Saltburn (2023)

[AngieBee1]

Writer/director Emerald Fennell's directorial follow-up to 2020's PROMISING YOUNG WOMEN is another dark-comedy (being touted as a gothic thriller) following Oxford University scholarship plebe Oliver Quick (Barry Keoghan) who is instantly besotted with golden boy Felix Catton (Jacob Elordi). 

Felix takes Oliver under his wing (much to the consternation of Felix's cousin Farleigh (Archie Madekwe) and invites him to stay at his stately home Saltburn. What transpires is a twisty, deliciously twisted look at obsession.

My favourite film of the year.  Barry Keoghan is exquisite and Rosamund Pike is a delight.  

The main complaint I see is that people say it's a ripoff of The Talented Mr. Ripley and yes, there are similarities, but this is very fun and riveting film that doesn't need any other film to bolster it.  It's a corker.

[Spartan Girl]

Yeah, I’m sorry, but I am one of the ones that didn’t like this movie. Tom Ripley was at least pitiful enough to be able to empathize with on some level, even though he was a sociopath.  Oliver was just a crazy asshole.

Emerald Fennell went from Promising Young Woman to this?! And yeah, I bristle at the “realism” that Cassie couldn’t get out of a rapist’s bachelor party alive, but Oliver could literally get away with murder.

[proserpina65]

I saw this on Sunday.  And by that I mean I saw it up until the end of the Oxford section.  I was only there for one particular actor, but was trying to give it a chance so I didn't leave when his scenes were over.  But the movie was not good.  "Vapid C*nts" would've been a better title for it or, to be a little less harsh on the characters, maybe "Vacuous Twats".  I wouldn't say it was a terrible movie because it simply wasn't interesting enough up to that point to even be terrible.  It was just fucking boring.  I wouldn't recommended it to my worst enemy.  Or probably I would, because they'd deserve to be as bored as I was.

On 11/26/2023 at 6:35 AM, Spartan Girl said:

Oliver was just a crazy asshole.

And it's not like he built to crazy asshole.  He was giving creepy stalker vibes from the get go.

[methodwriter85]

On 11/28/2023 at 1:13 PM, proserpina65 said:

And it's not like he built to crazy asshole.  He was giving creepy stalker vibes from the get go.

Yeah. I did enjoy it, but I get why people don't. I was in a movie theater with people who started laughing at how ridiculous everything was, so I think that helped me enjoy it more. Also, "Murder on the Dance Floor" is one of my favorite songs do yeah. I did get annoyed at the anachronistic references to "Superbad" and "Apple Bottom Jeans" songs that are '07, but they did a generally good job of capturing the '05-'06 vibes.

On 11/26/2023 at 6:35 AM, Spartan Girl said:

Tom Ripley was at least pitiful enough to be able to empathize with on some level, even though he was a sociopath.  Oliver was just a crazy asshole.

I did think it was funny to see Oliver actually play poor when he actually came from a pretty respectable background. Not Saltburn rich or anything, but he had a decent amount of his own privilege. 

[proserpina65]

3 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

Also, "Murder on the Dance Floor" is one of my favorite songs do yeah. I did get annoyed at the anachronistic references to "Superbad" and "Apple Bottom Jeans" songs that are '07, but they did a generally good job of capturing the '05-'06 vibes.

I guess part of my problem is that I don't have any nostalgia for that time period. (I had a real life, a mortgage I could barely afford and a job which sucked and I got fired on Black Friday 2006 so it's a time I'd prefer to forget.)  And I'm too old to find people acting like total douches funny.  I might've been amused when I was that young; hell, I might've been that kind of douche, although much poorer, when I was that age, but not anymore.  I'd rather have hung out with Michael Gavey than Felix and his asshole friends.  Seriously, when the socially inept, easily triggered math genius was the most pleasant character, it clearly wasn't something I was meant to enjoy.

There were probably only 6 other people in the theater when I saw it and they didn't appear to find it funny either.

[kiddo82]

8 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

I did get annoyed at the anachronistic references to "Superbad" and "Apple Bottom Jeans" songs that are '07, but they did a generally good job of capturing the '05-'06 vibes.

THANK you!  When Apple Bottom Jeans started up I was distracted thinking "Wait.  When is this supposed to take place again?  Because I feel like this song was later."

