Predator and Prey: Assault, harassment, and other aggressions in the entertainment industry

[Bastet]

54 minutes ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

How exceedingly rare false accusations are?

Yes.  You may be unaware of the numerous studies concluding the same, and specifically of the investigative journalism that led to the documentaryVictim/Suspect, digestible for the TL; DR crowd, but they combine to confirm the obvious: the already miniscule number of false accusations are misrepresented as even more than they are, due to coerced recantations. 

[Danielg342]

I don't necessarily disagree that most accusations are not actually false. It takes a lot of courage to come forward with an accusation, and most will not expend that energy on something they know is false.

However, I also think that while it's important not to jump to conclusions that an allegation is false, it's also important not to jump to conclusions that an allegation is true. No matter how rare false accusations may be, everyone deserves their day in court, and every case has to be debated solely on its own individual merits.

[peachmangosteen]

That sentiment is all well and good but what it actually leads to is witch hunts against women that report/all this 'will someone only think of this poor man who might be falsely accused' bullshit. And it's just ridiculous because rape cases are barely even tried let alone lead to convictions anyway so there's basically no reason to worry about all these poor men who are being falsely accused, which again is literally not based in reality.

[Danielg342]

As someone whose life has been ruined by false accusations (no, I won't get into it), I would have to respectfully disagree that false accusations are not a problem. I don't care how many there really are- just like one rape is one too many so too is one false accusation.

All the problems you describe are not byproducts of "everyone has to have their day". They're byproducts of other parts of a broken system that- like many other parts of the justice system- are designed to protect those in power. Further, all the problems you describe are because the justice system does not really "give everyone their day", because it's a system that has been corrupted by those in power.

A fair justice system does not have to hurt anyone, and one that is truly fair where everyone "gets their day" should not hurt anyone.

[bluegirl147]

10 hours ago, Bastet said:

Her actions, and her parent' actions/inactions, don't matter.  If this is true, which I have no reason at this point to believe it is not, given how things have apparently played out thus far (amending the lawsuit from Celebrity A to naming Jay-Z following his camp's campaign of intimidation as a response to her lawyer's request for mediation) - and, you know, how exceedingly rare false accusations of sexual assault are - two men decided to rape her.  How she got to the party, what she did at the party, how old they thought she was, where her parents thought she was if they didn't know -- all irrelevant.  The alleged perpetrators' actions are the only ones that deserve scrutiny in evaluating this case, because if they did what she says they did, they're guilty, and nothing she or her parents did/didn't do has any bearing on that.

Thank you! We hear this a lot. Why was the girl/woman someplace she could get assaulted when the question should be why did a man assault her.

 

7 minutes ago, Danielg342 said:

A fair justice system does not have to hurt anyone, and one that is truly fair where everyone "gets their day" should not hurt anyone.

When it comes to sexual assault I don't know how fair I would call our justice system. One that allows the accuser's sexual history to be used against her but the accused sexual history is not allowed to be used against him.

[FilmTVGeek80]

8 hours ago, Bastet said:

Yes.  You may be unaware of the numerous studies concluding the same, and specifically of the investigative journalism that led to the documentaryVictim/Suspect, digestible for the TL; DR crowd, but they combine to confirm the obvious: the already miniscule number of false accusations are misrepresented as even more than they are, due to coerced recantations. 

I’m aware of the studies and of that documentary. I don’t take one documentary as gospel proof of anything. I’m sure false recantations happen, just like false accusations do as well. As far as the research, it always seems murky to me because is it just based on the public recantations? And sometimes there’s a difference between a flat out false report and an accusation that can’t be proven either way. But based on the studies I’ve seen false accusations make up about 2-10% of reported assault cases. In 2023, there were about 127,000 reported assaults. 2% of 127,000 is 2500. I’m going to guess that those men - and their families - aren’t shrugging their shoulders and acting like it’s no big deal because false accusations are “exceedingly rare.”

