Chit-Chat: The Feels

[PRgal]

22 minutes ago, Dimity said:

When my kids were older teens they worked in coffee shops and stores within easy reach of our house. One thing I rarely see anymore are teens babysitting or mowing lawns which were standard teen jobs when I was growing up. As you say the world has changed.

Other than sitting jobs here and there, I wasn't allowed to work when I was in high school, not even in the summer.  In university, my parents didn't want me to work during the academic year, but were fine with me working when I was off.  They had to tutor high school kids when they were in school to help with tuition and didn't want me to deal with a "job" while studying.  

[Notabug]

28 minutes ago, Dimity said:

When my kids were older teens they worked in coffee shops and stores within easy reach of our house. One thing I rarely see anymore are teens babysitting or mowing lawns which were standard teen jobs when I was growing up. As you say the world has changed.

I was one of 5 sisters and, when I was in high school, we lived in a condo and 3 of us were babysitting age.  In addition to taking care of our younger sibs, we had a ton of first cousins.  My youngest sister was still an infant and the 3 of us were all comfortable with newborns on up.  We would put our names and numbers in the condo newsletter every month and we would be turning jobs down.  I could've babysat every day of the month if I'd wanted it.  I only went to Burger King because they paid $2 an hour and I was getting around half that for babysitting.

You're right, though, teens don't do those sorts of jobs anymore.

3 minutes ago, PRgal said:

Other than sitting jobs here and there, I wasn't allowed to work when I was in high school, not even in the summer.  In university, my parents didn't want me to work during the academic year, but were fine with me working when I was off.  They had to tutor high school kids when they were in school to help with tuition and didn't want me to deal with a "job" while studying.  

My family was struggling economically when I was in high school and college and there really wasn't an option to stay home and not work.  As it was, my sisters and I often tossed our babysitting money into the pot to help pay for groceries.  We had a bunch of young siblings, we felt it was our responsibility to help where we could.

ETA:  Under the category of strange things I never thought I'd need to know; my employer, a large hospital system, sent out a systemwide memo this morning with information on what to do if/when ICE appears at our workplace.  What to say, who to call, etc.  It seems that healthcare facilities are going to be targeted next.

Edited February 6 by Notabug

[Bookworm 1979]

1 hour ago, Notabug said:

Times have also changed greatly.  Although the Republicans haven't noticed, teens no longer take menial jobs in the summer.  Take a look at your favorite fast food joint; they have trouble finding kids to work there and instead use retirees or young adults without vocational training or college.  It's even worse in rural areas where there are fewer kids overall. 

My nephew looked for a summer job last year, and he could not find one. A lot of the places here hire foreign workers for the entry-level jobs. The rest of places would only hire 18 and over. Doesn't help that Alberta has the lowest minimum wage in Canada, and our useless provincial government made it legal for companies pay minors even less.

I did babysit back when I was a kid, and I HATED it (it's a big reason why I'm childfree). Once my aunts started having kids and I didn't have to babysit for the neighbours anymore, it got a little better.

I do remember one of the students who worked at Wal-Mart (back in the 90's when I worked there) getting a bottle of shampoo thrown at her head when the customer didn't like the price. I don't blame kids for not wanting to work.

[peacheslatour]

4 minutes ago, Bookworm 1979 said:

My nephew looked for a summer job last year, and he could not find one. A lot of the places here hire foreign workers for the entry-level jobs. The rest of places would only hire 18 and over. Doesn't help that Alberta has the lowest minimum wage in Canada, and our useless provincial government made it legal for companies pay minors even less.

I did babysit back when I was a kid, and I HATED it (it's a big reason why I'm childfree). Once my aunts started having kids and I didn't have to babysit for the neighbours anymore, it got a little better.

I do remember one of the students who worked at Wal-Mart (back in the 90's when I worked there) getting a bottle of shampoo thrown at her head when the customer didn't like the price. I don't blame kids for not wanting to work.

Working with the public can be a nightmare no matter how old you are. I once eighty sixed a guy from my flower shop because he put his hands on me. I found out later that the girls at the deli next door weren't allowed to hand him his change. They had to place it on the counter or he would grab their hands.

[Bookworm 1979]

8 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

Working with the public can be a nightmare no matter how old you are.

My mom finally retired from Wal-Mart last year, and she told me stories of people threatening the greeters during Covid when businesses were asking people to wear masks. The public sucks in general, but the public at Wal-Mart is a whole new level of nightmare. I'm glad you were able to kick out that guy from your flower shop.

[bluegirl147]

17 minutes ago, Bookworm 1979 said:

My mom finally retired from Wal-Mart last year, and she told me stories of people threatening the greeters during Covid when businesses were asking people to wear masks. The public sucks in general, but the public at Wal-Mart is a whole new level of nightmare. I'm glad you were able to kick out that guy from your flower shop.

When covid happened I didn't step foot in a Walmart for over a year till I was vaccinated.  Walmart on a good day is bad enough but during a pandemic?  No thank you. 

Kids today want to make money being influencers.

Edited February 6 by bluegirl147

[Ohiopirate02]

8 minutes ago, bluegirl147 said:

Kids today want to make money being influencers.

