S05.E08: Mea Culpa

[yeswedo]

Jessica does damage control in the wake of Harvey punching Louis, just as Jack Soloff and Daniel Hardman are looking for weaknesses to exploit. Meanwhile, Donna counsels both men on how to rectify their issues. And Mike must find a way to turn down his recently announced promotion without raising suspicion - while he and Rachel combat an opposing attorney who holds the key to uncovering his secret.

[catrice2]

I didn't get a chance to watch (and don't know when I will get the chance)  and saw the end where some girl was telling Mike not to marry Rachel.   What happened? 

 

Can someone give a quick summary? 

 

Thanks!

[vibeology]

I knew Louis was up to something the moment Harvey opened up to him and Louis didn't invite him mudding or some other weird Louis thing. How Harvey wouldn't pick up on that shows me just how out of it he's become. Louis is an idiot though. He's a named partner. How does it look to outsiders if it gets out that one named partner attacked* another? How is that good for his future? For his investment in the firm?

 

Also, and I will give Harvey full grown up points for not making a big deal about this because he was still wrong either way, but Louis kept saying he was attacked and that is not exactly what happened. Harvey sucker punched him, but he didn't throw him into the table. Louis lunged at him and Harvey moved out of the way and as a result Louis crashed into the table. Harvey was totally wrong, but Louis needs to also take some ownership for his actions in that office.

 

I do think Harvey will find a way to win that vote, because Donna and Jessica will help him. It was nice to see Jack actually do the right thing a few times. If he's really wised up, he'd take whatever the hell Hardman has over him straight to Jessica so the whole team can work to solve the problem.

 

As for Claire, love her. For once someone who didn't buy Mike's bullshit and actually called him out for the damage he can do to the people he cares about. He's a fraud and his actions don't just put him at risk; they put his firm and his clients at risk. I'm so sick of Mike the "good guy" being above everyone else on the show. When he went in on Rachel for messing up, I wish she'd come back at him so much harder, but at least Claire was there at the end to slap him down and remind him that his is a house of cards that will all come crashing down eventually, the only question being how many people will he destroy in the process.

[Jediknight]

This show has to end with everything crashing down.  Claire's now involved, which since she knows, would destroy the deal she just worked on, because she knows that Mike worked on the case.  There's no way around it, this show can not have an everyone rides off into the sunset and lives happily ever after ending.  The only way it can end is with the firm being nuked.

[33kaitykaity]

The secret has to come out and Mike has to go bye-bye.  Watching this show has become being a lookie-loo on the freeway after a fatality -- you feel guilty, but you can't help craning your neck in case you see a stray body part.  

[samfk2000]

How many times do we have to see Louis get hurt then lash out and then try to undo it? It must be at least once a season if not more. How in the name of god did he manage to get in to a large law firm acting like that? 

While Harvey was a prat for hitting Louis, I have to say his actions after were pretty decent, he genuinely apologised and Louis just stabbed him in the back. Again. I knew the second I saw the dictaphone in his hand that he was recording it to use against him, Harvey took ownership of his actions Louis is behaving like a child, and is still not learning anything from his mistakes/previous tantrums. It's the same old same old with him, I think the writers have gotten into the habit of getting Hoffman to play Louis so nasty that we dislike him and then they do something to make us like/feel for him, again it's been done to death. When the only person with any kind of growth going on is Harvey you know they have reached a point where they don't know what to do.

 

Donna didn't annoy me this week, probably because we didn't see her too much. 

 

Still not liking Rachel at all and I assume she thought by lying to Mike about what really happened in the meeting was the kindest thing, but she has to know it's going to come back and haunt her. Not sure what the point of Claire was this week other than to have yet another person know the secret, I assume Hardman will drag the paperwork up and ask why Mike's name was removed and put the secret in the forefront again.

 

So Hardman has something on Soloff and is going to use him to get back into "his" firm, how many times are we going to have this particular storyline dragged up? It's boring and been done to death. 

[themadman]

I think it's time this show got renamed to "Dicks".

[TVForever]

Why is Rachel so mad? Did she not know this was going to happen someday? A lie of this magnitude can't stay buried forever. It's too easy to look up whether someone graduated from a law school, passed the bar, has been licensed to practice. It's just a wonder it hasn't happened sooner.

