Season 17 Live Feed Discussion: Watch People Sleep All Day!

[Donny Ketchum]

Sadly, with BOB, putting up Shelli/Clay isn't a great option either because if they win BOB then they're both safe. Meg/James/Jackie's best bet is probably to do Austin/Shelli and Clay/Vanessa and then just pray the veto goes their way.

 

They don't want to risk one winning veto and taking the other off, so they said they'd probably put up Steve and Austin, with a plan to backdoor Shelli.

Jason and Meg were talking about a Double Eviction, though.  Hence why Jason told Meg to put them up directly.

Edited July 29, 2015 by Donny Ketchum

[peachmangosteen]

Jason: You're so socially inept that no one is scared of you. You'll be in the final 5 easily.

Steve: Thank you.

 

He said that to his face? Geez! Perfect response from Steve though.

 

I would think the Twins.

 

I don't know about this plan lol. I feel like that would easily end in Liz or Julia going home, which really does nothing for Jackie/Meg/James. Better than nothing though, I guess.

 

But ugh BOB is awful. It is literally killing any chance of power shifts.

[Ceeg]

It's all moot anyway, because no way are two out of three of Jackie/James/Meg winning HOH.

[peachmangosteen]

It's all moot anyway, because no way are two out of three of Jackie/James/Meg winning HOH.

 

LOL but yes. It's gonna be Clay/Shelli. I have no doubt.

[ByaNose]

Meg is really cracking the one liners, isn't she? She really loves needling Clay. Hysterical!

[peachmangosteen]

Vanessa: I can play one level above her (Jackie).

 

Please let Jackie be the one to get Vanessa out.

 

ETA: Vanessa said, about Jackie, "She's never gonna win a HOH anyway. If she gets lucky, we'll worry about it then." Bitch are you nuts?! I just want Jackie/Meg/James to get HOH and nom Austin/Shelli and Clay/Vanessa! Dammit, I need to buy a banner plane!

Edited July 29, 2015 by peachmangosteen

[ByaNose]

I so want Jackie/Meg/James to win HOH. Put a little fear in the majority alliance. I'm not sure how successful it would end but for a few days they might be crapping their pants. LOL!!!! How can we make this happen? Is it possible for us to rig the next HOH?

[vb68]

 

Meg is really cracking the one liners, isn't she? She really loves needling Clay. Hysterical!

 

Somebody needs to now that Audrey is gone.

[Donny Ketchum]

He said that to his face? Geez! Perfect response from Steve though.

Honestly?  Not really.  That's just yet another clue as to how clueless Steve is regarding the rest of the houseguests' feelings for him.

[peachmangosteen]

Honestly?  Not really.  That's just yet another clue as to how clueless Steve is regarding the rest of the houseguests' feelings for him.

 

It seems like the kind of response that would piss Jason off though. He wants his words to hurt Steve and that showed that they don't. I love it! And I don't even like Steve at all, but Jason is such a dick. I'm so glad he's going.

 

Is it possible for us to rig the next HOH?

 

They need to pull a BB Canada and let us be HOH this week!

[Ceeg]

Vanessa: I can play one level above her (Jackie).

 

Please let Jackie be the one to get Vanessa out.

But where is the lie?

[peachmangosteen]

Now Vanessa's talking about how dumb Becky is. This is nagl. I hate that shit. My Vanessa hate grows with each passing second. I hate her more than I hate Shelli. I mean I don't see how anyone believes either of their bullshit, but I think Shelli is much better at selling it than Vanessa. Vanessa is SO transparent. I swear being in that house makes you stupid.

Edited July 29, 2015 by peachmangosteen

[kathybgd]

As somebody mentioned earlier, those stupid idiots never ,ever had a clue! Meg, James ,Jason PLUS Jackie and Megan weren't even play in the game all this time! WOW! They never noticed that little group always up there in the HOH room? They never noticed that little group EVER being out up on the block? They totally deserve to be picked off, but DAMN! I can not stand Shelli's smugness and DUMB ass Ken doll only being with the smart ones only through luck and Shelli. I hope Liz suffers with so much grossness every time that freak Austin breathes on her!

[kathybgd]

I'm sorry, I meant Becky not Megan.

