S04.E05: Stop The World (And Let Me Off)

[LotusFlower]

I did...it was great...though my favorite part was wanting to mount Trump's hair in the Ooooovaaaaal Office! What she's also said, though, is that it's legit to both change your mind as you gain new information and take time in making a decision. I believe both of those things to be true. Luke may eat crow later. Who knows. But I do think he's making the best decision he can at the moment.

No way! Hillary supporter here, but even I know that that's double-speak for a politician taking positions that are politically expedient at the time, and then "changing their mind" later when the political winds blow in a different direction. I kind of thought that was the whole point of the SNL joke - Kate McKinnon (who's gay) playing Hillary telling the real Hillary that she kinda blew it, and Hillary nodding and laughing and saying yea, i was late on the issue...I blew it.

Rayna is the hero. She better be like that! Luke's not that guy. He's much more strategic with his life and business. I think that's OK because, in many cases, it's how you succeed. To demand something else of him is to demand that he be willing to fail, and I don't think that's really up to anyone else except the person involved.

Willing to fail? I don't think that's giving the public enough credit. Or it's pandering to the worst of the lot (speaking of Trump!) out of fear or self-serving goals, instead of standing up for what you believe in. You might remember my love of the Dixie Chicks, so you know where I stand on that!

Edited October 23, 2015 by LotusFlower

[madam magpie]

Are you really going to use the Dixie Chicks as an example of why I should give the country music audience MORE credit?? I bailed on most mainstream country music after the Dixie Chicks because the majority of that audience and its establishment outed themselves as crazy jerks with pitchforks, and very little seems to have changed. Yes, that's exactly what I mean. You're asking Luke and his brand to risk crashing in country music the way the Dixie Chicks and their brand were forced to. I'm not willing to saddle anyone with that, not even a character like Luke whom I don't really like that much. He didn't make the brave choice, but I also can't really blame him. The Dixie Chicks didn't make the brave choice at first either. They caved and begged forgiveness. They chose brave when that didn't work and they'd already lost a lot.

People change their minds about things all the time. That's how human beings and public opinion evolves. If I expected celebrities or politicians to know exactly the right thing to do or say at every stage of their careers, I'd be disappointed a lot. Very few people could stand up to that kind of scrutiny. I much prefer and admire people who genuinely mean well, who can admit when they're wrong, and whose thinking evolves. But everyone definitely prefers different types.

Edited October 23, 2015 by madam magpie

[LotusFlower]

Are you really going to use the Dixie Chicks as an example of why I should give the country music audience MORE credit?? I bailed on country music after the Dixie Chicks because the majority of that audience and its establishment outed themselves as crazy jerks with pitchforks, and very little seems to have changed. Yes, that's exactly what I mean. You're asking Luke and his brand to risk failing in country music the way the Dixie Chicks and their brand were forced to.

Which is why I admire the Dixie Ckicks for the stance they took, even though it came with a huge price, and don't admire Luke for putting his business over his principles. And it's why I'll hold Rayna in admiration if she signs Will. It's why I like her.

People change their minds about things all the time. That's how human beings and public opinion evolves. If you expect celebrities or politicians to know exactly the right thing to do or say at every stage of their careers, I think you're going to be disappointed a lot. Very few people could stand up to that kind of scrutiny. I much prefer and admire people who genuinely mean well, who can admit when they're wrong, and whose thinking evolves. But everyone definitely prefers different types.

I draw a very clear distinction between politicians and everyone else on this topic (and I think most people do). Of course human beings change their mind all the time, and I'll take an open-minded, evolved person over a stuck-in-his-ways person every day of the week. But, even though I'm not so cynical to think that 100% of what comes out of a politician's mouth is said with poll numbers in mind, and I truly admire some and believe they're often speaking ther truth, I think an astute voter knows when a politician's changing position is due to an evolved point of view, or a change in public opinion, a/k/a political winds. Again, I thought that was the whole point of that SNL joke. Maybe others read it differently.

Edited October 23, 2015 by LotusFlower

[madam magpie]

Of course, yes, that was the point of the joke. What I'm saying is that the joke isn't 100% of the truth, and on the same show within the same sketch, she also commented on taking time to make up your mind. There was a lot being said there, which is why I liked it. Also it was funny.

