S01.E08: The Beginning

[paulvdb]

Quote

War...

Premiere date: April 10, 2024

[Cloudly]

… war never changes. 
 

Can’t wait for season 2!

They did a smashing job of balancing comedy and drama, lore and fresh stuff, gaming with (sort of) reality. 
 

Maybe it all came together a little too neatly in the end. A small cast of like 6 characters, in on all the action, some even since before the end of the world. 
 

I hope we see even more of The Ghoul next season. 
 

I rarely do rewatches but just might in this case. Kind of regret my bingeing but it was too good to stop. Sooo many heave moments of suspense in the last two episodes. 
 

So all those New Vegas truthers got what they wanted, eh? 
 

In the end, I never quite got Maximus as a character. He seemed both young and old, shrewd and naive, incredibly stupid, mostly well-meaning but also a little sociopathic. Complex…? Can’t decide if it’s a tricky character well played or if he was miscast. 
 

Ep 7, but clocked Fred Armisen as soon as I heard his voice. Fun cameo. 
 

You can get turned into a ghoul by a serum?! Weirdest chicken-fucker-not-a-doctor-but-wait-maybe-actually-a-doctor? NPC ever. 
 

Wonder if Barb went into a vault early and that was why she and Cooper were separated when the bombs fell? One character talked about alimony, but The Ghoul was clearly looking for his family (wonder how both he and his daughter survived the blasts, and also what happened for them to split up later). Hope we will find out. 
 

So Moldaver was the good guy after all, and now she’s gone. Wonder where she spent her cryo and what was her purpose in Shady Sands. 
 

Crazy to get confirmation that Vault-Tec actually actively caused the war. That was never confirmed in the games was it? 
 

The cold fusion CGI got me rolling. Also, brain-Bud was hilarious. 
 

Poor Rose. Wonder why she wasn’t feral, looking so far gone as she was? 

[Sakura12]

This was a pretty good season. Plenty of fun stuff for the game players while also giving us someone's playthroough

My question was how did Moldaver survive for 200 years? She wasn't a ghoul. Did she get herself in a vault? I'm also curious what the experiment is/was in vault 33. If vault 31 was all the executives wouldn't Cooper's wife be in there? 

Did they actually name the dog, Dogmeat from Fallout 4. 

I hope we get another season with the Ghoul and Lucy hunting down Vault-Tec. 

War....never changes. I was waiting for someone to say that. Lol

Edited April 12 by Sakura12

[paigow]

Boyd Cooper FTW!!!!

[MrWhyt]

well we didn't get Ron Perlman but we did a get a "War never changes". Overall I thought this was really good series. I don't particularly like Maximus, but Goggins and Lucy more than make up for him.

[Ottis]

Given what's currently going on IRL in terms of conflict, it's hard to fault the show's perspective about war and humanity's long-term future. If I understand this ep correctly, the baddie corporations provoked a global war so that its vaults and vault experiments would be the only side to survive ... eventually.

That's a colossal, horrible solution. And I'm not sure I understand it. if corporations are constructed to make money, how would they make money by destroying the world and then turning lose a relative handful of survivors? Corporations aren't about winning. They are about profit. There were scientists, sure, and part of the deal was mankind could perfect progress over long periods of time, but scientists don't run corporations.

It feels like we are missing a piece, maybe a military with the philosophy that all other factions should die, who takes over a corporate vault project. Or causes it to move forward unexpectedly.

Maximus is the dumbest character on the show. Frontally attacking someone in the knight armor, which you know inside and out? Maybe pull the fusion core? Pretty much all of his decisions in the show were poor ones, though he showed an ethical side. Still, he seems way older than a squire should be.

Overall, I enjoyed the show even as it was continuously depressing. The production values were excellent. And the overarching message was starting to come together, though not quite there.

Anyone know how the show is doing in terms of viewers? Not a lot of comments here, yet.

 

[PurpleTentacle]

It was a nice foreshadowing in an earlier episode where Lucy said that as a little kid she thought she played in a corn field under the real sun. Now we know, she actually did.