[Donny Ketchum]

It seems like the kind of response that would piss Jason off though. He wants his words to hurt Steve and that showed that they don't. I love it! And I don't even like Steve at all, but Jason is such a dick. I'm so glad he's going.

Normally, I'd agree.  But again, Steve is so oblivious to how everybody feels about him, of course it wouldn't hurt.  If he knew, then yes, his response would've been awesome.  But he's so in the dark about it, I can't really muster up any "awesomesauce" reactions to that.

[Cosmosgravitation]

Normally, I'd agree.  But again, Steve is so oblivious to how everybody feels about him, of course it wouldn't hurt.  If he knew, then yes, his response would've been awesome.  But he's so in the dark about it, I can't really muster up any "awesomesauce" reactions to that.

Actually, I think he does know they don't like him he just hides it well.  He's talked about how that side doesn't like him with Vanessa and Liz has told him they talk shit about him behind his back (and said she doesn't like it).

Edited July 29, 2015 by Cosmosgravitation

[Cutty]

Shelli to Vanessa: I call them [Jason, Meg, Jackie] the high school clique. They clique up together and they're mean. They make fun of people.

Shelli throwing a pity party because the house is onto her ways.

[vb68]

 

Actually, I think he does know they don't like him he just hides it well.  He's talked about how that side doesn't like him with Vanessa and Liz

 

 

I agree.  Steve absolutely knows about Jason.  I  think his response was definitely sarcastic.

 

Shelli is trying hard  to convince Vanessa that she's on the Steve train now.  I wonder what's up with that.

Edited July 29, 2015 by vb68

[Cosmosgravitation]

Shelli to Vanessa: I call them [Jason, Meg, Jackie] the high school clique. They clique up together and they're mean. They make fun of people.

Shelli throwing a pity party because the house is onto her ways.

In Shelli's defense, she was calling them that before they figured her out.

 

From a pre-Jason nomination conversation (talking about Steve):

Shelli: “The relationship is changing, we need to be there for him. Especially because the High School click is so mean to him.”

Clay: “Yeah, I don’t like that at all. I’ll say something to them if I hear it.”

Shelli: “Only really mean, we don’t want them to know we’re working with him. Just don’t contribute to it.”

Clay: “I don’t.”

Edited July 29, 2015 by Cosmosgravitation

[yankee1151]

So this week for all her craziness, went really well for Vanessa then? If she had gone through with the Austin BD: Austin's gone, Clay and Shelli are still playing both sides against the middle, Steve or the Twins would be guaranteed to go next week, and Vanessa would be in the weird position of trying to fit in with a majority "alliance," of a group of people she doesn't particularly mesh socially with that well. 

 

Now she gets to keep her shields in Austin, the Twins, and Steve one more week, Clay/Shelli are burned, the majority "alliance," (granted it won't last more than a week) is full up of her people, and nobody seems to be calling for her head. She even seems to kept up a decent relationship with Jackie. Everybody seems to be putting this week on Clay and Shelli. So it looks like a good week for Vanessa. 

I think Vanessa got lucky, and it remains to be seen whether or not she becomes a big target.  The only reason she's not at the top of the list right now is that Shelli and Clay completely blew up their game by lying and getting caught after the veto ceremony.  Had Vanessa gone through with the Austin plan, she makes the majority of the house happy, she brings the twins closer by getting rid of Liz's biggest non-related ally (and it wouldn't have helped Vanessa that Austin was/is completely willing to cut Julia loose, either).  Austin is a loose cannon and a bad player.  What's the use of keeping someone "as a number" when that person threw a hinky vote last week?  And straight up admitted that he's IN LOVE (ugh) so his judgement is clouded.  IMO, he's a liability to Vanessa, no matter how loyal he plans to be in the wake of her saving him.  Liz will always be his first priority, possibly above himself and definitely above Vanessa.  And the twins are bigger targets via their association with Austin (all this 3 headed monster talk).  None of this is particularly good for Vanessa.  Neither is Shelli and Clay being exposed and being targets - their playing both sides was Vanessa's main source of information.  Steve creeping around is not particularly effective.

 

Vanessa sticking with the stupid 8 person aliiance for ONE week would have built trust with the clueless people and well, KEPT THEM CLUELESS.  Now, they're all ready to play, guns blazing.  Now Victoria, I mean Meg, is ready to try for HOH!  