If I'd judged the Dixie Chicks solely on their initial response to the Bush nonsense, I wouldn't have called them brave or heroic. They initially bowed to public pressure in order to save their brand. And when that happened, I basically said the same thing as I'm saying about Luke now. They became brave and heroic when they had little of material value left to lose. (Which I think is fine, and for the record, I do consider them incredibly brave and heroic. But the truth is that they caved when initially faced with disaster, and frankly, I think an entire war is a much bigger deal to cave on than one gay cowboy losing a record label. But I digress.) Luke has A LOT of material value to lose. I'm also not saying Luke is brave or heroic, though. I'm saying he's not necessarily a bigoted asshole.

Edited October 23, 2015 by madam magpie

[LotusFlower]

MM - If it's not too OT, when did the Chicks bow to public pressure in order to save their brand? I don't know the whole story.

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

Nashville Goes To Natchez For Some Real Talk About Beverly
While Deacon and Scarlett clean out Beverly's house and stay out of each other's way...for a while, Juliette fails at parenting both her own child, and one of Rayna's.

[madam magpie]

MM - If it's not too OT, when did the Chicks bow to public pressure in order to save their brand? I don't know the whole story.

I'll PM you.

[quangtran]

 WTG writers room, you just took every deep dark fear a PPD mom might have and threw it all up on screen. Awesome.

If they wanted to make Juliette a bad mom then they should have made her a bad mom. Leave PPD out of it.

What I get from the writing is that this isn't just PPD. Juliette has shown this  self-descriptive side since the very start of the show. Avery even lampshaded the fact the Juliette has shown symptoms of PDD loooong before the baby.

 

Instead of realising that his wife was a very successful artist and would need a transition into motherhood/career from just a career Avery tried to make sure she was just a mom. Which probably contributed to her PPD

 

I have to completely disagrees with you here. Avery explicitly said that he wanted to to have balance in her life, which is the reason why he was the guitarist for her first rooftop show. He quit his band just so she can have it all.

 

Avery: You still don't get it, do you? Being a wife, being a mom, being Juliette Barnes, those things aren't mutually exclusive. It's all about finding a balance.

[Abstract]

But the truth is that they caved when initially faced with disaster, and frankly, I think an entire war is a much bigger deal to cave on than one gay cowboy losing a record label.

 

I would disagree that the DC debacle was really about the war, but I should probably take that to the small talk thread.

[Madding crowd]

I have seen Hayden on several talk shows in the last week; she is ok with the storyline. I really don't see it much as PPD though, Juliette has always been this way. Glad she got rid of the annoying hanger-ons, I wouldn't think Juliette would tolerate stupid people. Layla has really grown on me and I like her and Jeff as a couple. I couldn't stand her at first, but the actress sells a vulnerability to me.

 

I don't care that Maddie had sex, but I also don't think Rayna treats her like a child. She is still a child in many ways. Teenagers still need to have rules and to have parents. I'm sure Rayna wants her to concentrate on school first and then try her hand at being a professional performer. I am surprised to hearthat the sisters are complaining at their characters being treated as 'kids'. This is a great opportunity to showcase their talent, their are a lot of adult actors in this show so the girls are probably not going to have the same story lines as Juliette or Scarlett and well they are kids, especially the one who plays Daphne.

 

I love Deacon but he has become a little boring to me with his constant man-pain. I know it is justified in this case, but I keep wanting to tell him to "Buck up Sailor".

Edited October 23, 2015 by Madding crowd

[izabella]

Reality-wise, the reason why Jeff might not be considered for the position was such a non-reason. Cross-marketing clients is what a manager should do. Mostly, when one artist starts to inexplicably champion another or collaborate, it turns out they are with the same management agency. So why is using Juliette's events to garner Layla publicity is a bad thing and against the rules. Can somebody explain?

 

Juliette is on Luke's label and Layla is on Rayna's label.  If Jeff uses Juliette's events to get publicity for Layla, that means he's using Luke's label for free publicity for Rayna's label.  It's a conflict of interest, as Luke doesn't want a competitor to use the events he's paying for to get free publicity.