Rachel seems to be more upset that this is a woman Mike was once interested in. And if that's the case, girl, you don't have time for that. Choosing to stick by Mike (let alone marry him) once you knew THE SECRET means that you are going to be lying in some way to a lot of people for a long time. So suck it up, and get on with it. And if you want to be mad at someone, be mad at yourself.

 

Louis. God bless him. How many times has this child set fire to this firm because his feelings have been hurt? And why do Jessica and the others continue to put up with it? Should Harvey have hit him? Of course not. But Louis stepped to Harvey loaded for bear, and as the saying goes, he got the hot sauce he paid for.

Harvey didn't do anything TO Esther, as Louis is determined to see it. Harvey did something WITH Esther, a grown-a** woman, who made her own decision about Harvey. In fact, she invited it.

 

And thank you show, for more Jessica this week. And less Donna. Could've used some Gretchen though. I like her and Harvey together.

[Chicago Redshirt]

I didn't get a chance to watch (and don't know when I will get the chance)  and saw the end where some girl was telling Mike not to marry Rachel.   What happened? 

 

Can someone give a quick summary? 

 

Thanks!

Previously, Mike had dated a law student/lawyer named Claire and pretended to be a law student to impress her but got found out.

Despite all sanity, Jessica allowed Mike to become a junior partner, and his first case as junior partner has Claire as opposing counsel. So Rachel is forced to cover for Mike, because knowing how Mike lied originally would likely lead her to discover he did not go to Harvard. One thing leads to another, and the dealings eventually involve a background check of all who are involved. That leads Rachel to try to remove Mike's name from the paperwork, which leads to Claire catching on, which leads to Rachel begging Claire to not snitch Mike out. Rachel lies to Mike about how she handled it, and that leads Mike to talk to Claire about why she didn't rat him out. Claire tells him that eventually the Secret will come out and that if Mike really loved Rachel he wouldn't marry her because marrying her means she will have to deal with his BS when it finally does blow up.

[princessbroccoli]

The Mike-Harvard thing, the Harvey-Louis thing... It's the same s**t over and over again! We've passed this tree like a thousand times! Let's take a detour!

[Curious5]

Mike had lied and Rachel is holier than thy but she lies at the stage that they should trust each other totally. Bad girl and a fraud!

I can't say how much we root for Louis getting creamed each and every week. Such a slim ball. I can't imagine him having a great role in which he is nice. Some actors are just repulsive and he is one. Only thing that would be worse is if he had maggots popping out of his skin. That soft gooey face....

So, so sick of Mike and Rachel. Dump it! And why would any boss let Mike work as a lawyer - just doesn't make any sense.

And Louis has no say on whom Harvey is messing with. Someone should cut loose Louis's sister on Louis.

[Cranston]

I love Jessica's clothes, but not her judgement.  Why on earth she let the Mike fraud continue is beyond me.  She will eventually lose her company if not her license to practice law, as will a lot of people at that firm.  How can that be avoided?  Why on earth did Harvey bring Mike on board in the first place?  The entire storyline is so stupid and unbelievable.  Why do I watch it?  Harvey is cute, Jessica's clothes...

Edited August 13, 2015 by Cranston

[Chicago Redshirt]

Other thoughts on the episode:

 

I have long defended Rachel as a character but this was not a very good episode for her.

 

She admits to jealousy over a brief relationship Mike had-- and relationship is too strong a word. IIRC, they dated for a pretty short time before Claire's boss called Mike out and Claire was aghast. Rachel, meanwhile, in the not-too-distant past kissed her ex-fiance.

 

Rachel handles a legal matter practically solo when she is still in law school. (Someone who has not passed the bar should not be practicing law alone or holding herself out to be an "associate.")

 

She tells a bunch of transparent lies to Claire and ultimately gets caught when she tries to be sneaky and change the paperwork. When caught, she has no contingency plan but blubbering "Please don't rat out Mike! I love him!" She then LIES to Mike about whether Claire caught on to him. 

 

How is it that these two characters can even contemplate getting married to each other? It's clear that neither really trusts the other. And it's clear that the Secret will explode in their face at some point. If they had an honest discussion about what that might mean for a life together, OK. But they aren't.

