Spoiler Discussion: The apple was poisoned?!

[Souris]

Wait, so AUGUST gets a place but EMMA doesn't?

[kitticup]

Emma And August look very close to each other - too close for my taste. It almost seems like they are setting up a triangle and August has parental approval.

[YaddaYadda]

Emma And August look very close to each other - too close for my taste. It almost seems like they are setting up a triangle and August has parental approval.

Yeah, well Snowing have a history of wanting Emma with the people who fucked her over.  And seeing as they probably too fucked her over, it's not all that surprising.

 

No, there's no triangle coming.  I think Sunday's show might be the last one for August this season anyway.

[daxx]

At least one of those pictures of her with Eion is behind the scenes so it is the actors smiling and laughing. Not worried about August at all after the touching scene Sunday with Emma and Hook. She's finally enough for someone just the way she is, not cause she's the savior, because she's Emma, that's a huge deal for her.

[YaddaYadda]

Are people really worried about this?  Like for real?  I don't really understand the reasoning behind it.  I don't even think Snowing are approving or anything like that.  Sure, they could be worried that Hook might lead their already deep down evil daughter down a dark path and undo everything they have done (roll eyes, sigh, whatever), but I saw people talking about how Snowing smiled when Emma and August had their scene together.  She completely softened when Emma was talking to Hook about choosing to believe the best in him.  It's there, in the scene, her face changes and when she's talking to Regina, she tells her that Emma is starting to open her heart.  

 

I know it's this show, but seriously, there is still some sense of logic to it.

 

Regarding that picture Agnes Bruckner (Lily) posted yesterday in her EF costume, is it me or doesn't that look like a Black Knight costume?  I thought it up in my sleep because clearly this show has taken over my life (not in a good way).

[sharky]

Wait, so AUGUST gets a place but EMMA doesn't?

Emma is going to have her own place....on the Jolly Roger with Killian. Seriously, that stupid adorable ship better stay in Storybrooke now. I will accept nothing less.

 

And also, have we ever actually seen Marco's house? Could that maybe be the room belonging to Pinocchio/August?

[RadioGirl27]

Are people really worried about this?  Like for real?  I don't really understand the reasoning behind it. .

Yeah, after Hook's declaration and with the BTS pics from episode 20, no way there's going to be another triangle. But I get why some people is worried. With this show we all have learn to expect always the worst.

 

Thinking about August, I hope he goes back to being a kid, mainly for Marco. Yeah, he shouldn't have lie about the wardrobe, but after what he said to Regina, he is my hero, so I want him to get his kid back.

[KingOfHearts]

 

Thinking about August, I hope he goes back to being a kid, mainly for Marco. Yeah, he shouldn't have lie about the wardrobe, but after what he said to Regina, he is my hero, so I want him to get his kid back.

Since Mother Superior is slated to be in the next episode, this is probably what happens. I was never a big fan of August, but I'm really, really not a fan of tossing characters at the screen in quick succession. It just takes away the weight of their returns, if you ask me.

 

 

Emma is going to have her own place....on the Jolly Roger with Killian. Seriously, that stupid adorable ship better stay in Storybrooke now. I will accept nothing less.

There were filming spoilers for 4x16 showing  Emma meeting Killian at the docks with a hug. Don't know if it means anything.

 

http://captaincronut.tumblr.com/post/108716956143

 

 

I too thought it was the mansion, but why would they take him there?

Maybe they're searching for clues and August needed a rest? I don't know.

Edited March 25, 2015 by KingOfHearts

[RadioGirl27]

Script tease

[HoodlumSheep]

Ha, I love Cruella.

[KingOfHearts]

Script tease

 

That almost sounds like something the actors would make up on the spot. Because, darn it looks cold in some of those BTS shots!

[The Cake is a Pie]

Never change, Cruella.

[Emma]

I really want to keep Cruella. Like she should be in every scene. If she can't snark then just in the background throwing dirty looks at whoever she wants.

