Chit-Chat: What's On Your Mind Today?

[shapeshifter]

13 hours ago, Quof said:

Looking for advice.

I have someone coming to clean my house tomorrow. I've never done this, ever, for several reasons.  I hate to pay people to do things I can do myself.  I don't want people poking around in my house.  And I'm sure no one would clean better than I do myself.  

Because of an injury, I couldn't do a deep spring cleaning this year, so she's going to do the heavy tasks I can't do. 

What do I do while she's here????  She's a friend of a friend who does it as a side gig but I hadn't met her before now.   Nice lady, close to my age.  It will feel really weird to just sit and watch, but the house isn't big enough that I could just disappear to another area.   Do I just pretend she's not here? 

If it makes you feel any better, I've never had a house cleaner either.

[Bastet]

2 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

If it makes you feel any better, I've never had a house cleaner either.

I haven't either, because no one ever recommends theirs wholeheartedly, saying they do just as good or a better job, they all say it's good enough for the fact they don't want to do it themselves.  I don't want to do it myself anymore, either, and I'm happy to pay more than is typical to get it done the way I do it, but I'm not willing to pay even a lesser amount for an "eh, good enough" job.   One of these days that will change.

[Dimity]

3 minutes ago, Bastet said:

One of these days that will change.

I think I am almost there.  In the last year I've definitely let my own standards slip and I suspect it won't be long before I will be happy to pay someone to do the 'rough' as they say in British novels.  Even if they don't do it perfectly.  I'm not even doing it at all right now!

[fairffaxx]

I've never hired a housekeeper either.  When I was 5, my mother was pregnant with my little sister in Ohio during Spring/Summer.  My dad was highly frugal but he took pity on her & hired a local woman to clean the 2 story house once a week.  He didn't realize that my mom would feel the need to "just tidy up" for the cleaning lady, which entailed moving the sofa out into the middle of the living room to vacuum behind & under it, sweeping the kitchen & bathroom floors, washing the breakfast dishes, running up & downstairs to collect & stash all of my toys, etc., etc., etc.  I watched in horror as my increasingly pregnant mom "got ready" for the weekly visit while the temperature & humidity level rose month to month, & decided that I'd never put myself through such an ordeal. 

[Absolom]

Arthritis in my hands made the decision for me.  I could no longer get the fitted sheets on the bed.  Osteoarthritis in my back guaranteed my vacuuming, sweeping, and mopping days are gone.  I can do small areas to clean up spills, but not whole rooms.  My previous vacuum cleaner I couldn't even move.  At least I got a lighter one when that one broke. 

I've found if someone does all the big things, I can do the smaller fiddly things and If something really bothers me I ask them to do whatever.  That reminds me I forgot to have an area cleaned this last visit.  I'll put it down for next time.

[Absolom]

2 minutes ago, fairffaxx said:

I've never hired a housekeeper either.  When I was 5, my mother was pregnant with my little sister in Ohio during Spring/Summer.  My dad was highly frugal but he took pity on her & hired a local woman to clean the 2 story house once a week.  He didn't realize that my mom would feel the need to "just tidy up" for the cleaning lady, which entailed moving the sofa out into the middle of the living room to vacuum behind & under it, sweeping the kitchen & bathroom floors, washing the breakfast dishes, running up & downstairs to collect & stash all of my toys, etc., etc., etc.  I watched in horror as my increasingly pregnant mom "got ready" for the weekly visit while the temperature & humidity level rose month to month, & decided that I'd never put myself through such an ordeal.

Ah, it helps that while I was in early elementary school my mother had a cleaning lady who also did all the ironing and prepared dinner on her days - Tuesday and Thursday afternoons.  I was usually there also.  She's the one who taught me to clean so my assumption was cleaning ladies knew how to do it.  She was certainly better at it and more efficient than my mother.  All we did to prepare was a basic pick up and that was something my mother did require every evening before dinner.  We just did a better job of it Monday and Wednesday.  Those also became laundry days so the ironing would be ready to be done.  I do remember Pearl ironed underwear.  Nothing could talk her out it.  Mom tried to make sure it was all washed and put away so it wouldn't be ironed.  

[PRgal]

1 hour ago, supposebly said:

I prefer local coffee shops. Of the three Starbucks that I knew of when I moved here, only one is still open.

Anyway, I make better and cheaper coffee right here at home. 