 

Vanessa makes my head spin sometimes, but I can definitely relate to her.  I think I would overthink everything too if I were in that house.  I've also watched some of her poker videos and we have a similar playing style too.  Of course, she got rich off it and I did not, so... maybe I need to watch more.  Eh.  I don't think she's terrible at this game by any means, but she played this week pretty badly, IMO.  And if you're going to do something you KNOW is going to piss people off/blow shit up, STOP BITCHING ABOUT BLOOD, FOR THE LOVE OF GOD.  

[Donny Ketchum]

The difference, though, is that Vanessa's game has proven to be salvageable.  Clay and Shelli's games are not.  Vanessa's regrouped pretty easily from this and still might continue to.  Shelli and Clay are going to find it very difficult to get any real footholds now.  Especially if it does get down to the Sixth Sense people, plus their stragglers.  Vanessa has all the numbers if it does -- herself, Austin, Liz, Julia, and Steve.  And even better still is that James, Meg, and Jackie want to aid them, at least for a week or so.  Or at least not target their side till the Prom King and Prom Queen are gone.  Clay and Shelli only have themselves and John and Becky.

 

So yeah.  This week actually ended up being good for Vanessa, lucky or not, and completely bad for Shelli and Clay.

[Deputy Deputy CoS]

Becky and Johnny are not with Shelli and Clay though. They agreed they'll let Clay/Shelli think they are.

 

Vanessa's game is salvaged but it wasn't from anything she did. She benefited from Clay and Shelli's awful attempt to play both sides after the POV.

 

I dislike her but I haven't protested the notion that Shelli was playing a good game so I was floored at how badly she mangled the POV aftermath. I should have known she isn't all that given her reaction to people not cheering on her boy toy. 

Edited July 29, 2015 by Deputy Deputy CoS

[Katesus7]

It's weird. Last week I was completely bummed when Shelli and Liz won HOH, and then the Audrey thing happened, and it was kind of awesome. This week, Jackie and Vanessa won HOH, and I thought this week had tons of potential, and it sucked. At this point right now, this season looks exactly like last season at this point. Completely hopeless for any kind of shakeup.

As always, the biggest reason is the BoB. I wonder how Season 6 would have shaken out with this monstrosity. Kaysar probably would've been backdoored his HOH. That still is probably my favorite season, right up to the second when Janelle lost that final third HOH. But it was still organic, and fun, and you never knew what could happen the next week.

I know what is going to happen next week. There's no way two of Meg/James/Jackie win HOH. That's too stupid. I hope Jackie wins, because I like her the most, but she'll be dealing with someone who will happily backdoor her. And the endless rounds of who they can put up who will not target them, or who will agree to throw it is awful and I don't want to watch it anymore.

The only saving grace for this season is that there's no Derrick, who had everyone snowed, who was never mentioned as a target, and who quietly and efficiently ran things to the very end. This year, we have both Shelli and Vanessa. There is going to be a battle, I think the winner of that battle will deserve the win (although I don't particularly care for either) and I will enjoy seeing that.

But unfortunately, I now feel I have weeks of bullshit to get through before it happens.

Edited July 29, 2015 by Katesus7

[Deputy Deputy CoS]

So Becky is giving Shelli a general info of the other side of the house, told her they want to win HOH and come after the other side of the house but she doesn't know specifics.

 

The thing is that Becky does know who their targets are. She's supposedly in an alliance with Shelli and Clay so it is in her best interest to string them along with these little nuggets that when you think about, is useless information. 

 

She needs to play like this till the votes are called. Even might be in her best interest to carry it along another week depending on who wins HOH.

Edited July 29, 2015 by Deputy Deputy CoS

[Cutty]

Becky is just dying to be with the cool kids. She's actually a bigger waste of space than Meg. Boring ass sycophant. 

Edited July 29, 2015 by Cutty

[Cutty]

I'm not even a fan of Jason/James/Meg/Jackie but the number of HGs lining up to lick Clelli's ass is just revolting.