[Shanna Marie]

I really want to keep Cruella. Like she should be in every scene. If she can't snark then just in the background throwing dirty looks at whoever she wants.

At the rate this awful Author plot seems to be progressing, and with all the Zelena-as-Marian silliness to come, they should just put a silhouette of her on the bottom of the screen and have her providing episode commentary.

[YaddaYadda]

i'm really wondering about Cruella's backstory.

It seems like this second half is about family being everyone's happy ending.  I think more than anything, Ursula was reunited with her father.  Maleficent will be reunited with her daughter, so what about Cruella?  Does she also have a child out there somewhere?

[kili]

Maleficent will be reunited with her daughter, so what about Cruella?

 

She will be re-united with her dog - Pongo. 101 Dalmatians got it all wrong. Pongo was kidnapped from her and put into a forced breeding program. Roger and Anita were the evil ones who ran a puppy mill (seriously, how else do you get 99 puppies living under one roof?). Henry is the one to re-unite them (that is why he was chasing Pongo into the shrubbery).

 

Losing her dog was what drove her to drink. All of her coats are faux fur. Drum-roll twist....Anita and Roger are Gepetto's parents and they totally deserved to be turned into puppets (stop feeling sorry for those two!). That will totally justify what Team Evil did to Gepetto/August/Pinocchio this season (and why Archie can say goodbye to his dog). Pongo is magical and can live forever.

 

Double Twist: Pongo is Cruella's husband who was transformed into dog by Olga - Snow's Evil Grandmother.  Olgo accidently told The Black Fairy (disguised as an elderly goat herder) that Cruella's Husband's (Larry was his name) secret - he had been smoking behind the woodshed. Black Fairy turned Larry into Pongo and it is all the fault of the White family. Cruella wears black-and-white everything so that she never forgets the two that caused her pain - Olga White and Black Fairy.

Edited March 25, 2015 by kili

[FurryFury]

Somebody must write a parody fanfic using this plot. I will not settle for anything less.

[LizaD]

 

Somebody must write a parody fanfic using this plot. I will not settle for anything less.

 

Ask and you shall receive. Be sure to tune in Sundays on ABC for 4x18! Except it won't be a parody, it'll be dripping with honesty and sincerity. Seriously you know there's at least a 50% chance that very plot will indeed happen onscreen.

 

I remember throwing out the Snow and Charming babynapped Maleficent's kid before 4B even started sort of as a ridiculous joke. And lo and behold here we are today. The only part I was wrong on, was that I said Emma was Mal's long lost kid. But hey getting 50% of a plot point right in a joke plot should count for something no?

[FabulousTater]

I remember last year on TWoP when people were jokingly commenting that Snowing would probably name their baby Reginald after Woegina or after Nealfire because either way that would just be so ridiculous, and come on, they wouldn't would they. And yet... here we are today. HA... hA ha...ha....  >:-|   (My intense hatred of Snowflake's name is 4EVAH!)

 

I'm taking the Cruella - Pongo connection further and throwing my money down on Pongo being Cruella's long lost son. Because TS,TW.

Edited March 25, 2015 by FabulousTater

[FurryFury]

Yeah I remember how I (and probably everyone else) jokingly predicted that Zelena will be Regina's sister, and in a few weeks, it turned out to be true.

[FabulousTater]

Yeah I remember how I (and probably everyone else) jokingly predicted that Zelena will be Regina's sister, and in a few weeks, it turned out to be true.

It's like we're being trolled by A&E. "Think that's ridiculous, do you? Is that a dare? Do you dare us to make Zelena Regina's sister? Well, we'll show you! *BAM* Take that viewers! We do what we want! And while we're at it, the baby's middle name is Reginald!

 

I remember throwing out the Snow and Charming babynapped Maleficent's kid before 4B even started sort of as a ridiculous joke. And lo and behold here we are today. The only part I was wrong on, was that I said Emma was Mal's long lost kid.

