S15.E15: Paradise Lost

[ZettaK]

As the Puerto Rico trip comes to an end, things go from bad to worse as the Brynn and Ubah feud escalates to the point of no return; a shocking claim leaves everyone speechless and shaken.

First aired on 1/21/2025.

[Mindthinkr]

Let’s see if this episode is worth the hype. 

[Steph J]

"Ubah can apologize and Brynn can receive it, then maybe's there's a chance we can have fun together - which is what we do best."

... Did... did I miss the episode where they have fun together?

[Pi237]

Although, I feel like Brynn is weaponizing her trauma in this fight...Its very Ubah to scream and yell and get mad at everyone instead of jus being concerned and talking to Brynn like a normal person, with compassion.

[snarts]

Ubah's often irrational & extremely volatile but I believe that she was unaware of Brynn's assault. 

Brynn's lied/embellished too many times & I 100% believe she said Ubah knew just to get support from the other ladies. 

[Pi237]

Uh Oh, Hold on!!!  "Ubah maybe didn't clock it?!" Damn. 

Edited Yest. at 02:36 AM by Pi237

[bosawks]

Well, even for BRAVO, this is fucked up.

[Pi237]

Ew. That Jenna update was uncalled for. Stay classy, Bravo! 🤣

[njbchlover]

21 minutes ago, Pi237 said:

Ew. That Jenna update was uncalled for. Stay classy, Bravo! 🤣

Seriously?  Two things that can never be said in one sentence!  🤣

[Baltimore Betty]

I was a little confused about them shooting the apple holding/opening photos, I thought they were getting ready for the reunion but nope, it was the opening photos.

Ubah is so loud and screams at everyone it was hard for me to keep track of what was going on, it took me a while to understand who was supporting who, who was wrong or lying.

[njbchlover]

50 minutes ago, bosawks said:

Well, even for BRAVO, this is fucked up.

Most of us have been saying how boring and how bad this new group of women are, but they certainly were NOT boring tonight.

Sadly, imo, this was really not enjoyable at all to watch.  Brynn needs some intense therapy, as she's obviously not dealing well with her past - everything in her childhood, not just this assault.

Is it wrong of me to think that Brynn is weaponizing what happened to her and using it to garner sympathy?

I just can't understand how someone who has been sexually assaulted would continue to use sexual innuendo and constantly coming on to men (and women) in the way Brynn does.  I guess there's some deep psychological reason that I don't know, but I just feel like that is the case with Brynn.

Edited Yest. at 03:35 AM by njbchlover

[Baltimore Betty]

Just now, njbchlover said:

Is it wrong of me to think that Brynn is weaponizing what happened to her?

Nope!

I think she is manipulative, probably learned when she was young, learned to lie for attention, got the attention then manipulated people...she needs help.

The one think I rolled my eyes was Brynn yelled her kids will see this someday, what about all the stuff she did that was embarrassing all by herself.

[njbchlover]

2 minutes ago, Baltimore Betty said:

Nope!

I think she is manipulative, probably learned when she was young, learned to lie for attention, got the attention then manipulated people...she needs help.

The one think I rolled my eyes was Brynn yelled her kids will see this someday, what about all the stuff she did that was embarrassing all by herself.

I just edited and added more to my comment....hope you're still in agreement!  😊

[njbchlover]

13 minutes ago, Baltimore Betty said:

Nope!

I think she is manipulative, probably learned when she was young, learned to lie for attention, got the attention then manipulated people...she needs help.

The one think I rolled my eyes was Brynn yelled her kids will see this someday, what about all the stuff she did that was embarrassing all by herself.

I don't think I would feel this way about Brynn weaponizing her assault if she didn't seem so laissez-faire about things in the morning when talking to the producers.  She seemed well rested and not troubled at all by all that had happened.  Everyone else seemed shell-shocked but Brynn was all about going horseback riding and moving on with the day.

Maybe it's a coping mechanism, but I just don't trust anything with Brynn.

[QQQQ]

Hypersexuality as a trauma response

[njbchlover]

1 minute ago, QQQQ said:

Hypersexuality as a trauma response

Thank you - very informative.

I hope that if this is the case with Brynn, that she is getting the proper therapy she obviously needs.

