S02.E06: Where Is He?

[AnimeMania]

Galadriel considers a proposition. Elendil faces judgment. The Stranger finds himself at a crossroads. Sauron’s plans bear fruit.

Premiere Date: September 19, 2024   Prime Video    

[Grimnar]

Well, I suppose that for Rhun and Númenor storylines writers took inspiration from Empire strikes back and Clash of Titans.

Rhun storyline is stalling as there is probably not enough story. Yoda ... I mean Bombadil gave some lectures to "Gandalf" and of course he will choose Nori and will pass test for his staff. I don't think that Bombadil is supposed to be teacher for heroes, at least from book he didn't come as this person.

Númenor was kind of meh. They are now starting probably romance between Miriel and Elendil. Does it mean that Miriel is queen now and Pharazon was deposed when people started chanting her name? I think that the Valar judgment as concept didn't make any sense and writers should come with something else. And palantir doesn't show possible future.

Adar has great information(better than scouts in Eregion) because he know that there are 3 elven rings and that Lindon was healed. Also he suspected that Halbrand was Sauron but for some reason didn't kill him because reasons. And orcs are no longer suffering under sun?

Dwarves are afraid of bats. I wonder if the carts with gold were taxes or dwarves already mined gold and made some goods from it. Balrog in fire had subtlety of sledgehammer as future fate of Khazad-dum.

Why it looks like that Sauron is taking advantage of person with dementia? Sauron is teleporting between Khazad-dum and Eregion. In middle of square is dead soldier but Sauron ordered to bury him not to cause panic because certainly not many elves didn't see him. Elves don't notice army and siege engines till they are attacked. And for some reason we spend more time with creating nine rings than with three and seven combined.

I have to say that writting is still biggest weakness which make this show just average fantasy show(as adaptation of Tolkien's work I see it as below average at best).

[Msample]

Durin’s wife can summon bats ? WTF ?

 

Just once I’d like to see a director NOT use catapults shooting flaming shot in a siege .

 

Am I the only one who feels sorry for the Stranger having to wear what looks like the itchiest bathrobe every made ?

 

Celebrimbor’s characterization continues to piss me off. 

 

[Affogato]

I think they are doing a good job, or Celebrimbor’s actor is doing a good job, of showing how Sauron has made him doubt his abilities. Sauron isn’t only triangulsting his employees, he is subtly demeaning Celebrimbor , making him afraid to do anything for himself. It is a masterful show of covert abusiveness. 
 

Go Valar!  And your Valiant beast! 

[susannot]

Fantastic scene with Miriel saved by the Valar.  What do you think now, Al-Pharazon?

[quarks]

1. Add me to the chorus of people here going, wait, bats? Dwarves are afraid of bats?  These dwarves have been living in caves - elaborate caves, but caves - for thousands of years and still have a bat problem? 

I can't even justify this by saying that bats in Middle-Earth are evil bats under Sauron's control, since these bats were clearly under Disa's control - a control she says was given to her by Aule, something I think we're meant to believe. So...the dwarves are scared of good bats?

While I'm complaining about this, Durin and Disa are - at least in theory - meant to be intelligent, relatively sensible people, right? And yet they are planning on halting milthil and other mining with just an axe and some bats?

I hope there's more to this.

2. Love Sauron spending all that time being all diplomatic and discussing trade solutions, then realizing that he maybe - just maybe - was a touch too successful with his ring plan, and just going ahead and stealing the mithril  or making mithril out of his own blood or both anyway. And doing that while also somehow preventing the Elves of Eregion from panicking/noticing that hey, there's an army out there with flaming things. 

He's very good at being evil. Full credit for that.

3. Celebrimbor badly needs therapy.

4. Loved that final Sauron/Celebrimbor conversation happening right next to the statue of Earendil. 

5. Not loving this Poppy/Nobody romance. It's Nobody, Poppy, not you. Again, I realize that Poppy hasn't exactly had the chance to meet too many other partners, but still, I feel her standards should be higher. Surely this Stoor village has other potential partners, all living over graveyards?

