B&B: What's Up Today at Forrester Creations? - Daily Chat

[ByTor]

50 minutes ago, nkotb said:

However, we need to see that baby, alive & kicking, literally.

They're probably saving that for Friday.

[jenrising]

19 minutes ago, ByTor said:

No, it won't diminish the pain, but for some people (I'm one of them) seeing reminders makes the pain worse.  Smaller scale, but my dog recently had surgery and I was scared of anesthesia affecting her, so I hid her bed, dishes, and toys, because in case anything happened to her I couldn't bear to look at her things.

If I were trying to help someone in Hope's situation, I'd probably make the same suggestion.  

Yeah, this was actually good writing. Everyone mourns differently, plus Liam is just trying to do something/anything (imagine that!) 

[CountryGirl]

26 minutes ago, ByTor said:

No, it won't diminish the pain, but for some people (I'm one of them) seeing reminders makes the pain worse.  Smaller scale, but my dog recently had surgery and I was scared of anesthesia affecting her, so I hid her bed, dishes, and toys, because in case anything happened to her I couldn't bear to look at her things.

If I were trying to help someone in Hope's situation, I'd probably make the same suggestion.  

I can see that but she was adamant that they stop doing that and they kept on. They should have respected her wishes and let it go. 

[ByTor]

Just now, CountryGirl said:

I can see that but she was adamant that they stop doing that and they kept on. They should have respected her wishes and let it go. 

Oh, then in that case I agree, they were out of line.

[Foghorn Leghorn]

The actress playing Hope is doing a great job, very real and Liam is doing a superb job as well, so much great acting makes me overlook the horrible storyline!

[Waldo13]

A few times a year B&B gets it right. Holidays and Memorials, for the most part, stops the constant infighting and crests a sense of civility.  

I have to say that Stuffy has been looking a lot better since her pregnancy. All that hair actually covers her face a lot more and detracts from all that Botox. 

[Joimiaroxeu]

Loved Hope's faint "bish whet?" reaction to Eric's offer for him and Quinn to help take care of her and Liam while they're in mourning. Quinn's done enough "taking care of" Liam to last a lifetime.

Ditto comments upthread: look at Steffy making Hope and Liam's loss all about herself. This is my surprised face.

Wow, when was the last time $Bill was welcomed in the Forrester manse?

Quote

The only factor in the current storyline will be ratings.  If the ratings plummet the storyline will be wrapped up quickly, and conversely, if ratings go up it'll go on and on.

Yep, and that will likely depend on how much of a heroine Steffy will get to be as the story of Hope's "dead" baby gets resolved. The Hope Haters out there are in even fuller force, mad that Hope didn't die in childbirth and refusing to believe wee Beth may be still alive. They're already counting on Liam and Hope breaking up because the grief puts too much strain on their marriage. 😑

Edited January 9, 2019 by Joimiaroxeu

[mightysparrow]

I am so proud of Annika.  One can only imagine the kind of hell the lunatic fringe puts her through.  I heard that was one of the reasons Kim Matula decided to leave.  She had a shaky start but she has come into her own and is killing this storyline.  She and Scott are perfectly portraying a young couple going through hell.  The glances and small touches are just spot on.  In all the years that SC and JMW have worked together, they've never been so in sync.  Anika and Scott are showing us that there's more to Hope and Liam than 'cha cha cha'.  There always was.

BBell has got to STOP pushing unnecessary characters that nobody gives a damn about.  When the camera panned the room, we saw all the people watching Hope and Liam grieve.  When Zoe and Zander came into view, it was like hearing a needle scratching on a record.  What the fuck are they doing there?  They cheapen the scene because we're reminded of Bell's 'agenda'.  And to have Taylor take a call from the doctor who probably stole Hope and Liam's baby showed what a heartless piece of shit that creature is.  She might not know how shady he is but she has to wonder if he had anything to do with the baby dying.  Why would she take his call when she's surrounded by the baby's grieving family.  Taylor is truly a horrible person.  Was she brought back to make her monster of a daughter look better by comparison?

I liked the look on Annika's face when Hauxdilox grabbed her.  Hope might endure the embrace, but it's clear that Hope doesn't buy Hauxdilox' sympathy.

I know that there are a lot of people who think that Hope deserves losing her child because of what went down when Hauxdilox miscarried her child.  First of all, Hauxdi had an accident doing something that she and Liam agreed she wouldn't do.  As usual, Hauxdi had no respect for the father of her child and did what she wanted to do and lost her baby.  Secondly, and this is the most important point, the only reason that Liam was with Hauxdi was because she was pregnant.  She used that little fetus to stop Liam from marrying Hope.  Hope did say that she and Liam could be together now that pregnancy was over but Liam said the same thing to his father.  Hauxdilox had NEVER respected anybody's feelings so why should anybody respect hers?

One of the main reasons why Liam and Hope are together is because Hauxdilox fucked her father in law.  Hope wasn't even in the country when that went down, so she has nothing to do with the destruction of Liam and Hauxdi's marriage.  Liam might have intended to go back to Hauxdi but it wasn't out of love for the woman who betrayed him so horribly.  He was going back because of his antiquated ideas about what a father should be.  So, Hope is NOT the reason that Liam and Hauxdilox are not together.  Hauxdilox said it herself; Hope made her move when Hauxdi wasn't able to give Liam the only thing that has kept them together all of these years.

I know that Hope is going to experience mental issues over the loss of her baby, maybe even post-partum depression.  Hauxdi and Taylor (and probably Ridge too) will be in his ear 247, about his 'real family'.  This will give Liam the excuse to flip-flop once again and Hauxdilox will be waiting with her legs wide open.  But it sure would be nice if Liam lived up to his reputation of being and good guy and stood by his wife through this hard time.

[ByTor]

22 minutes ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

They're already counting on Liam and Hope breaking up because the grief puts too much strain on their marriage.

This is the only thing the writers know, I think these people are going to get their way before you know it.

[Gam2]

I certainly wasn’t a fan of AN’s acting abilities for a long time after she appeared on the screen. However, she’s brought skills to this current story that I didn’t know she had. The same is true of SC. I don’t understand other sites where people are saying horrible things about AN and her character (I don’t read or participate in any other sites) but perhaps those folks need to calm the shit down. If they’re fans of the character, Steffy, I think that’s all we need to know about them, right? I do hope that their baby is brought to them as quickly as possible. I’m not sure how much longer we can all hold on to this sadness.

[Anna Yolei]

4 hours ago, mightysparrow said:

I'm watching for the first time in months.  Why are they spending so much time on the Z-list characters and actors? 

Because they're cheaper than the veterans, lol. I guess they had to pay for Tylo somehow.

4 hours ago, mightysparrow said:

How is Hope supposed to react as Hauxdilox makes the death of her child ALL ABOUT HER?

It's an act of charity on Steffy's part that she didn't show up in lingerie at the pier to seduce Liam.

For this slattern, that counts as growth.

3 hours ago, CountryGirl said:

Taylor smirks: "I've never had familial feelings for Brooke."

Understatement of the year.

And thank you Countrygirl for braving the storm and sitting through this dreck.

3 hours ago, nkotb said:

Plus, Wyatt was there, he knows what it's like to lose a child, even what it's like to lose a child with Hope, but, again, no mention.

Soaps in general always like to minimalize the fact that women have children or we're pregnant by someone other than the current love interest. Of all the soap heroines I can recall, only Brooke and Barbara Ryan from ATWT have children by more than two men. With the latter, one was a literal villain with more lives than a cat, and the other was a seemingly less bad guy who was written out the show and his daughter adopted by Hal Munson...a fact that was never brought up in the show and learned about on TWOP after the character was killed off.

With B&B, they couldn't can either Ridge or Eric, but Ridge was definitely the one with more of the bonding moments with young Bridget and Rick until Tridge became semi permanent. But boy did they go hard with making Deacon out to be The Worst Ever once Taylor was off the show, Bridge was back on the rotation and the Breric kids were now adults.

