RW Homecoming: New Orleans (2022)

[Asp Burger]

Yep. That was Brandy. Julie left a message on his guestbook that "only pedophiles and assholes" give out their URLs, and signed Brandy's name. Then Matt embarrassed himself by calling Brandy to find out if her message was serious or a joke, and she said she had never signed his guestbook. (She clearly had no interest in him, because she wanted to know how he got her number. Lionel, the guy who was giving Melissa lessons in painting, knew Brandy and had given Matt the number.) 

Julie thought her joke was hilarious; Matt thought it was hostile. I leaned more toward his side on that one. Julie was also getting Brandy's name "wrong" in an interview during that episode ("Brittany...I mean, Brandy...").  

Other topic: I think we can assume Kelley would not be okay with a TV show in which the Party of Five cast gets back together, and Scott Wolf and Paula Devicq revisit their relationship in detail. (If two women is a large enough sample size, Scott definitely had a physical type.) 

[Tatum]

6 hours ago, Asp Burger said:

(If two women is a large enough sample size, Scott definitely had a physical type.) 

Weird! I never thought of it that way, but in that picture, Kelley and Paula Deviq do look a lot alike.

[LBS]

Julie in every episode: 

[MicheleinPhilly]

I don't get Matt, I really don't.

Not only was I raised Catholic, I was educated in Catholic schools (Note: I'm no longer Catholic) and no one, I MEAN NO ONE, was a super duper, hyper fundi like he is. All of my older family members are still practicing Catholics and guess what, they all welcome my wife with open arms and love her genuinely and sincerely. 

Just as he mentioned to Kelley that most Catholics don't follow the church's teachings on birth control, most Catholics don't follow the church's teachings on LOTS of things. If you have "10 or 12" things you don't agree with or have a problem with, it's okay for you to find a different religion that suits your beliefs. 

And I literally laughed out loud when he was talking about the example that was set and being Christ-like. News flash Matt! All of the sex and sexuality shit that the Catholic Church is obsessed with, it was all developed by men - real, mortal, fallible dudes, not Jesus himself. 🙄 I can't tell if he is being willfully obtuse just to avoid having to take any ownership of his feelings. He is quite skilled at side-stepping confrontation. 

I'm curious as to why Spencer was allegedly so uncomfortable around Jamie. Has Julie been talking to her husband about him for the last 15 years or however long they've been married? None of this makes any sense. 

Really excited for their kids to grow up and watch this. 

[CeeBeeGee]

3 hours ago, MicheleinPhilly said:

Not only was I raised Catholic, I was educated in Catholic schools (Note: I'm no longer Catholic) and no one, I MEAN NO ONE, was a super duper, hyper fundi like he is. All of my older family members are still practicing Catholics and guess what, they all welcome my wife with open arms and love her genuinely and sincerely. 

Just as he mentioned to Kelley that most Catholics don't follow the church's teachings on birth control, most Catholics don't follow the church's teachings on LOTS of things. If you have "10 or 12" things you don't agree with or have a problem with, it's okay for you to find a different religion that suits your beliefs. 

Right? I'm not Roman Catholic (I'm high church Episcopalian, close enough ;) but I have MANY friends who grew up Catholic and who went to parochial schools--and for a time I lived with my Dad in a very Catholic town and being super curious, asked a lot of questions. (My mother got nervous when I told her I wanted cross earrings, which I'd seen some of my friends wearing. She was like "uh, we don't do that.") I have never, ever known a Catholic who was anti-sex like that, or who was so sanctimonious about homsexuality. Yes, there are some homophobic RCs but it's more of a cultural, "dude, that's so gay" kind of reaction--a reflexive distaste that's much more the product of toxic masculinity than a sincere parsing of the Holy See position on homosexuality. And yes, Roman Catholics are allowed to practice a form of birth control--the rhythm method. It's horribly inefficient, but they're allowed.

I'm wondering if he wasn't actually raised Catholic--the stereotype of the hyper-convert has a lot of validity. (I remember one time at church there were some newcomers to whom I was talking and both of them kept asking if I was a "cradle Episcopalian"--it seemed a big deal to them that I was.) If he converted in his late teens, say, that might explain his...demonstrative (performative, even) brand of Catholicism.

[Cherry Cola]

3 hours ago, MicheleinPhilly said:

I don't get Matt, I really don't.