That and making money by playing video games as streamers. That being said, I do know of teens who have difficulty finding work because management does not want to hire teens. Store managers want adults who do not have as many restrictions on their hours and who will not up and quit on you in pursuit of their education. The job is never going to be the #1 priority for a teen, and that is a big turn off for management.

[Lugal]

13 hours ago, Soapy Goddess said:

While that might be true, I wonder what any of us would do if we were in Netanyahu's position?

Netanyahu's position is one of genocide.  Not only did he compare Gaza to Amalek, citing an explicitly genocidal passage from the Bible, but he has sabotaged previous ceasefire deals (and I have to give credit to Trump for leaning on him to get this deal passed).  Then Trump promises to "clean out" Gaza (his words with the connotation of ethnic cleansing) possibly putting US troops on the ground to do so.  This has earned him praise from Bezalel Smotrich and Itamar Ben-Gvir, hardly individuals that any decent human being should want to be associated with.

2 hours ago, bluegirl147 said:

You always hear it's undocumented workers keeping wages low.  No it's the companies that hire the undocumented workers.  And they will keep doing it.  If their current workers are deported they will look for new undocumented workers. It's not like they will suddenly decide to hire US citizens and pay them a living wage and provide benefits.  No matter what Trump and the Republicans say that is not happening.

Like I've often said, you can hate immigrants all you want, but until you stop loving the cheap labor they provide, nothing will change.

57 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

Working with the public can be a nightmare no matter how old you are. I once eighty sixed a guy from my flower shop because he put his hands on me. I found out later that the girls at the deli next door weren't allowed to hand him his change. They had to place it on the counter or he would grab their hands.

Retail work is its own circle of hell.

[Dimity]

Any job dealing with the public has challenges but what was great when I worked in a public library was being able to kick out badly behaved patrons and if we got a troublemaker threatening not  to come back if we didn't kowtow to them we could say, "cool, don't  come back. " the looks of shock on their faces was a treat.

[peacheslatour]

For all of our Canadian friends!

[jennifer6973]

19 hours ago, partofme said:

It is foreign aid and doesn’t directly affect us here, but I saw the director of USAID on Colbert and she said that the work they do eradicating diseases like Ebola in other countries is the reason we don’t have these diseases here.  So it does indirectly affect us and if their aid is completely cut off these diseases will spread worldwide.  

It kinda does affect us here,  the farmers that supply them are affected.

[lookeyloo]

My three grands live in a suburb of Tacoma, WA.  They have all gotten fast food, coffee barista, pizza joint summer and after school jobs.  Their co workers are their school friends or they make friends of the co workers.  None of them has ever complained of those things mentioned above.  My grands are very special to me (one graduating law school in June, one a junior in college and one a high school junior) but in the world at large they are just someone's kids.  What is different where they live?  None of us are influential or "know someone".

[MostlyContent]

28 minutes ago, lookeyloo said:

My three grands live in a suburb of Tacoma, WA.  They have all gotten fast food, coffee barista, pizza joint summer and after school jobs.  Their co workers are their school friends or they make friends of the co workers.  None of them has ever complained of those things mentioned above.  My grands are very special to me (one graduating law school in June, one a junior in college and one a high school junior) but in the world at large they are just someone's kids.  What is different where they live?  None of us are influential or "know someone".

Your post caught my eye because my 3 grands live so close to yours!  (Whidbey Island)  They aren't yet old enough to seek summer employment so it's nothing I've even thought to ask my daughter about.  It's good to know things sound pretty 'normal' (?) in that area.  

It's that way here, too.  Our lawn care and snow removal is handled by the 14 yr old twins who live in the house across the street, and most teenagers seem to work at fast food places, restaurants (in whatever capacity), their uncle's shop, helping out on a dairy farm......that sort of thing.  I suppose that we have our share of influencer-wannabes etc, but that's not the sort of thing I'd ever know about, I guess.  Social media is not my forte.  🤣

It must depend on where one lives.  ????

[Dimity]

At dinner tonight my husband and I were talking about whether the kinds of conversations he and I are having right now were taking place in households in Austria, Poland and Czechoslovakia back in the day.  Somehow I suspect they were.

Edited February 6 by Dimity

[dargosmydaddy]

3 hours ago, Notabug said:

ETA:  Under the category of strange things I never thought I'd need to know; my employer, a large hospital system, sent out a systemwide memo this morning with information on what to do if/when ICE appears at our workplace.  What to say, who to call, etc.  It seems that healthcare facilities are going to be targeted next.

We got a similar memo last week from our superintendent (I teach high school). 

Back in February 2020, before everything shut down but when everyone was starting to worry, events were getting cancelled, etc., I remember one of my students saying she felt like we were living in the beginning of a disaster movie and she really didn't like it. I am feeling that way now, and I really, really don't like it.

[bluegirl147]

27 minutes ago, Dimity said:

At dinner tonight my husband and I were talking about whether the kinds of conversations he and I are having right now were taking place in households in Austria, Poland and Czechoslovakia back in the day.  Somehow I suspect they were.

 

20 minutes ago, dargosmydaddy said:

We got a similar memo last week from our superintendent (I teach high school). 