TLDR: I'm not even shocked, but I think that's less to do with bad writing and more to do with sexism. #LetWomenHaveSexualPasts2019

[Anna Yolei]

1 hour ago, mightysparrow said:

know that there are a lot of people who think that Hope deserves losing her child because of what went down when Hauxdilox miscarried her child.  First of all, Hauxdi had an accident doing something that she and Liam agreed she wouldn't do.  As usual, Hauxdi had no respect for the father of her child and did what she wanted to do and lost her baby.  Secondly, and this is the most important point, the only reason that Liam was with Hauxdi was because she was pregnant.  She used that little fetus to stop Liam from marrying Hope.  Hope did say that she and Liam could be together now that pregnancy was over but Liam said the same thing to his father.  Hauxdilox had NEVER respected anybody's feelings so why should anybody respect hers?

Insensitive as the timing was of her comment was, I agree that was an entirely different situation.Liam was ready to marry Hope 6 years ago. He was ready to marry her in June before Wyatt spoke up about Bill running interference yet again before anyone knew she was pregnant.

That said, I don't blame Steffy fans for anticipating a break up. As mentioned earlier, it's all Bell can write for and I'd be expecting the same shoe to drop if he were married to Steffy. The only surprise would be if Liam waffled to someone new like Sally or God forbid Zoe. The last thing we need is for another embarrassment of riches and cement her place into the show. :|

[RedRockRosie]

Hope (& Liam) lose their child, and Hauxdi thinks that she should adopt another baby... an infant of course. Isn't that just rubbing it in their faces? Way to be sensitive there Stef. So since you couldn't give my precious baby girl a sister , I'll just get one myself.(Never a thought to their empty arms, right Hauxdi?)

 

2 hours ago, Waldo13 said:

I have to say that Stuffy has been looking a lot better since her pregnancy. All that hair actually covers her face a lot more and detracts from all that Botox. 

Actually I thought her lips looked extremely pregnant today. Maybe it was all that lipliner, but they pretty much covered her whole face. (That was kinda mean. Sorry JMW)

 

30 minutes ago, Anna Yolei said:

Of all the soap heroines I can recall, only Brooke and Barbara Ryan from ATWT have children by more than two men.

Well, there is Alexis Davis on GH with 3 daughters by 3 different mobsters (2 of them brothers no less! So her daughters are sisters & cousins!! Ya gotta love soaps). It is actually mentioned fairly often.

Edited January 9, 2019 by RedRockRosie

[sugarbaker design]

31 minutes ago, Anna Yolei said:

Soaps in general always like to minimalize the fact that women have children or we're pregnant by someone other than the current love interest. 

You must not watch General Hospital.  Two of its heroines, Alexis and Elizabeth, each have three children by three different daddies.  Anna, Maxie and Samantha have two kids apiece with different dads.

[TigerLynx]

3 hours ago, CountryGirl said:

I can see that but she was adamant that they stop doing that and they kept on. They should have respected her wishes and let it go. 

 

3 hours ago, ByTor said:

Oh, then in that case I agree, they were out of line.

Oddly enough, the writers have managed some consistency here.  I remember when Bridget miscarried, everyone was trying to get her to take Felicia's child because Felicia was dying and then didn't die.  Felicia told Bridget she would take care of Bridget's baby in Heaven, and Bridget could take care of Felicia's baby here.  {face palm}

If they are going to have Steffy end up with Hope's not dead baby, I wish they had kept Taylor as serene beauty (if HTy hadn't ruined her face) with a twist.  One of the things that made Dorian (OLTL), Kate (Days), and early Rachel (Another World) interesting to watch was how calm and cold they could be when executing their schemes.  Taylor having another lunatic breakdown when she finds out the truth about Steffy's adopted baby is not something I want to see.

Edited January 10, 2019 by TigerLynx

[Anna Yolei]

34 minutes ago, sugarbaker design said:

You must not watch General Hospital.  Two of its heroines, Alexis and Elizabeth, each have three children by three different daddies.  Anna, Maxie and Samantha have two kids apiece with different dads.

To be honest, I've always been a CBS viewer, so I didn't know. I can't speak for that show, but the CBS shows I've watched have also consistently downplayed paternity with someone other than the super couple with a few rare exceptions. To get into that overall trend would be to drag this thread way off topic.

20 minutes ago, TigerLynx said:

I remember when Bridget miscarried, everyone was trying to get her to take Felicia's child because Felicia was dying and then didn't die. 

There was a bit more to that, IIRC. Dino was believed to be Nick's, who Bridget was married to at the time. it came out at Nicole's memorial that Dino was Dante's and Feeling is saw how much the baby meant to her and wanted her to raise him together.

But then she didn't die, and rewarded Bridget's kindness by stealing Dante from her and putting oil in her sunblock (which is why she has a horrible orange cheeto-esque glow about her at Brooke and Nick's wedding several weeks later). I hope Bridget is living her best life far away from these jokers.

26 minutes ago, TigerLynx said:

One of the things that made Dorian (OLTL), Kate (Days), and early Rachel (Another World) interesting to watch was how calm and cold they could be when executing their schemes. 

Thing is, that was Stephanie's niche back in the day, too. 

Taylor's never been the calculator. She's the opportunist that keeps her hands clean as someone else does the dirty work or gets talked into a scheme. Stephanie talked her outta telling Ridge about James. Stephanie orchestrated whatever that scheme was involving Brooke and her father in Paris and the whole fake seduction thing by Ridge. Stephanie and Ridge both did the heavy lifing when Morgan went off the rails. Even when it came out that she hid Thomas's paternity, who was the fall man for that? Brooke. Because of course it was. And not even Thorne, who talked her into that scheme.

It reminds me of a rather notable scene in Star Trek: Deep Space Nine (an overlooked entry in the franchise I recommend to everyone) where the Captain resorts to forgetting in an attempt to get the Romulans on the Federation's side of a nasty war. The scheme fails, but by a stroke of "luck" the guy who noticed the forgery dies in an explosion of his shuttlecraft. The shady former cover ops character that said captain had been working with throughout the episode pretty much calls him out on his high-and-mighty Federation morals and the episode ends in what was one of Star Trek's most blatant subversions to the Picard-type morality that had been seen in Trek to that point.

Taylor is pretty much Captain Sisko, minus the ownership of any responsibility in her actions.

[CharlizeCat]

I am never one to defend Taylor, but I think the reason why she took Dr. Fuckingham's call during the memorial service was because she's worried about him. I read into the scenes that Taylor had switched completely into the "psychiatrist/helper" mode at the memorial service. She reached out to Hope and she probably automatically took the "good" doc's call because she assumes that he's upset and wracked with guilt.  She probably thinks that he wants to get together with her to talk and unload his feelings, etc. Granted, in a day or so, she will probably be priming Hauxdi about how now is her chance to swoop into Liam's life and play the kind understanding ex-wife, while dangling baby Kelly in front of him as bait. Also, ITA that Lippy and Sludge will once again start beating the drum to Liam about how he needs to make a "proper" family with Hauxdi and Kelly.

I thought that everybody has brought their "A" game the past few days, especially AN and SC. 

I am also one of those people who needs to get rid of any/all physical reminders of the departed. It's not that I'm pretending that the person or pet didn't exist, it's just my way of coping with the loss. 

I don't read other boards, but I can't believe all of the vitriol you all are sharing about what haters write about Hope and AN. I think it's ridiculous that people get so caught up in a soap (or any other TV show) that they take the story so seriously and can't distinguish between the character and actor. Sadly, it seems reflective of the world we live in today. Get a life, people! 

[Amberosia]

Ok, haven't spoken in a while around here... Quite frankly, it's more than a bit intimidating when there are such strong opinions being voiced that tend to not coincide with the way I interpreted things. After you (heh, well specifically me... I... You know what I mean...) read a few pages of people going one way, but I'm a bit too sheepish to voice an opinion that goes in the other. However I keep telling myself if it weren't for differing opinions then it all just boils down to an echo chamber l, right? So here goes...