So Kyle MacLachlan nuclear bombed an entire city? Man he is a nasty piece of work. Btw. the show did amazing things with its budget, but it clearly didn't go into deaging him convincingly. That was rough. And I always thought it was easier if you had a lot of footage from an actor when he was younger, like you would have here.

What was Moldaver on about with her cold fusion the whole time? What is in the fusion cores if not cold fusion? Can't really be hot fusion in such a small form factor. But even if it was, they already seem to provide unlimited energy, so what is the difference to her cold fusion? At first I thought maybe Vault-Tec didn't just lock it away, but used it in the fusion cores, just propriatary. But that can't be, since the suits run on fusion cores and Cooper Howard had fought in one of those years before she developed cold fusion.

Speaking of Moldaver, so how did she survive and not age for over 200 years? She wasn't a Ghoul and it didn't seem like she was frozen for any time. Are they just never going to reveal that? Because it seems like her story is over.

I still don't think Vault-Tecs plan makes much logical sense. But it makes a weird kind of internal sense. I could see it happening if enough Elon- Musk- type billionairs get together to realise their delusions of grandeur. I was googling something about the show a few days ago and accidentally stumbled over a reddit thread where people discussed who dropped the bombs in the war. The overwhelming consensus was that it was China. Nobody ever even mentioned Vault-Tec. But I have to say, from a world building perspective it being Vault-tec makes so much sense and I wouldn't be surprised if that was also always the plan in the games, but just kept vague until now.

Of course like I said, the plan is just insane. Not only is the plan basically "1. steal underpants, 2. ???, 3. ???, 4. Profit!", but even the profit, where there is no war anymore, because there aren't any factions, is insane. Humans will always split into factions along arbitrary lines. We have seen this in history time and again. Yet, it isn't unbelievable that some people would actually believe it. I actually read the sentiment from quite a few people about the Attack on Titan finale, that if Eren had just killed everybody on the planet but the Eldians, there would never again be war. It blew my mind that some people would actually believe something this stupid. But there they were.

The Deathclaw skull at the end was a nice touch. I guess we are saving the real thing for future seasons. I can live with that. I very much assume that there will be future seasons, as this is getting very good word of mouth and seems to get quite good numbers, as far as you can tell with a streaming service.

[AnimeMania]

For people who play the game, what do you have to do to kill a ghoul, since some ghouls are shot many times and don't die and others are shot once and die.

[Sakura12]

Feral ghouls are pretty easy to kill in small numbers. If it's a bunch or sentient ghouls. I usually throw a molotov or grenades at them. Headshots with an exploding weapon works too. 

[judemorrigan]

On 4/12/2024 at 6:03 PM, Sakura12 said:

I'm also curious what the experiment is/was in vault 33. If vault 31 was all the executives wouldn't Cooper's wife be in there? 

I think Vault 31 was all the executive *assistants*.  Cooper's wife presumably wound up with the actual big-wigs.

[thuganomics85]

Glad we got at least one "War.  War never changes", even if it was from Barb and not Ron Perlman's epic voice.  I'll take it, though.  That said, assuming this gets more seasons, he better show up at least once: even if it's just a cameo.

Man, I know opinions on corporations are at an all-time low, but Vault-Tec somehow outdid them all by basically going "Hey, you know what would really increase our profits?  If we cause a nuclear war so that they have to use our vaults!"  Damn, guys.  I think even the Roys from Succession would find that a step too far.  No idea how they pulled that off, but hopefully they are saving all of that for the future.

Whelp, he might have only been in two episodes for the entire season, but Kyle MacLachlan sure managed to leave a lasting impact for this episode!  Hank is just insane.  Truly think he is bettering humanity by... dropping a nuke on an entire city just to protect Vault-Tec's interest.  And to top it off, he's certainly not winning any Father of the Year awards for the way he took Lucy (and Norm's) mom away from her.  Dude's truly a psychotic company man through and through.

Moldaver is dead, but she at least turn the fusion on and powered up the city (world?)  That said, it's all in the hands of the Brotherhood of Steel now, which is... troubling.  At least Maximus is now looked upon as a hero, so maybe this new fame and status will help him find ways to at least slow the damage, if not stop it.