My neighbourhood is basically coffee, ice cream/gelato, sushi and pizza.  I live within walking distance to three Starbucks (used to be five before the pandemic) and three Tim Horton's.  And numerous independent or local chains, too.  Oh yeah, I think there are three (at least) cannabis places too.  

[Anduin]

48 minutes ago, PRgal said:

My neighbourhood is basically coffee, ice cream/gelato, sushi and pizza.  I live within walking distance to three Starbucks (used to be five before the pandemic) and three Tim Horton's.  And numerous independent or local chains, too.  Oh yeah, I think there are three (at least) cannabis places too.  

Do you have room for houseguests?

[ECM1231]

7 hours ago, Mindthinkr said:

Most seniors around here get their coffee (when not having it at home) at McDonalds for 64 cents (seniors discount price) 

I had no idea Mickey D's offered senior discounts. AARP has a list of places that offer senior discounts and Dunkin Donuts was one of them.  My local DD doesn't participate, though. I think the discount was a free small coffee.  I'll have to check out McDonald's.

 

I agree about Starbucks. Went once and couldn't figure out what was so great about it. It DID taste burnt.

[shapeshifter]

1 hour ago, ECM1231 said:

AARP has a list of places that offer senior discounts

Every time I get a mailer to join AARP and see that they're offering a "2 for 1" for a year, I toss it in the recycling on principle, since that is not a deal from which I can benefit. 

[ECM1231]

11 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

Every time I get a mailer to join AARP and see that they're offering a "2 for 1" for a year, I toss it in the recycling on principle, since that is not a deal from which I can benefit. 

I wonder if they would be willing to offer you a membership at half-price, then? It doesn't hurt to ask. We've saved a lot over the years on our car insurance, so for me it's worth the cost of membership.

[annzeepark914]

20 hours ago, Mindthinkr said:

I have never been a fan of Starbucks. Their coffee tastes burnt to me. I’m also unwilling to spend $6 on a cup. Most seniors around here get their coffee (when not having it at home) at McDonalds for 64 cents (seniors discount price) 

I have a sunroom that I usually catch up on here and mail when my cleaners are here. Sometimes I go sit on the porch. When they get to my sunroom I just move to my bedroom which is usually done by then. Even my cat has this routine down. 

Never went to Starbucks until I discovered their Chai Tea Latte and their Pink Drink (skip the icky sweet strawberries but give me more whipped cream, please). Yes, their coffee tastes like coffee in office kitchens at the end of the day. Coffee should taste rich, not burnt.

I'm retired so after the cleaners arrive, I either go out or go downstairs to the basement & read the paper or go online. Having cleaners do the work is not a luxury--it's a wise thing to do especially if one has had any physical limitations due to injury and/or surgery. I try to remove clutter, provide my own cleaning supplies, and have the house ready for them.

 

[Blergh]

Speaking for myself, I've never liked Starbucks and have done my derndest to avoid them whenever possible unless I was hungry and there was literally no other snack or coffee option available

. Among other reasons, my Old Country kin tell me that the coffeehouses that had hummed along for over three centuries in their cosmopolitan Continental metropolis through wars, uprisings,famines,etc. that had been cool neighborhood hangouts where folks snacked for hours, read papers &books, and found zillions of ways to reinvent the wheel, etc. are now going the way of the dodo thanks to Starbucks coming in and somehow being more trendy and appealing to the younger generations- even there!

BOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Dimity]

Coincidentally I just went by our new Starbucks a few minutes ago and the drive thru was packed, cars were on the street waiting to turn in.  My husband pointed out that every driver that he could see was a woman probably under 40.  Which does tally with the people I know who are frequenters of Starbucks.

[Browncoat]

I like Starbucks' peppermint hot chocolate, but I only go if someone has given me a gift card.

[PRgal]

Typical Starbucks clientele in my 'hood:  White or East Asian female millennial toting an iced Grande pink something or other (so not even coffee).  She probably has some sort of designer bag, and may or may not be wearing a hoodie and leggings.  She may or may not have a stroller with her.  The indie ones, especially the ones who go to a newly opened bakery cafe (which has the MOST DELICIOUS babka...probably the only place I've seen PISTACHIO babka) have a slightly older to older clientele, including many boomers.  It's actually SLIGHTLY cheaper, believe it or not!  And no weird pink drinks.  Just coffee, tea, water, hot chocolate.