 

*sets up my table for one* So above all, gotta say, not a Steffie stan by any means but I do tend to find myself leaning in her direction more often than not. Oh, she's done lots I don't like (that Caroline BS springs immediately to mind, as well as all the stuff that went down with Bill and I actually like them together) and I tend to move away from that particular camp, but before long someone, usually a Logan but not always, starts acting foul in their own right and them I find myself right back with Steffie. (Also, I'm really not a fan of her board nickname. )

 

Case in point: I do agree that as far as most of the cast goes Hope can qualify as "decent", but I don't find a single thing cute, selfless, or decent the way she jumped on a married Liam the second she came back under the guise of "friendship" and just "being there" for him. No. Just no, no one will ever convince me of that. The thirst was real and the milisecond she found out there was trouble in their marriage she was bashing Steffie and not just encouraging but downright urging Liam to leave her. She wasn't just some silent, supportive sounding board. I knew way before she finally admitted it that she still had feelings for Liam. The nanosecond she finally became Liam's wife for longer than a weekend she starts making demands. Hell, she and Liam made that baby the very same day he was going back to Steffie, and neither one of those fools said "hey, maybe this is a little fast" or even just made any sort of effort towards birth control.

 

So, ok, now Liam has to bounce between two families. Well... Yeah. That's what you get when you let your dick lead you around town. I don't think it's fair to blow off Kelly being sick just because she has the sniffles or a fever because your wife of this year (who wasn't the wife you had last year)  decided last minute she wants to go on a trip to all the same damn things y'all had access to at home. What heavily pregnant woman gets on a helicopter except in some sort of emergency? Your stupid, last minute, made up babymoon (which is a phrase that irks me as much as friendsgiving... Wtf, it's not called familygiving so why a new made up word to make yourself feel special? Ugh...) could have taken place anywhere on the mainland if you just wanted a small getaway. Or you could have just given up your seats to that annoying couple that keep popping up and just wait for Liam to come back so you can go together. Or, yanno, since y'all keep citing this blended family ish, you could have gone with him to make sure Kelly was ok, then take your dumb trip. I feel bad for her current grief... But only in the most general sense. The way I would feel bad for anyone. But I'm not moved to tears, and I really don't think her acting has improved much just because she's been crying for a couple days.

 

Wow, this has gone on way longer than anticipated, and I still have a lot to say, but maybe another time. I do enjoy reading the comments, though, and often they do provide me with things I hadn't noticed or considered on my own. 

[Anna Yolei]

1 hour ago, CharlizeCat said:

am never one to defend Taylor, but I think the reason why she took Dr. Fuckingham's call during the memorial service was because she's worried about him. I read into the scenes that Taylor had switched completely into the "psychiatrist/helper" mode at the memorial service. She reached out to Hope and she probably automatically took the "good" doc's call because she assumes that he's upset and wracked with guilt.  She probably thinks that he wants to get together with her to talk and unload his feelings, etc.

Except most therapists have a phone line that's capable of taking messages.

But then, Taylor's professionalism has been non-existent since day one, so.

[Amberosia]

Honestly I was beyond shocked that Taylor even had the balls to show up to the memorial get together after all the unnecessary shit she's been pulling the last few months.  Even more shocked when Brooke didn't grab her by the arm and haul her ass right back out of Eric's house. I've never been the biggest Brooke fan and even I would have understood if she did. This isn't really the time or place for gloating or taunting, and I sincerely didn't know if Taylor could behave herself at such a somber occasion. She hasn't been able to thus far whenever she catches so much as a whiff of Brooke or Hope. So I was pleasantly surprised to see her act like a civilized human being, I was beginning to think she couldn't remember how to do it. *sigh* I used to love Taylor. She lost me around the time Thomas and Steffie started referring to Eric by name. I don't think we're supposed to remember that, though.

 

Don't think I missed that look Brooke was giving Taylor when she saw her talking to Hope. But, as much as she can work my nerves, can't say I blame her that much. 

[CharlizeCat]

After the verbal dressing down that Taylor gave Hope recently, I would have given Taylor the side-eye, too.  But, Taylor mentioned more than once that Brooke invited her to the memorial service. Why ... I have no idea.  If Taylor hadn't made herself useful by trying to help Hope, then yeah ... she should have been off consoling Dr. Fuckingham.

[Anna Yolei]

After the wedding fiasco (where Brooke was adament about not inviting Steffy or Taylor) and her recent lunatic behavior, I don't get why Brooke invited her to this at all.

[Kimboweena]

4 hours ago, RedRockRosie said:

Hope (& Liam) lose their child, and Hauxdi thinks that she should adopt another baby... an infant of course. Isn't that just rubbing it in their faces? Way to be sensitive there Stef. So since you couldn't give my precious baby girl a sister , I'll just get one myself.(Never a thought to their empty arms, right Hauxdi?)

Has Steffy actually said, since Hope & Liam lost thier baby, that she is still planning to adopt another baby?  If she did, I must have missed it.

[RedRockRosie]

1 hour ago, Kimboweena said:

Has Steffy actually said, since Hope & Liam lost thier baby, that she is still planning to adopt another baby?  If she did, I must have missed it.

No, true, she hasn't come out since Beth died & stated that she still wants to adopt but she has been talking about it previously. And didn't she mention to someone just recently that she wants to go ahead & adopt as soon as possible?  I figure with this writing, it's only a matter of time. I hope I'm wrong...but it has been pretty predictable.

[Gam2]

9 hours ago, Anna Yolei said:

After the wedding fiasco (where Brooke was adament about not inviting Steffy or Taylor) and her recent lunatic behavior, I don't get why Brooke invited her to this at all.

Me either. I also don’t know why this gathering was held at Eric’s house. Why didn’t Brooke have it at her house? Or not at all to give Hope and Liam time to grieve before they have to deal with everyone else’s sorrow. Seems like a huge burden to me.

[RuntheTable]

Once again @CountryGirl, I must congratulate you on a wonderful recap. That piece of writing has successfully convinced me to tune back in.

I am not a parent, at least to human children, but I can say that historically when one of my furbabies pass, I don’t want to see any of their things. Ever. In 2015 I lost my 14 year old rescue to cancer and just couldn’t get past it. No matter that I had been through this numerous times before; my Jake was the one. We took him to the vet thinking we would get some medication and instead found ourselves putting him down. When we came home the first thing I saw was his bed in the living room. I wailed. Mr. R couldn’t get it out of the house fast enough. He then went down to Jake’s room, which was also our laundry room, and took away his things. Everything but his favorite toy. I tell you it was months before I did a decent load of laundry. I would stand at the doorway and lob the dirty clothes into the machine, refusing to go in because I knew all I would feel and smell was Jake. Would I be this way with a human child? I have no idea.

Sometimes actions speak louder than words. Let us remember Liam’s actions after Steffy lost their child. He brought her home and unceremoniously plopped her down on the couch and was out the door in search of Hope. But just look at him after losing a child with Hope. No way is he leaving her side.

I would really like show to shock us. Instead of the predictable path of a strained marriage, and Steffy moving in for the kill, why not have Liam and Hope stay together and get stronger from this terrible tragedy. Actually, I would like to see Hope rise up and be the strong one who has to help Liam carry on. Let Hope show us what a strong, independent woman really is.

I made the huge mistake of venturing over to some of the other sites. The comments are not only shocking, but frankly, they are sickening. It made me so proud of my fellow posters here. No matter if we agree with each other, or if we like the same characters; I can’t think of one of us who would ever stoop as low as some of the people on these sites. In all honesty, I was cracking my fingers and doing wrist presses to warm up in order to properly be able to unleash on these cretins, then I thought better of it. Nothing I say will be able to break through their haze of insanity, and really, it would only bring me down to their level. So I just let it be.

Love you guys though!

Edited January 10, 2019 by RuntheTable

[nkotb]

12 hours ago, Amberosia said:

Ok, haven't spoken in a while around here... Quite frankly, it's more than a bit intimidating when there are such strong opinions being voiced that tend to not coincide with the way I interpreted things. After you (heh, well specifically me... I... You know what I mean...) read a few pages of people going one way, but I'm a bit too sheepish to voice an opinion that goes in the other. However I keep telling myself if it weren't for differing opinions then it all just boils down to an echo chamber l, right? So here goes...