Barb definitely knew Cooper was spying on her, right?  Sounds like was equally down with Vault-Tec's nefarious plans, so any potential reunion will be a sight to behold, I imagine.

The show looks good for the most part, but the de-aging of Hank/Kyle MacLachlan in the flashback was rough.  To be fair, most shows/films still seem to be struggling on that front.

Lucy and The Ghoul are now doing something they probably never would have predicted: teaming up (with Dogmeat!) to hunt down Hank.  The Wasteland really does create strange bedfellows!

A few quibbles aside, this actually exceeded my expectations and was a pretty good adaptation that I think can stand on its own as well.  Obvious brutal and had some typical post-apocalypse tropes, but I thought they did a pretty great job with also capturing the bizarre, outlandish, and sometimes offensive humor from the games, which helped makes the series standout from the pack.  The set designs and production was good as well, and the characters were enjoyable to watch.  Acting was great too: in a just world, Ella Purnell will get even more roles going forward after this.  And, of course, Walton Goggins.  Just more proof that he's one of the best actors in the world, IMO.

From what I can tell, most seem optimistic that it will get renewed (certainly as gotten a lot of buzz/traction online), and I certainly hope that is the case.  We need a Deathclaw, stat!

[shrewd.buddha]

This last episode seemed to turn back to a semi-serious tone - no wacky comedic shenanigans or characters.  The pre-apocalypse setting and the vault creation conspiracies are the only parts that I found engaging. 

Is the fact that Fallout doesn't take itself seriously the reason it is considered better than something like Rebel Moon? Both have high production values, but  also cliched characters and the usual story tropes.
  At least Rebel Moon provides second-hand entertainment with all the meme material it generates.  Fallout seems to be saying: "Hey look, I'm not even trying."

On 4/16/2024 at 2:57 AM, thuganomics85 said:

Moldaver is dead, but she at least turn the fusion on and powered up the city (world?) 

Was that her entire life's mission? Cold fusion energy for everyone? She seemed to have vastly different, ideological goals in previous episodes. 
Is the LA Observation Center a cold fusion power plant now?!? The electrical grid is still intact?  All those light bulbs in those buildings from the early 60's still work? 

Why am I trying to make sense of all this?   This feels like a show I could take more seriously if it were animated.

[Sakura12]

The world ended in 2077 not in the 60's. Fallout takes place in an alternate future where they went all in with nuclear tech and nothing else. It advanced in some areas but not everything. That's why it looks retro. I'm not really sure why but that's just the game. 

I hope they explain how Moldaver survived. I thought she might be a synth but those are in the east coast and we saw she died as a human. I suppose she said that vault-tec bought her company so maybe she was a double agent and got her self in one of the cryo freeze vaults. 

[peridot]

I was really glad to get confirmation that Maximus didn't maim his friend.  That was in the back of my mind for the entire season.

Cooper's wife is an evil woman.  How could she bring up her child's future, and then mention that bringing war to the world is a viable option? All the Vault-Tec people and their competitors are insane.

I wasn't expecting cryogenics to come into play.  Hank was such an awful person - immediately writing off his wife when she didn't do what he wanted and then punishing an entire city for it. 

I wasn't sure when Hank ended up in the end, but I'm glad the closing graphics showed that is was Vegas. 

I never heard of the game before this came out, but I enjoyed this show.  Hopefully it's renewed.

[Hanahope]

guess i was wrong about Lucy actually experiencing the sun.  the show sure made it look exactly like the vault's corn field.  

how did Moldaver survive 300 years?  she obviously wasn't a ghoul since she died (from something other than a head shot - which appears to be the way you kill them).  apparently ghouls can heal their injuries, at least to a point - i actually hope that gets explained more - why did thaddeus heal fully when given the elixer, but Cooper clearly has some injuries and poor Rose was virtually a skeleton?  

For as long as it has been since the vaults were created, not too many 31ers were brought back to oversee 32 and 33, and 33 had 3 current 31ers before Moldaver's raid.  were the vault dwellers living longer?  and it seemed like even before the raid, 33's numbers were quite diminished (same with 32) that they must have had issues with interbreeding.  

so why didn't cooper go into whatever vault Beth and his daughter were taken to?  and are they in cold storage chambers too?  or will he only find descendants?  