[thaliasghost]

Americans: what's up with the use of the term dating? Is dating really the word you use for everything short of marriage? I know a couple who've been sharing their lives for 23 years together, I know couples who have children and been together for decades without being married - do these people all have to refer to their relationships as "dating"?

 

Isn't that the initial phase of meeting up and going for "dates" before it gets more serious? Surely, Jeff and Layla, who basically live together, are in a relationship and not "dating"?

[thuganomics85]

Glad that Deacon has finally snapped out of his mourning anger, and finally apologized to Scarlett and admitted that she was right about Bev.  I don't dislike him since he was hurting, but he really was coming off horrible in this episode.  Glad Scarlett finally had enough and chewed him out several times.  If anything, she probably forgave him too easily, but I'll take it for now.  I just hope Deacon learns from this and doesn't automatically lash out at someone in this way again, no matter how angry he gets.  But knowing this show, that will probably happen again at some point.

 

I'm looking at this Maddie drama from two ways.  On one hand, I don't find it a huge deal personally that she sung on stage, and all things considering, losing her virginity to Colt in the way they did, was pretty healthy.  I don't even mind her saying that she thinks Juliette is cooler then Rayna, because of course she would probably think that.  In the end though, Rayna is her mother, and she knows damn well that Rayna didn't want her to do something like that, so I can't get why she was so stunned that Rayna yelled at her.  Yeah, maybe you think Rayna is overprotective and wrong about it, but guess what?  She's still your mom, Maddie.  Until you move out, you have to accept that your mom/parents will sometimes stop you from doing things.  And unless it's illegal or harmful, you kind of have to accept it or face the consequences, when you do break the rules.  Speaking of consequences, I really hope nothing else will come out of her losing her virginity, but I totally fear that we're getting another pregnancy story-line.  It would not only cause more James family drama, but even drag Luke into it.

 

Avery finally has enough of everything and double-downs on Juliette: he not only wants a divorce, but wants her to terminate parental rights.  Damn, that's cold!  Not sure if I agree with it, since I think a lot of it was from anger that I think he'll calm down from, but Juliette really has been a horrible mother so far, and when you've been so distant and uncaring, it was bound to happen.  It will take more then words to fix this.  Even then, maybe you should actually say that you fired all of your annoying yes women, instead of the vague "making changes." 

 

Gunnar's stuff was silly, but the only real humor here, so I guess I enjoyed it.

 

When did Kevin become so obtuse?  I think it is pretty obvious why Will isn't happy right now.  Sure, he'll get a pretty penny or two for giving his song to Luke, and yes, being a songwriters is an important thing, but Will is also a singer too.  Why wouldn't he be upset that he can't sing it, due to some bullshit over the fear of him daring to be gay?  I just thought Kevin would have understood that better.

 

Jeff is totally going to get that CEO job.  The question is, will he sacrifice Layla for it.

[madam magpie]

Americans: what's up with the use of the term dating? Is dating really the word you use for everything short of marriage? I know a couple who've been sharing their lives for 23 years together, I know couples who have children and been together for decades without being married - do these people all have to refer to their relationships as "dating"?

 

Isn't that the initial phase of meeting up and going for "dates" before it gets more serious? Surely, Jeff and Layla, who basically live together, are in a relationship and not "dating"?

 

Ha! Honestly, a lot of the time, yes. Lots of people would call all of those relationships "dating." We'd also say they're in a relationship, though. The terms are often synonymous. It gets tricky when you need to refer to a long-term relationship. A lot of the time, no one seems to know what to call that...

[CreamedPeas]

I was cheering on Luke's comment to Juliette. But especially liked seeing Lucky, I mean Avery telling her off in such a calm way. She deserves it.

[CreamedPeas]

TBH, i just thought it was kinda ugly. Then again, I don't think nude netting belongs anywhere outside of a skating rink

Haha! So true!

[Soup333]

Ha! Honestly, a lot of the time, yes. Lots of people would call all of those relationships "dating." We'd also say they're in a relationship, though. The terms are often synonymous. It gets tricky when you need to refer to a long-term relationship. A lot of the time, no one seems to know what to call that...