[Brian Cronin]

While I agree that it was moronic of Clay and Shelli to lie about knowing about the Jason move (really, really stupid), I find it difficult to beleive that they'd be in much worse shape if they told the truth. This was always bound to be the sort of "line in the sand" moment for this season. Putting up Jason with the intent to evict him could not be explained away as anything but "we have the numbers and we are going to Pagong you." Yes, Clay and Shelli should have just owned up to it so as to not piss off Vanessa, but they were going to be "found out" this week no matter what.

[Cutty]

While I agree that it was moronic of Clay and Shelli to lie about knowing about the Jason move (really, really stupid), I find it difficult to beleive that they'd be in much worse shape if they told the truth. This was always bound to be the sort of "line in the sand" moment for this season. Putting up Jason with the intent to evict him could not be explained away as anything but "we have the numbers and we are going to Pagong you." Yes, Clay and Shelli should have just owned up to it so as to not piss off Vanessa, but they were going to be "found out" this week no matter what.

 

ITA. They are idiots for not getting their story straight before the ceremony. They could have spun it better after without the initial lie. 

 

But like you said it doesn't really matter at this point. They have such a huge advantage that it's almost impossible to fuck it up.

[pennben]

I think maybe their bigger mistake was when Shelli/Clay led the charge to change the vote from Austin to someone else because they decided folks were coming after Clay if he stayed on the block, which I don't think would happen.  That led them to the path were they ended up overreaching after Jason got put up by pretending not to know for awhile.  Now, it seems, at least a couple of folks on the "other side" seem to think Shelli directly led the charge for the change and hold her/Clay a bit more accountable than Vanessa.

[Kromm]

ETA: Vanessa said, about Jackie, "She's never gonna win a HOH anyway. If she gets lucky, we'll worry about it then." Bitch are you nuts?! I just want Jackie/Meg/James to get HOH and nom Austin/Shelli and Clay/Vanessa! Dammit, I need to buy a banner plane!

Confused. 

 

Didn't we just see Jackie win one?  She lost it sure, but that wasn't due to her own skill levels at anything.

[Artsda]

Shelly and Clay might have been in a better position if they didn't lie point blank to everyone's faces, act shocked and didn't spin 245 different stories. If they had one story and told them the first time they were asked if they knew it wouldn't have been so shady and lying to their faces. 

[bobthefrog]

Confused.

Didn't we just see Jackie win one? She lost it sure, but that wasn't due to her own skill levels at anything.

To be fair, James pretty much won it for her with his strategy of just pushing a random button.

[Nashville]

Yea, but when she has no reasons, she just makes them up lol.

 

Exactimundo!

Vanessa just wants a Reason.  Any Reason.

And if one doesn't exist?  Then, by cracky, we'll just MAKE a Reason.

 

 

Meg is really cracking the one liners, isn't she? She really loves needling Clay. Hysterical!

Somebody needs to now that Audrey is gone.

 

Darn.  Beat me to it.

[Donny Ketchum]

I'm not even a fan of Jason/James/Meg/Jackie but the number of HGs lining up to lick Clelli's ass is just revolting.

I think only John and Becky are doing that now.  And even then, not out of any desperation to be liked or accepted by them.

[Nashville]

My favorite bit of the night - from Joker's:

 

Tue 9:37 PM BBT

Jackie is mad that Vanessa told Austin so early - a day and a half to turn things around.

 

Think Jackie will realize any time soon that SHE is the one who screwed up Jason's game?

Remember - V was talking to Jackie in the HoH room prior to the PoV meeting, and at the end of their conversation, V asked Jackie to send Jason up to HoH.

To give Jason a chance to argue his case before PoV meeting?  Maybe, maybe not.  We'll never know.  Why?

BECAUSE JACKIE FORGOT TO TELL JASON TO GO UP TO THE HOH ROOM.

Jackie got distracted (started chatting with other people, IIRC?), so Jason was never told. 

V waited in HoH until TPTB called her to the DR, and that's where V stayed until shortly before the PoV meeting.

 

So - how might this game have turned out different, had Jackie only told Jason to head up to HoH before the PoV ceremony...?

 

;)

Edited July 29, 2015 by Nashville

[Donny Ketchum]

Did anyone hear the story Steve told about his school crush last night?