[Jack Shaftoe]

This kind of cartoon villainy doesn't work when the show isn't particularly funny in the first place and ends up with an episode that is dead serious. Sure, many CEOs are little more than sociopaths but Vault-Tec insane plan should have been laughed out of the room by everyone who wasn't stark raving mad. "Oh, yeah, let's hide underground for decades or even longer in order to achieve some vague utopia - even though we are portrayed as incredibly selfish, so we shouldn't give a fuck about any utopias in the first place".

The Brotherhood forgiving Maximus just like this was rather silly but it was funny how they called his dumb bluff with the random head immediately.

You know, if Lucy's dad was in the conspiracy all along, you would think he would have known Moldaver's people were not from Vault 32.

I guess the joke was that the descendants of executive assistants tend to be obedient and that's why Vault 33 is such a tidy place but it felt rather flat.

Seeing the brain in the robotic contraption only made me realize how much better many of the show's themes are developed in Fallout New Vegas: Old World Blues. It's also far, far funnier than the show.

All in all, for me the show ended up being mostly style over substance and it's too bad because Nolan managed to do wonderful things on a much smaller budget in Person of Interest.

Edited April 20 by Jack Shaftoe

[Tachi Rocinante]

Not a game player so I'm sure I missed some references and in-jokes.

So if they nuked Shady Sands did they nuke other places too?  Did they blame it on China?

Since Coop saw multiple explosions, we're those retaliatory or did Shady Sands require more than one nuke?

The Roomba-brain was just dumb.

I enjoyed it enough I guess.

[Jack Shaftoe]

The Shady Sands nuking was more than 200 years after the initial Great War. The explosions Coop saw were during that war.

[paigow]

23 hours ago, Jack Shaftoe said:

because Nolan managed to do wonderful things on a much smaller budget in Person of Interest.

And blew a big budget on an incoherent final Westworld season... so maybe give him $500 and unlimited food for his next project...

[Helena Dax]

I enjoyed this. Not the most wonderful show ever, but good and entertaining enough. 

It was obvious that there was something off about the vaults, Hank etc, but I liked the twists and certainly I didn't expect Hank or the Ghoul 's wife to be such psychopaths. Also,I agree that the plan created by Vault Tech didn't make any sense because you're throwing away your chances of being immensely rich and ruling the facto a whole planet, like it's happening right now, for the possibility of ruling a way smaller world with 1% of the luxuries you would have had in a non-nuked world. 

Moldover must have spent some time frozen, I guess.

I really liked Lucy and the Ghoul. Maximus is a hit or miss for me and I'm really, really glad Dogmeat survived. Honestly, you could tell the creators of the vaults were irremediably evil when we found out they had banned dogs.

Edited April 21 by Helena Dax

[Ottis]

On 4/15/2024 at 5:58 PM, PurpleTentacle said:

Of course like I said, the plan is just insane. Not only is the plan basically "1. steal underpants, 2. ???, 3. ???, 4. Profit!",

OK, this made me laugh. Thank you.

On 4/16/2024 at 2:57 AM, thuganomics85 said:

A few quibbles aside, this actually exceeded my expectations and was a pretty good adaptation that I think can stand on its own as well.

Me, too. Though my expectations were low. Now we just need some narrative development beyond, "Hey look, it's like the game!"

On 4/17/2024 at 9:17 AM, shrewd.buddha said:

Is the fact that Fallout doesn't take itself seriously the reason it is considered better than something like Rebel Moon?

Given I have tried to watch Rebel Moon 3 times and have made it 15 minutes into Part 1 and was alternately bored and eye rolling, Fallout *has* to be better. I was shocked to see a Rebel Moon Part 2 dropped. 

On 4/20/2024 at 12:27 PM, Jack Shaftoe said:

The Shady Sands nuking was more than 200 years after the initial Great War. The explosions Coop saw were during that war.

Yes, and that's a key point. Despite the horrors of the Great War, and all the knowledge he had of it, Coop went ahead and nuked another city to protect V-T. So he is a True Believer, not a victim or bystander. 