6. I think I liked Tom Bombadil more in his previous appearance, where he was more of a passive guide. But, still, Tom Bombadil!

7. Was Arondir only in this episode to remind us that he's still on the show? Because it felt like he was only in this episode to remind us that he's still on the show.

8. Still not working for me: Earien's character. I think the show is trying to go for "still has complicated feelings for her father," but what I'm seeing is a woman who has switched sides, knows she's switched sides, apparently genuinely thinks her father is wrong here, and yet is trying to save him - without seeing any of the complicated feelings that at least in theory should be going on here. As it is I kinda half wondered if she had brought Miriel in to try to collect evidence against both Erendil and Miriel - it would have been as convincing as what we saw on screen.

9. That said, Miriel deciding to face the test of the Valar, followed by the Valar being nicely overdramatic with the timing? Kinda awesome. 

Mild book spoilers:

Spoiler

I get why they went with "Sea-Monster" instead of trying to show Ulmo, Osse or Uinen on screen, and I also get why Ulmo, Osse and Uinen might find it more convenient to just leave a sea-monster around patrolling things, so that they could focus on doing stuff like, say, conveniently tipping over little rowboats to convince Cirdan to keep the Three Rings and thus ensure that Elves Could Remain in the Plot, but....I dunno. I kinda felt that all three of them would have been more likely to use a weather event to make their judgements clear.

Then again they were trying to communicate to the same people that couldn't distinguish between approving eagle and irritated eagle, so...maybe not.

 

10. And even if the Poppy/Nobody romance is kinda making me think that the show should avoid romance for the rest of its run (not that it will, hi, Isildur, and presumably some other upcoming pairings), I'm now kinda onboard for an Elendil/Miriel romance now. Kinda.

Edited September 20 by quarks

[Affogato]

I liked the exchange between Galadriel and Adar. He wanted children and Galadriel wanted an army. As they speak Celebrimbor wanted to create something wonderful and be remembered. a history of abuse and manipulation by Sauron. He doesn’t just buy an ice cream cone. He gets you to buy one to give to an orphan child and then poisons the ice cream and tells you the child wouldn’t have died if you hadn’t given them ice cream. 
 

Spoiler

Disa really should have a beard and pants and I’m disappointed.

The bat thing, though, well it is clear the dwarven women have their ways.  Anyone would retreat before a herd of stampeding bats. They may bite as well. It doesn’t mean they are terrified of bats in general. 
 

I’m not sure why the stranger needed to make that choice. Maybe Tom is just trying to go along with his need for mentoring. 
 

Arondir was there to remind us he is still around (maybe in his contract?)?but also, I think, to show the Orcs aren’t all behind the war on Sauron. 

[KatWay]

two seasons in and I'm still like...why is the Stranger there. His storyline drags. The show generally suffers from very uneven plotlines and timings. Some storylines have too much going on for the time frame (Numenor, the rings corrupting the dwarves) and others not enough (Stranger, Arondir/Isildur).

the actress who plays Galadriel does have great chemistry with basically anyone she shares a scene with.

[Affogato]

The monster attacks the boat halbrand is on. Apparently they are a judgmental monster in more ways than one. I bet they also attack human boats the go too near the blessed lands. 

[Aulty]

3 hours ago, KatWay said:

two seasons in and I'm still like...why is the Stranger there. His storyline drags. The show generally suffers from very uneven plotlines and timings. Some storylines have too much going on for the time frame (Numenor, the rings corrupting the dwarves) and others not enough (Stranger, Arondir/Isildur).

With all those disjpint storylines and characters getting only a couple of scenes every other episode this show would benefit from a different release schedule.