The impish part of me kinda wanted this to be a thing. Is it wrong? Probably, but I wanted to see that reveal. "Oops, we got your parents wrong, Emma. Meet your real mama....Maleficent! On the bright side, she probably wants you and doesn't care if you were evil in utero!"

 

Poor Emma. I would feel so bad for her, but this show has gotten so dumb that I mostly wanted it to be a thing just so I could watch heads explode in the fandom from that reveal. Total epic telenovela f*ckery that would make no sense, but that's like this show's specialty nowadays. They don't let things like continuity or logic stop them from doing a thing.

Edited March 25, 2015 by FabulousTater

[KAOS Agent]

I think Snowing don't steal the baby, they steal the egg, but Lily hatched before they could use it and no one knew what to do with a baby dragon so they gave it to Shady who used portal #258513 to send Lily into this world where her dragon issues wouldn't be a problem. Dragon Guy in Thailand is probably her daddy.

 

I'm serious about this egg thing though, you don't think they called it "Best Laid Plans" for nothing, do you?

Edited March 26, 2015 by KAOS Agent

[YaddaYadda]

Probably not.  Their 3 hints were Feinberg (Cruella), Voice (Ursula) and Egg (Maleficent).  Dragons lay eggs so, I guess where the whole thing comes from.  The whole thing is just a lot of weirdness though.

[snarkastic]

Wasn't there that possibility of Grace/Paige making an appearance in Cruella's episode? There's still that minor chance of her being her long lost mother, or something.

 

And, yeah, Snowing are definitely running with an egg, not a baby, but omg, I didn't even realize with the Best LAID Plans. A&E probably think they're sooo clever.

[Souris]

It would be weird to have Cruella turn out to be Grace's mother without Jefferson being in the ep. I mean, they could do it, but it would lack a lot of oomph.

Edited March 26, 2015 by Souris

[ParadoxLost]

And, yeah, Snowing are definitely running with an egg, not a baby, but omg, I didn't even realize with the Best LAID Plans. A&E probably think they're sooo clever.

 

I think they are counting on it being an egg instead of a baby letting them have the storyline and drama without it turning into long term character assassination.  As usual with TS, TW its not going to work out that way.

 

I think there are pretty good odds that they will try to undermine Snow and Charming's culpability in this eventually by remembering that Charming put an egg in Mal at Rumpel's behest.  They didn't really kidnap the kid from its mother, she's just a surrogate and its too bad Mal got attached. This of course, will all be in interviews and twitter and explained to us in the manner that we are educated that Regina didn't rape Graham.  Honestly, if the egg Charming put in Mal is this kid that makes this whole nightmare even worse.

 

I am long past the point where I like Snow enough to let this go if it goes down the way I suspect it will. 

Edited March 26, 2015 by ParadoxLost

[The Cake is a Pie]

Let's be honest here, any kid that was hypothetically taken from Cruella would no doubt be better off than being raised by her mother. I really hope that off all the villains, Cruella gets no redemption and no sob story. She's just guano loco and evil.

[YaddaYadda]

Cruella already had a line about how she would never go back where she started and Rumple asking her if she wasn't tired of being ordinary.

the show is off on April 5th and we're coming back with Heart of Gold. Wonder what that's gonna do for the ratings.

[FabulousTater]

I think there are pretty good odds that they will try to undermine Snow and Charming's culpability in this eventually by remembering that Charming put an egg in Mal at Rumpel's behest.  They didn't really kidnap the kid from its mother, she's just a surrogate and its too bad Mal got attached. This of course, will all be in interviews and twitter and explained to us in the manner that we are educated that Regina didn't rape Graham.  Honestly, if the egg Charming put in Mal is this kid that makes this whole nightmare even worse.