 

*sets up my table for one* So above all, gotta say, not a Steffie stan by any means but I do tend to find myself leaning in her direction more often than not. Oh, she's done lots I don't like (that Caroline BS springs immediately to mind, as well as all the stuff that went down with Bill and I actually like them together) and I tend to move away from that particular camp, but before long someone, usually a Logan but not always, starts acting foul in their own right and them I find myself right back with Steffie. (Also, I'm really not a fan of her board nickname. )

 

Welcome to the table, @Amberosia! Just speaking for myself, I'll say that I think we all learn far more from someone that we disagree with than someone who agrees with everything we say. Seeing things from a different perspective is the best way to broaden your mind. I tell all of my friends who are politically-different than me the same thing. Listen to each other & you may learn something &/or change your mind. It doesn't hurt anyone to hear a differing opinion. I say voice your opinion, that's what these boards are for! 

I used to be a die-hard Liam/Steffy fan. Hope was just too saccharine-sweet. However, over the years, I've changed my thoughts. But, that's ok, I'm glad that you're still a fan of hers, & I'd welcome you pointing out her good points. It makes for a well-rounded discussion. 

I was the same way about TK's Ridge. The general consensus on the board was that he was bad. However, I liked him; through the red string of engagement, I really loved him with Caroline II (& I'd still like to see them back together, as I thought they were a good pair), I didn't hate him for denying Thomas his child, I loved him sneaking around with Quinn, I just liked him, even though I was a party of 1. But, even though I can't pinpoint when, I flipped & can't stand him now. If they wrote him out, or wrote him with Taylor, so Brooke could be with Bill, I'd be just fine. 

The more, the merrier, especially if it makes the majority think differently. I say bring your Steffy love on!

[CountryGirl]

Recap for Wed. 1/9/2018:

This one will be shorter because: Xander/Zoe/Reese. Which is a shame because people of color are a rarity on soaps, but Badley either wastes them as window dressing (I'm looking at Viv and Julius and Maya) or hires bottom-of-the-barrel talent (Xander/Zoe/Emma et al).

We open at Steffy's house where they discuss going over to Eric's to be supportive of Liam and Hope. Is it just me or shouldn't the memorial have been at Brooke's? It's tiresome to have everything at Eric's and it's all kinds of ick when you consider the Quinn factor. There's zero love lost between her and the grieving couple.

Taylor: "I'm surprised Brooke invited me."

Steffy surmises: "They're all feeling the loss." She looks toward the nursery door and remarks: "I almost feel guilty, having Kelly, and being so blessed." This woman wouldn't know guilt if it came up and smacked her in the face. She had zero qualms about fucking her father-in-law's dick and renewing her vows with his son all in the same night. Need I say more?

The nanny arrives then and is clearly saddened by the news. She offers to check in Kelly as she knows they'll want to be leaving soon.

Steffy, tearing up: "What am I going to say to him, Mom? What am I going to say to Liam…and Hope?” And here is the first of many times I will say this during this recap so you've been forewarned. THIS IS NOT ABOUT YOU, STEFFY.

You say, "I'm sorry" or even "I don't know what to say, this just sucks." Any words will honestly do and this hand-wringing over what to say or how to say it or whatever is making it all about her feelings and her comfort zone and who gives a fuck about that right now?

We cut to FC where Xander and Zoe are getting ready to go to Eric's and what in the what now? Why in the hell they would be invited is beyond me. Emma (I know!) makes a lot more sense as she actually worked with Hope on HFTF. And why are they getting ready at FC? Do they live there now?

Oh wait - I don't care.

We cut to Dr. F in his apart and he's flashing back to Hope's delivery. We are reminded of the monitor which showed Hope's vitals and Beth's to be just fine until the last few seconds. 

He decides to calls Zoe, learning they're attending the memorial.

Zoe: "I might stop by later."

Dr. F: "Gulp." He tells her it's "a bad idea." Why, because you have a totally out-of-place newborn as your houseguest?

He shares that he won't be attending the memorial and Zoe tells him not to feel guilty. Oh what do you know, Zoe?

At Eric's, Hope looks down at the last sonogram of Beth. It's well-worn around the edges and you can tell she's looked at this a million or more times, especially since last week.

It's all she has left. 

Liam is at her side, he's barely left it since that horrible day in Catalina, squeezes her arms for reassurance.

 

Brooke approaches and Hope, looking like she's ready to bolt and escape what she cannot, confesses: "I don't know if I can do this."

Brooke and Liam both reassure her that the family knows how difficult this if for her and Brooke takes a moment to put her arm around Liam, telling him "and how difficult it is for you." I appreciate that Liam isn't forgotten. He's lost a child, too, and he is bearing the lion's share of being the strong one for a still recovering from delivery Hope.

Eric approaches with Quinn somewhat tentatively behind him and again, this is all kinds of awkward and...well, wrong.

Liam is gracious as always though, telling Eric: "Thank you for opening up your home." His eyes flick a quick dismissal at Quinn. Good for you, Liam.

Eric moves to hug them both.

Eric: "Challenging times are when we need family the most." True, this. But then he says this: "Quinn and I want to take care of you anyway we can." 

Like the way Quinn took care of Liam during Captive Cabin?

At least we don't see Quinn attempt to hug them or anything.

Eric drifts over to Brooke then and they have a sweet moment as he hugs her tight, knowing how much this is hurting her as Hope's mother and Beth's grandmother. I wonder if he's thinking of Beth's namesake, his first love, as well?

Elsewhere, Pam is visibly upset, forgetting her disdain for Quinn, as she arranges platters of food no one is going to have much of an appetite to eat. 

Pam's voice breaks: "I will never understand this." It's one of those rare moments where we get to see how good an actress AM can be when giving something besides crazy antics or insipid Charlie scenes to play. And isn't it interesting how Pam, not Hope's biggest fan considering how she almost physically attacked her months ago over her reaching out to Liam. When even Pam can see the senseless tragedy and heartbreak in this, anyone who doesn't is...welll...you can draw your own conclusions. 

Hope is on the phone with Rick and nice continuity there. She mentions seeing him in Paris in the future and we have this odd moment of Maya overhearing that and making an odd face and darting for the terrace. Maybe she's just upset about their breakup (I am, too, as I really liked them together) but I read it as something more. 

We see Hope's aunts, Katie and Donna, hugging Hope, and while it was nice to have them there, I so wanted AJ's Bridget to make another appearance. Having had a stillborn daughter (Nicole) and a miscarriage, she knows exactly what Hope is feeling right now.

Thorne is at home, taking care of Will, who is sick with the flu, and I can't imagine having Will there at his tender age anyway.

Katie gives Hope a sweet drawing Will made for his cousin (and niece!), showing Beth as an angel with other angels around her.

A touched Hope cries and thanks Katie...and I've got tears in my eyes, watching them, especially Liam's face.

Maya remarks to Ridge about the tragedy of it all. It might be the first time they've spoken in months.

We see Wyatt, Sally, and Bill arrive and each hug Liam, who is grateful to see them.

I'm reserving judgment re Wyatt and the lack of discussion regarding the child he lost with Hope. It's not exactly something he would discuss with Liam, all circumstances considered, but I really hope there is a scene between Hope and Wyatt later on. 

Liam: "It means a lot that you're all there."

Bill: "Beth will always be a part of this family...and a part of you."

Liam starts to break down then as he looks at his father: "A part of you, too. You lost a granddaughter. I'm sorry." Bill starts to tear up, hearing Liam, this son he has hurt and who has been so hurt, apologizing? To him? It's the most bittersweet of moments as they embrace again.

Father and son again, at last, if only for today, or even this moment. That it should come as a result of Liam's loss...the price for a reconciliation (no matter how temporary) far, far higher than anyone could have imagined.

Bill, his tight almost-smile, the catch in his voice, shows how tightly he's holding onto his emotions to be strong for Liam, reassures him: "There's nothing to be sorry about."

Later, Bill sees Brooke sitting alone on the couch and as naturally as breathing, he sits next to her and slips a comforting arm around her shoulder as they meet eyes and find their shared grief there.

Brooke, the tears coming freely now as she leans into this man she loved so much (and still does, IMO): "I wanted this baby for Hope and Liam so much." 

He holds her that much tightly as they, the grandparents to be, mourn their loss...and dammit if they don't look so exactly right for each other.

While AN and SC continue to bring the emotion in spades, these little moments between the DD and KKL as the grieving grandparents are a close second in the need-for-Kleenex count.

It's at that moment when Steffy and Taylor finally arrive. Ridge comes over and embraces them effusively and it's a bit much, considering we haven't even see him attempt to console Hope or Liam, except to say they could try again, which is so tone deaf right now.