There are shows that need spacing out with a one episode per week release. RoP imho would be a better watch if there were two big drops. With one episode per week there is time to look for the Easter eggs, but also to get annoyed with the bigger picture stuff they get wrong.

[IndiaCat]

Does it strike anyone else that the jewels on the rings are ridiculously large?  A very minor issue but I can’t help thinking that they’d be banging into everything.

[astrohip]

17 hours ago, quarks said:

Love Sauron spending all that time being all diplomatic and discussing trade solutions, then realizing that he maybe - just maybe - was a touch too successful with his ring plan, and just going ahead and stealing the mithril  or making mithril out of his own blood or both anyway. And doing that while also somehow preventing the Elves of Eregion from panicking/noticing that hey, there's an army out there with flaming things. 

I got the impression it was only Celebrimbor who was tricked into seeing Serenity Now. Sauron/Annatar made him see calm, so he would go back to work. In reality, the city was in panic.

[thuganomics85]

I'm guessing Sauron has been somehow been playing enough mind games with Celebrimbor that he's just become completely erratic now.  I know the final scene of him seeing a tranquil city was all part of it, but I'm also guessing the whole bit where he forgot Mirdania's name and couldn't find his hammer in front of him was also hinting that Sauron's been doing this for a while.  Would explain a lot going with him, thankfully.

Yeah, it's really hard to buy Earien "No, dad!" panic act after everything she's done.  She never struck me as someone that naive, so it doesn't feel earned that she would be so concerned and upset that her dad might be executed.  At last, it ends up not mattering as Miriel takes his place at the last minute and the giant sea worm deems her worthy of being spared.  Yeah, the political drama is far from over!  And go figure: after using the elf orb as the main reasons Miriel isn't worthy to lead, Pharazon ends up using it himself to get an edge.  Hypocrite!

Poor Durin and Disa.  The only sane dwarves in this mind: or at least the only two willing to actually stand up to the king.

It's pretty obvious that "Gandalf" will end up choosing to save Nori/Poppy over his destiny.

New Adar actor is still mainly good, but I still kept thinking how much better the scenes could have been with Joseph Mawle.

I wonder if we'll get an actual battle next week or will we do one of those classic "Cut to the aftermath" scenes instead.

[quarks]

2 hours ago, astrohip said:

I got the impression it was only Celebrimbor who was tricked into seeing Serenity Now. Sauron/Annatar made him see calm, so he would go back to work. In reality, the city was in panic.

It's not just Celebrimbor. I'm talking about earlier scenes/episodes, where it's fairly clear that an evil army is approaching - Elrond and the gang see it; Sauron sees it; and even people in Lindon and Khazad-dum seem to be aware of it.

But although the people of Eregion appear to be seeing something, they all seem remarkably calm right up until the last few scenes. I figured either they were like, eh, after Gondolin and the other things we've seen, this is nothing, or Sauron was casting illusions/doing something with their minds. Not up to the level of the Celebrimbor stuff, but something. 

[peridot]

I wasn't as frustrated with this episode, I enjoyed it.  I was just wondering why Elendil didn't tell his daughter what really happened and why her friend was killed.  The stoic warrior thing was a bit annoying.

Sauron looks completely evil in his elf form.  I jumped when he appeared in Khazad-dum and when he slammed the window on Celebrimbor.  I was glad he defied Sauron about going outside, but damn at that illusion!  That's some insidious stuff.

They had some good special effects this episode.  I hated the episode ended there!

[Phillygurl]

My favorite storylines in order are

1) Anything with Khazad Dum. I love the music they play anytime we are there

2) Numenor. I actually buy Elendil and Muriel more than any other pairing save Disa and Duran

3) Nori/Poppy/Stranger. The storyline is weird but I could literally watch a Poppy and Nori go on adventures spin off and be totally content.

The elves are annoying to me because they seem so arrogant. They keep making silly mistakes and yet they're the superior race???

Sauron, I just don't like the blond to be honest. And his manipulation of people gives narcissistic abuse which is hard for me to watch.