I saw this as part of a three movie day last Friday.  Move over, Barbemheimer.  I present to you:  WishBurnGames.  I liked not loved it.  The twist wasn't all that surprising but I was still engaged throughout.  I think Fennell's direction made up for a lot for me.  The breakfast scene (lunch scene?) after they find Felix's body was simultaneously funny and horrifying.  I think this one might also get better on rewatch.

There were two older teen girls on my theater, probably there because of Jacob Elordi, who couldn't contain some of their incredulous gasps.  On the way out I heard one say to the other "I thought this would be a fun teen movie."  🤣

Edited November 30, 2023 by kiddo82

[Sheenieb]

9 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

I did think it was funny to see Oliver actually play poor when he actually came from a pretty respectable background. Not Saltburn rich or anything, but he had a decent amount of his own privilege. 

I didn't hate the movie, but I was still disappointed. It was a cross between The Talented Mr. Ripley and Parasite, but the motives for Tom and the Kim family made their sociopathy make sense, but here, Oliver was just crazy. There was no buildup to why he would lie about his background when he came from an upper-middle-class family and neighborhood. It was all so random. 

I would've liked it better if Farleigh learned about Oliver's lie and they teamed up since Farleigh was on the outs with the Cattons. Or, if the movie was from Farleigh's perspective. 

The performances were great, but I liked Promising Young Woman better. 

[methodwriter85]

1 hour ago, Sheenieb said:

Oliver was just crazy. There was no buildup to why he would lie about his background when he came from an upper-middle-class family and neighborhood.

See, it reminded me a lot of Anna Delvey. She herself came from a very respectable upper middle class background with a family that could pay to send her to prestigious universities and designer clothes, but she felt the need to lie about being the heiress of an aristocratic family.

It was kind of hilarious when Felix drives up to the house and he goes, "Wow, your mother must have gotten herself together because your house is quite lovely!" LOL Dude, that wasn't a council estate and you're kinda slow on the uptake here. LOL

3 hours ago, kiddo82 said:

THANK you!  When Apple Bottom Jeans started up I was distracted thinking "Wait.  When is this supposed to take place again?  Because I feel like this song was later."

I was in full college party hopping mode in 2005-2009 so I know a lot of that music like the back of my hand. It kind of drag me out of the immersion of 2006, but they generally did a really job with the styling especially on Felix. I did think the swimshorts weren't really period- guys generally wore much longer shorts- but maybe then I remember that they were British, not American.

[Dr.OO7]

Did anyone else expect that while Oliver was doing his naked dancing throughout the house that he was going to encounter Duncan, who would. . .join him, this revealing that the two of them planned the whole thing together?

Awful movie. And it's not that it's bad as far as acting/writing, etc., just that nearly everyone is an absolutely awful person who isn't worth rooting for. And the grimness just got relentless--first Felix dies, then Venetia, then James, then Elspeth (albeit years later). And all because of Oliver's actions or manipulations. And why? None of these people ever mistreated him in any way. Felix genuinely befriended him and despite how vapid they all were, the rest of them seemed to like him too.

[Spartan Girl]

7 minutes ago, Dr.OO7 said:

Awful movie. And it's not that it's bad as far as acting/writing, etc., just that nearly everyone is an absolutely awful person who isn't worth rooting for. And the grimness just got relentless--first Felix dies, then Venetia, then James, then Elspeth (albeit years later). And all because of Oliver's actions or manipulations. And why? None of these people ever mistreated him in any way. Felix genuinely befriended him and despite how vapid they all were, the rest of them seemed to like him too.

This. At least the assholes in Promising Young Women deserved to have Cassie mess with them (some got off too lightly, but that’s another issue entirely). Why should we root for Oliver to ruin these people’s lives, just because they’re rich and snobby? 

[Dr.OO7]

51 minutes ago, Spartan Girl said:

At least the assholes in Promising Young Women deserved to have Cassie mess with them (some got off too lightly, but that’s another issue entirely). Why should we root for Oliver to ruin these people’s lives, just because they’re rich and snobby? 

Especially Felix, who had every right to be angry with him upon realizing how much Oliver had deceived him from the very beginning. You could tell that he wasn't just angry, he was genuinely hurt. I'm not going to lament the trials of rich people, but it can't be easy to wonder if someone really likes you or is just trying to social climb/gold dig, and in this case, have those fears confirmed. 

I hate movies that look like they're going to be good and then end up sucking.