 

With regard to Harvey, I'm mixed on whether his apology to Louis was honesty or manipulation. I assume he was honest with Jessica when he thought Louis had it coming.

 

I think Louis could use some therapy for getting so heated up about Harvey shagging his sister and breaking his promise. The explanation he gave in passing was that there was a whole history of guys pretending to be his friend so they could try to hook up with Esther. But Harvey has long known Louis and long been his friend/frenemy. So I don't see why them hooking up would open that old wound. And like others have pointed out Esther and Harvey are consenting adults.

 

ATL wasn't so much annoying or trouble-making this episode. I think I like him better in that mode, even if the reasons for him to be annoying and trouble-making were basically arbitrary. I'd much rather have him as an active and willing catspaw for Hardman (for whatever reason) than a blackmailed one. Because as another poster said, the rational choice when being blackmailed by Hardman would be to fess up to Jessica and co. and get everyone on the same page. This whole notion of "a bunch of us don't like you because everything comes so easy to you" doesn't seem to fit very well. Maybe it's because we have been watching closely what Harvey's been through for the last three years, but he obviously works hard and gets awesome results and he has been the target of some serious stuff.

[PepperMonkey]

So what the feck happened from last week, when Jessica told the fraud he better find a suitable way to to turn down the jr partnership nom, to this week, when she told him congrats and he deserves it? That was a massive disconnect for me.

 

Louis: used to root for him, now I'm done with him. He's a spoiled brat who interacts with his partners on a high school level. I used to root for him when he was somewhat redeemable, but that ship sailed so long ago, I don't even remember liking him at this point.

 

Donna and Harvey: still don't care. Gretchen: miss her when she's not there; she brings so much to the table.

 

I can't believe Claire is just going to let this all drop because stupid ass Rachel begged her to do??? Isn't anyone incensed this jackoff is running around pretending to be a lawyer and now he's a partner at this prestigious law firm?? This storyline no longer makes any sense. I can't wait for Mike to crash and burn, but sadly, I don't think that's how this is all going to end. Hell, he'll probably be elected president in the final episode.

[Curious5]

Claire "lets it go" because there is big money in the deal. Why sink her own ship?

[marcee]

I'm still not sure why Mike doesn't just take some online classes, get his degree and pass the bar. It can all be done on the down low, but then at least he's a valid lawyer, even if he's not a Harvard grad...and all the cases he wins won't be tossed out when the secret finally comes to light. It would take him a few months, at most, with his supersized brain. Just take the classes, get a degree and pass the godforsaken bar already. Jeez.

 

And really, all Rachel had to do was say, "You're right. It IS the same Mike. But he DID turn his life around. He graduated law school in 2 years and passed the bar last year." The -fucking- end.

[Chicago Redshirt]

Claire "lets it go" because there is big money in the deal. Why sink her own ship?

 

There would be just as big money in the deal if it were redone without Mike, which is easily done before the paperwork is signed. Indeed, all they really would have had to do is sub Harvey's name for Mike and if Claire noticed, just say "Name partner wanted to be the signatory. You know, politics." and have that be that.

 

I'm still not sure why Mike doesn't just take some online classes, get his degree and pass the bar. It can all be done on the down low, but then at least he's a valid lawyer, even if he's not a Harvard grad...and all the cases he wins won't be tossed out when the secret finally comes to light. It would take him a few months, at most, with his supersized brain. Just take the classes, get a degree and pass the godforsaken bar already. Jeez.

 

And really, all Rachel had to do was say, "You're right. It IS the same Mike. But he DID turn his life around. He graduated law school in 2 years and passed the bar last year." The -fucking- end.

 

The trouble is that even if Mike were to do those things now, all the work he's done for the past four years (or whatever it has been) is still invalid, he still has (in the Suitsverse) committed a crime, and it doesn't really insulate him or the firm. Also, I'm unclear if Mike took the bar exam with the rest of the first-year associates or what the story is on that.

 

It also seems weird that Claire would think "Maybe it's the same Mike Ross I dated for about three weeks years ago." Michael Ross is a pretty common name. In the real world, there appear to be 11 Rosses with the first name Michael and about another dozen with the middle name Michael who are licensed New York State attorneys.