Adar as the good baddie... I'm not buying it and I can't/won't root for him.

All in all, I do feel like it Is moving forward at enough of a clip for me to find enjoyable.

[wanderingstar]

I watched this episode with my sister, and when Miriel came back out of the water, my sister yelled "I'm back bitches!" at the TV.

I'm into the Elendile/Miriel relationship - both their friendship and the potential for more that the show is hinting at. I do worry, though, that with the pacing of this show, they won't even kiss until season 4-lol

I do not know how Durin and Disa are going to prevent his father from mining for more mitrhil. They seem to be the only ones challenging him. Are they going to try to win other dwarves over to their side?

New Adar is growing on me. 

While I'm enjoying this season, I realized I'd prefer more episodes per season if the episodes were shorter (the standard 45 minutes). They're currently trying to cram in different stories, which is making the episodes longer, while still not giving equal attention to all the stories.

[astrohip]

23 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

New Adar actor is still mainly good, but I still kept thinking how much better the scenes could have been with Joseph Mawle.

💯

[Grimnar]

On 9/21/2024 at 1:02 AM, quarks said:

It's not just Celebrimbor. I'm talking about earlier scenes/episodes, where it's fairly clear that an evil army is approaching - Elrond and the gang see it; Sauron sees it; and even people in Lindon and Khazad-dum seem to be aware of it.

But although the people of Eregion appear to be seeing something, they all seem remarkably calm right up until the last few scenes. I figured either they were like, eh, after Gondolin and the other things we've seen, this is nothing, or Sauron was casting illusions/doing something with their minds. Not up to the level of the Celebrimbor stuff, but something. 

I don't think that Sauron is creating illusions for all elves in the city. If he would be that powerful where he can much control whole city/region with his magic, it would kind of undermind his initial deception of Celebrimbor, because it wouldn't be due to him being deceiver but more about him being strong in magic.

On other hand I am little confused about Númenor and their faith in Valar. So far I got impression that Pharazon and king's men abonded their faith in Valar. But Pharazon is crowned because they interpreted eagle as Valar's blessing for Pharazon. Then they demolish Nienor's shrine. Then they came with trial where Valar are supposed to decide if Elendil(Miriel) is guilty. It is supposed to be mock trial(I assume that they thought that Elendil will be just killed by sea monster and Valar are not involved) but when Miriel survive it, they proclaimed her queen based on Valar's will.

One small detail, I wonder if casual viewer think that Ar mean king and Tar mean queen or if they know that one is in Númenor's language and second is in elvish but meaning is same.

 

[Affogato]

2 hours ago, Grimnar said:

I don't think that Sauron is creating illusions for all elves in the city. If he would be that powerful where he can much control whole city/region with his magic, it would kind of undermind his initial deception of Celebrimbor, because it wouldn't be due to him being deceiver but more about him being strong in magic.

On other hand I am little confused about Númenor and their faith in Valar. So far I got impression that Pharazon and king's men abonded their faith in Valar. But Pharazon is crowned because they interpreted eagle as Valar's blessing for Pharazon. Then they demolish Nienor's shrine. Then they came with trial where Valar are supposed to decide if Elendil(Miriel) is guilty. It is supposed to be mock trial(I assume that they thought that Elendil will be just killed by sea monster and Valar are not involved) but when Miriel survive it, they proclaimed her queen based on Valar's will.

One small detail, I wonder if casual viewer think that Ar mean king and Tar mean queen or if they know that one is in Númenor's language and second is in elvish but meaning is same.

 

Spoiler

I don’t know if this is a spoiler. I assume Pharzon’s faction is angry at the Valar and defies the Valar. But like a child, or children, who feel rejected for a favored sibling (elves) they feel all pouty and like no one, the Valar, cares what they do.  See, they will challenge mom and dad by breaking their things and staying out late.

