Season 17 Live Feed Discussion: Watch People Sleep All Day!

[call me ishmael]

Oh, she definitely wants to throw it. (Although she'll lie to us in DR about it after the fact.) However, if she catches wind of this thing with Austwins and/or if they actually tell her to vote Julia out instead, then she'll probably end up going for it. She'll have to.

 

 

 

Yep. I can't wait until they go to Vanessa with this. Vanessa's meltdown should be epic!

This is where i think that the worry about the social game gets in the way of the strategic game. They are all so afraid of it being personal that they tell the twins that they will do what they want. But how could john and vanessa possibly think it is better for tueir games to keep liz. It makes no sense.

[TexasChic]

I am developing a stronger and stronger dislike of Austin. I'm watching the feeds from Tuesday June 30 at 12:02. Jace is up on the block.

At the time, Jace was flirting with Liz and she kinda liked him back. But, Austin doesn't like it. He sees Jace and Liz go into the old hammock room to talk about getting votes to stay. Austin watches that and mumbles under his breath "He's gotta go."

Ick.

Y'all probably noticed that long ago, didn't you?

Add that to his lousy attitude for picture taking today and I'm feeling combustible!!! :)

I didn't like him anyway - but now I'm REALLY REALLY not liking him.

For me it was when Austin stormed into a room Steve was in and said, "Get out." Edited September 9, 2015 by TexasChic

[kellog010]

I really dislike Austin and hope whatever he plans backfires. The Austwins would have never gotten this far without Vanessa's help. Is she supposed to let the Austwins just push her out? Why do they think Vanessa double crossed them when all of Scamper Squad made it - wasn't the deal to get to the end and then duke it out? They are they so entitled!

 

Also, do they think John forgot how the Austwins turned on him and basically got him evicted?

Edited September 9, 2015 by kellog010

[Silo]

If she outplays them, I hope she enjoys her money on top of her other money, which she also acquired via skill, intelligence and hard work. This is not a charity.

I would feel this way if Vanessa were equally matched in the game, but she's not. She hasn't earned anything, IMO, bc she's mostly been playing against people who are really dumb. I could do what she's done and I'm not a poker player or a genius. For her it's been like shooting fish in a barrel.

For the viewing audience, at least for me anyway, it's been epically boring because she's made this while season so predictable, especially these last few weeks.

So 1) she already has the money, 2) this has been way too easy for her, almost no skill required on her end, 3) she's made this season boring.

Edited September 9, 2015 by Silo

[AndreaK1041]

So you think she was the best player, but best out of a bad bunch? Not her fault, best is best.

[JediDVguy]

Actually, let's forget about Vanessa for a second. What if Liz wins this game or Julia? They've been edited to be equally as unlikable, despite their competition wins, with any good aspects of their games largely discounted. The show has set it up so if any woman wins, the audience will be disappointed and be able to write off the win because none of them are likable.

I don't think that's a gender-exclusive problem. Very few are happy about the prospect of John or Steve winning either.

(And I really don't need to hear the tired "underdog" scenario, because it's so funny that only applies to white dudes.

I don't recall Marcellas, Kaysar, or Jameka being white dudes, but hey.

And I do see some unintentional sexism in this, because a man on this show always has "game play" as this entity entirely separate from his personality, but a woman's likability and her game play go hand in hand.

Dick, BB6 Eric, Mike Boogie? Edited September 9, 2015 by JediDVguy

[AndreaK1041]

I'd also add the repugnant Frankie. He was hated (especially by me!) but I actually thought he was a pretty decent player. Above average for sure, but no one ever talked about that.

[Former Nun]

Very few are happy about the prospect of John or Steve winning either.

 

 

But those "few" of us are VERY happy!

[Eolivet]

I don't think that's a gender-exclusive problem. Very few are happy about the prospect of John or Steve winning either.

 

There will be a heck of a lot more people will be happy about John or Steve winning than Vanessa, Liz or Julia. Just look at who's been featured on the live show. None of the remaining women (as far as I can remember), and two out of three remaining guys. That's not a coincidence.