 

I think she said dating because that's what she thinks it is. But if she would have said "in a relationship," it would have meant the same thing to me. I just probably would have rolled my eyes and said, "Yeah, a dysfunctional one."

 

I was cheering on Luke's comment to Juliette. But especially liked seeing Lucky, I mean Avery telling her off in such a calm way. She deserves it.

 

Didn't like the comment from Luke, but I did appreciate that Avery spoke to her face to face instead of over the phone or through a text and that he was calm when he said it. 

[DeLurker]

Since Deacon is staying in Natchez for another day, I am desperately hoping we will meet some of the kinfolk who will be played by Drew Carey, Ryan Stiles, Wayne Brady and Colin Mochrie.

[CreamedPeas]

Since Deacon is staying in Natchez for another day, I am desperately hoping we will meet some of the kinfolk who will be played by Drew Carey, Ryan Stiles, Wayne Brady and Colin Mochrie.

HA! Love This!

[TVForever]

Colt is his name ;) 

 

I had an issue with her reaction last week and it continues this week. I can completely understand her being freaked out but what she saw, that'd be scary for anyone I think. But what I don't get is why she's not at all concerned about him. She knows he's an alcoholic, she knows he just lost his sister in one of the worst possible ways, and she knows that he's still recovering from a liver transplant, so why didn't she at least stop to call her Mom and let her know what was going on? Go out to the car and make the call if you're that afraid of what's happening in the house, but at least hang out until your Mom gets there to make sure he hasn't hurt himself. 

      

        Maddie's reaction was perfectly understandable, given her age. Ultimately, teenagers are self-centered. I don't even mean that in a bad way, it's just where they are developmentally. Everything in their lives tends to be about how they are affected. When things go as they should, we all mature out of it. When it doesn't,

you get Juliette.

[axlmadonna]

On the Maddie is Too Young to Perform issue... how old was Rayna when she started out as a musician? I know she was an adult when she made it big, but I also know that a lot of musicians start out pretty young. Britney and Christina were children when they hit the national scene (Mickey Mouse Club, Star Search, etc.); and, more specifically to country music, Nanci Griffith (upon whom I am convinced Scarlett is based, especially since they have the EXACT same accent / voice) started performing publicly when she was 14, including on the main stage at the Kerrville Folk Festival. In my opinion, Rayna would do better to guide Maddie through the process of becoming a public figure, helping her stay grounded and teaching her to navigate through the pitfalls, rather than holding her back. It might even help Maddie mature a bit, and she's clearly already comfortable on a big stage.

On a side note:
 

 

You're asking Luke and his brand to risk crashing in country music the way the Dixie Chicks and their brand were forced to... He didn't make the brave choice, but I also can't really blame him. The Dixie Chicks didn't make the brave choice at first either. They caved and begged forgiveness. They chose brave when that didn't work and they'd already lost a lot.

If I recall correctly, the Dixie Chicks received backlash for trashing America while overseas. Of course, they have the right to have and speak their opinions whenever and wherever they like, but country music fans in particular tend to feel very patriotic toward America, whether or not they agree with all of the decisions made by current politicians.

The comments made by the Dixie Chicks felt like a slap in the face to many of their fans, who made their own opinions of the band clear by protesting and boycotting them. I'm not sure how the behavior of the Dixie Chicks was in any way "Brave", even when they ultimately decided to cast themselves as being "silenced". They weren't silenced, they were shunned because they spit in the faces of the fans who made them rich and famous in the first place. That's not bravery, that's poor business decisions. Free speech does not mean that there are no consequences or reaction to what you have to say. I could walk into work and tell my clients what I really think of them, and it would not be "silencing" me or trampling my free speech for my company to then fire me for being unprofessional.

However, there is a big difference between that, and assuming that the majority of country fans would reject an artist for being gay. I believe that it has already been pointed out that several country artists have recently come out publicly without backlash; and, even on the show, the only people who have rejected Will since he came out have been his label management, not the fans. They haven't shown concert or album sales going down, or blogs ripping him. Luke and his publicity lady just assumed that there would be a negative reaction. I don't see any evidence of that, either on the show or in recent real life.

 

Edited because the Kerrville Fold Festival seems like a place for laundry enthusiasts.