Ridge eyes Bill closely as Liam approaches, not liking what he sees, and he's still comforting Taylor, which, what? Seriously, the biggest favor this show could do is to reunite Tridge already and backburner their asses.

Hope joins Liam in the foyer as Steffy tells them: ""I'm so sorry. If you need anything, I'm here for you, okay? I'm gonna help you through this, I promise."

She hugs them both.

Hope: "How is Kelly?" You can see Steffy and Taylor are taken aback.

But that's my girl. Even after all she's been through and will go through, she thinks to ask after Kelly. So much for the haters claiming she doesn't care about any baby not her own. Of course, those of us with eyes know how supportive Hope has been - case in point, Liam wouldn't have even gone to Steffy's first ultrasound post-breakup if Hope hadn't encouraged him to be there. 

Instead of saying a simple "she's fine, thank you," Steffy dissolves into tears, blubbering about how much she regrets calling Liam that night and if she hadn't, he would have been with Hope (and thanks for THAT reminder!) and just making a full-on SCENE here as she pulls a clearly-numb Hope into her arms.

Once again - NOT.ABOUT.YOU.STEFFY. It's borderline tragedy-whoring, but remember whom we're dealing with.

Later, Brooke sees Taylor hugging Hope.

Hope shares that Taylor gave her a number for a grief counselor and some information on a support group. IOW, Taylor was actually helpful and selfless for once. 

Taylor gets a call from Dr. F as Zoe and Xander come in and to share just how awkward it is, they don't even go up to Hope or Liam. So WTF are they doing there?

Dr. F wants to see Taylor. I'm sure he does since he has a brand-spanking-new baby girl to sell her. 

Taylor, who has known him for all of a minute: "You're not to blame. I'll call you after the service." I was kind of hoping Taylor would start poking around and realize something isn't adding up (i.e. seeing Hope's charts, etc.) or even, as others have said, she's the one to find out the truth and makes things right. 

Brooke is on the phone with Bridget so at least there's that continuity as well.

Katie sits next to Bill and with IR on his way out, I shudder at the thought of Batie 3.0.

She updates him on Will and tells him to stop by and see him after. She tears up as she watches Liam and Hope holding each other.

Bill: "Hope and Liam will make it through. They are strong."

Brooke steps away to speak to Taylor, still hovering in the foyer. 

It's actually a nice moment between them.

Taylor acknowledges her pain and the tremendous loss she's feeling, reaching out to rub Brooke's arm.

Even Taylor has more tact for once than her "it's all my fault, feel sorry for MEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!" daughter.

Brooke: "I have to believe Hope's faith and strength will pull her through."

Liam and Hope sit near the fireplace, the ultrasound photo still in Hope's hand. He reaches out to take her hand as her tears flow, knowing the moment has come for them to begin to say "goodbye" to their daughter.

 

He stands then as all eyes fall upon him:

Liam: "Hey...everybody." He sniffs, takes a deep breath: "Hope and I just wanted to thank you all for being here for us...and for Beth." He keeps looking up, blinking back tears, and his voice is so ragged and sad and resigned.

Liam: "We..." He falters for a moment, trying to keep his composure as DB's Wyatt, jaw clenched, looks down at his feet, reflective on his brother's pain, his pain for his brother, and perhaps the memory of the child he lost.

Liam, beginning again: "We...wish that she could have met all of you. We wish that she could have experienced..." He's fighting those sobs in his throat so hard now, his throat on fire: "family and uh-"

A teary-eyed Katie and a steely-eyed, gritted-teeth Bill share a look. Again, do not, I repeat, DO NOT GO THERE.

Liam continues: "And friends..."

We cut to Pam and AM is so good here and it's criminal how they utilize her.

Liam: "And," he tries to smile here: "how they really are there for you when you need them."

Wyatt and Sally share a sad look.

Hope listens and AN's Hope is so raw here. You can tell she wants to run away, as far as away as she can get, but you can't outrun the pain.

Liam: "There's a lot of things I would......yeah...." He can't go on, especially when words seem so meaningless right now.

He sits down, spent, as Hope reaches out to caress the top of his head.

She looks down at him, his bowed head, and, just as Bill and Brooke predicted, as Liam himself predicted, she finds that inner core of strength to hold fast and firm when Liam cannot.

She gazes at the ultrasound photo, not bothering to wipe away her tears as she begins to speak: "This is, uh, the one tangible thing I have of our daughter."

We cut to Brooke, in tears, wishing she could take away her pain and Liam's while Ridge sits there, expressionless. Typical.

Hope: "And I think about how excited Liam and I were when we found out we were having a little girl and I imagined how she would look...and her hair...and what color her eyes would be." She's smiling through her tears with the memory of so many hopes and dreams...now unfulfilled. Gone in an instant.

She bursts into sobs them as Liam holds her, crying: "Her little fingers in mine."

Hope continues to cry, not caring about trying to hold it in anymore: "And I was so excited, I couldn't wait for her to be born." She shakes her head for a moment. "Um...I held her only briefly but she was so beautiful." She nods repeatedly, conjuring up the image of that sweet little face. "And I can't believed this happened, because I still feel her presence. All around me." And there's a reason for that.

Hope: "And Liam and I love you so, so much, baby girl. We will love and cherish you forever."

The sobs are coming faster now, her breathing faster, as the two of them cling to each other with everything they have.

Liam leans to kiss her forehead as we fade to black.

Scott and Annika continue to be the MVPs this week with strong assists from Kelly and Don.

As hard as this has been to watch, it has revitalized the show beyond measure where I'm actually invested in watching and seeing the rarity of these players getting to show off their craft and make me feel in the process.

Edited January 10, 2019 by CountryGirl

[CountryGirl]

3 hours ago, RuntheTable said:

Once again @CountryGirl, I must congratulate you on a wonderful recap. That piece of writing has successfully convinced me to tune back in.

I am not a parent, at least to human children, but I can say that historically when one of my furbabies pass, I don’t want to see any of their things. Ever. In 2015 I lost my 14 year old rescue to cancer and just couldn’t get past it. No matter that I had been through this numerous times before; my Jake was the one. We took him to the vet thinking we would get some medication and instead found ourselves putting him down. When we came home the first thing I saw was his bed in the living room. I wailed. Mr. R couldn’t get it out of the house fast enough. He then went down to Jake’s room, which was also our laundry room, and took away his things. Everything but his favorite toy. I tell you it was months before I did a decent load of laundry. I would stand at the doorway and lob the dirty clothes into the machine, refusing to go in because I knew all I would feel and smell was Jake. Would I be this way with a human child? I have no idea.

Sometimes actions speak louder than words. Let us remember Liam’s actions after Steffy lost their child. He brought her home and unceremoniously plopped her down on the couch and was out the door in search of Hope. But just look at him after losing a child with Hope. No way is he leaving her side.

I would really like show to shock us. Instead of the predictable path of a strained marriage, and Steffy moving in for the kill, why not have Liam and Hope stay together and get stronger from this terrible tragedy. Actually, I would like to see Hope rise up and be the strong one who has to help Liam carry on. Let Hope show us what a strong, independent woman really is.

I made the huge mistake of venturing over to some of the other sites. The comments are not only shocking, but frankly, they are sickening. It made me so proud of my fellow posters here. No matter if we agree with each other, or if we like the same characters; I can’t think of one of us who would ever stoop as low as some of the people on these sites. In all honesty, I was cracking my fingers and doing wrist presses to warm up in order to properly be able to unleash on these cretins, then I thought better of it. Nothing I say will be able to break through their haze of insanity, and really, it would only bring me down to their level. So I just let it be.

Love you guys though!

 

We love you, too and I'm deeply humbled to think I inspired you and others to tune back in.

About the not wanting the visible reminders, as a mama of fur babies, three I have now and two that have gone off to kitty heaven, I totally understand where folks are coming from. It's hard to even look at pictures or videos of my babies because any moment, I expect to see them coming around the corner to vie for a spot on Mommy's lap.

