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Spoiler Discussion: The apple was poisoned?!

regularlyleaded

By regularlyleaded
in Once Upon A Time

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Shanna Marie

Shanna Marie

1 hour ago, Souris said:

TBH, I don't think ABC cares enough about Once anymore to rein in A&E that much. I mean, they should care enough to worry about the effect on merchandising and residuals, but they have SO much else to worry about on their schedule, I'm not sure how much time they can or care to devote to Once.

It's not necessarily that they'd be devoting extra time to it. Series always get some kind of notes from the network. It may be from a lower-level executive and not a bigshot. I doubt they'd have got a renewal in the first place if the reboot plan involved Hook killing Emma to cast a curse, and if it showed up in a script, that's the kind of thing that would get notes or might get shot up the food chain to an executive who had the clout to call a halt.

So, while Hook casting the Dark Curse with Emma sacrificing herself for some good cause sounds like the kind of thing A&E might write, I don't think it's the kind of thing that will make it to air. My guess on Emma's participation is that she and Hook have been living happily cursed and unaware of it, but she'll either be very pregnant or have a young child, so when Henry shows up needing help, she sends Hook off to help. That preserves the happy ending while writing her off the show. Hook can have offscreen shellphone calls with her.

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Camera One
Camera One

When everyone realized Rumple and Regina weren't coming back, they had a big celebration and put on a cloaking spell so they can never be found or contacted ever again.

Curio
Curio

At least someone is freaking out over Emma's darkness. Keep giving a shit, Hook! You're pretty much the only one who does...

Serena
Serena

HER GRANDMA IS EMMA! Are they being serious with this?

Katherine

Katherine

2 hours ago, Shanna Marie said:

It's not necessarily that they'd be devoting extra time to it. Series always get some kind of notes from the network. It may be from a lower-level executive and not a bigshot. I doubt they'd have got a renewal in the first place if the reboot plan involved Hook killing Emma to cast a curse, and if it showed up in a script, that's the kind of thing that would get notes or might get shot up the food chain to an executive who had the clout to call a halt.

So, while Hook casting the Dark Curse with Emma sacrificing herself for some good cause sounds like the kind of thing A&E might write, I don't think it's the kind of thing that will make it to air. My guess on Emma's participation is that she and Hook have been living happily cursed and unaware of it, but she'll either be very pregnant or have a young child, so when Henry shows up needing help, she sends Hook off to help. That preserves the happy ending while writing her off the show. Hook can have offscreen shellphone calls with her.

I agree that this is more likely than Emma's death. But if this is what they're planning, I think they're making a big mistake by trying to keep it under wraps. I get that Adam and Eddy have an over the top aversion to spoilers--they seem to think their ideas are so clever that they must be protected at all costs--but them constantly dodging questions about whether Emma's happy ending will be destroyed does nothing but annoy or worry the fans they're counting on to tune in. They don't even have to outright say that Emma isn't dead (although I really don't think that's that big of a spoiler), but they could maybe try to be a little more optimistic in their responses instead of focusing all of their energy on trying so desperately to avoid spoiling their shocking! twists!

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Anna35

Anna35

6 hours ago, Shanna Marie said:

It's not necessarily that they'd be devoting extra time to it. Series always get some kind of notes from the network. It may be from a lower-level executive and not a bigshot. I doubt they'd have got a renewal in the first place if the reboot plan involved Hook killing Emma to cast a curse, and if it showed up in a script, that's the kind of thing that would get notes or might get shot up the food chain to an executive who had the clout to call a halt.

So, while Hook casting the Dark Curse with Emma sacrificing herself for some good cause sounds like the kind of thing A&E might write, I don't think it's the kind of thing that will make it to air. My guess on Emma's participation is that she and Hook have been living happily cursed and unaware of it, but she'll either be very pregnant or have a young child, so when Henry shows up needing help, she sends Hook off to help. That preserves the happy ending while writing her off the show. Hook can have offscreen shellphone calls with her.