 

I never saw Marcellas' original season and I'm ashamed to say I don't remember Jameka. I'm talking about a power alliance being edited negatively in order to be bested by a smaller alliance of underdogs. Kaysar is a good point, though he was evicted early. I'm talking about whole "John and Steve tackle the Austwins!" narrative from this year. Basic white dudes as folk heroes taking down the majority woman alliance, thanks to editing.

 

 

Dick, BB6 Eric, Mike Boogie?

 

You're making my point. Dick was celebrated by the show, as was Mike Boogie (invited back for a third time). Their odious personalities were absolutely excused due to "game play." BB6 Eric (Cappie?) was evicted so early, he had very little game play to speak of. But Dick and Mike Boogie were allowed to exist independently as people from their game play. Show me a woman contestant, other than Maggie, who was allowed to use "game play" as an excuse for a terrible personality in the way those men were -- and whose game play was actually celebrated.

 

I'm not talking about people here on this site -- I'm talking about the general population of BB viewers and the show in general perpetuating sexist attitudes so that no woman will ever be respected for game play if her personality isn't all sunshine and roses or Janelle. That's a really big deal, to me -- especially in a season with three potential woman finalists who aren't nearly as beloved by the viewers or show as two basic white dudes who haven't done a fraction of what they have in the game.

 

Unfortunately, I believe that's not exactly unintentional sexism.

Edited September 9, 2015 by Eolivet

[pennben]

 

I would feel this way if Vanessa were equally matched in the game, but she's not. She hasn't earned anything, IMO, bc she's mostly been playing against people who are really dumb.

 

As opposed to other BB winners who played against mensa members?:)  I mean, last year was not a bastion of great players, indeed, I see them as being on par with folks this year, but many feel that Derrick played one of the greatest games ever.  You play the game against the opponents you have. 

 

For the record, I don't see Vanessa pulling off the win, I haven't for awhile, but she's played a helluva game thus far (despite some mistakes that have put her behind the eight ball a couple of times only to spin her way out).  She's been by far the most interesting one to watch play the game this year.

Edited September 9, 2015 by pennben

[Deputy Deputy CoS]

Sexism exist on Big Brother. There is no denying that. Grodner has always loved her beefy guys. And in past I've hated them just because. Maybe it's because I'm not watching the shows but I haven't seen a blatant production male favorite like I have in the past.

Despite its existence by production and the fandom as a whole, it is possible to dislike Vanessa, or any female contestant for that matter, on a personal or game level, without the element of sexism. Vanessa in particular displays plenty of attributes that is unlikable and I as a fan of the show should be able to express this view without having to defend my stance. I find it offensive that I'm labeled a sexist just because I fall into the group that dislike Vanessa but is rooting for John to win.

I could write paragraphs of my why preferences are what they are but like someone eloquently posted about the juror's perceptive of what makes a good game, I also have my reasons for rooting for or against a houseguest, and it has nothing to do with their private parts. It comes down to how relatable I find them, their likability and entertainment value.  

I prefer to mostly root for the houseguests I most identify with namely the females and African Americans but I don't do so like its my job. Cast my sister or best friend then I'll slap on my tinfoil and root for them against all odds.

We all have bais, and I don't begrudge the ode to Vanessa's so called strategy. I personally don't think she's playing that good a game for the simple fact that she doesn't have a single loyal ally and never has. Shay had each other, Steve now has John, the twins have eachother, ADC, Becky and John had each other's backs. Julia waffles but her loyalty has and will always be with Liz. Steve seemingly had a good thing with her but Steve was ready to cut her weeks ago. Shelli who was a strong ally wouldn't even look at her now. Her remaing allies, strongly dislike the game she's playing but are too passive to do anything about it. All of this didn't happen to her because she's female. She's in the game and might make it to F2 but if sh gets nary a vote, it won't be because of a bitter jury. It'll be because she played a hell of a shitty social game. You know, the aspect that makes up 50% of the game. 

Even Maggie was liked by her minions.

Edited September 9, 2015 by Deputy Deputy CoS

[Cutty]

John says he doesn't care which twin goes. Exhibit 1 billion why he's a terrible player.

[mooses]

Vanessa seems to be hedging her bets on John, wanting Steve gone if an Austwin wins. But John and Steve are supposed to talk game with Austin later, and I'm going to take a wild guess that Vanessa's double dealing will be the center of that conversation.

It will be tough if Vanessa actually gets HOH this week.