Not only was I raised Catholic, I was educated in Catholic schools (Note: I'm no longer Catholic) and no one, I MEAN NO ONE, was a super duper, hyper fundi like he is. All of my older family members are still practicing Catholics and guess what, they all welcome my wife with open arms and love her genuinely and sincerely. 

Just as he mentioned to Kelley that most Catholics don't follow the church's teachings on birth control, most Catholics don't follow the church's teachings on LOTS of things. If you have "10 or 12" things you don't agree with or have a problem with, it's okay for you to find a different religion that suits your beliefs. 

Matt does seem to accept Danny.  I still don't get the big deal about Matt.  Matt and Danny had a really good convo together towards the end of the episode. They are friends.  What more does Matt need to do? Kelly was uncomfortable with past sex talk. Is she awful for getting up and walking away too?

Anyway, tired of Julie.  

[Bastet]

1 hour ago, CeeBeeGee said:

I'm wondering if he wasn't actually raised Catholic--the stereotype of the hyper-convert has a lot of validity.

I remember reading, maybe even in the thread for the original season on this site, that he indeed chose religion on his own rather than being indoctrinated by his family.  I don't know if that's true, but it was said, so you may be right.

[choclatechip45]

1 hour ago, CeeBeeGee said:

Right? I'm not Roman Catholic (I'm high church Episcopalian, close enough ;) but I have MANY friends who grew up Catholic and who went to parochial schools--and for a time I lived with my Dad in a very Catholic town and being super curious, asked a lot of questions. (My mother got nervous when I told her I wanted cross earrings, which I'd seen some of my friends wearing. She was like "uh, we don't do that.") I have never, ever known a Catholic who was anti-sex like that, or who was so sanctimonious about homsexuality. Yes, there are some homophobic RCs but it's more of a cultural, "dude, that's so gay" kind of reaction--a reflexive distaste that's much more the product of toxic masculinity than a sincere parsing of the Holy See position on homosexuality. And yes, Roman Catholics are allowed to practice a form of birth control--the rhythm method. It's horribly inefficient, but they're allowed.

I'm wondering if he wasn't actually raised Catholic--the stereotype of the hyper-convert has a lot of validity. (I remember one time at church there were some newcomers to whom I was talking and both of them kept asking if I was a "cradle Episcopalian"--it seemed a big deal to them that I was.) If he converted in his late teens, say, that might explain his...demonstrative (performative, even) brand of Catholicism.

Danny said in an interview during the summer of 2020 that Matt wasn't raised in a religious family and became religious in college. 

[Asp Burger]

So, we have had three of seven people float the idea of leaving before the scheduled taping period was up: Julie, Matt, and Kelley. 

I wonder if Kelley actually does walk. At the end of episode 4 (presumably the middle of the season), they showed scenes from the remainder of the season, and there was one with Danny and Tokyo talking to Julie. Julie was expressing that she felt responsible for something, and Tokyo was saying it wasn't her fault. Julie said there had been a "metamorphosis," and Danny told her that maybe it wasn't as much of a metamorphosis as she thought. That would definitely fit, as he (and Melissa) knew about how uncomfortable Kelley was getting. Then there's the Julie/Kelley conversation we've seen in more than one preview ("I'm so happy for your sexual revolution..." "What you signed up for is not what I signed up for"). 

I hope I'm wrong and that this cast is the one with no early departures.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Cherry Cola said:

Matt does seem to accept Danny.  

To me saying, “I’ll never understand how God created you” is the antithesis of accepting. 

[1011101010001]

1 minute ago, Dani said:

To me saying, “I’ll never understand how God created you” is the antithesis of accepting. 

Yup.  They didn’t resolve anything.  Danny just realized there is no point in talking to someone so close-minded so he let it drop.

[MerBearStare]

54 minutes ago, MrBuhBye said:

Yup.  They didn’t resolve anything.  Danny just realized there is no point in talking to someone so close-minded so he let it drop.

There's a quote from RuPaul I love: "I tell you this as someone who’s a smart motherfucker: Don’t waste your time fooling with dumb people or trying to figure them out or trying to educate them. It doesn’t work. It’s a lose-lose situation." If Matt's views of gay people haven't changed in the 20+ years since he was last on the show (years in which we went from absolutely no gay marriage to civil unions to full on marriage equality), they're not going to change now because of one conversation with Danny. Danny should have saved himself the aggravation. 