Edited October 23, 2015 by axlmadonna

[madam magpie]

Maddie's reaction was perfectly understandable, given her age. Ultimately, teenagers are self-centered. I don't even mean that in a bad way, it's just where they are developmentally. Everything in their lives tends to be about how they are affected. When things go as they should, we all mature out of it. When it doesn't,

you get Juliette.

I just don't believe this. Kids are fairly self-focused because they lack the perspective borne from experience, but the many teens and kids I know aren't inherently compassionless, selfish whiners. They are kind, understanding, loving, and selfless. The kind of teen Maddie has become is a cliche. That doesn't mean there are none like her in the world, but it's an overused type on TV.

[shron17]

Kids are fairly self-focused because they lack the perspective borne from experience, but the many teens and kids I know aren't inherently compassionless, selfish whiners.

 

I've seen many examples of teens who put their best face on with others and save all the worst for their parents.  Also, they're often still in the process of separating their own identities from their parents which causes them to appear much more self-centered in those interactions.  So yeah, completely normal.

Edited October 24, 2015 by shron17

[Isazouzi]

 Nanci Griffith (upon whom I am convinced Scarlett is based, especially since they have the EXACT same accent / voice)

Oh. My. God. I had no idea who that was, so I went and listened to her on youtube. It's the same voice and the same accent! But Scarlett is a much better singer, IMO. But yeah, the voice resemblance is uncanny.

[DeLurker]

Maddie's reaction was perfectly understandable, given her age. Ultimately, teenagers are self-centered. I don't even mean that in a bad way, it's just where they are developmentally. Everything in their lives tends to be about how they are affected. When things go as they should, we all mature out of it. When it doesn't, you get Juliette.

I just don't believe this. Kids are fairly self-focused because they lack the perspective borne from experience, but the many teens and kids I know aren't inherently compassionless, selfish whiners. They are kind, understanding, loving, and selfless. The kind of teen Maddie has become is a cliche. That doesn't mean there are none like her in the world, but it's an overused type on TV.

From my memories and current experience with a teen, they are both of these things at different times, but can switch from one to another in mercurial speed.

[shron17]

Avery finally has enough of everything and double-downs on Juliette: he not only wants a divorce, but wants her to terminate parental rights.

 

I think the deal was he would file for divorce in another state using their middle names so Juliette wouldn't get bad publicity in exchange for giving up her parental rights.  If Juliette was really ready to change she could let Avery know this has been a wake up call to her that she doesn't want to lose Cadence, agree to therapy and treatment and ask if he would consider holding off filing for divorce while she tries to get her life straight. And not expect him to let her move back in with them any time soon after the stunt she pulled last time. Juliette's problem all along has been that she rarely takes responsibility for her actions. She needs to get to a point where she's willing to own her behavior and get help to fix it.  Avery's decision seems necessary to protect Cadence as long as Juliette lives the way she has been.

Edited October 23, 2015 by shron17

[Nancybeth]

I will put money on the fact that Maddie will have a pregnancy scare that leads to a bonding moment between her and Rayna.

And it seems that Rayna only wants her girls performing onstage when it makes HER look good!

[madam magpie]

From my memories and current experience with a teen, they are both of these things at different times, but can switch from one to another in mercurial speed.

Sure, but I've also seen them remain consistently awesome. The assumption that any group is absolutely one way or another is always false. Maddie doesn't ring true for a lot of people because...her behavior isn't true for a lot of people. Many things are "normal" that don't ring true on TV, and if the storytellers leave a lot of their audience not believing their story, I feel they've failed at their job. Clearly others think that's fine. I mean...OK.

[Clemgo3165]

I surely hope there's no pregnancy scare for Maddie, that'd be way too trite. I figure that having sex and taking the stage with Juliette are just the first two things that Maddie will do to prove she's an "adult." Since the promo pics for next week show Colt stealing booze from a reception table, I'm guessing some experimenting with alcohol, maybe something else too, will be next. As will the inevitable discussion about how alcohol could impact her given her family history - yet one more strike against Deacon. Who knows what comes after that, finding more ways to perform? Arguments with her sister since she's singing by herself and leaving Daphne back home? 