[Megras]

1 hour ago, Ottis said:

Yes, and that's a key point. Despite the horrors of the Great War, and all the knowledge he had of it, Coop went ahead and nuked another city to protect V-T. So he is a True Believer, not a victim or bystander. 

Wasn't it Hank that nuked Shady Sands not Coop. Or do I need to watch again (oh no the hardship!)

[Ottis]

14 minutes ago, Megras said:

Wasn't it Hank that nuked Shady Sands not Coop. Or do I need to watch again (oh no the hardship!)

Dang it, this is what happens when the actor playing Hank played Agent Cooper in Twin Peaks! Yes, Hank in Fallout, thank you for catching that.

[PurpleTentacle]

On 4/17/2024 at 3:17 PM, shrewd.buddha said:

Is the fact that Fallout doesn't take itself seriously the reason it is considered better than something like Rebel Moon? Both have high production values, but  also cliched characters and the usual story tropes.
  At least Rebel Moon provides second-hand entertainment with all the meme material it generates.  Fallout seems to be saying: "Hey look, I'm not even trying."

If you are satire you don't have to hold to the rules of your universe as tightly, as long as deviating from them serves the satire. In that sense it's a bit easier.

But on the other hand, if you are satire, you actually have to be funny and being funny is hard. Not necessarily laughoutloud-funny, but at least amusing-funny.

I also very much disagree with your statement that Fallout isn't trying. I think it tried and succeeded at a lot of things.

On 4/20/2024 at 4:56 AM, Jack Shaftoe said:

This kind of cartoon villainy doesn't work when the show isn't particularly funny in the first place and ends up with an episode that is dead serious. Sure, many CEOs are little more than sociopaths but Vault-Tec insane plan should have been laughed out of the room by everyone who wasn't stark raving mad. "Oh, yeah, let's hide underground for decades or even longer in order to achieve some vague utopia - even though we are portrayed as incredibly selfish, so we shouldn't give a fuck about any utopias in the first place".

Counterpoint: Elon Musk.

[Affogato]

On 4/23/2024 at 12:47 PM, Megras said:

Wasn't it Hank that nuked Shady Sands not Coop. Or do I need to watch again (oh no the hardship!)

Yes, I think Coop is being confused with Dale Cooper

[Affogato]

 

Impossible oysters and Beyond Tuna are a possibility, I think oysters might actually be something that could be used in maintaining vault ecosystems, though.  if the ‘pods’ hold people in stasis fields,there could be rooms of canned food in stasis, but it is more likely that each vault put aside some resources to make fake meat and fish. 

I assume the knights are the result of another company’s vaults, like Vault 4 was another company;s vaults. I think that Max made sense, as a traumatized four or five year old who want security and thinks the knights are his heroes. He believes what they say, and they wouldn’t want to put him in power, but he makes a good underling. I imagine the older knights hang onto power as long as they can and it isn’t unusual to have an older squire and squires that don’t become knights, or die before they become knights. 

It took a while for me to get really interested in what was happening, by which I mean invested in the characters. I think I’m more interested in what is happening in the different vaults than the post apocalyptic nonsense.

I wonder if the ghouls are the result of research into anti radiation and longevity research, possibly we will find out that Coop was taken into That Vault. It doesn’t seem like anyone except management would get put in stasis.

[Hanahope]

So thinking back to Ep 1, when the group from vault 32 (or what 33 thought was 32) showed up for the wedding.  When someone from vault 31 shows up, don't the people from 33 wonder why its just the single person showing up and not a group to help celebrate the wedding?

and when Betty announces that vault 33 (who was already  low in numbers after the wedding slaughter) was going to repopulate 32, and they sent like a dozen people, why isn't anyone asking, 'hey can't 31 send some too' since a dozen people can't really be a large enough gene pool.

or are we just to assume there's more people in these vault than we actually see?  and where were vault 33's storm troopers during the wedding slaughter?