Edited August 13, 2015 by Chicago Redshirt

[Racj82]

So what the feck happened from last week, when Jessica told the fraud he better find a suitable way to to turn down the jr partnership nom, to this week, when she told him congrats and he deserves it? That was a massive disconnect for me.

Louis: used to root for him, now I'm done with him. He's a spoiled brat who interacts with his partners on a high school level. I used to root for him when he was somewhat redeemable, but that ship sailed so long ago, I don't even remember liking him at this point.

Donna and Harvey: still don't care. Gretchen: miss her when she's not there; she brings so much to the table.

I can't believe Claire is just going to let this all drop because stupid ass Rachel begged her to do??? Isn't anyone incensed this jackoff is running around pretending to be a lawyer and now he's a partner at this prestigious law firm?? This storyline no longer makes any sense. I can't wait for Mike to crash and burn, but sadly, I don't think that's how this is all going to end. Hell, he'll probably be elected president in the final episode.

The man who nominated Mike is the problem. It became clear that Mike was right in that him turning down the offer causes even more problems. And she has no logical answer for why it seemed to be a issue for her. I honestly don't have the hang ups on the Mike/lawyer thing. It's part of the shows DNA. It's not something they came up with to stur up drama. It's always been there. I just accept it and move on. It will always be an issue whether Mike leaves the firm or not. As Jessica has already said in the past, she might as well get her money's worth out of him.

[Carolina Girl]

 

Name partner wanted to be the signatory. You know, politics." and have that be that.

 

Bingo.  And considering the way the deal had been restructured, it is perfectly believable.  I see it happen at the firm all the time. 

Suddenly so-and-so wants to the sign the brief.  Because it's been transformed from piece of crap to a GREAT brief by the senior associate, who was in line to sign it.

[CaptainCranky]

Actually this is one of the better shows this year with the exception of 1, the petulant man child Louis, 2, Rachel who can't act for shit and 3, Donna putting up with Litt's bull shit.

 

Loved Jessica and her strength as a leader and  some sorely needed humility from Harvey.

[ElleryAnne]

Why do I watch it?

 

 

I watch it because Gabriel Macht, Gina Torres and Rick Hoffman sell the hell out of this show every week with their performances.  But thank goodness the half-seasons are short, because I think I'm getting a concussion from the weekly head-desking.  

 

I alternately like and hate Rachel.  This season I've liked her well enough, but I cringed when she told Mike she was feeling jealous of Claire.  Gah, why?  She'd been doing so well, telling him off earlier for dumping this mess on her and then complaining when he didn't like the way she handled it.  (In other news,  Mike heeds a swift kick.  Kicker's choice where to place the kick.)

 

If Jessica wanted to avoid the issues that will arise with Mike being a junior partner, I don't know why she didn't just say she wanted to wait another year or two.  They mentioned that he was the youngest junior partner in the firm's history, so it shouldn't have been impossible for her to say that they like their partners to have more years of experience before giving them that kind of recognition.  But I guess that would take away the drama.

 

I love Louis as a flawed character, but fake-accepting Harvey's apology and then accusing him during the partners' meeting was not one of his finer moments. 

[yeswedo]

I was hoping that Jessica agreed to Mike becoming a junior partner and giving him the case because she somehow knew Mike's history with Claire. It would be a lesson to him about why he had to keep a low profile and ultimately decide he should leave the firm. The switch from her original order for Mike to turn down the partnership didn't seem to have a motive.

[movado23]

PLEASE let it all come crashing down on Mike. Every single week someone new finds out and every single week Louis behaves like a two year old. Do something new or let the show end !

[3girlsforus]

Claire tells him that eventually the Secret will come out and that if Mike really loved Rachel he wouldn't marry her because marrying her means she will have to deal with his BS when it finally does blow up.

 

I'll take Claire's advice one further. If Mike really cares about all these people he claims to (Rachel, Harvey, Donna, Louis, Jessica) he would give up being a lawyer and find another line of work to make sure they are protected. Of course I also maintain that Rachel doesn't love him enough to stay with him if he isn't a high powered lawyer, even a fake one. So maybe they are a perfect match.