[Mountainair]

I go to the grocery store a lot and our local chain grocery stores have Starbucks inside. I try to avoid bringing my kids to the store with me but sometimes that’s unavoidable. They have become obsessed with Starbucks. I will buy it for them once every few months as a treat but any other time they have to use their own money or gift cards. It’s so expensive! I only drink black coffee which I can make my self at home for way cheaper so Starbucks doesn’t appeal to me. I did really like their Nitro Cold Brew but found out that the grocery store Starbucks don’t offer Nitro- only the freestanding Starbucks do and I don’t like it that much to go out of my way to visit a free standing store. 

[PRgal]

3 hours ago, annzeepark914 said:

Never went to Starbucks until I discovered their Chai Tea Latte and their Pink Drink (skip the icky sweet strawberries but give me more whipped cream, please). Yes, their coffee tastes like coffee in office kitchens at the end of the day. Coffee should taste rich, not burnt.

I'm retired so after the cleaners arrive, I either go out or go downstairs to the basement & read the paper or go online. Having cleaners do the work is not a luxury--it's a wise thing to do especially if one has had any physical limitations due to injury and/or surgery. I try to remove clutter, provide my own cleaning supplies, and have the house ready for them.

 

It’s chai syrup so it’s a no go for me.  There are several places in my area that used real tea.  I’ll go there for my dirty chai or dirty matcha. 

[Dimity]

30 minutes ago, Mountainair said:

They have become obsessed with Starbucks.

My granddaughter (age 7) loves Starbucks.  So, for that matter does her dog.  Starbucks offers what they call Puppuccinos which are free and a nice little treat.  I thought it was a cute idea.

[lookeyloo]

6 minutes ago, Dimity said:

My granddaughter (age 7) loves Starbucks.  So, for that matter does her dog.  Starbucks offers what they call Puppuccinos which are free and a nice little treat.  I thought it was a cute idea.

The local coffee shop the granddaughter worked at when she was in high school offered "pup cups".  She would make them for me with two shots of espresso. 

[annzeepark914]

33 minutes ago, Dimity said:

My granddaughter (age 7) loves Starbucks.  So, for that matter does her dog.  Starbucks offers what they call Puppuccinos which are free and a nice little treat.  I thought it was a cute idea.

Harrumph! Nothing for cats?? 😾

[lookeyloo]

2 minutes ago, annzeepark914 said:

Harrumph! Nothing for cats?? 😾

Cattachino? 😄

[Mindthinkr]

24 minutes ago, lookeyloo said:

Cattachino? 😄

Personally my cat likes Niptinis 🍸😹

[nokat]

On 5/28/2025 at 5:11 PM, Bastet said:

I still have my dictionary, thesaurus, and atlas, but I gave away the encyclopedia set long ago because it took up too much room.

My parents had a full set of encyclopedias. I would sit and flip through them. So much knowledge in those books.

Now I'm fortunate to have an excellent library nearby.

[nokat]

I'm going to preface this with what I think is a sweet tale.

My horse was pastured in an L shaped pasture. They all came in to the stable at night. I brought her in from the pasture for a farrier appointment.  When I walked her back, she didn't see the herd, so stuck by my side. I could tell she was nervous, so walked with her to show the way. When she saw them, it was f you as she galloped away.

I had my patio door open, and a honeybee flew in. I left the door open, so it could fly back out. It chose to follow me. I'm thinking there's the big outside.  But it followed me into the kitchen and bathroom. I had to show the bee the way out.

 

[Yeah No]

On 5/27/2025 at 8:24 PM, PRgal said:

@Yeah No:  Just curious why you didn't get an Airbnb/Vrbo?

Sorry for the delay - We did what the insurance company told us to do, which was stay in a hotel. Honestly I am grateful for the housekeeping service and free hot breakfast here. We've been under so much stress that not having it right now would have been an additional difficulty. I don't know if Airbnb's come with cooking pans, utensils, flatware and dishes either. Also, we didn't think we'd be here anywhere near this long. It's been one snag after another. Our builder is very frustrated too. Much of it has been beyond his control. He called me today to give me the good news that a lot is going to happen this week, so we're keeping our fingers crossed.

But I have still not heard back from the insurance company on my questions about coverage. This is going on 2 weeks already. My husband said the agent was very responsive when he was dealing with him months ago, so I don't know what the deal is with him now. The builder said that not hearing from them is not uncommon. But he and our lawyer seem to think we won't have any issues with the hotel bill because staying here has been beyond our control at this point. And they have much more experience with this kind of situation than we do. The house is not livable so we have to stay somewhere and the insurance company approved this. Despite this my husband and I are feeling stressed out. He's even considering the option of taking a loan against his 401K just in case. I told him not to do that but if it helps him sleep at night I understand.