Back in February 2020, before everything shut down but when everyone was starting to worry, events were getting cancelled, etc., I remember one of my students saying she felt like we were living in the beginning of a disaster movie and she really didn't like it. I am feeling that way now, and I really, really don't like it.

Evil never survives.  Oh it will run rampant for awhile but in the end decency always wins out.  We just have to outlive the evil.

And this is why this thread is so important. We need to keep each other hopeful and not let anyone fall into despair.

[fastiller]

When he was a teenager, my older brother "found" Jesus (had he been missing?) and all his politics since have been informed by his preacher's views.* To this day, this includes his disdain of undocumented immigrants.  Every time he's mentioned the evils of "illegals" I have to remind him that two of our cousins were here illegally.  Seems he forgets that a not insignificant number of undocumented immigrants have come from Ireland.

*Were she still alive,, our very feminist mother would be heartbroken at his misogyny & racism.

Edited February 7 by fastiller
punctuation

[Blergh]

4 hours ago, Notabug said:

 

ETA:  Under the category of strange things I never thought I'd need to know; my employer, a large hospital system, sent out a systemwide memo this morning with information on what to do if/when ICE appears at our workplace.  What to say, who to call, etc.  It seems that healthcare facilities are going to be targeted next.

I got one too at my Southeast US hospital. My area doesn't directly deal with patients themselves. However, we take patient privacy VERY seriously to the degree that if we need any help getting a patient's medical record to cross over to our system, we have to send a message to the techs via encrypted email with only the patient's initials and internal medical record.

Essentially, what the memo I got said was that if ICE shows up and demands patient records [regardless of whether or not they themselves convey this politely or professionally], we are expected to contact the hospital's legal department and politely convey to ICE that we would be unable to release ANY patient records to them without the legal department's approval due to HIPAA regulations. Now whether HIPAA regulations will endure is not something I'd be willing to bet at this time. However, I don't envy those who DO have direct patient interaction. .or even those area that store patient hard copy records (e.g. billing) as  it seems they would be the more likely places where ICE would show up. Yet, it's possible they could show up at any part of the hospital,laboratory or research areas. BTW, I've noticed far fewer Latin American maintenance and cleaning workers in our department's neck of the woods over the last few weeks.

[PRgal]

For Canadians looking to shop as much Canadian as they can, there's a new website up that is curating a list.  

 

At the same time, we must not forget that people working in non-Canadian brands in Canada are Canadian, residents in Canada or working here on a visa, and contributing to the Canadian economy.  Many are also franchise owners of internationally owned/based brands.

[Anela]

7 hours ago, bluegirl147 said:

You always hear it's undocumented workers keeping wages low.  No it's the companies that hire the undocumented workers.  And they will keep doing it.  If their current workers are deported they will look for new undocumented workers. It's not like they will suddenly decide to hire US citizens and pay them a living wage and provide benefits.  No matter what Trump and the Republicans say that is not happening.

And if they raise wages, we’re told they have to raise prices, too.  

5 hours ago, Bookworm 1979 said:

My nephew looked for a summer job last year, and he could not find one. A lot of the places here hire foreign workers for the entry-level jobs. The rest of places would only hire 18 and over. Doesn't help that Alberta has the lowest minimum wage in Canada, and our useless provincial government made it legal for companies pay minors even less.

I did babysit back when I was a kid, and I HATED it (it's a big reason why I'm childfree). Once my aunts started having kids and I didn't have to babysit for the neighbours anymore, it got a little better.

I do remember one of the students who worked at Wal-Mart (back in the 90's when I worked there) getting a bottle of shampoo thrown at her head when the customer didn't like the price. I don't blame kids for not wanting to work.

I used to be acquainted with someone whose mother owned an inn or something, in Maine. She hired people from places like Poland - that’s how he met his wife. 

2 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

I'm back on Xanax to sleep at all. 

I just slept for fourteen hours, and I’m not sure how. I couldn’t sleep on Wednesday morning/Tuesday night, and only had a nap, but still, fourteen hours.  

Edited February 7 by Anela

[Annber03]

1 hour ago, Dimity said:

Agreed.  It's definitely a balancing act going forward.  One thing I did notice on another site with regard to avoiding Made in USA was about food products and they make, sadly, a very good point:

 

...U.S.A., U.S.A...

I would ove for Trump supporters to explain how stuff like this is supposedly going to "make America great again". 

[Mollywolly555]

My grand nephew at 17 started his own business selling vintage tees and Carhartt clothing online and then at pop-ups. His grandmother, my sister, had been taking him to thrift stores since he was little. He s almost 19 now and goes to community college for business ed too.

Another teen I hired thru Nextdoor to detail my car had his own business doing vehicle cleaning and detailing  he worked hard for 4 hours and my car was gorgeous. 

My neighbor's teen started a lawn service business with a truck and a mower and it had grown since then. 

I guess I'm saying that the internet has opened up new ways of capitalizing on old ways so instead of garage sales, car washes, lawn mowing, the kids are smart enough to be owners in control and  able to reach a wider market.

