Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness (2022)

[tv echo]

‘Marvel Studios Assembled: The Making of Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness’ Coming To Disney+
June 21, 2022 by Michelle Beck
https://www.disneyplusinformer.com/marvel-studios-assembled-the-making-of-doctor-strange-in-the-multiverse-of-madness-coming-to-disney/ 

Quote

Disney has announced that “Marvel Studios Assembled: The Making of Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness” will release on Disney+ on Friday, July 1, 2022.

[Spartan Girl]

3 hours ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

I don't know, I liked some parts of this movie, and America Chavez will be a fine addition now that she's arrived. But the question of 'where is So And So' is particularly glaring at times like this, since Wanda was an Avenger herself and arguably lost more than anyone. Every time someone gives the character shit for Westview and fails to equally roast Steve Rogers for hijacking Peggy Carter's life for himself, it just makes it more glaring. Forget Loki, since his story isn't really over yet and he's mostly stopped being a tool. Wanda dies (for now) as penance for her actions, but Rogers gets his 'stupid dancing happy ending timeline' and that's okay?

It doesn't seem fair.

No. No, it’s not. Especially when Steve’s stupid dancing timeline resulting in getting Sharon thrown under the bus as a villain just to absolve him and appease the Civil War backlash.

But what they did to Wanda is a million times worse, and I don’t say that lightly. Wanda, unlike Sharon, at least had more of a developed character arc before they pissed it away in this movie. And I also can’t cling to theory that the evil Wanda will turn out to be a Skrull. 

[Ailianna]

I have many of the same concerns about how Sands was treated, but there's one bit of sexism I haven't seen anyone address. Its that Wanda's whole motivation is her kids. Such a 1950s stereotype of what a woman values. She shrugs off temporal/ruling power just for her kids. Now, Wanda has been seeking love and family since she was 10 and a Stark bomb failed to go off, but it is never questioned that her whole ambition is in "a woman's place." Which I think is heightened by the complete lack of Vision or Pietro or her parents. And I get that parents love their kids. There's just something about how this was presented that made me think they were making her an uber powerful "little woman" and it grated.

I should add I love Wanda and WandaVision and hate them making her a villain again without some developed, emotionally resonant reason.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

Not kids, though. Family. Because as someone mentioned upthread, she can literally create matter out of thin air, so why couldn't she have just made herself some "new" kids and been happy with them? She wanted her kids, Billy and Tommy, the ones she decided she'd created with Vision. The one time she gets "Pietro" back, it turns out to be an impostor foisted off on her by Agatha, likely as a prod to keep her on a certain path, so she wouldn't have created more fakes, something that even in her deluded state she would know wasn't real.

[Spartan Girl]

11 hours ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

Clint gets a pass, and even that's contingent on Barton's encroaching deafness and the fact that he probably feels old and tired, and anyway now Kate's here. Everybody else who met Wanda and is still alive? Sucks, even Bruce and (unfortunately) Carol, who can make time for a holo-conference with Wong near the end of Shang Chi but can't be bothered with Wanda. Probably because they didn't need her to do anything for them. Great planning, guys.

Well, I’ll give Carol a pass, since she didn’t meet the gang until after the Snap and therefore wasn’t really friends with Carol. Plus, she was preoccupied with other galaxies. Bruce, on the other hand, was Wanda’s friend but like you said, he and the others couldn’t make time for her unless they needed something from her. With friends like these…

[Bruinsfan]

I'm not so sure Bruce and Wanda were friends. The only interactions between them I can remember were in the 2nd movie, and they were all hostile. He was absent from the team from the end of that until the beginning of Infinity War, and then within a few hours she turned into a dust bunny for 5 years. As near as I can figure, Clint, Sam, and to a lesser degree Rhodey were the only Avengers left after the end of Endgame who had any connection with her.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Bruinsfan said:

I'm not so sure Bruce and Wanda were friends. The only interactions between them I can remember were in the 2nd movie, and they were all hostile. He was absent from the team from the end of that until the beginning of Infinity War, and then within a few hours she turned into a dust bunny for 5 years. As near as I can figure, Clint, Sam, and to a lesser degree Rhodey were the only Avengers left after the end of Endgame who had any connection with her.

This. Bruce only spent a brief amount of time with her after Vision was created in Age of Ultron and flying to Wakanda in Infinity War. There wasn’t time to become friends when he was still angry from her mind games or when she was focused on a dying Vision. 

Based on the scene at Tony’s funeral, I think it was a wasted opportunity that they didn’t develop a relationship between Wanda, Sam and Bucky post-Endgame. I loved WandaVision but a slow burn getting her to that point would have been better than only taking her from one trauma to another. They never even let us see her actually being a hero. 

[Spartan Girl]

9 hours ago, Dani said:

They never even let us see her actually being a hero. 

And that’s what makes me hate this film. Wanda could have had a great antihero/hero arc, and they wasted it.