[catrice2]

I thought that was his motivation for going to the other job ( was so disinterested I don't even remember what he was doing), because he realized that he would never be promoted.  I maintain that was his main reason because if I remember correctly he made that decision after some conversation with Jessica about how basically his light could never shine too bright because it would bring too much attention to him.  Again, now that I think about it I think he was more influenced by that than the fact that he was causing the other people in his life to be in peril. 

 

I had to fast forward through a lot of it and the recaps gave me the gist of what happened. This show started off as cute, but they dropped the ball on resolving MIke's situation. That should have been handled and over when Trevor told Jessica.  

 

I maintain, however, that Harvey also did not care or stop to think about how his actions would affect others...Jessica and the other people at the firm....but they all act as if they are morally superior and can judge others.

Edited August 14, 2015 by yeswedo
removed dup text

[Nanrad]

Honestly speaking, Harvey's apology was sincere. There is no way that Harvey would have taken his manipulation that and be left that vulnerable if it was to manipulate Louis. He just wants there drama to be over with. Despite Harvey's occasional outburst, he has been trying to handle the situation way more maturely than Louis and has apologized to him TWO times all while accepting fault for his behavior and admitting as to why he was wrong.

 

Louis' behavior is why I'll never really feel sympathetic for him. Hmm...because he was upset at Harvey, he "accidentally" left his check in the copier machine in order to decrease his earnings as well as all that other crooked shit he's done, but Harvey deserves to leave the law firm for punching him. Harvey deserves to leave based on Mike, but he does as well for allowing that to happen in order to get his name on the wall. 

 

I think Donna stays with Louis out of pride, she feels sorry for him, and she wants to find her identity outside of Harvey. But, at this point, she might as well find another boss or leave the firm because Louis appears to be much more of a handful than Harvey ever was.

 

Jessica is boss af.

[CaptainCranky]

The sad part about the basis premise of the show is that Mike has some serious chops as a litigator and knows more and can perform better than most Harvard Law grads with a lot more experience.

[Tarasme]

The switch from her original order for Mike to turn down the partnership didn't seem to have a motive.

 

Another poster mentioned this as a disconnect as well...

 

Jessica went to see Jack Soloff about his jr partner nom of Mike. Jack wondered why Jessica would be interested in Mike becoming OR NOT BECOMING jr partner with all the garbage that happened between Harvey and Louis (which, show could have utilized the as yet unused this season associates bullpen to show how much water cooler traction the event of two partners duking it out had caused).

 

Place between Rock and Hard Place, meet Jessica.

 

Not that it's a great excuse for these shenanigans, but I can hand waive that Jessica needed to both NOT make Mike stick out by declining partnership and also needed to shift focus from the brawl. Had it not been for Louis, the partners meeting would have been a love fest for the new jr partner and Jessica's way around the drama.  

[Aquariuz]

I really like Troian Bellisarion and Meghan Markle in this episode. They make the episode for me. I'd hate getting into the Miike-hate train since he's like one of my favorite TV characters of all time but the way he pushed Rachel around this episode, he's starting to get on my nerves.

I HATE that Louis reverted back to his old self and fake-accepted Harvey's apology then crucified him in the meeting. Will we ever see them on good terms?

And I HATE that Jack Soloff will probably screw someone in the near future because Daniel had something on him.

I hope in the near future, Mike's secret will REALLY come out, because if not, it may seem like the writers have no balls to challenge themselves creatively and just play at the kids' table.

[Cthulhudrew]

This show has to end with everything crashing down.  Claire's now involved, which since she knows, would destroy the deal she just worked on, because she knows that Mike worked on the case.  There's no way around it, this show can not have an everyone rides off into the sunset and lives happily ever after ending.  The only way it can end is with the firm being nuked.

 

I think you're on to something, but maybe the scope of the finale is bigger than this. Mike continues to practice law, makes name partner, gets elected to the Supreme Court, then finally gets found out. Everything he's ever worked on - ever - suddenly is suspect, and the domino effect ends up reverberating across the entire USA, bringing the entirety of the Judicial System crashing down, sending the country into anarchy, crashing the economy, erupting into World War III, and devastating the entire planet.