The common folk, however, still revere the Valar.

 

[Grimnar]

1 minute ago, Affogato said:

  Hide contents

I don’t know if this is a spoiler. I assume Pharzon’s faction is angry at the Valar and defies the Valar. But like a child, or children, who feel rejected for a favored sibling (elves) they feel all pouty and like no one, the Valar, cares what they do.  See, they will challenge mom and dad by breaking their things and staying out late.

The common folk, however, still revere the Valar.

 

I will reply in spoiler part

 

Spoiler

Problem is that so far, we don't see any reason why Pharazon's faction would dislike Valar. There was brief moment where Pharazon hinted that he would like immortality but beside that, no other reason that they would envy elves and resent due to that Valar. Also faithful are presented as clear minority, not that only elite resent Valar/elves.

 

[Affogato]

1 minute ago, Grimnar said:

I will reply in spoiler part

 

  Hide contents

Problem is that so far, we don't see any reason why Pharazon's faction would dislike Valar. There was brief moment where Pharazon hinted that he would like immortality but beside that, no other reason that they would envy elves and resent due to that Valar. Also faithful are presented as clear minority, not that only elite resent Valar/elves.

 

Maybe. They haven’t developed the Numenoreans well. 
 

Spoiler

My guess is the faithful may be more numerous but there is oppression. Pharazon controls the army.
 

yes, I am reading between the lines. Maybe when Halbrand appears he will spur Pharazon to make what is happening more obvious.  

 

[Affogato]

2 hours ago, Grimnar said:

I will reply in spoiler part

 

  Reveal spoiler

Problem is that so far, we don't see any reason why Pharazon's faction would dislike Valar. There was brief moment where Pharazon hinted that he would like immortality but beside that, no other reason that they would envy elves and resent due to that Valar. Also faithful are presented as clear minority, not that only elite resent Valar/elves.

 

I think the shoert form is we are to assume the faithful

Spoiler

Are analogues for Jewish people in Germany, possibly earlyish, but LOTR is drawn in part from that history. 

 

[Grimnar]

8 minutes ago, Affogato said:

I think the shoert form is we are to assume the faithful

  Hide contents

Are analogues for Jewish people in Germany, possibly earlyish, but LOTR is drawn in part from that history. 

 

I would say that Númenor schism between faithful and Pharazon's group is not depicted very well in the show. They will probably spend more time on it in next season but so far it is not exactly clear what is supposed to be general feeling of Númenor regarding Valar.

[dkb]

I enjoyed this episode - so far every episode this season better than the last. Hopefully it keeps up for the last two.

I can kinda see what this show is trying to do big picture but it still lacks in execution. They need to streamline the stories alittle more and be more in your face with time passing.

Also Elrond better have a lot of screen time next episode seeing as he was missing in the last two basically. 

Galadriel, girl, gave up the info about the rings pretty fast, but she's not wrong with the idea that in the end Adar is providing Sauron the army he wants by bringing his children to him. 

That one particular orc, was definitely listening to Galadriel and Adar's conversation, and did not like Adar's dismissal of what Galadriel was saying. Are the Orc's going to turn on Adar by the last episode?

Pretty sure Gandalf will pick saving Nori/Poppy and therefore fulfill his destiny, 2 for 1. 

Also I will say that listening to the RingerVerse podcast House of R, and The Fellowship of The Fans, and Nerd of the Rings on YouTube have really helped me understand some things overall. I only watched and read The Hobbit and LoTR, and have no knowledge of the other era's of Middle Earth.

They call out stuff they don't like, but also are not just straight up hating everything, while providing lots of knowledge about this world.

