S05.E16: Amster-Damn

[ryebread]

The day it's legal in Michigan, I will be the first person in line. 

I'll be right behind you and while we're waiting for the store to open, we can wax poetic over our magical Clarisonics.  When you do get your hands on that legal bud, use caution and don't love it too much.  The stuff that's legal now seems 10 times more potent than what I remember.  Trust.  One and done.  Hit, that is.

 

I think I would be silly in an Amsterdam café like the Hos were, too.  I've never been able to imagine what it would be like to just go somewhere and order it off a descriptive menu. And it's been legal there forever.  I'd totally be tittering over the menu like they were but I'm a quiet titterer. 

[motorcitymom65]

 

I loathed Brandi long before it became popular to do so but it's hard for me to cut Kyle any slack.  In my mind, she's just as awful as Brandi on the inside. Mean and spiteful and very damaged.  She just presents a classier picture on the outside. (Unless her legs are wide open on a bed or table as she gets a bikini wax for ratings.)  They've all got good points and bad points.  Some just have a greater deficit in the 'good' column. 

 

This season, Kyle is really cleaning up her act.  I don't think we will ever see her in such a compromising, spread eagle position again. In combination because she's seen the backlash (possibly her daughters have had some) and Moe is growing an empire.  I just keep wondering why she doesn't quit this shit storm show, leave Kim in the dust and just go about her days doing something worthwhile and spending all that lovely money.

I love you more than my luggage, but cannot see that Kyle is comparable to Brandi. I have always liked Kyle, which is not to say that I like everything about her, or co-sign everything she has done. But then I can't say that I like everything about anyone that I know. For the most part she seems to have her priorities all lined up, which is something that I dig. While I think she can be a mean girl, I don't think she takes any pleasure in hurting people, or thinks that she somehow looks better when she makes someone else look bad. I also think she is capable of self-reflection. I don't think we will see her doing the splits again, but I have zero issue with the gals changing elements about themselves once they see the way it plays out on TV. I've had to do that thing at work where they film you making presentations or interacting with others, and they play it back for the crown for analysis. All in the interest of showcasing your personal communication style and why it may/may not work. It is jarring and I still get nervous just remembering it. The first time it happened to me I was shocked to see some of my mannerisms. Things I had done my whole life that I thought were funny or endearing that were just silly. I changed a lot of those things because the reaction of others highlighted the fact that I wasn't nearly as cool as I thought I was. 

 

I do think that Brandi believes that Kyle is the same basic person as she is, and that this is one of the reasons she is the most jelly of Kyle. Kyle is the only person on the show who lives the life that I think Brandi would aspire too. She was enamored with Lisa and Ken, and also with Yo, and she would like a lot of things about their lives, but she doesn't want to be married to an old man. Their money and the power that gives is all that she would want. With Kyle she would like the whole thing. They are the closest in age, and Brandi said early on that she found Mauricio sexy and that he was a good father and husband. Brandi had a somewhat dysfunctional childhood, like Kyle did, but Kyle was able to get out of it all fairly unscathed (not including Kim). An out-of-wedlock pregnancy, a young marriage and then a divorce, but none of that ruined her life. She was able to land a great guy - who was a regular Joe at the time, far away from what her crazy mother wanted for her - and make a very nice life. She is beautiful and hasn't felt the need to completely fuck with her face, but yet she does do things to keep herself fresh and as young as possible. I think to Brandi, Kyle is very much like her, but she gets away with things, or things just seem to work out for her. Brandi's husband was a cheater and she made it the "worlds business". I have no idea about Mauricio, but Brandi wouldn't mind reminding people that perhaps he has done the same. Why should Kyle get away with having a cheater for a husband? Why is she so special? Why does Kyle get to drink and folks not judge her? Brandi loved to make the accusation in her blog early in the season on several occasions that Kyle was drinking as much as she was. In her world, that makes Kyle the same as her. Brandi smokes pot, so if Kyle does, why shouldn't the world know this about this? Doesn't it make them the same? I think it makes Brandi nuts that in her mind, Kyle is just like her but doesn't get judged in the same manner. I think they are nothing alike. 

I'll be right behind you and while we're waiting for the store to open, we can wax poetic over our magical Clarisonics.  When you do get your hands on that legal bud, use caution and don't love it too much.  The stuff that's legal now seems 10 times more potent than what I remember.  Trust.  One and done.  Hit, that is.

 

I think I would be silly in an Amsterdam café like the Hos were, too.  I've never been able to imagine what it would be like to just go somewhere and order it off a descriptive menu. And it's been legal there forever.  I'd totally be tittering over the menu like they were but I'm a quiet titterer. 

It's a date. You can show me the ropes. Just don't tell Brandi or bring any Bravo cameras with you. 

[eurekagirl mOo]

SO of Kim did go into the hospital to detox (or had an od we don't know about)she is trying. I think all the hernia, coughing stuff was a cover for the get Kim to the hospital and get the drugs out of her. Addicts relapse. It happens all the time. And, honestly, I don't think just because we watch her on TV we have any right to know to know if she has a sponsor or works a program. That's her business. Not ours. doesn't matter what we think we see or don't see on TV, in real life it's not any of our business! That's what medical records are sealed. Privacy is not something you sign away just because you agree to be on TV 20 mins. a week. Addicts also aren't the nicest people when they get off there drug of choice. That's natural. Your body craves something it can't have and it can make you mean and nasty .Take a cigarette example: You smoke for years. Your kids want you to quit, your partner wants you to quit, your Dr. tells you to quit or you will die. So you finally try. You may make it a week. Maybe only a few days. Then the nicotine calls you. So you have a few quick drags. Then a few more. Then you buy a pack. Then you're smoking again! Relapse!!!! So are you a horrible, terrible,awful, human being because you can't quit on try 1 or 2 or even 3?  Same thing people. How many cranky people have you come across who just quit smoking? How many actually succeed? Drugs,alcohol,nicotine,pills,all addictive

[ryebread]

Episodes such as this where Kyle becomes the villain because she doesn't do enough for Kim are taxing and Kim is doing nothing to even be close to acting like a co-star let alone sister to Kyle.  How incredibly uncomfortable Kim makes it for the rest of the ladies when she decides to ice Kyle out. 