WRT the show, I definitely didn't mean to suggest there's one right way to grieve. No one can know how they will react until it happens to them and it's not the same for every loss. It's hard to say how Liam really felt as he made a move to start picking up stuff after hearing Brooke's self-admonition about not doing so. He may have felt the same as Hope or he may have thought seeing the things was too painful. And that's tough because it's not just Hope who's hurting, it's Liam as well. But in all honesty, my comments were more about me feeling protective of Hope when she clearly didn't want that - I mean, the second they hit the door, Brooke was already telling her they should have cleared all this "stuff" out of there. Hope's own words told them so as did her clear telegraphing of that as she lingered over their items and that bothered me a bit.

I would like to see the same path as you re the future and that Hope/Liam come out of this stronger than ever and are very much together when they are reunited with Beth. And I would love to see Steffy happy and in a relationship of her end. I thought I saw a spark with that hottie Leo. Bring him back and hey, maybe's he's a single dad, and they bond over that. Escape at that from the ToD would be a win-win for everyone, especially us, the viewers.

But I fear we'll see Liam drift back to the woman he has a living child with while Hope spirals and is just dragged through the gutter even worse than she is now. I mean, it doesn't get much worse than her being blamed for Beth's death for choosing to travel so late in her pregnancy. First of all, there's this thing called science that clearly shows traveling doesn't cause a placenta abruption. I'm not a doctor by any stretch, but while change in altitude can cause a late-term woman to go into labor, there's no evidence connecting that with an abruption. Meaning, if Beth really is dead, it would have happened ANYWAY.

Steffy was foolish and reckless, riding a motorcycle while pregnant and maybe she would have lost her baby anyway, maybe not, but REGARDLESS, she did NOT deserve what happened to her. I felt horrible for Steffy then as I do for Hope now. I mean, does anyone really think that Hope would have knowingly chosen to put her baby in harm's way? Any rational person would say, "Of course not." So to take her to task for this and blame her, whether outright statements crowing about karma or little jabs like making fun of her "babymoon" or not staying home or not going to Kelly's appointment first is all the same thing and it's spiteful and petty. And I'd say she's suffered enough and paid the ultimate price for her "silly little venture." 

 Or the ridiculousness that Hope should stop being such a baby (I mean, I literally saw comment after comment about how she needs to stop sniveling) because it's likely a baby swap is in the works. 

Um, newflash, SHE DOESN'T KNOW THAT - YET. 

We (the collective "we") don't even know that yet.

Her pain and heartache and anguish and grieving are all absolutely normal, human feelings and even if Beth is alive and they are reunited with her, that joy will always be tempered with what was stolen from them. The days, weeks, months, (please, not years!), the milestones, can't be replaced. Reunited, it's still a loss.

I don't engage with the haters no matter how much my fingers itch to because honestly? Nobody that dumb is worth my time. You can't fix stupid.

Edited January 10, 2019 by CountryGirl

[mightysparrow]

24 minutes ago, CountryGirl said:

I would like to see the same path as you re the future and that Hope/Liam come out of this stronger than ever and are very much together when they are reunited with Beth. But I fear we'll see Liam drift back to the woman he has a living child with while Hope spirals and is just dragged through the gutter even worse than she is now. I mean, it doesn't get much worse than her being blamed for Beth's death for choosing to travel so late in her honeymoon. First of all, there's this thing called science that clearly shows traveling doesn't cause a placenta abruption. I'm not a doctor by any stretch, but while change in altitude can cause a late-term woman to go into labor, there's no evidence connecting that with an abruption. Meaning, if Beth really is dead, it would have happened ANYWAY.

Steffy was foolish and reckless, riding a motorcycle while pregnant and maybe she would have lost her baby anyway, maybe not, but REGARDLESS, she did NOT deserve what happened to her. I felt horrible for Steffy then as I do for Hope now. To take her to task for this and blame her, whether outright statements crowing about karma or little jabs like making fun of her "babymoon" or not staying home or not going to Kelly's appointment first is all the same thing and it's spiteful and petty. And I'd say she's suffered enough and paid the ultimate price for her "silly little venture." 

 Or the ridiculousness that Hope should stop being such a baby (I mean, I literally saw comment after comment about how she needs to stop sniveling) because it's likely a baby swap is in the works. 

Um, newflash, SHE DOESN'T KNOW THAT - YET. 

We (the collective "we") don't even know that yet.

Her pain and heartache and anguish and grieving are all absolutely normal, human feelings and even if Beth is alive and they are reunited with her, that joy will always be tempered with what was stolen from them. The days, weeks, months, (please, not years!), the milestones, can't be replaced. Reunited, it's still a loss.

I don't engage with the haters no matter how much my fingers itch to because honestly? Nobody that dumb is worth my time. You can't fix stupid.

I'm so glad that I'm a part of this community.  I don't think there are many places where people show as much respect and care for each other. 

It would be such a step forward if Hope and Liam's relationship did get stronger through this.  Regardless of what some people say, I think both characters have grown, especially Hope.  One of the things that I liked about NuHope was that she didn't back down when Hauxdilox told her to.  She didn't slink away and cry in her corner.  Hope took a page out of Hauxdilox' book and went for what she wanted and didn't give a damn what anybody else thought.  Hope has had almost everyone who wasn't a blood relative in her face, telling her to back off and let Hauxdilox sink her fangs into Liam AGAIN, as if Hope was the one who broke the happy couple up instead of Hauxdi's midnight ride of the Stallion.  Hope refused to back down because she knew that she and Liam were the BETTER match.  Hope remembers that Steffy and Liam have gone through 10 years, 3 marriages and not one anniversary.  Hope has backed off numerous times and it never made a bit of difference.  This time she stood her ground.

I honestly think that this storyline is intended to placate the fanbases who have been screaming for Hope's (and her baby's) blood since Ridge brought her back to LA.  They all seem to forget that Ridge is the one responsible for Hope coming back to LA.  These same fans howled just as loudly for Sally's blood a while ago; I remember she was even called a prostitute.  The lunatic fringe is cool with Sally now because she's safely in Wyatt's bed and no threat to Hauxdilox.  It would be nice if these fans are satisfied with all the tears Hope is shedding and will back off enough to let the poor woman have a fucking happy story.

I am also sickened by some of the other sites.  Morbid curiosity keeps me peeking in at one site but I think I've had enough because even a few minutes with that kind of hatefulness is too much.  I know we're talking about fictional characters but I honestly think that some of these folks LIVE through these characters.  It's sad and very troubling.  I really hope that those folks don't start showing up here.

[ByTor]

15 hours ago, Amberosia said:

I'm really not a fan of her board nickname.

I don't moderate this particular board, but yeah, that one name she gets called really shouldn't be used.  "Stuffy" will do :)

15 hours ago, Amberosia said:

Your stupid, last minute, made up babymoon (which is a phrase that irks me as much as friendsgiving... Wtf, it's not called familygiving so why a new made up word to make yourself feel special?

I haaaaate that word!

1 hour ago, CountryGirl said:

Steffy dissolves into tears, blubbering about how much she regrets calling Liam that night and if she hadn't, he would have been with Hope

As much as it pains me, I have to defend Stef here.  Truth be told if that were me, I'd be crying and profusely apologizing for keeping Liam from getting to Catalina.

[CountryGirl]

31 minutes ago, mightysparrow said:

I honestly think that this storyline is intended to placate the fanbases who have been screaming for Hope's (and her baby's) blood since Ridge brought her back to LA.  They all seem to forget that Ridge is the one responsible for Hope coming back to LA. 

Thank you!

How conveniently the haters forget that Hope was living her life, doing her thing, in Europe, and most certainly not pining away for Liam.

It was one year ago that Ridge urged her to come back to town and come back she did, with that same fun-loving twinkle in her eye.

She assumed that Liam and Steffy were living their happily-ever-after as well, with a baby on the way and was fine with that. A bit wistful about what might have been (which is normal!) but otherwise happy for him. Because that's what real love is - wanting happiness for someone else even if that means they're not with you.

She was floored to find out Liam was living in a hotel room and she couldn't understand what happened. Before Liam finally broke down and told her the truth, Hope urged him to reunite with Steffy, certain nothing could be that bad.

