Chit-Chat: What's On Your Mind Today?

[Bastet]

42 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

My family always put a priority on travel and I'm glad they did.  I got to see a lot of the country and Canada before I was 20. 

Same here -- by the time I graduated high school, I'd been to more than half the states (and a bit into Canada, but I didn't travel farther abroad until I was on my own).  I love traveling. 

My cat doesn't like anyone but me, so when my parents (or my friend, at Thanksgiving when my parents and I are gone together) take care of her she's quite lonely, which means I haven't been comfortable being gone more than a week at a time since I adopted her, and these days I can't go anywhere as she needs medication every 12 hours (and it can't just be put in her food), so I still have quite a backlog of places I want to explore, but I'm glad to have already been able to see more places than many people are ever able to, when I still hopefully have many good exploring years left.

Edited May 2 by Bastet

[Yeah No]

1 minute ago, Bastet said:

Same here -- by the time I graduated high school, I'd been to more than half the states (and a bit into Canada, but I didn't travel farther abroad until I was on my own).  I love traveling.  My cat doesn't like anyone but me, so when my parents (or my friend, at Thanksgiving when my parents and I are gone together) take care of her she's quite lonely, which means I haven't been comfortable being gone more than a week at a time since I adopted her, and these days I can't go anywhere as she needs medication every 12 hours (and it can't just be put in her food), so I still have quite a backlog of places I want to explore, but I'm glad to have already been able to see more places than many people are ever able to with hopefully many good exploring years left.

Yes!  I often think the same thing.  Not having kids or pets I was able to travel during those years when most of my peers were taking care of families and just not able to manage as many trips as I could.  My husband and I even took separate vacations at times.  I went through a phase in my late 30s and 40s where I had a lot of frequent flyer miles and would jump on a plane to visit friends in different parts of the country.  I don't regret any of it, it was amazing.  I still have a bucket list of places I want to go (especially Italy and Sicily because of my mother's heritage), but I've been to England a few times and Ireland.  I am suddenly in a situation where I am able to afford a little traveling again and of course now my husband is planning all these trips for us.  Covid delayed these plans so they have been shelved for a while now and I figure at my age I'd better go sooner rather than later. 

[Bastet]

1 minute ago, Yeah No said:

My husband and I even took separate vacations at times. 

I wonder if that's unusual; a very brief internet search indicates it's common, but I didn't do a proper one. 

Among the couples I know, it is indeed the norm -- they have a mix of family trips (if they have kids), couple trips, individual trips with their respective friends, and maybe individual solo trips (I say maybe because it only applies to about half of them; there seem to be a good number of people who don't like traveling alone*).  My parents had that mix (well, except for my dad going on friend trips; he hates people even more than I do, so he has very few friends and I don't think he ever liked any of them enough to travel with them), so that's the norm with which I grew up.

*Which always stands out to me.  Not as anything bad, just as so different from my own preference, as I love traveling alone most of all forms of travel.  I can do a weekend trip with just about anyone I like, or an occasional week-long trip with a very short list of people, but to do that regularly, or take a longer trip, no way in hell with anyone I know.

[ABay]

Traveling solo has been my norm and it's my preference. I could travel with someone else but only if we have our own rooms. I don't want to be with people 24 hours a day, even people I like.

[Browncoat]

2 hours ago, ABay said:

Traveling solo has been my norm and it's my preference. I could travel with someone else but only if we have our own rooms. I don't want to be with people 24 hours a day, even people I like.

Same.  I generally tell people I don't share well, and must have my own bathroom. 

[kristen111]

20 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

How about mobile phones that are just, now hear me out - phones?

All thru grammar school, this kid who liked me used to punch me in my upper arm which was black n blue as a result.  He came from a 7 kid poor family, so I didn’t want to report him as his Mother probably had her hands full.  I never told my Mother either.  Never told her anything.  I always wanted to keep things to myself.    In fact lots of minor things happened tome, but I never rocked the boat and got anyone in trouble, even when I was older.  I must be very strong inside.  The only thing that freaked me out in my life was when my Disney daughter had cancer a few years ago at 39.  Two surgeries, 14 radiation therapys and pills.  Her husband bought her a small Timeshare and they go often.  If it wasn’t for my wonderful husband, I would have died from fright.  She’s cancer free now, and enjoys every day to the fullest, thank God.

[JustHereForFood]

9 hours ago, Yeah No said:

I agree with you.  Most of my bullies were entitled narcissists.  Were they given mixed messages in childhood?  For sure, but as far as being "victims of trauma"?  Yeah, no.

I've dealt with both and I actually think mental bullying is worse.  Usually physical bullying is less frequent especially if we're talking kids bullying other kids.  Unlike mental bullying it doesn't follow you around everywhere you go (and online like it can today).  It has to take place face-to-face.  So there's less opportunity to commit it.  Plus, usually physical bullying is what I would consider a lesser form of mental abuse than true mental bullying.  It exists on a more basic emotional level.  It doesn't seek to destroy you completely little by little every day of your life unless the person is out to murder you. 

Mental bullying can be a reign of terror from which there is no escape that seeks to absolutely crush and annihilate you, not just give you a black eye and steal your lunch money.  It messes with your self esteem and makes you feel absolutely worthless.  The emotional cuts can be deeper than with physical bullying too.  When I have been on the receiving end of physical bullying usually the bullies were not operating on that deep a level.  It would be hard to sustain physical bullying that was that relentless and emotionally crippling unless it were in the context of an abusive domestic relationship.