Anyway at least the engineers found that there is enough support for the load bearing wall so we don't need to have any additional work done on that issue, which would have taken even more time. But just to get them to inspect, then issue their report took up most of the week. The rest of it was spent doing little fixes on other minor issues that the building inspector wanted done. So again we're hopeful that this is the last of it with the delays and the builder can get on with the work. I know, I am rarely this optimistic.

In case anyone's wondering what's been going on with my husband's job - We have noticed that his boss is paying much more attention to his workload and has been asking him who he's driven and how many hours he's been working in any given week. At times his boss is surprised at the answer. We have noticed that he is getting at least 2-3 days a week off now and that is feeling deliberate. Sweet mother-in-law told him she wouldn't need him this week because a friend is coming to town who will drive her to church. Thank goodness.

On 5/28/2025 at 8:12 AM, shapeshifter said:

Just mostly bumping this for @Yeah No, 'cause inquiring minds want to know, LOL. 
Was it an insurance reimbursement issue?

I'm not sure. If I could at least talk to our contact at the insurance company that would help.

[Anduin]

35 minutes ago, Yeah No said:

I don't know if Airbnb's come with cooking pans, utensils, flatware and dishes either.

In my limited experience, they do. It's like staying in someone else's home while they're away. Though others may have different experiences.

[Yeah No]

On 5/28/2025 at 2:22 PM, StatisticalOutlier said:

I'm sure YeahNo will be along to answer, but someone said it might have to do with insurance reimbursement.

Also, this needed to be an open-ended stay, and that can be tricky to arrange if you're not in a hotel, where the rooms are more or less fungible and rooms are assigned upon arrival. 

But really, the only reason I'm posting is because this is an opportunity to say that I'm hoping I can go my entire life without supporting an industry that has ruined neighborhoods, driven up rent for people who want to actually live in a given town, and made neighbors of short-term rentals miserable.  Not to mention that lots of them are illegal.

Thank you! Yeah, I don't know if the Airbnb arrangement would be accommodating to open-ended arrangements. As it is, even here I experience weekly anxiety renewing our stay for another week. I have started doing it 2 weeks in advance and figure if we have to cancel that's a better option than having them complain about having to extend us. This is the hotel's busy season so they are a little touchy about extending when online they're showing as sold out.

About AirBnb in general, I agree with you from what I've read about them. Also, I'd be a little cautious about staying in one given what I hear about bad hosts and security concerns.

Once way back in 2008, when AirBnb was just starting, I rented an apartment for two months in my Dad's neighborhood in the Bronx. I was using vacation time for long weekends to help him go through my mom's belongings, something he couldn't bear to do himself (she died in 2001), and get rid of a lot of stuff. Anyway, it wasn't an AirBnb, I got it off of Craig's List, which back then didn't seem quite as scary as it is now, LOL. The apartment was usually inhabited by a group of graduate students from some famous school of music in NYC (The Mannes School) that went on a trip to Europe for the Summer to play concerts there. They were willing to rent it for two months at a very reasonable price. It was in a very big private house that had been converted to apartments and I even got my own driveway space, which if you know anything about parking in NYC was a HUGE plus. It even had a deck in the back.

Anyway, staying there alone I did feel a little less secure than usual but I was younger then so I didn't see things the way I do now. But one day I woke up to the sounds of a man's voice coming from below me, which would have been the basement (a walk-out so it had windows). I knew there were other apartments in the house but this sounded a little too loud so it spooked me. I went to the doorway to the basement staircase and found it unlocked and heard the voice of a man on the phone. I was petrified. I called the man who rented me the room and luckily he answered the phone from all the way in Europe! He told me that the owner of the house had been converting the basement into an apartment but that it wasn't supposed to be occupied for another month, after I'd be out of there. He apologized and told me he'd refund me for the last few weeks (I only had maybe two weeks left at that point) if it made me feel that uncomfortable. I told him that as long as I could lock the door it would be OK. It was a snap-lock, not the most secure thing ever, but I lived with it. I even propped up a heavy dresser against it. I don't even think the person down there knew about the stairway upstairs anyway. But lesson learned.

Edited Sunday at 07:02 AM by Yeah No
Clarity.