 

I just don't see Kyle being painted as a victim.  No matter how much Harry thinks this is art.  Seriously, though, I see Kyle getting a good edit thus far.  If anyone would see her as a villain, that would be me but I've actually felt a tiny bit, read: miniscule, sorry for her.  Not that I still don't think she's a dumbass but all these posts describing what it's like to be the family member of an addict opened my eyes a little.... I'm not a complete monster. ;-)

[Sincerely Yours]

No, its the lack of apology for not just one incident, but many incidents.  Did Kim ever apologize to anyone for her behavior in Hawaii?  Did Kim ever apologize to Adrianne and Paul for holding up their plane?  Did Kim ever apologize to LisaR for her behavior in the limo?  Did Kim ever apologize to Eileen for her behavior at the poker party?  Did Kim ever apologize to Kyle for ANY of the times she screamed at her, whether it was for not being there for her or bitching about Kyle holding them up at the airport?  There have been other instances in between Hawaii and the latest incidents, where Kim had her wagging finger working overtime, but I tuned them out at the time (kind of a 'blah, blah, blah' thing like Kim does when she doesn't care to listen).  I'd like to see a list of the times Kim HAS apologized, rather than blaming others and playing the eternal victim. 

Then I guess no one should expect one from her. Not exhaust themselves. I'm not saying Kim is right I'm just saying it's ridiculous to keep banging heads against brick walls. Definition of insanity. Doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different result. Just saying.

[talula]

So far she owes apologies to Kyle, Lisar, Eileen, Yolanda, Lisav and even Brandi-but Brandi claims she is so strong she wouldn't want one.  I do think after the dog chomped Kay Rosario's arm that Kim's kids were probably concerned about her lack of responsibility.

For a 12 out of a 19 episode season of RHOBH co-workers identify Kim as an alcoholic/drug addict and say she's crazy, never bother to speak off camera to her and she owes them an apology....poppy cock? Somewhere along the line it might be considered a wash.

[ryebread]

For the most part she seems to have her priorities all lined up, which is something that I dig.

 

See, I think her priorities are allllllll jacked up by being on this show at all.  She doesn't need to be there, exposing herself and her family.  In other areas she may have her priorities in order but in this regard not so much.  Again, imnsho she should go live her great life relatively stress free and stop embarrassing her kids.  (Assuming they're embarrassed but they're young women. How can they not be? For the raspy, gasping crying alone!) 

 

While I think she can be a mean girl, I don't think she takes any pleasure in hurting people, or thinks that she somehow looks better when she makes someone else look bad.

 

I just can't forget the scene of her laughing at Brandi during her own fundraiser the first time she met her.  While Brandi sat alone and listened.  To top it off, Faye was cackling along with her.  That's another thing:  Faye as bestie. Big fat character question mark for me.  And the pointy finger and ignorance about The Gays and homeless people and...and...and...LOL.  I just can't stand her. I like Brandi LESS but there ya go. The same but different.  I  think she's a very mean girl and if she wasn't living this charmed life (Kim excepted) she'd be jelly and trying to take down someone who was.  Just like Brandi.  Because I do agree with all you said about Brandi being jealous of everything Kyle has.

 

LOL at your introspection video.  I did something similar.  Gah.  That's why I never, ever blame or disbelieve an actor or spokesperson that says they don't watch themselves on tape. 

 

But we can trade those stories when we meet up to smoke a doobie, weed, pot, joint...I'd better call Kyle to confirm the term.  ;-)

[ottergirl]

Funny she was also in the hospital 8 days. Can anyone say detox! Thats why I dont believe her "one pill"/hernia story. Probably why she was in so much pain she was taking Monty's meds and patches and she finally had a bad reaction that almost was fatal. There is no telling how long before and during filming season 5 when she was taking his drugs and hers even for anxiety and panic disorders. 

 

This is interesting to me.  It explains why Kim was SO angry at Kyle the table, and afterwards, for not defending Kim - not because Kyle knew Kim was sober, but because Kyle knew she WASN'T, and wasn't "protecting" her.  Kim's anger almost makes more sense to me if Kyle knew that Kim had OD'd, had relapsed, was having a serious crisis, and wasn't trying to cover it up for her.  

 

Now let me be clear.  I don't think Kyle should cover up for Kim. I think Kim is one hundred percent wrong on every level - she is a nasty piece of work, an addict, who is clearly used to doing whatever she wants and having everyone around her (Kyle, AND PRODUCTION) "cover up" for her.   I think the entire Richards dynamic is a disaster and Kyle, who is the closest to being a normal, functional human being, is getting sucked in and spit up by the Richards machine.  Her exit from the dinner table was literally a step in the right direction:  I think Kyle should keep running and never stop.  I am completely Team Kyle in this sense, and if there's an intervention to be had, I want an intervention for Kyle, to drop Kim (and probably a lot of the rest of that Richards crew), and rebuild her life without them.