[Notabug]

2 hours ago, Blergh said:

I got one too at my Southeast US hospital. My area doesn't directly deal with patients themselves. However, we take patient privacy VERY seriously to the degree that if we need any help getting a patient's medical record to cross over to our system, we have to send a message to the techs via encrypted email with only the patient's initials and internal medical record.

Essentially, what the memo I got said was that if ICE shows up and demands patient records [regardless of whether or not they themselves convey this politely or professionally], we are expected to contact the hospital's legal department and politely convey to ICE that we would be unable to release ANY patient records to them without the legal department's approval due to HIPAA regulations. Now whether HIPAA regulations will endure is not something I'd be willing to bet at this time. However, I don't envy those who DO have direct patient interaction. .or even those area that store patient hard copy records (e.g. billing) as  it seems they would be the more likely places where ICE would show up. Yet, it's possible they could show up at any part of the hospital,laboratory or research areas. BTW, I've noticed far fewer Latin American maintenance and cleaning workers in our department's neck of the woods over the last few weeks.

The memo we received emphasized that we were to be polite, but tell the agents that we could do nothing for them without the presence of the hospital police (if in the hospital) or the location supervisor (outpatient facilities) and that those individuals would be contacting the hospital's legal reps first before speaking to the agents let alone providing them with any information.

The final sentence of the memo was to state that the hospital system's mission was to provide medical care to EVERYONE regardless of their immigration status and all employees need to do is remember that at all times.

[Anela]

This was posted on twitter today, by someone in Ohio.  They want to make it illegal to discuss abortion in classrooms.  They also want to make it illegal to strike. 
 

Quote

Ohio Senate Bill 1 was introduced last week and is an obvious anti-union attempt to silence public university faculty union members and limit their bargaining on the job. SB 1, the first bill of the 2025 General Assembly session, would impact 13 Ohio campus unions and roughly 10,000 Ohio union members. We Are Ohio is the coalition that defeated SB5, the 2011 assault on public collective bargaining rights. It would also silence discussions about abortion, making it illegal to discuss in classrooms. Strikes would be illegal Environmental Change discussions would be illegal in class rooms. Environmental classes are at this risk of being eliminated on college campuses throughout the state of Ohio if passed. This would impact our Great Lakes algae situation would get drastically worse- would impact all those who rely on the Great Lakes for their income. It would be just the beginning of silencing the next generation. It would just be the beginning of being able to implement whatever greedy incorporations want. WE OUR A COUNTRY OF DEMOCRACY- NOT Tyranny. Our children deserve the same freedoms & safety that we all had. Ohio needs YOUR help to be our voices, to make it know what lawmakers are doing, and help organize resistance.

 

I also saw that the creator of project 2025 was voted in. 😣

[SoMuchTV]

5 hours ago, lookeyloo said:

My three grands live in a suburb of Tacoma, WA.  They have all gotten fast food, coffee barista, pizza joint summer and after school jobs.  Their co workers are their school friends or they make friends of the co workers.  None of them has ever complained of those things mentioned above.  My grands are very special to me (one graduating law school in June, one a junior in college and one a high school junior) but in the world at large they are just someone's kids.  What is different where they live?  None of us are influential or "know someone".

 

4 hours ago, MostlyContent said:

Your post caught my eye because my 3 grands live so close to yours!  (Whidbey Island)  They aren't yet old enough to seek summer employment so it's nothing I've even thought to ask my daughter about.  It's good to know things sound pretty 'normal' (?) in that area.  

It's that way here, too.  Our lawn care and snow removal is handled by the 14 yr old twins who live in the house across the street, and most teenagers seem to work at fast food places, restaurants (in whatever capacity), their uncle's shop, helping out on a dairy farm......that sort of thing.  I suppose that we have our share of influencer-wannabes etc, but that's not the sort of thing I'd ever know about, I guess.  Social media is not my forte.  🤣

It must depend on where one lives.  ????

 

17 minutes ago, Mollywolly555 said:

My grand nephew at 17 started his own business selling vintage tees and Carhartt clothing online and then at pop-ups. His grandmother, my sister, had been taking him to thrift stores since he was little. He s almost 19 now and goes to community college for business ed too.

Another teen I hired thru Nextdoor to detail my car had his own business doing vehicle cleaning and detailing  he worked hard for 4 hours and my car was gorgeous. 

My neighbor's teen started a lawn service business with a truck and a mower and it had grown since then. 

I guess I'm saying that the internet has opened up new ways of capitalizing on old ways so instead of garage sales, car washes, lawn mowing, the kids are smart enough to be owners in control and  able to reach a wider market.

5 hours ago, lookeyloo said:

My three grands live in a suburb of Tacoma, WA.  They have all gotten fast food, coffee barista, pizza joint summer and after school jobs.  Their co workers are their school friends or they make friends of the co workers.  None of them has ever complained of those things mentioned above.  My grands are very special to me (one graduating law school in June, one a junior in college and one a high school junior) but in the world at large they are just someone's kids.  What is different where they live?  None of us are influential or "know someone".

I know it’s easy to go all “kids these days” but it seems like people who actually know kids are still seeing them doing typical kid jobs. Maybe it depends on where you are or where you’re looking?