[Yeah No]

On 5/28/2025 at 3:07 PM, EtheltoTillie said:

Back to AirBNB:  I don't know about @Yeah No, but I wouldn't want to stay in an AirBNB.  I'd rather stay in a hotel.  I have seen the inside of quite a few AirBNBs that friends rented, and all of them were weird in some way and not as clean as you'd want.  There was one out on eastern Long Island where you were not allowed to throw toilet paper in the toilet because of the septic system!  I mean, come on.

I also like the security of a hotel with desk staff and so on. 

Plus what you other guys said about the company. 

Yes to all of the above, and the security in these modern hotels really helps with a staff here 24/7. That apartment I rented was about as clean as you'd expect from graduate student musicians, which was OK but still not as clean as I'd like. I came with my own sheets, pillows, and even paper plates and utensils as I recall. It did feel a bit like "roughing it", but what I got for the price was phenomenal. Although that bit with the man in the basement did change how I felt about it. Fortunately that was toward the end of my stay anyway. But it changed how I felt about such arrangements.

[Yeah No]

On 5/28/2025 at 4:24 PM, shapeshifter said:

I pretty much ignore properties with "septic tank" in the listing.
In my many experiences as a renter, one had a septic tank issue. 
Having rented 2 places for 7 years each, another for 10 years, and another for 5, I do have some home maintenance knowledge under my belt. 
Just enough to terrify me, heh.

I hear you but it shocked me to learn that most of my town is on septic and well water, including this hotel, so it's not just my house. I thought it was because we lived on a mountain but even down here in "civilization" they're on well water. But at least our taxes are low!

I'll be honest, I would avoid them too, especially if you can't have an inspection. We at least were able to have ours inspected before we bought. Knock wood, but we have not had any issues with our septic. We have had regular cleanings but that's it. And of course there's the water softening and purifying, which cost money to install and more in terms of putting heavy bags of salt in the system and the annual replacing of the filter and UV light that kills the e-coli in the water. So we don't pay a water bill but we pay for the annual maintenance which runs about $300 a year. BTW, those bags of salt weigh at least 30 lbs. even in the smaller size, which I can't lift and are getting harder for my 69 year old husband to lift every year, and if you have to have the service come and put them in can add up too.

And I'm sure you remember my story about how the hard water in this hotel was ruining my hair. So now every few days I'm running back to the house to wash my hair since the water was turned back on. Because shockingly, they don't have water softening at this hotel. And it was really wrecking up my hair and even my face didn't like it!

[Yeah No]

On 5/30/2025 at 5:40 AM, Quof said:

Looking for advice.

I have someone coming to clean my house tomorrow. I've never done this, ever, for several reasons.  I hate to pay people to do things I can do myself.  I don't want people poking around in my house.  And I'm sure no one would clean better than I do myself.  

Because of an injury, I couldn't do a deep spring cleaning this year, so she's going to do the heavy tasks I can't do. 

What do I do while she's here????  She's a friend of a friend who does it as a side gig but I hadn't met her before now.   Nice lady, close to my age.  It will feel really weird to just sit and watch, but the house isn't big enough that I could just disappear to another area.   Do I just pretend she's not here? 

Oh wow, I was thinking about posting with the same question, so thanks, and thanks to everyone who answered!

We actually used to have heavy cleaning done by a good friend of ours who also did handywork around the house for us. But that was different because he was a friend. This went on for about 12 years until the pandemic which brought everything to a screeching halt. Then he suffered a series of injuries that rendered him unable to do much of what he did before. And not having much money, he experienced several delays in getting the medical attention he needed. Just last week he finally got out of rehab. after a hip replacement - he needs to have the other hip replaced next. And he doesn't even have a car anymore. His old car finally died (a Prius and the battery finally went). And he's now 64 so he's getting older like the rest of us. Let's just say that if I were to hit the lottery, he'd be the first person I'd hand a check.

But anyway, back to cleaning. I really relate to your question. In fact, yesterday when the housekeeper came just as I was getting ready to leave the suite at the hotel, I apologized to her for the crumbs on the floor. She laughed and said it was no problem and that's what she was there for! Yeah, I'm that person that apologizes to the cleaning person, LOL. And I'm not comfortable being there when they're there either which is an issue for me because on days they come I have to get out of here earlier than I'd like. And sometimes I don't even want to go out, like yesterday, because it was raining pretty steadily. But this room is small and she came after the breakfast was over so there was nowhere to go.