Also, mental bullying can be committed by adults too.  You don't see many adults physically bullying other adults in the same way as kids do.  But there are many toxic adult mental bullies online and in person and I have been on the receiving end of them too in years past.  And in many situations they are much harder to get away from than physical bullies because they can exist in your workplace, your organizations, your social groups and operate under the radar.  Physical bullying is a lot harder to hide.

I've also experienced both and we'll have to agree to disagree. Being scared for your physical safety also leaves you stressed (I would also count being explicitly threatened with physical/sexual violence into that category). With online, you can technically log off - yes, it's not fair to have to do that, but at least it can be a means to escape.

[Yeah No]

37 minutes ago, JustHereForFood said:

I've also experienced both and we'll have to agree to disagree. Being scared for your physical safety also leaves you stressed (I would also count being explicitly threatened with physical/sexual violence into that category). With online, you can technically log off - yes, it's not fair to have to do that, but at least it can be a means to escape.

I hear you although in my case there were ways to deal with the fear of physical abuse such as avoiding places where the bullies would be and of course what they do is more obvious and criminally dangerous so there are authorities and authority figures you can get involved too.  You can't always avoid people at work or in school that will engage in mental bullying and people tend to dismiss you as a "wuss" if you complain about it or dismiss it because it's harder to see.

I used to regularly get roughed up by bullies at the end of my block for lunch money.  I got my hair pulled in the hallways at school.  Cursed at, shoved, punched.  I even had a very tall and large friend in Jr. High that called herself my "bodyguard" who volunteered to walk with me through the halls to protect me as it was dangerous to walk though the halls back then!  But interestingly, despite that I don't wear scars from any of that physical bullying to this day the same way I wear the emotional scars I got from the mental and emotional bullying I suffered.  It's hard to explain but that was far more toxic and harder to get over than any physical abuse I ever got in my life.  The "mean girls" that emotionally bullied me were people I wanted to be friends with, or they were in fact my teachers!  I was bullied by my 2nd grade teacher.  She would back me against the fence in the schoolyard and call me a little "snot nose".  I never did anything to deserve it.  I was a good kid and smart.  My 4th grade teacher wasn't much better.  The people that physically bullied me I didn't know or care to know.  I think that makes the difference for me, and it's a big one.  YMMV.

I mentioned some of the stories I could tell about living in the Bronx when I was young - Here's one:

I was once threatened with physical bullying by a woman that lived upstairs from me in the Bronx back when I was in my 20s.  She would come home after a night of drinking and beat up her girlfriend.  My husband and I were separated at the time so I was alone.  I would wake up at 3:00 a.m. to the sound of furniture being thrown across the room, cursing, yelling, and cries for help as the victim was beaten.  I was terrified and afraid to complain but after a while it got worse and I was afraid for the victim's life so I complained to the landlord.  He put them on a warning and for a while they were as quiet as church mice.

Then one day I was afraid that the victim was being murdered because the violence was that loud and bad so I called the police.  I asked not to be named in both cases but of course the abuser figured it was me and started physically threatening me in the elevator and hallway of the building.  I was literally afraid to come and go from my own apartment building and had to take the stairs and sneak in and out the back way.  I told the landlord again and he put them on notice that the next time it happened they would be evicted.  It just so happened that my husband was moving back in with me the next week so he went up there and told them if they threatened me again they'd have to deal with both him and the police.  After that the bully backed down and they were soon evicted from the building.  As terrifying as that was it doesn't hurt me to recall it the way the mental/emotional bullying I suffered as a kid does.

Edited May 2 by Yeah No

[kristen111]

3 hours ago, ABay said:

Traveling solo has been my norm and it's my preference. I could travel with someone else but only if we have our own rooms. I don't want to be with people 24 hours a day, even people I like.

Ha, I get ya.  I was brought up in a two bedroom house.  My parents had one bedroom .. me and my two sisters had another.  I had to sleep with my older sister until I got married.  I absolutely HATED it and never got a good nights sleep.  I love my own space.  Once in awhile, even my husband or I will wind up on the sofa.  I hate noise in my bedroom, so sleep with a sound machine on full blast.  I can’t listen to him snoring, even tho I love him.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[PRgal]

59 minutes ago, JustHereForFood said:

I've also experienced both and we'll have to agree to disagree. Being scared for your physical safety also leaves you stressed (I would also count being explicitly threatened with physical/sexual violence into that category). With online, you can technically log off - yes, it's not fair to have to do that, but at least it can be a means to escape.

Or they're incredibly jealous/resentful of your life.  I went to high school with a girl who called "white washed" (basically a "banana" or someone who was "yellow on the outside and white inside" because I wasn't interested in Cantopop or any of the other Hong. Kong boybands that many Hong Kong Canadian girls liked.  I liked country music and Broadway until I went all Lilith Fair later in high school).  Her dad was an optlometrist and worked well into the evening and weekends as well.  Oftentimes, she would sit in his office on weekends, doing homework, and later, helping out.  Even as an adult, she would comment on the school choices for my son (for preschool, anyway).  She's since stopped.  Maybe it took her until 40-something to grow up?

[kristen111]

40 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

I hear you although in my case there were ways to deal with the fear of physical abuse such as avoiding places where the bullies would be and of course what they do is more obvious and criminally dangerous so there are authorities and authority figures you can get involved too.  You can't always avoid people at work or in school that will engage in mental bullying and people tend to dismiss you as a "wuss" if you complain about it or dismiss it because it's harder to see.