[suomi]

He is, as the Brits say, barking mad.

6 February 2025

At the National Prayer Breakfast in Washington, Mr. Trump took a moment to speak of bipartisan comity. Just hours earlier, he torched the federal bureaucracy, the global order, the media and Democrats.

Of all the many forms Donald J. Trump can take, maybe the most perplexing one is Pious Trump.

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/02/06/us/politics/trump-national-prayer-breakfast.html

 

Edited February 7 by suomi

[Yeah No]

12 hours ago, Dimity said:

This was done at least a few times on this thread.  Which, fair enough, has moved fast.  Still we could ask the mods to do a sticky with those bullet points and the Trump supporters will ignore it.

True. Even if they looked at it they're primed by their media to believe that they aren't really accomplishments anyway. Or that Biden didn't do them. Or that they are not the "right kind" of accomplishments.

9 hours ago, Notabug said:

I worked at Burger King when I was in high school back when dinosaurs roamed.  Kids nowadays are not looking for that kind of work.  I'm not a parent, I don't know what they do for spending money, but they ain't picking tomatoes.

I too worked at Burger King when dinosaurs roamed. In my area no kids work at fast food restaurants anymore. I see some working in supermarkets doing stuff like bagging and stocking but that's it. It's a different world now.

7 hours ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

That and making money by playing video games as streamers. That being said, I do know of teens who have difficulty finding work because management does not want to hire teens. Store managers want adults who do not have as many restrictions on their hours and who will not up and quit on you in pursuit of their education. The job is never going to be the #1 priority for a teen, and that is a big turn off for management.

No, not today but back when I was a teen there was a different work ethic. And I hate to say a different level of maturity about some things.

5 hours ago, Dimity said:

At dinner tonight my husband and I were talking about whether the kinds of conversations he and I are having right now were taking place in households in Austria, Poland and Czechoslovakia back in the day.  Somehow I suspect they were.

My husband and I have very recently had that kind of conversation and we suspected they were too. By some.

5 hours ago, dargosmydaddy said:

Back in February 2020, before everything shut down but when everyone was starting to worry, events were getting cancelled, etc., I remember one of my students saying she felt like we were living in the beginning of a disaster movie and she really didn't like it. I am feeling that way now, and I really, really don't like it.

I know just what you mean. I felt that way back in 2020 and do again right now. It feels like there was a rift in the spacetime continuum and we branched off on some kind of horrible dystopian timeline that should never have happened. Even 20 years ago if this movie we're living in right now were made people would have panned it as utterly ridiculous and unrealistic.

1 hour ago, SoMuchTV said:

I know it’s easy to go all “kids these days” but it seems like people who actually know kids are still seeing them doing typical kid jobs. Maybe it depends on where you are or where you’re looking?

I know kids through friends and through their kids' friends and around here none of them have done or are doing typical kid jobs. There has been a trend toward treating teenagers as children which makes them unsuited and unwilling to go out and get these jobs. And I suspect that employers don't see them as suited and willing either. Most of these jobs are done in my area by adults that come from poorer neighborhoods and immigrants.

My Godchild is now 23 years old. She is the youngest person I know about that started working as a teenager - in her case at 17, when she started working at a local dry cleaner. She dropped out of college then got a job working in a supermarket bakery. Now she is working at a Whole Foods bakery. Another person I know of is one of my best friends' daughters who started working Summers as a teen at a local Ben and Jerry's, then after college worked her way up to district manager. She eventually left the company and now at 32 works for a big insurance company. Her brother did roofing in the Summers and his other sister waited tables at a local diner/joint. But they are all in their 30s now. I think it's more rare for the teenagers now to work around here.

[Soapy Goddess]

17 hours ago, bluegirl147 said:

Is Trump really running the country or is it Elon Musk?

Trump's ego won't allow it. Musk was hired to do a job and he's doing it. Billions of dollars wasted for the most ridiculous things like Iraqi Sesame Street.

17 hours ago, Annber03 said:

And we're simply calling out Trump supporters on the lie that the price of eggs was why they couldn't possibly vote for Kamaa -i f they were suppsoedly angry enough to refuse to vote for Democrats because of inflation, they should be equally as furious with Trump. If he has time to push out executive orders to go after transgender people and immigrants, he sure as hell should've had time to tackle the inflation issue that Trump supporters were so insistent he could totally fix. 

And yet he hasn't done that, and instead is throwing us into a trade war that is only going to jack up prices even nmore. 

If you think the price of eggs is why Kamala lost the election, I beg to differ. Besides not being able to put a full sentence together without cracking up, she had no policies to speak of. When asked by Sunny Hostin (the View) what she would do different (a perfect opportunity to TELL US), she said "Nothing"!

Trump is prioritizing. It's only been 3 weeks. Rome wasn't built in a day.

[Soapy Goddess]

16 hours ago, Yeah No said:

We'll never know how JFK would have dealt with it had the public found out about his affairs. AFAIK, Trump has never apologized publicly for his behavior or done any kind of public soul searching to show that he has realized his wrongs and reformed himself like Clinton did. So yeah, let's ask Hillary.