Edited September 22 by dkb
corrected name of youtube channel

[quarks]

4 hours ago, Grimnar said:

On other hand I am little confused about Númenor and their faith in Valar. So far I got impression that Pharazon and king's men abonded their faith in Valar. But Pharazon is crowned because they interpreted eagle as Valar's blessing for Pharazon. Then they demolish Nienor's shrine. Then they came with trial where Valar are supposed to decide if Elendil(Miriel) is guilty. It is supposed to be mock trial(I assume that they thought that Elendil will be just killed by sea monster and Valar are not involved) but when Miriel survive it, they proclaimed her queen based on Valar's will.

One small detail, I wonder if casual viewer think that Ar mean king and Tar mean queen or if they know that one is in Númenor's language and second is in elvish but meaning is same.

 

 

The show called the previous now dead king "Tar," but I have no idea if casual viewers noticed this point.

Regarding the name of the shrine: I thought that was meant to be a shrine to Nienna, but after I thought about it, I think your suggestion of Nienor also works as an indication of just how mixed up current beliefs are, and how mixed up the myths have gotten. I like it.

Agreed that the show hasn't done a great job of showing/clarifying what the Numenoreans - any of the Numenoreans - feel about the Valar. Miriel as probably the most prominent example - she's one of the Faithful, yes, but she often doesn't seem to be following their faith and tenets. She didn't show up to the ceremony at the shrine, for instance. Then we have Elendil, who apparently stopped believing at one point, and is now a believer again, and Pharazon, who apparently is not a believer but is happy to make use of their beliefs. 

There's also the issue that back in the first season, the Faithful were apparently so unpopular that Miriel and Elendil initially felt they could only speak about them in coded language, but in this season, we have Belzager talking about them in open court - disparagingly, but still - and agreeing to have a Faithful ceremony as a trial for Elendil and Miriel.

So my guess is - and I have to stress is that this is just a guess - that we are meant to figure out that the Faithful are a small but quiet group, with a few members at court, with coded ways to identify each other, and that the majority of the Numenoreans are skeptical to hostile towards the Valar. The Sea Monster trial didn't have all that many witnesses, after all, and although at least some of that is thanks to production issues, I think we can also assume that not all that many Numenoreans believe in the Valar. I think.

 

[Glade]

I wish this show would stop presenting mangled, inverted quotes from the LOTR films.  It's not clever. 

Edited September 23 by Glade

[Grimnar]

16 hours ago, quarks said:

 

The show called the previous now dead king "Tar," but I have no idea if casual viewers noticed this point.

Regarding the name of the shrine: I thought that was meant to be a shrine to Nienna, but after I thought about it, I think your suggestion of Nienor also works as an indication of just how mixed up current beliefs are, and how mixed up the myths have gotten. I like it.

Agreed that the show hasn't done a great job of showing/clarifying what the Numenoreans - any of the Numenoreans - feel about the Valar. Miriel as probably the most prominent example - she's one of the Faithful, yes, but she often doesn't seem to be following their faith and tenets. She didn't show up to the ceremony at the shrine, for instance. Then we have Elendil, who apparently stopped believing at one point, and is now a believer again, and Pharazon, who apparently is not a believer but is happy to make use of their beliefs. 

There's also the issue that back in the first season, the Faithful were apparently so unpopular that Miriel and Elendil initially felt they could only speak about them in coded language, but in this season, we have Belzager talking about them in open court - disparagingly, but still - and agreeing to have a Faithful ceremony as a trial for Elendil and Miriel.

So my guess is - and I have to stress is that this is just a guess - that we are meant to figure out that the Faithful are a small but quiet group, with a few members at court, with coded ways to identify each other, and that the majority of the Numenoreans are skeptical to hostile towards the Valar. The Sea Monster trial didn't have all that many witnesses, after all, and although at least some of that is thanks to production issues, I think we can also assume that not all that many Numenoreans believe in the Valar. I think.

 

My bad, I meant Nienna but wrote Nienor. Thanks for correcting.