I used to regularly get roughed up by bullies at the end of my block for lunch money.  I got my hair pulled in the hallways at school.  Cursed at, shoved, punched.  But interestingly I don't wear scars from that to this day the same way I wear the ones I got from the mental and emotional bullying I suffered.  It's hard to explain but that was far more toxic and harder to get over than any physical abuse I ever got in my life.  The "mean girls" that emotionally bullied me were people I wanted to be friends with, or they were in fact my teachers!  I was bullied by my 2nd grade teacher.  She would back me against the fence in the schoolyard and call me a little "snot nose".  I never did anything to deserve it.  I was a good kid and smart.  My 4th grade teacher wasn't much better.  The people that physically bullied me I didn't know or care to know.  I think that makes the difference for me, and it's a big one.  YMMV.

I mentioned some of the stories I could tell about living in the Bronx when I was young - Here's one:

I was once threatened with physical bullying by a woman that lived upstairs from me in the Bronx back when I was in my 20s.  She would come home after a night of drinking and beat up her girlfriend.  My husband and I were separated at the time so I was alone.  I would wake up at 3:00 a.m. to the sound of furniture being thrown across the room, cursing, yelling, and cries for help as the victim was beaten.  I was terrified and afraid to complain but after a while it got worse and I was afraid for the victim's life so I complained to the landlord.  He put them on a warning and for a while they were as quiet as church mice.

Then one day I was afraid that the victim was being murdered because the violence was that loud and bad so I called the police.  I asked not to be named in both cases but of course the abuser figured it was me and started physically threatening me in the elevator and hallway of the building.  I was literally afraid to come and go from my own apartment building and had to take the stairs and sneak in and out the back way.  I told the landlord again and he put them on notice that the next time it happened they would be evicted.  It just so happened that my husband was moving back in with me the next week so he went up there and told them if they threatened me again they'd have to deal with both him and the police.  After that the bully backed down and they were soon evicted from the building.  As terrifying as that was it doesn't hurt me to recall it the way the mental/emotional bullying I suffered as a kid does.

I don’t know about you, but in grammar school, all my teachers were old and spinsters.  They always were very crabby as I remember.  They actually used to pick on kids for no good reasons.  Then when I worked in the school system, I noticed the teachers were young and nice.  It was a very big difference from the old days.  School is enjoyable now, as it should be.  It’s a happier environment.   My oldest daughter just landed a job in the school library.  She’s ecstatic.  So am I.  It’s a happy place to work as things have changed for the better.

Edited May 2 by kristen111

[Yeah No]

Just now, kristen111 said:

I don’t know about you, but in grammar school, all my teachers were old and spinsters.  They always were very crabby as I remember.  They actually used to pick on kids for no good reasons.  Then when I worked in the school system, I noticed the teachers were young and nice.  It was a very big difference from the old days.  School is enjoyable now, as it should be.  It’s a happier environment.

Yes, thank you, you are absolutely right about the way the teachers were back then in public school especially in NYC.  I always got the impression that none of them were very happy people and were always crabby.  I do think most of them weren't married but even the married ones were often nasty so it went beyond that.  I don't know why I was their target.  It made no sense to me then or now.  But was very damaging to me as a kid to be singled out and treated unfairly by teachers, who were people I wanted to look up to.  Not all of them were that way.  I had a few that were very nice and thank goodness, because if not for them I don't know what would have happened. 

It's amazing that I did so well in school in spite of all of this.  Up until 4th grade the teachers told my parents I was a good student but they labeled me a "behavior problem".  I was not.  I was smarter than most of the rest of the kids in the class and the work wasn't challenging me enough so I was fidgety and bored.  But that was THEIR fault for not putting me in the right class soon enough.  They stared me off in 1st grade in the "dumb" class because I moved from another school and their excuse was they didn't know where to put me.  It wasn't until 3rd grade that I finally was put in the right class for me.  They used to have classes that were graded from "dumbest" to "smartest" back then.  I'm sure they don't do that now.  

[kristen111]

4 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

Yes, thank you, you are absolutely right about the way the teachers were back then in public school especially in NYC.  I always got the impression that none of them were very happy people and were always crabby.  I do think most of them weren't married but even the married ones were often nasty so it went beyond that.  I don't know why I was their target.  It made no sense to me then or now.  But was very damaging to me as a kid to be singled out and treated unfairly by teachers, who were people I wanted to look up to.  Not all of them were that way.  I had a few that were very nice and thank goodness, because if not for them I don't know what would have happened. 

It's amazing that I did so well in school in spite of all of this.  Up until 4th grade the teachers told my parents I was a good student but they labeled me a "behavior problem".  I was not.  I was smarter than most of the rest of the kids in the class and the work wasn't challenging me enough so I was fidgety and bored.  But that was THEIR fault for not putting me in the right class soon enough.  They stared me off in 1st grade in the "dumb" class because I moved from another school and their excuse was they didn't know where to put me.  It wasn't until 3rd grade that I finally was put in the right class for me.  They used to have classes that were graded from "dumbest" to "smartest" back then.  I'm sure they don't do that now.  

Yes .. there were three categories.  For reading, math and science in your homeroom class.  It was probably more work for the teachers.  When I worked, all the classes had a teacher aide to help out.  Progress finally.

[Mindthinkr]

Back to the travel discussion: 

My family also put an emphasis on travel as being part of an education. As I result I’m well traveled. I also did this for my daughter. I got her to 19 countries by the age of 18. She took Art Appreciation in college and was tickled that she had seen so many of them on our trips. 
I also enjoy traveling alone. Last time I went to Paris I spent a month there and had a swell time. I met lots of people which further enhanced my experience. 
 