[1011101010001]

38 minutes ago, MerBearStare said:

There's a quote from RuPaul I love: "I tell you this as someone who’s a smart motherfucker: Don’t waste your time fooling with dumb people or trying to figure them out or trying to educate them. It doesn’t work. It’s a lose-lose situation." If Matt's views of gay people haven't changed in the 20+ years since he was last on the show (years in which we went from absolutely no gay marriage to civil unions to full on marriage equality), they're not going to change now because of one conversation with Danny. Danny should have saved himself the aggravation. 

Imagine if someone said their religious beliefs teach them that other races or genders are sinners because of their very existence.  Would anyone give the slightest respect to that opinion?  All opinions are not equally valid.

[MicheleinPhilly]

8 hours ago, MrBuhBye said:

Imagine if someone said their religious beliefs teach them that other races or genders are sinners because of their very existence.  Would anyone give the slightest respect to that opinion?  All opinions are not equally valid.

Exactly. I can't believe I'm going to say this because I loathe her, but I had mad respect for Julie during the parts of this episode when she talked about ditching Mormonism. She acknowledged that she couldn't square Mormonism's racism and homophobia and because it's not a religion where you can take what works and leave the rest, she bounced. And in Julie's case, that was a tough decision because of her family and upbringing. If you voluntarily converted to Catholicism as an adult, YOU CHOSE THAT. You looked at what they believe and preach and said, "I think I'd fit in here." And I really don't appreciate his "the Church makes me do this" martyrdom. Spare me. 

[choclatechip45]

43 minutes ago, MicheleinPhilly said:

Exactly. I can't believe I'm going to say this because I loathe her, but I had mad respect for Julie during the parts of this episode when she talked about ditching Mormonism. She acknowledged that she couldn't square Mormonism's racism and homophobia and because it's not a religion where you can take what works and leave the rest, she bounced. And in Julie's case, that was a tough decision because of her family and upbringing. If you voluntarily converted to Catholicism as an adult, YOU CHOSE THAT. You looked at what they believe and preach and said, "I think I'd fit in here." And I really don't appreciate his "the Church makes me do this" martyrdom. Spare me. 

I agree with you about Julie and it makes so much sense why Danny has said in interviews he planned on having the same conversation with Julie, but didn't once he found out she left the religion and the reasons why (he said this in an interview before the last episode aired). 

[MicheleinPhilly]

3 minutes ago, choclatechip45 said:

I agree with you about Julie and it makes so much sense why Danny has said in interviews he planned on having the same conversation with Julie, but didn't once he found out she left the religion and the reasons why (he said this in an interview before the last episode aired). 

Unfortunately she then made me reconsider her stance on racism with her "a Black girl" comment later. 2 steps forward, 3 steps back with that one. 🙄

[ljenkins782]

9 hours ago, MrBuhBye said:

Imagine if someone said their religious beliefs teach them that other races or genders are sinners because of their very existence.  Would anyone give the slightest respect to that opinion?  All opinions are not equally valid.

Plenty of religions teach that people who embrace other religions are sinners. I'm not agreeing with it, but it's hardly an outlandishly rare occurrence that people who know each other or are even friends with each other have this fundamental belief underneath that the other is wrong for their beliefs or lifestyle.

Quote

So, we have had three of seven people float the idea of leaving before the scheduled taping period was up: Julie, Matt, and Kelley. 

I wonder if Kelley actually does walk. At the end of episode 4 (presumably the middle of the season), they showed scenes from the remainder of the season, and there was one with Danny and Tokyo talking to Julie. Julie was expressing that she felt responsible for something, and Tokyo was saying it wasn't her fault. Julie said there had been a "metamorphosis," and Danny told her that maybe it wasn't as much of a metamorphosis as she thought. That would definitely fit, as he (and Melissa) knew about how uncomfortable Kelley was getting. Then there's the Julie/Kelley conversation we've seen in more than one preview ("I'm so happy for your sexual revolution..." "What you signed up for is not what I signed up for"). 

Was this taping significantly longer than the other reunions? It seems impossible that Kelley could struggle this hard in just a single week, especially when she has her close friend Danny right there with her. Julie struggling in a week would make more sense since she's not close to any of them, but she's fueled by attention-seeking and manipulation, so she's in her glory.

I hope if she does leave, Kelley lays it all out for Julie, who seems to be operating under the mistaken impression that she's doing the "work" of making a tv show and her roommates are slacking on their shared purpose, I'd like to see someone set her straight that the rest of them are doing what they came there to do and Julie is the only one on a different page.