So Killian just abandons Emma while she is pregnant?

People holding out hope that Emma will be too distracted playing mommy to help Henry are being naive. The show hasn't given us CS moments for the entire season 6. I doubt they're just going to start now.

It's a curse. That is why Emma isn't on the new show. I'd bet money on it.

Shanna Marie

Shanna Marie

1 hour ago, Anna35 said:

So Killian just abandons Emma while she is pregnant?

Maybe, if their son (and granddaughter) needed help -- and I do think that even before they got married, Hook thought of Henry as his son. Even before he got together with Emma, he'd have done just about anything for Henry because he's Milah's grandson, and that's only intensified. If Emma were physically incapable of going adventuring, she'd want Killian to help Henry. Whether it's pregnant or with a new baby, it would be a more sensible division of parenting labor than we saw with the Charmings, where they were either hauling around or entirely abandoning the infant. That would be the quickest and easiest way to write Emma out without really messing things up so much that they piss off the fans. Show Emma around just enough to establish their situation and that the happy beginning has continued, then have Hook off on adventures with the suggestion that they're staying in touch offscreen, and there can even be the hint of an offscreen reunion, like they return to town and we see Hook run up the front porch steps and enter the house.

If that video is of Jared and meant to show Henry leaving town, it fits with the scenario I came up with after the finale: Teen Henry leaves town for whatever reason, and while he's out of town, another curse hits, freezing the town in time and shutting it off from the world, so that he can't get back into the town, can't even find it. This is what causes him to become bitter and jaded. Maybe he uses his Author powers to do some realm jumping in an effort to get back to his family -- if he can't get into Storybrooke via regular roads, maybe he can portal in from another realm. He has adventures, meets Lucy's mother, has Lucy, maybe that scene at the beginning of the finale happens, where he sends Lucy away, then another curse sends him back to our world with a memory wipe.

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Anna35

Anna35

The latter scenario happening in the show but at this point, CS children is wishful thinking to me and if it did happen I don't expect CS to be around to raise them. The show has made it clear that CS isn't important to them after the fifth season.  I fully expect Jen's last scene to be where she says goodbye to Jared (because like last season final "parallels" before plot) and if were lucky Hook will be shown to be at least mildly concerned with reuniting with Emma after the curse.                        

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KAOS Agent

KAOS Agent

I don't care whether canon tries to make this a new curse, kills off Emma and destroys everyone's happy ending. I'm with Henry. It's not a curse. It's a wish realm/waking nightmare/badly written AU by a new author. When it ends, no one's original ending is messed with except Henry's and I don't care about Henry.

Also, finally a spoiler I wish we could have had a couple of seasons ago. Henry leaving town. Of course, now we get an entire season about what happened to him when he left instead of the continuing adventures of those I actually care about that he left behind. It's like the writers know what I want and give it to me, but then ruin it by taking the worst possible storytelling route from that point.

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Guest

Guest

17 hours ago, superloislane said:

Honestly, I'm the most pessimistic person about season 7 and I have no intention of watching any episode without Emma in it but this idea is blowing my mind with how pessimistic it is! too depressing.

Maybe they have a way around that.  Maybe the curse  transforms Emma in addition to everything else.  She could be in Hook's room the whole season without him even knowing. 

After all, every pirate needs a parrot. 

They can even do a shocking twist where we think the parrot is Iago and it turns out to be Emma.  Then domestic scenes galore.  Hook feeding Emma from his hand.  Pecks and kisses. Hook carrying Emma around all the time.  Emma talking to Hook trying to get him to realize by only repeating certain phrases.

maryle

maryle

(edited)

I remembered reading about how everyone was tired of the show being all about shipping!

So, I believe there a lots of way to use Killian and Rumple  in a meaningful without give them temporary love interest. They have both connection to Henry they can explore at least for this year. After, who know if the show will even be on air!