Back to the bullying: 

My daughter experienced it terribly in middle school. One kid even shot her (yes, with a gun), but the authorities didn’t want to ruin his life (he was 16) by charging him. I even went to plead with the local judge. Since he was “allowed” to shoot her, everyone thought she was fair game and she was beaten up a few times. Even her school looked the other way. 
I made the decision to leave a wonderful job and move far away to a different state to give her a fresh start. Thank goodness my medical license had reciprocity. It was worth it. 
   

[PRgal]

24 minutes ago, Mindthinkr said:

Back to the travel discussion: 

My family also put an emphasis on travel as being part of an education. As I result I’m well traveled. I also did this for my daughter. I got her to 19 countries by the age of 18. She took Art Appreciation in college and was tickled that she had seen so many of them on our trips. 
I also enjoy traveling alone. Last time I went to Paris I spent a month there and had a swell time. I met lots of people which further enhanced my experience. 
 

Back to the bullying: 

My daughter experienced it terribly in middle school. One kid even shot her (yes, with a gun), but the authorities didn’t want to ruin his life (he was 16) by charging him. I even went to plead with the local judge. Since he was “allowed” to shoot her, everyone thought she was fair game and she was beaten up a few times. Even her school looked the other way. 
I made the decision to leave a wonderful job and move far away to a different state to give her a fresh start. Thank goodness my medical license had reciprocity. It was worth it. 
   

Was your daughter in a school with high school (say, 7-12)?  Just wondering why a high school aged kid was in a middle school.  Glad you guys moved away.  

[JustHereForFood]

40 minutes ago, Mindthinkr said:

 

Back to the bullying: 

My daughter experienced it terribly in middle school. One kid even shot her (yes, with a gun), but the authorities didn’t want to ruin his life (he was 16) by charging him. I even went to plead with the local judge. Since he was “allowed” to shoot her, everyone thought she was fair game and she was beaten up a few times. Even her school looked the other way. 
I made the decision to leave a wonderful job and move far away to a different state to give her a fresh start. Thank goodness my medical license had reciprocity. It was worth it. 
   

Not sure if it's ok to ask, why was he "allowed" to shoot her? I know laws are different in the US, but still, holy crap.

[Mindthinkr]

26 minutes ago, PRgal said:

Was your daughter in a school with high school (say, 7-12)?  Just wondering why a high school aged kid was in a middle school.  Glad you guys moved away.  

The shooting incident happened on a Columbus Day and he lived up the street. He wanted to see if shooting someone really hurt. Then the bullying began in school when everyone else saw there were no consequences to hurting her. 
I’m glad we moved too. She deserved all I could do as a mother to protect her. 

11 minutes ago, JustHereForFood said:

Not sure if it's ok to ask, why was he "allowed" to shoot her? I know laws are different in the US, but still, holy crap.

His father was a Viet Nam vet and had loaded guns all over the house. 
I’m sure his parents didn’t condone his action, but they didn’t punish him either. 
 

I guess I wasn’t clear and shouldn’t have used the word “allowed”. I meant more that he able to do it without consequences. That made others think they were entitled to hurt her too without repercussions. 

Edited May 2 by Mindthinkr

[chitowngirl]

When the ladies in my MOMs group travel to State convention, I ALWAYS get my own room. I get twitchy thinking of 4 to a hotel room and sharing a double bed with someone. When my husband and I, who have a queen bed, travel and have to sleep in a double-there is just no room. I would hate to be trying to claim space with someone not my husband or child.

[JustHereForFood]

9 minutes ago, Mindthinkr said:

The shooting incident happened on a Columbus Day and he lived up the street. He wanted to see if shooting someone really hurt. Then the bullying began in school when everyone else saw there were no consequences to hurting her. 
I’m glad we moved too. She deserved all I could do as a mother to protect her. 

His father was a Viet Nam vet and had loaded guns all over the house. 
I’m sure his parents didn’t condone his action, but they didn’t punish him either. 
 

I guess I wasn’t clear and shouldn’t have used the word “allowed”. I meant more that he able to do it without consequences. That made others think they were entitled to hurt her too without repercussions. 

Sorry to hear that. He sounds like a sociopath. I'm glad she survived.

[kristen111]

As a teen, we would sometimes hang out at the corner candy store.  One of the nice guys would walk me home.  One night this guy walked me home and showed me a gun in his pants.  I was horrified and didn’t go back to the candy store for a month.  He didn’t come often and had parents that were alcoholics and seven kids.  Later onas the years went by, I read in the papers that he was in jail for killing someone.  Then I heard he had died or something.  I think he was notorious.  A killer who grew up in a dysfunctional family.  His sister who went to my school died at 16 hanging out the window from an asthma attack.  I’m so glad my parents were very strict.  So is my husband.  He made sure our kids had after school activities and lots of sports to join.

[Bastet]

8 hours ago, ABay said:

I could travel with someone else but only if we have our own rooms. I don't want to be with people 24 hours a day, even people I like.

Same here, plus I somehow have a lot of snorers in my life and I cannot sleep in the same room with that racket!

[kristen111]

Very good therapy session today.  Sometimes it’s good to let things out.  Lifts a weight off.  

[athousandclowns]

I envy you all for your traveling. I look daily at solo trips as my best friend has been radio silent since his husband came into an inheritance and we would go someplace together when that happened.
 