I wouldn't want to leave when strange cleaning people are in my home. It's different in a hotel. I go through this when the contractors are in my house. What to do with myself. It's uncomfortable and my house has a big open living area but not many places to go hide other than bedrooms. I've done that thing where I sit with my laptop on the couch in what used to be our living room but will now be a den. I guess there's no way around it. I didn't grow up with cleaning people around and I tend to be a little uncomfortable about strangers in my house in general, especially when they're men. It's who I am I guess. But I'm going to have to get over it. My house is going to be bigger now and after the construction it's going to need a very deep cleaning.

[Fool to cry]

People wonder why fashion seems to have changed very little in the last 30 years compared to previous decades and I've come up with a theory. It's because of the decline of hairspray in society due to it's harmful effects on the ozone layer. 

Edited Sunday at 02:07 PM by Fool to cry

[Anduin]

2 minutes ago, Fool to cry said:

People wonder why fashion seems to have changed very little in the last 3 decades and I've come up with a theory. It's due to the decline of hairspray in society due to it's harmful effects on the ozone layer. 

I realise that hairstyles are part of fashion, but not the whole show. How does lack of hairspray affect clothing?

I for one would like skater shorts to come back into style, around October or November thanks.

[Fool to cry]

8 minutes ago, Anduin said:

I realise that hairstyles are part of fashion, but not the whole show. How does lack of hairspray affect clothing?

I for one would like skater shorts to come back into style, around October or November thanks.

I think having bolder hairstyles leads to wanting bolder clothes.

[Mindthinkr]

Does anyone have a favorite brownie mix? 

[Browncoat]

Just now, Mindthinkr said:

Does anyone have a favorite brownie mix? 

Ghirardelli.

[Dimity]

2 minutes ago, Mindthinkr said:

Does anyone have a favorite brownie mix? 

I have a favourite recipe if that would help.

[shapeshifter]

2 hours ago, Mindthinkr said:

Does anyone have a favorite brownie mix? 

My Dad was "famous" for his brownies that he would bring to an office gathering or a Bridge or Trivial Pursuit night. It was just whatever mix he bought with chocolate chips added and frosting on top.

ETA: If asked, it was a "secret" recipe.😉😂😍

Edited Sunday at 06:07 PM by shapeshifter

[Mindthinkr]

34 minutes ago, Dimity said:

I have a favourite recipe if that would help.

Yes please 🙂

[StatisticalOutlier]

9 hours ago, Yeah No said:

Once way back in 2008, when AirBnb was just starting, I rented an apartment for two months in my Dad's neighborhood in the Bronx. ...The apartment was usually inhabited by a group of graduate students ... that went on a trip to Europe for the Summer to play concerts there. They were willing to rent it for two months at a very reasonable price.

I'm the one who started the Airbnb bashing here, and I just remembered that I do have experience with the concept.

It was around 1990 that two friends and I were visiting NYC and we rented someone's apartment to stay in.  I'm sure I made the arrangements (I always did), but don't remember how I found out about this apartment. 

I used to subscribe to a monthly newsletter about travel deals and wonder if that's where I found out it was possible, and I'm guessing the newsletter article gave the phone number of some sort of service that the apartment people signed up for.  I did know that it was someone's apartment who worked in the city during the week.  Regardless, we stayed there for our usual 3 or 4 days, and it was fine.  

But my point is that this sort of thing worked, but only because it was on a small scale--some people renting their apartments for a few days to people who had the wherewithal to find out about it in the first place.  The wherewithal for me was to find out there was a newsletter in the first place, then pay to subscribe to it and receive it in the mail once a month, and then actually read each page.  

It was the necessity of that wherewithal that kept it nice, and no wherewithal whatsoever is needed to do anything any more.  

 

[Dimity]

1 hour ago, Mindthinkr said:

Yes please 🙂

This is from the Branksome Hall Cook Book.  It came out in the early '80s I think and was well used by my aunt who then gifted it to me.  This page clearly shows how popular this recipe is (and what messy bakers my aunt and I are!!)

ETA: Branksome Hall is a private girls school in Toronto - this cookbook was not purchased because anyone we know went there - it was in the bargain bin in Eaton's basement 😀.

[PRgal]

47 minutes ago, Dimity said:

This is from the Branksome Hall Cook Book.  It came out in the early '80s I think and was well used by my aunt who then gifted it to me.  This page clearly shows how popular this recipe is (and what messy bakers my aunt and I are!!)