Adding, I find the new Henry as hot as Killian and I can totally see myself rooting for his romance with Lucy's mother with the right condition are there.

And, the epic love will be cover by Henry and Lucy and Regina who could possibly meet someone later on.

Edited by maryle
scarynikki12

scarynikki12

Even though I am convinced Emma's a goner, I would say a recast is second on my list of possibilities. Then the premiere can end with the reveal and episode 2 (assuming spec is correct about Morrison's shooting schedule) can show the face change. 

Again, I think she's getting killed off but this would be right up the show's alley. 

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Guest

Guest

2 hours ago, scarynikki12 said:

Even though I am convinced Emma's a goner, I would say a recast is second on my list of possibilities. Then the premiere can end with the reveal and episode 2 (assuming spec is correct about Morrison's shooting schedule) can show the face change. 

Again, I think she's getting killed off but this would be right up the show's alley. 

It would also address my other question.  If they were really surprised they couldn't get JMo to sign up for another season (which I kind of doubt) are A&E capable of adapting their original idea to her absence.  They never did a good job of dealing with being forced to let Charming live given that he practically couldn't have a scene until the maternity leave.

Shanna Marie

Shanna Marie

10 minutes ago, ParadoxLost said:

If they were really surprised they couldn't get JMo to sign up for another season (which I kind of doubt) are A&E capable of adapting their original idea to her absence. 

That's why I lean toward the "you go help Henry while I deal with the baby" idea -- the original plan may have been both Emma and Hook going off with Henry to help, and this just gives a reason for it to be only Hook without a lot of changing the basic outline of the story. Killing Emma would require changing the story significantly.

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KingOfHearts

KingOfHearts

(edited)
Quote

are A&E capable of adapting their original idea to her absence.

A&E can't even adapt to their original ideas, so I'd say no.

Quote

That's why I lean toward the "you go help Henry while I deal with the baby" idea -- the original plan may have been both Emma and Hook going off with Henry to help, and this just gives a reason for it to be only Hook without a lot of changing the basic outline of the story. Killing Emma would require changing the story significantly.

If the show doesn't last a full 22 episodes, I could buy that.

Edited by KingOfHearts
Rumsy4

Rumsy4

Why is noone talking about a new love-interest for Rumple? Belle probably died, and Rumple is the sad single-father trying to raise his son (yet again). Unless Golden Queen is revived again (shudder), both Rumple and Regina might well be getting new LIs. Maybe Dragon Queen will finally happen (naaah).

Somehow I can see the geniuses giving Cursed!Killian a love-interest. but once he gets his memories back, he'll be back to "Finding Emma" mode. 

I'm not worried about Emma dying simply because the Charmings are off the Show as well (along with Zelena and Belle). Some of these characters could be written-off as dead, but not all, especially not Emma. 

The "Curse" will be used to explain their absense. The writers will try to get as many of the missing members as possible for the reunion. Whomevee they can't get, that character will either be shown with a distance-shot using a proxy or their absence explained away (they went to Arendelle. etc.). 

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Anna35

Anna35

7 hours ago, Shanna Marie said:

That's why I lean toward the "you go help Henry while I deal with the baby" idea -- the original plan may have been both Emma and Hook going off with Henry to help, and this just gives a reason for it to be only Hook without a lot of changing the basic outline of the story. Killing Emma would require changing the story significantly.

What makes you think there would be a baby? It could just be "you go help Henry while I deal with Storybrooke because I'm the savior/sheriff whatever". 

Shanna Marie

Shanna Marie

6 hours ago, Anna35 said:

What makes you think there would be a baby? It could just be "you go help Henry while I deal with Storybrooke because I'm the savior/sheriff whatever". 