And @Cobalt Stargazer is right: regardless of how “close” the surviving Avengers were with Wanda, she was still their teammate and deserved more from them. For the record, I still lay most of the blame at Steve’s feet*, but Strange KNEW about Westview and Wanda’s traumas and didn’t even bother to go see her until he needed something from her.

*Which gives me another reason why I’m glad Wanda killed Peggy’s Captain variant. Yeah, I’m petty, sue me.

[Raja]

Dr. Strange was never an Avenger, their paths just crossed while fighting Thanos. Aside from Tony Stark's funeral he should be just as close to any Asgardian or Wakandan soldier as to her.

[tv echo]

I finally watched this movie (on Disney+). I'm pretty easy to please when it comes to MCU movies, but I really struggled just to finish watching the entire movie. It was a mess. This is the first MCU movie that I do not want to rewatch.

[BaggythePanther]

On 6/23/2022 at 9:19 AM, Spartan Girl said:

Strange KNEW about Westview and Wanda’s traumas and didn’t even bother to go see her until he needed something from her.

I remember hearing that the original plan for WandaVision had Strange reaching out to Wanda. That’s what the commercials were supposed to be, Strange trying to break through. And then he would have appeared at the end, I think in a post credits scene. Supposedly it was scrapped because they didn’t want Strange’s appearance to take away from Wanda’s story. But in hindsight this just isolated her which made it easier to cast her into the villain role in MoM.

[supposebly]

So, I finally watched this. As always, I find Dr Strange boring and annoying. Arrogant without  charm. And while Elisabeth Olson was phenomenal, I also agree that this was covered in Wanda Vision and the magic book was simply the MacGuffin to make this repetitive plot work. Just instead of Vision, it was her imaginary kids. Lazy.

Also, did they ever explain how there were 2 children in the other universe(s) while Vision was nowhere to be found? So they were imaginary kids too? So she was planning to simply go back to her imaginary Westview? I mean, repetitive doesn't even cover this writing.

[Kel Varnsen]

I watched it today and mostly liked it. I love that it was obviously directed by Sam Raimi. That camera flying into someone's eye bit looks great with modern technology. Also loved the use of his Delta 88.

I kind of don't really care about the multiverse though. Like who cares of Reed Richards gets killed since we just met him and he is not the "real" Reed Richards. 

I did like making Wanda the villain though. After Wandavision I always thought she got off too easy. Especially with how they made Agatha the bad guy who got punished way worse than Wanda even though what Wanda did was way worse. On the plus side she looks awesome as the Scarlett Witch.

i also liked alternate universe Christine, although I did watch Mean Girls with my kids this week so it was hard not to see Regina George. I feel like Regina George could take down evil Wanda with just gossip and rude comments. 

[cambridgeguy]

By the rules they laid out Wanda had to be the villain - they kept going on about how using the Darkhold would corrupt the reader.  Her using that book without any consequences would be like someone using the One Ring and being totally OK.  On the plus side, unlike the other Stranges we've seen she wasn't just moping about her love interest, but the whole White Vision thing really deserved some followup. 

[Cobalt Stargazer]

17 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

I did like making Wanda the villain though. After Wandavision I always thought she got off too easy. Especially with how they made Agatha the bad guy who got punished way worse than Wanda even though what Wanda did was way worse. On the plus side she looks awesome as the Scarlett Witch.

Yeah, boo hoo for Agatha, who murdered her own mother and a whole bunch of other people for power. The only reason she was even in Westview was because she wanted to find out how Wanda did it, created the Hex, so that she could steal Wanda's abilities for herself and probably do something a lot worse. All things considered, everyone's better off if she can't do magic stuff for a while.

On 6/23/2022 at 8:23 AM, Raja said:

Dr. Strange was never an Avenger

I have a legitimate question: why does it matter if he was an Avenger or not? How did he find out what happened in Westview unless he was in contact with someone or heard something related to the incident? He's not a government agent either, he's a doctor in his 'normal' life, and it seems like the kind of thing that wouldn't be talked about in civilian circles unless it was Avenger-adjacent. He doesn't know Monica Rambeau or Darcy Lewis or Jimmy Woo either, AFAIK. My complaint hinges on the fact that it's somehow relevant that he never fought side by side with the Original Six but not relevant that he knows enough to brush off Wanda's inquiry about him being there to discuss the issue with her. Does he hang out at art galleries with Luis or something?

[Kel Varnsen]

3 hours ago, Cobalt Stargazer said:

Yeah, boo hoo for Agatha, who murdered her own mother and a whole bunch of other people for power. The only reason she was even in Westview was because she wanted to find out how Wanda did it, created the Hex, so that she could steal Wanda's abilities for herself and probably do something a lot worse. All things considered, everyone's better off if she can't do magic stuff for a while.