 

But before, I honestly didn't even understand why Kim was mad at Kyle, who never attacked her or tried to out her.  Now I might get it more:  "You know I almost died, you know I'm in real trouble, and you're just sitting there and letting these people expose my secrets.  Mom's going to haunt you for sure."

[thesupremediva1]

 

Sorry, but Kyle was not outed. It was something she didn't hide or deny. Honestly, if she were trying to hide something, you think she would do it in Brandi's presence? Pot smoking...eh. No big deal. Who cares if Kyle or even Brandi smokes it?  It wasn't pot smoking that got Brandi a DUI or caused her to show her nasty ass with the tampon string.

Thank you! There was nothing to out. Just the words of a bottom-feeder who's been spreading vicious lies about her coworkers for years. Outing other's family secrets and defaming their families is what gives Vacant Parasite a second-hand contact high. Misery is her drug. Not wanting to smoke pot on camera has nothing to do with being a hypocrite. Only someone as classless as the Vacant Parasite would be unable to see that. Kyle calmly explained that it was her choice as a parent. I can't believe that Kyle hasn't attempted to throttle VP at this point. She deserves it more than her bff Kim.

 

VP, with her heavy guilty conscience, took Kyle's rationalization as a jab at her parenting ability and went off, once again, like the unstable booze-hound loon ball she is. True narcissists cannot see past themselves, and VP demonstrates that to a T. What VP doesn't understand is that there is no need for the other ladies to speak ill of her parenting ability or call her names. VP makes her shortcomings apparent all by herself. Tampons, aggression, malcontented outbursts... I could go on. I don't need Kyle or Lisa or anyone to tell me Brandi's a bad parent or a lush. I can see that with my own eyes. Take an inventory, love.

[talula]

An alcoholic is a person with a disability and is protected by the ADA if he or she is qualified to perform the essential functions of the job. An employer may be required to provide an accommodation to an alcoholic.

 

I hope Kim hires a disability lawyer.
 

[QuinnM]

I too hope Kim hires a disability lawyer who will have to publicity announce that Kim is active in her disease.  You understand that an alcoholic that is not currently active in their disease has not disability, right?  So get a lawyer and admit that you continue to have relapses.

[talula]

I too hope Kim hires a disability lawyer who will have to publicity announce that Kim is active in her disease.  You understand that an alcoholic that is not currently active in their disease has not disability, right?  So get a lawyer and admit that you continue to have relapses.

Bravo could not fire her as long as she was a recovered alcoholic because that is a disability.  Maybe this was an additional reason she was upset with having Lisar saying she's an addict. 

 

Also this is what could have prompted Brandi to do a 21-day cleanse to prove to the other ladies and Bravo that she is not an alcoholic.

Edited March 9, 2015 by RealityTVSmack1

[motorcitymom65]

I too hope Kim hires a disability lawyer who will have to publicity announce that Kim is active in her disease.  You understand that an alcoholic that is not currently active in their disease has not disability, right?  So get a lawyer and admit that you continue to have relapses.

God, that would be awesome! I would love to hear her claim she is disabled because she is an active alcoholic, after talking about her 3 years of sobriety. Bring it on.

It could never happen because she is considered a contract employee. She is not entitled to the same benefits that the vast majority of us are. She cannot sue for wrongful termination, for discrimination, etc. If they wanted to, they could fire her because she got fat. My employer cannot do that. Her remedy would be to sue if her contract was violated. If they told her it is just fine for her to be an alcoholic and put in her contract that they will never hold this against her - just drink and pop pills to your hearts content all the while on camera - then that would be a breach of contract if they fired her. They don't have to give any reason to fire these gals. They actually aren't firing them; they are not renewing their contract.

[zoeysmom]

For a 12 out of a 19 episode season of RHOBH co-workers identify Kim as an alcoholic/drug addict and say she's crazy, never bother to speak off camera to her and she owes them an apology....poppy cock? Somewhere along the line it might be considered a wash.

We have heard about Yolanda's daughters being models in every episode she has been in.  I guess I don't get the point of the number of times Kim's addiction/health issues have been mentioned.  Kim has pretty much left everything unexplained on the show.  We certainly didn't have a scene where we saw Kim explain to one and all she had taken a pain mediation.  We saw her explain it to but Brandi and Kyle.  Kim has said she wants no one asking about her so how would they all know what was up with Kim?  What Kim wanted was a BS explanation saying she was in pain and therefore her horrible behavior was excused because she went into the hospital the next day.

 

If you create havoc at a party, cause it to shut down early, have the discussion that took place in the driveway, call people stupid, tell the host to eff off you owe an apology.  You owe an apology if you go after someone's husband for no other reason that to hurt them.  If nothing else when Lisar was apologizing to Kim accept it and move on instead of lashing out at her.

[AnnA]

I just can't forget the scene of her laughing at Brandi during her own fundraiser the first time she met her.  While Brandi sat alone and listened.  To top it off, Faye was cackling along with her.  That's another thing:  Faye as bestie. Big fat character question mark for me.  And the pointy finger and ignorance about The Gays and homeless people and...and...and...LOL.  I just can't stand her. I like Brandi LESS but there ya go. The same but different.  I  think she's a very mean girl and if she wasn't living this charmed life (Kim excepted) she'd be jelly and trying to take down someone who was.  Just like Brandi.  Because I do agree with all you said about Brandi being jealous of everything Kyle has.