1 hour ago, peachmangosteen said:

That sentiment is all well and good but what it actually leads to is witch hunts against women that report/all this 'will someone only think of this poor man who might be falsely accused' bullshit. And it's just ridiculous because rape cases are barely even tried let alone lead to convictions anyway so there's basically no reason to worry about all these poor men who are being falsely accused, which again is literally not based in reality.

Literally not based on reality? Tell that to Conor Oberst. Or Brian Banks. I had this happen to a family member of mine. So, yes, it is literally based in reality.

41 minutes ago, Danielg342 said:

As someone whose life has been ruined by false accusations (no, I won't get into it), I would have to respectfully disagree that false accusations are not a problem. I don't care how many there really are- just like one rape is one too many so too is one false accusation.

It blows my mind that this is considered a controversial take. No one is saying don’t feel bad for assault victims. It’s a horrific crime. But false accusations do happen. I don’t care how rare you think they are. To act like being accused falsely of something like that isn’t damaging and psychologically hard to come back from is not the case.

I’m not saying Jay-Z’s accuser is lying. But I’m allowed to have questions about her story and not be guilted for it. I’d much rather keep an open mind than act like I have all the information needed and label someone a pedophile rapist based on very little.

[Danielg342]

1 hour ago, bluegirl147 said:

When it comes to sexual assault I don't know how fair I would call our justice system. One that allows the accuser's sexual history to be used against her but the accused sexual history is not allowed to be used against him.

I acknowledged that the justice system is not fair. My point is that all the problems we have with the system- the witch hunts, the suppression tactics, people using their wealth and power to make things "go away", etc.- are due to the fact the system is not fair. Me wanting a fair system where every case is evaluated on its merits does not create these problems, the absence of a fair system does.

[Stats Queen]

5 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

That sentiment is all well and good but what it actually leads to is witch hunts against women that report/all this 'will someone only think of this poor man who might be falsely accused' bullshit. And it's just ridiculous because rape cases are barely even tried let alone lead to convictions anyway so there's basically no reason to worry about all these poor men who are being falsely accused, which again is literally not based in reality.

I know someone whose life was destroyed by false allegations. Years later, the person came out and apologized and said she lied. The man in question lost his job and his life purpose. One of the best humans I have ever known.

You wouldn’t be happy if is happened to you or someone you love.

[peachmangosteen]

I'd be less happy if I or someone I love was raped and never got justice tbh, which is like par for the course and yet some people really do seem to get more up in arms over the like .01% false accusations that happen but to each his own I guess.

[Danielg342]

First, I think all of our perspectives will be coloured by our own experiences. Someone who was attacked and didn't receive justice for it will feel stronger about that than someone else whose life was ruined by a false accusation and vice versa.

More importantly, this ought to not be a competition. An injustice is an injustice, period. I feel just as strongly for survivors who didn't receive justice- for any reason- as I do for those, like me, who have had their lives ruined by a false accusation. Both of those incidents are wrong and shouldn't happen in a fair and just society.

Honestly, from a policy perspective, the numbers don't mean anything. There could be 300 false accusations of rape compared to one rape victim who didn't get justice, and that one victim who didn't receive justice should be taken just as seriously as the 300 people who were falsely accused.

One false accusation, just like one rape, is one too many.

I think the real problem with harassment and assault discussions is that it's too polarized and few really see the other side. It does not nor should it be that way. False accusations are wrong. So are having survivors who do not receive adequate justice. No one side is a "greater" problem- in fact, to ensure a fair and equitable justice system, they both ought to be treated as problems of great concern.

We can have an equilibrium where we can get justice for harassment and assault survivors and deal with the problem of false accusations. This doesn't have to be an either/or dichotomy, and reducing it to one prevents solving the problem- on both sides of the ledger.

[Bastet]

10 minutes ago, Danielg342 said:

No one side is a "greater" problem

But one is greater in numbers -- one is a fucking epidemic, and one is something that happens rarely.  So while both are wrong, I am going to proportionally commit my attention to the one that is happening to someone every 68 seconds in this country.