[luna1122again]

I don't think we're supposed to be rooting for Oliver. He's clearly a villain. That doesn't stop me from finding this film wildly entertaining. Barry Keoghan is an astonishing talent, imo. 

[StatisticalOutlier]

1 hour ago, luna1122again said:

I don't think we're supposed to be rooting for Oliver. He's clearly a villain. That doesn't stop me from finding this film wildly entertaining. Barry Keoghan is an astonishing talent, imo. 

I was planning to see it based solely on the fact that Barry Keoghan is in it.  The only thing I've ever seen him in is Banshees of Inisherin and I adored him and want more.

[AngieBee1]

On 11/30/2023 at 1:44 PM, methodwriter85 said:

It was kind of hilarious when Felix drives up to the house and he goes, "Wow, your mother must have gotten herself together because your house is quite lovely!" LOL Dude, that wasn't a council estate and you're kinda slow on the uptake here. LOL

That entire scene was so well played by Elordi. Slowly - very slowly - the alarm bells start going off and then when he notices the manicured, watered lawn it gets a tad louder and then when he sees the "Gone Fishin'" scene you can tell he knows what will be behind those doors. I loved that scene. 

And for both Fennell and Elordi to say how terrible a person Felix can be, he was so nice to make Oliver stay and have dinner with his parents because he knew it meant a lot to them. 

Even in the maze scene with Oliver, it's as if his anger has died down and now he's jus sad. While he would have had every right to throttle Oliver, when Oliver throws up he asks if he feels better and suggests he goes to bed.  I think Oliver started out as a pity project to him or maybe a way to be a good person by taking him under his wings, but I think he felt a friendship with Oliver. Or at least the image Oliver created for himself while at Saltburn.

[heatherchandler]

On 12/4/2023 at 3:52 PM, StatisticalOutlier said:

I was planning to see it based solely on the fact that Barry Keoghan is in it.  The only thing I've ever seen him in is Banshees of Inisherin and I adored him and want more.

I will watch him in anything!  He’s so good.  He should have gotten the Oscar for Banshees of Inisherin.  Colin Farrell too but I digress!

[proserpina65]

On 12/4/2023 at 3:38 PM, luna1122again said:

I don't think we're supposed to be rooting for Oliver. He's clearly a villain. That doesn't stop me from finding this film wildly entertaining. Barry Keoghan is an astonishing talent, imo. 

I didn't like his performance at all.  I've been surprised to read all the praise of it.

[AngieBee1]

The Golden Globes nominations are Monday and I'm hoping that Barry gets nominated for Best Actor in Comedy, Rosamund Pike for Best Actress in Comedy and the film itself for Best Picture Comedy or Musical. 

[AngieBee1]

On 12/8/2023 at 5:10 PM, AngieBee1 said:

The Golden Globes nominations are Monday and I'm hoping that Barry gets nominated for Best Actor in Comedy, Rosamund Pike for Best Actress in Comedy and the film itself for Best Picture Comedy or Musical. 

A well-deserved nomination for both but not in comedy. 

[Cotypubby]

One of my favorite films of the year!

[StatisticalOutlier]

I just don't understand how someone who would slurp semen-tainted bathwater out of a bathtub's drain could be repulsed by runny fried eggs.

[AimingforYoko]

 

[Sweet Tee]

I didn't love it but it was entertaining.  Pretty clear where it was going from the very beginning though.  I liked it way better than Promising Young Woman.  I was furious at the end of that movie and I still don't know what message Fennel was trying to send with that one.  At least this one didn't leave me in angry tears.  

I thought Alison Oliver was fantastic.  That scene between Venetia and Oliver in the bathtub was the best of the movie, imo.

[Giuseppe]

Ok, but what happened to Farleigh? Last I remember, Sir James ordered him out of the dining room, but then we didn't see him for the rest of the movie did we? Are we to assume Oliver offed him, too? I was half-expecting him to pop up behind Oliver at the end when he was dancing in the house.

The ending montage went a little fast for me, so I was unclear if they were actually showing us what Oliver did to Felix in the maze, and it looked like Venetia was asleep in the tub and Oliver placed two razer blades on the rim? Was he stalking Elspeth and set up the 'run-in' at the coffee shop? I couldn't really figure out what was happening. The timeline confused me as well because as far as I could tell, we didn't get any timestamps. I could deduce that some years had passed between Oliver leaving Saltburn and then seeing Elspeth in the coffee shop, but how much time? And what did he do to Elspeth anyway? Poison her? So many questions.