ETA: Branksome Hall is a private girls school in Toronto - this cookbook was not purchased because anyone we know went there - it was in the bargain bin in Eaton's basement 😀.

Whoa....are you a Branksome Old Girl?  Because I went to a....rival girls-only school...

[Anduin]

8 hours ago, Fool to cry said:

I think having bolder hairstyles leads to wanting bolder clothes.

I can see the connection. But hairdye still exists.

[annzeepark914]

I miss the clothes & shoes that I used to find in those old impressive department stores. You could find beautiful dresses & shoes (for all ages!) 

 

 

[Mindthinkr]

12 minutes ago, annzeepark914 said:

I miss the clothes & shoes that I used to find in those old impressive department stores. You could find beautiful dresses & shoes (for all ages!) 

 

 

How true. Stores used to also have more choices. Now that everything is online they just sell their most popular items and styles. Rarely do they carry my size as it isn’t as popular as the 6-12 club (no shame intended towards any size). Even when I couldn’t afford much, how fun it was to go wish and dream. 

[shapeshifter]

1 hour ago, annzeepark914 said:

I miss the clothes & shoes that I used to find in those old impressive department stores. You could find beautiful dresses & shoes (for all ages!) 

The Marshall Fields sale rack! (before Macy's took over)

When I was a kid Mom would go shopping in the The City at Saks.
I would love to stroke the fur coats while she tried stuff on.

[Yeah No]

13 hours ago, Fool to cry said:

People wonder why fashion seems to have changed very little in the last 30 years compared to previous decades and I've come up with a theory. It's because of the decline of hairspray in society due to it's harmful effects on the ozone layer. 

I've asked myself this question many times and I think there are many reasons for it but the decline of hairspray never crossed my mind as being one of them. I actually think the decline of hairspray is part of the effect of a societal shift in values, but not the cause itself.

I agree that styles haven't changed that much in 30 years but over that time people have been moving toward dressing more casually and changing when and where they wear more formal and more casual clothing. I think we've been undergoing what I call the "casualization" of clothing for the past 30 years or so. It's a reflection of a backlash against what people today see as society formerly having been too formal, "stuffy", and restrictive and oppressive, especially of women. 30 years ago in corporate offices women still wore formal business attire on weekdays, which included such punishing items like fitted skirts, pantyhose and heels during the week followed by a "casual Friday". In the '80s the concept of "business casual" took over and eventually over time that became everyday attire, not just on Fridays. The concept of business casual continued to evolve into an ever more casual look. And this extended to the rest of society too.

I think people decided that they were tired of dressing to please others and being judged based on their appearance. They felt that they should be accepted regardless of how they looked and be able to wear whatever they want to wear, which often meant dressing for comfort over appearance. I can understand that to some degree but unfortunately they took that a little too literally and the end result is that many people today don't put that much into how they look and so they end up looking dreadful. It is my opinion that just because you don't want to be judged on your appearance doesn't mean you shouldn't try to look good. There are ways to be comfortable and still have your clothes fit and flatter your figure without selling out to others' standards.

I think another reason styles haven't changed that much in 30 years is that our modern society has plateaued for now in terms of values and outlook. We seem to be stuck in a holding pattern in many ways. The Industrial Revolution started off a centuries long societal evolution that kept our values and outlooks changing (especially women's) and so the fashions had to keep up with that evolution. But ever since the '90s or so we've kind of stopped changing that much. In fact in some segments of society there has been a regression and backlash against the direction we were heading, especially with regard to women. And I think fashions are reflecting that by not changing very much. Putting that together with the general trend toward not caring so much about what other people think of one's appearance and it adds up to not much changing. Why should manufacturers put money into designing new styles when they can just slap a new print or fabric on an old one and it will sell just as well as last year? I remember when you rarely saw last year's styles on the racks the next year. Now I see the same styles on the racks in different colors and prints for 4 or 5 years in a row.

So in light of all of this "casualization" where is there any need for hairspray? None whatsoever. Hairspray is one of those things associated with pantyhose and pumps, which are those formal things that were once a function of a stuffy and restrictive society that was oppressive of women. That said, I wear hairspray but only because I have very fine, wavy hair and if I don't it goes wild even in a gentle Summer breeze. And the look and marketing of hairspray has changed to the point that you often wouldn't even know it was hairspray until you really looked at the fine print on the label. Many of them are marketed as styling sprays for smoothing and conditioning when they're really in other words just hairspray in a non-aerosol bottle.