 

I agree with you about Kyle and love that you mentioned Faye as her bestie.  IMHO that speaks volumes about Kyle.  I dislike Brandi too but at least she's not a phony.  She's loud, crude, inappropriate and often mean but she doesn't pretend to be anything other than what she is.  That's the one thing I can give Brandi  - what you see is what you get.  She gives off this "take it or leave it" attitude. Personally, I think that's a cover she uses to protect herself from getting hurt again.   I'd prefer to "leave it" because she's not the type of person I would associate with  but I still give her credit for not playing the martyr like Kyle does.

Edited March 9, 2015 by AnnA

[BlackMamba]

I think Brandi and Kim are trying very hard to make Kyle quit the show. We hear Kyle talking about growing her business and taking care of four children and a husband. If Kim and Brandi had it their way they would like to start taking away what Kyle has managed to accumulate. This is the first season where I have heard Kyle during the season express doubts about returning. Personally, I think there is very little chance she will quit but I think there is probably a higher chance that Kim will not be asked back. I don't think Kim will be happy until she starts seeing Kyle have to give up some of what she has acquired. I fully expect Kim to then call Kyle a weak loser for not being able to juggle everything.

Episodes such as this where Kyle becomes the villain because she doesn't do enough for Kim are taxing and Kim is doing nothing to even be close to acting like a co-star let alone sister to Kyle. How incredibly uncomfortable Kim makes it for the rest of the ladies when she decides to ice Kyle out. Lisar for me has two strikes against her this episode, first shattering the glass and now saying she doesn't want to hang with Eileen and Kyle and rehash the circumstances of the night before. Pretty brazen considering she and Kim were at the center of the disaster.

I still dont believe Kyle is quiting. She was just giving an answer most HWs would typically give since their contrActs are year by year basis. I think LVP said something to this effect on her Twitter a few days and I just rolled my eyes. Like I said in previous posts, if they (Bravo) do end up keeping Kim and Brandi they are just gonna sweeten the pot and give Kyle more money or a bonus I believe. Or they'll find a way like, LVP, to keep Kyle from shooting many scenes with Brandi. Come season 6 I dont expect Brandi and Kyle to feud, Brandi will probably make Lisa R her next target since going against LVP/Kyle didn't work to her in her best interest the last two seasons.

But I do agree Brandi was counting her eggs before they hatched big time before the season started that we the viewers would witness Season 2 Kyle vs Brandi in her preseason interviews. Brandi thought she would win more fan support by going against Kyle again but the minute she came inbetween sisters and taking advantage/manipulating a known drug addict like Kim some viewers wasn't having it all even some of her own fans defected.

Edited March 9, 2015 by BlackMamba

[motorcitymom65]

I agree with you about Kyle and love that you mentioned Faye as her bestie.  IMHO that speaks volumes about Kyle.  I dislike Brandi too but at least she's not a phony.  She's loud, crude, inappropriate and often mean but she doesn't pretend to be anything other than what she is.  That's the one thing I can give Brandi  - what you see is what you get.  She gives off this "take it or leave it" attitude. Personally, I think that's a cover she uses to protect herself from getting hurt again.   I'd prefer to "leave it" because she's not the type of person I would associate with  but I still give her credit for not playing the martyr like Kyle does.

Yea, but that doesn't win any points with me. I use to read where folks would say the same thing back in the day about Joe Giudice. He is just himself all the time. Take him or leave him, but at least he is being honest and himself. I am good with that unless you are an asshole. If you are in fact an asshole, being yourself is a terrible thing to be.

[parisprincess]

Then I guess no one should expect one from her. Not exhaust themselves. I'm not saying Kim is right I'm just saying it's ridiculous to keep banging heads against brick walls. Definition of insanity. Doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different result. Just saying.

 

Oh, I agree with you, Sincerely Yours.  That's why I think they should all just back away and leave her alone like she has asked them to.  None of them, including Kyle, can "fix" her.  As hard as it is to watch someone spiral out of control, if that's what needs to happen for Kim to commit to getting well, then so be it. 

[Sincerely Yours]

Or, Lipsa provoked it by ONCE AGAIN bringing up Kim's sobriety, something Kim has asked her several times to stop doing, including less than 24 hours before this happened, on the plane trip over.

 

This time, Kim reacted by bringing up something Lipsa obviously didn't want brought up, and Lipsa attacked, physically, TWICE.

I don't get the semantics. It's clear as day to me. It was addressed on the plane. Kim already spoke on it and that confrontation wasn't the most pleasant. Fast forward to the dinner and Lisa brings it up again. Just because she was slick enough (well not slick in my book but apparently hiding it behind a tragic story about losing a sister must excuse Lisa bringing it up again) and found a way to again speak to Kim about her sobriety. Just because it was in the form of an "apology" or "heartfelt explanation" (gag) she was still going against Kim's wishes to speak to her about it. Lisa was tying her situation directly to Kim so it's not about not being able to talk about substance abuse around Kim (although I think its still in bad taste but that's just me) it's the fact that Lisa R tied it and used it as a Segway into talking about how she feels about Kim's issues.  So I don't see how Kim was wrong to take offense. I don't see why Kim wasn't allowed to react to the continued disregard. I like to talk about the issue at hand not whether Kim deserves it because she never apologizes, she points her finger at people, her dog bites the mailman. I'm talking about a woman reacting to the fact that the woman speaking to her seems to be completely incapable of understanding how volatile the subject matter is and can become especially after having a not so cute interaction about it not 24 hours before. SMH! 