 

[Affogato]

2 hours ago, Hanahope said:

So thinking back to Ep 1, when the group from vault 32 (or what 33 thought was 32) showed up for the wedding.  When someone from vault 31 shows up, don't the people from 33 wonder why its just the single person showing up and not a group to help celebrate the wedding?

and when Betty announces that vault 33 (who was already  low in numbers after the wedding slaughter) was going to repopulate 32, and they sent like a dozen people, why isn't anyone asking, 'hey can't 31 send some too' since a dozen people can't really be a large enough gene pool.

or are we just to assume there's more people in these vault than we actually see?  and where were vault 33's storm troopers during the wedding slaughter?

 

Well, I haven’t paid a log of attention to the game and wasn’t watching any pre nmedia for the show, so imagine my surprise when it is based on Ellison’s novella, “A boy and his dog’. Whiuch is a remarkably moving, well written story which has a pretty finished, stable bit of worldbuilding. Of course, everyone wanted more from him, and he produced a little. 

So I s[ent the first half of this looking for a reason why this existed. So far it is mildly entertaining and I’m somewhat engaged by some characters, but the world building has not surpassed, or even caught up with, the original. We are shown everything that poor puppy went through, but so far, no real character development. If he is telepathic, well read and so on, it is not evident. The vaults don’t make a lot of sense. Are there backup pods of people? How many times have the pod populations been replaced? I agree that Lucy talked about the gene pool, so that should be something the general population of the vaults is concerned with and I wondered if they had let the surface dwellers in for that reason, but haven’t seen any evidence that was what 31 did. 

So far the show was entertaining, in part because Amazon threw a lot of money at it and got good actors, but ….. um…….that seems about it. 

Iwant to know more about great uncle peter.

Edited May 1 by Affogato

[HDJulie]

Overall, I liked the show. I found it because of Goggins & stayed because of him & Lucy. I have to admit, though, that I spent a good bit of time with my eyes averted. That was a lot of gore. 
 

I am admittedly a low-bar viewer, which means that I care very little if things make sense, so long as I am entertained. However, even I took issue with some of the nonsense:
 

1. Did Moldaver's people do the slaughtering of the Vault 32 people so they could get to Vault 33 & ultimately, Hank?  And then slaughtered Vault 33 people?  If they got into 32, why couldn't they have gotten Into 33 the same way. Oh well, I guess the end justifies the means

2. The corporate people were interested in human behavior experiments?  Why?

3. The corporate people, the same ones who wanted to do behavioral experiments, thought that with populations in different vaults, there'd still be no us vs them mentality?  

4. Assuming that the corporate people all went into stasis as well, they wanted to wake up 200 years later, when I guess the level of radiation would have become not as deadly or whatever, to 'rebuild' the world as they saw fit, a world where the entire infrastructure was gone & there would be no modern conveniences for likely decades?  
 

5. Assuming also that the corporate people were more power hungry than greedy, were they going to rebuild together with just one person having power, or did they expect to each have their own kingdom in their respective vaults. And if they were masters of their own domain, they expected the other masters to have the exact same visions & therefore would have no conflict? 
 

I just can't hand wave the idiocy of thinking that annihilating an entire planet could ever be a good thing, any more a profitable one. 

[Sakura12]

22 hours ago, HDJulie said:

Did Moldaver's people do the slaughtering of the Vault 32 people so they could get to Vault 33 & ultimately, Hank?  And then slaughtered Vault 33 people?  If they got into 32, why couldn't they have gotten Into 33 the same way. Oh well, I guess the end justifies the means

The people in vault 32 murderd each other 2 years before Moldavers crew got there. 

The vault-tec people seem more interested in Power over money. They seemed to think that everyone on the surface would be dead or kill each other then they would come up and start a new world in their image. Is it a stupid and not well thought out plan, yes.  That's why managers shouldn't be running the world. They come up with dumb ideas and expect everyone else to actually do the work and blame them when it fails. 

The vaults from what I understand are supposed to be like survival of the fittest. They do different experiments and scenarios and see  if those people can take over the world. While also just messing with other vaults to see what happens. Some were really messed up and cruel. 