[Marley]

Ubah & Bryn both need to be gone after this season. I think it would get better without them. I can't stand Ubah & her constant screaming.

Bryn needs to get help too. It's horrible what happened to her obviously but she is clearly a pathological liar.

These ladies need to do this stuff on camera all out on the open not this retelling bs. This behind the scenes bs we never see is killing the show.

[dancingdreamer]

I didn't  enjoy this episode, I know enjoy is the wrong word. I don't  think  this a show Brynn should  be on, not until she seeks excellent  therapy. 

I don't  think  it would hurt Ubah either, but for different  reasons. 

I usually  look forward  to the updates at the end, but I didn’t  think  they were very good, especially  Jenna's. 

I keep  reading,  and seeing  on WWHL just how much people  are enjoying  rhony, I'm missing  something,  because I don't. 

[ZettaK]

1 hour ago, dancingdreamer said:

I didn't  enjoy this episode, I know enjoy is the wrong word. I don't  think  this a show Brynn should  be on, not until she seeks excellent  therapy. 

I don't  think  it would hurt Ubah either, but for different  reasons. 

I usually  look forward  to the updates at the end, but I didn’t  think  they were very good, especially  Jenna's. 

I keep  reading,  and seeing  on WWHL just how much people  are enjoying  rhony, I'm missing  something,  because I don't. 

Only Andy Cohen is hyping the show and forces his guests to say they like it (in order not to appear rude). The actual viewers say on blogs, social media, etc. that the show is unwatchable, and the ratings are dismal- the worst in the show's history. 

Edited Yest. at 07:27 AM by ZettaK

[Keywestclubkid]

7 hours ago, njbchlover said:

 

I just can't understand how someone who has been sexually assaulted would continue to use sexual innuendo and constantly coming on to men (and women) in the way Brynn does.  I guess there's some deep psychological reason that I don't know, but I just feel like that is the case with Brynn.

You see this a lot in some not all kids that were molested and yes some adults they become hyper sexual in life .. it’s just a psychological thing where the behavior is embedded in the subconscious 

 

6 hours ago, QQQQ said:

Hypersexuality as a trauma response

This part 

[KristenR]

So that was really awful. On many (every?) levels.

I have to say that I kind of liked last season. I thought the new cast showed some promise and, honestly, given how dark some of the other franchises have gotten -- conning the elderly, DUIs, assaults with cocktail glasses -- I really appreciated a multi episode storyline about cheese. Just give me some ridiculous fashions, real estate/travel porn with some shady talking heads and I'm good. But this season was not it and ended on a really disturbing note. I don't know where they go from here.

ETA: I am not the first person to say this but I am starting to feel that we may be reaching the end of the road for this franchise.  Housewives in general, not just NY. Though NY is probably the best (worst?) example of the "producing housewife" phenomenon that is killing these shows. The ladies are simultaneously making the show incredibly boring -- as mentioned above, nothing ever actually happens on camera anymore -- or really ugly. Like whatever the fuck Brynn was doing tonight. 

Edited Yest. at 11:28 AM by KristenR

[bosawks]

I actually hope they get another chance despite this episode not because of it.

I like Jessel, this version of Sai, Jenna and the 2 newbies were actually ok.

But Brynn does not make for good tv, even before this, and I'd be fine seeing what an Brynn free Ubah is like.

I think there is some there, there but I'd rather oust the production team and Brynn rather than a full recast.

Edited Yest. at 12:36 PM by bosawks

[bosawks]

The fact that Brynn's season might be worse than both Potomac Karen and Salt Lake Jen who were headed to jail is one of the more impressive HoWife feats.....

[ZettaK]

Ubah looked good during the women's photoshoot at the end in her short bob, and her mostly dissolved cheek fillers.

Brynn might be damaged, but this is not an excuse to lie about Ubah. I don't know if Brynn can continue filming with the women if there is another season (Andy Cohen is going to make sure it's going to be). 

The women didn’t want to communicate with her anymore after the episode in PR, as they mentioned at the end of the episode. Jenna Lyons was on Watch What Happens Live yesterday, and she said they still don't.

 

24 minutes ago, bosawks said:

I actually hope they get another chance despite this episode not because of it.

