind of guy who's rather play with his toys than deal with politics. He wrongly trusts Jafar to take care of everything. And he's completely oblivious to the poor people in Agrabah.

Don't get me wrong, he's not a bad guy, just oblivious and dim witted. Although to be fair, he does become a better ruler in the sequels and TV series once Aladdin and Jasmine open his eyes to the plight of the poor people. Not to mention the TV show unleashes his inner badass: he helps Jasmine escape from a bunch of Amazon fighters and he gets possessed by evil armor that makes him invincible.

He should also get credit for his relationship with Aladdin. Once he sees his true worth (and how much he and Jasmine love each other) he changes the law so that they can marry. And in the sequels and TV series, he grows fonder of Aladdin never holds his past against him. Even when he gets angry and disappointed when he hides Iago and later busts his dad Casssim out of the dungeon, he eventually understands why and forgives him.

So all in all, the Sultan isn't perfect...but he's still universes better than Anna and Elsa's parents.

Edited June 2, 2019 by Spartan Girl

[GHScorpiosRule]

The problem with the animated Aladdin is that it's a mishmash of what they thought was Arabic/Moghul rule and Hindustani rulers/mores. Jasmine's father is animated to look like an Indian Maharajah; Raja, the tiger, is a Hindu name. And while history only tells the tales of male rulers, India had some phenomenal queens, both Hindu and Moghul, who ruled during war time. Some after being widowed; some while their husbands, the king, was still alive.

That's not to say that I didn't enjoy it--I LOVED the animated theatrical version. And the television series.

And while I haven't seen the live version, based on the comments, it seems Disney should have done better research, to get more accurate clothing that Arabs wore during this period, as well as the music, OR should have switched it to take place in India. Because Naomi's outfits, in the marketplace and from the stills I saw of her as Princess Jasmine, are all of East/South Indian design. Just because the actress playing Jasmine is half Indian, her character is not. Google is your friend. They could have done the research to find accurate costume designing, just as Hollywood claims it does for the numerous period pieces they do for theatrical, cable and television.

So it's not unrealistic or unbelievable of how the live action movie ended with respect to Jasmine--had she been a Hindustani princess or even a Moghul one who ruled India waaay back, because I've read about them. I can't speak to the Arab world, since I'm not knowledgeable about its history of rulers.  BUT. It's a movie, so they can do what they want. I'm NOT dismissing the ending as unbelievable. Just based on what I've read about the music, costume design,etc., it sounds like it should have been set in India. But that's not the story, so they should have done a better job.

Just my take.

[Katy M]

1 hour ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

The problem with the animated Aladdin is that it's a mishmash of what they thought was Arabic/Moghul rule and Hindustani rulers/mores. Jasmine's father is animated to look like an Indian Maharajah; Raja, the tiger, is a Hindu name. And while history only tells the tales of male rulers, India had some phenomenal queens, both Hindu and Moghul, who ruled during war time. Some after being widowed; some while their husbands, the king, was still alive.

That's not to say that I didn't enjoy it--I LOVED the animated theatrical version. And the television series.

And while I haven't seen the live version, based on the comments, it seems Disney should have done better research, to get more accurate clothing that Arabs wore during this period, as well as the music, OR should have switched it to take place in India. Because Naomi's outfits, in the marketplace and from the stills I saw of her as Princess Jasmine, are all of East/South Indian design. Just because the actress playing Jasmine is half Indian, her character is not. Google is your friend. They could have done the research to find accurate costume designing, just as Hollywood claims it does for the numerous period pieces they do for theatrical, cable and television.

So it's not unrealistic or unbelievable of how the live action movie ended with respect to Jasmine--had she been a Hindustani princess or even a Moghul one who ruled India waaay back, because I've read about them. I can't speak to the Arab world, since I'm not knowledgeable about its history of rulers.  BUT. It's a movie, so they can do what they want. I'm NOT dismissing the ending as unbelievable. Just based on what I've read about the music, costume design,etc., it sounds like it should have been set in India. But that's not the story, so they should have done a better job.

Just my take.

I don't expect the Disney fantasy movies to be historically accurate.  Like at all.  I just don't.  It's not what they're for.

[Trini]

2 hours ago, Katy M said:

I don't expect the Disney fantasy movies to be historically accurate.  Like at all.  I just don't.  It's not what they're for.

And with Aladdin in particular, it's set in a fictional fantasy land, so I give them a little more leeway.

[GHScorpiosRule]

More power to you. And I mean that sincerely. But as someone who is Indian, I’m going to side-eye this kind of laziness in 2019, fantasy or not.

[Spartan Girl]

2 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

More power to you. And I mean that sincerely. But as someone who is Indian, I’m going to side-eye this kind of laziness in 2019, fantasy or not.