[Cherry Cola]

I feel like a lot of people think Matt should renounce his religion in order to be acceptable to them and I think that is awful.  He is not out there shouting hate to gay people.  Danny himself said he, danny is too set in his ways to change his beliefs. Why is that ok, but Matts? 

Julie calling them all old is really old.  

[Asp Burger]

17 minutes ago, MicheleinPhilly said:

Unfortunately she then made me reconsider her stance on racism with her "a Black girl" comment later. 2 steps forward, 3 steps back with that one. 🙄

I didn't have a reaction to that in the moment. I thought she probably didn't remember Brandy's name and was just saying something that would clarify which Matt dating interest she was talking about. Brandy wasn't the only woman outside the house Matt tried to date. There was also a blonde named Kelley (yeah, she spelled it the same way as Belfort Kelley) who worked at Club 735. She came over and played pool, and Jamie and Julie were spying and making fun of her. (Jamie said she was a Monet, because she looked good at a distance, et cetera.) But Matt didn't seem as head over heels with Kelley-from-the-Club as he did with Brandy.

Anyway, while I'm always up for a good Julie roasting, I didn't think she was saying, "You weren't interested in me, and then you were trying to get with a Black girl!" MMV.  

13 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

Was this taping significantly longer than the other reunions? It seems impossible that Kelley could struggle this hard in just a single week, especially when she has her close friend Danny right there with her.

This one was two weeks, per a number of articles. I don't know how that compares with the NY and LA ones.  

Edited May 27, 2022 by Asp Burger

[MicheleinPhilly]

1 minute ago, Asp Burger said:

I didn't have a reaction to that in the moment. I thought she probably didn't remember Brandy's name and was just saying something that would clarify which Matt dating interest she was talking about. Brandy wasn't the only woman outside the house Matt tried to date. There was also a blonde named Kelley (yeah, she spelled it the same way as Belfort Kelley) who worked at Club 735. She came over and played pool, and Jamie and Julie were spying and making fun of her. (Jamie said she was a Monet, because she looked good at a distance, et cetera.) But Matt didn't seem as head over heels about Kelley-from-the-Club as he did about Brandy.

Anyway, while I'm always up for a good Julie roasting, I didn't think she was saying, "You weren't interested in me, and then you were trying to get with a Black girl!" MMV.  

This one was two weeks, per a number of articles. I don't know how that compares with the NY and LA ones.  

Your recall of what transpired during the original series is awe-inspiring. I don't even remember what I had for lunch yesterday. 🤣

And my lack of recall certainly could have inspired my interpretation of Julie's words. But taken in tandem with what we've seen of her this season, I'm less inclined to give her the benefit of the doubt. But I'm a salty grump. 🤷‍♀️

[choclatechip45]

I think Kelley is stressed about her clip package. One thing I've noticed rewatching the original New Orleans season is how anxious she is all the time. I know she mentioned in that one episode with Melissa that she suffered from depression. 

She's mentioned in interviews how she had to take her life coach hat off because ethically none of her cast members are her clients. Julie stresses me out I can't imagine having a front row seat. I would hope I would react like Danny stoned and finding amusement in the trainwreck and enjoy the free entertainment, but I feel like I would be more like Kelley stressed out. 

Edited May 27, 2022 by choclatechip45

[Asp Burger]

1 minute ago, MicheleinPhilly said:

Your recall of what transpired during the original series is awe-inspiring. I don't even remember what I had for lunch yesterday. 🤣

And my lack of recall certainly could have inspired my interpretation of Julie's words. But taken in tandem with what we've seen of her this season, I'm less inclined to give her the benefit of the doubt. But I'm a salty grump. 🤷‍♀️

It's just as possible I'm going too easy on her. Like, I'm the umpire who's called strikes on the same batter so many times that I'm letting her have a ball on a borderline call. Ha ha.  

But re: recall of the original series, this was a favorite season of mine, and when the Homecoming was announced, I watched it again on P+ and looked through the book. If we were talking about Back to New York or Las Vegas, I would be starting from much further back, even though I watched those seasons when they were on. 