There are other reasons too, such as the internet making it attractive to buy second hand clothing, which keeps older styles alive longer and is often cheaper than buying new. I myself have participated in this. I keep buying the same purse over and over again in different colors because it's a timeless style and it's the best purse for my needs. I often get it "new with tags" even though the manufacturer stopped making it 10 years ago. I do this with clothing too.

My final reason for now is the pandemic effect. With many people working from home (many still are) they didn't have the reason nor desire to dress up so they just existed in sweats, t-shirts and athletic shoes. And from what I've read, many of them are still dressing that way even though the pandemic is officially over. They got used to it so that's their "new normal".

Forgive the tome but in different ways fashion runs on both sides of my family so I've been an observer and shopper of it all of my life. Plus it's boring here in this hotel room at night when my husband goes to bed early! 😉

Edited Monday at 03:44 AM by Yeah No
Added the bit about the pandemic.

[Yeah No]

4 hours ago, Anduin said:

I can see the connection. But hairdye still exists.

You know I am not seeing as much hair dye in the drug stores as I used to. I have had to order my usual colors online a few times because they've shrunk the selection in all the brands in some stores. Walmart still carries it though. I am reading that women are choosing not to color their hair as much as they used to. I am not noticing a lot more women with natural gray hair around so I don't know if maybe that trend is among younger women. Years ago a lot of younger women colored their hair but I'm reading that now a lot of them just go with their natural color. Again, another thing held over from the pandemic, so I've read.

3 hours ago, annzeepark914 said:

I miss the clothes & shoes that I used to find in those old impressive department stores. You could find beautiful dresses & shoes (for all ages!)

~Sigh~ me too. And you can't even blame the internet because the selection isn't even good THERE. And who wants to buy a dress or shoes online anyway? I could never buy either without trying them on first. I will buy shoes I've bought before online in different colors, though as long as I know that the style fits.

3 hours ago, Mindthinkr said:

How true. Stores used to also have more choices. Now that everything is online they just sell their most popular items and styles. Rarely do they carry my size as it isn’t as popular as the 6-12 club (no shame intended towards any size). Even when I couldn’t afford much, how fun it was to go wish and dream. 

I could have written this! Why should they go to all the trouble and expense of having more choices when they can make as much money selling the most popular things? They have all their little spreadsheets to tell them just how little they can get away with doing and spending and still make the same $$$. So we have less choice.

And being a petite size, I have even LESS choice all the time. Remember that old mall store "Petite Sophisticate"? I used to shop there once upon a time. I miss that store!

2 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

The Marshall Fields sale rack! (before Macy's took over)

When I was a kid Mom would go shopping in the The City at Saks.
I would love to stroke the fur coats while she tried stuff on.

My Mom and I would shop down in Manhattan at places like B. Altman and others. We'd often have lunch at the store cafeteria. I miss those stores.

[PRgal]

I’m not sure I like the casualization all that much.  When I was in high school, the difference between first dress and “casual uniform” at my own school was whether we wore a blazer or not.  These days, kids have the option of wearing polos at some schools (including my son’s, where they don’t need to wear dress shirts and ties until middle school.  This isn’t super common in any other private school in the city, for boys OR girls).  I think they look even MORE like slobs than when we were in school, and we looked like slobs back then (hey, it was the 90s. Grunge was a thing).  The pandemic only made it worse.  And as for adults, the only dress down look I can tolerate is the mom uniform.  And that doesn’t belong in an office unless you’re working from home and aren’t seeing people online. 

Edited Monday at 10:46 AM by PRgal

[lookeyloo]

7 hours ago, Yeah No said:

And being a petite size, I have even LESS choice all the time. Remember that old mall store "Petite Sophisticate"? I used to shop there once upon a time. I miss that store!

Yes I do!  Talbot's has a petite section and depending on the moment, some viable options and lately they run a lot of really good sales.  My Talbot's clothes never wear out or show signs of wear.  But to me too expensive to buy full price.  I also think what has contributed is "fast fashion" from places like Temu, etc. and I know my granddaughter and her friends buy something, they all wear it and then pitch it.  And a lot of these things are made in Asia and those women are very small.  I watch some YouTube videos of American young women who now live in Japan of what we consider normal size and they say it is very difficult for them to find clothing that fits, including shoes.  One would think someone would key into the average American woman but when that happens usually out of most average American woman price range