If Disney wanted to do an actual Indian fantasy movie, animated or live action, I would LOVE for them to do The Ramayana! I read it in high school and I fell in love with it (except for the ending which completely screws over poor Sita). But if done correctly it would make great fresh material for Disney.

[GHScorpiosRule]

1 minute ago, Spartan Girl said:

If Disney wanted to do an actual Indian fantasy movie, animated or live action, I would LOVE for them to do The Ramayana! I read it in high school and I fell in love with it (except for the ending which completely screws over poor Sita). But if done correctly it would make great fresh material for Disney.

Oh yeah. Love, Jealousy, Honor, Brotherly love and loyalty, and a great Villain in both Ram’s Stepmother and Ravan. But a movie wouldn’t do it justice. You’d need a mini-series...and how Ram’s exile was a result of his father’s youthful accidental mishap that resulted in an innocent’s death.

Can you tell I’m VERY familiar with this story?

[Spartan Girl]

6 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

Oh yeah. Love, Jealousy, Honor, Brotherly love and loyalty, and a great Villain in both Ram’s Stepmother and Ravan. But a movie wouldn’t do it justice. You’d need a mini-series...and how Ram’s exile was a result of his father’s youthful accidental mishap that resulted in an innocent’s death.

Can you tell I’m VERY familiar with this story?

Same! Maybe Netflix should do a miniseries ;)

Back to Aladdin, another scene that shows just how incompetent the Sultan was in the first movie was how he handled Jasmine telling him that Jafar had Aladdin unjustly executed.  His idea of "setting things right" was giving Jafar a stern lecture and sweeping it under the rug. SERIOUSLY. An innocent person was murdered and you are just going to overlook it?!

Yes, Aladdin wasn't really dead, but still!

[GHScorpiosRule]

I should add that among Hindus, The Ramayana wasn’t a fantasy, but a true story. Ram was one of many incarnations of Lord Vishnu.

[Spartan Girl]

I've been rewatching the Toy Story films, and I just like to say that Bo Peep may have been a porcelain doll, but even if she wasn't as outgoing as Jessie, she was still awesome in her own way.  She was the no-nonsense voice of reason in Andy's room.

[Mabinogia]

I tend to prefer Bo Peeps quiet strength to Jessie's in your face yee hawing. I'm not sure I really like the panting of Bo though. It just feels slightly like saying you can't wear a dress and be tough or a badass. It's not a hill I'd die on, it just slightly annoys me. I liked her old look. 

[Spartan Girl]

18 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

I tend to prefer Bo Peeps quiet strength to Jessie's in your face yee hawing. I'm not sure I really like the panting of Bo though. It just feels slightly like saying you can't wear a dress and be tough or a badass. It's not a hill I'd die on, it just slightly annoys me. I liked her old look. 

Well, to be fair, her new outfit is more practical for what appears to be her new nomadic life, it's not really a statement that you can't wear dresses and be a badass.  Her original dress wasn't designed for that kind of life.

And Jessie had her "quiet moments of strength" too, particularly in the incinerator scene in  Toy Story 3.  The look she shares with Buzz when they both realize that there's no point, and then her gently stopping Bullseye's frantric scrambling was very powerful.  Actually that whole scene was a great "quiet strength" for all of them: "we're going to die, but we're going to die a family."

Dammit, it's getting dusty again...

[Spartan Girl]

Another great video analysis from The Take by ScreenPrism!

[Dee]

Melissa McCarthy in Talks to Play Ursula in Disney's Live-Action 'Little Mermaid'

Quote

The actress is in talks to play Ursula, one of the biggest villains in Disney’s pantheon, for the studio’s live-action remake of The Little Mermaid, The Hollywood Reporter has confirmed. Rob Marshall is directing.  

[Spartan Girl]

1 hour ago, Dee said:

Melissa McCarthy in Talks to Play Ursula in Disney's Live-Action 'Little Mermaid'

That could be fun. 

Some people are upset because they wanted her to played by a drag queen. And while that would be awesome, I had no illusions that Disney would be that bold.

And there are others that are complaining that it's inconsistent because Ursula's daughter in those Descendants shows is black. To which I say, these fools actually think that crap is canon?

 

[Dee]

If Zendaya is on the shortlist to play Ariel, Disney is missing the boat by not casting Lizzo as Ursula.

[Spartan Girl]

That would be great. And I'm still hoping for Zendaya as Ariel.

I'm pretty sure Ursula is going to be CGI'd, regardless of who plays her.

[laffytaffy997]

I swore I heard that they were casting Lea Michele as Ariel, so I looked up to see where I got that idea from. She’s actually played her at the Hollywood bowl in May. But didn’t they just do a Little Mermaid Hollywood bowl show recently before that? I remember Rebel Wilson playing Ursula. 