Edited September 9, 2015 by mooses

[Silo]

So you think she was the best player, but best out of a bad bunch? Not her fault, best is best.

If I beat toddlers in a game of soccer, how much would you admire my technical skill? Would that game be fun to watch? In a game where *someone* has to win, how proud could I feel over my victory?

It's kinda like that. Not worth anything skill-wise. Not impressed by her at all.

Edited September 9, 2015 by Silo

[Cutty]

I can't believe Vanessa wants to keep Liz now. Is she off her meds? Yikes.

[Silo]

Very few are happy about the prospect of John or Steve winning either.

At this point, I personally hope nobody wins. I want a drone to come and blow up the BB compound lol

[pennben]

 

I can't believe Vanessa wants to keep Liz now.

 

I'm not sure that she wants to, just that she is dealing with the notion that the twins now say that is what they want and they all agreed to let the twins decide.  If she doesn't play in to the possibility that Liz could stay, John could be the hero to keep Liz (and I think he's been thinking about that), leaving Vanessa holding the bag of the vote against Liz. It's still only Tuesday, let's see where this all goes.

[Silo]

I can't believe Vanessa wants to keep Liz now. Is she off her meds? Yikes.

Vanessa always wants the opposite of what people want for themselves because she thinks if they want something really, really bad it means they're up to something. And with this season, she's been right about that.

[Katesus7]

Despite its existence by production and the fandom as a whole, it is possible to dislike Vanessa, or any female contestant for that matter, on a personal or game level, without the element of sexism. Vanessa in particular displays plenty of attributes that is unlikable and I as a fan of the show should be able to express this view without having to defend my stance. I find it offensive that I'm labeled a sexist just because I fall into the group that dislike Vanessa but is rooting for John to win it all a sexist.

 

Deputy Deputy Cos, I love your entire post, but especially this. I love that everyone here has differing opinions, and they like and dislike different HGs; I've always tried my best with debating various players without judging others, although I'm sure I've failed at times.  And I'm fine with general discussions about sexism in this game - and there is a lot of it.  I just feel like I've been called out as a sexist many times over this discussion, and it's starting to get to me a bit.  I always, always try to find a woman to root for.  Women good, men bad is my motto :).  I really thought this season was going to be the season of the badass women, and in many respects it has.  Shelli and Vanessa will always stand out to me as the most fearless players, who owned the first half of this season.  The two of them could have gone to the end, and if I personally had liked either of them just a little bit, I would have been cheering them on.  But I didn't.  Maybe that's on me, but I don't think it is. 

 

I like John.  I HATED him before the show, with his interview with Jeff.  I wanted him gone first.  But I like him.  It's not because he's a guy, he already had two strikes against him with me, one of which was because he was a guy (because I tend to be against men in this game).  But I like him.  And I'm not a sexist for it. 

 

I don't like the twins.  I really, really wanted to like them, I kept expecting to like them, but it never happened.  I just don't like them.

 

Vanessa was one of my pre-show favorites.  During her first HOH, she became my absolute favorite.  She got out Jeff. Yes!  But then I watched her on the feeds.  A lot.  And she cried, and she talked and talked, and I did not care for the way she talked to other people.  Austin when he almost got backdoored, but she "saved" him, John when he told her how he honestly felt about her, and she felt the need to tell him how awful he was for saying it, Steve when he dared go against her, and she gave him the mother of all guilt trips.  I don't like that.  I don't like it if it's a man, or a woman, or anyone.  I just don't care for it. 

 

So I will just say everyone in this forum is watching the feeds, and therefore is already nuts  But we know these people, and we come by our likes/dislikes of these people honestly, and maybe we can all just agree to disagree about all of them? And that I'm not sexist? I promise?

[mooses]

If I beat toddlers in a game of soccer, how much would you admire my technical skill? Would that game be fun to watch? In a game where *someone* has to win, how proud could I feel over my victory?

It's kinda like that. Not worth anything skill-wise.

I think these HGs aren't useless sheep like last year. There's varying levels, ranging from say Meg to Vanessa, but no one is handing the game away like The House to Derrick last year (who also had Team America!).

Vanessa has been in trouble and wiggled out of it enough times that she's earned her keep. She's seemed to be screwed many times, most recently needing to put someone up with Meg without getting anyone mad, and still managed to make it to Final 5. And won competitions to save herself.