That would be really baffling. For once, I don't think that level of WTF is where the writers are going with it because that "egg" that Charming stuck in dragon form Maleficent was the same "egg" that Emma retrieved at the end of season 1 when she "killed" dragon form Maleficent. And it wasn't even really an egg. It was like Rumple's faberge egg jewelry box where he stashed a vile of True Love potion (the True Love potion he dropped down the well to bring magic to Storybrooke). So the "egg" that Charming put in dragon Maleficent and the thing that Snow is stealing from Maleficent (which looks like an egg) in the spoilers/promos for the upcoming episode, are two different things.

 

I think the writers expect us to have forgotten that Charming shoved that jewelry box egg into dragon Maleficent and that Emma retrieved it way back when, so they'll probably be surprised if someone ask them about it now. Like, "Whuh? You guys remember that!? LOLz"

Edited March 26, 2015 by FabulousTater

[tennisgurl]

I feel like it could go either way They could go with the "poor Mal is a victim of the evil Charming`s" and go full villain woobie with Mal, or they could try to downplay what the Charming`s did, and make it more a tragic misunderstand, if they want to make sure their main couple (well, kind of main. They haven't really done much in ages) stay sympathetic. For all their talk of redemption and such, the writers are really uncomfortable with genuine dark character work, or shades of grey. If a villain does something good, they were a good guy all along, and their evil is all excused. If a good guy does something bad, they either ignore it, or have them drown in guilt to prove they're still good. Or make a huge deal about doing nothing even that evil (Eva and Cora, Snow and Regina).   

[FabulousTater]

the show is off on April 5th and we're coming back with Heart of Gold. Wonder what that's gonna do for the ratings.

So off for one week and when it comes back it looks like (if the spoilers pics are any indication) that's the Robin Hood centric? HA! What that means to me is that the show is having a 2 week break, instead of just one. I'm not even gonna bother with a Robin Woegina crapfest. Eff that noise. I'll just keep to my tumblr dash, thank you very much, and enjoy any Emma or Hook scenes that get gif'd.

[Souris]

A Robin Hood ep written by Scott Nimerfro. If that doesn't get you excited, I don't know what will. ;)

 

BTS pic of Hook on the Jolly.

Edited March 26, 2015 by Souris

[Rumsy4]

That would be really baffling. For once, I don't think that level of WTF is where the writers are going with it because that "egg" that Charming stuck in dragon form Maleficent was the same "egg" that Emma retrieved at the end of season 1 when she "killed" dragon form Maleficent. And it wasn't even really an egg. It was like Rumple's faberge egg jewelry box where he stashed a vile of True Love potion (the True Love potion he dropped down the well to bring magic to Storybrooke). So the "egg" that Charming put in dragon Maleficent and the thing that Snow is stealing from Maleficent (which looks like an egg) in the spoilers/promos for the upcoming episode, are two different things

 

 

Agree. It's probably an egg Mal laid, and has a Dragon papa. The Dragon who got banished to our world and got killed by Tamara. :-p

[FurryFury]

I'm serious about this egg thing though, you don't think they called it "Best Laid Plans" for nothing, do you?

 

Oh hell, I haven't even thought of it. This is just the season of lame puns, isn't it? *headdesk* I mean, there is also "Sympathy for De Vil" and "Enter The Dragon" also looks suspicious, considering Charming put an egg into Maleficent.

[YaddaYadda]

I think the writers expect us to have forgotten that Charming shoved that jewelry box egg into dragon Maleficent and that Emma retrieved it way back when, so they'll probably be surprised if someone ask them about it now. Like, "Whuh?

 

Emma slaying Maleficent and Hook's turn under the library was brought up in 413.

 

Also, Maleficent is not Danaerys Targaryen.  She may be mother of dragons, but she's a lame one and I don't even like Dany that much.  This whole thing is just reminding me of how the 3 dragons hatched from their eggs.

[dassala]

So this just happened on Tumblr. Have we seen these before, and do we think they're legit? 