[Irlandesa]

1 hour ago, Bastet said:

But one is greater in numbers -- one is a fucking epidemic, and one is something that happens rarely.  So while both are wrong, I am going to proportionally commit my attention to the one that is happening to someone every 68 seconds in this country.

Plus, this is Jay-Z.  He has money.  He has influence.  It feels like we keep seeing powerful men with multiple accusers, with court judgments against them, face a society giving a collective shrug of their shoulders and offering them more and more chances.

Basically, I'm not worried about false accusations ruining his life because I don't think real accusations would ruin his life.

 

[Danielg342]

I completely understand and agree that sexual violence is a serious and widespread issue that demands urgent attention and resources. It’s heartbreaking that someone experiences it every 68 seconds—that statistic alone shows how much work we have to do to address the problem.

At the same time, I think it's important to recognize that ensuring fairness and due process in how cases are handled doesn't take away from supporting survivors. In fact, a justice system that is consistent, impartial, and fair strengthens everyone’s trust in it. False accusations may be rare, but they do happen, and acknowledging that doesn’t mean minimizing the epidemic of sexual violence—it just means holding space for fairness for all parties in every individual case.

1 hour ago, Irlandesa said:

This is Jay-Z.  He has money.  He has influence.  It feels like we keep seeing powerful men with multiple accusers, with court judgments against them, face a society giving a collective shrug of their shoulders and offering them more and more chances.

Basically, I'm not worried about false accusations ruining his life because I don't think real accusations would ruin his life.

Which is another part of the broken system that needs fixing. Wealth and power should be meaningless in a truly fair and impartial justice system.

[Blergh]

Maybe I'm out of the loop but has anyone heard whether Miss Knowles has made any comment for public record re the accusations against her spouse? I mean adultery with a consenting adult would be bad enough but it's not a technical crime. However, one's spouse committing an assault (especially against a minor) would be beyond the Pale (to say the least).

P.S. And I don't care if the claimant snuck out of her house with her parents being clueless or looked like she was forty. A crime against a minor  would still be a crime against a minor!

[Kel Varnsen]

2 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

Plus, this is Jay-Z.  He has money.  He has influence.  

Your comment made me think of something. Jay-Z is rich and could possibly be a target for a false accusation or any kind of extortion scam. So if people are going to ask where the accusers parents were, you could also ask where Jay-z's security team was to make sure he couldn't end up in a position where he might be accused of something?

[Danielg342]

25 minutes ago, Blergh said:

I mean adultery with a consenting adult would be bad enough but it's not a technical crime.

Make of it what you will, but according to this timeline by ELLE magazine, Beyonce didn't start dating Jay-Z until 2001 and they didn't marry until 2008. The accusations against Jay-Z date to before they were a couple.

[Zella]

53 minutes ago, Blergh said:

Maybe I'm out of the loop but has anyone heard whether Miss Knowles has made any comment for public record re the accusations against her spouse? I mean adultery with a consenting adult would be bad enough but it's not a technical crime. However, one's spouse committing an assault (especially against a minor) would be beyond the Pale (to say the least).

P.S. And I don't care if the claimant snuck out of her house with her parents being clueless or looked like she was forty. A crime against a minor  would still be a crime against a minor!

I doubt she will ever comment, but her mom apparently liked an Instagram post that said he was accused of rape and then claimed she was hacked and was supporting him. Sure, Tina. I'm sure the hacker used the same French router that set Josh Duggar up. 🙄 Between that and Solange beating his ass in the elevator several years ago, I suspect her family really aren't big fans of his. 

[Cobalt Stargazer]

7 hours ago, Bastet said:

But one is greater in numbers -- one is a fucking epidemic, and one is something that happens rarely.  So while both are wrong, I am going to proportionally commit my attention to the one that is happening to someone every 68 seconds in this country.