Still, I enjoyed it. For me it was like if Talented Mr. Ripley and Call Me by Your Name had a baby, though I do wish we had gotten a bit more insight into Oliver's frame of mind. I agree with others that the crazy seemed to come out of nowhere. 

Lastly, is this really how 'elite' British people live?? The whole scenario reminded me of the last season of YOU , which made me ask the same question.

[AngieBee1]

Quote

Ok, but what happened to Farleigh? Last I remember, Sir James ordered him out of the dining room, but then we didn't see him for the rest of the movie did we? Are we to assume Oliver offed him, too? 

Sir James kicked him out for having drugs. He was banished again, and this time permanently. Sir James said he wouldn't do anything more for Farleigh.

 

6 hours ago, Giuseppe said:

The ending montage went a little fast for me, so I was unclear if they were actually showing us what Oliver did to Felix in the maze, and it looked like Venetia was asleep in the tub and Oliver placed two razer blades on the rim? Was he stalking Elspeth and set up the 'run-in' at the coffee shop? I couldn't really figure out what was happening. The timeline confused me as well because as far as I could tell, we didn't get any timestamps. I could deduce that some years had passed between Oliver leaving Saltburn and then seeing Elspeth in the coffee shop, but how much time? And what did he do to Elspeth anyway? Poison her? So many questions

There was a 15 year time jump from Oliver leaving Saltburn to "bumping" into Elsepeth in the cafe.

The montage showed Oliver spiking the alcohol, begging off to vomit and handing the alcohol over to Felix knowing he would drink it.  He left the razor blades on the edge of the bathtub. Venetia was susceptible as displayed by Oliver having her eat his croissant after telling her the night before in the garden that he wanted her to eat and not get up from the table (although, she did ultimately leave he table). 

Surely after reading about Sir James' death Oliver started looking into Elspeth's life and found out she lived in that neighborhood. He located a cafe to hang out in in order to orchestrate "bumping" into her. 

I am in the minority and believed Elspeth just got sick; and it hand nothing to do with Oliver. Yet, when she did get sick he made sure to have her amend the will so that it would come to her and then he killed her. But I don't think he was the initial cause of her illness because we would have been shown it.  

6 hours ago, Giuseppe said:

I do wish we had gotten a bit more insight into Oliver's frame of mind. I agree with others that the crazy seemed to come out of nowhere. 

I don't think it came out of nowhere. From his parents we know that he already had a tendency to lie. A majority of what he did was driven by his need to be with Felix. Whether he was in love with him or just wanted to be him or a combination of both, he wanted to be a part of Felix's life.  When Felix first tried to ditch him after getting annoyed by him in his dorm and not inviting him to the pub; Oliver came up with the lie about his father. 

When Oliver saw how fickle the Cattons were with Pamela, he started working on them individually so that they would like him enough to not think him boring and wanting him to leave (which was Pamela's fate).  He had to get Farleigh out the house because Farleigh was the only one who he couldn't manipulate. 

Once Felix found out he was lying about his background, Oliver knew it was game over and that he was going to lose Felix and access to his life. He gave Felix a chance in that maze by putting his feelings on the line, but one Felix told him he made his blood run cold Oliver knew he had to kill him.  

He tried to move on to Venetia but then she expressed how she and her father truly feels about him so he knew that would be a dead end, so he placed the razors on the tub so she could kill herself because he knew she would poison the family against him. 

[Giuseppe]

5 hours ago, AngieBee1 said:

Sir James kicked him out for having drugs. He was banished again, and this time permanently. Sir James said he wouldn't do anything more for Farleigh.

Yeah I got that, but I still thought he would've popped up again, especially after Sir James died. Just seemed like we needed some sort of epilogue for Farleigh.

5 hours ago, AngieBee1 said:

There was a 15 year time jump from Oliver leaving Saltburn to "bumping" into Elsepeth in the cafe.

The montage showed Oliver spiking the alcohol, begging off to vomit and handing the alcohol over to Felix knowing he would drink it.  He left the razor blades on the edge of the bathtub. Venetia was susceptible as displayed by Oliver having her eat his croissant after telling her the night before in the garden that he wanted her to eat and not get up from the table (although, she did ultimately leave he table). 