[Trini]

On 6/28/2019 at 8:51 PM, Spartan Girl said:

Some people are upset because they wanted her to played by a drag queen. And while that would be awesome, I had no illusions that Disney would be that bold.

I didn't think they'd pick a man for the role either, but I was hoping they'd go for a black woman. And there are so many singer/actresses with enough starpower to choose from. Can McCarthy sing?

[Guest]

56 minutes ago, Trini said:

Can McCarthy sing?

I had the same question. Looks like she can. 

[BetterButter]

Disney Finds 'Little Mermaid' Star in Singer Halle Bailey

[ruby24]

Interesting.

[Dee]

Yay! I LOVE Halle & Chloe! SO excited for her!

[Spartan Girl]

I had to look up a clip of her singing because I never heard of Halle and Chloe, and she is PERFECT! "Part of Your World" is in good hands!

[Dee]

[Dee]

[Trini]

Speaking of remakes/etc. , any updates on the live-action Mulan?

Edited July 4, 2019 by Trini

[Anduin]

4 hours ago, BetterButter said:

Disney Finds 'Little Mermaid' Star in Singer Halle Bailey

Really? There's no singing listed on her IMD... hang on, you said Bailey? Oh, okay. That's more like it. fair enough, carry on.

[SimoneS]

Halle as Ariel is great casting on talent. The racists complaining on social media can just shut the hell up and don't go see the movie.

[Spartan Girl]

1 hour ago, SimoneS said:

Halle as Ariel is great casting on talent. The racists complaining on social media can just shut the hell up and don't go see the movie.

Seriously. Even worse are the assholes going "I'm not racist but this just doesn't feel realistic" and "I'm not racist but red haired white people/gingers need representation too."

 

 

Edited July 5, 2019 by Spartan Girl

[Guest]

Great casting. Her version of Unforgettable is amazing and I actually think she has the right look for Ariel. Matching Ariel’s temperament is far more important than matching her coloring. 🤞that they find the right Eric. 

Edited July 5, 2019 by Guest

[Guest]

On 7/3/2019 at 6:20 PM, Trini said:

Speaking of remakes/etc. , any updates on the live-action Mulan?

One of the cast members has hinted that the teaser trailer will air during the World Cup. 

[swanpride]

Yeah…I mean, I have some understanding for people who want that, say, superman should look as superman as possible. But in this case? Even if it is a Remake, it is a Remake of a movie based on a fairy tale. There is no rule whatsoever that The Little Mermaid has to be a redhead. In fact, in most adaptation she isn't (I think the Czech one from the 1970s was the first one in which she was a red-head in her human form - she had blue hair as a mermaid).

I would say that the quality of the voice is more important. And naturally acting abilities.

[Notwisconsin]

21 minutes ago, swanpride said:

But in this case? Even if it is a Remake, it is a Remake of a movie based on a fairy tale. There is no rule whatsoever that The Little Mermaid has to be a redhead.

With that logic, there's no rule that says Mulan has to be Chinese. Aladdin was in the original work.

[swanpride]

I wasn't aware that Mulan belongs to an entirely fictional species….

[Guest]

2 hours ago, swanpride said:

Yeah…I mean, I have some understanding for people who want that, say, superman should look as superman as possible. But in this case? Even if it is a Remake, it is a Remake of a movie based on a fairy tale. There is no rule whatsoever that The Little Mermaid has to be a redhead. In fact, in most adaptation she isn't (I think the Czech one from the 1970s was the first one in which she was a red-head in her human form - she had blue hair as a mermaid).

I would say that the quality of the voice is more important. And naturally acting abilities.

I wouldn’t be surprised if she is a redhead for the movie. A Japanese actress played Ariel in the broadway musical wearing a red wig. Although it would probably be a natural shade of red which Ariel’s hair definitely was not.

There is a picture on Twitter of Halle with red hair and she looks great. 

2 hours ago, Notwisconsin said:

With that logic, there's no rule that says Mulan has to be Chinese. Aladdin was in the original work.

Mulan isn’t a fairy tale. She is based on a Chinese legend. 

Edited July 6, 2019 by Guest

[Guest]

Harry Styles in Talks to Play Prince Eric in Disney's Live-Action 'Little Mermaid'

Maybe he’ll surprise me but I’m going to be disappointed if this is true. 

[MelloYellow]

[Spartan Girl]

On 7/16/2019 at 5:28 PM, Dani said:

Harry Styles in Talks to Play Prince Eric in Disney's Live-Action 'Little Mermaid'

Maybe he’ll surprise me but I’m going to be disappointed if this is true. 

Looks like he turned it down

I don't dislike Harry, but it's probably all for the best.  