We don't even proportionally treat male victims the same way we treat female victims. If more people had publicly sided with Sinead O'Connor back in 1992 instead of laughing at her or acting like she was a kook, would there have been a much more serious take on the abuse allegations she was making? The accusations against Michael Jackson have followed him beyond the grave, but we may never know how many boys he assaulted. I try to stay out of this kind of thing because it all leads back to the same place, but the system not being equal applies to other things too.

[andromeda331]

3 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Your comment made me think of something. Jay-Z is rich and could possibly be a target for a false accusation or any kind of extortion scam. So if people are going to ask where the accusers parents were, you could also ask where Jay-z's security team was to make sure he couldn't end up in a position where he might be accused of something?

Does he need a security staff to keep him from doing something with a thirteen year old? Shouldn't he already know that because he's an adult? 

[Kel Varnsen]

4 hours ago, andromeda331 said:

Does he need a security staff to keep him from doing something with a thirteen year old? Shouldn't he already know that because he's an adult? 

Ideally yes. But if he didn't actually do it where were his people to make sure he didn't end up in a situation where he could be accused, or provide the evidence that he couldn't possibly have done anything? If the parents of the accusers have some kind of fault for it happened then maybe so does Jay-Z.

[Ohiopirate02]

1 hour ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Ideally yes. But if he didn't actually do it where were his people to make sure he didn't end up in a situation where he could be accused, or provide the evidence that he couldn't possibly have done anything? If the parents of the accusers have some kind of fault for it happened then maybe so does Jay-Z.

The buck really does stop at Jay-Z. He's the adult and the one who tells his staff and security who to allow into the room. I also never buy the "I didn't know she was a minor" defense. That is what happens when grown-ass adults would rather party with young women barely past the age of consent. It doesn't happen when you choose to party with other adults. 

[bluegirl147]

Jay Z is accused of forcible rape right?  Does it matter the age of the girl?  

8 hours ago, Zella said:

Between that and Solange beating his ass in the elevator several years ago, I suspect her family really aren't big fans of his. 

As I said in an earlier post I definitely get an abusive vibe from him.  Could be physical. Could be verbal or emotional.  But there is something there.

[FilmTVGeek80]

18 hours ago, Bastet said:

But one is greater in numbers -- one is a fucking epidemic, and one is something that happens rarely.  So while both are wrong, I am going to proportionally commit my attention to the one that is happening to someone every 68 seconds in this country.

Who's saying you can't do that? I was responding to you saying that Jay-Z can't possibly be innocent because of how "exceedingly rare" false accusations are, and your seeming to act as if being falsely accused isn't a big deal.

15 hours ago, Danielg342 said:

I completely understand and agree that sexual violence is a serious and widespread issue that demands urgent attention and resources. It’s heartbreaking that someone experiences it every 68 seconds—that statistic alone shows how much work we have to do to address the problem.

At the same time, I think it's important to recognize that ensuring fairness and due process in how cases are handled doesn't take away from supporting survivors. In fact, a justice system that is consistent, impartial, and fair strengthens everyone’s trust in it. False accusations may be rare, but they do happen, and acknowledging that doesn’t mean minimizing the epidemic of sexual violence—it just means holding space for fairness for all parties in every individual case.

 

100%.

18 hours ago, Danielg342 said:

I think the real problem with harassment and assault discussions is that it's too polarized and few really see the other side. It does not nor should it be that way. False accusations are wrong. So are having survivors who do not receive adequate justice. No one side is a "greater" problem- in fact, to ensure a fair and equitable justice system, they both ought to be treated as problems of great concern.

We can have an equilibrium where we can get justice for harassment and assault survivors and deal with the problem of false accusations. This doesn't have to be an either/or dichotomy, and reducing it to one prevents solving the problem- on both sides of the ledger.

THIS. There's no nuance in the discussion. You either have people refusing to listen and name-calling the accuser or the other side drawing and quartering the accused the minute an accusation comes out. And if someone says, "Maybe we should wait to hear all the facts," people accuse those people of being rape apologists.

7 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Ideally yes. But if he didn't actually do it where were his people to make sure he didn't end up in a situation where he could be accused, or provide the evidence that he couldn't possibly have done anything? If the parents of the accusers have some kind of fault for it happened then maybe so does Jay-Z.