 

Kim doesn't deserve that sort of blatant disregard on a whim just because she's not the most likeable. No one is calling it what it is. It's a back and forth battle of wills with Kim being the more justified in my book because addiction or no addiction who keeps inviting confrontations during rather amicable and comfortable settings? All in the name of getting something out of someone else in order to ease this need of.... what exactly? Who hasn't experienced a draining situation that just doesn't get resolved and the next best thing is to just let it go or remove/distance yourself?  "Working" with someone doesn't mean you can't figure out how to be amicable and share the same air without continuing to bring up whatever conflict there is. It's not enabling if you just decide that you've done all you can and it's time to leave the issue alone until you decide you have a GENUINELY invested interest in it to maybe try again in a more trustworthy way. NOT the way Lisa has handled it. I really don't understand why Kim isn't justified in being pushed to the brink. I mean how many different ways can you tell someone to lay off?

 

I would get it if Lisa R brought it up after Poker night and then Kim's was inebriated for that event as well and it created a scene and then Kim being inebriated again caused issues at the scavenger hunt as well as spoiling for a drunken fight at that dinner but she wasn't and she didn't do any of those things because of some inebriated state.  Using Kim's past and adding that to Poker night, to me isn't the same as treating and addressing it like its CURRENT ongoing relapsed behavior. I really can't understand why these women can't get this. Drives me nuts honestly. 

 

BTW, I'm in agreement with your post.

Edited March 9, 2015 by Sincerely Yours

[zoeysmom]

I agree with you about Kyle and love that you mentioned Faye as her bestie.  IMHO that speaks volumes about Kyle.  I dislike Brandi too but at least she's not a phony.  She's loud, crude, inappropriate and often mean but she doesn't pretend to be anything other than what she is.  That's the one thing I can give Brandi  - what you see is what you get.  She gives off this "take it or leave it" attitude. Personally, I think that's a cover she uses to protect herself from getting hurt again.   I'd prefer to "leave it" because she's not the type of person I would associate with  but I still give her credit for not playing the martyr like Kyle does.

I find people like Brandi to be the phoniest and meanest of them all.  Now she is making age jokes, calling Lisav a prostitute for marrying someone 25 years older (Ken and David are both 16 years older than their wives), I think Brandi more than anything wants to be accepted and because she has no discernible talent she tries way too hard to be the outrageous one.  I think Brandi has used martyrdom to get her very far the past several years since Eddie's exit as her husband.  First she was amartyr on the show becaue everyone made comments about her snatch duster and high heels, then it was Kim didn't want her on her team on Game Night, and then poor Brandi couldn't get away (in spite of the fact she had a walking cast) because Kim hid her crutches.

 

There was a reason when Brandi went off the rails on the street in Amsterdam everyone eventually just left her to her own devices.  And we saw poor Brandi separated from the herd walking down the street bewildered that no one even cared enough to turn around and see where she was.

[racked]

Bravo could not fire her as long as she was a recovered alcoholic because that is a disability.  Maybe this was an additional reason she was upset with having Lisar saying she's an addict. 

 

Also this is what could have prompted Brandi to do a 21-day cleanse to prove to the other ladies and Bravo that she is not an alcoholic.

 

The ADA is a little more complicated than that, but I'm not sure what reasonable accommodation Kim could have requested of Bravo.  And Bravo could fire her even though she is an alcoholic. If Bravo determined that her current alcohol use interfered with her performing her job, they could indeed fire her. Drug addicts are also not protected under the ADA. 

[AnnA]

I find people like Brandi to be the phoniest and meanest of them all.  

 

 

Yes, she is mean but I don't see her being as phony as much as you do but she does make outrageous and inappropriate comments all the time.

[talula]

I don't get the semantics. It's clear as day to me. It was addressed on the plane. Kim already spoke on it and that confrontation wasn't the most pleasant. Fast forward to the dinner and Lisa brings it up again. Just because she was slick enough (well not slick in my book but apparently hiding it behind a tragic story about losing a sister must excuse Lisa bringing it up again) and found a way to again speak to Kim about her sobriety. Just because it was in the form of an "apology" or "heartfelt explanation" (gag) she was still going against Kim's wishes to speak to her about it. Lisa was tying her situation directly to Kim so it's not about not being able to talk about substance abuse around Kim (although I think its still in bad taste but that's just me) it's the fact that Lisa R tied it and used it as a Segway into talking about how she feels about Kim's issues.  So I don't see how Kim was wrong to take offense. I don't see why Kim wasn't allowed to react to the continued disregard. I like to talk about the issue at hand not whether Kim deserves it because she never apologizes, she points her finger at people, her dog bites the mailman. I'm talking about a woman reacting to the fact that the woman speaking to her seems to be completely incapable of understanding how volatile the subject matter is and can become especially after having a not so cute interaction about it not 24 hours before. SMH! 

 

Kim doesn't deserve that sort of blatant disregard on a whim just because she's not the most likeable. No one is calling it what it is. It's a back and forth battle of wills with Kim being the more justified in my book because addiction or no addiction who keeps inviting confrontations during rather amicable and comfortable settings? All in the name of getting something out of someone else in order to ease this need of.... what exactly? Who hasn't experienced a draining situation that just doesn't get resolved and the next best thing is to just let it go or remove/distance yourself?  "Working" with someone doesn't mean you can't figure out how to be amicable and share the same air without continuing to bring up whatever conflict there is. It's not enabling if you just decide that you've done all you can and it's time to leave the issue alone until you decide you have a GENUINELY invested interest in it to maybe try again in a more trustworthy way. NOT the way Lisa has handled it. I really don't understand why Kim isn't justified in being pushed to the brink. I mean how many different ways can you tell someone to lay off?