Edited May 7 by Sakura12

[Affogato]

21 hours ago, HDJulie said:

 

 

1. Did Moldaver's people do the slaughtering of the Vault 32 people so they could get to Vault 33 & ultimately, Hank?  And then slaughtered Vault 33 people?  If they got into 32, why couldn't they have gotten Into 33 the same way. Oh well, I guess the end justifies the 

4. Assuming that the corporate people all went into stasis as well, they wanted to wake up 200 years later, when I guess the level of radiation would have become not as deadly or whatever, to 'rebuild' the world as they saw fit, a world where the entire infrastructure was gone & there would be no modern conveniences for likely decades?  
 

 

I think Moldaver’s people arranged the wedding via 32 after the residents of 32 all died from overpopulation or mass hysteria. Or both. 
 

my guess is that they were thinking the world was going to blow up anyway. They wanted the advantage. 

Edited May 7 by Affogato
Typo

[mrspidey]

On 5/6/2024 at 6:00 AM, HDJulie said:

2. The corporate people were interested in human behavior experiments?  Why?

3. The corporate people, the same ones who wanted to do behavioral experiments, thought that with populations in different vaults, there'd still be no us vs them mentality?  

4. Assuming that the corporate people all went into stasis as well, they wanted to wake up 200 years later, when I guess the level of radiation would have become not as deadly or whatever, to 'rebuild' the world as they saw fit, a world where the entire infrastructure was gone & there would be no modern conveniences for likely decades?  
 

5. Assuming also that the corporate people were more power hungry than greedy, were they going to rebuild together with just one person having power, or did they expect to each have their own kingdom in their respective vaults. And if they were masters of their own domain, they expected the other masters to have the exact same visions & therefore would have no conflict? 
 

I just can't hand wave the idiocy of thinking that annihilating an entire planet could ever be a good thing, any more a profitable one. 

From your other posts i take it you've played the games. If so, this problem should feel very familar, since every villain faction on the games is like this. The Master, the Enclave, Caesar's Legion, the Institute, Vault-Tec, they all want to be the only ones left standing and rebuild the world as they see fit.

While VT and the Institute were content with waiting it out underground, while preventing local surface factions to rise to power in their region, the Master and the Enclave took a more proactive and genocidal approach. Caesar's Legion just wanted to absorb everyone into their "Ancient Rome Revival"-society.

It is a recurring theme condensed into Maximus' line about everyone wanting to save the world but disagreeing on how.

Edited May 7 by mrspidey

[Spaceman Spiff]

A bit of a slog to get through for me. I was never "I really need to see the next episode" so it took me bit finally finish. Everything was happening too slow, long drawn out visual shots or peoples reactions didn't hold my attention and get me asking for more. Worst character was Max. At first I was all "fist pump" when he let his knight die (cause he was an asshole) and he got the armor, I was thinking now he's gonna prove himself, but nope he was still just a big idiot. I can't bear to watch someone who consistently fails upward. I'll watch a 2nd season, but won't be eagerly anticipating it.

[PurpleTentacle]

On 5/7/2024 at 1:00 AM, Affogato said:

I think Moldaver’s people arranged the wedding via 32 after the residents of 32 all died from overpopulation or mass hysteria. Or both. 

If finding out that you were breeding stock for a bunch of high powered assholes and mounting a revolution because of it is mass hysteria, sure. They all died from mass hysteria.

[Affogato]

9 hours ago, PurpleTentacle said:

If finding out that you were breeding stock for a bunch of high powered assholes and mounting a revolution because of it is mass hysteria, sure. They all died from mass hysteria.

I don’t know that we have a definitive answer about what happened. The tv show about rodents was suggestive. 

[tennisgurl]

I really did not see all of that coming, Lucy certainly got a lot of information in thirty seconds. It turns out that Vault-Tech is even more evil than we thought, they didn't just take advantage of the war, they were apparently the ones that started it! And Coopers wife was the person who first suggested it! And now the Ghoul and Lucy (and Dogmeat!) are teaming up! I cant wait for season two!

I like how Cooper in the past and Lucy in the present both found out at the same time that the person they love and sacrificed for is actually a horrible person. Barbara was down to destroy the world in a convoluted evil scheme to control the market, even if that meant destroying her own daughters future, and Hank nuked a whole thriving city because he was pissed at his wife for leaving him and to keep up the Vault-Tech party line. Wow. 