We don't know what his security team will say if this ever gets to the deposition stage. I'm not sure it would matter to the people bound and determined to believe he's guilty. They'd say they're covering for their boss out of loyalty or because they're being paid to. 

15 hours ago, Blergh said:

Maybe I'm out of the loop but has anyone heard whether Miss Knowles has made any comment for public record re the accusations against her spouse? I mean adultery with a consenting adult would be bad enough but it's not a technical crime. However, one's spouse committing an assault (especially against a minor) would be beyond the Pale (to say the least).

She hasn't said anything, but she and her family, including Jay-Z, attended the Mufasa premiere the next day. So, publicly, she supports him.

I wasn't even looking for this, but it appeared in the daily alert I get from People magazine.

https://people.com/stripper-admits-lied-duke-lacrosse-rape-accusations-8760988?hid=0633e9d4abc2e711c9e050a830c53a751fcddc66&did=15785176-20241213&utm_source=ppl&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=ppl-news_newsletter&utm_content=121324&lctg=0633e9d4abc2e711c9e050a830c53a751fcddc66&lr_input=306e6dc24a3e35bb60d79b7878e4745b481dda5f3f43a6156315a8a8cb93eee1&utm_term=midday

[Bastet]

10 minutes ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

Who's saying you can't do that? I was responding to you saying that Jay-Z can't possibly be innocent because of how "exceedingly rare" false accusations are, and your seeming to act as if being falsely accused isn't a big deal.

A) No one, nor did I claim they were.  B) I wasn't responding to you, I was responding to the poster I quoted.  C) I did not say that.  I said I have no reason thus far to believe her allegations are false.  That hardly translates to "Jay-Z can't possibly be innocent".

[Trini]

People really avoiding trials this holiday season:

'Paula Abdul Settles Sexual Assault Case Against Nigel Lythgoe'

Quote

Paula Abdul has reportedly settled her sexual assault case against American Idol executive producer and So You Think You Can Dance co-creator Nigel Lythgoe, which was first filed nearly one year ago, the Associated Press reports.

“I am grateful this chapter has successfully come to a close and is now something I can now put behind me,” Abdul says in a statement to TMZ. “This has been a long and hard-fought personal battle. I hope my experience can serve to inspire other women, facing similar struggles, to overcome their own challenges with dignity and respect, so that they too can turn the page and begin a new chapter of their lives.”

In the lawsuit, which was originally filed in December 2023, Abdul accused Lythgoe of sexually assaulting her during an early season of American Idol, and again in 2014 while she was judging SYTYCD.

 

[Is Everyone Gone]

The accuser has come forward, acknowledged some inconsistencies.

[Stats Queen]

On 12/12/2024 at 5:39 PM, Bastet said:

But one is greater in numbers -- one is a fucking epidemic, and one is something that happens rarely.  So while both are wrong, I am going to proportionally commit my attention to the one that is happening to someone every 68 seconds in this country.

What about all the Duke lacrosse students who were falsely accused and now the women came out an admitted it didn’t happened? She and the media narrative destroyed many lives.

No one, including my mom, didn’t believe my ex husband was sexually and physically abusing me. This was in 1991. So I truly understand how awful it is when the accuser is not believed, shunned and ridiculed. Also, the percentage of those victimized is far greater than the ones falsely accused.

If someone destroys another person’s life by either abusing them or being falsely accused, that life is still destroyed.

Crystal Magnum destroyed a lot of young men’s lives.

A victim is a victim and sometimes the victim is the one who is falsely accused. Any justification for destroying their lives is also unacceptable.

I do side with you focusing on the epidemic. It is frightening the number of women being victimized across the world in 2024. 

But no one’s life should be destroyed from false accusations. Those false accusations make it so much harder for women who re truly victims.