[choclatechip45]

12 minutes ago, Asp Burger said:

I didn't have a reaction to that in the moment. I thought she probably didn't remember Brandy's name and was just saying something that would clarify which Matt dating interest she was talking about. Brandy wasn't the only woman outside the house Matt tried to date. There was also a blonde named Kelley (yeah, she spelled it the same way as Belfort Kelley) who worked at Club 735. She came over and played pool, and Jamie and Julie were spying and making fun of her. (Jamie said she was a Monet, because she looked good at a distance, et cetera.) But Matt didn't seem as head over heels with Kelley-from-the-Club as he did with Brandy.

Anyway, while I'm always up for a good Julie roasting, I didn't think she was saying, "You weren't interested in me, and then you were trying to get with a Black girl!" MMV.  

This one was two weeks, per a number of articles. I don't know how that compares with the NY and LA ones.  

To me it was all about tone with Julie and the way she delivered it made me feel like there were racial undertones.

[heatherchandler]

10 hours ago, MrBuhBye said:

Imagine if someone said their religious beliefs teach them that other races or genders are sinners because of their very existence.  Would anyone give the slightest respect to that opinion?  All opinions are not equally valid.

We don't have to imagine this.  There are religions that believe a woman needs to not be educated and wear a covering - some people think this is horrible, and some say we must respect the religion. 

Religious beliefs are a very touchy subject in the world.

Edited May 27, 2022 by heatherchandler

[heatherchandler]

I never thought Jamie was that hot in 2000.  Why am I finding him hot now?  I live near Chicago, I am curious where he lives.  Not to stalk him, just curious!

[Guest]

6 hours ago, Cherry Cola said:

I feel like a lot of people think Matt should renounce his religion in order to be acceptable to them and I think that is awful.

Not at all. As many have pointed out not all Catholics share Matt’s beliefs. Even Matt points out that many Catholics ignore aspects of the religion. Being a Catholic is not the same as being anti-LGTBQ+. 

6 hours ago, Cherry Cola said:

He is not out there shouting hate to gay people. 

Shouting is not the only way spread hate. Subtle hate is often more damaging than the shouting. Having someone who you know well making comments implying their is something inherently wrong with you or implying that you choose your sexuality while claiming to love you can be more hurtful than outright hatred and slurs. 

6 hours ago, Cherry Cola said:

Danny himself said he, danny is too set in his ways to change his beliefs. Why is that ok, but Matts? 

Because religious beliefs are a choice and being gay isn’t. No one needs to respect hateful beliefs. What would Danny changing his beliefs even look like? Self-hatred? What would Matt changing is beliefs look like? It would be acceptance of something that doesn’t impact his life at all. 

[choclatechip45]

I really hope Kelley's clip package includes the clip of her wanting to be the white Oprah. 

[Asp Burger]

She said the "next" Oprah. And she did give a lot of credit. She said Oprah was the person she wanted to model herself on, because Oprah has affected thousands of people's lives, and if she could "impact" even one person that way, she will have done her job.

[choclatechip45]

9 minutes ago, Asp Burger said:

She said the "next" Oprah. And she did give a lot of credit. She said Oprah was the person she wanted to model herself on, because Oprah has affected thousands of people's lives, and if she could "impact" even one person that way, she will have done her job.

I still would love to see her look back on it and see if that inspired her to be a life coach. Rewatching the season I forgot how confident and goal driven she was with group job considering most cast members did not take it seriously. 

[shantown]

Perhaps the funniest part of this show to me is how often they have people's names on the screen when they're talking or even just shown. I can't imagine there's many people watching this show who didn't already know this cast. And for the few who started it without watching the original, if they're still watching in episode 6 do they really need reminders? Like we're gonna forget since 5 minutes ago who Jamie is? 😂

[1011101010001]

3 hours ago, ljenkins782 said:

Plenty of religions teach that people who embrace other religions are sinners. I'm not agreeing with it, but it's hardly an outlandishly rare occurrence that people who know each other or are even friends with each other have this fundamental belief underneath that the other is wrong for their beliefs or lifestyle.

Quote

The difference is religion is a choice.   So even thought it’s still an ignorant position, the “sinner” could change things if they wanted.

[1011101010001]

3 hours ago, heatherchandler said:

We don't have to imagine this.  There are religions that believe a woman needs to not be educated and wear a covering - some people think this is horrible, and some say we must respect the religion. 

Religious beliefs are a very touchy subject in the world.

Yes but they don’t say women are sinners for just existing.