[Artsda]

 

And it seems that Rayna only wants her girls performing onstage when it makes HER look good!

Exactly, like bringing onstage at the Opry or the Blue bird. I don't blame Maddie for being fed up and I think Rayna's rules are confusing to a 16 year old. If this issue is not being ready to perform on stage in public, then that should be the rule. Not a pick and chosen rule based on when Rayna wants to put them on stage to display or not. 

 

Rayna also plastered Maddie all over the media (ie. Rolling Stone family at home interview) when it suited her during her relationship with Luke. Yet Maddie can't go sing a song with Juliette? 

Edited October 23, 2015 by Artsda

[Clemgo3165]

In all those cases though, Rayna was with her or at least backstage. We've seen her at the Opry during Rayna's anniversary celebration, a couple of tunes with both girls at the Bluebird, and at school performances. Seems to me that Rayna is giving the girls opportunities to perform that she feels are safe and that she can control. I don't think she's doing it to pump herself up, but to make her kids happy.

[shron17]

Seems to me that Rayna is giving the girls opportunities to perform that she feels are safe and that she can control.

 

 

Exactly.  Not to mention the fact that these were planned appearances for which she likely knew it was okay with the venue, promoter, etc.  Juliette didn't ask anyone.

[dcalley]

On the Maddie is Too Young to Perform issue... how old was Rayna when she started out as a musician? I know she was an adult when she made it big, but I also know that a lot of musicians start out pretty young. Britney and Christina were children when they hit the national scene (Mickey Mouse Club, Star Search, etc.); and, more specifically to country music, Nanci Griffith (upon whom I am convinced Scarlett is based, especially since they have the EXACT same accent / voice) started performing publicly when she was 14, including on the main stage at the Kerrville Folk Festival. In my opinion, Rayna would do better to guide Maddie through the process of becoming a public figure, helping her stay grounded and teaching her to navigate through the pitfalls, rather than holding her back. It might even help Maddie mature a bit, and she's clearly already comfortable on a big stage.

Things have changed so much, though, since then, even with the youngest of your examples. Social media, videos you can instantly upload, the ability to find out where someone lives and goes to school and get a street view of those places, omnipresent paparazzi (once she starts performing they will say she's fair game)....

 

Rayna probably could have found out about Maddie's duet with Juliette even before Luke called her if she'd searched some particular hashtags (but why would she have?). I was going to say if she had a google alert set up, but I confess, I don't know if that would pick up instagram, twitter, and the like.

 

If Maddie has to have something bad happen as a result of having sex, let it be a UTI.

[evilmindatwork]

 We have no idea what Luke thinks about being associated with Will socially, but he's never behaved like a bigot at all. He bailed when his business looked like it would take a hit. It's business...which is the same approach he often took with Rayna.

Luke and Rayna have long been established to be different kinds of people, much less different kinds of label heads. Rayna had no idea that there'd been a picture issue with Will at that party. She just pulled Will in because she's kind and inclusive and doesn't care what she looks like. Great. Rayna is the hero. She better be like that! Luke's not that guy. He's much more strategic with his life and business. I think that's OK because, in many cases, it's how you succeed. To demand something else of him is to demand that he be willing to fail, and I don't think that's really up to anyone else except the person involved.

 I completely agree with this and I am super progressive. Also, let's not forget that the show has shown Luke to come from a much scrappier background than Rayna's. Rayna has always been wealthy (even if Lamar cut her off for a while) so she probably has complete confidence that her life will always be ok money wise. I think Luke is probably more careful with his investments because he comes from anything and earned his money and is afraid that a loss could really hurt him. 

I just don't believe this. Kids are fairly self-focused because they lack the perspective borne from experience, but the many teens and kids I know aren't inherently compassionless, selfish whiners. They are kind, understanding, loving, and selfless. The kind of teen Maddie has become is a cliche. That doesn't mean there are none like her in the world, but it's an overused type on TV.

 

I find Maddie's lack of compassion for anyone other than Deacon (which has also been extinguished) quite grating. I also found her whining about Deacon and Rayna marrying quite unrealistic... She found out that Deacon was her bio father, and then, suddenly, was completely over Teddy? She's written very badly on the show.