This was a pretty heavy episode, but I'm glad that we still got some of that quirky dark comedy we've come to expect. Bud the Brain was hilariously bizarre, especially as he pathetically chased Norman around with a needle trying to get him to stop moving.

Moldaver might be trying to do something good and is certainly more of a "good guy" than Hank, but she did still murder a lot of people in the Vault to get Hank and set her friends daughter up to be murdered on her wedding night in a pretty horrible way, plus she's keeping her friend in a horrible state as her permanent dinner guest. In general the show seems to be going for a vibe where no faction is really "good" or "bad" all the way (except for whoever started this whole mess) you just have to pick the lesser evil. 

There are a lot of unanswered questions, some of which I am guessing we will find out later, and some of which I am not sure about. What exactly happened in Vault 32? Did they find out what their Vault really was and they all killed themselves in an act of mass hysteria? There are a lot of other questions but I am willing to wait until season two. I know very little about the Fallout games but this has certainly gotten me interested. This show really exceeded expectations, lots of great drama, excitement, dark comedy, world building, and acting, I am really excited to explore more of this world. 

Edited May 10 by tennisgurl

[Sakura12]

The brain robots are from the game too. One of them is even romanceable. 

All the factions have thier flaws, some are worse than others. It's like Maximus said everyone is trying to save the world they just disagree on how.

 

[Hanahope]

1 hour ago, tennisgurl said:

What exactly happened in Vault 31? Did they find out what their Vault really was and they all killed themselves in an act of mass hysteria?

i think you mean Vault 32, which apparently was a lot like vault 33, meant to be happy sunny obedient people who would breed with vault 31 and do whatever the managers told them to do.  not sure how being happy sunny obedient people would help them take over or lead the outside world though.  

it also doesn't really explain the storm trooper guards in vault 33 that forced the chosen people to vault 32.  i am presuming there were similar guards in vault 32 and that is who vault 32's happy sunny obedient people fought with when they found out the truth.  

how/why are the guards not also 'happy sunny obedient' people, but just 'obedient'?  maybe when the children grow up the managers can figure out who is 'happy sunny' and who isn't, but will still be obedient.  

[Affogato]

48 minutes ago, Hanahope said:

i think you mean Vault 32, which apparently was a lot like vault 33, meant to be happy sunny obedient people who would breed with vault 31 and do whatever the managers told them to do.  not sure how being happy sunny obedient people would help them take over or lead the outside world though.  

it also doesn't really explain the storm trooper guards in vault 33 that forced the chosen people to vault 32.  i am presuming there were similar guards in vault 32 and that is who vault 32's happy sunny obedient people fought with when they found out the truth.  

how/why are the guards not also 'happy sunny obedient' people, but just 'obedient'?  maybe when the children grow up the managers can figure out who is 'happy sunny' and who isn't, but will still be obedient.  

I guess there are people in 31 who are uncorked to do specific tasks. Some may live among the labrats and some will beat them up and climb back into their pods. 

Lucy had martial arts training. The vault had militia. To protect against the outsiders, sure. But also to enforce the rule of law. 

[HDJulie]

On 5/7/2024 at 5:21 AM, mrspidey said:

From your other posts i take it you've played the games. If so, this problem should feel very familar, since every villain faction on the games is like this. The Master, the Enclave, Caesar's Legion, the Institute, Vault-Tec, they all want to be the only ones left standing and rebuild the world as they see fit.

While VT and the Institute were content with waiting it out underground, while preventing local surface factions to rise to power in their region, the Master and the Enclave took a more proactive and genocidal approach. Caesar's Legion just wanted to absorb everyone into their "Ancient Rome Revival"-society.

It is a recurring theme condensed into Maximus' line about everyone wanting to save the world but disagreeing on how.

I've played role player games, but this was 30 years ago when it was all text (open door, you're in a dark room with a lantern, get lantern, light lantern). I'm not familiar with these games but from what you've said, this appears to remain true to the game & that's good enough for me.