I have GI issues Yeah No and was surprised the bracelet that sends little shocks up to your fingers/ palm worked for me.. do I understand that nausea from cruising has to do with how big the ship is and weather etc? The one cruise husband and I went on an agent arranged it and didn’t mention it was storm weather in Mexico and although we were on a great cruise line it was their smallest one. I didn’t get nausea and my husband wore that patch behind his ear and had no nausea. 

[shapeshifter]

3 hours ago, Mindthinkr said:

I guess I wasn’t clear and shouldn’t have used the word “allowed”. I meant more that he able to do it without consequences. That made others think they were entitled to hurt her too without repercussions. 

2 hours ago, kristen111 said:

As a teen, we would sometimes hang out at the corner candy store.  One of the nice guys would walk me home.  One night this guy walked me home and showed me a gun in his pants.  I was horrified and didn’t go back to the candy store for a month.  He didn’t come often and had parents that were alcoholics and seven kids.  Later on as the years went by, I read in the papers that he was in jail for killing someone.

@Mindthinkr, it might be worthwhile in terms of future "closure" to keep track of the shooter on FB etc.
About 50 years ago a man who I am 100% sure was a serial rapist if not serial killer abducted me when I was hitchhiking with my paintbox and easel and other equipment. I escaped physically unscathed, but had to abandon all my stuff to do so. At the police station I drew a portrait of him with a red and a black marker. I also had noted the color of the car and the model name from an ornament on the glove compartment, and that the plates were from Ontario (this was in Michigan). The police found him quickly, but he claimed I was a prostitute, and I no longer had "visible means of support." So that was the end of it. 
But I still wish I knew his name so I could find out what became of him and/or his next victims.

At the time, a brother of a friend who lived in the area declared that it was not right to let him go (like the shooter of your daughter, @Mindthinkr).
But I just wanted to distance myself (literally) from the psycho perp. 

But now, in hindsight, especially post-Me-Too, I feel like I let down other young women by not pursuing it at all. 

Nowadays you can at least keep tabs on the person and be willing to testify, if it comes to that.

 

Edited May 2 by shapeshifter

[kristen111]

6 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

@Mindthinkr, it might be worthwhile in terms of future "closure" to keep track of the shooter on FB etc.
About 50 years ago a man who I am 100% sure was a serial rapist if not serial killer abducted me when I was hitchhiking with my paintbox and easel and other equipment. I escaped physically unscathed, but had to abandon all my stuff to do so. At the police station I drew a portrait of him with a red and a black marker. I also had noted the color of the car and the model name from an ornament on the glove compartment, and that the plates were from Ontario (this was in Michigan). The police found him quickly, but he claimed I was a prostitute, and I no longer had "visible means of support." So that was the end of it. 
But I still wish I knew his name so I could find out what became of him and/or his next victims.

 

Yikes.  Seems like lots of us had bad encounters of something or another.  At the time it happened, you don’t know what to do.

[peacheslatour]

Not to change the subject but we have a fugitive zebra in our neck of the woods. He escaped from a horse trailer that was taking him and three mares to Montana. They were able to catch the ladies but he has gone rogue.

 

 

 

[EtheltoTillie]

4 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

@Mindthinkr, it might be worthwhile in terms of future "closure" to keep track of the shooter on FB etc.
About 50 years ago a man who I am 100% sure was a serial rapist if not serial killer abducted me when I was hitchhiking with my paintbox and easel and other equipment. I escaped physically unscathed, but had to abandon all my stuff to do so. At the police station I drew a portrait of him with a red and a black marker. I also had noted the color of the car and the model name from an ornament on the glove compartment, and that the plates were from Ontario (this was in Michigan). The police found him quickly, but he claimed I was a prostitute, and I no longer had "visible means of support." So that was the end of it. 
But I still wish I knew his name so I could find out what became of him and/or his next victims.

At the time, a brother of a friend who lived in the area declared that it was not right to let him go (like the shooter of your daughter, @Mindthinkr).
But I just wanted to distance myself (literally) from the psycho perp. 

But now, in hindsight, especially post-Me-Too, I feel like I let down other young women by not pursuing it at all. 

Nowadays you can at least keep tabs on the person and be willing to testify, if it comes to that.

 

You have alluded to this story before.  Thank you for sharing.  It must be painful. 

6 hours ago, Bastet said:

Same here, plus I somehow have a lot of snorers in my life and I cannot sleep in the same room with that racket!

Some of my colleagues will share a room on a CLE trip to save a few bucks, but I just can't do it.  Partly it's our only child gene, I guess.  I did enjoy summer camp, though, where we shared bunkhouses. 

[Bastet]

32 minutes ago, EtheltoTillie said:

I did enjoy summer camp, though, where we shared bunkhouses. 

I never went to summer camp; it sounded like a punishment to me, having to spend time with kids I didn't know, in shared quarters, with communal dining and forced activities.  At the time, I only knew one friend who went to camp, so as a kid it seemed like something that only happened in books, and somehow all those books were set in NY or elsewhere in the East, so I thought it was a regional thing and her parents, here in L.A., were just weird.  As a little bit of an older kid, it popped up in movies and TV shows (where, of course, wacky hijinks - or, you know, spree killings - ensued), but fictional was still my primary exposure.  Finally I got old enough to meet enough people to realize, duh, it was a thing plenty of real kids from all kinds of places had done.  Still not anything I'd have been interested in, but at least I was no longer so ignorant!

[roseha]

My siblings and I are so glad that our parents never tried to send us to summer camp, I think we all would have hated it.  The one experience I had was with girl scouts and let's just say it was awful.  I was definitely teased/bullied by the other girls (they claimed I had to clean the latrine), just verbally but it was awful.  I also didn't like the idea of sleeping in a sleeping bag, I am definitely the indoor type.