I'm less thinking about boo hoo Agatha and more about what they did vs what happened to them. Agatha wanted to steal Wanda's powers in order to do something. Because she was the bad guy in Wandavision she basically got lobotomized, which seems like a brutal punished, especially since I don't think Wanda knew about her killing her family. Wanda on the other hand was presented as the good guy, so even though she basically tortured a town full of people for a few weeks (right after a bunch of them would have come back to life). And after doing that nothing really happened to her. So I liked how after seeing this movie, you can look at Wandavision as the first step to Wanda being a full on villain. 

I just hope that when she comes back (because you know she will) they just don't ignore everything she did and everyone she killed because she was under the influence of the Darkhold.

[katha]

Saw this recently. I liked it mostly. Raimi put his horror aesthetic with a twist and humor into it and IMO it really benefited from looking a bit different than the usual Marvel fare. Also served the characters. 

Wanda was a terrifying villain, really well done. Kudos to Olsen. And IMO it worked that Strange is so gray and Cumberbatch leans into his questionable characteristics. The script did a decent job of showing that Strange himself was only a step away from doing the same things Wanda would do, that's why he worked as someone who has the ruthlessness and deviousness to stop her. Being only noble and kind would have probably been a death sentence. 

I also liked that it all centered on her power and it took a village to defeat her by basically waking her up to herself and how that life she imagined with her kids would collide with reality. Wong was cool, America was a nice introduction and IMO Christine was better used this time compared to the last movie. Solid effort all around for me. 

[Racj82]

On 6/22/2022 at 9:53 AM, Spartan Girl said:

No. No, it’s not. Especially when Steve’s stupid dancing timeline resulting in getting Sharon thrown under the bus as a villain just to absolve him and appease the Civil War backlash.

But what they did to Wanda is a million times worse, and I don’t say that lightly. Wanda, unlike Sharon, at least had more of a developed character arc before they pissed it away in this movie. And I also can’t cling to theory that the evil Wanda will turn out to be a Skrull. 

Ha. I accidentally read this post before I saw who wrote it. But, I figured it out before looking.

I've long grown to not care about other opinions on these things. I don't know if it's people bringing in their own baggage, expectations or what. This is a general comment not targeted.

I enjoyed the movie. Just caught it on Disney plus. 

I was surprised that Wanda was a flat out villain but it makes sense. She has seriously been warped by the power she has gained and what she is working with.

Marvel is almost building their own Young Justice with so many heroes gaining younger sidekicks and partners. I dig it.

I've seen a bunch of people ask what the point of the movie was. Beyond further establishing the multiverse I think it's become a recurring theme throughout this phase. Are you happy? Our established heroes are generally all lost. Seeking happiness. Trying to move on like the rest of the world. But, they all aren't sure how to really find it.

Strange is directionless. He is not really succeeding as a wizard and he lost the love of his life. Through this movie he has found new purpose, building actual bonds. We may of known even less about him than any other character that got a solo movie or show. There is more to him than his ego and drive.

Hawkeye haunted by events after infinity war, Falcon deciding if he can or if he wants to follow in his friends footsteps, Bucky seeking redemption and happiness, etc. 

I thought the horror worked well. I could feel Sami's sensibilities throughout. Some of the visuals were dark! 

I enjoyed Chavez. They didn't make her too snarky. I grew to care about her. 

They did a good job making different set pieces feel different within the film. 

The movie didn't drag to me and didn't go on too long which is the standard these days.

People seem to get caught up in contradictions of characters and their choices. But, that's just literally called being a human being. It's kind of what we do. Now, put that reality in the hands of heroes. 

It's why Batman has a contingency plan for everyone including himself. Everyone can be corrupted either voluntarily or not. 

Cool visuals. I care about Strange more than once did. I thought it was sweet that he kept calling Chavez kid because that's what he did with Peter. I got to see some cool multiverse cameos. I was entertained. Some of this will actually stick with me long term rather than just fun in the moment. My second favorite post Endgame movie after no way home. Eternals was forgettable for me, Widow was unnecessary (and I always felt that way even when everyone kept complaining about her not having a solo film).

[cambridgeguy]

2 hours ago, Racj82 said:

I've seen a bunch of people ask what the point of the movie was. Beyond further establishing the multiverse I think it's become a recurring theme throughout this phase. Are you happy? Our established heroes are generally all lost. Seeking happiness. Trying to move on like the rest of the world. But, they all aren't sure how to really find it.

The movie has grossed about 950 million dollars worldwide.  I think we all know what the point of the movie was.  Fans can read into it however they want, but most fans were mostly happy with the movie and would happily see another movie with these characters.  Mission accomplished.

[Racj82]

4 hours ago, cambridgeguy said:

The movie has grossed about 950 million dollars worldwide.  I think we all know what the point of the movie was.  Fans can read into it however they want, but most fans were mostly happy with the movie and would happily see another movie with these characters.  Mission accomplished.

Basically every movie exists to make money. That's not the point. Narrative wise, what is the point is what I'm talking about.