3 hours ago, heatherchandler said:

We don't have to imagine this.  There are religions that believe a woman needs to not be educated and wear a covering - some people think this is horrible, and some say we must respect the religion. 

Religious beliefs are a very touchy subject in the world.

I imagine Matt is fine with women not being allowed to be priests as well because Catholicism is misogynistic as well as homophobic.

[1011101010001]

2 hours ago, Asp Burger said:

She said the "next" Oprah. And she did give a lot of credit. She said Oprah was the person she wanted to model herself on, because Oprah has affected thousands of people's lives, and if she could "impact" even one person that way, she will have done her job.

She could recommend mediocre books as well lol.

[heatherchandler]

1 hour ago, MrBuhBye said:

Yes but they don’t say women are sinners for just existing.

Yeah being forced to cover up is saying you are inherently sinful.

[Bastet]

5 hours ago, Asp Burger said:

I thought she probably didn't remember Brandy's name and was just saying something that would clarify which Matt dating interest she was talking about.

I wouldn't expect anyone to remember the woman's name, but if Brandy had been white, Julie wouldn't have used "that white girl" as her identifier. 

"The woman you met at X" or "That friend of So-and-So's" (however they met; I don't remember) is how to clarify which dating interest she's talking about, not "the black girl".  A lot of white people mention someone's race in situations where they are complaining about that person, but only with BIPOC.  A white person cuts them off, the story gets told as "And then this guy in a big 'ol truck cuts me off" but if the driver was BIPOC, it's "And then this [Black guy/Asian woman/etc.] cuts me off".  

[1011101010001]

26 minutes ago, heatherchandler said:

Yeah being forced to cover up is saying you are inherently sinful.

What they are really saying is the men are sinners who can’t control their lust if they see uncovered women.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, MrBuhBye said:

Yes but they don’t say women are sinners for just existing.

Many do using the original sin as justification to say women are inherently more sinful. 

[For Cereals]

On 5/25/2022 at 9:03 PM, heatherchandler said:

Is it just me that sees this?

Now I can’t unsee it

[ljenkins782]

2 hours ago, Bastet said:

I wouldn't expect anyone to remember the woman's name, but if Brandy had been white, Julie wouldn't have used "that white girl" as her identifier. 

"The woman you met at X" or "That friend of So-and-So's" (however they met; I don't remember) is how to clarify which dating interest she's talking about, not "the black girl".  A lot of white people mention someone's race in situations where they are complaining about that person, but only with BIPOC.  A white person cuts them off, the story gets told as "And then this guy in a big 'ol truck cuts me off" but if the driver was BIPOC, it's "And then this [Black guy/Asian woman/etc.] cuts me off".  

This is all true. In Julie's case, it seems like a typical "I want to talk about this but don't want to acknowledge MY wrongdoing" because the most obvious identifier that should have been applied to Brandy was "hey, remember that girl you liked and I played that trick on you with your guestbook? " That was the defining incident around Brandy and would sure as hell have been more memorable than anything else about that conversation after 22 years. 

But Julie being Julie, hits the trifecta of shitting all over a fun moment (the reminiscing over the goofy technology of Y2K), bringing it up in the absolute most awkward way possible and making everyone uncomFORTable, and also ignoring the social lifeline Danny tried to throw her when he remarked that it was cute she was still thinking about it 22 years later. In anyone else, that would be a cue that you're being a weirdo and you should maybe pivot off that course. But Julie ignores all that and barrels forth with her "why didn't you like MEEEEEEE" nonsense. I wonder how much her husband has had to hear about Matt over the years since he's apparently been inundated with Jamie talk.

Quote

The difference is religion is a choice.   So even thought it’s still an ignorant position, the “sinner” could change things if they wanted.

Deeply held beliefs about what some people consider to be the building blocks of life here and in the next aren't necessarily whims to them. My point was that people can co-exist even when their fundamental beliefs differ so greatly that each believes the other to be wrong on what they feel are the most crucial parts of life and disagreeing on those points doesn't equate hatred in every instance.

[1011101010001]

11 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

Deeply held beliefs about what some people consider to be the building blocks of life here and in the next aren't necessarily whims to them. My point was that people can co-exist even when their fundamental beliefs differ so greatly that each believes the other to be wrong on what they feel are the most crucial parts of life and disagreeing on those points doesn't equate hatred in every instance.

Eh some people believe in Sasquatch.  We don’t get to treat people as less then based on fanciful beliefs that can never be proven.