I like Jessel, this version of Sai, Jenna and the 2 newbies were actually ok.

But Brynn does not make for good tv even before this and I'd be fine seeing what an Brynn free Ubah is like.

I think there is some there, there but I'd rather oust the production time and Brynn rather than a full recast.

I think the show can continue, but without Brynn. 

[hoodooznoodooz]

Didn’t Sai just recently explain that after Pavit’s comments offended her, she’s been ignoring him? And she’s fantastic at ignoring people? Now she’s complaining that he didn’t say “hello” to her at one of the gatherings?

[Baltimore Betty]

9 hours ago, QQQQ said:

Hypersexuality as a trauma response

I learned that from watching Law & Order SVU...Olivia Benson would talk about that response to sexual trauma, it is sad for Brynn.

[janiema]

I would imagine that the book Brynn was working on is not going to be a best seller.

[hoodooznoodooz]

I have to give production credit. They made that 2 am sequence look extremely disturbing. It reminded me of the Blair Witch Project. Yes, I am as old as the hills.
 

But I actually think Brynn and Ubah have one thing in common. Their rage/pain/hurt blinds them, and they will spew all sorts of things that have no connection to reality. 
 

Brynn desperately wants love and support from the others. But she manipulates when she feels defeated or caged. 

[Chatty Cake]

I notice Brynn uses whatever she can when she feels backed in a corner. First she’s trying to prove herself as a black woman. At other times it’s her childhood trauma. Then it’s losing her beloved grandma. Then it’s the assault  I think she spouts off so many excuses that she can’t keep track of who she confided in. 
I thought the way Jenna babying her was ridiculous. Hopefully that’s over now.

Ubah gets so unhinged she becomes almost scary. If she could calm down when arguing she would be easier to watch.

Now for the asshole who says under the radar. Erin. She joins the trip being nice to Rebecca and offers to share a room with her. Last night when Rebecca stuck her head in the room to tell them the food was there, she starts snickering with Ubah and Sai like the turncoat piece of trash that she is.  I thought the way they treated Rebecca was mean and for no reason. They’d rather comfort crazy Ubah or poor sex kitten lying Brynn than give attention to someone that’s not crazy.

I wanted to like Raquel but she was so performative when pretending to relate to Brynn. I also noticed in her end script that she hasn’t gone to visit her mom but made it to the Hamptons to kiss ass. I think she used the mom not accepting her for a story. It sounded like the mom developed anxiety after the hurricane and Covid.  Raquel comes off as a shitty daughter to me.

Sai, Jenna and Jessel were much easier to watch than the rest of them.

[Keywestclubkid]

Hurt people hurt people .. and its true for both Ubah and Brynn .. and BOTH get a lot of allowance from this cast for their behavior ... BOTH def should not come back next year but with what Brynn did I see Ubah getting another season

[janiema]

I wonder whether Brynn has an inferiority complex vis a vis the other cast members. They all seem to have family and significant others as well as more wealth. 

[sugarbaker design]

6 hours ago, ZettaK said:

Only Andy Cohen is hyping the show and forces his guests to say they like it (in order not to appear rude). The actual viewers say on blogs, social media, etc. that the show is unwatchable, and the ratings are dismal- the worst in the show's history. 

I'm not one of those viewers who blog (I've never even read a blog) or social media (FB and Primetimer is the extent of my social media), but there are people, like me, who like the show.  We may be small in numbers but we do exist.

10 hours ago, Baltimore Betty said:

I was a little confused about them shooting the apple holding/opening photos, I thought they were getting ready for the reunion but nope, it was the opening photos.

This season started with Erin and Jessel at the opening photo shoot.

10 hours ago, njbchlover said:

Most of us have been saying how boring and how bad this new group of women are, but they certainly were NOT boring tonight.

Word.

1 hour ago, bosawks said:

I actually hope they get another chance despite this episode not because of it.

I like Jessel, this version of Sai, Jenna and the 2 newbies were actually ok.

Agreed.

1 hour ago, bosawks said:

But Brynn does not make for good tv, even before this, and I'd be fine seeing what an Brynn free Ubah is like.

On this we disagree, Brynn makes compelling TV.