We need to protect all who are victims 

[Vermicious Knid]

What Beyonce thinks is irrelevant because she wasn't there. But to that end, Jay-Z has cheated on her. And when you're married to Beyonce and can sleep with her and you still can't keep it in your pants around other women it wouldn't surprise me if he just took what he wanted whenever he felt like it. 

[Danielg342]

37 minutes ago, Vermicious Knid said:

But to that end, Jay-Z has cheated on her.

Beyonce says she met Jay-Z- who is 12 years older than her- when she was 18, which was in 2000. Beyonce says, further, they didn't start dating until she was 19, in 2001.

These allegations stem from the 2000 MTV Awards, which aired on September 7, 2000. So, according to the timeline, Jay-Z was not attached to Beyonce at that time.

Make of that what you will. If Jay-Z actually committed the act, I wouldn't say he cheated on Beyonce (though I'm not sure that's really relevant given the grievous nature of the act in question).

[Irlandesa]

1 hour ago, Danielg342 said:

These allegations stem from the 2000 MTV Awards, which aired on September 7, 2000. So, according to the timeline, Jay-Z was not attached to Beyonce at that time.

This incident isn't the cheating the poster is talking about. The infidelity the poster is referencing came out because of the elevator video and the "Becky with the good hair" reference in the Lemonade album.

Edited December 14 by Irlandesa

[FilmTVGeek80]

13 hours ago, Vermicious Knid said:

What Beyonce thinks is irrelevant because she wasn't there. But to that end, Jay-Z has cheated on her. And when you're married to Beyonce and can sleep with her and you still can't keep it in your pants around other women it wouldn't surprise me if he just took what he wanted whenever he felt like it. 

I know a lot of people think Beyoncé is this perfect goddess, but she’s a normal human with faults. It doesn’t mean she deserves to be cheated on, but it’s not unthinkable it could happen to her. Pretty women get cheated on all the time. Being a cheater doesn’t equal being a rapist.

[andromeda331]

On 12/13/2024 at 6:54 AM, Ohiopirate02 said:

The buck really does stop at Jay-Z. He's the adult and the one who tells his staff and security who to allow into the room. I also never buy the "I didn't know she was a minor" defense. That is what happens when grown-ass adults would rather party with young women barely past the age of consent. It doesn't happen when you choose to party with other adults. 

Yeah, it's all on Jay-Z. He's the adult, it was his party, and she was let it. Who let's a thirteen year old into an adult party. Jay-Z sees an thirteen year old girl at his party, his thought wasn't to find out how she got in, to keep her safe while contacting her parents' or have security do that. It was to have sex with her. 

[FilmTVGeek80]

6 minutes ago, andromeda331 said:

Yeah, it's all on Jay-Z. He's the adult, it was his party, and she was let it. Who lets a thirteen year old into an adult party. Jay-Z sees a thirteen year old girl at his party, his thought wasn't to find out how she got in, to keep her safe while contacting her parents' or have security do that. It was to have sex with her. 

Well according to others here maybe she didn’t look 13. We don’t know that he even met this girl, let alone assaulted her. Hell, at this point, who knows if she was even there since she claimed she was talking to the lead singer from Good Charlotte who confirms he wasn’t even there. 

[Raja]

On 12/15/2024 at 3:07 AM, andromeda331 said:

Yeah, it's all on Jay-Z. He's the adult, it was his party, and she was let it. Who let's a thirteen year old into an adult party. Jay-Z sees an thirteen year old girl at his party, his thought wasn't to find out how she got in, to keep her safe while contacting her parents' or have security do that. It was to have sex with her. 

That reminds me of the one season and done Kings. The Crown Prince's Secret Service equivalent  would film the checking of ID and look for signs of intoxication before women could join the royal party group. Does the rockstar class depend upon venue security to do the initial screening, it seems so. The other possibilities that the star is targeting the underage specifically to treat his party guest with is the next level.

[Danielg342]

On 12/14/2024 at 2:18 PM, FilmTVGeek80 said:

Well according to others here maybe she didn’t look 13. We don’t know that he even met this girl, let alone assaulted her. Hell, at this point, who knows if she was even there since she claimed she was talking to the lead singer from Good Charlotte who confirms he wasn’t even there. 