Surely after reading about Sir James' death Oliver started looking into Elspeth's life and found out she lived in that neighborhood. He located a cafe to hang out in in order to orchestrate "bumping" into her. 

Thanks @AngieBee1. The screen was dark and I was half falling asleep, so I missed Oliver poisoning Felix's alcohol. From the way everyone acted after discovering his body, I was thinking something much more gruesome had happened, like they were gonna pull to a wide shot and show that he'd been gored or something (those antlers Oliver was wearing sure were ominous). And he just manipulated Venetia into killing herself, which should be obvious after thinking about it, but at the moment I was like wait, did HE slit her wrists?

How do you know it was fifteen years later when Oliver 'ran into' Elspeth? I might have blinked and missed a date or something. 

[QQQQ]

I had such a sense of movie  deja vu when the family was behaving as if nothing was happening when Felix's body was being taken away and they kept eating... Did this scene remind anyone else of a different movie?

[AngieBee1]

1 hour ago, Giuseppe said:

How do you know it was fifteen years later when Oliver 'ran into' Elspeth? I might have blinked and missed a date or something. 

People have said they can see the date on Sir James' obituary.  The barista and the people outside the café are wearing masks.

[methodwriter85]

Yeah, I believe the date says something like 2021.

I did like that wistful way Rosamund said, "I suppose you would be" when she notices that Oliver is all grown up, as a woman who lost both of her children in their early 20's. So repressed but sad.

Edited December 31, 2023 by methodwriter85

[kiddo82]

9 hours ago, AngieBee1 said:

People have said they can see the date on Sir James' obituary.  The barista and the people outside the café are wearing masks.

The masks was great shorthand for the passage of one time frame to another.  

[methodwriter85]

I kind of figured they were just doing Dawson casting with Barry Keoghan playing a 20-year old (and there were moments where you could really see his actual age) but then the flash forward happened.  They chose to cast a guy in his 30's and make him look younger rather then try to make a 20-year old look believable as a 35-year old for one scene.

Edited January 1 by methodwriter85

[proserpina65]

So I watched this again on New Year's Eve because I thought maybe I hadn't given it a fair shake the first time and perhaps it got better after the point at which I had originally left.  Nope, it went from mostly boring to absolutely terrible pretty quickly and stayed there.  The last half hour or so I kept checking my watch hoping it was going to be over any minute; time honestly seemed to be standing still.

I have so many problems with this movie, starting with the entire premise (as stated by Ms. Fennell in an interview) as skewering the rich.  Because in the end, the only sympathetic characters from the moment Oliver arrived at Saltburn were the rich ones.  Well, and Pamela but we saw so little of her that she hardly mattered.

But my biggest problem was Barry Keoghan.  He was too old to ever look convincingly like a college student (since he wasn't presented as a "older" student) and I never bought his character as either a poor scholarship boy or as the master manipulator he was supposed to be.  I won't blame that entirely on Keoghan's performance.  The utterly shit writing surely had a great deal to do with it.

On 11/30/2023 at 5:03 AM, methodwriter85 said:

Also, "Murder on the Dance Floor" is one of my favorite songs do yeah. I did get annoyed at the anachronistic references to "Superbad" and "Apple Bottom Jeans" songs that are '07

I did like some of the music.  And Ewan Mitchell.  And I thought Jacob Elordi did a good job making Felix appealing enough to support the notion of someone becoming obsessed with him; I knew nothing about him prior to Saltburn and didn't really have any expectations but I'd maybe check out his work in the future if the subject interested me.

So all in all, my initial impression of the movie was wrong.  It sucked, but not for the reason I originally thought.  It was just shocking for the shock value and I hate that.  I knew going in it wasn't my kind of thing and honestly, if not for Ewan, I wouldn't have bothered.  Basically it was a awful way to end the year.

[Angeleyes]

It left me wondering what the ultimate payoff was for Oliver. Did he want the house and or money or just the destruction of these people? Is he really going to be satisfied going forward? Sure he was dancing around naked, but then what? Can he really maintain that large house long term plus, it’s not likely he would be accepted by people at that level of society. None of the staff or other family members thought these deaths were suspicious, especially when Oliver inherited everything? The family didn’t protest the will? I know, it’s just a movie and I’m overthinking. 

[AngieBee1]

Quote

It left me wondering what the ultimate payoff was for Oliver. Did he want the house and or money or just the destruction of these people? Is he really going to be satisfied going forward?