 

CAUTION - POTENTIAL MAJOR MAJOR SPOILERS BEHIND THIS LINK - SCRIPT PAGES FROM 4.22

 

http://tokillthequeen.tumblr.com/post/114663836038/the-final-pages-of-the-final-season-4-script

[Curio]

Umm, that better be freaking real because, quoting myself from the Speculation Thread:

Ugh...now you all have got me thinking about how cool it would be for Emma to battle Rumple head on and become the Dark One, and how she'd get that sparkly, lizard skin with the creepy eyes, and the irony behind the fact that the savior was the one who turned into the darkest being of them all, and then the other irony that Hook spent centuries of his life finding a way to destroy one Dark One only to have his True Love be the new Dark One and...ugh I need it.

 

I need it.

Edited March 26, 2015 by Curio

[NotBothered]

This seems fake to me, but I would totally be down with Emma turning into the Dark One.  And then maybe the show can actually get back to "you are responsible for your own choices."  Emma could be the Dark One, but not be evil, BECAUSE SHE MAKES GOOD CHOICES.

 

And I guess that whole bit about her wanting to stick a dagger in Gold's chest -- but not really -- would be a nice bit of foreshadowing. 

[YaddaYadda]

So this just happened on Tumblr. Have we seen these before, and do we think they're legit? 

 

CAUTION - POTENTIAL MAJOR MAJOR SPOILERS BEHIND THIS LINK - SCRIPT PAGES FROM 4.22

 

http://tokillthequeen.tumblr.com/post/114663836038/the-final-pages-of-the-final-season-4-script

 

So Regina fucks up the timeline, Emma becomes the new Dark One and Henry releases Jafar?

 

This is all sorts of fucked up and they're ending the season like this?  WTF, show!  This could obviously be fake especially, but Agrabah next season?  I think I could be convinced.

Edited March 26, 2015 by YaddaYadda

[HoodlumSheep]

That would be quite the twist if those spoilers end up true. Those spoilers are kinda making me freak out (both in a good way and bad). First off, Jafar; heck, yeah! He was a great villain in Wonderland and he got crap done instead of evil monologuing for 90% of the episodes.

Then on the hand, Nooo! Not Jafar!!!! With how they have been handling/destroying Will, I do NOT want the writers to touch my precious Jafar.

Also, sorry to burst your bubble Jafar, but you aren't free unless Henry wishes you free, or (from what I gathered from Wonderland (Wonderland spoilers ahead!)), there is the possibility that the last person who wishes the third wish gets sucked into the bottle and becomes the next genie, like what happened to Will.

ETA: evidence that these spoilers are fake: the bottle Jafar was trapped in looked nothing like the lamp from Aladdin, unless they decided to retcon that.

Who knows if those are fake. It could be an alternate ending. Didn't they say they had few different options when it came to the 3b finale?

Edited March 26, 2015 by HoodlumSheep

[dassala]

I don't know if we'd bring in Jafar. I mean, he was the villain on a show that got itself cancelled. Not a great idea. I also don't like the speech patterns for Regina and someone pointed out that 'ROBIN' is usually 'ROBIN HOOD' in the scripts. Other copies of scripts also do not have headers with so much information in them.

 

Plus, a LOT of this is pretty obvious and based on things which came from 4x15. Emma saying she'd kill Gold "if he did the same thing to me" which seems to say Hook is dead. I dunno. Hook is far too popular to kill him off.

 

Agnes Bruckner had better pull out some damage control if that is her script. (Do they really watermark the scripts with the actors' names?)

 

[FurryFury]

I don't buy Jafar for the next season. I mean, I'd LOVE to see "Aladdin" (hopefully, with the Frozen or at least Neverland treatment, not Oz/Sleeping Beauty treatment), but it just doesn't feel right. I still expect Camelot or something like that. Although I'd prefer something fairy-themed.

 

Emma becoming the Dark One would be cool, though... in theory. In practice, we'll get something like Buffy season 6, only even worse.

Edited March 26, 2015 by FurryFury

[Souris]

My guess is fake. If so, pretty shitty to implicate Agnes Bruckner in being careless or breaking confidentiality.