Until she learned that Steffy had ipso facto killed their marriage by fucking Bill and my how the haters just HATTTTTTTTTTTTEEEEEEEEEEE to have that pesky detail that just ain't going away brought up. In Liam's mind, their marriage was done that night or if not that night, the day he finally learned the truth - not only about said fucking of Bill, but the lies and the lies and oh yeah, more lies, including the paternity test. Anyone with any sense knows that Steffy would have taken this to the GRAVE had Liam not found the paternity test she so blithely tossed in her purse, so confident she was that she had gotten away with it. As much as the physical betrayal hurt, it was the lies and the deceit that sounded the death knell in the Leffy marriage. And that is 100% ALL on Steffy. 

But of course, the Steffy apologists blame it on Liam and his sharing a three-second kiss with Sally when they literally thought they were going to die. A kiss he confessed to and was clearly remorseful for not even 24 hours later. Liam owned his shit but apparently, Steffy isn't expected to own hers.

Hope was the ONLY person in Liam's corner. While Steffy had almost everyone in her's, who rugsweeped her actions and browbeat Liam (Ridge, most of all) to forgive Steffy. Hope was there for him as a FRIEND and nothing more until several months later (in mid-May), long after Liam ended the marriage in all but ink. But apparently that's insta-pouncing and "thirsty." Hardly. If it has been Steffy, she would have cha-cha-cha'd in his ears before his bags were unpacked and given the receipts of her pouncing less than 24 hours after Hope ended their first engagement, culminating with her putting the still-warm-from-Hope's-finger ring on, I don't think I need to say anymore on this point.

But in case anyone needs a visual of what thirsty really looks like, here ya go:

Now, as for Hope reuniting with Liam after everything that had gone down with Waffles 2.0, it was a definite head-scratcher (as was the thought of two smart, accomplished, gorgeous women like Hope and Steffy fighting over him). But reunite they did until Liam had pangs of guilt over not being in the same household as his innocent, unborn daughter. I don't believe Liam would have gone back to Steffy - period - if she hadn't been pregnant whereas he planned to marry Hope before her pregnancy was known.

Steffy would try to claim, I'm sure, that she, the strong, independent woman that she is, told Liam to marry Hope, but his mind was made up. He married Hope because he WANTED to. If he wanted to be with Steffy, he would be. 

Will the ToD make another round? I hope not, but I'm not holding my breath. 

But for now and for some time, Lope has been a loving, strong, committed couple and I'm rooting for them.

[ByTor]

29 minutes ago, CountryGirl said:

Steffy apologists blame it on Liam and his sharing a three-second kiss with Sally when they literally thought they were going to die.

Not picking on you, @CountryGirl, you just happen to be the most recent person who said this.  I'm scared, this is twice in one day, but I do not blame Steffy in the least for being livid about this, and I don't understand why thinking he was going to die excuses it.  "Oh well, I'll be dead soon anyway, might as well kiss someone who isn't my wife."  I do, however, blame Steffy for reacting to it by sleeping with her father in law.

[Amberosia]

I seem to recall Steffy getting a lot of flack for that stupid stunt with the motorcycle, myself included. Bad decisions are bad decisions. Hindsight is 20/20 and all that fun stuff. I think the babymoon was silly, indulgent nonsense, just like Steffy's quick ride was. They did what they wanted to do because they were being impatient and wanted their way. They're both in the same boat here and, ideally, it would bring them closer together somehow. But I'm not foolish enough to believe such a thing would happen. I wish it would, but I won't be holding my breath. I have never once nor would ever suggest that someone deserves such a devastating blow, no matter what I think of them as a person. 

 

I won't comment on placental abruption, since I sincerely doubt that is the case. We're all waiting for the confirmation of the switch. I just think it's not smart to go flying when you have less than a month of your pregnancy to go. It's the time to be more careful, not less. Err on the side of caution and all that.

 

I also don't see why Steffy wanting to continue with her adoption is anything nasty on her part. What was nasty was Hope saying their girls couldn't be close because Steffy wouldn't let her dictate her mother's role in her life. So she decided she'd get her little girl a sister that she can be close to for herself. That was decided before Beth was born, and after her "loss" why should Steffy have to change her plans? She still wants a sister for Kelly. It's not like she's doing it just to rub Hope's nose in it. I sympathize with Hope, I truly do, but that doesn't mean the world is going to stop to make her feel better. Is no one else supposed to have a baby because Hope lost hers? She is entitled to grieve. She's not entitled to everyone changing their plans just because she's grieving.

 

I admit it, I make fun of the babymoon because just the word alone is stupid. But my point wasn't really that it's stupid, it's that her whole reason for it was supposedly about her and Liam spending time alone together before the baby came.  If that was the case, she could have just as easily waited instead of going ahead first, or yeah, she could have just gone with him to check on Kelly and then take your precious trip. You live in Cali, why did it have to be Catalina? There were plenty of other options that did involve helicopter and wasn't dictated by high winds. I'm just saying. But I've never said that just because of it she deserves to be going through this. 

 

I also forgot to mention, I'm deeply curious about what's the story with Maya and Rick. I saw that deer in headlights look she gave yesterday when she heard his name mentioned. Also, I think it's a little cold that Bridget shows up for every little wedding and it's always a surprise, but she doesn't show for the memorial? It also bugs that she never comes back with Logan. Don't even get me started on how glaring Thorn's lack of presence is when he and Katie have been married all of five minutes. Was that even mentioned? I missed it if it was acknowledged.

[mightysparrow]

I didn't think the kiss was a big deal, but that's because I saw it.  If my SO told me that he had kissed another woman, it wouldn't matter if he had been under a bombed-out building while in the final stages of the Ebola virus, I would have been PISSED.  So pissed that I would have spent the entire evening cussing his ass out.  I sure as shit wouldn't have gone out and fucked his father.

One of the things that's forgotten is that Hauxdi had spent the previous months launching a campaign against Sally that included destroying Sally's relationship with Thomas.  She also took the time to drop by Spectra to remind Sally that she was dirt under Hauxdi's Forrester-shod feet.  AND, when she had some spare time, she was eye-fucking her father in law.  So our Hauxdi wasn't an innocent party in Kiss-gate.  Liam was wrong, but Hauxdilox had been doing her part to destroy her marriage, long before Sally and Liam's lips met. 

But the thing is, Steffy Forrester Jr.'s dirt is ALWAYS forgotten.  She's ALWAYS the poor wittle victim who 'made a mistake'.  As a viewer, I've been fed that bullshit for more than a decade and I've NEVER been able to swallow it.

[ByTor]

5 minutes ago, mightysparrow said:

If my SO told me that he had kissed another woman, it wouldn't matter if he had been under a bombed-out building while in the final stages of the Ebola virus, I would have been PISSED.  So pissed that I would have spent the entire evening cussing his ass out.  I sure as shit wouldn't have gone out and fucked his father.

Yep!!!

6 minutes ago, mightysparrow said:

She's ALWAYS the poor wittle victim who 'made a mistake'.

If I had a nickel for every time she said the word "mistake"...well...I'd have a lot of nickels! :)

11 minutes ago, Amberosia said:

I'm deeply curious about what's the story with Maya and Rick. I saw that deer in headlights look she gave yesterday when she heard his name mentioned

That look, though, is practically Maya's default look, it may mean nothing.

11 minutes ago, Amberosia said:

I just think it's not smart to go flying when you have less than a month of your pregnancy to go. It's the time to be more careful, not less. Err on the side of caution and all that.

Especially with the weather the way it was.  I don't blame her that her baby "died," I only blame her for having had to go through labor & delivery alone.

[Amberosia]

I can only speak for myself, and with that I say I definitely never gave her a pass for the Sally crap. In fact, that was my latest round of slipping out of the Steffy camp specifically. It actually started around the time she was obviously siding with Bill over Liam and just being the very definition of unreasonable and obstinate. She had a hate boner going for Sally that I just couldn't understand or get behind, and I was soooo disappointed in her. 

 

Heh, there really is no arguing with the fiasco of the still warm engagement ring of years past. That, as a Steffy fan, is a level of cringe that shall never pass, I'm afraid. I accept it. But I also can't let her be branded as the only thirsty bird at the bath. It doesn't matter why or how Hope came back (though personally I thought she should have beamed back in the same way she beamed out), the fact is even Brooke confronted her repeatedly about her feelings for Liam going beyond supportive friendship before Hope finally copped to it... Hell, I love Sally and she's come across as a bit of a thirsty Birdy on occasion in her own right. I swear Liam must be putting out some weird, brain altering pheremone to have all these women tripping over themselves to get to his buttery, flaky goodness. I like waffles too, but damn, not that much. He's not even an Eggo, that there waffle is store brand generic if ever I've seen one.