The ultimate payoff was to just be with Felix in any way he could (friendship or romantically).  Then when his secrets was going to put the end to that everything spiraled. He tried to lure Venetia back in with a kiss and that wasn't working so she had to go.  To me, if all he wanted was Saltburn or to destroy the family he would not have waited 15 years to do so.

Quote

Can he really maintain that large house long term plus, it’s not likely he would be accepted by people at that level of society.

He has the same chance of success at maintaining the estate as Elspeth had. She was living off of Sir James' money which she willed to Oliver. 

I think by the time he gets Saltburn he knows this. He knew it all those years back: people not remembering his name when they sang Happy Birthday to him, not  holding the attention of Henry's wife at the party.  It's as Emerald Fennell says, a "Pyrrhic victory".  It truly is. He "won", but at the cost of not having Felix in the world. 

Quote

None of the staff or other family members thought these deaths were suspicious

Twice when looking for Fellx, Duncan stopped and glared at Oliver. He is even standing on the mound looking at Oliver at Elspeth's grave. He knows Oliver is behind this. 

Quote

The family didn’t protest the will?

For all we know Elspeth had no other family. Even if Sir James' sister (Felix's mother) wanted to contest it, she had already been cut out by Sir James. But I think it would have been unnecessary to delve into that. It is, to me, supposed to be a hollow victory for Oliver.  He probably dreamt of having a life like the one he now had, but it's tainted.

[Irlandesa]

I heard some people on the radio talking about the bathtub scene (without any details) and so I decided to give this a chance because I didn't really have much else to watch last night.

I've read parts of this movie are taking off on TikTok and, after watching it, I think that's my problem with it.  There are parts of this movie I enjoyed, even loved.  Lots of parts that amused me, delightfully shocked/surprised me, visually pleased me...etc.  But those parts didn't really coalesce into a completely enjoyable movie. It feels like a movie of curated bite-sized snippets crafted to make a splash on social media. It certainly didn't have enough to justify its 2 hour and 10 minute run time while simultaneously feeling rushed at the very end.

I would have gotten rid of so much at the boarding school.  That felt like it lasted longer than it needed to.  And parts in the middle. 

However, as much as I feel like it was too long and I probably won't watch again, I will remember many of the memorable or more iconic scenes like the bathtub scene, the grave site scene, the dinner scene and the nude dance at the end.

And those memories might trick me into watching again thinking I enjoyed it more than I actually did.

 

[Dr.OO7]

On 12/31/2023 at 6:41 PM, methodwriter85 said:

Yeah, I believe the date says something like 2021.

I did like that wistful way Rosamund said, "I suppose you would be" when she notices that Oliver is all grown up, as a woman who lost both of her children in their early 20's. So repressed but sad.

It's really heartbreaking to realize--as evidenced by her more sensible clothing and hairstyle--that she isn't the same vapid, superficial Rich Bitch she used to be, only for all to go to hell when she takes in Oliver again.

On 1/6/2024 at 4:54 AM, AngieBee1 said:

He probably dreamt of having a life like the one he now had, but it's tainted.

Does he care?

The ending of The Talented Mr. Ripley was genuinely sad. Tom certainly realized that taking over Dickie's life had cost him everything, including having to kill the one person who truly loved him for himself. I don't Oliver gives a damn. If anything, his final monologue just before he kills Elspeth implies that he hated Felix even as he simultaneously loved him.

[proserpina65]

On 1/6/2024 at 3:04 AM, Angeleyes said:

None of the staff or other family members thought these deaths were suspicious, especially when Oliver inherited everything? The family didn’t protest the will?

You'd think the butler would've raised the red flag given his obvious dislike of Oliver.  Honestly, it was a ridiculous ending which made no fucking sense whatsoever.

[kiddo82]

Could the ending have taken place in Oliver's head?  Unreliable narrator and all that.

Edited January 10 by kiddo82

[Ambrosefolly]

On 11/30/2023 at 9:10 AM, proserpina65 said:

I'd rather have hung out with Michael Gavey than Felix and his asshole friends.  Seriously, when the socially inept, easily triggered math genius was the most pleasant character, it clearly wasn't something I was meant to enjoy.

Michael Gavey was the most pleasant character in the movie because he was the only authentic character.