[choclatechip45]

31 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

This is all true. In Julie's case, it seems like a typical "I want to talk about this but don't want to acknowledge MY wrongdoing" because the most obvious identifier that should have been applied to Brandy was "hey, remember that girl you liked and I played that trick on you with your guestbook? " That was the defining incident around Brandy and would sure as hell have been more memorable than anything else about that conversation after 22 years. 

But Julie being Julie, hits the trifecta of shitting all over a fun moment (the reminiscing over the goofy technology of Y2K), bringing it up in the absolute most awkward way possible and making everyone uncomFORTable, and also ignoring the social lifeline Danny tried to throw her when he remarked that it was cute she was still thinking about it 22 years later. In anyone else, that would be a cue that you're being a weirdo and you should maybe pivot off that course. But Julie ignores all that and barrels forth with her "why didn't you like MEEEEEEE" nonsense. I wonder how much her husband has had to hear about Matt over the years since he's apparently been inundated with Jamie talk.

Deeply held beliefs about what some people consider to be the building blocks of life here and in the next aren't necessarily whims to them. My point was that people can co-exist even when their fundamental beliefs differ so greatly that each believes the other to be wrong on what they feel are the most crucial parts of life and disagreeing on those points doesn't equate hatred in every instance.

Danny's reaction to Julie being bizarre behavior has made me laugh all season long.

[ljenkins782]

28 minutes ago, MrBuhBye said:

Eh some people believe in Sasquatch.  We don’t get to treat people as less then based on fanciful beliefs that can never be proven.

Matt isn't treating Danny as less than, though. And dismissing Matt's beliefs as fanciful notions that can never be proven sounds an awful lot like treating people who believe in those things as less than. They are diametrically opposed in certain beliefs and treating each other the same as they're treating everyone else. 

Matt probably has thoughts about other things people in the house have done, like pre-marital sex or promiscuity or whatever and how that affects their chances of reaching the heaven he believes in. The reason we don't hear about that is because no one asks him to explain his beliefs with regard to those topics, while his feelings on homosexuality are overtly probed by both Danny and producers. 

Quote

I think Kelley is stressed about her clip package. One thing I've noticed rewatching the original New Orleans season is how anxious she is all the time. I know she mentioned in that one episode with Melissa that she suffered from depression. 

She's mentioned in interviews how she had to take her life coach hat off because ethically none of her cast members are her clients. Julie stresses me out I can't imagine having a front row seat. I would hope I would react like Danny stoned and finding amusement in the trainwreck and enjoy the free entertainment, but I feel like I would be more like Kelley stressed out.

I can see where she'd be more stressed out in the sense that her usual life is talking people out of making terrible choices and trying to help them find the right path and not only can she not do that for Julie, Julie doesn't appear to even want that. She seems like she's looking forward to all the fallout and controversy around her time. Or rather it seemed that way while she was filming, I do wonder if the way the final shows were cut together have changed her mindset in any way. 

And since Kelley has a book coming out and a moderately famous husband, she's probably more stressed than average about things could come across. So she's going overboard to not give the editors anything to work with, spending so much time sitting on her bed and walking away from touchy conversations. 

[1011101010001]

23 minutes ago, ljenkins782 said:

And dismissing Matt's beliefs as fanciful notions that can never be proven sounds an awful lot like treating people who believe in those things as less than.

People who behave badly should be treated as less than.  It’s their choice.  Being bigoted against bigots is laudable, not equivalent. A religion that has a central tenet that gay people are sinners and will be going to hell is not a religion that deserves any respect.  White supremacists sincerely believe that other races are inferior but that does not mean that opinion should be treated as deserving of respect.  It’s disturbing that there is so much hate speech disguised as religion.

[heatherchandler]

1 hour ago, MrBuhBye said:

Eh some people believe in Sasquatch.  We don’t get to treat people as less then based on fanciful beliefs that can never be proven.

So you’re totally against all religion.  I respect all people’s beliefs.  I don’t agree with Matt but I don’t see him treating people as less-than.

[1011101010001]

22 minutes ago, heatherchandler said:

So you’re totally against all religion.  I respect all people’s beliefs.  I don’t agree with Matt but I don’t see him treating people as less-than.

Telling someone you are a sinner and you need to pray to change or you will go to hell is by definition telling someone they are less than.  He doesn’t tell straight people that.  I can read the room here and actually it’s the kind of stuff that contributes to gay teen suicide so I will not engage further.