The most popular things will also get scrutinized the most so, what can you do?

[Frost]

I just caught this on Disney+.  I mostly enjoyed it.  The visuals were stunning.  Strange's first journey though the multiverses, with the animation and paint versions, was a lot of fun.  I also loved that 'verse 838 Earth had extremely colorful buildings and flowers and yet all the non-Illuminati people only wore black and grey.  It was such a clear reminder that we were in a different world.

I was bummed out that Wanda was a straight up villain.  I loved her WandaVision character and really felt her pain.  Having the Darkhold twist that emotional pain into such a single minded focus on regaining her "children" that she would nonchalantly kill hundreds, if not millions, of people seems like a simplistic plot decision, not a real extension of what happened in WandaVision.

I also didn't like that Wong brought Scarlet Witch to the mountain just because she was torturing the remaining sorcerers.  It never feels heroic to me to be willing to sacrifice the entire universe to save some of your friends.

I spent the movie wishing that America's search for her mothers and Wanda's search for her children would end up with America connecting with Wanda and bringing her to her senses, rather than the boys wanting their real mother and not Scarlet Witch.  But I guess that would have been too wrenching for America to have to lose yet another mother figure.

[supposebly]

17 minutes ago, Frost said:

of people seems like a simplistic plot decision, not a real extension of what happened in WandaVision.

This is why I often prefer TV shows over movies, esp. these kinds. You just don't have time for decent character development while you need to set up villains, visuals, shoddy plots and final boss fights.

The MCU had some success with this when it came to Tony Stark but overall, most character development is sacrificed at the altar of plot ideas and final boss fights. Civil War is probably one the most obvious ones.

[ICantDoThatDave]

Just watched this recently as well. I thought it was a combination of AWESOME!! and just... dumb & boring.  Like a rollercoaster.  The good parts were top notch, but the bad parts & the parts that just dragged were totally bottom-tier of the MCU.  So overall: good, I guess.  I enjoyed it.

Wanda as the villain was completely earned, IMO.  They'd been setting this up for a while.  I like the comparison upthread to The Dark Phoenix Saga - they set the stage over several movies & the TV show.  I don't think Thanos can be topped as a villain (we'll see) but Wanda comes seriously close for Best Villain Ever.  And her heel-turn has parallels in the comics, which helps, at least for me, who likes when they keep them "comic-authentic" (although, side-note: I think the attempts to call the MCU Universe 616 is a misstep - that's the comics universe).

The Illuminati stuff, while I get that it was kinda a contrived attempt to elicit OMGWTF!! reactions from the fans got me - I was very careful to avoid spoilers, so I didn't even know about Jim as Reed, much less Patrick Stewart showing up.  When I heard Stewart's voice & they *even played a snippet of the X-Men cartoon theme* it worked on me.  They got the reaction they wanted - I was all OMGWTF!!!

On the downside, America was just boring as a character.  She had no personality, no character development, & I don't know if it's the actress or the script, but I just didn't care about her.  I've seen her called a "walking MacGuffin" & that seems a good description IMO.  Towards the end, particularly when she took on Wanda & was like "Uh huh" & Wanda took the punch & was like "Nuh uh" I was kinda on Wanda's side. :)

Don't care about Strange's love-life, the whole "the power was in you all along!" thing was dumb & cliche, they didn't actually do a whole lot with the "Multiverse of Madness" concept, & there were several eye-rolling scenes I thought (the "music battle" for example).

But still, I enjoyed it overall.

[ICantDoThatDave]

Oh, on an unrelated note: Pizza Poppa did nothing to deserve what Strange did to him!  America stole from him, & he thought Strange stole from the "Strange Museum".  F'd up to curse him to punch himself for weeks, if you ask me.,

[Kel Varnsen]

9 hours ago, ICantDoThatDave said:

Oh, on an unrelated note: Pizza Poppa did nothing to deserve what Strange did to him!  America stole from him, & he thought Strange stole from the "Strange Museum".  F'd up to curse him to punch himself for weeks, if you ask me.,

That's kind of true. I mean it is a jerk move to do that to him, but Strange is also kind of a jerk so it works. Plus, for me,  Bruce Campbell is like one of my favourite actors and I love the Evil Dead series. So the call back to Evil Dead 2 with Bruce fighting his own hand (in a huge budget movie no less) was kind of awesome.

Edited June 27, 2022 by Kel Varnsen

[Lantern7]

Penny Arcade gets to the movie.

[tv echo]

Doctor Strange 2 Producer Names Phase 4's Most Important Characters
BY NOAH DOMINGUEZ   JUNE 27, 2022
https://www.cbr.com/mcu-phase-four-doctor-strange-scarlet-witch-anchor-characters/ 

Quote

Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness producer Richie Palmer has strongly suggested that Dr. Stephen Strange (Benedict Cumberbatch) and Wanda Maximoff/Scarlet Witch (Elizabeth Olsen) can be seen as the Marvel Cinematic Universe's most important characters as Phase Four carries on and the post-Infinity Saga era continues to take shape.