 

Apparently, he had a crush on a girl throughout middle school and high school named Stevie. They were cast in a play together, and on the day the cast was announced she was bawling because she received a role where she had to kiss Steve.  Of course, he believed it was because it was going to be her first kiss, not because it was Steve.

 

Steve's mom also apparently made mention of the crush he had on her at a band performance in front of the entire school, and Steve not only wasn't embarrassed by this, but he apparently told his mom she could do it.

 

Steve is . . . something else.  If he's like this outside of the house, too, I shudder to think how he has anyone outside of his mother.

[pennben]

I heard it, it was part of a longer conversation with Vanessa about his inability to understand social cues and just in general discussing his life.  It was a nice conversation with Vanessa supporting him and trying to give him tips on social cues, etc. Yes, Steve does have limitations, but he seems aware of them and hopefully he can work through them and/or maybe find someone who can live with them. 

 

ETA:  One of the things that amused me about the conversation was Steve telling Vanessa about his inability to read social cues and requesting that she just be blunt with him if there is something she wants or if he's doing something wrong.  Then, towards the end of the conversation, Vanessa was doing long yawns, an obvious social cue she wanted him to leave, but didn't say anything for a long time.  She finally told him she wanted to go to bed. 

 

To be fair, he is honest about the social cue thing. I think most of us use social cues as we don't want to seem to be rude.  However, once someone tells you to be direct, not use cues, we lose the right to be annoyed at someone not picking up on cues.  To folks like Steve, it is as though cues are a foreign language they haven't learned.

Edited July 29, 2015 by pennben

[Donny Ketchum]

I heard it, it was part of a longer conversation with Vanessa about his inability to understand social cues and just in general discussing his life.  It was a nice conversation with Vanessa supporting him and trying to give him tips on social cues, etc. Yes, Steve does have limitations, but he seems aware of them and hopefully he can work through them and/or maybe find someone who can live with them. 

Given how many anti-Steve people there are in the house right now, and the story he told . . . I kinda doubt he'll do either for quite some time.

 

Anyway, as a result of talking to Steve, apparently, Clay and Shelli think he's so non-threatening now, they're willing to get John and Becky booted before they deal with him.  Even though he's another one of Vanessa's minions.  Wow.  This week has really rattled their brains.

 

It's funny that Shelli's biggest fear was that the Dark Moon alliance would put them in a five vs. three situation at the F8.  Because she was so afraid of it, she and Clay flipped on it and completely exposed their games, only to enter into a situation where they're set up even worse than before.  Not only does Vanessa have closer ties to Austin, Liz, Julia, and Steve, but she's also got Shelli and Clay wanting to cut John and Becky before anyone else in the alliance, which is dumb, as they are the only two people who may be more loyal to them.

 

Vanessa may go absolutely insane as HoH, but this is yet another example of how she really came out of this week in great shape.

[pennben]

Oh, I don't think he's going to win the game, I was just more commenting on the fact that some think there is no hope for him outside the game.

 

Edit:  I've added a couple of words to clarify my intent that I don't think things are hopeless for Steve in the world.  I apologize if I have caused pain with sloppiness in the original post.  That is on me.

Edited July 29, 2015 by pennben

[Machiabelly]

There are many people with Asperger's, including my daughter, who can not pick up social clues, and yet they have full lives including having relationships, jobs, a lot of things that everyone has. IT is difficult...not hopeless

[pennben]

Okay, this is going to be an incomplete report because I just can't go back and listen to thse guys again:

 

Where last left, Jason and Meg have decided Meg will lead the charge to save Jason, and that it will start tomorrow (eta: by which, I think they mean today, Wednesday) so there is not lots of time left to flip the house back once they change their minds.  Overall plan is to freak Shelli/Clay out...good start.  Then, Meg is going to convince them that Meg/Jackie/Jason/(I can't figure out fourth) will take Clay/Shelli back in and will forgive them and will move forward as a strong six.  I can't figure out fourth because they are saying it will leave James out in the cold and, of course, Becky would be gone if they save Jason, so I have no clue of the fourth.  Jackie is also scheduled to talk to Shelli/Clay in this plan. Jason will later approach Clay/Shelli explaining they should keep him as the next comp will be endurance and he has that in the bag.  However, Meg will have already explained that Jason is her puppet and will do whatever she wants so they shouldn't fear Jason.