Edited October 23, 2015 by evilmindatwork

[thaliasghost]

I find Maddie's lack of compassion for anyone other than Deacon (which has also been extinguished) quite grating. I also found her whining about Deacon and Rayna marrying quite unrealistic... Like so she found out that Deacon was her bio father and then,suddenly, was completely over Teddy? She's written very badly on the show.

This always irked me. The way they went to insta-family and deep father daughter connection by the snip of a finger seemed extremely unrealistic to me.

[airwair]

This always irked me. The way they went to insta-family and deep father daughter connection by the snip of a finger seemed extremely unrealistic to me.

It wasn't unrealistic for me because in my opinion it was born from her believing that they were both in the boat together--they had both been deceived in a horrific way by the same someone whom they loved so deeply.

They had that in common, as well as the guitar--something even Lennon has spoken out and said Maddie really connected with because neither Rayna or Teddy had any sort of talent on that instrument so where did hers come from?

Then there's just the expected curiosity and desire to know the man that created you and see how you're the same; how all of those quirks about yourself that never really seemed to fit with either parent now make sense.

Let's also recall that they were somewhat close (obviously not in the same way) before the truth came out.

That said, again, had he been in on the lie I don't think she would have taken to him so quickly or as deeply.

[madam magpie]

Also, I think the fact that Maddie went straight to Deacon with her news about the paternity test speaks volumes to how close they already were, so their quick bond seemed natural to me. I always really liked that because I like to think Rayna secretly nurtured that relationship on purpose. I do wish the show had included some clues in the first season that Maddie felt disconnected from Teddy. Nothing super melodramatic. She always seemed much closer to Rayna to me, but that didn't necessarily have to mean anything.

[Tara]

They have absolutely destroyed the Deacon character.

In the beginning, he was a man, a Country singer, wise and likeable.

Now he's a whiny, always crying, overly sensitive , addled wimp. And they never should have had him and Rayna together.

[Catronia]

I find Maddie's lack of compassion for anyone other than Deacon (which has also been extinguished) quite grating. I also found her whining about Deacon and Rayna marrying quite unrealistic... She found out that Deacon was her bio father, and then, suddenly, was completely over Teddy? She's written very badly on the show.

 

I agree! And I found this attitude reflected in this episode, when her big response to Rayna's objections to her taking to an arena stage without permission or even notice was that "Juliette's cooler than you!" Yeah, she probably is. Juliette's also 20ish years younger than Rayna, and not nearly old enough to be Maddie's mother at all. This reminded me of her reaction to finding out Deacon was her bio-father: She was thrilled to discover that the super-cool uncle was her father, instead of that homework-helping, curfew-setting fuddy-duddy.  Now that she's learned that Deacon isn't always being cool, she's not even giving a single damn about whether he's ok.

 

P.S. I tried every which way I could see to post the quote properly as a quote and then add my comments, but I kept getting trapped in a separate box and couldn't seem to get out to add comments :(

[Sutton]

TARA -- I agree with you about the Deacon character in season #1, he was a talented musician, famous gutarist, country singer, wise and very likable and he would help anyone who needed help. Yes, he had that unabidding love for the only woman he would ever love but they took that and made him into a character so unrealistic of the character he was in season #1. Season #1 was IMO the best writing in getting to know these characters, what happened to those writers did they quite after finding out what direction they were going to take these characters in season #2. I'm hoping after all this sadness ends that the Deacon character can again have confidence in himself as a man, strong husband, father and deal with all the issues they are going to throw at him and be Rayna's best support person by her side and having her back in what she will be going through as the head of Highway #65. I can only HOPE. I loved the Deacon character with all his deamons he was always there to be somebodies friend.

 

Remember the hotel scene with Will, Deacon finding out that he was guy, telling Will if he needs to talk he's there.  Gunnar was the only other person who knew Will was guy but Deacon would be there for him if he needed to talk. Nashville bring back that character.

[Cranberry]

P.S. I tried every which way I could see to post the quote properly as a quote and then add my comments, but I kept getting trapped in a separate box and couldn't seem to get out to add comments :(

Fixed it for you! I've gotten trapped in quote boxes before, too. FYI, you can click this icon at the top of the reply box:

 

 

It'll make everything plaintext, and you can get yourself out from between the quote tags, write whatever you were planning to write, and then hit the button again to get all of the rich text stuff back.