[proserpina65]

On 1/9/2024 at 9:17 PM, kiddo82 said:

Could the ending have taken place in Oliver's head?  Unreliable narrator and all that.

Hmmm, I suppose that's possible.  Didn't think of that.

[SlovakPrincess]

It's like The Talented Mr. Ripley but poorly written, gross, frustrating, smug, and with the writer/director constantly giggling at me and going "Isn't it shocking?!  Aren't you shocked?"   No, Emerald Fennel, I'm annoyed.  

Parts of this could work -- in a movie that knew what the hell it was trying to say.  Rosamund Pike (as someone so removed from reality by wealth she's proudly vapid), is easily the best part.  Jacob Elordi perfectly portrays that unique mix of noblesse oblige / callousness in the rich golden boy - and he's very good in the scenes where Felix learns the truth about Oliver.  Fennel could have done something interesting with Farleigh or Duncan the butler (but apparently chose not to).  And the naked dance scene is Barry Keoghan's best work here -- it makes literally no sense whatsoever to tack it on the end of this movie, but in a better movie with a better story, it actually could have been used to great effect, as funny, joyful, or disturbing. 

Otherwise, Keoghan doesn't work for me at all in this.  He's too old for the part and looks it.  The script gives him two things to do here: look like a blank-eyed fish out of water or do something disturbing (and boy does Fennel keep throwing that at us -- by the f**king-the-grave scene I actually laughed out loud, because lol please stooooopppp Emerald, we get it).  I don't buy whatever sexual hold he supposedly develops over Venetia at one point in the movie.  Unlike in Ripley, I'm not fascinated by what makes this guy tick or feeling tension build wondering what he's going to do and if he'll be caught.   

Just a complete annoying mess.    

[Ambrosefolly]

Here is my pet theory about Emerald Fennel's justifications about Oliver's actions and why they aren't quite landing every time she explains it. Emerald's father is a high end jeweler in the UK, well known to the point of having his own wikipedia page and a list of celebrities he made pieces for. However, that is the thing; he needed to sell to the nouveau rich and aristocracy to maintain an upper middle class status. While she could respect people like Elton John who earned his money on his talent, she probably deeply resents that that her family needed to service people of generational wealth and only the wealthy. The before mention Elton John could sell his music to everyone, rich, poor, middle class, all around the world, so he didn't need the nobility like Emerald's family did.  Oliver is her stand in,  upper middle class, Oxford educated and the Catton family is the stand in for the aristocratic clients her dad had to service. The thing is, there is so much class envy she projecting, it has blinded to Oliver, her stand-ins, own privilege. There are plenty of kids, even in the UK that would love to be in Oliver's position; nice middle class house and being educated at Oxford. A good portion of the audience turned against his character because unlike Tom Ripley, who grew up poor, Oliver also never knew real struggle in the same way that Felix never knew struggle. And as much as Emerald hates it, I am sure that she used a few of her father's connections to get her foot in the door in the world of entertainment.  It didn't pave the way, it is more than the average person gets. 

The thing is to most Americans that watched the movie, the Cattons are the wealthy, weird, generous family whose kids threw the best parties, so why destroy or even hurt people that throw charity functions and lets their kids' friends tag along on the occasional luxurious trip?

[SlovakPrincess]

I think one of the things the film does do well is show the Cattons are nice and lovably eccentric on the surface ... become a bother or boring, and out you go.  (Except Felix goes out of his way to find Oliver's parents and broker a reunion, completely undermining this -- did Fennel realize creating the "a-ha!" moment for Felix meant turning Felix into a person far more selfless and motivated than most college students, let alone super-privileged ones, would be???).

Oliver is too extreme and unconvincing for us to do what Fennel wants -- cheer despite ourselves when he murders a sad, sickly, lonely Elspeth at the end of the movie, and then gleefully dances.  Oliver is desperately obsessed AND a calm, cold schemer; painfully awkward AND a sexual god who easily seduces Venetia and Farleigh when the plot requires it -- and some sort of stand in for everyone who resents the super-rich (not for any lofty political reason, just a pathetic, greedy desire to be the super-rich).  Give me a break.  

Fennel has made a very pretty movie with a lot of half-finished ideas that work against each other.

Ripley worked because Matt Damon made Tom's desperation to be included palpable and understandable and Jude Law's Dickie was such a magnificent, beautiful bastard that you totally get why Tom desires him and snaps so violently when Dickie rejects him.  Hell, Kellie Martin's obsession with and killing Tori Spelling in Death of a Cheerleader worked better on an emotional level than this movie (I'm only sort of joking).  