A cheater is a cheater, reformed or not. The fact that you didn't know about JFK doesn't make him a saint. Personally speaking, I don't believe DJT owes ANYONE an apology for his cheating, except his WIFE. And I'm pretty sure she's still in it for the money. And if that works for them, so be it. None of our business.

16 hours ago, Yeah No said:

Meanwhile Biden quietly got tons done but no one except his supporters were paying attention to it or gave him credit for it. It's incredibly unfair and incidentally, contrary to the right's assumptions, the so-called "liberal" media was only making that perception worse by not making a big deal about Biden's accomplishments.

Well, then you can't really blame us for being in the dark and repeating the trope.

And believe me, Trump is running the country. As everyone knows, his ego won't allow anyone else to take credit.

15 hours ago, Notabug said:

Blatantly cheating on their mother and bragging about it in the media is not the act of a loving father who cares about his children.

Oh please. If that were the case, then half of Hollywood men are terrible fathers!

[Yeah No]

5 minutes ago, Soapy Goddess said:

A cheater is a cheater, reformed or not. The fact that you didn't know about JFK doesn't make him a saint. Personally speaking, I don't believe DJT owes ANYONE an apology for his cheating, except his WIFE. And I'm pretty sure she's still in it for the money. And if that works for them, so be it. None of our business.

I didn't say JFK was a saint. He was far from it. I said I don't think the public, especially Republicans would have just accepted his behavior and he would have paid the price for it. Unlike with Trump where he can basically do whatever the F he wants with women and his followers don't even bat an eye or think it's bad enough to see him as anything but someone to admire and trust. It's interesting that you can be so critical of JFK and yet completely hand wave Trump's behavior with women other than his wife and act like it's nobody's business. Imagine if Biden had a history like that with women. Republicans would have been calling for his head on a platter! It just amazes me how Trump supporters don't see the inconsistency in their opinions on this subject. 

[Soapy Goddess]

2 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

I didn't say JFK was a saint. He was far from it. I said I don't think the public, especially Republicans would have just accepted his behavior and he would have paid the price for it. Unlike with Trump where he can basically do whatever the F he wants with women and his followers don't even bat an eye or think it's bad enough to see him as anything but someone to admire and trust. It's interesting that you can be so critical of JFK and yet completely hand wave Trump's behavior with women other than his wife and act like it's nobody's business. Imagine if Biden had a history like that with women. Republicans would have been calling for his head on a platter! It just amazes me how Trump supporters don't see the inconsistency in their opinions on this subject. 

I'm only using JFK as a comparison. I was old enough to hear it all, including the threesome with RFK & Marilyn. The Kennedy's were just as corrupt as any other politician(s). 

At the risk of sounding like a broken record, many of us don't care about his sex life. It has nothing to do with border control, cutting costs, making young girls happy again in their chosen sport, etc. etc. THAT's what he was elected to do! 

[Yeah No]

4 minutes ago, Soapy Goddess said:

I'm only using JFK as a comparison. I was old enough to hear it all, including the threesome with RFK & Marilyn. The Kennedy's were just as corrupt as any other politician(s). 

At the risk of sounding like a broken record, many of us don't care about his sex life. It has nothing to do with border control, cutting costs, making young girls happy again in their chosen sport, etc. etc. THAT's what he was elected to do! 

For the life of me I don't understand women not seeing this man as morally bereft and a misogynist. What has come out of his own mouth is more than enough to find repulsive and insulting as a woman and yet Republican women think it is "irrelevant". How on earth would someone like that be able to do right by women? I don't care what someone wants to do, if they are that corrupt, sexist and piggish in their personal relationships they're not going to be any better by their constituents. They're going to use them for their own gain at their expense in the long run. Because it was never about helping you, it was always about aggrandizing his own ego.

You can't make a deal with the devil and expect that he's going to somehow do right by you. It doesn't work that way. But I suppose this time it'll be different, right? Or you're going to tell me he's honest and true about doing right by the country and his followers. Even if he were, the cockamamie, hair brained, half baked stuff he has tried to do in the past two weeks has shown that he's not even capable of doing right by anyone. He thinks he can run the world like a dictator and a real estate mogul. I am sorry but he is going nuts and is demented with delusions of grandeur at this point. It's truly scary. Thank goodness we still have some sane minds in the government that will call him on it and won't let most of it happen because most of it is illegal and unconstitutional.

[Bliss]

I am a senior Canadian and I've never in my life had the thought, "I hate so-and-so"... until now. I hate what tRump has done to our world - to our sense of peace and humanity. Mr Bliss and I have concluded that he is demonic.

At times, it feels as if we're living in a nightmare... and we don't even have all the threats that are clouding the minds of so many.

As for men putting their hands on you, here's my solution: When I was in my youthful prime, 30ish, I was busy at work making coffee for everyone - my hands were  both full of stuff. My  boss came up behind me and put his hands on my breasts. O M G. This was the 80s, way before the MeToo movement.

The words came out of my mouth, "If you ever do that again, you'll be wearing your balls as earrings." I didn't copyright it, so feel free to use it. Anytime.