[Blergh]

14 minutes ago, Spartan Girl said:

Looks like he turned it down

I don't dislike Harry, but it's probably all for the best.  

I agree. It's tough enough to be known as an ex One Direction singer, a Taylor Swift ex without also forever being known as Live Action Little Mermaid's Prince Eric!  

[joanne3482]

I too am glad he turned it down. I don't dislike Harry, but I'm not overwhelmingly in awe of him either. I'd prefer it to go to someone who is lesser known.  I'm also on the fence about Melissa McCarthy. Lizzo's tweet about wanting it so much touched my heart a little bit. 

[Silver Raven]

Emma Stone as Cruella DeVille in the upcoming Cruella.

Edited August 24, 2019 by Silver Raven

[Wiendish Fitch]

6 minutes ago, Silver Raven said:

Emma Stone as Cruella DeVille in the upcoming Cruella.

I simply can't wait to see how they're going to try to give her some dumbass backstory to make her sympathetic. Because God forbid we just have villains who we're supposed to hate. Gag.

[ruby24]

Oh  wow, I thought that was Helena Bonham Carter for a second. And now that I think about it, she would have made a great Cruella.

[Mabinogia]

19 minutes ago, Wiendish Fitch said:

I simply can't wait to see how they're going to try to give her some dumbash backstory to make her sympathetic. Because God forbid we just have villains who we're supposed to hate. Gag.

Nothing on earth can make me sympathize with Cruella. She is mean to puppies. That's a deal breaker for me. 

[Spartan Girl]

28 minutes ago, Mabinogia said:

Nothing on earth can make me sympathize with Cruella. She is mean to puppies. That's a deal breaker for me. 

She tried to KILL puppies for Christ's sake.

I like Emma Stone but this is a Hell No and a Hard Pass.

On the bright side, all the upcoming animated Disney/Pixar animated movies announced at D23 sound fantastic.

[Mabinogia]

I am not a fan of the "life action" trend Disney has going, but I have to admit that I took one look at the dog who is playing the Tramp in Lady and the Tramp and I think I am going to have to watch that one. He's just the scruffiest, most adorable doggy I've ever seen, and he went from kill shelter to movie star so I gotta support that!

[Luckylyn]

3 hours ago, Wiendish Fitch said:

I simply can't wait to see how they're going to try to give her some dumbass backstory to make her sympathetic. Because God forbid we just have villains who we're supposed to hate. Gag.

I remember an episode of Scrubs where Jordan is mean to someone and then says her parents were mean to her as justification.  Then seconds later she admits her parents were wonderful and she has no explanation for why she turned out mean.  I’m kinda hoping that Cruella subverts expectations.  I’d love it if we get a Debbie from Adams Family Values type of monologue where she provides an explanation for her evil that makes sense to her but is actually no justification at all.  

Spoiler

Debbie really believed she was justified in murdering her parents because they gave her Malibu Barbie instead of Ballerina Barbie when she was little.

Bonus if they give is a Kind Hearts and Coronets type of narration.  The protagonist of that movie murders various people with the aim of getting an inheritance.  He narration is entertaining even if you’re horrified by his coldness.  He speaks as if his actions are totally reasonable and just.  I’d rather a villain be interesting than sympathetic.

[Wiendish Fitch]

10 minutes ago, Luckylyn said:

I remember an episode of Scrubs where Jordan is mean to someone and then says her parents were mean to her as justification.  Then seconds later she admits her parents were wonderful and she has no explanation for why she turned out mean.  I’m kinda hoping that Cruella subverts expectations.  I’d love it if we get a Debbie from Adams Family Values type of monologue where she provides an explanation for her evil that makes sense to her but is actually no justification at all.  

  Hide contents

Debbie really believed she was justified in murdering her parents because they gave her Malibu Barbie instead of Ballerina Barbie when she was little.

Bonus if they give is a Kind Hearts and Coronets type of narration.  The protagonist of that movie murders various people with the aim of getting an inheritance.  He narration is entertaining even if you’re horrified by his coldness.  He speaks as if his actions are totally reasonable and just.  I’d rather a villain be interesting than sympathetic.

That would be wonderful, but unfortunately, villain apologia has been quite the thing for some time now, and doesn't appear to be going away any time soon. Backstories don't always make a character interesting. No, they don't. They really don't. Remember this great line from Scream?

Well, I don't really believe in motives... I mean did Norman Bates have a motive? Did we ever find out why Hannibal Lecter like to eat people? DON'T THINK SO! See, it's a lot more scarier when there's no motive.

I don't care about a villain's childhood, daddy issues, war trauma, what-the-hell-ever. Just give me a villain who has a plan, challenges the hero, cackles and gloats a bit, then gets defeated and there's much rejoicing (yay). Is that really asking so much?