This is part of the problem with litigating cases after so much time has passed- memories fade, and memories become garbled. Trauma can exacerbate these effects. The sad truth is, she may have been really assaulted that night but because so much time has passed, her memories of the event may have become so distorted that she has messed up or maybe even outright forgotten many of the actual details.

4 hours ago, Raja said:

That reminds me of the one season and done Kings. The Crown Prince's Secret Service equivalent  would film the checking of ID and look for signs of intoxication before women could join the royal party group. Does the rockstar class depend upon venue security to do the initial screening, it seems so. The other possibilities that the star is targeting the underage specifically to treat his party guest with is the next level.

I'm not sure Diddy's parties would be so rigid with their security systems. They likely had doormen, there may have been a list of people who were actually invited to attend the party, but I'm sure- because his parties were unregulated events- that if there was someone Diddy or one of Diddy's trusted associates wanted inside the party, they could be brought in. This could include a woman who may look 18 even though she's actually 13, because she could be brought in and all they may care about is her word that she's of age.

[Vermicious Knid]

Quote

Pretty women get cheated on all the time.

When did I say pretty women didn't get cheated on? Or that Beyonce was a Goddess. She is a woman that millions of men would give a limb to sleep with. And Jay-Z still wasn't satisfied with her. 

[FilmTVGeek80]

13 hours ago, Vermicious Knid said:

When did I say pretty women didn't get cheated on? Or that Beyonce was a Goddess. She is a woman that millions of men would give a limb to sleep with. And Jay-Z still wasn't satisfied with her. 

I never said you said she was a goddess, but I’ve seen plenty of people who said the same thing you did - “how could he cheat on her of all people” - who do think that. Your post, to me, made it sound like if Jay-Z would cheat on Beyoncé of all people that somehow made it more plausible he would commit assault. My point was Beyoncé is just like any other woman and it’s not unheard of that she could be cheated on. Millions may want to sleep with her but they don’t live with her. None of us know the ins and outs of that marriage and what led to their problems. Like I said before, cheating is not necessarily an indicator of someone’s likelihood of committing assault.

Edited December 16 by FilmTVGeek80

[EtheltoTillie]

1 hour ago, FilmTVGeek80 said:

I never said you said she was a goddess, but I’ve seen plenty of people who said the same thing you did - “how could he cheat on her of all people” - who do think that. Your post, to me, made it sound like if Jay-Z would cheat on Beyoncé of all people that somehow made it more plausible he would commit assault. My point was Beyoncé is just like any other woman and it’s not unheard of that she could be cheated on. Millions may want to sleep with her but they don’t live with her. None of us know the ins and outs of that marriage and what led to their problems. Like I said before, cheating is not necessarily an indicator of someone’s likelihood of committing adultery.

Typo?  Cheating is an indicator of committing adultery. I think you probably meant assault. 

[FilmTVGeek80]

14 minutes ago, EtheltoTillie said:

Typo?  Cheating is an indicator of committing adultery. I think you probably meant assault. 

Ye Thank you. Will fix that.

[BetterButter]

English Teacher creator Brian Jordan Alvarez accused of assault by former collaborator

Quote

The Gay And Wondrous Life Of Caleb Gallo star Jon Ebeling says Alvarez assaulted him on set of the webseries.

 

[peachmangosteen]

Dammit.

[peachmangosteen]

Twitter thread with excerpts of Blake Lively's complaints against Justin Baldoni:

 

[Spartan Girl]

Say what you want about Blake but she did not deserve any of this.

[Dimity]

PR Strategist Melissa Nathan’s Role in Smearing Heard & Lively

[merylinkid]

Jay-Z vehement reaction is exactly what I would expect from someone who got caught.   Lots of loud bluster that accuses the attorney (who is the same way who finally got DeShaun Watson held somewhat accountable and the reason we knnow what a perv he is) and calling a simple request for settlement (which is fairly standard in the legal world) an attempt at blackmail and extortion.   