[Yeah No]

@Soapy Goddess, my husband was a Trump supporter and voted for him in 2016. He read all his books, admired him as an example of a genius businessman, the whole nine yards. He wanted to believe in him but thanks to his willingness to listen to facts, good common sense and true Christian values (not the corrupt ones of the Christian right) he saw the light about Trump and now comes to me ranting about his crazy behavior, prejudices, narcissism and misogyny. And this from a man who was a boy scout Republican that would rather mug his own mother than turn on the party. But he DID because he has a mind and a heart and doesn't live in a fantasy world that he can't let go. He had to face reality and it hasn't been easy on him. I just wish there were more Republicans out there and others that voted for Trump that could see the light like he did.

Edited February 7 by Yeah No

[Bliss]

Oh, and the eggs? I think the  biggest issue is women's eggs.

Carlos (from Santana) once looked me right in the eyes and said, "It's up to you women to heal our world. The men have made a mess of it." That was about 30 years ago. He was right then and it still applies today.

[Soapy Goddess]

10 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

For the life of me I don't understand women not seeing this man as morally bereft and a misogynist. What has come out of his own mouth is more than enough to find repulsive and insulting as a woman and yet Republican women think it is "irrelevant". How on earth would someone like that be able to do right by women? I don't care what someone wants to do, if they are that corrupt, sexist and piggish in their personal relationships they're not going to be any better by their constituents. They're going to use them for their own gain at their expense in the long run. Because it was never about helping you, it was always about aggrandizing his own ego.

You can't make a deal with the devil and expect that he's going to somehow do right by you. It doesn't work that way. But I suppose this time it'll be different, right? Or you're going to tell me he's honest and true about doing right by the country and his followers. Even if he were, the cockamamie, hair brained, half baked stuff he has tried to do in the past two weeks has shown that he's not even capable of doing right by anyone. He thinks he can run the world like a dictator and a real estate mogul. I am sorry but he is going nuts and is demented with delusions of grandeur at this point. It's truly scary. Thank goodness we still have some sane minds in the government that will call him on it and won't let most of it happen because most of it is illegal and unconstitutional.

Actions speak louder than words. Many of us have known DJT from his early days (pre-Marla). We're really not interested in his personal relationships. Humans aren't perfect...especially in their personal relationships. That has nothing to do with how we treat our family and friends. 

Let's face it, humans tend to prioritize what's most important to them. I don't view DJT as evil because he's piggish in his relationships. And contrary to popular belief (here), he WILL do right by all of us. Did you see all those adorable young women who applauded the fact that they can now compete fair and square in their chosen sport? Give him time...he'll do the right thing.

[tessaray]

29 minutes ago, Soapy Goddess said:

Did you see all those adorable young women who applauded the fact that they can now compete fair and square in their chosen sport?

We've seen him use youngsters like them to fan hate and direct discrimination towards trans women especially and trans folk in general. For years. 

Trump is 78 years old. He's never been interested in doing the right thing before - why would he start now? 

Edited February 7 by tessaray

[tessaray]

1 minute ago, Soapy Goddess said:

Have you been stalking Trump for 78 years?  Do you believe in redemption?  Or would you prefer to remain stagnant in your thoughts?

I do believe in redemption. Does he? In an interview Trump said he didn't have anything to repent (last time around, I'm sure a Google search will turn it up). Hard to redeem someone who doesn't think they need it. 

I don't care one way or the other about Trump the person. I do care about what he and his cronies are doing to the  government.  It wasn't perfect but it mostly worked. I don't see Musk rooting around Treasury as a good thing.  I don't see alienating Canada, Mexico, Denmark and Panama as good things. My 401k doesn't see Trump as a good thing. 

Just keeping up with the chaos is exhausting. 

[Dimity]

I actually foolishly thought, given his age, that perhaps he would stop focusing on revenge and lining his own pockets and surprise us all by turning into a decent person concerned with leaving a legacy to be proud of.  I was so very, very wrong.

[bluegirl147]

29 minutes ago, Dimity said:

I actually foolishly thought, given his age, that perhaps he would stop focusing on revenge and lining his own pockets and surprise us all by turning into a decent person concerned with leaving a legacy to be proud of.  I was so very, very wrong.

You can't teach an old dog new tricks.  Trump is who he is.  He is never going to change. And why would he?  His whole life he has gotten away with things that would have destroyed other people. 

[Dimity]

1 minute ago, bluegirl147 said:

You can't teach an old dog new tricks.  Trump is who he is.  He is never going to change. And why would he?  His whole life he has gotten away with things that would have destroyed other people. 

True. This is all that gives me hope for the future. Only Trump gets away with being Trump.

[Cementhead]

6 hours ago, Soapy Goddess said:

Trump is prioritizing. It's only been 3 weeks. Rome wasn't built in a day.

Rome is falling. 

 

[bluegirl147]

9 minutes ago, Cementhead said:

Rome is falling. 

 

It's true and the quote "The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to nothing" seems appropriate.

But as i said in an earlier post this won't last.  It will suck for however long it lasts but there is no fucking way we can let these motherfuckers win.  We beat the Nazis in Europe so if we can't beat them in our own country shame on us.