 

The sequel picks up 30 years down the road as a post-Apocalyptic journey with Harvey and Mike as the sole survivors of the firm, in an action road-trip called "Aftersuits." :D

[Cthulhudrew]

On a side note, wouldn't it have been easier if Mike had just come and met with Claire and said, "I did end up going back and turning my life around and getting a degree and passing the bar. I avoided you at that first meeting because I was ashamed of what I'd done at the time we went out." 

 

Because, realistically, is she honestly going to assume that he somehow defrauded his way into joining a law firm and becoming a junior partner? She must watch too much television.

[needschocolate]

Couldn't Jessica just tell Jack that they have an unwritten policy that they don't promote someone to junior partner until they are a certain age (3-4 older than Mike is now) or they have been with the firm for a certain amount of time (3-4 longer than Mike hase been with the firm) and promoting Mike now would create too many problems with other associates?

[Chicago Redshirt]

On a side note, wouldn't it have been easier if Mike had just come and met with Claire and said, "I did end up going back and turning my life around and getting a degree and passing the bar. I avoided you at that first meeting because I was ashamed of what I'd done at the time we went out." 

 

Because, realistically, is she honestly going to assume that he somehow defrauded his way into joining a law firm and becoming a junior partner? She must watch too much television.

Part of the issue would be how much she knows about his previous lie and when she found out about it.

 

For instance, let's say that their relationship and her finding out about him lying about going to Columbia took place in 2010. 

 

It would be extremely fishy for Mike to finish three years of law school (the norm), and to put in enough time at a firm like PSL to be a partner. (It typically takes at least 4 years to be considered for partner, is my understanding).

Edited August 17, 2015 by Chicago Redshirt

[bros402]

Part of the issue would be how much she knows about his previous lie and when she found out about it.

 

For instance, let's say that their relationship and her finding out about him lying about going to Columbia took place in 2010. 

 

It would be extremely fishy for Mike to finish three years of law school (the norm), and to put in enough time at a firm like PSL to be a partner. (It typically takes at least 4 years to be considered for partner, is my understanding).

 

For some reason, I want to say the episode that showed it took place 5 years before that point in the Suits timeline. So let's say Mike graduated law school after 2 years because of his memory, then got into PH/PS/PSL right out of Harvard, and the partners recognized his legal genius and decided to put up his name for partner a year earlier than is typically done, due to his legal acumen.

[Tess23]

I'm still not sure why Mike doesn't just take some online classes, get his degree and pass the bar. It can all be done on the down low, but then at least he's a valid lawyer, even if he's not a Harvard grad...and all the cases he wins won't be tossed out when the secret finally comes to light. It would take him a few months, at most, with his supersized brain. Just take the classes, get a degree and pass the godforsaken bar already. Jeez.

 

And really, all Rachel had to do was say, "You're right. It IS the same Mike. But he DID turn his life around. He graduated law school in 2 years and passed the bar last year." The -fucking- end.

I always thought that Mike couldn't apply for law school/pass the bar because of his past drug issues and when he was 'caught.' Honestly, for such a big story arc, you'd think I'd know this tidbit.

 

My son is an attorney and you can't believe the background checks he had to pass last year when applying for the bar. Part of the process included filling out a 35 page moral character document that included documentation of EVERY breach of law since the age of 18, including traffic warning tickets (date and state/county in which the stop occurred ). I'm guessing that somehow, somewhere, Mike's indiscretions would show up at this point of the process.

[Chicago Redshirt]

Real world -- at least in my case -- you also are supposed to report where you have lived for the 10 years prior, your schools, and other info. You also have to get letters of recommendation to vouch for your character.

All of this would trip Mike up, assuming anyone bothered to check. Records would show no sign of him graduating college or Harvard Law, and no signs of him living 2-3 years in Boston, while showing signs of living in New York.

He would have no recs, because he never knew any law professors or lawyers.

[TVForever]

I don't know the law concerning college records, so maybe it wouldn't be as easy as I assume to determine whether someone attended or graduated from Harvard.

But I figure that anyone should be able to find out if someone has passed the bar or been licensed to practice law. Wouldn't that information be public?

[vibeology]

Mike's hacker client/friend hacked into both the New York Bar association and Harvard Law and added Mike's name so a cursory search shows he's legit. Where Mike gets into trouble is when he meets people who either know him or know Harvard well enough to say that he's full of shit.