Marvel Studios president and Marvel Entertainment chief creative officer Kevin Feige previously described Cumberbatch's Doctor Strange as "the anchor of the Marvel Cinematic Universe." Palmer elaborated on this in Multiverse of Madness' audio commentary. "If Doctor Strange is the anchor of the MCU of Phase 4, then Wanda Maximoff is the jewel in the crown," he said.
*  *  *
"It's crazy to see Wanda act like this for the first time, it's so exciting," Palmer explained. "And for fans of the comics, we were so excited to bring this to screen and finally deliver on the promise. Once you introduce the character of the Scarlet Witch, even before she was the Scarlet Witch, we introduced her in Age of Ultron, there was always the hope that we can bring her to this place of her doing things like [infiltrating Kamar Taj]. And it's really exciting, and she is the best."

[festivus]

Finally saw this last night. I do think the seeds were there for Wanda to become a villain. It does feel a bit rushed and anyone that didn't watch WandaVision will probably be lost. However, I think they did it this way because she was too powerful and you can't really have that. I don't think she's dead. I think there's still a story to tell with her and White Vision.

I really like America Chavez and I thought the actress playing her was great. There was a sweet connection with Strange and he definitely needs that. It's weird that I actually feel the connection between him and Christine when I'm usually not into that sort of thing. I'm okay with them being doomed in every universe though, it's a different story to tell and I think it works. I do love Christine though, I hope they'll find a way to keep her around. 

All around I was entertained, the visuals were great and the cameos fun. I hope if we get another movie that we see what our Mordo is up to. 

[ICantDoThatDave]

On 6/27/2022 at 11:18 AM, festivus said:

However, I think they did it this way because she was too powerful and you can't really have that.

True.  It's the "Superman Effect".  Why do you need, say Green Arrow or well, even Flash, with Superman around?  Why do you need a Captain America or Black Widow with Carol & Wanda around?  What's Mantis or Groot or Gamora gonna do with Captain Marvel & the Scarlet Witch on the field?  Just watch, like the rest of us, while they solve all the problems?

They have to be sidelined for some reason, to give all the other characters a reason to be there.  And this was kinda an awesome way to sideline Wanda (better than "Captain Marvel is just... elsewhere *shrug*", which I get, but, same thing).

Edited June 29, 2022 by ICantDoThatDave

[tv echo]

[Sandman]

On 12/29/2021 at 9:49 PM, Brn2bwild said:

My hope is that they'll avoid making Wanda a villain because she's powerful and unhappy. That's so cliche, and already covered in WandaVision besides.  

Well, so much for Wanda's character arc -- this movie makes WandaVision feel entirely pointless. How many times is Marvel going to back to the "redhead gets drunk on her own power, wrecks everything for everyone" well? Jesus. Enough!

Olsen is never less than mesmerizing, but I hated that Wanda is so completely without self-awareness for nine tenths of the movie. Visually, the movie is arresting, and it was nice to see Christine again; I always like McAdams, and she and Cumberbatch have nice chemistry, but it's hard to feel much sympathy for Wanda. Crazy Bitch Wanda is ... not that interesting, sadly. And I don't buy the whole retcon of the Scarlet Witch being some prophesied* bringer of universal doom. (I also don't buy Wanda as more powerful than absolutely everyone. Charles Xavier, in particular, is the most powerful telepath on the planet. Wanda should not have been able to trounce him that easily, Darkhold or no. Now, Reed Richards, on the other hand, has the dumbest power in any universe. I have no trouble imagining that Wanda could best a guy made of gum.

Please stop assassinating your female heroes, Marvel.

Other Wanda tells her "Know that they're loved."

I've seen references to the first iteration of Strange we see (the one with the ponytail, pre-Zombie) as "Defender Strange." Does Strange ever make an appearance on the Netflix Defenders series?

(*And, no, Waldron, "prophesized" isn't a word, no matter what Dylan told you. Just, no.)

Edited July 3, 2022 by Sandman

[Guest]

24 minutes ago, Sandman said:

I've seen references to the first iteration of Strange we see (the one with the ponytail, pre-Zombie) as "Defender Strange." Does Strange ever make an appearance on the Netflix Defenders series?

He’s not in the Netflix series. Strange was one on the founders of the Defenders in the comics and the look in the movie was based off of that. 

[Sandman]

14 minutes ago, Dani said:

Strange was one on the founders of the Defenders in the comics and the look in the movie was based off of that. 

That part I knew, but I was pretty sure Cumberbatch wasn't part of the Netflix series. Thanks for the confirmation.

On 6/22/2022 at 2:02 PM, Ailianna said:

I should add I love Wanda and WandaVision and hate them making her a villain again without some developed, emotionally resonant reason.

Agreed.