 

22 minutes ago, Chatty Cake said:

I think she used the mom not accepting her for a story. It sounded like the mom developed anxiety after the hurricane and Covid.  Raquel comes off as a shitty daughter to me.

The mother sounds like a religious homophobe to me.

[Baltimore Betty]

2 minutes ago, sugarbaker design said:

This season started with Erin and Jessel at the opening photo shoot.

You have a much better memory than I do.

[heatherchandler]

1 hour ago, Chatty Cake said:

Now for the asshole who says under the radar. Erin. She joins the trip being nice to Rebecca and offers to share a room with her. Last night when Rebecca stuck her head in the room to tell them the food was there, she starts snickering with Ubah and Sai like the turncoat piece of trash that she is.

That was so messed up.  I hate Erin she’s a total asshole.  But she thinks she’s hilarious.

 

8 hours ago, dancingdreamer said:

I didn't  enjoy this episode, I know enjoy is the wrong word. I don't  think  this a show Brynn should  be on, not until she seeks excellent  therapy. 

I don't  think  it would hurt Ubah either, but for different  reasons. 

I usually  look forward  to the updates at the end, but I didn’t  think  they were very good, especially  Jenna's. 

I keep  reading,  and seeing  on WWHL just how much people  are enjoying  rhony, I'm missing  something,  because I don't. 

Right, this is not enjoyable television!  WHO THINKS IT WOULD BE???? 
 

Andy Cohen is pretending the show is doing well (it’s actually weird to watch him do this) but the numbers say otherwise.  It’s like 80000% down from old RHONY.  

Edited Yest. at 03:06 PM by heatherchandler

[Marley]

Yes & Andy basically forces his guests on WWHL to praise it. If they try getting rid of Brynn, Ubah & Rebecca I think it could maybe get better. They need to try tho. I have never like Ubah she's so grating & a spaz & not a fun to watch spaz.

[Chatty Cake]

2 hours ago, sugarbaker design said:

 

The mother sounds like a religious homophobe to me.

We really can’t tell based on what Raquel said. The mom did show up to Raquel in Puerto Rico. Raquel didn’t go to her. Her mom sat there while the straight people had a laugh at her expense by kissing each other. I doubt Rackie gives a shit about having a better relationship with her mom.

[sugarbaker design]

32 minutes ago, Chatty Cake said:

We really can’t tell based on what Raquel said.

Oh, I can tell.  I can read between the lines.

32 minutes ago, Chatty Cake said:

The mom did show up to Raquel in Puerto Rico. Raquel didn’t go to her.

That could be for many reasons.  Maybe Mom didn't want her house filmed, maybe production could only film at the HW house.

33 minutes ago, Chatty Cake said:

Her mom sat there while the straight people had a laugh at her expense by kissing each other.

There's no doubt about that.

34 minutes ago, Chatty Cake said:

I doubt Rackie gives a shit about having a better relationship with her mom.

On that we disagree.

[Pi237]

2 hours ago, heatherchandler said:

That was so messed up.  I hate Erin she’s a total asshole.  But she thinks she’s hilarious

 

She really does think she’s clever & hot shit. Always gossiping about whomever isn’t in the room at the time, but can’t handle when she’s called out for it.  Total mean girl. Great abs tho, and loved her tomato dress. 
 

They all seem to hate each other more than any cast I watch. Their laughter is always at someone’s expense. Yet, they hug and love you/love you so much!   
 

I’ll still watch tho lol love seeing the city, their apartments and fashions. Could probably enjoy it more on mute. 

[politichick]

I would love another season but without Brynn and to a lesser extent without Erin. They're both liars. Brynn will definitely be called out for her lies at the reunion, but I hope that Erin is, too. 

And then Brynn shows up to the photo shoot wanting sympathy? What a bitch. She needs to ditch the support group and seek psychiatric help.

[StevieRocks]

Agree with those who said the three mean girls, I mean the three middle-aged crones, nastily snickering at Rebecca<?> was one of the most gross, lame, and basic things ever. And Erin--Dear, I realize you're trying desperately to be the Greek Chorus AND hold on to your apple and your howives paycheck, but this isn't Shakespeare--it's a gaggle of dingbats on a howives show, so please stop trying to be a combination of Alistair Cooke and Edward R. Murrow in your talking heads. It/y'all ain't that deep. 🙄

Edited 23 hours ago by StevieRocks

[Chatty Cake]

45 minutes ago, sugarbaker design said:

Oh, I can tell.  I can read between the lines.