I don't see her walking to the end at all. She has a tough road ahead of her, and seems to be back up on the target list next week. I'd say that I see her going if I hadn't been wrong so often before.

I feel like everyone left has earned their keep for the most part by now, except John because he's on his second life.

[Silo]

I think these HGs aren't useless sheep like last year. There's varying levels, ranging from say Meg to Vanessa, but no one is handing the game away like The House to Derrick last year (who also had Team America!).

Vanessa has been in trouble and wiggled out of it enough times that she's earned her keep. She's seemed to be screwed many times, most recently needing to put someone up with Meg without getting anyone mad, and still managed to make it to Final 5. And won competitions to save herself.

I don't see her walking to the end at all. She has a tough road ahead of her, and seems to be back up on the target list next week. I'd say that I see her going if I hadn't been wrong so often before.

I feel like everyone left has earned their keep for the most part by now, except John because he's on his second life.

If Vanessa has earned her position by "wiggling out of" situations, hasn't John earned his position by getting back into - and staying - after being evicted? If we're judging by wiggle ability, doesn't that count? Edited September 9, 2015 by Silo

[mooses]

So I will just say everyone in this forum is watching the feeds, and therefore is already nuts But we know these people, and we come by our likes/dislikes of these people honestly, and maybe we can all just agree to disagree about all of them? And that I'm not sexist? I promise?

Yeah, I kinda think this topic has been beaten down, then revived, just to be beaten again. I don't think anyone is a sexist who doesn't like Vanessa (or any other woman!).

I do think the way Big Brother The Show portrays HGs does tend to have a dividing line between men and women. But that's more of a big picture, spanning seasons discussion.

Just to make that clear. I don't want to insult anyone herr for having an opinion, because we all have 'em.

Because, yeah, I like my fellow nuttos.

If Vanessa has earned her position by "wiggling out of" situations, hasn't John earned his position by getting back into - and staying - after being evicted? If we're judging by wiggle ability, doesn't that count?

Because he was evicted. That's just my viewpoint - he was outplayed once, which he couldn't wiggle out of. It's fair to say that he's a legitimate HG and can win because Big Brother had the twist so it's okay, but I think getting evicted is a big black mark on the resume. Edited September 9, 2015 by mooses

[Cutty]

Actually letting the nominees decide who gets evicted at F6 might be the stupidest thing I've ever seen on this show.

[pennben]

That's what they all told the twins when it was Liz that wanted to go (and who was who they wanted to go), let's just wait out the next couple of days.

Edited September 9, 2015 by pennben

[AndreaK1041]

If I beat toddlers in a game of soccer, how much would you admire my technical skill? Would that game be fun to watch? In a game where *someone* has to win, how proud could I feel over my victory?

It's kinda like that. Not worth anything skill-wise. Not impressed by her at all.

You would deserve the win, yes.

[mooses]

Actually letting the nominees decide who gets evicted at F6 might be the stupidest thing I've ever seen on this show.

Seriously. They hate John, Steve and Vanessa at this point anyway. And it's not like they have many other nomination choices. So stupid to still try and stay good with absolutely everyone.

And apparently the twins are offended by John's "byeee" to them.

Edited September 9, 2015 by mooses

[Cutty]

Liz tells Julia the deal she made with Vanessa is bullshit and she's not following through with it.

She also tells Julia to blow up Vanessa's game before she goes.

[mooses]

Liz tells Julia the deal she made with Vanessa is bullshit and she's not following through with it.

She also tells Julia to blow up Vanessa's game before she goes.

Well, that was an over the top ridiculous deal to rule all of Vanessa's deals...

Although I will laugh if Liz leaves after her and Austin are so sure she's staying!

Edited September 9, 2015 by mooses

[robertorv]

I know its only Tuesday and things can change, but if things stay the same and Julia gets evicted ... The thing I will look forward to is the cbs show segment of her arriving to the jury house. I am expecting SHOCKED reactions. I think if you were to give each member of the jury a pen and paper, and asked them each to write down their order of most likely to least likely person to next walk through the jury house doors ... I think every last one of them would choose Julia as their dead last least likely.