About the not many witnesses during trial, I think this is one of the issues of the show. We have elven cities, Númenor, Southland village, etc but every time it seems that there are 20-30 people max, which makes everything small. At some places it makes sense or can be explained like Harfoots tribe or faithful in shrine on Númenor but during coronation, Adar's army, elves in Lindon during healing of tree, etc it doesn't make sense to have present only 30 people.

Edited September 23 by Grimnar

[Affogato]

On 9/22/2024 at 11:52 AM, Grimnar said:

I would say that Númenor schism between faithful and Pharazon's group is not depicted very well in the show. They will probably spend more time on it in next season but so far it is not exactly clear what is supposed to be general feeling of Númenor regarding Valar.

I agree, but we did spend time wandering around Numenor a few years ago. 

Edited September 23 by Affogato

[tv-talk]

On 9/20/2024 at 5:12 PM, thuganomics85 said:

New Adar actor is still mainly good, but I still kept thinking how much better the scenes could have been with Joseph Mawle.

I wonder if we'll get an actual battle next week or will we do one of those classic "Cut to the aftermath" scenes instead.

I'm finding Adar the best character in the show, consistently more sympathetic than Galadriel who has her psychopath moments. However they made Adar go from fairly brilliant in his understanding of exactly how Sauron worked and how he could manipulate anyone to instantly falling full bore into Sauron's trap. Which will obviously end up with Adar dead and his army under Sauron's control.

We better get a big battle! This show draaaaags a lot. So many plotlines to follow, so much talking, scant action for long periods. We need a knock down, drag out battle that had better involve mass destruction by way of Hill Trolls.

Regardless of how he is being portrayed and used, it just makes me happy Tom Bombadil has finally made it from book to screen- and as Gandalf's mentor no less.  

[Camera One]

I found this episode disappointing.  Stuff was happening, but I hardly felt any emotion and I found it hard to root for any of the characters, who were either being foolish, stupid or gullible.

This show made the Numenorians seem like fickle idiots.  First, the witch hunt mob mentality at Elendil's "trial".  They were fine with Pharazon acting like an intolerant dictator?   But then later, totally forgetting that dumb Eagle and switching to Team Miriel simply because she survived the sea monster.  

I wanted to cheer on Elendil, if he pretended to bow down to Pharazon but worked behind the scenes to help Miriel, but nope.  He offered himself on a silver platter.  They never established his daughter ever cared about him, so it was impossible to feel sad in their scene together.  Why did she have so much trust in Pharazon, anyway?  It wasn't like she knew him that well either.

The Dwarf king turning into a gold hungry tyrant wasn't subtle at all, and just happened really fast.  I wanted to cheer on Disa and Durin the Younger, but again, their methods were simplistic.  She even suggested lying on the path to one of the tunnels?  Really? Surely, some of the dwarves would have been grumbling about the King's unreasonable demands... Durin the Younger couldn't get some of them on his side?  The older King has always been an antagonist for his son, so I couldn't even feel sad for Durin the Younger.

How did Halbrand get his hands on mithril when he visited?  Just using his magical influencer powers?

The Elves in Eregion running in panic looked like any medieval town of humans under siege.  Weren't Elves supposed to be more calm or methodical?  Never mind they only had one group of scouts out and they all died apparently.  

How did Galadriel know for sure Halbrand was in Eregion forging rings?  And if Adar suspected Halbrand was Sauron, why did he let him go?  I thought the first conversation between Adar and Galadriel and the fact they had in common Sauron's "seduction" of them was sort of interesting, but it basically devolved into Galadriel being gullible and oversharing.  And now Adar will be gullible as well.  Even the daddy orc guy side-eyed him.  How did Adar know about the 3 elven rings, anyway?

If Sauron had that much control over Celebrimbor (making him lose his memory of that female assistant's name?), why not just force him to forge the rings?  Only giving a single elf a speaking role in the workshop weakened this whole subplot.  Surely, some of the other elves would have worked with Celebrimbor for years, and would have tried to get through to him.  Instead, Eregion and Celebrimbor's workshop was simply bunch of extras + female assistant elf + Celebrimbor + Sauron.