Edited July 3, 2022 by Sandman

[Bookworm 1979]

I finally watched this over the weekend and I liked it more than I thought I would, especially since I knew they erased all of Wanda's character development from WandaVision. I was a little disappointed that no one thought to go check on Alternate Universe Wanda and make sure she was okay after being possessed by the Scarlet Witch.  She was the one I really felt bad for.

The movies like to screw over Wanda in every universe, don't they?

[Bruinsfan]

On 7/2/2022 at 10:56 PM, Sandman said:

I've seen references to the first iteration of Strange we see (the one with the ponytail, pre-Zombie) as "Defender Strange." Does Strange ever make an appearance on the Netflix Defenders series?

Specifically I think they named him that because he was wearing the outfit Strange wore in Matt Fraction's Defenders limited series back in 2012.

[tv echo]

‘Marvel Studios Assembled: The Making of Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness’ Delayed to July 8
July 1, 2022 by Michelle Beck
https://www.disneyplusinformer.com/marvel-studios-assembled-the-making-of-doctor-strange-in-the-multiverse-of-madness-delayed-to-july-8/ 

Quote

When Disney+ first announced its July release schedule,  “Marvel Studios Assembled: The Making of Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness” was scheduled release on Disney+ on Friday, July 1, 2022.  However, Disney+ just released their Next on DIsney+ trailer for July and now the show is scheduled to arrive on the streaming service on Friday, July 8, 2022.

[BetterButter]

[Kel Varnsen]

On 7/2/2022 at 11:56 PM, Sandman said:

Well, so much for Wanda's character arc -- this movie makes WandaVision feel entirely pointless. How many times is Marvel going to back to the "redhead gets drunk on her own power, wrecks everything for everyone" well? Jesus. Enough!

I don't know, to me Wanda going evil here seemed like a pretty natural progression of what went down in Wandavision. It would be less likely to me, if after the bad stuff she did in Wandavision she just got better, and over her grief and trauma, after spending a bunch of time alone with her thoughts without getting any outside help.

[Lantern7]

31 minutes ago, BetterButter said:

“See, this is why my favorite Doctor Strange movies are Avengers 3, Spider-Man 3 and Thor 3.”

Cold, Epic Voice Guy. So cold.

ETA: “Homeopathic Iron Man”

“America . . . just like her namesake, she means well, but she leaves behind a trail of destruction and fast food wherever she goes.”

Edited July 5, 2022 by Lantern7

[tv echo]

[Lantern7]

HISHE takes its turn.

[shantown]

On 6/26/2022 at 11:18 AM, Frost said:

The visuals were stunning.  Strange's first journey though the multiverses, with the animation and paint versions, was a lot of fun.  I also loved that 'verse 838 Earth had extremely colorful buildings and flowers and yet all the non-Illuminati people only wore black and grey.  It was such a clear reminder that we were in a different world.

We finally watched this on Disney+ last night. For a movie with "Multiverse" in the title it sure would have been nice to spend more than 30 seconds flipping through some other universes before deciding on one where the biggest change was swapping red and green traffic lights. 

This seemed a lot more like a "made for streaming" movie than a big budget, theatre movie. The monsters were very cartoon-y looking. All the flippy cape tricks and glowstick rave hand dancing powers of Dr. Strange seemed cheesy. As others have said, the setup of Wanda as a villain seemed... I don't know if unearned or contrived or manufactured is the word I'm looking for here. But it didn't seem to make sense on screen easily. I didn't mind the horror genre leanings, but all these things combined just left me disliking the movie overall. Which is a bummer, because I generally like Wanda and after the most recent Spiderman wanted to see more of the actual Multiverse.

[tv echo]

Marvel Studios Assembled: Making of Doctor Strange In the Multiverse of Madness is now on Disney+ - here's the trailer for it...

Marvel Studios' Assembled: The Making of Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness | Disney+
Marvel Entertainment   Jul 8, 2022

Edited July 11, 2022 by tv echo

[tv echo]

The Cast & Crew of Marvel Studios' Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness | What's Up, Disney+
Disney Plus    Jul 16, 2022

[paramitch]

Ugh. I love Strange and Wanda as characters (and their actors are superb), so I was looking forward to this. Then I got maybe 32 minutes in and realized with a sinking heart that I hated what I was watching. It just felt schlocky, cruel, and deeply unpleasant. By the time it was over? Times a thousand. I mean, this was bad.

I can't believe we went from "WandaVision" and its thoughtful, complex, rich exploration of grief, love and loss... to this piece of dreck that turned Wanda from a complicated and grieving trauma victim into a one-note, cardboard villain shrieking "My children!" every time she decimated another swathe of heroes and innocents.

It's telling that Raimi admitted to not watching "WandaVision," as this movie undid everything Wanda learned there -- when SHE HERSELF let her imaginary children go as part of her acceptance of grief.