[Spartan Girl]

10 hours ago, Ambrosefolly said:

Here is my pet theory about Emerald Fennel's justifications about Oliver's actions and why they aren't quite landing every time she explains it. Emerald's father is a high end jeweler in the UK, well known to the point of having his own wikipedia page and a list of celebrities he made pieces for. However, that is the thing; he needed to sell to the nouveau rich and aristocracy to maintain an upper middle class status. While she could respect people like Elton John who earned his money on his talent, she probably deeply resents that that her family needed to service people of generational wealth and only the wealthy. The before mention Elton John could sell his music to everyone, rich, poor, middle class, all around the world, so he didn't need the nobility like Emerald's family did.  Oliver is her stand in,  upper middle class, Oxford educated and the Catton family is the stand in for the aristocratic clients her dad had to service. The thing is, there is so much class envy she projecting, it has blinded to Oliver, her stand-ins, own privilege. There are plenty of kids, even in the UK that would love to be in Oliver's position; nice middle class house and being educated at Oxford. A good portion of the audience turned against his character because unlike Tom Ripley, who grew up poor, Oliver also never knew real struggle in the same way that Felix never knew struggle. And as much as Emerald hates it, I am sure that she used a few of her father's connections to get her foot in the door in the world of entertainment.  It didn't pave the way, it is more than the average person gets.

I don’t want to speculate because I don’t know Emerald or what motivates her, but if any of this is really why she wrote it this way, then JESUS. Resenting others that have it better than you is such a waste of time and energy.

[proserpina65]

On 1/13/2024 at 10:42 PM, Ambrosefolly said:

A good portion of the audience turned against his character because unlike Tom Ripley, who grew up poor, Oliver also never knew real struggle in the same way that Felix never knew struggle. 

This is a huge part of why the movie did not work for me.  Well that, and the fact that Barry Keoghan was miscast.  And the gross stuff, so much grossness for no real point other than shock value.

[Ohiopirate02]

I watched this over the weekend, and was bored.  The plot does not support the runtime.  Too many lingering shots of Saltburn and the Catton's possessions that did nothing to add to the plot.  I wanted more scenes showing the class divide with Oliver bumbling through various interactions with the Cattons and staff instead.  And the Oxford section dragged on far too long for a story that has been told so many times before.  

I also wanted more Rosamund Pike's Elspeth.  She was the best part of the movie.  

[Ambrosefolly]

On 1/14/2024 at 9:39 AM, Spartan Girl said:

I don’t want to speculate because I don’t know Emerald or what motivates her, but if any of this is really why she wrote it this way, then JESUS. Resenting others that have it better than you is such a waste of time and energy.

This was just a pet theory. I concede I might be totally wrong and will chalked up to her writing what she knowns, gaps in what she doesn't know and her perception vs the audience. By all accounts, people loved working with her. I do buy the idea that this a vampire movie without supernatural elements & no finale girl as she said it was, but when EF starts talking class, I zone right out. I see Olivier like Joe from the tv show You, and the Cattons like Guinevere Beck, both Beck and the Cattons might not have been as great as they self believed but innocent, and their only crime being crossing paths with a monster in a human body that simultaneously idealized and resented them. 

[catrice2]

Farleigh was the best part of the movie.  Hope to see more from this actor.  Pike is always stellar, but I just don't get the hype for the movie or for Barry or Jacob's peformance.    The daughter and Farleigh were better. 

[Dr.OO7]

Jacob Elordi hosted SNL last night and apologized to everyone who saw Saltburn with their parents. 😄😄😄😄

[kiddo82]

Thankfully I didn't see this one with my parents but I still think about the time I saw The Shape of Water with my dad.  If I could have allowed myself to get swallowed up by my movie theater seat, I would have.

[proserpina65]

12 hours ago, Dr.OO7 said:

Jacob Elordi hosted SNL last night and apologized to everyone who saw Saltburn with their parents. 😄😄😄😄

He should apologize to everyone who saw it, period.  Although since he wasn't the reason I tortured myself with it, I'll cut him a break.

I saw it alone because even my best friend wouldn't go with me, and she still owes me for making watch Last Exit to Brooklyn.

Edited January 22 by proserpina65