Because that's never stopped them before. Emma's always been the one to rush off, usually also with David, the co-sheriff, leaving Storybrooke without a sheriff or savior. Something in the status quo really should change to explain why Emma's not going along this time, when she always has before, especially if it means her husband and son are going. If anyone was going to run off to help Henry while the other person stayed behind, you'd think it would be Emma, the one with magical powers who's actually his mother, while Hook could handle sheriff duties. A baby is a quick and easy change to the status quo that's a logical next step after ending the previous season with a marriage, a nursing mother or very pregnant woman would explain why it has to be Hook and not Emma running off into danger, and it somewhat mollifies the fans in showing that, yes, Emma still has her happy ending and the writers haven't blown everything up, so it's safe to keep watching the show. If Jen had renewed her contract, the plan was for Emma to be part of the gang, and throwing in a baby is a minimal bit of writing to remove Emma without changing the scenario they planned.

12 hours ago, Rumsy4 said:

Why is noone talking about a new love-interest for Rumple? Belle probably died, and Rumple is the sad single-father trying to raise his son (yet again).

Because writing Belle off doesn't actually change anything about the way she's written? She's still there. She's just asleep in the back room or in a box, or something. Or ... we never see Belle or Gideon, and Rumple refuses to talk about them when he goes along with whatever thing they're doing to break the latest curse. Then, in a Shocking!Twist near the end of the season, we learn that Belle got fed up with his evil (again) and left him, taking Gideon with her, and getting magical help to go to some place where he couldn't reach her. Rumple was the one who cast the curse (not the Dark Curse, a totally different curse, more of a Pale Gray) in an attempt to get to her, but the curse backfired and trapped him in Storybrooke/sent him to an apartment building in Seattle along with everyone else, except for Henry, who was out of town at the time.

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maryle

maryle

I think the subject of worry depend of the faction of the Once fans to gravite towards. I know a lots of rumbelle are totally worry about Rumple storyline without Belle.

And, the subject are very similar than I see in the cs fandom but the division in the Once fandom make it hard to see the big picture!!

But, I do find it rather interesting that the big issue overall seems to be Emma! I really believe people didn't realized first how hard it will be for the show to go without her!

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KingOfHearts

KingOfHearts

(edited)

It's funny how all the major couples are either split up or gone completely. Snowing, Captain Swan, Rumpbelle, Outlaw Queen. This really is about romance and happy endings, isn't it?

But at least Henry gets to break up with Violet and fall in an epic love with another woman, right? Right? There really is such a thing as hope!

Edited by KingOfHearts
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Guest

Guest

(edited)
5 hours ago, maryle said:

I think the subject of worry depend of the faction of the Once fans to gravite towards. I know a lots of rumbelle are totally worry about Rumple storyline without Belle.

And, the subject are very similar than I see in the cs fandom but the division in the Once fandom make it hard to see the big picture!!

But, I do find it rather interesting that the big issue overall seems to be Emma! I really believe people didn't realized first how hard it will be for the show to go without her!

Now that you mention it, I think that Belle/Gideon may tilt the scales towards Storybrooke is "frozen" in time ala EF in the original curse and they can spend a lot of time not knowing they are cursed, then knowing they are cursed but knowing who they are supposed to be but nothing about those left behind in Storybrooke, and then dealing with a quest to get back to Storybrooke.

Its just too hard to come up with multiple explanations for all the departures and they can't kill off everyone.  Its too depressing.

The issue they are going to have is whether Henry's daughter will know all the background or not.  Then if she does whether they come up with "reasons"' not to tell anyone besides Henry.

Edited by ParadoxLost
PixiePaws1

PixiePaws1

(edited)

The pics of that stone troll holding a VW bug that looks like Emma's bug turned to stone..just made sick to my stomach. Then i wondered if it is a misdirect. Killian remembers who he is,  then he and Henry spend a goodly portion of 7a trying to turn Emma's bug back from rock only and when they finally do they find she isn't in it.

 

And apparently Killian's cursed cop persona is, Rogers 

https://mobile.twitter.com/katmtan/status/885735611633512448

Edited by PixiePaws1
Curio

Curio

I've been away from this forum for a bit, but leaked filming pics will always bring me back!