Edited May 3 by roseha

[EtheltoTillie]

49 minutes ago, Bastet said:

I never went to summer camp; it sounded like a punishment to me, having to spend time with kids I didn't know, in shared quarters, with communal dining and forced activities.  At the time, I only knew one friend who went to camp, so as a kid it seemed like something that only happened in books, and somehow all those books were set in NY or elsewhere in the East, so I thought it was a regional thing and her parents, here in L.A., were just weird.  As a little bit of an older kid, it popped up in movies and TV shows (where, of course, wacky hijinks - or, you know, spree killings - ensued), but fictional was still my primary exposure.  Finally I got old enough to meet enough people to realize, duh, it was a thing plenty of real kids from all kinds of places had done.  Still not anything I'd have been interested in, but at least I was no longer so ignorant!

Maybe camp is more of an east coast tradition. I went to a camp that was part of a federation of low-cost camps for working class Jewish kids to get them out of the city. This federation goes back to the early 20th century (there were also camps for Catholic kids). It was a chance to get away from parents!  Fun!  No high class activities like horseback riding. 

[Yeah No]

51 minutes ago, EtheltoTillie said:

Maybe camp is more of an east coast tradition. I went to a camp that was part of a federation of low-cost camps for working class Jewish kids to get them out of the city. This federation goes back to the early 20th century (there were also camps for Catholic kids). It was a chance to get away from parents!  Fun!  No high class activities like horseback riding. 

The travel camp I went to as a teenager was through the Riverdale YMHA.  It was much cheaper than most travel camps but it was very good.  By that time my days of being bullied were over and I had a great time.  We traveled all the way up to Montreal and Quebec City and all the way down to Disney World.  And the people were fantastic.  Many of them went to my schools but others I knew from the neighborhood.

Once we were supposed to stay overnight at an old sleep away camp with bunk houses in the White Mountains of New Hampshire but somehow there must have been a mix-up and no one was there to let us in when we got there.  We were way out in the middle of nowhere in 1972 before cell phones so we were up the creek without a paddle.  We ended up building a bonfire and sleeping outdoors in our sleeping bags.  Of course there were s'mores!  I got bitten up by mosquitos but it was worth it to see the stars at night like I'd never seen them before.  I had never seen so many stars in my life.  We usually stayed in cheap motels so this was very out of the ordinary.

As far as going to camp goes, I pretty much had to because my mother worked full time by the time I was 9 and there wasn't much to do in the Summers because nobody was around.  I would have been bored to death if I didn't go to camp.

[Yeah No]

8 hours ago, athousandclowns said:

I have GI issues Yeah No and was surprised the bracelet that sends little shocks up to your fingers/ palm worked for me.. do I understand that nausea from cruising has to do with how big the ship is and weather etc? The one cruise husband and I went on an agent arranged it and didn’t mention it was storm weather in Mexico and although we were on a great cruise line it was their smallest one. I didn’t get nausea and my husband wore that patch behind his ear and had no nausea. 

I bought one of those "shock" bracelets and hope it works for me.  I haven't tried it out yet.  I should.

Yes I think the size of the ship and the weather do have something to do with how much motion you might feel.  The bigger the ship the less you'll feel it.  And the Queen Mary II is supposed to have better stabilizers than cruise ships because it's a true ocean liner.  I am hoping for the best but will prepare for the worst.  Unfortunately if the weather is that bad I don't think anything will help me.  I do hope that I can tolerate the patch without too many side effects.  I emailed my doctor today to ask if she would prescribe it for me in advance so I can try it out.

[Yeah No]

6 hours ago, peacheslatour said:

Not to change the subject but we have a fugitive zebra in our neck of the woods. He escaped from a horse trailer that was taking him and three mares to Montana. They were able to catch the ladies but he has gone rogue.

 

 

 

LOL, that is hysterical, thanks for sharing that!  I heard about the zebra on my local news if you can believe that.  It looks like he's fitting in with PNW culture just fine, LOL!  😉😄

[GHScorpiosRule]

8 hours ago, EtheltoTillie said:

Maybe camp is more of an east coast tradition. I went to a camp that was part of a federation of low-cost camps for working class Jewish kids to get them out of the city. This federation goes back to the early 20th century (there were also camps for Catholic kids). It was a chance to get away from parents!  Fun!  No high class activities like horseback riding. 

I went to camp twice-through school. First one was at...Camp Letts? At Chesapeake Bay, I think? We were there a week. That was...fifth grade. Then in the 8th grade, went to camp again, and I'm blanking on where it was we went.

It was fun for me. And of course in high school, I joined the outdoors club, where we went backpacking near Harper's Ferry, and the last day before coming back home, we all went to Harper's Ferry; rock climbing at Crescent Rock in Virginia.

[peacheslatour]

1 hour ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

I went to camp twice-through school. First one was at...Camp Letts? At Chesapeake Bay, I think? We were there a week. That was...fifth grade. Then in the 8th grade, went to camp again, and I'm blanking on where it was we went.

It was fun for me. And of course in high school, I joined the outdoors club, where we went backpacking near Harper's Ferry, and the last day before coming back home, we all went to Harper's Ferry; rock climbing at Crescent Rock in Virginia.

Yes, despite living on the west coast, it was very common to go to camp in the summer. I loved it and so did my son when he went.  I don't know if Camp Sealth is still in operation but it was right on the Sound and we spent the days hiking, learning about nature and hanging out at the beach.