 

I would get it if Lisa R brought it up after Poker night and then Kim's was inebriated for that event as well and it created a scene and then Kim being inebriated again caused issues at the scavenger hunt as well as spoiling for a drunken fight at that dinner but she wasn't and she didn't do any of those things because of some inebriated state.  Using Kim's past and adding that to Poker night, to me isn't the same as treating and addressing it like its CURRENT ongoing relapsed behavior. I really can't understand why these women can't get this. Drives me nuts honestly.

ITA with your post. Just because Kim may not be likable to her co-workers does not give Lisar the right to ignore her message to stop talking about her sobriety. Maybe it's Lisar who has a disability...loss of hearing...the woman needs hearing aids badly. Maybe LisaR can do a commercial for hearing aides she's been practicing most of the season for what it's like to be deaf, LOL.

[Sincerely Yours]

An apology for acting like such a twit in the limo and at Poker Night.  The rest is optional but Kim does need to apologize for her behavior.  Being stoned may be the reason (though it seems Kim is just meaner than all get out) but she still has to apologize or make amends.

Wow, so the absence of an apology justifies all the crazy that has ensued and Kim's to blame for it all? Because women can't just let bygones be bygones... or better yet, addicts be addicts? I mean yeah I'd be aggravated if I'm tripping over a drunken hot mess while I'm trying to get my LipsUp... ummm I mean closeup but that is NOT what was happening this season. The lack of an apology for Poker night, I feel is the only legitimate gripe against Kim (aside from the behavior itself of course). After the that it was just a mash up of inappropriate behavior all around so everyone owed everyone else an apology for one thing or another and not just Kim to all the women. Also, really? All this jazz because Kim didn't apologize for Poker night? I've actually managed to live all of my 40 years quite nicely without getting many, many, many well deserved apologies. Just saying.

[talula]

The ADA is a little more complicated than that, but I'm not sure what reasonable accommodation Kim could have requested of Bravo.  And Bravo could fire her even though she is an alcoholic. If Bravo determined that her current alcohol use interfered with her performing her job, they could indeed fire her. Drug addicts are also not protected under the ADA.

It was mentioned she's a contract employee, not covered under the ADA requirements by some posters further up.

[AnnA]

Bravo could not fire her as long as she was a recovered alcoholic because that is a disability.  Maybe this was an additional reason she was upset with having Lisar saying she's an addict. 

 

I'm sure the Bravo legal team has an "out" in any of the HW's contracts.  I thought the contracts were renewable each year anyway.  That would mean that Bravo simply doesn't have to renew Kim's contract.  Aside from that, California is an "at will" employment state anyway which means an employer does not have to give a reason for firing someone.  

 

California At Will Employment 

[ryebread]

There was a reason when Brandi went off the rails on the street in Amsterdam everyone eventually just left her to her own devices.  And we saw poor Brandi separated from the herd walking down the street bewildered that no one even cared enough to turn around and see where she was.

 

I hate to say it, ZM, but imo that's Bravo's subtle method of beginning to turn the tides back in Brandi's favor.  I'm seeing shades of it here, there and everywhere.  I could be totally wrong but it's something I sense, like the faintest whiff of mold on cheese.  I think it's starting.  Lock your doors. Hide your young sons.

[Sincerely Yours]

I think if Kim said I accepted your apology and kindness but now it is time to put it to rest as you are making me uncomfortable with your repeated efforts to continue the discussion.  STFU, Beast, I hate your face and hair, and the attacks on Kyle and Eileen were not a way to put it to rest.

So because she didn't wrap the request up in a nice little bow AFTER she's made the request before it's to be disregarded? That's the part that's wrong to me.

[talula]

I'm sure the Bravo legal team has an "out" in any of the HW's contracts. I thought the contracts were renewable each year anyway. That would mean that Bravo simply doesn't have to renew Kim's contract. Aside from that, California is an "at will" employment state anyway which means an employer does not have to give a reason for firing someone.

California At Will Employment

Even under the California At Will Employment law, If your under a contract you may have a problem firing a person with a Disability (mental and physical). If the contract is up/finished then your no longer under contract and just not picked up the following year. Edited March 9, 2015 by RealityTVSmack1

[AnnA]

Even under the California At Will Employment law, If your under a contract you may have a problem firing a person with a Disability (mental and physical). If the contract is up/finished then your no longer under contract and just not picked up the following year.

 

It doesn't matter since their contracts are renewable annually, so that's not a problem.  

 

And Kim has not claimed any disability - in fact, she has vehemently denied it.  

[Trooper York]

I wish there was an excuse Auto-mat like the one the girls went to in Amsterdam so Kim could find a nice tasty explanation for her nasty indefensible behavior. 

 

 

The turkey leg would be the excuse for Kingsley chomping on her nieces hand.

[motorcitymom65]

Even under the California At Will Employment law, If your under a contract you may have a problem firing a person with a Disability (mental and physical). If the contract is up/finished then your no longer under contract and just not picked up the following year.

And that's the thing really. They can just not renew her contract for whatever reason they decide. Maybe she gets pregnant (I know, I know, but stick with me here), joins some zany religion that requires her to do un-Bravo like things, or just gets really fat. Most folks are protected if they get pregnant, have religious affiliations, or just get fat or become old and/or ugly. In general, you cannot fire someone just for these things. In Kim's case they can just say they want to take the show in a different direction.