Tom Bombadil said things that were seemingly profound but sounded like blah blah blah.  Is he going to fall and hit his head later, and that's why he eventually no longer cared about the dangers of Sauron by the Third Age?

Overall, it felt like season 2 episode 6 of "Rings of Power" was just checking off boxes leading up to everything falling into place for Sauron, but it just left me cold. 

Edited September 25 by Camera One

[Haleth]

4 hours ago, Camera One said:

just checking off boxes leading up to everything falling into place for Sauron, but it just left me cold. 

Bingo.  Way too much going on so we get brief check ins that afford no emotional connection to the characters.  I really want to like Elendil but he's too two dimensional for me to really care.  There's a concept of a good show on Numenor, I wish the writers had nixed some of the other storylines to focus more on this one.  (Speaking of, where is Isildur?)

On 9/23/2024 at 1:29 AM, Glade said:

I wish this show would stop presenting mangled, inverted quotes from the LOTR films.  It's not clever. 

It's lazy.  The writers can't come up with enough engaging original dialog so they borrow from the movies, hoping the familiarity of the words will distract from how badly written the conversations are.  It's kind of insulting.

I really, really want to like this show.  It is stunningly beautiful to see and hear.  (I don't mind the musical themes being borrowed from the movies.)  I don't know how it could be improved at this point, I'm sure the next three years have already been mapped out.  Yeah, I'll watch, but it's such a disappointment.

[Camera One]

On 9/22/2024 at 4:46 PM, dkb said:

Also I will say that listening to the RingerVerse podcast House of R, and The Fellowship of The Fans, and Nerd of the Rings on YouTube have really helped me understand some things overall. I only watched and read The Hobbit and LoTR, and have no knowledge of the other era's of Middle Earth.

They call out stuff they don't like, but also are not just straight up hating everything, while providing lots of knowledge about this world.

I end up deriving more enjoyment from watching/listening to reviews than the series itself.  Since I haven't read "The Silmarillion", I don't know a lot about the Second Age and I enjoy learning more about Tolkien's source material.  For example, I didn't realize that Pharazon was friends with Elendil's father.  I usually listen to Nerd of the Rings, Men of the West and The One Ring channels.  I'll check out some of the ones you mentioned after the season ends.

I've only watched the Peter Jackson movies twice (I've read LoTR and the Hobbit twice as well), so I also often don't realize when lines are lifted directly from those.  It reminds me how important delivery and context is... a lot of the dialogue and lines from the films had an impact on me, but on this show, the same lines almost always end up sounding trite/boring or falling flat.  Maybe it's also because when you don't feel a connection with the characters, it's hard to find anything they say genuine or meaningful.

[JustHereForFood]

I liked the Miriel and Elendil scenes and I am a bit torn about them -  I have a weakness for ships that are like: a queen/strong female leader + her bodyguard/captain of guards who is devoted to her. But just recently I have been thinking that it would be nice to see a couple like that that stayed completely platonic and here I thought that we got just that with these two characters. But now I am kind of not opposed to see them probably becoming romantically involved either, because it is working for me. Just a few more times of Elendil calling her "my Queen" and I will be probably all into it... ehm. What I mean is, I liked this episode more then the previous ones and it seems that it is finally picking some pace.

Apparently Pharazon and his group didn't read the same guides how to usurp power that the Lannisters did, they should have blackmailed Elendil with his daughter's life if they wanted him to admit to treason and swear loyalty to them.

 

On 9/21/2024 at 2:06 AM, Phillygurl said:

Adar as the good baddie... I'm not buying it and I can't/won't root for him.

I hate him and I hate his "my children" bullshit. "We are just poor orcs who want to live in peace after we kill a few more people and we want to have our own land, uwu." Yeah, the land that you destroyed and made inhospitable to normal humans last season. Spare me, please.