[dassala]

Something definitely feels off about the speaking patterns in that script and why would Henry assume Aladdin was trapped in a lamp?

 

Exactly. He'd be thinking it was a genie, not Aladdin. Why would he think Aladdin could help him? 

[sharky]

I don't like the idea of Emma being the Dark One at all. The whole point of her being the Savior is that she isn't dark. This whole "Emma has the potential to be dark" is cool and very "Heart of Darkness" or "Apocalypse Now" or whatever. But then to have her be the Dark One and yet somehow say "But she can be saved because she has love." WTF? If that was the case, why couldn't Gold get rid of the dagger when he fell in love with Belle?

 

I don't know if we'd bring in Jafar. I mean, he was the villain on a show that got itself cancelled. Not a great idea.

Yep, this too. It would help justify Will's existence on the show and if they planned to bring Wonderland in before getting sidetracked with Frozen, it would explain why he's been around with a whole lot of nothing to do yet. But yea, that ship sailed. As Elsa says, let it go.

 

Oh, and according to IMDB, Naveen Andrews, who plays Jafar, is currently filming a show for Netflix. Maybe he could work both into his schedule, but that seems like a tight fit if he's going to be on Once.

 

I'm not sure about the watermark on an actual script but at the very least, those couldn't be her sides -- she's not in any of the scenes mentioned so she wouldn't have sides for those scenes.

 

ETA:

My guess is fake. If so, pretty shitty to implicate Agnes Bruckner in being careless or breaking confidentiality.

I'm assuming that someone saw her as a "likely culprit" since she seems to be a little more loose with spoilers than other people have been. For a team like Adam and Eddy who are very #nospoilers and who have carried that over to their actors, no one seems to have reeled her in yet, which is a bit strange. She's like above Robert Carlyle when it comes to spoilers, which is saying something. Plus, she's a guest so far so could be seen as more prone to do something like this than Josh or Lana or Colin.

Edited March 26, 2015 by sharky

[YaddaYadda]

For Emma to go and stab the Dark One means that something pretty awful happened.  She wouldn't otherwise.  And Even then, she stabs him and then she seems sort of freaked out, like she forgot the implication of what that means to stab the Dark One with his dagger.

 

And why would they watermark their scripts like that?  I'm assuming Adam and Agnes Bruckner will come out during the day and say something.  If this is real, I cannot imagine how pissed A&E will be with her.

[FurryFury]

WTF? If that was the case, why couldn't Gold get rid of the dagger when he fell in love with Belle?

 

That's the point. He could get rid of the curse right then, but he was shown consistently choosing power over Belle. Rumple is basically the definition of tragic hero - once well-intentioned, yet ruined because he couldn't overcome his flaws.

[HoodlumSheep]

Double-checked the lamp-thing. The lamp that Jafar is trapped in is definitely completely different from the lamp described in those "script" pages. Also, Aladdin was never mentioned in Wonderland, so I don't know where he would fit into Jafar's timeline. Maybe before Wonderland/as he was searching for the 3 genie bottles? These spoilers sound more and more fake.

[sharky]

Screen shot the pages if you still have them because it gets weirder. First, the post says they've now been removed at the request of ABC. Really? ABC cares about your stupid little tumblr? Or you are creating more drama? Second, I looked at this person's tumblr. They haven't posted something in over two years -- and that was one post. Most of her posts are from the first season in 2012.

Edited March 26, 2015 by sharky

[Selina K]

I clicked the link five minutes ago and got the script and then just now I clicked it and got 'removed at the request of ABC.'  Intrigue!

 

I love me some Naveen Andrews so I'd be ok with Jafar.  I will not be ok with a deceased Hook.

 

ETA: Sharky is faster than I am and did actual research.  The fact that ABC would care at all about someone's tumblr and find it does sort of scream fake.  YouTube, I get.  Tumblr?  Maybe not.  Esp not a super popular account.  Did they have a lot of trackbacks such that it would have wended its way up to ABC?

Edited March 26, 2015 by Selina K