[motorcitymom65]

I hate to say it, ZM, but imo that's Bravo's subtle method of beginning to turn the tides back in Brandi's favor.  I'm seeing shades of it here, there and everywhere.  I could be totally wrong but it's something I sense, like the faintest whiff of mold on cheese.  I think it's starting.  Lock your doors. Hide your young sons.

Oh, I completely agree with this. It won't be this season for the most part because we are going to deal with her slapping Lisa for the rest of the season, and then the reunion where they are going to rip her a new asshole.

But next year? She will start a bit of a redemption. I am starting to sense that as well. This always ends up being the case when it appears that someone is being isolated. Even if they are horrid and the isolation is deserved, sympathy begins to slowly seep in. The problem will be if no one wants to film with her. I think that most of these women really do hate her to her core, and keeping her off camera will be their plan next hear. They will pull an Alexis on her and no matter how much she might change or the audience sympathizes with her, she can't be saved if the others won't interact with her.

[AnnA]

 In Kim's case they can just say they want to take the show in a different direction.

 

Yes! Please!  From your keyboard to Bravo's ears!

 

 They will pull an Alexis on her and no matter how much she might change or the audience sympathizes with her, she can't be saved if the others won't interact with her.

 

If Bravo wants it that way, wouldn't they have to interact with her?

[tulip555]

An alcoholic is a person with a disability and is protected by the ADA if he or she is qualified to perform the essential functions of the job. An employer may be required to provide an accommodation to an alcoholic.
 
I hope Kim hires a disability lawyer.

Very interesting

[talula]

It doesn't matter since their contracts are renewable annually, so that's not a problem.  

 

And Kim has not claimed any disability - in fact, she has vehemently denied it.  

So we agree.  Only a sober alcoholic or drug addict can claim disability. If you fall off the wagon your no longer disabled.

[AnnA]

So we agree.  Only a sober alcoholic or drug addict can claim disability. If you fall off the wagon your no longer disabled.

 

Huh?

[WireWrap]

Yes, she is mean but I don't see her being as phony as much as you do but she does make outrageous and inappropriate comments all the time.

She is a proven liar which makes her "phony" IMO.

 

Wow, so the absence of an apology justifies all the crazy that has ensued and Kim's to blame for it all? Because women can't just let bygones be bygones... or better yet, addicts be addicts? I mean yeah I'd be aggravated if I'm tripping over a drunken hot mess while I'm trying to get my LipsUp... ummm I mean closeup but that is NOT what was happening this season. The lack of an apology for Poker night, I feel is the only legitimate gripe against Kim (aside from the behavior itself of course). After the that it was just a mash up of inappropriate behavior all around so everyone owed everyone else an apology for one thing or another and not just Kim to all the women. Also, really? All this jazz because Kim didn't apologize for Poker night? I've actually managed to live all of my 40 years quite nicely without getting many, many, many well deserved apologies. Just saying.

An apology shows that someone recognizes they have done something wrong, Kim does not acknowledge she did anything wrong to anyone for anything which makes others more concerned with her state of mind/drug use even more. And things were calming down a bit after poker night UNTIL Brandi filled LisaR's head with thoughts of Kim killing herself either on purpose or by accidental OD. 

[breezy424]

I agree with you about Kyle and love that you mentioned Faye as her bestie.  IMHO that speaks volumes about Kyle.  I dislike Brandi too but at least she's not a phony.  She's loud, crude, inappropriate and often mean but she doesn't pretend to be anything other than what she is.  That's the one thing I can give Brandi  - what you see is what you get.  She gives off this "take it or leave it" attitude. Personally, I think that's a cover she uses to protect herself from getting hurt again.   I'd prefer to "leave it" because she's not the type of person I would associate with  but I still give her credit for not playing the martyr like Kyle does.

But aren't you saying that she is a phoney?  She uses the 'take it or leave it' attitude as a cover to protect herself from getting hurt again.

[talula]

Huh?

We both said the same thing with a yearly contract Bravo just doesn't hire her next year.  Her employment is up this season and dies with her contract ending.

 

After reading the disabilities act taking the pill may have rendered her off the wagon.  Only a ex-alcoholic or ex-drug addict is considered disabled.

[eurekagirl mOo]

Well I'm on disability and an addiction to alcohol or drugs was NOT in  my papers as to what constitutes a disability! Also disability is VERY hard to get. It took me 2 years and I was "fast tracked". Also you CAN work on disability. I got a "cap" as to how much I can earn each month. And I still HAVE to work as my disability doesn't even cover all my rent!

I hate Brandi with a passion and I hope she doesn't get the redemption arc. Geesh they got rid of the horror show that was Aviva! Bye Brandi...Have fun being a washed up, never was, has been.

[janie2002]

One thing that hasnt been mentioned, and in the grand scheme of the episode was looked over easily. 

Brandi saying Lisa being married to old man and getting diamonds is the same as prostitution.

WTF she is so ugly an I dont mean her outside although that is pretty ugly to me. Her legs are chicken gawky  and normally bruised up, she has no butt, and horrible implants, swollen cheeks, and has lost alot of her hair. ugh.

 

Anyways I hope that remark comes up at the reunion so Lisa could say no that is marriage, if anyone is close to being a prostitute it'd be Brandi by her own admission. Bathroom sex, hood of a car sex random one night stands with movie stars.

Edited March 9, 2015 by janie2002

[AnnA]

She is a proven liar which makes her "phony" IMO.

 

 

 

That's true.  I just don't see Brandi pretending to a socialite as some of the HW's do.