[PRgal]

On the trans issue:  I went to school with someone who transitioned to male as an adult.  I’m pretty sure he’d be uncomfortable playing on a women’s team or be forced to use the women’s bathroom. 

Edited February 7 by PRgal

[Yeah No]

4 hours ago, Soapy Goddess said:

Actions speak louder than words. Many of us have known DJT from his early days (pre-Marla). We're really not interested in his personal relationships. Humans aren't perfect...especially in their personal relationships. That has nothing to do with how we treat our family and friends. 

Let's face it, humans tend to prioritize what's most important to them. I don't view DJT as evil because he's piggish in his relationships. And contrary to popular belief (here), he WILL do right by all of us. Did you see all those adorable young women who applauded the fact that they can now compete fair and square in their chosen sport? Give him time...he'll do the right thing.

It's not even just his personal relationships but his past record of unethical and dishonest, corrupt business behavior, of which New Yorkers like me go way back with, and many more selfish and narcissistic things about him that don't add up to someone that is capable of truly helping anyone unless there's something in it for him, and even then that's questionable. And his record as president is more of the same. How any of the Christian right thinks he's a true pro-lifer is beyond me - this man couldn't care less about unborn babies, he just wants to stick it to Democrats and socially liberal people in general and continue to have the backing of people that are easy to dupe. And if women have to suffer because of that, he has zero conscience about it.

He's always working off this massive grudge against Democrats because those are the people he felt rejected by way back when, incidentally for being a corrupt, piggish, morally bereft person that screwed people in the back for his own gain. They didn't reject him for being a "Republican" (he was even a Democrat for a while). They rejected him because they knew he had no scruples and knifed people in the back for his own gain.

Unfortunately where leaders are concerned, they need to have ideals and ethics. You can't just ignore that dimension and think they're going to do right by anyone. Not everything is transactional. It has to come out of true values not just "you scratch my back and I scratch yours". That's dangerous, because there is no honor among corrupt people with no real ideals (and thieves, BTW). They can turn their back on your in a hot minute if cornered or it benefits them. As soon as Trump doesn't need you, he drops you like a hot potato.

I don't know how any Trump supporters can sleep at night when their kids can be looking at this guy as some kind of behavioral role model. Do they tell their kids not to be like him but he's still doing right for the country anyway? How does that add up? Incidentally, as a person who looks at things through not only an ethical but a psychological lens, young and impressionable minds can see what he does and how nasty he is in general and think it's OK because if the president does it, it has to be OK, right? Either that or the hypocrisy of their elders is not lost on them and they become cynical. So it's no wonder our society continues to go down the tubes. This guy isn't going to take anyone back to some kind of "promised land" - in fact, just the opposite, he's leading us straight into HELL.

And don't tell me that Biden, Harris and all the other Democrats are just as bad because they are not anywhere near as corrupt and immoral as this guy. In many cases, in the final analysis it's just the opposite and they are holding onto true ideals and trying to live them. Imperfectly for sure, but at least they have that moral foundation to work from. I will stake my stellar reputation as a good judge of human character on that. I don't listen to the media. I judge people based on my own standards based on known facts and my own eyes, not what people say about them. Yeah, actions DO speak louder than words if you don't deny what you see and you know the difference between a charlatan and an idealist.

[tres bien]

The past three weeks have been a huge ball of schmuckery

 

[bluegirl147]

49 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

He's always working off this massive grudge against Democrats because those are the people he felt rejected by way back when, incidentally for being a corrupt, piggish, morally bereft person that screwed people in the back for his own gain. They didn't reject him for being a "Republican" (he was even a Democrat for a while). They rejected him because they knew he had no scruples and knifed people in the back for his own gain.

Trump has spent most of his adult life holding grudges against anyone who didn't do what he said or didn't  show him the respect he thought he deserved.  He can't get over anything he considers a slight.  He still complains about the 2020 election being "stolen" from him.  I think the anger and resentment he feels brings him more pleasure than anything else.  

 

[tres bien]

He still “insults” President Obama by him using his middle name because he felt mocked at the WH Correspondents dinner in 2012

His crazy MAGAs in house want to change the constitution so he can for a third term. Well so can President Obama but President Obama isn’t a megalomaniac 

Edited February 7 by tres bien

[fastiller]

58 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

It's not even just his personal relationships but his past record of unethical and dishonest, corrupt business behavior, of which New Yorkers like me go way back with, and many more selfish and narcissistic things about him that don't add up to someone that is capable of truly helping anyone unless there's something in it for him, and even then that's questionable. And his record as president is more of the same. How any of the Christian right thinks he's a true pro-lifer is beyond me - this man couldn't care less about unborn babies, he just wants to stick it to Democrats and socially liberal people in general and continue to have the backing of people that are easy to dupe. And if women have to suffer because of that, he has zero conscience about it.

Same.  The trump name (father & son / family / company) has been shit for decades in NYC.  I work in construction in NYC and know at least four separate entities who weren't paid for their supplies or labor by the guy currently in the WH.  Further,  I've got two words: CONSENT DECREE.

 

Woody wrote this about Fred, but it could just as easily apply to  Donald.

 

[Dimity]