Edited September 9, 2015 by robertorv

[Vicky]

So I will just say everyone in this forum is watching the feeds, and therefore is already nuts  

 

 

Because, yeah, I like my fellow nuttos.

 

Amen and Amen...:)  

 

(Lots of good discussion and interesting points made)

Edited September 9, 2015 by Vicky

[kellog010]

I think part of the reason Vanessa is playing along with the twins is that Steve gives her nothing. If Steve gave her more incentive to pick his side then I think she'd go all in with John and Steve for now. Instead every time Vanessa tries to talk game with Steve, he deflects and acts all squirelly which she picks up on. John doesn't really give her anything either so Vanessa probably feels in her mind she has to survive at least through this next eviction without winning HOH and she can't count on them. She probably knows she's not likely to win this game but at least if she makes it F4 her fate is in her own hands.

[peachmangosteen]

This is where i think that the worry about the social game gets in the way of the strategic game. They are all so afraid of it being personal that they tell the twins that they will do what they want. But how could john and vanessa possibly think it is better for tueir games to keep liz. It makes no sense.

 

I think it makes some sense for John. I think his primary reason for not caring if it's Julia that goes is because Julia is the #1 goat and with her gone he will be seen as the #1 goat. He seems to think his best path now is to be seen as someone with no shot to win and therefore a good person to take to the end and Julia stands in the way of that because she's a much better goat and she has more connections than he does.

 

So I will just say everyone in this forum is watching the feeds, and therefore is already nuts  But we know these people, and we come by our likes/dislikes of these people honestly, and maybe we can all just agree to disagree about all of them? And that I'm not sexist? I promise?

 

LMAO at the first sentence. Truer words!

 

I'll say this, I think Vanessa has played a better game than Derrick to be sure and she'll be a better winner than him imo, but I still don't like her.

Edited September 9, 2015 by peachmangosteen

[Deputy Deputy CoS]

John says he doesn't care which twin goes. Exhibit 1 billion why he's a terrible player.

 

Yet Vanesa is the one who gave them a choice on which twin goes. Even if she was bullshitting, why put herself in that corner. This type of poor people management is why is unpopular with her peers.

[peachmangosteen]

Yet Vanesa is the one who gave them a choice on which twin goes. Even if she was bullshitting, why put herself in that corner. This type of poor people management is why is unpopular with her peers.

 

I agree. That was just monumentally stupid on Vanessa's part and I hope it screws her over.

Edited September 9, 2015 by peachmangosteen

[MrsMommy]

Imo if you strip vanessa down to game play only, I think she played one hell of a game, it's when you start mixing in all the crazy talk, all the repeating herself, all the unnecessary lies that make me not like her for the winner. But again based on just game play she is pretty awesome.

Eta// her giving the twins a choice in who leave adds fuel to my dislike fire

Edited September 9, 2015 by MrsMommy

[blixie]

 

That's what they all told the twins when it was Liz that wanted to go (and who was who they wanted to go), let's just wait out the next couple of days.

 

Yeah the fact this is all playing out now makes me more calm, by Thursday I assume Vanessa (and John if he has half a brain cell) will land the same place the landed when Clelli was on the block and James wanted Shelli out: fuck you, we have the votes, we will just roll on those competitions that matter more now, with Julia, even if it doesn't work out, I can't believe the ODDS are with keeping Liz. No way. 

[perfectstorm]

I would feel this way if Vanessa were equally matched in the game, but she's not. She hasn't earned anything, IMO, bc she's mostly been playing against people who are really dumb. I could do what she's done and I'm not a poker player or a genius. For her it's been like shooting fish in a barrel.

For the viewing audience, at least for me anyway, it's been epically boring because she's made this while season so predictable, especially these last few weeks.

So 1) she already has the money, 2) this has been way too easy for her, almost no skill required on her end, 3) she's made this season boring.

Well, she can't be all that stupid if she eventually walks off with $500K by convincing a jury of her peers (whom she had a hand in voting off) - that she deserves to win.  Hardly chump change for supposedly being boring.

 

Skills?  This is Big Brother - not Top Chef, not Project Runway, lol.

[peachmangosteen]

I just read what Vanessa's demands were for keeping Liz.