[PRgal]

I went to music camp in high school and it was a lot of fun.  I'll likely send my son to overnight camp when he's older, but I'm not sure if he'll be going to a traditional overnight camp (like the music camp I went to) or an enrichment camp at a university or boarding school - kids stay at the school's residence and eat in the cafeteria.  I have a friend who went to one when she was in middle school.

[peacheslatour]

Correction to the zebra story. It turned out today that the still fugitive striped critter is a female zebra. Go girl!

[JustHereForFood]

I've been to a summer camp a few times and one of those was my worst experience with bullying. I was 12, bullied occasionally at school and there I was during the holidays, with a completely different group of kids, bullied again. At that time, I was almost resigned that I would probably always end up bullied in any new environment. (It turned out to not be the case, thankfully, though I still don't know how to make friends). At least, those camps were for about 7-10 days. I wasn't forced to go, but encouraged by my parents who wanted me to "do things" during summer. We usually went to one vacation to Croatia and one somewhere to the mountains, which were good, but I still kind of preferred the time I was alone at home and could do whatever I wanted on my own - which was basically watch TV and read books all day, I wasn't interested at all in going outside other than for lunch. 

[Bastet]

My parents got their first motorhome when I was six, so I got to do all the outdoor stuff that way, without being forced to be around kids I didn't know.  I'd frequently meet someone my age at a campground and wind up hanging out with them, but I could be by myself whenever I wanted.  Best of both worlds, just like being an only child but having kids my age on the block -- I always had someone to play with when I wanted, but didn't have to have another kid in my space when I didn't want to.

[peacheslatour]

47 minutes ago, Bastet said:

My parents got their first motorhome when I was six, so I got to do all the outdoor stuff that way, without being forced to be around kids I didn't know.  I'd frequently meet someone my age at a campground and wind up hanging out with them, but I could be by myself whenever I wanted.  Best of both worlds, just like being an only child but having kids my age on the block -- I always had someone to play with when I wanted, but didn't have to have another kid in my space when I didn't want to.

This is why I loved being an only child. I could go over to my friends houses and hang out but when they started to rough house or get too fractious, I could lust go home to my nice, quiet house and read, make a snack or watch TV in peace.

[Yeah No]

6 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

56 minutes ago, Bastet said:

My parents got their first motorhome when I was six, so I got to do all the outdoor stuff that way, without being forced to be around kids I didn't know.  I'd frequently meet someone my age at a campground and wind up hanging out with them, but I could be by myself whenever I wanted.  Best of both worlds, just like being an only child but having kids my age on the block -- I always had someone to play with when I wanted, but didn't have to have another kid in my space when I didn't want to.

This is why I loved being an only child. I could go over to my friends houses and hang out but when they started to rough house or get too fractious, I could lust go home to my nice, quiet house and read, make a snack or watch TV in peace.

Member of the only child club here - The two of you sound just like me!  I also liked it that it was easy for my parents to take me everywhere they would go so I had some experiences some other kids might not have. 

A lot of people think only children don't learn how to share or socialize with other kids but when we grew up we were always out playing with other kids and sharing our toys so it was almost like having a slew of brothers and sisters.  And their parents were all like your aunts and uncles.  It really took a village.  I don't know if it would be like that today with the way kids grow up now. 

And it gets me mad when people say that only children are "spoiled".  Sure, some may be like any other kid, but the ones I have known have not been and I wasn't with my Depression-era parents who came from nothing and encouraged my autonomy and self-reliance.  It's interesting that some of my best friends have also been only children.  It certainly wasn't intentional.  Perhaps there is something we all share that resonates for us?  BTW, my Dad was also an only child and so was his mother!

[peacheslatour]

9 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

Member of the only child club here - The two of you sound just like me!  I also liked it that it was easy for my parents to take me everywhere they would go so I had some experiences some other kids might not have. 

A lot of people think only children don't learn how to share or socialize with other kids but when we grew up we were always out playing with other kids and sharing our toys so it was almost like having a slew of brothers and sisters.  And their parents were all like your aunts and uncles.  It really took a village.  I don't know if it would be like that today with the way kids grow up now. 

And it gets me mad when people say that only children are "spoiled".  Sure, some may be like any other kid, but the ones I have known have not been and I wasn't with my Depression-era parents who came from nothing and encouraged my autonomy and self-reliance.  It's interesting that some of my best friends have also been only children.  It certainly wasn't intentional.  Perhaps there is something we all share that resonates for us?  BTW, my Dad was also an only child and so was his mother!

So true. I always had chores and my only child son did too. My parents never handed me anything, if I wanted a toy or and ice cream form "the ice cream man" truck, I had to pull weeds - one penny per five weeds! Good lord we sound like old pioneers! "Why, we had to cross the prairie in covered wagons and we had to fight off outlaws and wild animals!"

[Yeah No]

45 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

So true. I always had chores and my only child son did too. My parents never handed me anything, if I wanted a toy or and ice cream form "the ice cream man" truck, I had to pull weeds - one penny per five weeds! Good lord we sound like old pioneers! "Why, we had to cross the prairie in covered wagons and we had to fight off outlaws and wild animals!"

Wow, that is severe.  My parents did give me Christmas gifts but if I wanted ice cream money I had to beg grandma for it.  She used to throw it down to me from the 2nd floor in a napkin wrapped with a rubber band, LOL.  I didn't get an allowance like other kids either.  I only got lunch money, which I used to save to buy candy, gum, pretzels and egg creams!  If I really wanted something I had to negotiate with my mother for it and she drove a hard bargain!  I always had to do something to get it.  My mother was a big deal maker back in the days when you could negotiate the price of things and she did it with me too, LOL. 