 

ETA: Lol, ok ByTor, you got me there on Maya. As soon as I typed that I knew someone would point it out. She does always look either startled, bored, or pissed. But it was more the way she turned around when she heard him mentioned, then kinda hustled off.

Edited January 10, 2019 by Amberosia

[CountryGirl]

44 minutes ago, ByTor said:

Not picking on you, @CountryGirl, you just happen to be the most recent person who said this.  I'm scared, this is twice in one day, but I do not blame Steffy in the least for being livid about this, and I don't understand why thinking he was going to die excuses it.  "Oh well, I'll be dead soon anyway, might as well kiss someone who isn't my wife."  I do, however, blame Steffy for reacting to it by sleeping with her father in law.

Please don't misunderstand, I would be pissed as hell if my husband kissed another woman for ANY reason and would verbally kick his ass six ways from Sunday.

I wouldn't run off and fuck the first dick that presented itself. 

In the haters mind, it's all Liam's fault (and that hussy Sally) that Steffy did that - I mean, they drove her to that dick after all and comparing the actions (and excusing Steffy because Liam cheated, too) when they aren't even in the same universe.

Liam kissed Sally - once - and almost instantly confessed.

Steffy rode Bill like the Pony Express and lied about it, threw on her clothes, and ran home to her husband where she oh-so-magnanimously apologized (easy for her now that she had long since lost the moral high ground) and insta-renewed her vows with him...and then she went on to lie about it for months and would have kept on lying if she hadn't been caught red-handed.

The literal acts themselves aren't remotely comparable IMO, but the aftermath is where the chasm is insurmountable but for some Steffy fans, it was even stevens. That's what I take issue with.

Edited January 10, 2019 by CountryGirl

[CountryGirl]

5 minutes ago, Amberosia said:

I swear Liam must be putting out some weird, brain altering pheremone to have all these women tripping over themselves to get to his buttery, flaky goodness. I like waffles too, but damn, not that much. He's not even an Eggo, that there waffle is store brand generic if ever I've seen one.

I might not agree with you on everything you've posted, but I am definitely nodding along, reading this last bit. I truly don't see what all the ladies see in Liam. 

[Amberosia]

Oh gawd, that vow renewal... So much secondhand embarrassment. I was literally screaming "Steffy noooo.... You haven't even taken a shower yet, you nut!" during the whole thing. Honestly? I was hoping that was going to be it for them, Liam could be with Sally and Steffy could be with Bill since Brooke was back with Ridge. I had wanted Brooke to stay with Bill, but if she wasn't going to fight for her marriage why should I care more than she did? So I was just fine with it and didn't really like Sally and Thomas together in the first place. But when Hope popped up, I knew that was pretty much it for any chance Sally had with Liam. She might have been ok if it was just Steffy or just Hope, but I don't think any girl stands a chance with him when both Steffy and Hope are around.

[Anna Yolei]

18 hours ago, CountryGirl said:

Or the ridiculousness that Hope should stop being such a baby (I mean, I literally saw comment after comment about how she needs to stop sniveling) because it's likely a baby swap is in the works.

The actual fuck? Just..fo they not understand what a drastic thing that is? Even if you get the baby back when they're still young enough not to remember, whether it's two weeks or 6 months....that's godawful. You can't give that time back or remove that crushing pain of making them think their baby was gone.

I thought Tumblr fandom in general was ugly but goddamn, this is a whole other level of whackadoodle.

Edited January 11, 2019 by Anna Yolei

[Anna Yolei]

1 hour ago, Amberosia said:

 

I also don't see why Steffy wanting to continue with her adoption is anything nasty on her part. What was nasty was Hope saying their girls couldn't be close because Steffy wouldn't let her dictate her mother's role in her life. So she decided she'd get her little girl a sister that she can be close to for herself. That was decided before Beth was born, and after her "loss" why should Steffy have to change her plans? She still wants a sister for Kelly.

Me neither. If she mentioned it at the service, then maaaaaaaaybe it's an issue of poor timing at best but she owes neither of them any explaination on an adoption.

[Waldo13]

What happened to Eric and Quinn?  Second of all, why was the memorial in Eric's house to begin with?  Shouldn't of it been in Brooke's house?  Hope and Liam only had to walk to the main house instead of traveling to Eric's. 

Dr Wayne Shady is a better con artist than OB. 

[Petunia13]

Watched live and started tearing up at the gym. Annika/Hope ripped my heart out. 

I feel like Liam isn’t listening to her adequately or understanding her needs 100%. He thinks mentioning the future and mote chances will help but she’s in such a place of raw intense pain and still processing Beth’s chaotic birth and unexpected  death. She completely made sense when she said she was mourning all the expectations and longing and milestones. 

I can’t stand seeing stupid Zoe or Xander or that Dr Scumbag. I hope they all leave and if we have a model cast member bring back Sasha and maybe Darla to pose and have b story. At least they’re pretty and likable. 

[ByTor]

In the spirit of @Amberosia giving unpopular opinions, I'll give mine.  I think this time Ridge & Brooke are going to stick, so in that case, I'd actually like to see Katie & Bill get back together :)

[Kimboweena]

Was anyone else half-expecting to hear a baby cry in the background at Dr. B's?  The times he was on the phone, and when Taylor was there, I was bracing myself for that.  If he does have Hope's baby and the switch is being planned, he must have someone else involved, taking care of the baby.

[Gam2]

 I have appreciated how many people have recognized and sympathized with Liam’s loss and pain also. Too often, the mothers get all of the attention and the dads are kind of shuffled to the side. His loss is as great as hers.

[Amberosia]

I don't think I'd like another trip down that path with Katie and Bill again. I just could never get over the fact that she said directly in her vows to not try and change him because she loved and accepted him just the way he was... and then proceeded to try and change him. It always bugged me. 

 

I don't know what I'm going to do if I don't get some sign of a perfectly healthy little baby Beth by tomorrow. Four days of Hope's uninterrupted grief is more than enough. No matter how much that girl irks me, I kinda need some confirmation that there is light for her at the end of the tunnel. I wonder if Dr. Buckingham would have gone through with this if he was aware that she had already suffered a late term miscarriage in the past. I can only hope (heh, no pun intended) that's he wouldn't be that cruel. At least he seems to feel some level of guilt for what he's done. Just not enough to undo it, or to have not done it at all. But if I really squint and tilt my head just so, I can see where he'd rationalize that it's Hope's daughter or his own, and of course he'd pick his.

 

Speaking of, I'd think the initial pic taken of Zoe leaving FC would be more effective than the latter pic that was clearly a professional pic of her in lingerie, probably even snatched straight from the FC website or an online article or something. The first gives the impression of "see how close we can get to her?" whereas the second one was more like "we know you have a daughter". It should have been the other way around, I think.

[Joimiaroxeu]

Uh oh, Reese, Brooke wants to have a conversation with you. You better run. She's gonna unleash the Squinty-Eyed Stare of Death on you.

Brooke and Taylor hugging! Dogs and cats living together, mass hysteria!

I feel like Reese is working Taylor over this baby thing. Does he know she has shot a guy before?

Quote

But in case anyone needs a visual of what thirsty really looks like, here ya go:

The truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the mf-ing truth. And Steffy thought she washed that away years later by taking off her ring and jamming it on Hope's finger. Nah, sweetums, not the same. Not by a long shot.

Quote

If he does have Hope's baby and the switch is being planned, he must have someone else involved, taking care of the baby.

That plus the baby might be medicated or something. In the movie A Quiet Place,

Spoiler

they put the baby in a soundproof box with an infant-sized oxygen mask on so the monsters wouldn't hear its noises.

I could see B&B trying to imitate that.

Edited January 11, 2019 by Joimiaroxeu

[Ohwell]

Wayne Brady needs to grow some hair on that eggplant head of his.  Just sayin'.

Edited January 11, 2019 by Ohwell