Wanda's trauma has never been simplistic. It was trauma upon trauma. It was that she had lost her entire family and home in childhood, except her brother, then lost him too. Then rebuilt her capacity for love and friendship... with Vision, who was nurturing, loving, and absolutely 100% there for her. Then had that ripped away too. Again, and in the cruelest way possible.

The shame of it for me is that what was once a complex evocation of Wanda's grief in WV, about the loss of Vision, her brother, everyone she had ever loved, plus her (imaginary, if real to her) children was here reduced by the writers to a maddening, simplistic grieving mommy trope. There's barely a mention of Vision (and that one line doesn't even go into what was so horrible -- not just that she had to kill the man she loved -- but that she had to do it, then had to watch him die all over again, this time in fear, not in love and acceptance).

And watching her kill all the Illuminati so gruesomely really left a bad taste in my mouth. (Bisecting Carter with the shield? Seriously?) And as always with these kinds of things the power differentials were laughably inconsistent fight by fight.

And while it was great to see Bruce Campbell back in another Raimi cameo, his appearance was (par for the course with this entire movie) unnecessarily cruel. Making a guy punch himself for days after being robbed? Really? There's a nastiness at this movie's core.

I know Wanda has all sorts of arcs in the comics, and okay, that's cool. But for me, what they did here was a betrayal of the movie character they have given us across all of these movies and shows. For me, they did to Wanda what they did to Nat. Created a wonderful, rich female hero then ripped out her complexity and reduced all motivation to the presence or absence of children. (I mean, don't get me started on poor Nat.)

On 5/5/2022 at 10:31 PM, dmeets said:

I don’t think I can even get into the Wanda BS. Total character annihilation so that Raimi could get his horror movie.

This.

On 5/6/2022 at 5:38 AM, Spartan Girl said:

This really felt like one giant middle finger to everyone that got emotionally invested in WandaVision.

Wanda had her villain arc, but when she saw the damage she was (unintentionally) doing to the Westview residents, she was horrified: “That’s not me.” She did the right thing and undid the spell, even though it broke her heart for the millionth time, and vowed to learn to harness her problems so something like that would never happen again. We’re supposed to believe she just kinda forgot about all that and went straight to murder? Even if the dark book was corrupting her, it felt like cheap and lazy writing.

Beautifully put. You are my people.

On 5/8/2022 at 9:01 AM, Shannon L. said:

It really pains me to say this, but my least favorite Marvel movie, which hadn't moved from that spot since the day I saw it in the theater, has finally been replaced with this one.

Mine too. I buy almost all of the Marvel movies (okay, so I didn't buy the Norton Hulk, it just didn't do anything for me), but I am so glad I didn't buy this one. Never will.

On 5/8/2022 at 6:51 PM, Proclone said:

I also thought it was strange (no pun intended) that Vision wasn't really mentioned in all this.  There has to be a universe with Billy, Tommy and Vision all together, right? I mean the obvious answer is they couldn't get or didn't want to use Paul Bettany for some reason, but his absence on screen and more importantly as a lack of motive for Wanda seemed to make little sense, since she enslaved a town over her grief for him. 

Right. Grief over Vision sent her into madness and he's barely a blip here but her imaginary kids are now her big thing? Whatever. I also agree with you that they could have had Wanda genuinely frantic thinking her kids were trapped/in danger.

I would then have added in her attempting NOT to kill people, just to disable them, and Strange genuinely trying to reach her, only have the Darkhold poisoning her further so that when she DOES kill, late in the film -- it's a big moment, a punch in the gut. Instead of her decimating Strange's monastery casually in the first big confrontation, like, "Oh, right, I guess Wanda is a remorseless psychopath now..."

On 5/8/2022 at 9:22 PM, Proclone said:

It's not great storytelling to have a character learn certain lessons and then conveniently unlearn everything just because of a McGuffin.  We spent an entire series watching Wanda learn to deal with her grief.  To learn she can't just create (or steal) a family...But in this, that's exactly what she's trying to do.  Have the Darkhold corrupt her in some other way, if you need her to be the villain of this.  Don't just say to the audience that time you spent watching Wanda grieve and learn to move on was a ultimately pointless.

This.

On 5/9/2022 at 8:53 AM, Jenniferbug said:

If they wanted Wanda to be the villain, I think using an alternate Wanda would have been the better move. She could have been acting on her own, and our Wanda ends up tempted to join her because she understands her pain and grief. Or maybe she's dreamwalking our Wanda, who isn't really resisting because again, pain and grief at losing her children. End result leaves our Wanda a viable character either way and doesn't undo the arc from WandaVision. 

100% this. A story where Wanda lost everything and did NOT learn from Wandavision would have been appropriate and moving (and interesting for Wanda to witness; she was already horrified at herself over Westview).

On 5/9/2022 at 1:03 PM, Proclone said:

In any case, as someone who's experienced probably more than their fair share of grief, I found WandaVision to be a fairly moving treatise on the nature of grief.  How it often effects and even hurts those around us. How it makes us retreat from the world. How it often causes us to over romanticize the ones we've lost..."What is grief, if not love preserving?" Is a pretty epic line.