 

Note also, while Meg/Jason were discussing this, James and Jackie from time to time came to the couches where this was happening.  Shelli/Clay were on the hammock watching throughout. 

Edited July 29, 2015 by pennben

[kellog010]

This master plan is they will convince Shelli and Clay that Becky is after them at the double eviction setting off Shelli's paranoia. This whole plan hinges on Meg being some puppet master controlling Jason and that the 4 of them (Jackie, Jason, Meg and James) will protect them through the DE. Shelli and Clay are supposed to flip to save Jason going back on their 6S alliance to a group of people they can't fully trust. Stranger things have happened -  this all started because they didn't cheer for Clay when he won POV. I think they'd be stupid to flip.

 

ETA: Meg just put the plan in motion talking to Clay about wanting her and Jason to work with Shelli, Clay and Vanessa.

Edited July 29, 2015 by kellog010

[BlackMamba]

Meg is a waste, Clay will be reporting soon to Vanessa.

https://twitter.com/meBethanyB/status/626359975896588288

[Ceeg]

So, Meg talked to Shelli/Clay about saving Jason. She laid it all on pretty thick, but Shelli didn't really buy any of it (Clay might have, but his mom talked some sense into him). But now Shelli/Clay are talking, and her plan is to kind of go along with Meg and act like they're really considering keeping Jason, in the hopes that Meg will tell all the info to Jackie. And then, Jackie will vote to evict Becky, since she believes Shelli/Clay might too, and that will damage her relationship with Becky when Becky stays, since Jackie had promised Becky her vote.

 

I think it's actually a pretty smart plan, to create those cracks between Jackie and Becky, since they've been working on Becky all week.

Edited July 29, 2015 by Ceeg

[pennben]

Okay, so I stayed up later, now Jackie/Jason and Meg are talking.  They are saying they'll decide later about how long to keep Shelli/Clay, but that for now they need to focus on getting rid of, and I'll paraphrase, the bottom-feeders, the floaters, the randos, the Liztins (austin/liz).  Good to see them back in charge:)

Edited July 29, 2015 by pennben

[kellog010]

I think Shelli and Clay are being short sighted with this plan of theirs. They are going to lie to that trio again. While it may get them past the double eviction, if Meg is still around as their "pawn" I think Meg would eventually turn on them and possibly swing over to Vanessa's side. If Meg is still in the game I don't think she forgets this. Meg may not win HOH's or comps but she is a vote or a bitter juror.

Edited July 29, 2015 by kellog010

[loki567]

Oh, I hope they do that. I doubt Becky will care that much and it's liable just to cause unnecessary paranoia and blow up on Clay/Shelli. So yes, please. 

[Ceeg]

I think Shelli and Clay are being short sighted with this plan of theirs. They are going to lie to that trio again. While it may get them past the double eviction, if Meg is still around as their "pawn" I think Meg would eventually turn on them and possibly swing over to Vanessa's side. If Meg is still in the game I don't think she forgets this. Meg may not win HOH's or comps but she is a vote or a bitter juror.

They aren't going to say "Okay we're in, we'll vote to evict Becky". They said they were going to act like they were open to the plan and that they were on the fence the whole time. Not commit either way.

Honestly, I have no time for Meg and Jason anymore. Jason said that if the plan works, he really won't target Shelli/Clay for the time being. They all deserve to be evicted. Shelli, Clay, and Vanessa should be the final 3, because they're the only ones who actually do things.

Edited July 29, 2015 by Ceeg

[Skycatcher]

 

They need to pull a BB Canada and let us be HOH this week!

How did that work?  Was the "us" the feedsters, or the whole viewing audience.  I'd think the viewing audience would be snowed by the manipulative editing this show does.  I'm always surprised at how the  broadcast show can be so different from what's reported here; it's like two different entities.

[PinkSprinkles]

Honestly, I have no time for Meg and Jason anymore. Jason said that if the plan works, he really won't target Shelli/Clay for the time being. They all deserve to be evicted. Shelli, Clay, and Vanessa should be the final 3, because they're the only ones who actually do things.

 

Excuse me- Johnny Mac throws competitions. That's doing something. :-)