That could be for many reasons.  Maybe Mom didn't want her house filmed, maybe production could only film at the HW house.

There's no doubt about that.

On that we disagree.

I feel that I can read between the lines regarding Raquel as well. She was a big deal when her rich husband got her jobs as a museum model of some sort. She decided to be true to herself but found out that without the money behind it she’s not that big a deal. She uses her story to get on housewives including insinuating that her mama who doesn’t live anywhere near her didn’t accept her. This kind of story flies in the world of Bravo but it doesn’t mean that it’s 100% true. I wouldn’t be surprised if production  cooked up the bad mama stuff because let’s face it, she’s on the boring side. 
She also looks hideous in that wig with the bangs. But that’s neither here nor there.

Erin’s actually grosser than Brynn. Brynn is just repeating stuff that may or may not be true. Erin paraded her sickly (RIP to her dad) parents around for a story.  Her and Raquel are both two peas in a pod. At least Raquel isn’t showing pics of her fiancée’s nether regions to people like Erin. She also didn’t volunteer to let Brynn do her sexpot routine to her lady the way Erin did to Abe. Abe seemed kind of emasculated this season. Probably to make up for his affair or the bitcoin or whatever had Erin mad at him at the beginning of the season.

[Natalie68]

14 hours ago, njbchlover said:

Most of us have been saying how boring and how bad this new group of women are, but they certainly were NOT boring tonight.

Sadly, imo, this was really not enjoyable at all to watch.  Brynn needs some intense therapy, as she's obviously not dealing well with her past - everything in her childhood, not just this assault.

Is it wrong of me to think that Brynn is weaponizing what happened to her and using it to garner sympathy?

I just can't understand how someone who has been sexually assaulted would continue to use sexual innuendo and constantly coming on to men (and women) in the way Brynn does.  I guess there's some deep psychological reason that I don't know, but I just feel like that is the case with Brynn.

That is the only way she feels worthy?

[ZettaK]

8 hours ago, sugarbaker design said:

I'm not one of those viewers who blog (I've never even read a blog) or social media (FB and Primetimer is the extent of my social media), but there are people, like me, who like the show.  

I like the show enough to still watch it.

[Marley]

I'm still not getting why Ubah was so next level spaz lol.

[tvfanatic13]

Hi, my name is tvfanatic13, and I like Erin. Sorry (small voice). 

[snarts]

18 hours ago, StevieRocks said:

Agree with those who said the three mean girls, I mean the three middle-aged crones, nastily snickering at Rebecca<?> was one of the most gross, lame, and basic things ever.

This scene didn't strike me as meanspirited so maybe I missed something. I thought they were giggling about Rebecca coming in like a Mom, reminding them to eat because they'd all been drinking, when all hell was breaking out around them.

I don't recall nastiness, more amazement that she was so mom-like focused on making sure they their dinner. And it worked, they all followed her out to the table.

8 hours ago, tvfanatic13 said:

Hi, my name is tvfanatic13, and I like Erin. Sorry (small voice). 

Me too. I think she gets blamed for a lot of things because she tries to actually connect with these ladies & doesn't view them just as co-workers. I get that she can be a little messy but I don't see her as meanspirited or manipulative like some others.

[Baltimore Betty]

12 hours ago, Marley said:

I'm still not getting why Ubah was so next level spaz lol.

Because she over reacts to everthing! Remember the fake bug induced barfing, actual barfing because of a plastic bug.  Her go to move is screaming at anyone for anything.

[Keywestclubkid]

Erin will never be these girls real friends I'm sorry she talks mad shit about them all then runs to who they were talking about to tattle while leaving her part in what was said out ... 

 

that's not connection that's calculation 

 

she's a pick me girl that is a fence straddler 

Edited 3 hours ago by Keywestclubkid

[lasu]

Don't forget, Erin was supposedly Brynn's bestie, and basically the first thing we heard her do was use it to her advantage, telling Jenna she should believe her about not calling Jenna poor.