[Avaleigh]

Wow, so the absence of an apology justifies all the crazy that has ensued and Kim's to blame for it all? Because women can't just let bygones be bygones... or better yet, addicts be addicts? I mean yeah I'd be aggravated if I'm tripping over a drunken hot mess while I'm trying to get my LipsUp... ummm I mean closeup but that is NOT what was happening this season. The lack of an apology for Poker night, I feel is the only legitimate gripe against Kim (aside from the behavior itself of course). After the that it was just a mash up of inappropriate behavior all around so everyone owed everyone else an apology for one thing or another and not just Kim to all the women. Also, really? All this jazz because Kim didn't apologize for Poker night? I've actually managed to live all of my 40 years quite nicely without getting many, many, many well deserved apologies. Just saying.

The reason it's a big deal about Kim failing to *ever* apologize for her behavior is because it indicates that she thinks that her behavior was acceptable. Kim was wrong and she frequently shows that she doesn't give a shit about how her actions can have a negative impact on others. 

 

Kim is the one who couldn't let bygones be bygones at that dinner table. Also, Kim is the one who spoke directly about her sobriety and at length. Kim is the one who brought up the pill again. 

 

I know this has been posted by multiple people at this point but I want to say again that this isn't just about a lack of an apology for Poker Night. It's about Kim's behavior and attitude from every season.  

 

This isn't only about the lack of apology for Poker Night. It's about the lack of apologies in general. 

 

This isn't only about Kim taking "one pain pill" that wasn't prescribed to her. It's about Kim again having lies and excuses for her relapse and unacceptable behavior. 

 

Kim is supposed to have sympathy and respect from LisaR with regard to her drug addict medical/substance abuse issues but it's totally okay in Kim's world for Kim to taunt LisaR about a medical issue like anorexia.

 

This is about Kim's multiple instances of hypocrisy. Kim's children and family are off limits but it's a totally different story for Lisa Rinna's children and family. Kim takes it to an extra level when she involves HH considering that Harry had done nothing to her. It think it's completely ridiculous to blame Lisa for Kim deciding to fling mud at Harry who was in no way involved. Lisa sensed that Kim had problems but she was still shocked and unprepared for how horrible Kim can be.

[AnnA]

But aren't you saying that she is a phoney?  She uses the 'take it or leave it' attitude as a cover to protect herself from getting hurt again.

 

I hadn't thought of it that way but you're right.  Pretending she doesn't care what people say about her is disingenuous.  She obviously does care but I just don't think she does it the way the other HW's do, i.e., to pretending to be better, more sincere, wealthier, happier, etc.  than they actually are.  

Edited March 9, 2015 by AnnA

[talula]

Well I'm on disability and an addiction to alcohol or drugs was NOT in  my papers as to what constitutes a disability! Also disability is VERY hard to get. It took me 2 years and I was "fast tracked". Also you CAN work on disability. I got a "cap" as to how much I can earn each month. And I still HAVE to work as my disability doesn't even cover all my rent!

I hate Brandi with a passion and I hope she doesn't get the redemption arc. Geesh they got rid of the horror show that was Aviva! Bye Brandi...Have fun being a washed up, never was, has been.

We were not talking about social security disability. 

[film noire]

(Thankfully, I now know outing is COOL when your co worker is disingenuous!! Thanks Lisar and Eileen fans!!!)

 

In this situation, I’m a fan of addicts getting treatment -- or getting off television -- not a fan of any one housewife.

 

Privacy is not something you sign away just because you agree to be on TV 20 mins. a week.

 

 

You sign away a huge part of it when you participate in reality tv (and in scripted tv, in the form of a morals

clause). Add in Kim herself bringing it up & all bets are off.  I think the only 'privacy' protection these

women have is a mutually-assured-destruction mentality (which Kim seems to have destroyed, based

on the other housewives gasping, calling Kim disgusting, etc)

 

Faye as bestie. Big fat character question mark for me. 

 

Me too – just no way to see that as anything but corrupt beyond measure, imo.

[zoeysmom]

I hate to say it, ZM, but imo that's Bravo's subtle method of beginning to turn the tides back in Brandi's favor.  I'm seeing shades of it here, there and everywhere.  I could be totally wrong but it's something I sense, like the faintest whiff of mold on cheese.  I think it's starting.  Lock your doors. Hide your young sons.

The tides are not coming back Brandi's way this season.  She has been too duplicitous and just ignorant.  Wine throwing and slapping Lisav gets you excommunicated.

 

Sometime the editors and producers can take it too far.  Eileen's comments were perfect to accompany Brandi's poorly acted out behavior.  This is why Brandi keeps falling flat-her sense of humor is off as is her sense of timing.  Brandi is in a battle this year everyone else has acting experience.  They can very easily make her look foolish.  Brandi may not get the big finish this season she wanted.

 

I will be locking my doors to keep her away from my son.

[zoeysmom]

So because she didn't wrap the request up in a nice little bow AFTER she's made the request before it's to be disregarded? That's the part that's wrong to me.

If you feel uncomfortable then you should deescalate the discussion.  Kim wanted to win and let the world know she was sober and by doing so escalated the discussion.  Lisar never used the word sober only Kim and Yolanda.  BTW I don't think telling someone they are making you feel uncomfortable is a nice little bow-I think it is a slight growl.  For this show maybe she should have said . . . you are starting to piss me off- more of a stationary bark. 

[Trooper York]

Kim doesn't growl before she bites. She just bites.

Where did you think Kingsley learned it?