Edited May 28, 2022 by MrBuhBye

[choclatechip45]

Danny was on Kelley's podcast during the summer of 2021 one thing I found interesting is his brother the one who came with his parents on the show is gay. It's a pretty good interview 

[Glade]

On 5/25/2022 at 9:18 PM, Asp Burger said:

Yep. That was Brandy. Julie left a message on his guestbook that "only pedophiles and assholes" give out their URLs, and signed Brandy's name. Then Matt embarrassed himself by calling Brandy to find out if her message was serious or a joke, and she said she had never signed his guestbook.

Julie thought her joke was hilarious

I rolled my eyes so hard when that episode first came out, because Julie was badly misquoting Cruel Intentions, where Ryan Phillipe's character quips that "email is for geeks and pedophiles." I'm sure she thought of that as a super edgy film and that she was so clever for trying to parrot that dumb line,  thereby implying that Matt was a pedophile and setting up a confrontation between him and Brandy, who I'm sure would never have quoted that film. Julie was in the wrong there on so many levels, and continues to be to this day.

Edited May 28, 2022 by Glade

[Hiyo]

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I wonder how much her husband has had to hear about Matt over the years since he's apparently been inundated with Jamie talk.

I wonder how bad Julie just wants a 3some with Jamie and Matt.

[ljenkins782]

8 hours ago, Hiyo said:

I wonder how bad Julie just wants a 3some with Jamie and Matt.

Yikes, there's a mental image I didn't need! I'm sure Julie's fantasy would be complete though, in terms of the mind-blowing, anything can happen TV show she wants to create, that would be the ultimate coup. 

Back to Kelley, I wonder if she wants to leave because her obvious anxiety could harm her brand. I'd forgotten that her slogan is "choose love over worry," and the anxiety etched into her face in every episode indicates she's chosen worry at this moment. Not great timing with her book coming out now and she might be afraid of how her clients will view her advice after seeing how much anxiety she's displaying. 

She had no way of knowing that most of the footage of her was pretty benign and that there was a minimal quantity of screen time anyway.

[Zizzlezazzle]

I don’t care much for Kelley, never have. I had forgotten about her incredulity that Jamie wasn’t jumping all over her when they first met simply because they were both attractive, (cringey entitlement later echoed by Cara to Kyle in the Chicago season).

Prior to homecoming, two super random memories of Kelley before and after her RW season live rent-free in my head: The first was during the NOLA casting special when she held up a pinky finger with an impish grin to insinuate why she and her last boyfriend didn’t last. I think with that move the casting directors were hopeful that beyond the pretty face she’d be an unexpected firecracker, which wasn’t the case. The second was in an interview after her season where she talked about Scott Wolf courting her. In the days before TiVo or DVR, he tried to call her when she was watching Oprah and eating her strawberries and chocolate milk, and she chewed him out. I think that anecdote was also meant to deliver proof of her spunkiness and relatability—“I don’t care if you’re some hotshot celeb—don’t interrupt my favorite show!” Beyond the scolding, it was her snack choice that irked me and was also just a little too holier-than-thou—like, strawberries and chocolate milk are your indulgence? Had she said Doritos and Diet Coke I would have been All In (yes, yes, I know I’ve reached the summit of Mt. Petty here! 😹)

But that’s also Kelley on this reunion: inaccessible and not particularly relatable. She seems to genuinely have a fantastic marriage and family life, but I wonder about her capacity to be a warm, impactful life coach (a title that already heralds all sorts red flags) when she still seems to be withholding so much of herself from the others. She missed the drag show to work on her book—is that why she was also absent for the second airboat ride? By the way, her book, Flow,  isn’t self-published, but the publisher also isn’t a well-known nonfiction imprint or Canadian extension of one of the big houses (Random/Penguin, Hachette, Harper, etc.) So why was this deadline so imperative? Who’s waiting with baited breath for this book?

And sure, Julie’s thirsty BS is creeping them all out, but putting up with one week of her shenanigans for a 200k payout or whatever shouldn’t be so rattling for someone who identifies as a “transcendental meditation” expert.

Ha, evidently there are sparks flying everywhere from me grinding my ax so hard, but I think there has always been a stark contrast in this cast between Matt and Kelley—the pale boring ones who continue to just sort of coast—and the rest of them. Their skin looks great though, I’ll give them that!