I'm so sorry for your losses. I've experienced a lot of loss and grief too, and I found "WandaVision" to be incredibly rich and moving -- it shocked me how profound and smart it was. This movie felt to me like it burned "WandaVision" to the ground. I'm horrified and angry.

On 5/19/2022 at 8:05 AM, Spartan Girl said:

Apparently all the Avengers had an unspoken agreement that once they Snapped her back, she was on her own, friend or not. “Let’s leave the traumatized and powerful witch on her own after she’s lost the love of her life, I’m sure she’ll be just fine.” And the fact that the MCU STILL refuses to acknowledge the Avengers’ post Endgame shortsightedness makes my teeth crack.

100% this (and what @Cobalt Stargazer said too). It's even sadder when he responds to Wanda with an acknowledgment that it has been a year and a half since Westview! And -- nobody? Nothing? Her grief captured/shattered a town. And nobody thought, "Hey, maybe Wanda needs some support and company"--? It's gross. And it breaks immersion for me because I DO buy that the movie Avengers are a family and no, I DON'T think they would have abandoned her like that.

On 5/19/2022 at 6:00 PM, Spartan Girl said:

Honestly it’s enough to make me wish they had a scene of Wanda finding her way to Steve’s stupid dancing happy ending timeline and had her blow the house the fuck up. 

Oh hell, yes, count me in. I'll always hate that so much. Such a lazy sentimental utterly illogical, borderline-insulting ending. Total pandering.

Edited July 19, 2022 by paramitch

[Kel Varnsen]

2 hours ago, paramitch said:

can't believe we went from "WandaVision" and its thoughtful, complex, rich exploration of grief, love and loss... to this piece of dreck that turned Wanda from a complicated and grieving trauma victim into a one-note, cardboard villain shrieking "My children!" every time she decimated another swathe of heroes and innocents.

But do you think after Wandavision with Wanda just hiding out in the forest by herself that she would just get better? Without any kind of help. Even without the influence of the Darkhold, her just getting over all her issues seems hard to believe. It seems more likely to me she would replay everything that happened in her head and realize how she could have done it better so she doesn't lose everything. 

2 hours ago, paramitch said:

And while it was great to see Bruce Campbell back in another Raimi cameo, his appearance was (par for the course with this entire movie) unnecessarily cruel. Making a guy punch himself for days after being robbed? Really? There's a nastiness at this movie's core.

I am a huge Bruce Campbell fan and Raimi torturing him is kind of part of their relationship (and they have been friends since childhood). My favourite one is in Army of Darkness, there is a scene with Evil Ash being buried alive, and Bruce admitted (either in his first book or on the DVD commentary) that Raimi himself was the one shovelling the dirt on him.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

9 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

But do you think after Wandavision with Wanda just hiding out in the forest by herself that she would just get better? Without any kind of help. Even without the influence of the Darkhold, her just getting over all her issues seems hard to believe. It seems more likely to me she would replay everything that happened in her head and realize how she could have done it better so she doesn't lose everything.

It keeps coming back to that, though. That Wanda was alone, without company or help, and even during WandaVision Monica was the only one who tried to approach her like she was a human being in pain. Hayward wanted to either lock her up or kill her, and that was in addition to using her as a scapegoat to cover up his at best illegal and at worst inhuman treatment of Vision's remains. Agatha was I guess not as bad as she could have been, but she still manipulated Wanda because she wanted to know how she created the Hex. But I repeat - Wanda was alone, with no one to turn her for advice or solace. I know where Sam was, off making sure Bucky could cross the street by himself. Natasha died on Vormir in a sacrifice play. Clint only came out of retirement long enough to help clean up the mess Kate Bishop made, and anyway his deteriorating hearing is a better than average reason for him to stay retired. If I was feeling generous, I would allow that the other survivors (Bruce, Thor, Carol, Peter, whoever else) either don't really know Wanda or don't have that great of a relationship with her, but.....I am no longer feeling generous. If they wanted me to think something else, like that anyone cares if Wanda lives or dies unless she can do something for them, they should have written that Something Else.

Edited July 20, 2022 by Cobalt Stargazer

[Spartan Girl]

At this point, I really just wish the WandaVision post credits scene had White Vision finding Wanda at the cabin after he got his memories back, like it the How It Should Have Ended video. Then we wouldn’t have had to deal with this shit at all.

[Kel Varnsen]

So I was thinking about Bruce Campbell today and if the place where the Illuminati live and the place where Tobey Maguire Spider lives are just alternate universes does that mean that Pizza Poppa and the wrestling announcer, or the waiter, or the theatre usher are the same guy. It is too bad we never got a Raimi Spiderman 4 because then Pizza Poppa would have been an alternate universe Mysterio.

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