A shorter simpler statement would have been more believable.

The story is that the 13 year old was trying to get to the party, one of Diddy's people spotted her and through she was EXACTLY Diddy's type and brought her in.   

Are there inconsistencies in her story?   Yes.   You know why?   Because normal people don't tell consistent stories as they go along.   Only those with memorized stories do.

[Blergh]

4 hours ago, merylinkid said:

Jay-Z vehement reaction is exactly what I would expect from someone who got caught.   Lots of loud bluster that accuses the attorney (who is the same way who finally got DeShaun Watson held somewhat accountable and the reason we knnow what a perv he is) and calling a simple request for settlement (which is fairly standard in the legal world) an attempt at blackmail and extortion.   

A shorter simpler statement would have been more believable.

The story is that the 13 year old was trying to get to the party, one of Diddy's people spotted her and through she was EXACTLY Diddy's type and brought her in.   

Are there inconsistencies in her story?   Yes.   You know why?   Because normal people don't tell consistent stories as they go along.   Only those with memorized stories do.

Yeah, if any alleged adult at that shindig  had had any decency, they'd have had that underage child sent home in a cab as soon as she was spotted (as would have been the case for that girl left in Mr. Polanski's company at Jack Nicholson's abode).  Alas, nothing jaded and indifferent so-called adults appeared to have been  at both places.

Edited 20 hours ago by Blergh

[tearknee]

On 12/13/2024 at 5:29 PM, Cobalt Stargazer said:

We don't even proportionally treat male victims the same way we treat female victims. If more people had publicly sided with Sinead O'Connor back in 1992 instead of laughing at her or acting like she was a kook, would there have been a much more serious take on the abuse allegations she was making? The accusations against Michael Jackson have followed him beyond the grave, but we may never know how many boys he assaulted. I try to stay out of this kind of thing because it all leads back to the same place, but the system not being equal applies to other things too.

 

“It’s clear from some of the public commentary when Joynes was convicted that there is still a lack of understanding when it comes to men and boys being the victims of sexual offences. They have had to read comments stating others are ‘jealous’ of them, and that they should be’ happy a young female teacher was interested in them’, and this rhetoric is very damaging and dangerous.

“Women can still be paedophiles; this term is not reserved only for men. Men and boys can still be victims of sexual abuse. I would encourage anyone who wants to pass comment on this case really thinks before they speak, about the impact their words could have on not only those affected by this case, but others who are currently out there suffering.

 

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/rebecca-joynes-paedophile-sexual-abuse-29476607

[Shrek]

3 hours ago, merylinkid said:

Are there inconsistencies in her story?   Yes.   You know why?   Because normal people don't tell consistent stories as they go along.   Only those with memorized stories do.

I was always told the exact opposite because you don't need to try remember what you said last time but even then there would be small inconsistencies after such a long time. 

[tearknee]

32 minutes ago, Shrek said:

I was always told the exact opposite because you don't need to try remember what you said last time but even then there would be small inconsistencies after such a long time. 

You are right and the PP is wrong. It's like the silly notion that girls can't be Jacks or Ralphs or Piggys when placed in a Lord of the Flies scenario.

[Irlandesa]

4 hours ago, Shrek said:

I was always told the exact opposite because you don't need to try remember what you said last time but even then there would be small inconsistencies after such a long time. 

I don't know enough about the inconsistencies in the Jay-Z story but it's usually the surrounding details that tend to change over time. 

I recall some cognitive researchers looking at people's memories of and around 9/11 and then following up weeks later.  They found that the memories changed.  People forgot details or added new details.  And given the serious nature of the event, they believed more strongly in their memory of 9/11 than they did of the more mundane things that happened before or after that day.  

It's why I was frustrated when I see things like time of year or place used against victims, especially when it comes to ongoing abuse.  An adult muddling up external details of a traumatic event from their childhood doesn't negate their memory of the actual traumatic event.