 

1. No front doors for Vanessa and they take her to F4.
2. Vanessa decides who goes between Steve/John.
3. They choose Vanessa over Steve/John for a final 2.

 

Really Vanessa? My damn, woman! You (dumbly) told them that you'd vote how they wanted, so you actually don't get to 'make a deal' now to do what you already told them you would. Also, maybe don't make so many demands, it might work out better for you.

 

I'm assuming she just got cocky with the 'I'll vote how you decide' business. She was trying to work that social game (little late!) and she assumed she was going to be able to manipulate them into believing Liz going was better for them. It didn't work out. So then she made it about 10 times worse by trying to 'make a deal' now. You already made a deal, Vanessa. All that wanting to make a new deal does is prove to Austwins that you were lying about the other one. And like honestly, it's about to be F5, deals are kinda over now.

[Cutty]

That's one of the things I've hated the most about this season (and Vanessa's gameplay in particular). Deals, deals, deals. We must make deals with everyone in the house every single week. Laughable that it's still happening at final fucking six. This is why I much prefer a split house. You're on that side, I'm on this side. We're going after each other because THAT'S THE GAME. 

[gunderda]

Vanessa made this season boring?? I have to strongly disagree with that one.... I don't even like her but she's brought some great crazy to the game.  She took over where Audrey left off.  Without her mind-screwing everyone this game would be REALLY boring. 

[Jrae9233]

Well, she can't be all that stupid if she eventually walks off with $500K by convincing a jury of her peers (whom she had a hand in voting off) - that she deserves to win. Hardly chump change for supposedly being boring.

Skills? This is Big Brother - not Top Chef, not Project Runway, lol.

Yeah my way of determining if a win was deserved is pretty simple. "Did you win? Yes. Okay, congrats, you deserved and earned that win." This is Big Brother, where luck, smart moves, personality, and comp wins all lead up to the finals. There isn't a set skill necessary to make it to the end, so as long as you get to the end, a good game was played.

[LoveLeigh]

Yeah my way of determining if a win was deserved is pretty simple. "Did you win? Yes. Okay, congrats, you deserved and earned that win." This is Big Brother, where luck, smart moves, personality, and comp wins all lead up to the finals. There isn't a set skill necessary to make it to the end, so as long as you get to the end, a good game was played.

However, a winner can get there just from the process of elimination because he flies under the radar while all the others are picked off for so many reasons one by one. That's how Adam won in season 9. 

[Eolivet]

I just wanted to apologize to anyone I offended with my posts. It was not my intent. My frustration is with the show and reactions from the general public to certain contestants, not this thread. Thank you to all who recap for those of us who don't have the feeds. I'm indebted to you.

 

I think I'm ready for Survivor to start again. At least they have to edit towards a winner there, no matter who he -- or she -- is.

[Wings]

Catching up here.  I am still reeling from their decision to vote Julia out because that is what the twins want.  Jesus. 

[TheRealT]

However, a winner can get there just from the process of elimination because he flies under the radar while all the others are picked off for so many reasons one by one. That's how Adam won in season 9. 

If that works, there's no reason to do anything else. Some people (e.g., Julia) just luck into being carried far in the game because they have the protection of one or more strong players, there are always bigger fish to fry, etc., etc. If someone is positioned that way it's dumb for them to make big moves just for the sake of making big moves. There's a huge element of luck to the game, from who wins the comps to the mix of players in the house. Some people luck into being able to fly under the radar for a long time while others have a big target on them from the beginning.

[Nashville]

The Austwins are being foolish. Even if they "expose" Vanessa, why would anyone take her out before taking out the Showmance (humoring for a second that Liz stays). .

 

Expose WHAT, exactly??? I can hear it now...

Julia: All of you listen! Vanessa has been making deals with everybody!!!

John: Aaaahhhh... yeah. And where have you been for the past two-plus months...?

  

If I beat toddlers in a game of soccer, how much would you admire my technical skill?

If giving little Jimmy a Spaulding tattoo with a soccer ball netted you $500K, I'd admire the hell out of it.

  

I like John.  I HATED him before the show, with his interview with Jeff.  I wanted him gone first.  But I like him.  It's not because he's a guy, he already had two strikes against him with me, one of which was because he was a guy (because I tend to be against men in this game).  But I like him.  And I'm not a sexist for it. 