[smiley13]

I finally got to watch today via On Demand.  I am thrilled that Avery is standing up for himself and his daughter.  Just because Juliette came crawling back does not mean that she is ready to be a good wife and Mother, especially after the last time when she ditched them and changed her number.  

 

Why oh why did they have Gunnar hook up with the nasty woman?  He will probably catch something from her and now they are hauling her back to Nashville?  Why would Will and friend think that trash was what Gunnar needed?  Of course Will has been shown to be a man whore through out the show, so I guess he thinks sex is a cure all.

 

Maddie deserved to be chewed out by Rayna.  That dress was tacky and she had no business performing like that without Rayna knowing.  Thankfully Luke knew Maddie was in the wrong.

[Cranberry]

Why would you assume that that girl is trashy/has an STD?

[Haleth]

Disregarding all the ~drama~, I can't look at Gunnar without thinking he looks like Beaker of the Muppets. Dude, lose the pompadour.

[smiley13]

Why would you assume that that girl is trashy/has an STD?

Let's see, she shoved a guy that she had barely met into a utility closet to have sex with him, and obviously YMMV, but to me, that's trashy behavior.

 

And she just looked nasty to me.

[Soup333]

I finally got to watch today via On Demand.  I am thrilled that Avery is standing up for himself and his daughter.  Just because Juliette came crawling back does not mean that she is ready to be a good wife and Mother, especially after the last time when she ditched them and changed her number.  

 

Why oh why did they have Gunnar hook up with the nasty woman?  He will probably catch something from her and now they are hauling her back to Nashville?  Why would Will and friend think that trash was what Gunnar needed?  Of course Will has been shown to be a man whore through out the show, so I guess he thinks sex is a cure all.

 

Maddie deserved to be chewed out by Rayna.  That dress was tacky and she had no business performing like that without Rayna knowing.  Thankfully Luke knew Maddie was in the wrong.

 

Will isn't anymore of a man whore than anybody else on this show. I think a lot of his sleeping around was an attempt to prove to himself/others that he wasn't gay. 

[RemoteControlFreak]

I find Maddie's lack of compassion for anyone other than Deacon (which has also been extinguished) quite grating. I also found her whining about Deacon and Rayna marrying quite unrealistic... She found out that Deacon was her bio father, and then, suddenly, was completely over Teddy? She's written very badly on the show.

I think Maddie is over having any adults, especially parental figures, in her life. That includes Rayna, Teddy and Deacon.  This is not out of range for a 16-year-old.  The writing on Nashville can be variable, but the child/teenage characters seem to be pretty accurate.

[Cranberry]

Let's see, she shoved a guy that she had barely met into a utility closet to have sex with him, and obviously YMMV, but to me, that's trashy behavior.

 

And she just looked nasty to me.

 

I see. What about Gunnar, then? Is he trashy for going along with it?

[smiley13]

Maddie's not nearly an adult yet. Getting up on stage, wearing a sexy dress, and doing it with your boyfriend in the back of a tour bus don't make you an adult.

I totally agree with this.  Maddie is headed down a bad path.  She is not an adult and is making rather childish decisions.

I may be alone in thinking this but Claire Bowen is getting less tolerable with every passing episode. She's a terrible actor, her extensions looks like something my cat routinely throws up, and she talks like she has a mouth full of paper clips. She's a great singer - I love her performances with Gunnar - but that's it.

I enjoy Clare Bowen's performances.  Scarlett is one of the highlights of the show to me, especially when she is with Gunnar.

Edited October 25, 2015 by smiley13

[madam magpie]

I don't care what child development experts say about a fictional TV show.

I'm only justifying Avery's actions as being logical given the storyline of Nashville and the development and arcs of the relevant characters.

What I was responding to was that cutting off Juliette was best for Cadence, not whether Avery was logical or not. That said, Pork Blood Peggy was logical in the show too. I usually like a little realism with my melodrama, but you know, to each his own. Edited October 25, 2015 by madam magpie