I was an early "latch-key kid".  They call Gen-X that but I was one before it was a thing.  So I was responsible for a lot of things before my parents came home from work, like laundry, walking and feeding the dog, feeding myself, putting leftovers in the oven for dinner, etc.  My grandma lived in our building so she was there when I needed her and I did hang out at her house often so it wasn't like I didn't have some adult supervision.  But like most grandmas she was very "hands off" with me so I didn't really feel like she was supervising me.  I did get to watch her cook, which was amazing as she was a real old world "mama mia" who made classic Italian food from scratch.  I often used to come over to her house to find a bowl with a cloth over it sitting on the dining table.  She would say, "Don't touch the dough, she has to rest", LOL.  Everything was "she", LOL.  My grandma was a classic and people would make excuses to come over to her house to eat her food.  It was that good.  She died in 1985 so it's been a long time since I've had it.

[peacheslatour]

2 hours ago, Yeah No said:

Wow, that is severe.  My parents did give me Christmas gifts but if I wanted ice cream money I had to beg grandma for it.  She used to throw it down to me from the 2nd floor in a napkin wrapped with a rubber band, LOL.  I didn't get an allowance like other kids either.  I only got lunch money, which I used to save to buy candy, gum, pretzels and egg creams!  If I really wanted something I had to negotiate with my mother for it and she drove a hard bargain!  I always had to do something to get it.  My mother was a big deal maker back in the days when you could negotiate the price of things and she did it with me too, LOL. 

I was an early "latch-key kid".  They call Gen-X that but I was one before it was a thing.  So I was responsible for a lot of things before my parents came home from work, like laundry, walking and feeding the dog, feeding myself, putting leftovers in the oven for dinner, etc.  My grandma lived in our building so she was there when I needed her and I did hang out at her house often so it wasn't like I didn't have some adult supervision.  But like most grandmas she was very "hands off" with me so I didn't really feel like she was supervising me.  I did get to watch her cook, which was amazing as she was a real old world "mama mia" who made classic Italian food from scratch.  I often used to come over to her house to find a bowl with a cloth over it sitting on the dining table.  She would say, "Don't touch the dough, she has to rest", LOL.  Everything was "she", LOL.  My grandma was a classic and people would make excuses to come over to her house to eat her food.  It was that good.  She died in 1985 so it's been a long time since I've had it.

Oh, I got Christmas presents it wasn't that bad. I was a latch key kid too. I literally wore our front door key on a string around my neck. Your grandma sounds like a total blast!

Edited May 4 by peacheslatour

[Dimity]

I am envious of people who lived near their grandparents!  My parents moved for work and were what was, then, a 3 day drive from their home town.  We got to see our grandparents every other summer.  One year though my sister closest in age to me and I got to spend the whole summer with them.  Magic.  So cool to be around two people who dote on you ☺️!

Edited May 3 by Dimity

[Browncoat]

I was a latch-key kid in the 70s, starting when I was six.  I kept my key in my lunchbox, and I had the same key until my parents had to have their lock changed sometime in the 2010s.  I might still have that key, although it is useless now.

[JustHereForFood]

3 hours ago, Yeah No said:

And it gets me mad when people say that only children are "spoiled".  

Oh, that pisses me of too. Maybe I was spoiled in the sense that my parents, especially my mom, wanted me to have all that I needed. And they were older compared to my classmates' parents - my mom was 36 when she had me, which is normal now but was considered old 30+ years ago, so she was quite overprotective. But some of the worst spoiled and unpleasant kids that I knew had siblings, so I don't think one can draw any generalization from that. 

[Yeah No]

1 hour ago, JustHereForFood said:

Oh, that pisses me of too. Maybe I was spoiled in the sense that my parents, especially my mom, wanted me to have all that I needed. And they were older compared to my classmates' parents - my mom was 36 when she had me, which is normal now but was considered old 30+ years ago, so she was quite overprotective. But some of the worst spoiled and unpleasant kids that I knew had siblings, so I don't think one can draw any generalization from that. 

Thanks, you get it.  I have said the same myself that some of the most spoiled kids I knew had siblings.  Maybe I didn't wear hand-me-downs and I had my mom's undivided attention but I think that's different than being spoiled.  My mom was 34 when she had me back in 1958.  My parents were also older than a lot of the other kids' parents.  My mom would have had me sooner but she married at 29 after a career in the Women's Army Corps. and then it took me a while to come along after a miscarriage before me.  But she was not overprotective at all, in fact the opposite.  She was very encouraging of my independence and never sheltered me, which suited my personality just fine.  We were very close and looked a lot alike.  She used to call me her little "carbon copy", LOL.  My parents would have had their 70th wedding anniversary two days ago.  They're celebrating in heaven!

[Bastet]

My parents were older than was typical at the time when they had me, too -- 32 in the early '70s.

And I did wear hand-me-downs even as an only child; my best friend had an older sister, and whenever she had clothes that no longer fit/she no longer wanted, she made a pile and my friend and I went through and negotiated over who got what.  (Our moms were really close friends, and our families spent a lot of time together, so we were honorary members of each other's families [still are], that's why I got to act like another sister when it came to the clothes.)  I had no issue with hand-me-downs -- they were new to me.

[EtheltoTillie]

We onlies have such similar stories.  Older parents, for a start.