On the one hand, it's a nice change of pace that they're ditching the hook for Killian's cursed personality for a little while. (You know there'll be a big reveal scene later in the season where he remembers his old personality and triumphantly reattaches his hook.) On the other hand, while the uniform is pretty to look at, I was hoping the writers would choose a cursed career that's a little more original. Last we saw of Killian in the finale, he was a deputy riding alongside Emma fighting crime in Storybrooke. Basically, he has his same job now, but he's just relocated to a new city. This was a rare chance to roll the dice and shake up Killian's personality for a bit, but oh well.

Also, I'm really hoping this show doesn't devolve into a cop procedural with random fairy tale flashbacks. As terrible as the writing has gotten over the years, OUAT was at least unique in that it wasn't yet another cop or hospital procedural show. 

I can't even muster up any enthusiasm about the filming pics for the new cast members. I have zero emotional attachment to any of them at this point.

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Kktjones

Kktjones

My biggest fear is that Killian will end up as Rumple's lackey in this new scenario. I can't think of anything I would hate more than that. If these writers had any creativity they would flip that relationship around and give Killian the one-up on Rumple. I'm kinda meh about the latest spoilers. They could do some cool things with Jacinda (Lucy's mom) partnered with Killian and working against corruption (which would turn out to be the big bad) or something, but I don't see them going that route. I think the only thing that could make me interested in this season is if Killian has a child. Otherwise it's just too depressing to think about him cursed, working under Rumple without his true love. Oh well, sounds par for the course. 

On another note, it appears JMo will not be in this episode since it wraps Monday. Here's hoping they make the most of her appearance in 7x02...

Curio

Curio

2 hours ago, Kktjones said:

My biggest fear is that Killian will end up as Rumple's lackey in this new scenario. I can't think of anything I would hate more than that. If these writers had any creativity they would flip that relationship around and give Killian the one-up on Rumple.

If the rumor about Robert only sticking around one more year is true, and if A&E see this show limping around longer than Season 7, then Rumple having the upper hand over Killian for the majority of this season makes sense. At this point in the series, Killian has been firmly established as being a Good Guy™, so the writers will be banking on the audience rooting for him right away in this cursed Seattle world. He's also one of the few returning main characters, so Hook is probably going to be given the role of the protagonist who is constantly belittled by Rumple, but little by little each week, Killian will get small victories over Rumple, kind of like Emma and Regina in Season 1. So Rumple will probably start Season 7 having a lot of power, but his arc will slowly tear him down and reveal him to be a darker person, whereas Killian will start Season 7 as a lackey and will have the cards stacked against him, but he'll work his way up to having more power and will ultimately help Henry with breaking the curse.

2 hours ago, Kktjones said:

On another note, it appears JMo will not be in this episode since it wraps Monday. Here's hoping they make the most of her appearance in 7x02...

I'm going to be an optimist for once and guess that Emma isn't going to be killed off in Season 7, and 7x02 will show flashbacks to Emma and Killian in Storybrooke continuing their Happy Beginning while the current Seattle storyline shows Rogers trying to figure out what happened to his missing wife. Everyone will assume she's dead and will tell Rogers to "just give up looking for her, it's a dead end," but something keeps nagging at him that she's still out there. Cue Henry and Lucy and their crazy crackpot theory that Killian's missing wife is actually stuck in a fairy tale town in Maine that has disappeared off the map. That allows the writers to use Jen in 7x02 to set up Killian and Emma's life in Storybrooke before the new curse, and it also gives cursed Rogers a reason to stay single the entire season if he's on a mission to find his missing wife. The arc is completed when Killian and Emma reunite in the finale, and hopefully this show will FINALLY be over at the end of Season 7. If it somehow miraculously gets renewed for Sesaon 8, Killian can effectively be written off the show after he reunites with Emma and all the newbies can carry the show going forward.