 

 

Looking back through the gray mists of time to the beginning of the season, I seem to remember a lot of folks looking at the bio page and saying, "A dentist from Scranton? God, he's going to be boring as hell." Which has been one of the reasons I've continually liked Sir John Mac, Anal Raper of First Impressions.

 

Actually letting the nominees decide who gets evicted at F6 might be the stupidest thing I've ever seen on this show.

  

I think it makes some sense for John. I think his primary reason for not caring if it's Julia that goes is because Julia is the #1 goat and with her gone he will be seen as the #1 goat. He seems to think his best path now is to be seen as someone with no shot to win and therefore a good person to take to the end and Julia stands in the way of that because she's a much better goat and she has more connections than he does.

After much reflection, I've come to the conclusion that - with the exception of JMac, for the specific reasons peachmangosteen has already laid out - anybody in the House who votes to evict Julia over Liz is stupider than sun-dried shit.

I get the "Oh, Julia just may float all the way to F2" argument - but I do not accept it, because the alternative presented is so much more of a viable threat. Julia's laser-like skill at keeping a ball on a boomerang notwithstanding, she will always be this season's Victoria - easy to jettison right up to F3 because her game will always be in the hands of others. Whereas Liz has won enough comps - including HoH comps - to take the power of game control out of your hands, and quite possibly put you OTB and out the door.

[Katesus7]

So I think everyone is in danger of going next week except Vanessa, depending on who wins HOH and Veto.  Even though I do think everyone is on to her "final two" deals, I believe John would still target Austin/Liz and they would target Steve/John.  I think Vanessa is much more vulnerable at final four, once one of those two groups is broken up, so it makes perfect sense to throw this HOH. 

 

But yeah, telling the twins that they can decide, and they deciding on Julia?  That could bite her in the ass.  Even after trying to get them to agree to that laughable "deal" of hers.  Sheesh, she practically made them promise her their first born child!

[Ceeg]

So I think everyone is in danger of going next week except Vanessa, depending on who wins HOH and Veto.

Hmm. I think we're at a point where everyone is in danger, even Vanessa. That's why all this "Vanessa needs to be exposed!!1!" stuff just makes me laugh because, exposed to who? There are only 5 players left. Everyone is exposed and everyone is in danger of going home. Vanessa could very well go home next week, and so could John or Steve or Liz or Austin.

 

I'm at the point now where I just wish everything would fast forward very quickly. Two weeks is a long freakin time to only have 5 people left. Game play talk is almost irrelevant now. It's just down to comps IMO, because everyone in that house knows what way they'll vote and who they'll evict, depending on who's on the block. 

Edited September 9, 2015 by Ceeg

[Vicky]

I wish they'd have a 'house meeting' and just lay it all out there.  Look - this is a game.  I want to win, you want to win.  I've made deals, you've made deals...that's the point of Big Brother (more or less).  There's nothing sinister going on - nobody hates anybody - we're just trying to position ourselves to win.  Let's play.

 

It's tiresome to hear the twins whine about Vanessa, to see Johnny Mac and Steve still dance around their plans, and to watch Austin do his exercises and primp (blech Austin).

[gina64]

I wish they'd have a 'house meeting' and just lay it all out there.  Look - this is a game.  I want to win, you want to win.  I've made deals, you've made deals...that's the point of Big Brother (more or less).  There's nothing sinister going on - nobody hates anybody - we're just trying to position ourselves to win.  Let's play.

 

It's tiresome to hear the twins whine about Vanessa, to see Johnny Mac and Steve still dance around their plans, and to watch Austin do his exercises and primp (blech Austin).

 

THIS. I just wish Vanessa - all of them, really - would just own their individual game. I want them to say "you know what? No, I won't evict Julia because it's not good for MY game. Good luck to everyone in the remaining comps!" I'm really tired of the excessively convoluted game play this year. It was whacky and fun for a while, but it's worn me down, lol.

 

Steve's sketchiness and inability to just answer a damn question even when it's posed by an alliance member, even at this stage of the game, probably doesn't help Vanessa's confidence in that alliance.

 

Also, I've never been a fan of Steve, but I kinda feel bad that his HOH has been completely gutted by Vanessa. (If they do end up keeping Liz).