They really need to get Jen back for the finale, otherwise this entire season will be a waste.

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orza

orza

4 minutes ago, oncebluethrone said:

If she was, then it would keep her relevant to the plot without her having to be in every episode. But it's a actual structure in Seattle so maybe not?

Yeah, the Fremont Troll is a well-known landmark and tourist attraction that's been around for ages. It's more likely it's just a shout-out and visual cue that the action takes place in the Fremont neighborhood of Seattle.

Shanna Marie

Shanna Marie

(edited)
13 minutes ago, daxx said:

The stone bug is part of the real structure.

However, the one they're using for filming isn't the real deal. It's a replica they built in Vancouver, so there's no telling what role it will play in the show. I can see how it would be irresistible to use that imagery if you're setting a fairy tale based show in Seattle and if one of the icons in your story is a Bug. They may be giving an "explanation" for the Seattle sculpture -- it's not really a sculpture! It's a real troll that was turned to stone by a curse, just as it was clutching a certain yellow Bug!

ETA: It may just be lighting and camera angle, etc., but it seems like the Bug is more detailed and distinctively a Bug in the filming replica than in the real deal, where it seems less distinct.

Edited by Shanna Marie
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RhyleeS

RhyleeS

Quote
1 hour ago, Shanna Marie said:

ETA: It may just be lighting and camera angle, etc., but it seems like the Bug is more detailed and distinctively a Bug in the filming replica than in the real deal, where it seems less distinct.

 

This is my first post so Hi everyone.    Another thing to note. Adam and Eddy are huge Star Wars fans.  Hans Solo was frozen in stone (carbonite) in the Empire Strikes Back.

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RhyleeS

RhyleeS

Quote
43 minutes ago, oncebluethrone said:

Do you think they're going a similar route with Emma?

 

With A and E, nothing would surprise me at this point.  Plus a lot of fans of the show probably don't know about the Fremont Troll.  But they do know Emma drove a VW Bug.  My personal opinion is if that Troll Statue is shown on the show, it's more than it just being a Seattle Landmark.

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oncebluethrone

oncebluethrone

5 minutes ago, RhyleeS said:

With A and E, nothing would surprise me at this point.  Plus a lot of fans of the show probably don't know about the Fremont Troll.  But they do know Emma drove a VW Bug.  My personal opinion is if that Troll Statue is shown on the show, it's more than it just being a Seattle Landmark.

That's sort of what I was thinking.

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Anna35

Anna35

1 hour ago, oncebluethrone said:

That's sort of what I was thinking.

I third this. Emma being literally frozen in stone is the perfect way to keep her out of the plot without permanently ruining her happy ending. Maybe the season villain did it so their wouldn't be a savior left to break the curse? 

My theory is that Henry leaves town at 18 like in the scene was saw with Jared and Lana. Henry travelled and eventually ended up in the Enchanted Forest where he met Lucy's mom and they had a child together. Complications broke them up (as mentioned in 6x21&6x22). As we saw, Henry fought the dark cloud thing and sent Lucy away. Henry was cursed to Seattle where he is made to be bitter and lonely. Lucy was cursed to Hyperion Heights with her mom and the rest of Storybrooke sans the Charmings, because if the caster didn't want them breaking the curse. Emma is stuck in the troll statue. The new book allowed Lucy to keep her memories and she went looking for Henry. 

Flashbacks will be Henry's and the new characters lives between when Henry left town to the scenes we saw in the season 6 finale.

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RhyleeS

RhyleeS

4 minutes ago, orza said:

Well, in Episode VII of Star Wars we learn that Han and Leia eventually split up and are estranged so no happily ever after for them.

This is also True.   Though I'm pretty sure they said this mostly back in 2014 before that episode of Star Wars was released.   I personally think at this point, not many CS fans would buy a divorce/separation.  That is why Emma's death is what so many were speculating. 

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